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"Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats?" "No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose" If they have nothing, how are they managing to get onto a boat to make the crossing? | |||
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"It did work for Denmark. The number of asylum applicants went down drastically there. It was the left wing party in Denmark that did this because they were sane enough and hence were able to keep the right wingers off power. They did these while they were called fascists by other political parties in Europe, some of whom are now thinking about using the same methods. The question is how many of Denmark's methods can be implemented in UK. For example, the anti-ghetto rules will not work here anymore and the jewellery law will be quite controversial too. But things like limiting access to permanent residency, family reunions and sending them back even if their home country's situation is even marginally better could work here. " Yes it seems Denmark have their version of reform who was also pushing the sitting government and looks like this is to counter them and show the population they are listening to concerns. If the policy has worked then no wonder several countries that criticise such things are now interested | |||
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"Why do they need to visit Denmark for ideas, they’ve been waiting to run the country for 14 years and supposedly were ready to hit the ground running on day 1… They couldn’t run a bath, let alone a country Trump stopped the crossings within a week of being elected, this lot couldn’t stop the traffic at a pelican crossing" Put Israeli Navy in the channel and there will be no more small boats, none. When they see the Star of David they will be paddling back to France at a pace | |||
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"Why do they need to visit Denmark for ideas, they’ve been waiting to run the country for 14 years and supposedly were ready to hit the ground running on day 1… They couldn’t run a bath, let alone a country Trump stopped the crossings within a week of being elected, this lot couldn’t stop the traffic at a pelican crossing" Well yes they were to hit the ground running as soon as elected. I suspect they are starting to realise that their own plans are not going very well so far. They may also be starting to realise that this is an important topic with the population and just accusing others of being racist for wanting to tackle it has backfired. The Denmark scheme is I suspect fairly new and seems they had to face up to reality or face election pressure from other parties willing to address the issue. | |||
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"Well yes they were to hit the ground running as soon as elected. I suspect they are starting to realise that their own plans are not going very well so far. They may also be starting to realise that this is an important topic with the population and just accusing others of being racist for wanting to tackle it has backfired. The Denmark scheme is I suspect fairly new and seems they had to face up to reality or face election pressure from other parties willing to address the issue." From the rhetoric, I get the feeling that they aren't actually intending to do anything about it, they just want to look like they're doing something. They seem to be announcing that working groups will study what has happened in Denmark and then report back at some unspecified future date, at which point the government will consider whether any changes might be warranted. I'm not expecting anything to happen before the end of this parliament. Though that might be sooner than we think at this rate. | |||
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" I'm not expecting anything to happen before the end of this parliament. Though that might be sooner than we think at this rate." 16 months in, 44 to go Will they run the term ? | |||
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"Well yes they were to hit the ground running as soon as elected. I suspect they are starting to realise that their own plans are not going very well so far. They may also be starting to realise that this is an important topic with the population and just accusing others of being racist for wanting to tackle it has backfired. The Denmark scheme is I suspect fairly new and seems they had to face up to reality or face election pressure from other parties willing to address the issue. From the rhetoric, I get the feeling that they aren't actually intending to do anything about it, they just want to look like they're doing something. They seem to be announcing that working groups will study what has happened in Denmark and then report back at some unspecified future date, at which point the government will consider whether any changes might be warranted. I'm not expecting anything to happen before the end of this parliament. Though that might be sooner than we think at this rate." That is a fairly strong possibility I guess but wouldn't that just amount to another broken promise, which is hardly what they need. | |||
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"What happened to the one-in one-out scheme? How many did we send back? Any effect of that?" Not sure where the latest figures are to be found but have seen at the end of October it was around 70 returned so far. One of these in theory made the journey twice and deported twice. Perhaps they need more like him to boost the figures  | |||
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"Can anybody imagine ever running a private business this way. You wouldn’t see the month out if you did " July 2024 public sector net debt £2.54 trillion October 2025 - £2.9 trillion | |||
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"What happened to the one-in one-out scheme? How many did we send back? Any effect of that? Not sure where the latest figures are to be found but have seen at the end of October it was around 70 returned so far. One of these in theory made the journey twice and deported twice. Perhaps they need more like him to boost the figures "1772 arrived in last three days | |||
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"What happened to the one-in one-out scheme? How many did we send back? Any effect of that? Not sure where the latest figures are to be found but have seen at the end of October it was around 70 returned so far. One of these in theory made the journey twice and deported twice. Perhaps they need more like him to boost the figures "Curious what kind of deal the people smugglers offer now? Maybe they have a "pay once for as many journeys as you want" offer? 😂 | |||
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"Curious what kind of deal the people smugglers offer now? Maybe they have a "pay once for as many journeys as you want" offer? 😂" In some parts of the world, some of the NGO's are providing the funds to pay them. | |||
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"What happened to the one-in one-out scheme? How many did we send back? Any effect of that? Not sure where the latest figures are to be found but have seen at the end of October it was around 70 returned so far. One of these in theory made the journey twice and deported twice. Perhaps they need more like him to boost the figures
Curious what kind of deal the people smugglers offer now? Maybe they have a "pay once for as many journeys as you want" offer? 😂"Just read that another asylum seeker that was sent back to France under the one in one out scheme has returned to the UK. Mind you I read it on the BBC so could mean anything | |||
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"Use the Navy - if the government actually wanted to stop illegal immigration via small boats it really is that simple" It really isn't. What would you expect the Navy to do? | |||
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"Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats? No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose If they have nothing, how are they managing to get onto a boat to make the crossing?" Debt / “payment on arrival” arrangements. Migrants take on debt (to the smuggler or lenders) or agree to pay once they reach the destination. This often leads to exploitation or forced labour to repay the debt. | |||
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"Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats?" "No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose" "If they have nothing, how are they managing to get onto a boat to make the crossing?" "Debt / “payment on arrival” arrangements. Migrants take on debt (to the smuggler or lenders) or agree to pay once they reach the destination. This often leads to exploitation or forced labour to repay the debt." So you're saying that the bloke above was wrong, and they do have something to lose. | |||
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"Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats? No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose If they have nothing, how are they managing to get onto a boat to make the crossing? Debt / “payment on arrival” arrangements. Migrants take on debt (to the smuggler or lenders) or agree to pay once they reach the destination. This often leads to exploitation or forced labour to repay the debt." Stop the RNLI taxi service Stop the constant drone surveillance of the channel Stop making it easy to invade the UK | |||
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"6 November, 621 7 November, 648 8 November, 503 9 November, 349 4 days arrivals 2,121 39,075 have made the journey so far this year" Haven’t you heard Kiers smashed the gangs and now only has a 1 in 1 out policy monitored by the doorman and his finger clicker | |||
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"‘Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats?’ No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose " They look the trendiest people I've seen who (supposedly) have nothing. | |||
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"Send the cunts back, they deserve nothing except a one way ticket to the shithole they came from Anyone who crosses illegally should have their biometrics recorded and be banned for life." | |||
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"Stop housing them for free Stop free access to constant legal support Stop feeding them for free Stop giving them free access to smart TV Stop giving them free clothing Stop funding NGO’s who fight on their behalf and concentrate on our own populace for once" I don't think legal immigrants finds it fair?....they came in a legally way, working their ass off every day, paying taxes, sometimes more than some British person and they see that others gets everything for free.... | |||
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"Looking like the first of the Danish inspired changes could be announced on Monday. The change is about only granting temporary right to stay. When or if their home country is deemed safe, that can be returned " This makes sense and can be a really good deterrent. | |||
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"Would this help deter the people crossing in small boats? No. Because if you’ve got nothing you’ve got nothing to lose If they have nothing, how are they managing to get onto a boat to make the crossing?" exactly! Some pay over £6k while others force there way on! often killing women&children in the process! This proposal by mammoud is smoke&mirrors left wing propaganda that will never happen with anybody except reform!!! | |||
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"New proposed plan for people granted asylum in the UK, will now have a 20-year wait before they can apply to settle permanently Will that stop the boats, or smash the gangs, or reduce the £3bn hotel /hmo accommodation cost. Mears Group, Serco and Clearspings contracts offering above market local rents to intice landlords to house asylum over anyone else. On the hmos licensing not required if letting to Mears/serco. " My question is in that 20 year's who's paying for their upkeep? | |||
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"Freedom of information request apparently has revealed the government spent £200,000 on vapes delivered to a migrant hotel Budget next Wednesday for us to pay for this." Also the issue around paying taxi fares for them still has not been solved. Just remember next time you need to visit a hospital, don't drive there and pay for the parking as well as fuel, just get a taxi, I'm sure the government will pick up the tab | |||
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"Freedom of information request apparently has revealed the government spent £200,000 on vapes delivered to a migrant hotel Budget next Wednesday for us to pay for this." Yarl's Wood IRC is not a migrant hotel, it's an immigration detention centre for people awaiting removal and is reportedly the largest such facility in Europe. The place has a terrible reputation - google it to see the history. It's run by Serco and they are responsible for how they choose to spend their money. Serco banned smoking so I guess vapes are the only option. Although I suppose they could force everyone to give up nicotine completely. If you look at the number of people detained then the numbers of vapes used might not be out of proportions for a 21 month period. But it's a question for Serco not the government. | |||
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"The list of asylum policy changes are out and I think they will work well in the long term: - Today, asylum seekers granted refugee status can apply for permanent residency in 5 years. It has been changed to 20 years - Refugees will have to reapply for their refugee status every two-and-a-half years. If their country is deemed safe at that time, they will be sent back - ECHR interpretation of right to family life to be changed to be applicable only to immediate family members like parent or child - Limitations of benefits for asylum seekers. Additionally, if an asylum seeker is found to have high value items, they will be expected to pay for their own accommodation - AI to predict the age of asylum seekers - Legal routes for asylum seekers will be provided but capped. And people can sponsor asylum seekers themselves if they want - Modern sl&very laws to be reinterpreted to help deport dangerous criminals - Visa ban for three African countries who didn't cooperate well to take back failed asylum seekers" Some interesting proposals in there. Seems they are very keen on the Danish model which is understandable given it's success. A few labour MPs are not so keen but unless there is a serious rebellion they won't get to vote it down. Maybe it won't work as well as for Denmark but can't be much worse than the so called smash the gangs scenario | |||
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" Some interesting proposals in there. Seems they are very keen on the Danish model which is understandable given it's success. A few labour MPs are not so keen but unless there is a serious rebellion they won't get to vote it down. Maybe it won't work as well as for Denmark but can't be much worse than the so called smash the gangs scenario " Kemi seems to be supportive of it. It would be interesting to see how many Labour MPs vote against it and how many Tories vote in favour of it. | |||
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"I am amazed at this government and its lack of success stopping the small boats. Why didn't they copy the outstandingly successful immigration policies the Conservative governments of the previous 14years had carried out. " I sense sarcasm 🤣🤣🤣 | |||
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"The list of asylum policy changes are out and I think they will work well in the long term: - Today, asylum seekers granted refugee status can apply for permanent residency in 5 years. It has been changed to 20 years - Refugees will have to reapply for their refugee status every two-and-a-half years. If their country is deemed safe at that time, they will be sent back - ECHR interpretation of right to family life to be changed to be applicable only to immediate family members like parent or child - Limitations of benefits for asylum seekers. Additionally, if an asylum seeker is found to have high value items, they will be expected to pay for their own accommodation - AI to predict the age of asylum seekers - Legal routes for asylum seekers will be provided but capped. And people can sponsor asylum seekers themselves if they want - Modern sl&very laws to be reinterpreted to help deport dangerous criminals - Visa ban for three African countries who didn't cooperate well to take back failed asylum seekers" And this is what's wrong with politics these days. The government will announce a whole bunch of policy changes, and get people talking about what an improvement they are, while not actually putting any legislation forward. I'm betting that at the end of this parliament, almost none of the above will have actually happened. | |||
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"The list of asylum policy changes are out and I think they will work well in the long term: - Today, asylum seekers granted refugee status can apply for permanent residency in 5 years. It has been changed to 20 years - Refugees will have to reapply for their refugee status every two-and-a-half years. If their country is deemed safe at that time, they will be sent back - ECHR interpretation of right to family life to be changed to be applicable only to immediate family members like parent or child - Limitations of benefits for asylum seekers. Additionally, if an asylum seeker is found to have high value items, they will be expected to pay for their own accommodation - AI to predict the age of asylum seekers - Legal routes for asylum seekers will be provided but capped. And people can sponsor asylum seekers themselves if they want - Modern sl&very laws to be reinterpreted to help deport dangerous criminals - Visa ban for three African countries who didn't cooperate well to take back failed asylum seekers And this is what's wrong with politics these days. The government will announce a whole bunch of policy changes, and get people talking about what an improvement they are, while not actually putting any legislation forward. I'm betting that at the end of this parliament, almost none of the above will have actually happened." Positive thinking there lol. Have a brilliant day. | |||
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"And this is what's wrong with politics these days. The government will announce a whole bunch of policy changes, and get people talking about what an improvement they are, while not actually putting any legislation forward. I'm betting that at the end of this parliament, almost none of the above will have actually happened." I agree that we are not likely to see much movement in this space.. The governments efforts to control this issue will be undermined by the many MP's who are either blind to the issues within the country or put their own views first regardless of their constituents worries. Obviously the human rights lawyers, charities and pressure groups will be ramping up too. | |||
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"Why aren't France sorting it out. Britain gave them squillions to do so. If not ask for the money back and buy a couple of jet carriers and fly the dodgy ones back to their country of origin or continent. Should gave been nipped in the bud in the 80's. I'm all for integration but with a level of control. Set a limit. Plus vetting should be more stringent. If someone looks like a rapist or a murderer they probably are then delve into their history. Don't wait till they go on the rampage. The government's have faffed around now it's getting out of hand. No doubt when it all falls apart here everyone will be seeking sanctuary in another country. " What does a rapist or murderer look like. | |||
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" I'm not expecting anything to happen before the end of this parliament. Though that might be sooner than we think at this rate. 16 months in, 44 to go Will they run the term ? " 14 years of conservatives did not sort the immigration problem. Who do we try now? Reform? They are just watered down Trumpism and we can see where that has taken the USA. And please don't say Trump and ICE have stopped immigration. Who provides the statistice to prove that? What about the billions of dollars thrown at the issue? If it was easy any fool could do it. | |||
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"I find the rhetoric around the whole asylum and refugee debate very disturbing and distasteful. Especially when voiced by Reform who is led by a man who wants to run this country but is not fit enough to run a bath. Once you go down the path of demonising a group of people as part of a popularism agenda you are very slippery slope as history has proven. The first question to ask is why do people risk their lives to travel to this country in the first place and no it’s not to take your jobs or claim benefits as some would have us believe. So someone comes to this country with a basic grasp of the language and works as a cleaner for example. Then you complain that there are no jobs why aren’t you doing that job in the first place. That’s not to say that we should not have a robust and effective refugee and asylum process where people are treated humanely and efficiently. Start seeing these people like you and me and not as a group you can just stick labels on as that takes you down a dangerous road. One thing to note there is no such thing as illegal immigration as it a legal process just as breathing is a process. What is being referred to by the use of illegal immigration is actually illegal entry in to the UK. If you start using the correct terminology you can avoid falling into some of the traps that populist politicians have set for you. I have no doubt that will raise the hackles of many who have already fallen prey to bigotry and intolerance voiced by certain sections of society." The employment rate of asylum seekers who are given refugee status is about 51% and even the ones who work earn less than the national average. Are you willing to pay for all of them out of your own pockets? Considering most of the asylum seekers are single men with no background checks done on them, do you think a family with young children would be happy to live next to the hotels they are put up in? Protecting the borders is one of the primary responsibilities of a government. It's not unreasonable for people to have concerns about these issues. | |||
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"I find the rhetoric around the whole asylum and refugee debate very disturbing and distasteful. Especially when voiced by Reform who is led by a man who wants to run this country but is not fit enough to run a bath. Once you go down the path of demonising a group of people as part of a popularism agenda you are very slippery slope as history has proven. The first question to ask is why do people risk their lives to travel to this country in the first place and no it’s not to take your jobs or claim benefits as some would have us believe. So someone comes to this country with a basic grasp of the language and works as a cleaner for example. Then you complain that there are no jobs why aren’t you doing that job in the first place. That’s not to say that we should not have a robust and effective refugee and asylum process where people are treated humanely and efficiently. Start seeing these people like you and me and not as a group you can just stick labels on as that takes you down a dangerous road. One thing to note there is no such thing as illegal immigration as it a legal process just as breathing is a process. What is being referred to by the use of illegal immigration is actually illegal entry in to the UK. If you start using the correct terminology you can avoid falling into some of the traps that populist politicians have set for you. I have no doubt that will raise the hackles of many who have already fallen prey to bigotry and intolerance voiced by certain sections of society." You can't treat all small boat arrivals as if they are fleeing life threatening danger, they simply are not. Tens of thousands of mainly young men are making a choice to cross safe countries and pay criminal gangs to get them to their chosen final destination, the UK. People are angry because billions are being spent on hotel rooms, food and support while their public services are collapsing. Dismissing their anger as bigotry is akin to sweeping it under the carpet and that is another reason people are angry. The irony is small boat crossings hit genuine asylum seekers the most. The system is overwhelmed by people who should not be here, those who are really fleeing danger are stuck, how do they pay the criminal gangs and if they can pay they get wrapped up with the tens of thousands that shouldn't be here and take up all processing time. The labour government started out thinking this was an easy thing to solve and people will be happy with empty promises, they have now come to understand the enormity of the problem and the anger it is creating. | |||
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"The first question to ask is why do people risk their lives to travel to this country in the first place and no it’s not to take your jobs or claim benefits as some would have us believe." So what do you believe to be the reasons that people come to this country? "One thing to note there is no such thing as illegal immigration as it a legal process just as breathing is a process. What is being referred to by the use of illegal immigration is actually illegal entry in to the UK." It's very common for people to start redefining language to try to re-frame the argument in a way that suits their purposes, and that's what you are trying to do here. The fact is that the main laws governing entry into the UK are the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999, and the Immigration Act 2016. Any offences covered by these acts are "Immigration Offences", and can reasonably be called "illegal immigration". | |||
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"There is a common misconception that asylum seekers are almost exclusively young men. Gender should not dictate your right to safety. No human being is illegal, and seeking asylum is a human right. While 18 to 49 year olds make up the majority, they are not the only group, and there are significant numbers of women and children seeking asylum as well. Firstly, asylum seekers do not migrate by choice. They flee persecution and life-threatening situations, seeking safety and protection. There is an oft-quoted line from Somali-British writer Warsan Shire on seeking asylum - she says that no one puts their child in a boat unless the water is safer than the land. And no one leaves home unless home is the mouth of a shark. The dangerous nature of certain journeys, such as small boat crossings, means more men are often able to make the trip alone, while women and children may stay in camps until a safer way for them to travel can be found. The motivation for the reason for making these journeys are many for fleeing conflict and persecution are varied and affect all genders. For many men, this includes evading military conscription, which is often punishable by imprisonment. Undoubtedly some are just purely economic migrants but theses are very much in the minority. Just 1% of the refugees who have been displaced across the world make the UK their home. They make up around 0.6% of the UK population. And, based on the number of asylum applications per capita, the UK currently ranks 20th in Europe. This is borne out by official statistics on the boarder control page of gov.uk website. The total number of asylum seekers in the UK is lower than many believe, and the vast majority of applications for protection are granted as people are found to be in genuine need. Asylum seekers come to the UK for various reasons, often driven by existing family or community ties, and because they speak English, which is a significant factor for integration. Other factors include the UK's historical and colonial links with their home countries, the UK's perceived human rights record, and sometimes a lack of other safe routes to claim asylum. For many, their journey is dictated by circumstances, including being forced to rely on people smugglers due to a lack of official safe routes, or following limited options available to them. There is no easy option for any government of any flavour to adopt but unfortunately using the politics of fear that is peddled by certain politicians and sections of the media intent on stoking up division as this only leads to anger and hatred. Which is a destructive path to tread. If you only get your news from certain sources and are mesmerised by politicians that say what you want to hear rather than understanding what is the actual reality then you have fallen into their trap of echoing their lies. " It could be that you should follow your own advice and take your news from other sources? You mentioned 1% and 0.6% I googled that and found it is directly from 2018 Labour Force Survey data and the numbers that crossed in small boats that year 299. It is better to translate the numbers of small boat entrants to something meaningful, over the last 10 years the numbers of small boat arrivals are equal to the population of Oxford. Real asylum seekers deserve to be supported, the tens of thousands that are here gaming the system, that we know nothing about are preventing the genuine asylum seekers the opportunity of asylum. Thankfully those that are blind to the worsening situation are becoming less in number, as even the hardcore empathetic are waking up to the fact they put their faith into the nefarious who are using our goodwill to prosper at the countries expense. | |||
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"There is a common misconception that asylum seekers are almost exclusively young men. " Data shows 75% of them area adult males. 16% of them are under 18. So not really a misconception. https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-system-statistics-year-ending-june-2025/how-many-people-come-to-the-uk-irregularly " No human being is illegal, " No one said human beings are illegal. But the act of getting into another country without permission is illegal. " and seeking asylum is a human right. " Similarly Denying asylum is the right of the country where they apply from. The proposed rules don't ban them from applying for asylum. " While 18 to 49 year olds make up the majority, they are not the only group, and there are significant numbers of women and children seeking asylum as well. " Wrong. See the numbers above. It's only from Ukraine that we received mostly women and children as refugees. " Firstly, asylum seekers do not migrate by choice. They flee persecution and life-threatening situations, seeking safety and protection. " It's on the asylum seekers to prove it. It's especially hard to use this excuse when they are taking boats from France paying lot of money to criminals. " There is an oft-quoted line from Somali-British writer Warsan Shire on seeking asylum - she says that no one puts their child in a boat unless the water is safer than the land. And no one leaves home unless home is the mouth of a shark. " Emotional, but unfortunately not the truth for most people. " The dangerous nature of certain journeys, such as small boat crossings, means more men are often able to make the trip alone, while women and children may stay in camps until a safer way for them to travel can be found. " Do you have statistics to back this claim? I don't think so. " There is no easy option for any government of any flavour to adopt but unfortunately using the politics of fear that is peddled by certain politicians and sections of the media intent on stoking up division as this only leads to anger and hatred. Which is a destructive path to tread. " The solution to this is simple. People like you who care about asylum seekers so much can pay for their accommodation, make sure they get a job and take responsibility if they commit crimes. | |||
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"There is an oft-quoted line from Somali-British writer Warsan Shire on seeking asylum - she says that no one puts their child in a boat unless the water is safer than the land." Has anyone ever taken her to France so that she can see people carrying their children onto boats, and she can help determine whether the water is indeed safer than the French shoreline? "For many, their journey is dictated by circumstances, including being forced to rely on people smugglers due to a lack of official safe routes" Nobody is forced to to use people smugglers to come to the UK. They always have the option of choosing another safe country, most of which are much easier, and safer, to get to. | |||
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"Why aren't France sorting it out. Britain gave them squillions to do so. If not ask for the money back and buy a couple of jet carriers and fly the dodgy ones back to their country of origin or continent. Should gave been nipped in the bud in the 80's. I'm all for integration but with a level of control. Set a limit. Plus vetting should be more stringent. If someone looks like a rapist or a murderer they probably are then delve into their history. Don't wait till they go on the rampage. The government's have faffed around now it's getting out of hand. No doubt when it all falls apart here everyone will be seeking sanctuary in another country. What does a rapist or murderer look like. " Photographs are available of all convicted ones. Problem is that it will only be a mugshot and not show that their flies are already undone or they are carrying weapons... | |||
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"I'm all for integration but with a level of control. Set a limit. Plus vetting should be more stringent. If someone looks like a rapist or a murderer they probably are then delve into their history. Don't wait till they go on the rampage." "What does a rapist or murderer look like." "Photographs are available of all convicted ones." Only in the country that convicted them. They might have multiple convictions in their home country, but it's surprising how much information gets lost when an enquiry is made about deporting a criminal back to where they came from. That was one of the big problems with the Dublin Agreements. A startling number of countries 'forgot' that certain individuals had previously applied to them, which meant that when those people turned up in the UK we couldn't send them back. | |||
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