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"I come on here to get horny and let off some steam, not political talk 🙄" | |||
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"Entirely depends on which party is best placed to stop Reform/Tories winning the seat. " I have never understood this approach.. Why would you vote for any other to stop a party whose policies you disagree with? surely it is a better idea to not second guess other peoples voting, and vote for the MP / party who best represents your views? | |||
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"Entirely depends on which party is best placed to stop Reform/Tories winning the seat." It must be a very tiring life constantly fighting the things you hate, instead of embracing the things you like. | |||
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"Entirely depends on which party is best placed to stop Reform/Tories winning the seat. It must be a very tiring life constantly fighting the things you hate, instead of embracing the things you like." Wouldn't know, that research would take less than two minutes. Well worth it to do my bit to make the world a better place. | |||
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"It's really strange how some people don't seem to understand tactical voting. Any rational voter needs to look at polling data in their area and decide how best to vote in order to optimise the likelihood of their political aims being implemented. Given our first past the post system, simply voting for the candidate that most closely matches your opinions can be counter-productive. " If I can't get what I want, I will do my best to not let others get what they want is certainly tactical, and also very militant. Voting then becomes about denial and blocking rather than representation. | |||
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"The current voting intentions polls are interesting. Unless there is a drastic change, signs are that we will have a coalition government if there is an election tomorrow. Tories and Labour both have similar support at 18% and 19% The rest of the right wing votes are going to Reform with 27% The rest of the left wing votes are with Greens at 16% Lib dems are at 15% These votes may not translate to seats proportionately. But if assume they do, the results are going to be wild. Farage has already hinted about potentially talking to Tories about a deal. If Labour end up having a coalition with Greens/LibDems, there will be crazy amounts of infighting considering the difference in policies between Starmer's labour and Zack's green party. " This plays into the way Farage operates, and I bet he can't believe how easy it is to rinse and repeat. He is already changing Labour policy and rhetoric without really trying. If the polls stay like this as we get closer to the next GE he will be basically running the country by proxy. | |||
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"The current voting intentions polls are interesting. Unless there is a drastic change, signs are that we will have a coalition government if there is an election tomorrow. Tories and Labour both have similar support at 18% and 19% The rest of the right wing votes are going to Reform with 27% The rest of the left wing votes are with Greens at 16% Lib dems are at 15% These votes may not translate to seats proportionately. But if assume they do, the results are going to be wild. Farage has already hinted about potentially talking to Tories about a deal. If Labour end up having a coalition with Greens/LibDems, there will be crazy amounts of infighting considering the difference in policies between Starmer's labour and Zack's green party. This plays into the way Farage operates, and I bet he can't believe how easy it is to rinse and repeat. He is already changing Labour policy and rhetoric without really trying. If the polls stay like this as we get closer to the next GE he will be basically running the country by proxy." Have to give it to him when it comes to getting what he wants. Labour have passed more stricter immigration policies compared to the Tories. Whether it has any practical effect on the numbers is yet to be seen though. He knows how to run a single issue party. Then we have the other single issue party named "Your party"  | |||
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"If I can't get what I want, I will do my best to not let others get what they want is certainly tactical, and also very militant. Voting then becomes about denial and blocking rather than representation." We don't have proportional representation, therefore the only logical way to vote is to take into account how the first past the post system operates. To adopt any other strategy would be stupid. | |||
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"“I no longer vote so whenever an election is is irrelevant to me” “First election where I wouldn't vote (kind of a protest vote)” Then please do not complain about the actions of a party or individual that somebody DID vote for, no matter how disagreeable you might find them. People fought for - even died for - the right to choose their leaders, if you don’t like ANY of the candidates, become one yourself." No, people fought for the right to have the choice of who to vote for, I choose to vote for nobody. They also fought for me to be able to criticise the actions of those who choose to take up public office. Ironic, someone championing privileges of what people fought for telling others what they can’t do  | |||
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"We don't have proportional representation, therefore the only logical way to vote is to take into account how the first past the post system operates. To adopt any other strategy would be stupid." Your logic is impaired. At the last election 14% of the population voted for Reform, despite there being no realistic chance of them winning. The high vote number made the 2 big parties start to worry about them, and change their policies. Labour are now touting strong immigration controls to try to fend off the Reform vote. If those people had acted tactically and voted Tory (in most cases), Labour would still have won, and would now not even be considering immigration control. In addition the low turn out for Reform would have made many people dismiss them as a gimmick party. All those people ignoring tactical voting has resulted in them getting some of the stuff they wanted, and making the party they support much more electable. | |||
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"Your logic is impaired. At the last election 14% of the population voted for Reform, despite there being no realistic chance of them winning. The high vote number made the 2 big parties start to worry about them, and change their policies. Labour are now touting strong immigration controls to try to fend off the Reform vote. If those people had acted tactically and voted Tory (in most cases), Labour would still have won, and would now not even be considering immigration control. In addition the low turn out for Reform would have made many people dismiss them as a gimmick party. All those people ignoring tactical voting has resulted in them getting some of the stuff they wanted, and making the party they support much more electable." In reality those people voting for Reform delivered a 174 seat majority for Labour. Now it may be that Labour are touting Reform-ish sounding immigration policies but I don't see many people who voted for Reform changing their minds and saying they'll vote for Labour next time. All such talk has achieved is a shift on the left from Labour to the Greens. Starmer is an idiot but that doesn't change the fact that tactical voting is the only rational strategy in a first past the post electoral system. | |||
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"Your logic is impaired. At the last election 14% of the population voted for Reform, despite there being no realistic chance of them winning. The high vote number made the 2 big parties start to worry about them, and change their policies. Labour are now touting strong immigration controls to try to fend off the Reform vote. If those people had acted tactically and voted Tory (in most cases), Labour would still have won, and would now not even be considering immigration control. In addition the low turn out for Reform would have made many people dismiss them as a gimmick party. All those people ignoring tactical voting has resulted in them getting some of the stuff they wanted, and making the party they support much more electable." "In reality those people voting for Reform delivered a 174 seat majority for Labour." Yes. And they also changed the Labour party to be more like Reform. So those non-tactical votes for Reform has got those voters some of what they want. Had they voted tactically, Labour would still have won, and those voters would have got none of what they want. "Now it may be that Labour are touting Reform-ish sounding immigration policies but I don't see many people who voted for Reform changing their minds and saying they'll vote for Labour next time. All such talk has achieved is a shift on the left from Labour to the Greens." Correct. So all those non-tactical votes have lost Labour some of its support, and made Reform more likely to defeat them next time. "... that doesn't change the fact that tactical voting is the only rational strategy in a first past the post electoral system." The evidence above suggests that you are incorrect. | |||
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"The evidence above suggests that you are incorrect." You seem a little distracted by the vibe of politics rather than the realities. Labour's huge majority is real. Personally I think all the talk about the small boats and asylum policy is pretty much irrelevant to what's going on in the wider economy, so I suppose I can see why Starmer might think that throwing a few bones to Reform supporters might make sense even though he's actually undermining Labour's support. Anyway, I suspect that the Labour government will hang on until 2029 and by then the environment will be totally different. | |||
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" Now it may be that Labour are touting Reform-ish sounding immigration policies but I don't see many people who voted for Reform changing their minds and saying they'll vote for Labour next time. All such talk has achieved is a shift on the left from Labour to the Greens. " Starmer went with Stricter immigration policies because doing this worked for Denmark's social democrats. If it worked in Denmark, it's reasonable for them to assume that it will work here too. Not to mention the fact that Labour won the election making manifesto promises to reduce immigration. Policy changes alone aren't enough though. The changes have to be backed by a drop in the number of immigrants too. If that happens, a single issue party like Reform won't have much to say. Considering the fact that the Tories are seen to have betrayed the voters on immigration, Labour will get good support if they can show the numbers. Starmer did the right thing there. | |||
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"Obvs not but who you voting for any more importantly why?.... I know who I'm not voting for, Labour but can't quite get to vote reform... Probs lib dem but more as a protest" Green traditionally. I have voted tactically in the past when it was clear the only way to dislodge the incumbents at the time (Cons) was with a groundswell of Lab votes. I was hoping Lab would remember their roots but alas they are still to far right politically for me. Going back to the Greens and their base is growing. | |||
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"Green traditionally. I have voted tactically in the past when it was clear the only way to dislodge the incumbents at the time (Cons) was with a groundswell of Lab votes. I was hoping Lab would remember their roots but alas they are still to far right politically for me. Going back to the Greens and their base is growing." Do you really believe that the Green Party’s policies are sensible? They have morphed from a party with genuine and legitimate concerns about the environment to the party of the rabid loony left. Having them anywhere near power would be a disaster. | |||
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"The comments in this thread give insight into how fucked up our political system is and how disillusioned people are with it (and no judgement on my part at all about that, as I agree!) The majority of comments are about tactical and protest voting (along with the expressions of disillusionment), which surely shows that the system is not fit for purpose, as people are not voting for who they want to be in power, they are voting for who they don't want in power. Whilst that approach is legitimate and justifiable, it surely indicates the negativity that we have to the current system that exists!" I'm not in agreement that the political system is not fit for purpose. I would be more inclined to say I was convinced society is breaking, and the hard left are as equally to blame as the far right. To read that people are more inclined to vote to keep someone out than to put their vote behind their preferred candidate speaks volumes. As you say it is legitimate, however PR would be a nightmare situation we can't get things done now, imagine all those other inputs clogging up decision making. PR appeals directly to the fringe the types of people who would vote to deny than to represent. | |||
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"I'm not in agreement that the political system is not fit for purpose. I would be more inclined to say I was convinced society is breaking, and the hard left are as equally to blame as the far right. To read that people are more inclined to vote to keep someone out than to put their vote behind their preferred candidate speaks volumes. As you say it is legitimate, however PR would be a nightmare situation we can't get things done now, imagine all those other inputs clogging up decision making. PR appeals directly to the fringe the types of people who would vote to deny than to represent." I guess it depends on what you think democracy means. For me it's about decisions being made on the basis of consensus. Our FPTP system doesn't deliver this, instead it produces fairly chaotic amplifications of power - the most recent example being that Labour won 33.7% of the vote but ended up with 63.2% of MPs. I would prefer some form of PR and would actually welcome it if policies that couldn't win sufficient support fell by the wayside. It would produce less powerful adminstrations but that isn't necessarily a bad thing as a few good policy decisions would be better than lots of bad ones. There's little prospect of the system changing so we have to make the best of a bad job and this inevitably involves tactical voting. | |||
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"I'm not in agreement that the political system is not fit for purpose. I would be more inclined to say I was convinced society is breaking, and the hard left are as equally to blame as the far right. To read that people are more inclined to vote to keep someone out than to put their vote behind their preferred candidate speaks volumes. As you say it is legitimate, however PR would be a nightmare situation we can't get things done now, imagine all those other inputs clogging up decision making. PR appeals directly to the fringe the types of people who would vote to deny than to represent. I guess it depends on what you think democracy means. For me it's about decisions being made on the basis of consensus. Our FPTP system doesn't deliver this, instead it produces fairly chaotic amplifications of power - the most recent example being that Labour won 33.7% of the vote but ended up with 63.2% of MPs. I would prefer some form of PR and would actually welcome it if policies that couldn't win sufficient support fell by the wayside. It would produce less powerful adminstrations but that isn't necessarily a bad thing as a few good policy decisions would be better than lots of bad ones. There's little prospect of the system changing so we have to make the best of a bad job and this inevitably involves tactical voting. " I agree that low voting numbers leading to one side taking a landslide is not ideal. If voting became a legal obligation would that improve or worsen democracy in the country? Is it the system or society? | |||
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"I agree that low voting numbers leading to one side taking a landslide is not ideal. If voting became a legal obligation would that improve or worsen democracy in the country? Is it the system or society?" Voter turnout fell to only about 60% in the last GE, possibly as a result of efforts by the previous government to make it harder for people to vote. Making voting compulsory would no doubt increase turnout although I'm not sure it's a good idea to fine people becasue they don't want to vote. But more importantly, simply increasing turnout wouldn't deliver more proportionality because FPTP is inherently not proportional. Under FPTP it's theoretically possible for a party to win all 650 seats on the back of a small popular vote even with a turnout of 100%. | |||
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"All Labour Governments hike taxes. It's in their DNA. But Rachel Reeves didn’t just present a disastrous Budget. She misled the British public about the state of our finances, triggering real-world harm for families and savers. Over months, we read unprecedented leaks to the press that painted one picture, when the figures they had access to painted a very different story. People drew down pensions early. Families rushed to fix mortgages. Small businesses paused investment. All because the Chancellor painted a false picture of a crisis that didn’t exist. There have been allegations of market manipulation. That's a serious crime, and it's a charge we asked the Financial Conduct Authority to investigate. Rachel Reeves has broken trust with the electorate yet again, and her position as Chancellor is completely untenable." I concur with this view that she is not to be trusted . I can't see her resigning just yet unless markets are spooked by any further shenanigans on her part. I really wanted to believe that Labour can be trusted on tax this last election but once again they have showed they cannot.Increasing the amount of tax I pay on the same income next year is the final straw for me along with increasing taxation for political ideals based on a falsehood . | |||
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" Whether left or right or minority a general dissatisfaction with what’s on offer, or voter apathy " The former, leading to the latter. | |||
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"Green traditionally. I have voted tactically in the past when it was clear the only way to dislodge the incumbents at the time (Cons) was with a groundswell of Lab votes. I was hoping Lab would remember their roots but alas they are still to far right politically for me. Going back to the Greens and their base is growing. Do you really believe that the Green Party’s policies are sensible? They have morphed from a party with genuine and legitimate concerns about the environment to the party of the rabid loony left. Having them anywhere near power would be a disaster." Their views on nuclear weapons and nuclear power alone are enough for me to disregard them. Might as well hand over the country to Putin if we are giving them the power. | |||
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"“I no longer vote so whenever an election is is irrelevant to me” “First election where I wouldn't vote (kind of a protest vote)” Then please do not complain about the actions of a party or individual that somebody DID vote for, no matter how disagreeable you might find them. People fought for - even died for - the right to choose their leaders, if you don’t like ANY of the candidates, become one yourself." Ok, calm down - angry energy or what! | |||
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"All Labour Governments hike taxes. It's in their DNA. But Rachel Reeves didn’t just present a disastrous Budget. She misled the British public about the state of our finances, triggering real-world harm for families and savers. Over months, we read unprecedented leaks to the press that painted one picture, when the figures they had access to painted a very different story. People drew down pensions early. Families rushed to fix mortgages. Small businesses paused investment. All because the Chancellor painted a false picture of a crisis that didn’t exist. There have been allegations of market manipulation. That's a serious crime, and it's a charge we asked the Financial Conduct Authority to investigate. Rachel Reeves has broken trust with the electorate yet again, and her position as Chancellor is completely untenable." Did she? Or did the MSM speculate and simply make stuff up? Where is your evidence to support your claims? There are ongoing investigations but many of these claims have already been shown to be nonsense. For example the MSM claimed she said there was another blackhole. She never said that. If people want to act on speculation more fool them, and bear in mind instant changes to taxes or allowances are extremely rare. Most of her changes are two+ years away. | |||
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"Guy Fawkes woz right" Based , maybe the next reincarnation of el fawkes will get it right lol  | |||
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"At the moment it would be Lib Dem or Green Party for me I think zac taking on reform straight on and being the anti reform party is a really smart move " Well labour and conservatives are dead ducks. So there’s no purpose for people to look at them any longer. It’s a trident now. Reform vs greens and Lib Dem’s (whom I imagine will ally up nearer the time ) | |||
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"Reform. Anything is better than the shower who we have in charge at the moment!" Anything? | |||
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"I will give REFORM a chance, Hopefully they will remove all benefits so that if you need cash you can get off your arse and earn it. Only exception is the Extremely Disabled but everyone else get back to work you bone idle sods." So you'd send pensioners back to work... okay then | |||
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"I come on here to get horny and let off some steam, not political talk 🙄" Why are you posting in the POLITICS forum then ? | |||
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"Reform aren’t a protest choice, they are the ultra rich establishment and full of the same tories who were just in power for 14 years. If you want a protest vote go green, really scare the people in power " has Zack been hipnotysing you?? | |||
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"It's really strange how some people don't seem to understand tactical voting. Any rational voter needs to look at polling data in their area and decide how best to vote in order to optimise the likelihood of their political aims being implemented. Given our first past the post system, simply voting for the candidate that most closely matches your opinions can be counter-productive. " True but people still mainly vote tribaly or on principle. Let's see if this next election is any different but as things stand it would take tactical voting on a scale we have never seen before. | |||
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"Reform. Anything is better than the shower who we have in charge at the moment!" Voting for an unknown and untested party with few real policies. That's going to end badly. Speaking of ending badly.. Look at how an unknown referendum with misinformation has dealt us with the crap known as Brexit. | |||
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"As it’s a fuck site, I’ll say the candidate with the biggest breasts, and best “come to bed” eyes. I’m hoping it’ll be a lass tbh. " I do agree that being shaggable is important in politics. Good looking guys only please! I rarely vote for female candidates. | |||
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"Reform. Anything is better than the shower who we have in charge at the moment! Voting for an unknown and untested party with few real policies. That's going to end badly. Speaking of ending badly.. Look at how an unknown referendum with misinformation has dealt us with the crap known as Brexit. " So you'll be against anyone voting Green then? And as for 'tested' parties....Tories, Labour and Lib Dems have all had a taste of power this century and been proven to be utterly useless. Remind of the definition of insanity again? | |||
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"It's really strange how some people don't seem to understand tactical voting. Any rational voter needs to look at polling data in their area and decide how best to vote in order to optimise the likelihood of their political aims being implemented. Given our first past the post system, simply voting for the candidate that most closely matches your opinions can be counter-productive. True but people still mainly vote tribaly or on principle. Let's see if this next election is any different but as things stand it would take tactical voting on a scale we have never seen before." We essentially had a two party system which polls suggest may have widened to five contenders. In 2024 tactical anti-Tory voting gave the Lib Dems 72 seats and some big name Tories joined the ranks of the unemployed. So we have already seen tactical voting on a significant scale. Farage only became an MP on his 8th attempt. I read he has done sod all for Clacton-on-Sea. With a concerted stop Farage campaign poor Nige might have to go back to eating testicles. Nothing is certain in politics. | |||
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"Reform. Anything is better than the shower who we have in charge at the moment! Voting for an unknown and untested party with few real policies. That's going to end badly. Speaking of ending badly.. Look at how an unknown referendum with misinformation has dealt us with the crap known as Brexit. " If that's the case then we are stuck with Tories or labour with a sprinkling of lib Dems forever. It also means that the current labour government would never have been voted in as labour were out of office for so long that very few had the experience, which quicker showed | |||
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"Can we just vote for the king to take back control and be done with it
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"Bring back the monster raving loony party 💜" At least you know what you are getting. | |||
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"It's really strange how some people don't seem to understand tactical voting. Any rational voter needs to look at polling data in their area and decide how best to vote in order to optimise the likelihood of their political aims being implemented. Given our first past the post system, simply voting for the candidate that most closely matches your opinions can be counter-productive. True but people still mainly vote tribaly or on principle. Let's see if this next election is any different but as things stand it would take tactical voting on a scale we have never seen before. We essentially had a two party system which polls suggest may have widened to five contenders. In 2024 tactical anti-Tory voting gave the Lib Dems 72 seats and some big name Tories joined the ranks of the unemployed. So we have already seen tactical voting on a significant scale. Farage only became an MP on his 8th attempt. I read he has done sod all for Clacton-on-Sea. With a concerted stop Farage campaign poor Nige might have to go back to eating testicles. Nothing is certain in politics." Was definitely more to do with reform splitting the Tory vote then anything else.. Labour and the libdems just gained the windfall from that. | |||
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"What do you call a Reform voter with two brain cells? Pregnant" Nigel had better make sure they continue to get benefits! | |||
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"Can we just vote for the king to take back control and be done with it
"I thought of that when I listened to his Christmas speech. He wouldn't stand any nonsense from Putin or Trump. He would just quietly advise them to be nice to all fellow men... | |||
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"For those planning to vote reform: There's a good mirror now in the USA... Do you wanna have any of the putins visiting the UK, shaking hands with fartage?" Absolutely 100% nails it | |||
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"Reform are our only hope of saving this once great country. " Then we better all take up religion and hope that we suffer from a modern plague that wipes us all out | |||
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"I'm part of the Zack army. But I would cause voting tactically to keep Farage out. " I’ve always voted conservative but would vote tactically to keep Zack and Starmer out. Socialism is a wonderful idea in theory, but sooner or later you always run out of other people’s money. | |||
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"i will vote for whoever increases military spending by over 25%. increases service men and women numbers by offering housing and good wages. " MOD pay awards last year added significantly to defence spending, with reported £862 million allocated for pay, pensions, and allowances. Another 4.5% pay rise recommended this year. MOD lawyers threatening docked pay for those complaining about poor service accommodation Dwarfed by the ever increasing costs of benefits and hotel housing for small boat arrivals at £5bn annually. | |||
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"Reform are our only hope of saving this once great country. " Is there any particular need to be great, ever? | |||
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"Reform are our only hope of saving this once great country. Is there any particular need to be great, ever?" Don’t you want to be great or your kids be great at something they enjoy doing? | |||
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"I'm part of the Zack army. But I would cause voting tactically to keep Farage out. " The tit whisperer ? 🤣 | |||
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"For those planning to vote reform: There's a good mirror now in the USA... Do you wanna have any of the putins visiting the UK, shaking hands with fartage? Absolutely 100% nails it" Bearing in mind that reform’s leader in wales literally just got sent to jail for taking pro Russia bribes, and Farage thinks it’s NATO and Ukraines fault they got invaded by Putin, this isn’t so far fetched…. | |||
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"Reform are our only hope of saving this once great country. Is there any particular need to be great, ever?" Once you adopt that attitude you start to accept decline in everything that generations in the UK have strived for. | |||
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"I'm part of the Zack army. But I would cause voting tactically to keep Farage out. I’ve always voted conservative but would vote tactically to keep Zack and Starmer out. Socialism is a wonderful idea in theory, but sooner or later you always run out of other people’s money. " Neoliberalism was chugging along nicely until they ran out of public entities to sell off. Socialised debt, privatised profit. Get your wallets out. | |||
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"Reform what else is there " Literally everything. But if you want specifics, self-respect. | |||
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