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anybody know about consumer rights ?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

my mate bought a second hand car from a trade dealer in early april.

he paid £1,200 for it so as u can tell it is not exactly 'new'

it came with no warranty but a 12 month MOT.

it broke down last week and the head gasket has blown + it has a hole in 1 of the pistons.

result is it needs a new engine, which he has been quoted £1,000 to £1,200 for - so the chances are it's headed to the scrapper.

so seems to me like he's been sold a pup.

has he got any recourse from the dealer that sold it him or is it purely a case of 'let the buyer beware' and tough shit ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nope no warraranty no hope I'm afraid

The best he can hope for is a sympathetic dealer

But I wouldn't hold ya breath xx

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Nope no warraranty no hope I'm afraid

The best he can hope for is a sympathetic dealer

But I wouldn't hold ya breath xx "

that is pretty much my thinking

just wanted to see if anyone knew any different coz i haven't seen watchdog since lynn faulds-wood was on it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

i expect it had a pretty high mileage when he bought it. it happens mate

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

I would think no. I think from a dealer even if they don't give you a warranty they still have to sell you something fit for it's purpose, I am guessing it was fine when he bought it.

It is now 4 months after, I can't see them doing anything about it.

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By *etillanteWoman
over a year ago

.

Prob is an MOT only tells you a vehicle is road worthy at that time and really means nothing once it goes out of the testing station.

Think your pal is gonna have to grin and bear it

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Prob is an MOT only tells you a vehicle is road worthy at that time and really means nothing once it goes out of the testing station.

Think your pal is gonna have to grin and bear it"

yeah av told him that - and to cut his losses rather than 'kicking off' about it because it won't go anywhere

i guess it's just frustration on his part that he is skint and feels he's been ripped off

he'll calm down when the next old banger arrives

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Unless he can prove that the dealer deliberately set out to deceive him over the condition of the vehicle he's stuffed really.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Have a look at the honest john motoring website - lots of helpful stuff on there

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

what car is it?

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By *adchickCouple
over a year ago

Cyprus

Look in the service book, if he got one and see what works been done. If there is anything in there about the head gasket (or cam belt) over the past year, or within cam belt mileage, he may have recourse over those that fitted/carried out any works.

Other than that, probably no come back. Unfortunately, head gaskets can 'go' at anytime, even on new cars and only the warranty will cover them.

Jason's just started out on his own and is giving a warranty on used cars, even those for 1st time drivers, and a 6 month warranty at that.

The advice he gives is...... whatever car you buy, buy a warranty if one isn't offered...... there are not expensive but will give peace of mind.

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By *ENGUYMan
over a year ago

Hull


"my mate bought a second hand car from a trade dealer in early april.

he paid £1,200 for it so as u can tell it is not exactly 'new'

it came with no warranty but a 12 month MOT.

it broke down last week and the head gasket has blown + it has a hole in 1 of the pistons.

result is it needs a new engine, which he has been quoted £1,000 to £1,200 for - so the chances are it's headed to the scrapper.

so seems to me like he's been sold a pup.

has he got any recourse from the dealer that sold it him or is it purely a case of 'let the buyer beware' and tough shit ?"

I had similar problems with a second hand car I bought, even with a six months warranty, which cost almost the original cost again 10 months after purchase, to put right.

I took some legal advice, but whilst technical people advised me that the mechanical problems could have been in their early stages of malfunction when I purchased the car, I'd have an uphill struggle to prove that the dealer sold me a duff car. In other words, put it down to experience and walk away!!

Thus in this case, without a warranty, tough as it seems, you have answered your post in the last line - "let the buyer beware and tough shit".

It's harsh I know, but all he can do is walk away.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

old cars sold on forcourts are sold just like they are privately and are sold as seen .its up to the buyer to do the checks on the car and once cash has been exchanged the car and all its faults are yours.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You say your mate bought it unwarranted in April so has presumably he has been getting satisfactory use of the car since then,,,, there is no way on gods earth he can expect the dealer to now compensate him because the engine has now gone wrong, as the problem you describe can easily be caused to a good engine being treated badly by its user in a very short space of time,,,,, even if that were not the case!!!!

,,,,

You’ll no doubt also only have your mate's word he’s checked and topped up the oil correctly since he acquired the vehicle unless of course he has documented evidence having paid someone do it for him.

And that’s before even taking into account your mate driving style,,,,,, again you can only take his word that he always adheres to sympathetic driving technique’s and does not stray into a lead footed approach coupled to inappropriate gear selection style when other people are not present in the car with him,,,,, .....

I mean come on.... whats next?.... " these tyres were brand new when I bought the car,,,, and I've only done twenty thousand miles on them and now they are bald,,,,I demand a refund!!!!"

Oh,I know.... I'm bit harsh...but its how I role.....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You say your mate bought it unwarranted in April so has presumably he has been getting satisfactory use of the car since then,,,, there is no way on gods earth he can expect the dealer to now compensate him because the engine has now gone wrong, as the problem you describe can easily be caused to a good engine being treated badly by its user in a very short space of time,,,,, even if that were not the case!!!!

,,,,

You’ll no doubt also only have your mate's word he’s checked and topped up the oil correctly since he acquired the vehicle unless of course he has documented evidence having paid someone do it for him.

And that’s before even taking into account your mate driving style,,,,,, again you can only take his word that he always adheres to sympathetic driving technique’s and does not stray into a lead footed approach coupled to inappropriate gear selection style when other people are not present in the car with him,,,,, .....

I mean come on.... whats next?.... " these tyres were brand new when I bought the car,,,, and I've only done twenty thousand miles on them and now they are bald,,,,I demand a refund!!!!"

Oh,I know.... I'm bit harsh...but its how I role..... "

+1

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By *eppersCouple
over a year ago

telford

BUY a Haynes Bible, and fix it yourself, its not difficult, just remember to have the head skimmed, After i got ill Kaz did a headgasket on our vectra 1.7td, she was as proud as punch when she finished it, if kaz can do it, anyone can,

Designed by man

Built by man

Driven by pillocks

and even women can repair.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"You say your mate bought it unwarranted in April so has presumably he has been getting satisfactory use of the car since then,,,, there is no way on gods earth he can expect the dealer to now compensate him because the engine has now gone wrong, as the problem you describe can easily be caused to a good engine being treated badly by its user in a very short space of time,,,,, even if that were not the case!!!!

,,,,

You’ll no doubt also only have your mate's word he’s checked and topped up the oil correctly since he acquired the vehicle unless of course he has documented evidence having paid someone do it for him.

And that’s before even taking into account your mate driving style,,,,,, again you can only take his word that he always adheres to sympathetic driving technique’s and does not stray into a lead footed approach coupled to inappropriate gear selection style when other people are not present in the car with him,,,,, .....

I mean come on.... whats next?.... " these tyres were brand new when I bought the car,,,, and I've only done twenty thousand miles on them and now they are bald,,,,I demand a refund!!!!"

Oh,I know.... I'm bit harsh...but its how I role.....

+1"

no need for the arseyness tbh - i wasn't defending him but rather asking advice and stating the facts as they stand

ie he ain't had it long and it's fucked !

the responses before your own 'ten penneth' do infact match my own thoughts on the matter

i just wanted to check in case i could offer the lad some flicker of hope

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I asked advice about something similar where a garage had fitted wrong parts to my car and the engine was damaged beyond repair from piston and valves going through cylinder head. They blamed me because I didnt tell them what sort of work I wanted doing on car - laughable!!

Ten long months later and lots of wearing down letters they put a claim into their public liability insurers who have settled my claim against the garage in full. So sometimes it pays to be persistant.

Have you looked at their dealership guarantees or any membership of motor traders associations etc? If you wrote to them about it and said you didnt think they deserved being a member of their organisation this often helps.

Just make sure your friend sends any copies of letters by recorded delivery etc.

I think the only comeback in this case might be write it off as the garage will just say its one of those things that happen.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Have a look at the "sales of goods act" the wording is ambiguous and can therefore be used to your advantage.

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By *eaboMan
over a year ago

marden

sorry to say after four months you have no chance. Some cars are prone to head gasket failure, and somtimes they go. Particularly on engines with aluminium heads.

As for doing it yourself, the engine will have to be totaly stripped, the holed piston has sprayed aluminium throughout your engine, even the smallest piece in a bearing will wreck the engine again. Skiming the head is a precision and expensive job which can be easily done wrong. It may not need it but without checking you cant tell.

The best advice i fear is to scrap it.

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By *urreyfun2008Man
over a year ago

East Grinstead

Getting an AA comprehensive check is probably a good idea on any second hand car.

Driving is not a cheap game, some get lucky with cheap second hand cars, but some of that may be driving style, i.e. kinder on the poor thing.

Also why seeing more Hyundai's with long warranties I guess.

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

If tyres go bald in just twenty thousand miles, yeah i wish, why dont they sell hairy ones to begin with?

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By *adchickCouple
over a year ago

Cyprus


"old cars sold on forcourts are sold just like they are privately and are sold as seen .its up to the buyer to do the checks on the car and once cash has been exchanged the car and all its faults are yours."

I've just spoken to Jason on this and he says....

The above quote is incorrect.

NO car can be 'sold as seen'.

They have to be sold as 'spares or repair' or 'scrap' otherwise they have to be 'fit for purpose'

Speak to your local Trading Standards Office, explain how, when and under what heading (and whats on the invoice) you bought the car and they will advise if you are entitled to take it back to the dealer or not.

However, head gaskets are notoriously difficult to diagnose and can go at anytime on any car.

HOWEVER, a head gasket will not put a hole in a piston. It is more likely to be the cam belt gone and broken a valve off and it's gone through the piston. Either way...... there is something seriously wrong with the car.

So, the garage is right, it probably needs a new engine.

Now a lesson for those of us that know nowt about cars.

A head gasket will either put water into the oil or oil into the water but will still drive. When you buy a car, check the oil and the water and if either is milky then you have a problem and the head gasket is gone. You will still be able to drive but you will go through an inordinate amount of oil or water.

Cam belts can't be diagnosed until they've gone. However, when buying a car, the only thing you can do is to check when the cam belt was last changed (should be in the service history or an invoice) and make sure it is still within mileage.

If unsure at all......... have the cam belt changed immediately or ask the dealer to do it on the car before you drive it away, instead of giving you any discount. Far better for peace of mind.

One more point...... tell him to take it back to the garage where they diagnosed the head gasket and ask them to diagnose it correctly or at least tell him why it needs a new engine.

Jason can't understand why they've diagnosed a hole in the piston unless they've taken the head off and had a look.

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By *urreyfun2008Man
over a year ago

East Grinstead

Surely easy to check piston head condition these days, small endoscope affair feed in via a spark plug hole?

My first car the you could even see the piston head when you hand cranked the engine with the spark plugs out.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"One more point...... tell him to take it back to the garage where they diagnosed the head gasket and ask them to diagnose it correctly or at least tell him why it needs a new engine.

Jason can't understand why they've diagnosed a hole in the piston unless they've taken the head off and had a look.

"

As I understand it, that's exactly what they have done. They asked him to come up to the garage and showed him the damage to the piston.

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By *adchickCouple
over a year ago

Cyprus


"One more point...... tell him to take it back to the garage where they diagnosed the head gasket and ask them to diagnose it correctly or at least tell him why it needs a new engine.

Jason can't understand why they've diagnosed a hole in the piston unless they've taken the head off and had a look.

As I understand it, that's exactly what they have done. They asked him to come up to the garage and showed him the damage to the piston."

Then......... the cam belt has put a hole in the piston and it's fucked ..... but it's not the head gasket.

By the way, just in cause you doubt, Jasons been working with cars for 25 years.

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By *adchickCouple
over a year ago

Cyprus


"Surely easy to check piston head condition these days, small endoscope affair feed in via a spark plug hole?

My first car the you could even see the piston head when you hand cranked the engine with the spark plugs out."

We take your point about the endoscope... however, not all garages use them.

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By *hite SnakeMan
over a year ago

leeds

ALL cars sold by a dealer have to have at least 3 months warranty by law.

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By *adchickCouple
over a year ago

Cyprus


"ALL cars sold by a dealer have to have at least 3 months warranty by law."

No they don't.

It depends on how they are sold. If they are sold as 'scrap' or 'spares or repair' they don't need a warranty.

Retail cars..... minimum is 3 months warranty.

So..... if the OP's friend didn't get a warranty then he was either sold the car as 'scrap' or 'spares and repair'.

However, if the invoice (if he got one) doesn't say this, and doesn't say "no warranty implied or given" then he does have recourse and needs to speak to Trading Standards or the dealership immediately.

Also, the warranty is between the warranty company and the purchaser and NOT with the dealership.

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Did he pay by credit card? If he has any financial redress at all, the credit card co. may also be liable and be the better party to pursue.

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