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vehicle tracking.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

As we appear to be quite willing (at least our 'representatives do) to throw away yet another civil liberty. Has anyone thought about the consequences to dogging?! Joking aside, why do we (and our mps) allow this erosion? Surely it cannot be another small step in the governments (of all hues) grand sinister plan of totalitarianism, could it? Are we no longer the guardians of freedom by eternal vigilance? Or are we just fuckwitted sheep as our government think/know?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

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By *izzy RascallMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

This hasnt convinced me to become a voter

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights..... "

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester


"As we appear to be quite willing (at least our 'representatives do) to throw away yet another civil liberty. Has anyone thought about the consequences to dogging?! Joking aside, why do we (and our mps) allow this erosion? Surely it cannot be another small step in the governments (of all hues) grand sinister plan of totalitarianism, could it? Are we no longer the guardians of freedom by eternal vigilance? Or are we just fuckwitted sheep as our government think/know?"

You make some good points there...BUT....they read like opinion, not fact...which is simply going bring out the trolls and gainsayers on here (look at the post which says "I don't give a fuck for doggers rights" whilst also protesting they are not a sheep).

Please repost with at least some info as to the source of the "further erosion of freedoms" (and I agree with you, btw) so we can see what our would-be "controllers" have got lined up for us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about."

Why should I worry if anyone is wasting their time tracking my movements....

It's not like my movements are being restricted... so where's the infringement on my freedom ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not heard anything about this ???

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I’d be really interest to hear what objectors believe constitutes “living in a free country”

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And how are they going to track your movements ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My only real objection would be to spending tax-payers money funding the scheme….

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester

If you have a mobile phone, it can be done already. GCHQ can triangulate the movements of a mobile phone and to some extent historically too. They've been snooping in a very intrusive way for years and most of it we won't know about. Takes a whistle-blower to reveal it and now he's a hunted man.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Im not reposting anything. Its my right not to! But our freedoms are being eroded. Thd cctv coverage cannot be justified by the tiny amount of crimes it solves. Banks, bookies, jewellers etc still get robbed. So the prevention argument doesnt stand up. GCHQ want unfettered access to our online communication. That hasn't happened, officially, yet. DNA info is stored about you upon arrest, and it is not destroyed. The technologies are being developed and put in place, the next step is to change the laws to suit the needs of government and they have us sewn up tight. And we invited it.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

Why should I worry if anyone is wasting their time tracking my movements....

It's not like my movements are being restricted... so where's the infringement on my freedom ? "

Because it's costing money that could be doing some actual good?

Because it's possibly/likely to be the first step in infringing your freedom?

Because a right to a private life is one of your human rights and something you should expect?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Although I would agree that it's impossible to accurately measure the deterrent effect CCTV etc creates within the criminal minds of those who would disregard the fundamental rights of law abiding members of society....

I don't feel its an imposition on my individual freedom having a monitoring system in place which helps deter or catch those individual who elect to behave in a manner that disregards the very freedoms I truly value...

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By *atasha_DavidCouple
over a year ago

Slough


"Im not reposting anything. Its my right not to! "

As it is the right of anybody else on here to think you do not have any reliable sources to support your opinions and to ignore or just contradict you.

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By *ricky_DickyMan
over a year ago

Mirfield


"Im not reposting anything. Its my right not to!

As it is the right of anybody else on here to think you do not have any reliable sources to support your opinions and to ignore or just contradict you.

"

Think he's worried we'll discover he's a Daily Mail reader, a quick google about vehicle tracking and press the news button reveals the Mail Online story about the EU plans to have an eCall device fitted to new vehicles from 2015

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about."

As a trucker my truck is tracked 24/7 anyway... So no issues here unless you have something to hide

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

The Daily Mail???!!! Ill see you in court! I actually read about it on an insurance website. So there. Ner ner nee ner ner.

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

As a trucker my truck is tracked 24/7 anyway... So no issues here unless you have something to hide"

I take it then that yours is a privately owned truck? Otherwise you just might find out your company frowns on the getting down and dirty in your cab...of course that's not going to be a problem is it...until they have good reason to use it against you......that's what forms the "electronic wet dream" for the GCHQ types and their ilk...the ability to collect information that can be used "as required" to keep the sheep in order, or to find and eliminate them if they get too out of hand.

"For the good of the rest" of course.

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

It was mentioned on Radio 2 today

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

As a trucker my truck is tracked 24/7 anyway... So no issues here unless you have something to hide"

And you want your car tracked to? You may not be doing anything illegal... yet. Laws change, very easily.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Would it stop people driving like pricks?

If so I'm in favour.

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

As a trucker my truck is tracked 24/7 anyway... So no issues here unless you have something to hide

And you want your car tracked to? You may not be doing anything illegal... yet. Laws change, very easily."

in not bothered if they track my car their is plenty of CCTV you cant drive from one side of my town to the other without being "tracked" anyway so what's the problem or are you a dodgy geezer & you doing dirty deeds

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By *inaTitzTV/TS
over a year ago

Titz Towers, North Notts

I'm not too worried, I intend to wrap my car in tin foil.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If the government want to know that I go to sainsburys on Friday mornings and visit my parents on a Sunday lunchtime they are welcome to the information.

They'll get bored of tracking my movements long before I get fed up with them doing so.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Is the fact that the various governments, ministries and 'agencies' want this to be mandatory not ringing any alarm bells? I think tin foil sales will rocket.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"As we appear to be quite willing (at least our 'representatives do) to throw away yet another civil liberty. Has anyone thought about the consequences to dogging?! Joking aside, why do we (and our mps) allow this erosion? Surely it cannot be another small step in the governments (of all hues) grand sinister plan of totalitarianism, could it? Are we no longer the guardians of freedom by eternal vigilance? Or are we just fuckwitted sheep as our government think/know?"

If that is how you feel then never put the location services on your mobile phone..... I hate for you to fall foul of the "who's near you?" Function on fab

Nasty pasties!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is the fact that the various governments, ministries and 'agencies' want this to be mandatory not ringing any alarm bells? I think tin foil sales will rocket."

I'm curious to know whether you think all these people who work for these governments, ministries and agencies must be getting special dispensation from being tracked ... or do you think they are all part of some secret organisation and any misdoing in their daily activities will be struck from the records... Eh!

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I'm not a fuckwitted Sheep.... and I don't give a shite about protecting doggers rights.....

So are you happy to have your movements tracked 'for your own good'? The EU want it compulsory. Sorry but that is not what a free country is about.

As a trucker my truck is tracked 24/7 anyway... So no issues here unless you have something to hide

And you want your car tracked to? You may not be doing anything illegal... yet. Laws change, very easily.

in not bothered if they track my car their is plenty of CCTV you cant drive from one side of my town to the other without being "tracked" anyway so what's the problem or are you a dodgy geezer & you doing dirty deeds"

I have done nothing illegal and dont have any points on my license. Just because I dont want to be monitered (all the data will be stored and be accessible by government), it doesnt mean I am a criminal. I value privacy, by all means give away yours, but I dont want mine taken. Its another step to totalitarianism.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Im not reposting anything. Its my right not to! But our freedoms are being eroded. Thd cctv coverage cannot be justified by the tiny amount of crimes it solves. Banks, bookies, jewellers etc still get robbed. So the prevention argument doesnt stand up. GCHQ want unfettered access to our online communication. That hasn't happened, officially, yet. DNA info is stored about you upon arrest, and it is not destroyed. The technologies are being developed and put in place, the next step is to change the laws to suit the needs of government and they have us sewn up tight. And we invited it."

You sound like a person with potentially a lot to hide

I can't see why anyone with nothing to hide would really give a flying fuck what kind of monertirng goes on.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

And thats exactly how you walk in to a state of total control of the population. Because you were naive enough to think it was for you benefit. Just how much do you trust an MP? Really?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

If you don't want to be tracked I assume you never use a mobile phone... Or ever have it switched on

Or use a computer... Damn having an IP address tracked

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"And thats exactly how you walk in to a state of total control of the population. Because you were naive enough to think it was for you benefit. Just how much do you trust an MP? Really?"

Can I ask what country you feel embodies a state of "freedom" you admire or desire....?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"And thats exactly how you walk in to a state of total control of the population. Because you were naive enough to think it was for you benefit. Just how much do you trust an MP? Really?

Can I ask what country you feel embodies a state of "freedom" you admire or desire....?"

Just because we, or others dont have it, is it wrong to aspire to it? Or shall we say 'fuck it, we are halfway to hell, we might as well go the whole hog.'.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"If you don't want to be tracked I assume you never use a mobile phone... Or ever have it switched on

Or use a computer... Damn having an IP address tracked"
Two wrongs dont make a right.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have nothing to hide therefore I couldn't give a shit

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This has been on the cards for the last 15 years or so, a black box fitted to your car by law to track you. It will receord your movements and also your speeding offences, it will be downloaded at either a service or MOT and fines given out when needed. That was the idea of it back in the 90's when the concept came out.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm more concerned that our kids will track our phones to see where we really are when we go away for a weekend to a club

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I have nothing to hide therefore I couldn't give a shit"

That porn on your computer, they will know its there, who is downloading what and also with their phone and car, where they are. Are you really comfortable with that. How about if we start opening your letters to? You know, like in prison. Take this to its logical conclusion, from what liberties we have given away under the guise of 'for societys benefit'. Do you honestly feel safer than in the seventies or eighties? They invented a bogeyman then sold us the tools to protect ourselves. Hasnt worked though, has it?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Lets flip this then, you are out in the middle of nowhere and you have had a crash, you would be grateful if the trackung device. Or when your vehicle gets nicked you will know where it is.

As long as you are doing nothing wrong what it the worry? Or do you have too much to hide.....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Porn is legal as far as I'm aware so what could they possibly do with the info ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Porn is legal as far as I'm aware so what could they possibly do with the info ? "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Know what type of porn you are into, then send you links to sites you might like.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Know what type of porn you are into, then send you links to sites you might like."

That'll save me searching then.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What I'd hoped would be an entertaining discussion seem to have descended into paranoiac rambling, so I shall take my leave instead of saying what’s really on my mind…..

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester


"Porn is legal as far as I'm aware so what could they possibly do with the info ?

"

You just might want to get a qualified legal opinion on that, in particular on exactly what particular porn is on your machine. BTW in most cases for the stuff that is ruled illegal the offence is "possessing" it...and those images that you went "yeuch" at and deleted can in many cases still be recovered from your hard-drives. You'll be hard put to mount a defence against the mud-slinging that your local press puts up in their feeding frenzy.

You don't think this kind of thing could be used to influence/control you eh? How bout if we made all your activities fully public to your kids, mum, dad, extended family and friends, employer or just used them to put you on a black-list?

And for the smart-arses who are going to go "Go on, I don't care, then why are you on here, and many other places, under a "handle"?

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By *iverpool LoverMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Whats really scary is whats coming next. (Dunno when).

Few months ago I seen a google representative talking about technology they are working on, a bar code tatto on the wrist (the owner can have any cool design they want), this bar code tattoo will open electronic doors of things you own car, house for example.

will have all your personal information on it... you will use it instead of a bank card to pay for things.

Its quite scary and yet she seemed so enthusiastic about it saying its like having super powers.

Here is the link.

RFID Tattoo and the Authorization Super Pill: http://youtu.be/axIVSJsW6W0

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People might change their 'Doesn't bother me nothing to hide attitude' when they recieve their insurance renewal after having a tracker fitted for a year...."Yes Mr Smith we noticed you regularly drive in excess of national speed limits. That's just doubled your renewal etc.......".

These boxes won't be compulsory but try getting insured without one........there's demons in them woods I swear!!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Porn is legal as far as I'm aware so what could they possibly do with the info ?

You just might want to get a qualified legal opinion on that, in particular on exactly what particular porn is on your machine. BTW in most cases for the stuff that is ruled illegal the offence is "possessing" it...and those images that you went "yeuch" at and deleted can in many cases still be recovered from your hard-drives. You'll be hard put to mount a defence against the mud-slinging that your local press puts up in their feeding frenzy.

You don't think this kind of thing could be used to influence/control you eh? How bout if we made all your activities fully public to your kids, mum, dad, extended family and friends, employer or just used them to put you on a black-list?

And for the smart-arses who are going to go "Go on, I don't care, then why are you on here, and many other places, under a "handle"?"

That doesn't answer the question of what will they use the information for. I can't envisage a government official turning up at the house and saying "give us more tax or I'll tell your mum you're on Fabswingers.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Porn is legal as far as I'm aware so what could they possibly do with the info ?

"

A lot of what you think is legal, isnt, and MPs on all sides have made it known they would like to legislate further on what THEY see as suitable for us.

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester


"This has been on the cards for the last 15 years or so, a black box fitted to your car by law to track you. It will receord your movements and also your speeding offences, it will be downloaded at either a service or MOT and fines given out when needed. That was the idea of it back in the 90's when the concept came out."

You made a good point there Scouserat until you decided later to play devil's advocate with how helpful it would be if you crashed (as if hundreds of people were dying because they crashed and nobody found them in the UK).

Priapus and Scouserat make some very valid points and those who offer up the "I'm not a crim so I don't give a fuck what they know" are simply being naive or have no respect for the concepts of individual freedom that used to be held in such high esteem in this country.

Let's take just one little example: the black boxes (actually with the exception of military equipment they're rarely black but never mind) to be fitted to cars. The average speed monitor is just one superb idea that must have the pound signs lighting up in the revenue gathering depts of police/councils across the country.

Right now they don't have the manpower to chase you for minor infringements, so, unless you fall into one of their camera traps or it's one of their talivan "fill the coffers/purge days" they only go after the stupid/silly people who push things too far. Wouldn't be the case with your black box: it turns you in and they collect.

Several high-end car makers already have working in-car comms systems that talks directly to your dealer via mobile radio links to prewarn them about faults/spares or servicing due/needed on that particular vehicle. Extending it to do much more reporting (like ave speed, location, straying into things like congestion zones etc etc) is easy-peezy.

Remember the balloon floated about road pricing? Here it comes again via these "black" boxes.

Finally before they message can the nanny-state, nappy wearing, coochy-coo voiced "speed kills" (because I mentioned ave speed infringements) "mummies" shove their input somewhere else. This is not a thread about the lunatics who feel 50mph is safe when passing schools or who have to pass me because my car has a high speed spec. I own a new car capable of over 140 mph, yet I drive safely and sensibly, sticking (mostly) to the same road speed as other people, unless I determine that conditions warrant my going even slower in which case I do.

This thread is about the ever encroaching state of control over everything we do, usually sold to us on an "It's good for you" sales platter.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"What I'd hoped would be an entertaining discussion seem to have descended into paranoiac rambling, so I shall take my leave instead of saying what’s really on my mind…..

"

Thats just what they want you to do!

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By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham


"Whats really scary is whats coming next. (Dunno when).

Few months ago I seen a google representative talking about technology they are working on, a bar code tatto on the wrist (the owner can have any cool design they want), this bar code tattoo will open electronic doors of things you own car, house for example.

will have all your personal information on it... you will use it instead of a bank card to pay for things.

Its quite scary and yet she seemed so enthusiastic about it saying its like having super powers.

Here is the link.

RFID Tattoo and the Authorization Super Pill: http://youtu.be/axIVSJsW6W0

"

just think if I can get the bar code for a rich bugger tattood on my wrist I would be made for life, or have several sleeves of different bar codes of rich people. Yes I know it is illegal. In theory yes it is a good idea about these bar codes, but it wont catch on.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"People might change their 'Doesn't bother me nothing to hide attitude' when they recieve their insurance renewal after having a tracker fitted for a year...."Yes Mr Smith we noticed you regularly drive in excess of national speed limits. That's just doubled your renewal etc.......".

These boxes won't be compulsory but try getting insured without one........there's demons in them woods I swear!!!!! "

So will sensible drivers get cheaper insurance ? I'm all for that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"What I'd hoped would be an entertaining discussion seem to have descended into paranoiac rambling, so I shall take my leave instead of saying what’s really on my mind…..

Thats just what they want you to do!"

Pfffft shucks,,,,, I'd hoped for so much more

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"People might change their 'Doesn't bother me nothing to hide attitude' when they recieve their insurance renewal after having a tracker fitted for a year...."Yes Mr Smith we noticed you regularly drive in excess of national speed limits. That's just doubled your renewal etc.......".

These boxes won't be compulsory but try getting insured without one........there's demons in them woods I swear!!!!!

So will sensible drivers get cheaper insurance ? I'm all for that "

Of course. As long as you only take the car out once a week to church and never go near a congested city, motorway,accident black spot etc........

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"People might change their 'Doesn't bother me nothing to hide attitude' when they recieve their insurance renewal after having a tracker fitted for a year...."Yes Mr Smith we noticed you regularly drive in excess of national speed limits. That's just doubled your renewal etc.......".

These boxes won't be compulsory but try getting insured without one........there's demons in them woods I swear!!!!!

So will sensible drivers get cheaper insurance ? I'm all for that

Of course. As long as you only take the car out once a week to church and never go near a congested city, motorway,accident black spot etc........ "

That's me sorted then. I'll get it fitted as soon as they're available.

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By *Ryan-Man
over a year ago

In Your Bush

Anyone seen Winston Smith? I can't seem to track him down.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"People might change their 'Doesn't bother me nothing to hide attitude' when they recieve their insurance renewal after having a tracker fitted for a year...."Yes Mr Smith we noticed you regularly drive in excess of national speed limits. That's just doubled your renewal etc.......".

These boxes won't be compulsory but try getting insured without one........there's demons in them woods I swear!!!!!

So will sensible drivers get cheaper insurance ? I'm all for that

You have soooooo never been to church lol

Of course. As long as you only take the car out once a week to church and never go near a congested city, motorway,accident black spot etc........

That's me sorted then. I'll get it fitted as soon as they're available. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't care. It's like lots of new technology - if they really want to take an interest in you they already can. I'm happy to try and remain of no interest to the authorities and therefore of no concern.

This is quite distinct from choosing to keep my personal habits and interests private from friends and family. That's about respect and taste.

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester

To the Polks: don't get me wrong I'm not picking on you per se...but I can't work out if you're being naive or just provoking argument. From previous posts you've already let slip that the Mail and Express fall somewhere in your sphere of reading. If I have that wrong then I apologise, but no matter what their shortcomings, the readers of those two papers used to be the kind of folk who stood up for personal freedom and were anti interference by the state.

Yes, they may have wanted all sorts of things banned, people horse-whipped etc, but when it came to the crunch they'd be prepared to die for the British version of a free people.

You wonder what "they" will do with the information? How about silencing whistle-blowers? How much press space was given to the alleged crimes of Assange once he published Snowden's whistleblowing?

If they've no use for the information why was (and still is) there such a huge operation going on between the US, Britain, Australia, New Zealand etc to gather such huge troves of email, phone messages etc etc? Just some kind of job creation exercise?

The sad fact is that the general public have only glimpsed the tip of the ice-berg in a few newspaper headlines, the reality of the computing power and information gathering network out there is far, far greater than most people think and it's getting bigger. Who has oversight of it and whether or not it is infringing your freedoms?

I trust you both work in some kind of very lowly job, where neither you nor the company gives a shit about what people know about you or how you behave judged against society's current "norms". If you don't fit into that description then heed this: this is just one example of what they could do to you if you became a "person of interest" and they "found" porn on your computer.

I'm not naming names because there's an on-going legal case for compensation but it went something like this:

Mr A, who worked in a very visible job in the local community had an organisation supplied laptop. Said laptop was called in for an upgrade. The IT people (who are nosey buggers (I know I used to be one) and like showing off their forensic skills) ran a scan (as required by their manager) on the old drive and found deleted, but recoverable porn (quite hard-core so the allegations went) images. As many of the images involved people who were allegedly over 18, but only just, the manager went ballistic (for starters the company contract _xpressly forbade the use of the machine for anything other than organisation work) and after an internal investigation, involving the suspension of Mr A, the manager decided to hand over the problem to the local police, just in case.

Now Mr A's suspension from his post could hardly go unnoticed and once the matter reached the local police then the "smut/mud" began to leak to the local press who had a field day.

To cut to the chase Mr A wasn't actually guilty, but in the months that followed, until he could clear his name he actually came close to suicide.

There but for the grace of God go you or I.

Consider these last two persons quotes and ask who was the defender of freedom?:

“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, [1759]

“The American people must be willing to give up a degree of personal privacy in exchange for safety and security.” Louis Freeh, FBI Director, [1994]

“Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add ‘within the limits of the law,’ because law is often but the tyrant’s will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.” Thomas Jefferson

.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"To the Polks: don't get me wrong I'm not picking on you per se...but I can't work out if you're being naive or just provoking argument. From previous posts you've already let slip that the Mail and Express fall somewhere in your sphere of reading. If I have that wrong then I apologise, but no matter what their shortcomings, the readers of those two papers used to be the kind of folk who stood up for personal freedom and were anti interference by the state.

Yes, they may have wanted all sorts of things banned, people horse-whipped etc, but when it came to the crunch they'd be prepared to die for the British version of a free people.

You wonder what "they" will do with the information? How about silencing whistle-blowers? How much press space was given to the alleged crimes of Assange once he published Snowden's whistleblowing?

If they've no use for the information why was (and still is) there such a huge operation going on between the US, Britain, Australia, New Zealand etc to gather such huge troves of email, phone messages etc etc? Just some kind of job creation exercise?

The sad fact is that the general public have only glimpsed the tip of the ice-berg in a few newspaper headlines, the reality of the computing power and information gathering network out there is far, far greater than most people think and it's getting bigger. Who has oversight of it and whether or not it is infringing your freedoms?

I trust you both work in some kind of very lowly job, where neither you nor the company gives a shit about what people know about you or how you behave judged against society's current "norms". If you don't fit into that description then heed this: this is just one example of what they could do to you if you became a "person of interest" and they "found" porn on your computer.

I'm not naming names because there's an on-going legal case for compensation but it went something like this:

Mr A, who worked in a very visible job in the local community had an organisation supplied laptop. Said laptop was called in for an upgrade. The IT people (who are nosey buggers (I know I used to be one) and like showing off their forensic skills) ran a scan (as required by their manager) on the old drive and found deleted, but recoverable porn (quite hard-core so the allegations went) images. As many of the images involved people who were allegedly over 18, but only just, the manager went ballistic (for starters the company contract _xpressly forbade the use of the machine for anything other than organisation work) and after an internal investigation, involving the suspension of Mr A, the manager decided to hand over the problem to the local police, just in case.

Now Mr A's suspension from his post could hardly go unnoticed and once the matter reached the local police then the "smut/mud" began to leak to the local press who had a field day.

To cut to the chase Mr A wasn't actually guilty, but in the months that followed, until he could clear his name he actually came close to suicide.

There but for the grace of God go you or I.

Consider these last two persons quotes and ask who was the defender of freedom?:

“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, [1759]

“The American people must be willing to give up a degree of personal privacy in exchange for safety and security.” Louis Freeh, FBI Director, [1994]

“Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add ‘within the limits of the law,’ because law is often but the tyrant’s will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.” Thomas Jefferson

."

Thanks for taking such an interest in our posts but you can't be more wrong if you tried. I have no idea which posts point me out as a newspaper reader let alone the ones you've mentioned. As for lowly jobs, I don't really know what to make of that comment so won't retort.

And Mr A deserved a suspension as he knew the consequences of using a company laptop for accessing certain sites.

Paranoid people used to amuse me but now I'm a little worried about the close attention you're paying us.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I will comment when the pigeons come home to roost. Moscow rules George, Moscow rules.

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester


"

Thanks for taking such an interest in our posts but you can't be more wrong if you tried. I have no idea which posts point me out as a newspaper reader let alone the ones you've mentioned. As for lowly jobs, I don't really know what to make of that comment so won't retort.

And Mr A deserved a suspension as he knew the consequences of using a company laptop for accessing certain sites.

Paranoid people used to amuse me but now I'm a little worried about the close attention you're paying us. "

Thanks for the reply, but do try to read my comments more closely: you've posted a couple of comments linking to those papers, and, as I said, if you're not a reader then I apologise.

I'll simplify the "lowly jobs" comment: if you're in any kind of job with "status" in society then you def wouldn't want to be on the wrong end of mud-slinging the way these guys play.

Mr A DIDN'T deserve his suspension, because he wasn't guilty of loading the porn, as he was able to eventually prove (and which is why there's an on-going compensation case) as I noted in my message. I used him as an example to show you what could happen if you or anyone else was targetted.

I'll ignore the paranoid slur, since unless you can show me otherwise, I know a great deal more than you do about computer information gathering.

Even more worrying is I've seen at first hand how computer held information becomes the truth in organisations, no matter how vague or untrustworthy the source.

As a prime example have you forgotten already the "dodgy dossier" that took us to war in Iraq?

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By *hubnwife_36dd_ukCouple
over a year ago

chester

To the Polks: don't worry about the attention: I'm not going to come and stalk you. Your pics are hot, I've fabbed some, but not what we are looking for. Take care, and while we disagree on some things those are still hot pics, esp the wet T shirt.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Thanks for taking such an interest in our posts but you can't be more wrong if you tried. I have no idea which posts point me out as a newspaper reader let alone the ones you've mentioned. As for lowly jobs, I don't really know what to make of that comment so won't retort.

And Mr A deserved a suspension as he knew the consequences of using a company laptop for accessing certain sites.

Paranoid people used to amuse me but now I'm a little worried about the close attention you're paying us.

Thanks for the reply, but do try to read my comments more closely: you've posted a couple of comments linking to those papers, and, as I said, if you're not a reader then I apologise.

I'll simplify the "lowly jobs" comment: if you're in any kind of job with "status" in society then you def wouldn't want to be on the wrong end of mud-slinging the way these guys play.

Mr A DIDN'T deserve his suspension, because he wasn't guilty of loading the porn, as he was able to eventually prove (and which is why there's an on-going compensation case) as I noted in my message. I used him as an example to show you what could happen if you or anyone else was targetted.

I'll ignore the paranoid slur, since unless you can show me otherwise, I know a great deal more than you do about computer information gathering.

Even more worrying is I've seen at first hand how computer held information becomes the truth in organisations, no matter how vague or untrustworthy the source.

As a prime example have you forgotten already the "dodgy dossier" that took us to war in Iraq?"

Wow , vehicle tracking to the Iraq war.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"To the Polks: don't worry about the attention: I'm not going to come and stalk you. Your pics are hot, I've fabbed some, but not what we are looking for. Take care, and while we disagree on some things those are still hot pics, esp the wet T shirt."

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