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"England ? You do know this is the uk. " Number 11 was going to be independence for Scotland , Ireland and Wales  | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good" Where to? | |||
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"England ? You do know this is the uk. " Lmao good point well made  | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to?" Essex  | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" I think this has been based on headlines and envy rather than fact and financial sense. Understandable, but not really helpful. | |||
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"England ? You do know this is the uk. Number 11 was going to be independence for Scotland , Ireland and Wales "He/she was doing well til that point . Hate sloppiness + errr, that would need a vote of the public . Thankfully the bright Scots saved our glorious Union last time | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to? Essex "Blimey! The Dartford Crossing would get busy on visiting day. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage. | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to?" Well, we buy one of the remote Falkland islands from any inhabitants having compensated them well. No infrastructure at all and each month a ship leaves Southampton loaded with all the criminal scum and delivers them in the south Atlantic island. Result? Very little crime. I know ..yes we did this years ago but that was for poor souls stealing to stay alive. This country is left for decent hard working peeps. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? I think this has been based on headlines and envy rather than fact and financial sense. Understandable, but not really helpful. " Helpful? I feel this thread is more to have a bit of a rant, raise conversation or even dare I say it, tongue in cheek in places. I don't think it's a genuine manifesto to challenge the status quo. I also can't wait to see a policeman challenge someone and ask them how to prove pythagarous theorem in full. English or not, it may challenge a few. | |||
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"I hate the "front line good / back office bad" public sector dichotomy. It's utter bollocks. The admin staff, finance staff, legal staff etc might not have the public sympathy but how the hell do you think the front line services function? So you lost me at the first suggestion. " Good point | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" good of you to publish ukips next manifesto early  | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to? Essex
Blimey! The Dartford Crossing would get busy on visiting day."Just imagine the revenue from the tolls, though  | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" Nothing on corporations, retirement, prison reform, working hours, funding the health service, Europe, transport, climate change. Half assed really | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good" Not judgemental all we all knew all offenders were foreign | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to? Essex "Oi! Fuck off,we've already got all the Chavs  | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? Nothing on corporations, retirement, prison reform, working hours, funding the health service, Europe, transport, climate change. Half assed really " They forgot benefit scrounging too. | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....  "Just build them out of twiglets | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" I think it's a good job you aren't an economist | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets "That could work...... | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets
That could work...... "I love Marmite,but I can't stand Twiglets | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets
That could work......
I love Marmite,but I can't stand Twiglets "Well we could try using crisps..... but I wouldn't recommend flying them in the rain...... | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets
That could work......
I love Marmite,but I can't stand Twiglets
Well we could try using crisps..... but I wouldn't recommend flying them in the rain...... "Aeros? | |||
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"10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage." I can't speak to the rest of it, but, from experience, this point is spot on. -Courtney | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets
That could work......
I love Marmite,but I can't stand Twiglets
Well we could try using crisps..... but I wouldn't recommend flying them in the rain......
Aeros? "about as much use as a chocolate teapot | |||
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"I like the idea of Marmite flavoured aircraft.....
Just build them out of twiglets
That could work......
I love Marmite,but I can't stand Twiglets
Well we could try using crisps..... but I wouldn't recommend flying them in the rain......
Aeros? "It has possibilities..... but I wouldn't be keen to use them on sunny days......  | |||
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"All flawed imho especially number one. I would take great offence if someone in the UK payed much less tax than myself because of their chosen occupation. It's your choice what you do in life but to expect the VIP treatment for your job is ridiculous. " I agree it's a flawed proposition, but it comes from the background of front line workers being assaulted and attacked so deserving of recognition. At least I think it does | |||
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"All flawed imho especially number one. I would take great offence if someone in the UK payed much less tax than myself because of their chosen occupation. It's your choice what you do in life but to expect the VIP treatment for your job is ridiculous. I agree it's a flawed proposition, but it comes from the background of front line workers being assaulted and attacked so deserving of recognition. At least I think it does " By that logic we should give bartenders and private security staff a tax cut because they're more likely to be assaulted and attacked at work than some other people. | |||
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"All flawed imho especially number one. I would take great offence if someone in the UK payed much less tax than myself because of their chosen occupation. It's your choice what you do in life but to expect the VIP treatment for your job is ridiculous. I agree it's a flawed proposition, but it comes from the background of front line workers being assaulted and attacked so deserving of recognition. At least I think it does " I'm not convinced how many front line public sector staff are actually at risk but I would have thought higher pay would be a better way of acknowledging the dangers inherent in some positions. Or look at eliminating those dangers where possible. | |||
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" 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. " Sounds a lot like Donald Trumps idea to ban all Muslims entering the US until the government "works out what it's doing" - some, vague, undefined point that will never officially happen. If you look at the size difference between overseas aid and the DWP you'd know why this is a stupid idea... | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage."
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP... | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! " You haven't seen yes minister have you? Most of it is available already via FOI | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! " Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage.
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP..."I don't consider myself to have particularly left-wing _iews politically. | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. " Yep
I was the Access to Information Officer where I last worked ....
What with FPI, RPSI, EIR, SAR I bloody well made sure as much was published on the Web as possible, just to make it easier, but the number of hits and downloads was minimal.
Not to mention the numpties who asked for this that and the other with no real reason other than to be vexatious | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. Yep
I was the Access to Information Officer where I last worked ....
What with FPI, RPSI, EIR, SAR I bloody well made sure as much was published on the Web as possible, just to make it easier, but the number of hits and downloads was minimal.
Not to mention the numpties who asked for this that and the other with no real reason other than to be vexatious "I feel your pain. Vexatious objections to the annual accounts are also a personal favourite. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage.
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP...
I don't consider myself to have particularly left-wing _iews politically."I no longer understand the meaning of left and right anyway, they seem to have been reversed from original definitions. Lefties were supposed to be libertarians (i.e the rights of the individual are most important) but they seem to entrust the responsibility of administrating that to the government which is the single biggest fucker of liberty imaginable. So in practice it seems to be the right wing who want less government even though conservatism is about restricting the rights of the individual for the benefit of society. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage.
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP...
I don't consider myself to have particularly left-wing _iews politically.
I no longer understand the meaning of left and right anyway, they seem to have been reversed from original definitions. Lefties were supposed to be libertarians (i.e the rights of the individual are most important) but they seem to entrust the responsibility of administrating that to the government which is the single biggest fucker of liberty imaginable. So in practice it seems to be the right wing who want less government even though conservatism is about restricting the rights of the individual for the benefit of society. "FWIW I broadly align with many Conservative/Right policies when it comes to budgets and money. But I see benefits from many of the things that the Left introduce too (and I don't consider them loony, just not of the world I want to live in). "Left" has never quite meant "libertarian", it's always meant quite a specific mindset when it comes to policy-making in this country. I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage.
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP...
I don't consider myself to have particularly left-wing _iews politically.
I no longer understand the meaning of left and right anyway, they seem to have been reversed from original definitions. Lefties were supposed to be libertarians (i.e the rights of the individual are most important) but they seem to entrust the responsibility of administrating that to the government which is the single biggest fucker of liberty imaginable. So in practice it seems to be the right wing who want less government even though conservatism is about restricting the rights of the individual for the benefit of society.
FWIW I broadly align with many Conservative/Right policies when it comes to budgets and money. But I see benefits from many of the things that the Left introduce too (and I don't consider them loony, just not of the world I want to live in).
"Left" has never quite meant "libertarian", it's always meant quite a specific mindset when it comes to policy-making in this country.
I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground."I consider myself a swinger, sexually and politically. I don't believe in any ideology and think politicians are generally more harmful than good / a necessary evil. The only way to mitigate that is to constantly switch votes in order to keep them on their toes. I think that people who never switch their votes are anti-democratic. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage.
I think waspy is turning me into a looney left because I agreed to with all of hers and none of the OP...
I don't consider myself to have particularly left-wing _iews politically.
I no longer understand the meaning of left and right anyway, they seem to have been reversed from original definitions. Lefties were supposed to be libertarians (i.e the rights of the individual are most important) but they seem to entrust the responsibility of administrating that to the government which is the single biggest fucker of liberty imaginable. So in practice it seems to be the right wing who want less government even though conservatism is about restricting the rights of the individual for the benefit of society.
FWIW I broadly align with many Conservative/Right policies when it comes to budgets and money. But I see benefits from many of the things that the Left introduce too (and I don't consider them loony, just not of the world I want to live in).
"Left" has never quite meant "libertarian", it's always meant quite a specific mindset when it comes to policy-making in this country.
I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground.
I consider myself a swinger, sexually and politically. I don't believe in any ideology and think politicians are generally more harmful than good / a necessary evil. The only way to mitigate that is to constantly switch votes in order to keep them on their toes. I think that people who never switch their votes are anti-democratic. "I don't think "swinger" is a political _iew... | |||
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" I don't think "swinger" is a political _iew..." That's strange, politicians always want swing voters... | |||
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"I have voted for the same party all my adult life. However, I am an active member of that party. I attend ward, council and regional meeting, I regularly vote on issues within the party and I campaign during elections. Am I undemocratic?" Any chance you could vote on them (MPs) stopping them giving themselves unearned and ridiculous pay increases | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. " . Have you ever tried fighting a local council over any particular issue?. Sure you can tap into lots of public stuff and yes, it's all boring and mundane, however on particular issues they have in my time been known to make many public paid for reports completely secret to anyone including some councillors. Local level council has less ability to corrupt itself I'll admit, however I've seen it myself on many occasions. On a national level it's much much worse, you only need look at the long time waited for report into the Iraq war! | |||
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"I have voted for the same party all my adult life. However, I am an active member of that party. I attend ward, council and regional meeting, I regularly vote on issues within the party and I campaign during elections. Am I undemocratic?" No, I don't think I phrased it well. I was trying to refer to people who passively and habitually vote for the same party every election without any real interest of consideration of the issues. They've known from a young age that it's "four legs good, two legs bad" so what else is there to think about... | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. . Have you ever tried fighting a local council over any particular issue?. Sure you can tap into lots of public stuff and yes, it's all boring and mundane, however on particular issues they have in my time been known to make many public paid for reports completely secret to anyone including some councillors. Local level council has less ability to corrupt itself I'll admit, however I've seen it myself on many occasions. On a national level it's much much worse, you only need look at the long time waited for report into the Iraq war!" What you're suggesting (disclosure of everything, ever) would do absolutely fuck all to deal with things like the delayed Iraq war report. It would probably worsen it by drowning people in extraneous data and information to obscure the real issue. It's often entirely suitable for information on reports to be in confidential form; apart from anything else, you would never get the private sector or other partners to do any business with you whatsoever if it wasn't. And yes, I have, it was frustrating but no more so than when I have had disputes with large companies. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. " I would require anyone who wanted a job as a government representative (as you suggest above in a specialist subject) to also obtain a qualification in politics - which would include media training and economics. I don't want people running the country who don't understand politics. Or economics. In fact I'd rather have a politician in the 'leading' role, and then an excellent set of advisors around them. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. " You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. | |||
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" I would require anyone who wanted a job as a government representative (as you suggest above in a specialist subject) to also obtain a qualification in politics - which would include media training and economics. I don't want people running the country who don't understand politics. Or economics. " Well that would eliminate the majority of the current lot!! Most of them couldn't define the difference between deficit and debt. | |||
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"All flawed imho especially number one. I would take great offence if someone in the UK payed much less tax than myself because of their chosen occupation. It's your choice what you do in life but to expect the VIP treatment for your job is ridiculous. I agree it's a flawed proposition, but it comes from the background of front line workers being assaulted and attacked so deserving of recognition. At least I think it does By that logic we should give bartenders and private security staff a tax cut because they're more likely to be assaulted and attacked at work than some other people." I'm not sure bartenders and private security staff necessarily provide a public service in the same way | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" I think you should be locked up | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. " I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. " Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. | |||
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"Just 1 change really. Open publicly available transparency on every single government meeting both local and national.... I mean every detail of every memo, email and transcript,I don't belive a government should have or need secrecy from its electorate! Have you heard of the Freedom of Information act? And do you fancy paying for the extra staff and systems to deal with the publication of every fucking little thing that no one is the slightest bit interested in? I saw the web stats for an organisation I work for, where I have to manage getting all the expenditure over £250 published. One month the report was downloaded twice. And one of those was probably me testing it. It's a monumental waste of people's time. Have a proper audit and inspection regime with some teeth, then you don't need all this armchair auditor shit. All meetings of local authorities are already public. I can't count on one hand the number of times in the last year there have actually been people who've turned up to the ones I attend as an officer. When is the last time you actually looked at any data for your local authority? There is a whole raft of stuff they're already required to publish, by law. Most are already opening up theIr data streams in open platform formats for use by anyone and everyone. Everyone thinks they're going to uncover the next big expenses scandal; the reality is infinitely more mundane. . Have you ever tried fighting a local council over any particular issue?. Sure you can tap into lots of public stuff and yes, it's all boring and mundane, however on particular issues they have in my time been known to make many public paid for reports completely secret to anyone including some councillors. Local level council has less ability to corrupt itself I'll admit, however I've seen it myself on many occasions. On a national level it's much much worse, you only need look at the long time waited for report into the Iraq war! What you're suggesting (disclosure of everything, ever) would do absolutely fuck all to deal with things like the delayed Iraq war report. It would probably worsen it by drowning people in extraneous data and information to obscure the real issue. It's often entirely suitable for information on reports to be in confidential form; apart from anything else, you would never get the private sector or other partners to do any business with you whatsoever if it wasn't. And yes, I have, it was frustrating but no more so than when I have had disputes with large companies. " . Exactly yeah the only difference being at least private companies are private, you expect it to an extent from them, what you don't expect is the run around from the local representative, who you find out 3 years later they've got dodgy ties to the third party your fighting! | |||
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"1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. "How about Chief Constables and fancy surgeons who spend most of their time in meetings or on the gold course? | |||
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"1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax.
How about Chief Constables and fancy surgeons who spend most of their time in meetings or on the gold course?"*golf | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. " Oh Thatcher...No I don't really know much about her tbh. Yeh TVP makes a lot of sense. | |||
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"All Mp's to vote how their constituents want them to vote,not how the party wants them to vote. This would be a good start for democracy." So we'd have a local referendum before each vote then? Sounds complicated. | |||
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"These things will never happen. Why. Because our great leaders are terrified of upsetting the rest of the e u. Our government are the biggest load of crap As I have said before = There are only Two Good politicians. A dead one. And one who has not been born "That's comedy gold right there. Have you got any gigs coming up ? | |||
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"I would, however, like to put myself forwards as Secretary of State for Affairs "Or you could just play your lengthy lists music in the house of Commons.  | |||
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"I would, however, like to put myself forwards as Secretary of State for Affairs
Or you could just play your lengthy lists music in the house of Commons. "It would sound better than hot air | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. " Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... | |||
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"England ? You do know this is the uk. Number 11 was going to be independence for Scotland , Ireland and Wales
He/she was doing well til that point .
Hate sloppiness + errr, that would need a vote of the public .
Thankfully the bright Scots saved our glorious Union last time " | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... " Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. " Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? " The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! " Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. " That's an idiotic comment. And immature. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. That's an idiotic comment. And immature. " As is the idea that anyone who disagrees with your very minority _iew point "just doesn't get it" | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. That's an idiotic comment. And immature. As is the idea that anyone who disagrees with your very minority _iew point "just doesn't get it" " But...you don't get it...That's not my fault. I've only met one person who understood it but didn't support it because he just didn't think the world would get better. But from what he said it was clear that he got the idea. But from what you say it's clear you don't. | |||
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"Not bad,... May need refining just a tad but - yes you're on the right track. I would add that after three serious criminal offences the offender is deported for good Where to? Well, we buy one of the remote Falkland islands from any inhabitants having compensated them well. No infrastructure at all and each month a ship leaves Southampton loaded with all the criminal scum and delivers them in the south Atlantic island. Result? Very little crime. I know ..yes we did this years ago but that was for poor souls stealing to stay alive. This country is left for decent hard working peeps." Aye it's bad enough these bleeders are stealing our jobs.....but I ain't sitting back while they go about stealing all the crimes I wanted to commit as well! Honest British crims for British crimes! | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. That's an idiotic comment. And immature. As is the idea that anyone who disagrees with your very minority _iew point "just doesn't get it" But...you don't get it...That's not my fault. I've only met one person who understood it but didn't support it because he just didn't think the world would get better. But from what he said it was clear that he got the idea. But from what you say it's clear you don't. " Oh well, guess I'm missing out then. None of the other people on the forum that I rate as intelligent got it either, people from all ends of the political spectrum. | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ?" | |||
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"I also can't wait to see a policeman challenge someone and ask them how to prove pythagarous theorem in full. English or not, it may challenge a few. "Like a plod would know | |||
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"You're wrong" Can you be more specific? | |||
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"None of the other people on the forum that I rate as intelligent got it either, people from all ends of the political spectrum. " I'd ask who you rate as 'intelligent' but it's not worth the pixels. | |||
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"You're wrong Can you be more specific?" I'm giving a brief synopsis of the debate. | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. That's an idiotic comment. And immature. As is the idea that anyone who disagrees with your very minority _iew point "just doesn't get it" But...you don't get it...That's not my fault. I've only met one person who understood it but didn't support it because he just didn't think the world would get better. But from what he said it was clear that he got the idea. But from what you say it's clear you don't. Oh well, guess I'm missing out then. None of the other people on the forum that I rate as intelligent got it either, people from all ends of the political spectrum. " It's not about people being intelligent or not. It's about the time spent learning about it. It's not something that someone can understand by having a quick skim through the website. | |||
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"You're wrong Can you be more specific? I'm giving a brief synopsis of the debate. "Ah yes, thank you. When I'm earning over £2 million I'd rather be able to do good with the money than pay over half of it in tax. Obviously I will never earn more than £1.9999 million  | |||
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"I found this inscription on the base of a statue of Mercury the other day, which I quite liked: "If you know better tell me, if not follow me." Seems fair" Seems logical too | |||
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"Honestly! You'd think people have nothing better to do than plan their next fuck" It's planned | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? I think this has been based on headlines and envy rather than fact and financial sense. Understandable, but not really helpful. " If you add leaving the EU into the equation you'll save over £20 billion per year which might be helpful. We pay far more in than we take out. Plus the extra taxation measures & loss of welfare to EU nationals. Add the extra cash you make when you make MPs serve 20+ years before they can draw a pension which is in line with what other public sector workers earn. Some additional food for thought. | |||
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"Honestly! You'd think people have nothing better to do than plan their next fuck It's planned "Me too | |||
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"My problem is that this is little more than an intellectual pissing contest. People don't want synthesis - they want to be 'right'. The world turns, people die of starvation, war, poverty and a host of preventables this debate changes nothing. Congratulations. Well done. "But starving African children have their bellies filled because of your witty comments? | |||
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"My problem is that this is little more than an intellectual pissing contest. People don't want synthesis - they want to be 'right'. The world turns, people die of starvation, war, poverty and a host of preventables this debate changes nothing. Congratulations. Well done.
But starving African children have their bellies filled because of your witty comments?"Which is why I support Save the Children, Sight Savers, Barnardos and told the family not to buy effing Xmas pressies we don't want or need but to spend it on some livestock in Africa last year. I agree. | |||
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"My problem is that this is little more than an intellectual pissing contest. People don't want synthesis - they want to be 'right'. The world turns, people die of starvation, war, poverty and a host of preventables this debate changes nothing. Congratulations. Well done.
But starving African children have their bellies filled because of your witty comments?
Which is why I support Save the Children, Sight Savers, Barnardos and told the family not to buy effing Xmas pressies we don't want or need but to spend it on some livestock in Africa last year.
I agree. "Good for you, enjoy your feeling of moral superiority and jack off whilst facing a mirror. | |||
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"Good for you, enjoy your feeling of moral superiority and jack off whilst facing a mirror. " I beg your pardon? | |||
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"My problem is that this is little more than an intellectual pissing contest. People don't want synthesis - they want to be 'right'. The world turns, people die of starvation, war, poverty and a host of preventables this debate changes nothing. Congratulations. Well done. "I think that's true to a certain degree. People I think have emotional attachments to their _iews. But it's good to get ideas out there. | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI" Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? | |||
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"My problem is that this is little more than an intellectual pissing contest. People don't want synthesis - they want to be 'right'. The world turns, people die of starvation, war, poverty and a host of preventables this debate changes nothing. Congratulations. Well done.
I think that's true to a certain degree. People I think have emotional attachments to their _iews.
But it's good to get ideas out there."Yes... Light, not heat | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? " Go find a political forum to play in | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in "Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in
Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw"Sorry, what was that? I was busy enjoying my feeling of moral superiority and jacking off whilst facing a mirror. Political debate! Pfft! | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in
Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw
Sorry, what was that?
I was busy enjoying my feeling of moral superiority and jacking off whilst facing a mirror.
Political debate!
Pfft!
"Be sure to fart in a glass when you finish and enjoy the smell | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in
Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw
Sorry, what was that?
I was busy enjoying my feeling of moral superiority and jacking off whilst facing a mirror.
Political debate!
Pfft!
Be sure to fart in a glass when you finish and enjoy the smell "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhWi1-fy-Xk | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in
Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw
Sorry, what was that?
I was busy enjoying my feeling of moral superiority and jacking off whilst facing a mirror.
Political debate!
Pfft!
Be sure to fart in a glass when you finish and enjoy the smell "Why do you have to be so horrible? | |||
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"You think you're gonna sit around at home complaining, smoking mary jane, thinking you're gonna change the world? You gotta fight sometimes. Alabama 3 live at the Astoria "Mao Tse Tung says" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpGgLyfDERI Who comes on fab to change the world ffs. If you can't debate on an Internet forum then where the heck are you supposed to debate? Go find a political forum to play in
Sorry I didn't realise the fab lounge was only for people who want to change the world. Do remind people on the kiss, fuck, avoid threads btw
Sorry, what was that?
I was busy enjoying my feeling of moral superiority and jacking off whilst facing a mirror.
Political debate!
Pfft!
Be sure to fart in a glass when you finish and enjoy the smell
Why do you have to be so horrible?"There's always method to my madness: https://youtu.be/ZTpgqqLyAs8 | |||
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"There's always method to my madness: https://youtu.be/ZTpgqqLyAs8" That looks like an episode of South Park, not your madness | |||
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"There's always method to my madness: https://youtu.be/ZTpgqqLyAs8 That looks like an episode of South Park, not your madness "It's the only political commentary that is truly neutral. I meant that I choose my words carefully. | |||
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"I have political _iews on General and local politics that I don't think I'd discuss in my swinging lifestyle. " Believe it or not, this isn't what we talk about in the hot tub at AbFabs... | |||
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"I have political _iews on General and local politics that I don't think I'd discuss in my swinging lifestyle. Believe it or not, this isn't what we talk about in the hot tub at AbFabs... " Mind you, politics is in everything we do! | |||
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"Feel free to discuss but these are my ideas for if I ever get in power 1 all front line public sector workers, soldiers, nurses, doctors, police etc only pay 5% income tax. 2 Professional sportsmen earning over 1 million pay an extra 2% on earnings 3 All earnings over 2 million a year are taxed at 55% for everyone. 4 If you want to live in England you must be able to answer in English any question asked to you by a police officer. 5 M.P's must spend 3 days a week available in their constituency. And 3 full days in parliament. 6 Why can you ride your moped to see your partner and have sex at 16 but you then can't have a glass of wine with them or play c.o.d for another two years? 17 is the new legal age for all . 7 no overseas aid until England is fixed and elderly are all warm and cared for. 8. Three strikes prison system 9. New maritime patrol aircraft to protect our shipping and shores 10 extra 2 % tax on all people moving to UK for 2 years to top up system. What do you think ? 1. Nope. A job is a job. Some jobs that are equally essential are not covered by 'front line'. 2. Nope, I don't agree with singling people out for tax based on what they're good at doing. 3. Do you have any reasonings for those figures? Any thoughts on exactly how much extra revenue that might raise? 4. Nope. I don't owe shit to any police officer. I have a right to not say anything to the police. 5. Nope. I don't believe in forcing people to work six day weeks. I think we should be actively looking to cut the number of hours that we work as a nation. 6. Because in our society we have decided that sex is less damaging to people than alcohol or violence. 7. Nope. Our elderly have had the opportunity to work and save all their lives, and they do already get some benefits due to their age. Many people overseas have not had the ability to work and save all their lives. And they get no benefits. And often we, as a country, are the cause of people overseas being forced out of their homes or being in the situations they are in (either through current actions or historical actions). I cannot turn my back on those who have nothing, for the sake of people who have more. 8. Three strikes... and then... what? 9. Protect our shipping and shores from what? 10. We need to encourage economic migrants who have relevant skills into our workplace. If we add extra tax onto economic migrants then they will simply go elsewhere, which will ultimately lead to us having weaker and less competitive industries on the world stage." You get my vote! | |||
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"I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground." is that like extreme middle of the road? i can hear the chants at their political demonstrations on route to hyde park ... what do we want? gradual change when do we want it? in due course | |||
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"I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground. is that like extreme middle of the road? i can hear the chants at their political demonstrations on route to hyde park ... what do we want? gradual change when do we want it? in due course" That did make me chuckle. But seriously people on marches aren't trying to change jack shit. They just want to release anger at something to make themselves feel better. I went down and met that lot at occupy London. You've never seen a less politically minded group of people in your life!! Most of them were intensely focussed on trying not to drool from whatever drugs they were on and the smell... Oh the smell... | |||
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"I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground. is that like extreme middle of the road? i can hear the chants at their political demonstrations on route to hyde park ... what do we want? gradual change when do we want it? in due course That did make me chuckle. But seriously people on marches aren't trying to change jack shit. They just want to release anger at something to make themselves feel better. I went down and met that lot at occupy London. You've never seen a less politically minded group of people in your life!! Most of them were intensely focussed on trying not to drool from whatever drugs they were on and the smell... Oh the smell... " It's easy to criticise | |||
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"I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground. is that like extreme middle of the road? i can hear the chants at their political demonstrations on route to hyde park ... what do we want? gradual change when do we want it? in due course That did make me chuckle. But seriously people on marches aren't trying to change jack shit. They just want to release anger at something to make themselves feel better. I went down and met that lot at occupy London. You've never seen a less politically minded group of people in your life!! Most of them were intensely focussed on trying not to drool from whatever drugs they were on and the smell... Oh the smell... It's easy to criticise" And anyway, I quite liked the little games they had going on, there was some nice art, some interesting banter and my mum had a nice afternoon out | |||
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"I consider myself a Radical Centrist - a position that is gaining ground. is that like extreme middle of the road? i can hear the chants at their political demonstrations on route to hyde park ... what do we want? gradual change when do we want it? in due course That did make me chuckle. But seriously people on marches aren't trying to change jack shit. They just want to release anger at something to make themselves feel better. I went down and met that lot at occupy London. You've never seen a less politically minded group of people in your life!! Most of them were intensely focussed on trying not to drool from whatever drugs they were on and the smell... Oh the smell... It's easy to criticise And anyway, I quite liked the little games they had going on, there was some nice art, some interesting banter and my mum had a nice afternoon out "I had some time to kill in London so I went there and vowed I would just listen and not present any of my own _iews. In all I spoke, or attempted to speak to 6 people. 3 were literally incapable of conversation. 2 basically refused to talk or answer questions like "what motivated you to come here?". 1 was a jolly nice chap and I asked him what the fuck he was doing hanging around with the other 5 idiots. His exact words were "yeah I know but they've been turned away from everywhere else and I didn't want to be the next guy to move them on". So it was basically a cross between a homeless shelter and a hippy camp. Not a novel by Havel between the lot of them. | |||
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"I remember on the Stop The War march in 2012, shimmying up a lamp post at Piccadilly Circus - a vast, unending mass of people... Some guys were sporting a banner that said: SMASH CAPITALISM AND REPLACE IT WITH SOMETHING NICER "Be honest Joe, you made the banner for them didn't you? | |||
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"I remember on the Stop The War march in 2012, shimmying up a lamp post at Piccadilly Circus - a vast, unending mass of people... Some guys were sporting a banner that said: SMASH CAPITALISM AND REPLACE IT WITH SOMETHING NICER "when we were on the CJB march in 1994 some guys had a banner that said SPREAD ANARCHY when they weren't looking we spray painted a line through it and wrote DONT TELL ME WHAT TO DO underneath it | |||
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"No mention of science in the OP... : / My government would be made up of people who are qualified for the job. Engineers, sociologists, health experts, criminal psychologists etc... No more business or law people in politics because they are not qualified. Science would be the way forward with the goal of improving everyones quality of life. You're a fan of Mrs T then? I don't think most of those things make you any more "qualified" to be in power anyway. You want a balance above all - too much concentration of a narrow range of specialities seems a bad thing to me. Personally I think there should be more historians in govenrment. I don't know who Mrs T is... I'm a fan of The Venus Project. Politics isn't needed at all. www.thevenusproject.com Politics and financial economics is primitive and out of date now. Our political/social structure is extremely far behind what's actually scientifically possible. Mrs Thatcher was the last prime minister to have been a scientist. I've seen the Venus Project stuff before, I won't go there with what I think of it. Please go there. I'm biting my tongue so much with the gaping flaws in it all but I really can't be arsed to explain it tonight... Oh I just realized it's you. Yes I remember the other thread about it. You didn't have any good points about it at all. Because you don't understand the difference between the scientific method, scientists and science as a field of employment. The latter is every but as political as the house of commons and the people themselves are as irrational in their personal beliefs as anyone else. The only way it could possibly work is with computers administering the allocation of resources, but I take it you've seen terminator? The terminator is a fictional film made for money. Not a documentary. The Venus Project isn't about putting scientists in control. I agree that there are a lot of scientist who are political/irrational etc...In THIS system. See! When I say people that disagree don't get it..it's true! Yeah, it's the rest of the world that's mad and you guys in the asylum are the normal ones. That's an idiotic comment. And immature. As is the idea that anyone who disagrees with your very minority _iew point "just doesn't get it" But...you don't get it...That's not my fault. I've only met one person who understood it but didn't support it because he just didn't think the world would get better. But from what he said it was clear that he got the idea. But from what you say it's clear you don't. Oh well, guess I'm missing out then. None of the other people on the forum that I rate as intelligent got it either, people from all ends of the political spectrum. It's not about people being intelligent or not. It's about the time spent learning about it. It's not something that someone can understand by having a quick skim through the website. " If an idea is so difficult to understand that barely anyone "gets" it - it is probably either a piss poor idea, or its proponents are doing a piss poor job of explaining it. Unless of course it's just a built-in I told you so? "We could have saved the world from this crisis, but you were all just to stupid to get it." "There's no point me trying to explain this, you won't get it." There are other possibilities out there other than just people not understanding it. I'd imagine many understand but don't agree with it. That shouldn't be beyond the realms of your understanding, however strongly you might believe in it. | |||
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" If an idea is so difficult to understand that barely anyone "gets" it - it is probably either a piss poor idea, or its proponents are doing a piss poor job of explaining it. Unless of course it's just a built-in I told you so? "We could have saved the world from this crisis, but you were all just to stupid to get it." "There's no point me trying to explain this, you won't get it." There are other possibilities out there other than just people not understanding it. I'd imagine many understand but don't agree with it. That shouldn't be beyond the realms of your understanding, however strongly you might believe in it. " The basic idea isn't too difficult to understand but because it covers everything involved in a social system and the physical infrastructure it can take time to go through it properly. There are lots of people who do understand it though so it's not that no-one gets it. Just some people don't get it. They COULD get it if they took the time but a lot of people just have a quick glance at the website and then form their judgement based on that. It's like watching the first scene of a film and judging the whole film. Think of a car mechanic who has spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. They will know more than someone who hasn't spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. | |||
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"I remember on the Stop The War march in 2012, shimmying up a lamp post at Piccadilly Circus - a vast, unending mass of people... Some guys were sporting a banner that said: SMASH CAPITALISM AND REPLACE IT WITH SOMETHING NICER
Be honest Joe, you made the banner for them didn't you? "No I did not... That's what we in the business call a joke. But I think you might make a good Commissar for Water Transport come the revolution. | |||
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" If an idea is so difficult to understand that barely anyone "gets" it - it is probably either a piss poor idea, or its proponents are doing a piss poor job of explaining it. Unless of course it's just a built-in I told you so? "We could have saved the world from this crisis, but you were all just to stupid to get it." "There's no point me trying to explain this, you won't get it." There are other possibilities out there other than just people not understanding it. I'd imagine many understand but don't agree with it. That shouldn't be beyond the realms of your understanding, however strongly you might believe in it. The basic idea isn't too difficult to understand but because it covers everything involved in a social system and the physical infrastructure it can take time to go through it properly. There are lots of people who do understand it though so it's not that no-one gets it. Just some people don't get it. They COULD get it if they took the time but a lot of people just have a quick glance at the website and then form their judgement based on that. It's like watching the first scene of a film and judging the whole film. Think of a car mechanic who has spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. They will know more than someone who hasn't spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. " Watching the first scene of a film and deciding it looks shit and you don't want to watch the rest of the film means it's a bad film, because it's failed in its purpose of grabbing your attention and making you want to watch it. If the people visiting the website aren't forming what you consider to be the right judgement because it hasn't grabbed their interest, then the website isn't presenting it well, which comes back to my point that the propagandists aren't putting their point across well. If everyone is just dismissing it without wanting to understand it, why do you think that is? | |||
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" If an idea is so difficult to understand that barely anyone "gets" it - it is probably either a piss poor idea, or its proponents are doing a piss poor job of explaining it. Unless of course it's just a built-in I told you so? "We could have saved the world from this crisis, but you were all just to stupid to get it." "There's no point me trying to explain this, you won't get it." There are other possibilities out there other than just people not understanding it. I'd imagine many understand but don't agree with it. That shouldn't be beyond the realms of your understanding, however strongly you might believe in it. The basic idea isn't too difficult to understand but because it covers everything involved in a social system and the physical infrastructure it can take time to go through it properly. There are lots of people who do understand it though so it's not that no-one gets it. Just some people don't get it. They COULD get it if they took the time but a lot of people just have a quick glance at the website and then form their judgement based on that. It's like watching the first scene of a film and judging the whole film. Think of a car mechanic who has spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. They will know more than someone who hasn't spent a lot of time learning about car mechanics. Watching the first scene of a film and deciding it looks shit and you don't want to watch the rest of the film means it's a bad film, because it's failed in its purpose of grabbing your attention and making you want to watch it. If the people visiting the website aren't forming what you consider to be the right judgement because it hasn't grabbed their interest, then the website isn't presenting it well, which comes back to my point that the propagandists aren't putting their point across well. If everyone is just dismissing it without wanting to understand it, why do you think that is? " | |||
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" Watching the first scene of a film and deciding it looks shit and you don't want to watch the rest of the film means it's a bad film, because it's failed in its purpose of grabbing your attention and making you want to watch it. If the people visiting the website aren't forming what you consider to be the right judgement because it hasn't grabbed their interest, then the website isn't presenting it well, which comes back to my point that the propagandists aren't putting their point across well. If everyone is just dismissing it without wanting to understand it, why do you think that is? " I don't think it's that people are making the wrong judgement so to speak. If someone fully understood it and still thought it wasn't possible then fair enough. Everyone isn't dismissing it. Only some people. I think if people are put off by the website and dismiss it then I think that is a poor reason for dismissing it. For TVP or anyone with any website about anything it would be difficult to create a 'one size fits all' website. Some will like it, some won't. My point is that whatever someones reason for dismissing it is, if they haven't learnt about it fully then by definition they won't understand it. That counts for TVP or anything else in life. If the website has prevented you from wanting to find out more that's fine by you can't then have a credible _iew of the idea itself. You can have a credible _iew of the website design/layout but not of the actual resource economy idea itself because you haven't learnt about it. Again....LOTS of people DO like it and support it so to blame TVP for a rubbish website doesn't hold true because plenty of people don't have a problem with the site at all. TVP are doing the best they can but there is only so much they can do. You can lead a horse to water...but can't make it drink it... | |||
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" Watching the first scene of a film and deciding it looks shit and you don't want to watch the rest of the film means it's a bad film, because it's failed in its purpose of grabbing your attention and making you want to watch it. If the people visiting the website aren't forming what you consider to be the right judgement because it hasn't grabbed their interest, then the website isn't presenting it well, which comes back to my point that the propagandists aren't putting their point across well. If everyone is just dismissing it without wanting to understand it, why do you think that is? I don't think it's that people are making the wrong judgement so to speak. If someone fully understood it and still thought it wasn't possible then fair enough. Everyone isn't dismissing it. Only some people. I think if people are put off by the website and dismiss it then I think that is a poor reason for dismissing it. For TVP or anyone with any website about anything it would be difficult to create a 'one size fits all' website. Some will like it, some won't. My point is that whatever someones reason for dismissing it is, if they haven't learnt about it fully then by definition they won't understand it. That counts for TVP or anything else in life. If the website has prevented you from wanting to find out more that's fine by you can't then have a credible _iew of the idea itself. You can have a credible _iew of the website design/layout but not of the actual resource economy idea itself because you haven't learnt about it. Again....LOTS of people DO like it and support it so to blame TVP for a rubbish website doesn't hold true because plenty of people don't have a problem with the site at all. TVP are doing the best they can but there is only so much they can do. You can lead a horse to water...but can't make it drink it..." Oh I wasn't put off by the website, or lack of understanding. I was put off by the fact it's utter, utter shit. But you seemed to be suggesting in your previous posts that either no one understood it (in which case it's a bad idea or being badly explained) or that they were just dismissing it without trying (in which case the exercise by the project of getting people to want to think about and to understand it has failed). You're convincing me more of my theory that it's building in a "told you so" mechanism because all the proponents can say "it's just because you didn't understand it, not like we higher beings do!" I am quite capable of reading something, understanding it and dismissing it for myself. Just because I don't agree doesn't mean I don't understand. | |||
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