FabSwingers.com forum: European Union....In or Out??

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

What's your views on this guys?? I ain't got a fucking clue. I am leaning towards out but haven't really taken enough notice of either argument yet to decide for definite

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Once they stop mud slinging and actually have an intellectual debate about it then hopefully people will be able to make their minds up.

Cameron went to Brussels promising to change things and came back tail between legs

Personally think Britain stronger in EU but needs more changes than Cameron has settled on

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not 100% to be honest

But from the little bits I've heard from both sides I say out

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By *ilthyjackcoupleCouple
over a year ago

Swansea

It pains me to agree with CallMeDave on anything, but definitely in.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Stay in for me x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

100% out for us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out for me

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By *exdexMan
over a year ago

formby lanzarote

out ,,it can only get worse ...not showing the riots on tv now ,about riots in germany ,,france ,,paris ..calias ,,denmark ,,sweden ,,..plus ..spend the money on .nhs....pensioners ,,homeless ..ect ect ,,

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

In for me.

Would you trust a government run by boris to keep the employment laws we currently have. No chance.

I dont fancy standing around a bonfire of working rights as one tory mp has stated.

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

EU has now decided (without any voting) that it will now decide who YOU can vote for... if any country votes in a "populist/nationalist" government, the EU will restrict that countries voting rights within the EU.

The "Remain" camp claims that our trade will suffer if we leave... bullshit.. are the EU countries suddenly going to stop selling us wine, cars, cheese, etc etc etc? Unlikely, and they wont levy trade taxes on us, as we will do the same to them.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

They say if we pull out, we risk the security of the UK.... bullshit, we are a member of NATO, the strongest combined Armed force in the world. They claim that the EU has kept the peace in Europe for 50 years... bullshit, the fact that its hugely expensive to wage wars is the reason no-one has started one.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

The biggest reason we should get out is that, if we fail to leave now, the EU will take it as a green light for them to really go for closer integration, more control over our taxes, borders, immigration, an EU army, a grab at our pensions etc.

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

There is much wrong with the EU, but speaking from a purely Welsh perspective, it has pumped vast sums of money in to the economically deprived areas of Wales through Objective One funding etc.

Wales has been a net beneficiary from Europe. I can understand people wanting to leave, but it makes me annoyed when people in Wales say "the EU has done nothing for us"....erm - have a good look around at those blue EU signs when you're driving around Wales mate. That new dual carriageway, that industrial estate, that wonderfully environmentally landscaped former industrial site. Billions of European money paid for that - at least say thank you.

I'm from an affluent city in Wales, but my family on both sides are from the industrial heartlands. I believe those areas were shamefully neglected by successive London governments. Working in those areas, it was obvious that much of what was done to regenerate them was done with European money.

I believe the Welsh economy needs to be more innovative, entrepreunial etc (I am neither a nationalist or socialist), but that help is needed to kickstart that - help which should have been given thirty years ago. Does anyone seriously think a Tory government run from London by the likes of Boris Johnson understands the needs of our poorest areas and will step in to replace the financial and other help given by Europe? Personally I think that's crackers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

Hit the nail on the head

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

I think someone needs to use the bbc reality fact checker...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What's your views on this guys?? I ain't got a fucking clue. I am leaning towards out but haven't really taken enough notice of either argument yet to decide for definite

Better if two evils is staying in we get taxed to shit now if we come out its an excuse to tax us more

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By *ouse and QuackersCouple
over a year ago

abergele

Out without a doubt. Every year we wear poppies, attend services across the country and lay wreaths at memorials to remember the many thousands of British servicemen and women that gave their lives to maintain the freedom and sovereignty of these shores. They would surely turn in their graves if they knew that we were even considering staying in EU knowing that we would in effect hand over our government to foreign control and worse still open our borders to allow many thousands of immigrants to flood in. If you have any sense of national pride and believe in maintaining our own national security then you surely have no credible vote other than "Out"

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

TURKEY WILL NEVER BE IN THE EU. GREECE & CYPRUS WILL NEVER ALLOW IT

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

IF YOU BELIEVE THE TORIES WILL SPEND THAT MONEY ON THE NHS ETC THEN I HAVE SOME MAGIC BEANS TO SELL YOU

RUBBISH

OUR TRADE WILL SUFFER. OUR TRADE IS ALREADY SUFFERING

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

SO WHAT? WE'RE HAVING A REFERENDUM. IT DOESN'T MEAN WE'RE DEFINITELY LEAVING, JUST HAVING THE DEBATE

BOLLOCKS

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

AS SHOULD YOU

WE HAVE CONTROL OVER OUR OWN TAXES & PENSIONS, BORDERS (we're NOT in schengen!), AND THE EU ARMY IS NONSENSE

PLEASE PEOPLE, DO YOUR RESEARCH BEFORE YOU VOTE - MOST OF THE PROPAGANDA, ON BOTH SIDES IS INFLATED. CHECK THE FACTS Jx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Tony Blair is backing the Remain campaign...so that's me DEFINITELY voting to leave...lol.

Having considered the matter in all seriousness, our country will be far better off leaving the EU. It's a failed experiment that they're now trying desperate measures to make work...but it can NEVER work going forward. The idea of joining the Common Market was the correct way to go at the time, but in these times an ever-expanding federal superstate run from Brussells can never succeed without pain for those countries at opposing ends of the economic spectrum...in other words, the UK paying billions towards the inevitable bailouts if we remain in...and there will be many more bailouts...Greece's finances in meltdown is FAR from an isolated case, with several other basket-case economies in line to follow the Greek experience in the years to come as they're all tied to the currency of the Euro with no scope to adapt their individual economies when they need to by currency devaluation.

And then there's the borders and immigration element to the argument...!

I'm voting to leave.

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

"Out without a doubt. Every year we wear poppies, attend services across the country and lay wreaths at memorials to remember the many thousands of British servicemen and women that gave their lives to maintain the freedom and sovereignty of these shores. They would surely turn in their graves if they knew that we were even considering staying in EU knowing that we would in effect hand over our government to foreign control and worse still open our borders to allow many thousands of immigrants to flood in. If you have any sense of national pride and believe in maintaining our own national security then you surely have no credible vote other than "Out"

My grandad fought in the war and lost many of his pals. He was immensely happy that a new Europe was forged by countries working together in the aftermath of the war and that peace reigned for many years.

He reserved his ire for "our" government which shamefully neglected to its own people as heavy industry declined, many of whom had risked their lives fighting in the war.

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

plain and simple out

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

I think someone needs to use the bbc reality fact checker..."

I think someone needs to stop living in a fantasy world

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

OUT OUT OUT

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I love a good debate

I think I'd learn more on here then I do on tele

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By *KMaxMan
over a year ago

Bristol

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with.

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By *oxicpinkdrinkWoman
over a year ago

Cardiff

100% in - listen to Lost Sock. He makes an incredible amount of sense.

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By *ouse and QuackersCouple
over a year ago

abergele

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with."

Who's beating them? Just don't want to open our borders to let them in. ..

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"100% in - listen to Lost Sock. He makes an incredible amount of sense. "

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with.

Who's beating them? Just don't want to open our borders to let them in. .. "

Out border AREN'T open, and aren't going to be. We're NOT in the Schengen Agreement!

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By *OWN AND COUNTY SOCIALSMan
over a year ago

CARMARTHEN

OUT

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

TURKEY WILL NEVER BE IN THE EU. GREECE & CYPRUS WILL NEVER ALLOW IT

* A number of the countries in the EU never met the criteria to qualify, but they still got in Greece being one... Turkey will be a member sooner or later.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

IF YOU BELIEVE THE TORIES WILL SPEND THAT MONEY ON THE NHS ETC THEN I HAVE SOME MAGIC BEANS TO SELL YOU

* I didn't just say the NHS... its £350 million more to spend IN THIS COUNTRY, every week.

RUBBISH

* True -- When Austria nearly voted in a far-right government a couple of weeks ago, Jean Paul Junkere stated this intent.

OUR TRADE WILL SUFFER. OUR TRADE IS ALREADY SUFFERING

* Nonsense, the UK economy has stabilised, and has in fact grown further, and faster than any other country since the recession, this will continue

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

SO WHAT? WE'RE HAVING A REFERENDUM. IT DOESN'T MEAN WE'RE DEFINITELY LEAVING, JUST HAVING THE DEBATE

* The rats are queueing up to leave the sinking ship, the EU is doomed, we know it, and now the rest of Europe is seeing it

BOLLOCKS

* A very erudite response my friend... your one word rebuttals are educational, you should consider taking up politics!

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

AS SHOULD YOU

* I have, that's why I wrote my original post

WE HAVE CONTROL OVER OUR OWN TAXES & PENSIONS, BORDERS (we're NOT in schengen!), AND THE EU ARMY IS NONSENSE

* Wrong again, we cannot even deport foreign criminals back to their own countries, those countries wont allow it, even though it is EU law... and the EU army has been talked about for a number of years.

PLEASE PEOPLE, DO YOUR RESEARCH BEFORE YOU VOTE - MOST OF THE PROPAGANDA, ON BOTH SIDES IS INFLATED. CHECK THE FACTS Jx

* Yes, do you own research folks, and when someone shouts down your points with "rubbish" or "bollocks".... ask yourself, if they had any counter-points, why wouldn't they use them?"

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

TURKEY WILL NEVER BE IN THE EU. GREECE & CYPRUS WILL NEVER ALLOW IT

* A number of the countries in the EU never met the criteria to qualify, but they still got in Greece being one... Turkey will be a member sooner or later.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

IF YOU BELIEVE THE TORIES WILL SPEND THAT MONEY ON THE NHS ETC THEN I HAVE SOME MAGIC BEANS TO SELL YOU

* I didn't just say the NHS... its £350 million more to spend IN THIS COUNTRY, every week.

RUBBISH

* True -- When Austria nearly voted in a far-right government a couple of weeks ago, Jean Paul Junkere stated this intent.

OUR TRADE WILL SUFFER. OUR TRADE IS ALREADY SUFFERING

* Nonsense, the UK economy has stabilised, and has in fact grown further, and faster than any other country since the recession, this will continue

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

SO WHAT? WE'RE HAVING A REFERENDUM. IT DOESN'T MEAN WE'RE DEFINITELY LEAVING, JUST HAVING THE DEBATE

* The rats are queueing up to leave the sinking ship, the EU is doomed, we know it, and now the rest of Europe is seeing it

BOLLOCKS

* A very erudite response my friend... your one word rebuttals are educational, you should consider taking up politics!

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

AS SHOULD YOU

* I have, that's why I wrote my original post

WE HAVE CONTROL OVER OUR OWN TAXES & PENSIONS, BORDERS (we're NOT in schengen!), AND THE EU ARMY IS NONSENSE

PLEASE PEOPLE, DO YOUR RESEARCH BEFORE YOU VOTE - MOST OF THE PROPAGANDA, ON BOTH SIDES IS INFLATED. CHECK THE FACTS Jx

* Yes, do you own research folks, and when someone shouts down your points with "rubbish" or "bollocks".... ask yourself, if they had any counter-points, why wouldn't they use them?"

The other points were responded to, but on those two particular points, they literally are fiction, so the only appropriate responses were given

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

As much as I love you all I am still none the wiser after sifting through all that haha

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

It's like Python in here! "What's the EU ever done for us?"

[1] http://news.cbi.org.uk/business-issues/uk-and-the-european-union/eu-business-facts/10-facts-about-eu-trade-deals-pdf/

[2] http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_MEMO-13-1080_en.htm

[3] http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/consumers_safety/product_safety_legislation/general_product_safety_directive/index_en.htm

[4] https://www.cornwall.gov.uk/business/europe/european-structural-and-investment-fund/

[5] http://ec.europa.eu/environment/life/project/Projects/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.showFile&rep=file&fil=LIFE05_ENV_D_000197_LAYMAN.pdf

[6] https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/oct/27/europe-abolishes-mobile-phone-roaming-charges

[7] http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/passenger-rights/air/index_en.htm

[8] http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/nov/05/england-beaches-bathing-waters-eu-standards

[9] http://ec.europa.eu/food/safety/labelling_nutrition/labelling_legislation/index_en.htm

[10] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_competition_law (I know I'm not supposed to use Wikipedia as a source for its less-than-rigorous academic standards, but FUCK YOU I'm not in uni anymore, I'll do what I like).

[11] http://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/eccc18&div=8&id=&page=

[12] http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/home-affairs/what-we-do/policies/borders-and-visas/visa-policy/index_en.htm

[13] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Convention_on_Human_Rights

[14] http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/12030457/David-Camerons-plan-to-scrap-the-Human-Rights-Act-delayed-until-2016.html

That's research m8

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out

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By *tu griffMan
over a year ago

bridgend

The impression I have is that most people who want to leave are very cynical about the present govnt.

Isn't staying more of the same? What's going to change just because we decide to stay?

There are misleading 'facts' from both sides(the fact we get £350 billion is a classic one)

I just wish I had some truthful information so i can make a good decision.

I think we are better off being part of Europe. Im pretty sure Wales is, even tho GB could be better off out(although that's something we just don't know for sure)

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By *elshboy_1981Man
over a year ago

Abertillery

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

I think someone needs to use the bbc reality fact checker..."

Bbc reality fact check the same bbc that's blocking news on the issues in Calais? Have a work with truckers who are getting attacked and vehicles damaged by the same people who want in

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By *uddsWoman
over a year ago

st athans

cant get away from this subject on here lately,its been in the chatrooms for weeks and now its in the forums

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"cant get away from this subject on here lately,its been in the chatrooms for weeks and now its in the forums

The thread title was quite clear

If it's a topic that offends/annoys (which I assume it does from the rolling eyes) you could have taken the logical option and not opened the thread

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

could not have said it better.. no brainer for us..OUT OUT OUT

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By *oxicpinkdrinkWoman
over a year ago

Cardiff

Just to actually inject some small snippets of fact here I work with the criminal justice system and we do deport people who have committed serious offences here, back to their countries or origin...

On a side note I have just had some very attractive Greek boys move in next door, if that's not a reason to stay in, I don't know what is.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

On Turkey http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/how-can-boris-johnson-live-with-himself-over-turkey-eu-lies-asks-yvette-cooper-in-passionate-attack_uk_575935fee4b04151436946ac

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

I think someone needs to use the bbc reality fact checker..."

Absolutely . . the "red herring" about the Turks is well proven to be just that.

Thing is we're talking about politicians here? You know . . "professional liars" . . and as they used to say about their lies . . "statistics, statistic and statistics"

One simple answer . . the British lsles is part of Europe. We need to forget the past and live for the future.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Has to be OUT for me too.

Let's face it the unknown can't be any worse than what we have now, or what we know is coming if we stay in.

Besides after watching Nicola "Jimmy Cranky" Sturgeon last night trying to tell us all that we are "better together", after she has spent her whole career trying to break up the UK, I'm convinced it's the right thing to do in my mind.

But I think this one is down to every individuals own consciousness, just vote for what you think is right for you, not what others tell you.

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By *urns007Man
over a year ago

bridgend

Iv watched so many tv debates bout this ..but I need a simple answer so somebody tell me cos I cant seem to find one ....the question is this ok ...What to we gain by staying in and what do we lose if we come out

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By *ountainwalkerMan
over a year ago

port talbot

In out in out..... I'm for staying in.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Has to be OUT for me too.

Let's face it the unknown can't be any worse than what we have now, or what we know is coming if we stay in.

But I think this one is down to every individuals own consciousness, just vote for what you think is right for you, not what others tell you."

The unknown can be a hell of a lot worse than what we have right now. We've just come out of one recession - this could conceivably cause another!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm voting to remain as the EU goverment have done a lot more to help me and my sister in university and funding than the UK goverment has. It's also far more benefitial to remain for the future than it is to leave

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out for sure. Cameron and his Cronies have fucked this Country up with their pandering to the EU over the years. I am British not European, We will lose our Army our Laws are now dictated by Brussels. The EU prevented a Bail Out at the Steel Plant at Port Talbot. Because the EU want us to use steel imported from China ffs. Its cheap and faulty. We will save £350 million a week in payments to those Eurocrats.Just think at what that money could be spent on.

The head of the EU stated Britain does not need the EU. But the EU needs Britain. Since we became a member of the EU all of our Industry has gone. All outsourced to European countries ffs. So its OUT OUT OUT for me

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm voting to remain as the EU goverment have done a lot more to help me and my sister in university and funding than the UK goverment has. It's also far more benefitial to remain for the future than it is to leave"

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My concerns aren't about whether Britain should have more power or not. They're about who that power is going to be given to. Even with a potential change in government in the next few years, I'm worried. None of the arseholes vying for power in any party really seem to represent me or my interests.

Whilst there are many things that I dislike about the EU, I fear that putting absolute power into the hands of David "zero hour contracts" "tax? never heard of it" "snooper's charter" Cameron and his mates might not be the best idea.

It's sad to think that the government of a G8 country, one of the great seats of art, literature and learning needs oversight, but unfortunately it seems that they do.

I'm still undecided at this point, and probably will remain so until I mark the ballot.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes"

Even if it did, do you honestly believe the current government would redistribute it all equitably!? Take your rose tinted glasses off

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Out for sure. Cameron and his Cronies have fucked this Country up with their pandering to the EU over the years. I am British not European, We will lose our Army our Laws are now dictated by Brussels. The EU prevented a Bail Out at the Steel Plant at Port Talbot. Because the EU want us to use steel imported from China ffs. Its cheap and faulty. We will save £350 million a week in payments to those Eurocrats.Just think at what that money could be spent on.

The "EU Army" is a complete myth, as are many other claim by the Brexit camp and throughout this thread

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-british-public-wrong-about-nearly-everything-survey-shows-a7074311.html

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

The "EU Army" is a complete myth, as are many other claim by the Brexit camp and throughout this thread

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-british-public-wrong-about-nearly-everything-survey-shows-a7074311.html"

Oh and the steel claim is skewed also. Yes EU state aid rules prevented an application for a bailout recently, but the EU have been trying to combat Chinese steel dumping for four years, and were prevented from doing so by a UKM veto as Osborne was cosying up to the Chinese! Check your facts

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/03/30/britain-sacrifices-steel-industry-to-curry-favour-with-china/

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

The "EU Army" is a complete myth, as are many other claim by the Brexit camp and throughout this thread

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-british-public-wrong-about-nearly-everything-survey-shows-a7074311.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/03/30/britain-sacrifices-steel-industry-to-curry-favour-with-china/ "

Oh and the cost of being in the EU is c.150 million a week not 350. And we get most of it back, and what we don't get back is worth it for the free trade agreement. Do your research!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 11/06/16 09:57:20]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We are going to get fucked over which ever way we vote

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are going to get fucked over which ever way we vote "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are going to get fucked over which ever way we vote "

Totally agree but it's a well oiled lubed fucked if we stay in or a fucking arse popping rough ride if we come out I'm afraid

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are going to get fucked over which ever way we vote

Totally agree but it's a well oiled lubed fucked if we stay in or a fucking arse popping rough ride if we come out I'm afraid

Well got to take the rough with the smooth

And as some people have stated on here many times they like it rough

It keeps things interesting

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Westminster governments have consistently underfunded Wales, hence it receives objective one EU funding. Do you think a vote to leave the EU will soften the hearts of current/future governments so that Wales is adequately funded, or do you think Wales will continue to be underfunded with no more help from the EU?

The rest of your claims hold about as much water as a collander

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm a bit mixed but I'm nearing out tbh. Italy wants out Germany's crumbling and I'm fed up of the threats off other country's.

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

A number of highly successful businessmen have also called for an Out vote, the latest two being the boss of JCB, and now Dyson.

JCB export all over the world, so I believe they know a thing or two about international trade, same for Dyson.

As I have said before, I believe that, if nothing else sways your vote one way or another, then this should... if we vote to stay, the powers-that-be in the EU WILL take that as a green light to push for closer economic, political, financial and social ties... meaning that this EU superstate will invade more of our lives, and dictate more of our laws, take more of our money, and prop up more failing economies than ever before.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

out me

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Just copied this from someone's post. It gives food for thought and worth thinking about

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.

Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.

Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.

Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.

British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.

Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.

Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.

M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.

Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.

Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.

Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.

Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.

Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.

Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.

ICI integration into Holland’s AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase.

JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU 'regeneration' grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry.

UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.

Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.

Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.

The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes"

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Just copied this from someone's post. It gives food for thought and worth thinking about

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.

Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.

Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.

Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.

British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.

Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.

Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.

M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.

Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.

Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.

Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.

Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.

Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.

Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.

UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.

Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.

Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.

After reading that. It looks like we would be better off by leaving

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes"

Do you understand what net contributor means in laymans teams we put more money in than we take out my friend

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes

Do you understand what net contributor means in laymans teams we put more money in than we take out my friend "

1) I am not your friend. I don't know you.

2) Do not talk to me like I am stupid. I know what it means. I see the EU doing a lot more to help me than the UK goverment is, so yeah, lets give them more money than they give us back, because they are making more use of it than our goverment is

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes

Do you understand what net contributor means in laymans teams we put more money in than we take out my friend

1) I am not your friend. I don't know you.

I call everybody my friend to show i'm not having a pop... plus i'm not talking to like your stupid i certainly think your Naive though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes

Do you understand what net contributor means in laymans teams we put more money in than we take out my friend

1) I am not your friend. I don't know you.

I call everybody my friend to show i'm not having a pop... plus i'm not talking to like your stupid i certainly think your Naive though. "

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

[Removed by poster at 11/06/16 14:05:24]

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Just copied this from someone's post. It gives food for thought and worth thinking about

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.

Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.

Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.

Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.

British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.

Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.

Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.

M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.

Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.

Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.

Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.

Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.

Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.

Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.

UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.

Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.

Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.

Labour is cheaper overseas. This has nothing to do with the EU, and everything to do with Cost of production in the UK versus other nations. Irrelevant to this discussion

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Actually the EU hasnt helped you or your sister. That money the EU provides comes out of the UK coffers. Open your eyes

They didn't give us money. They gave us a scholarship. And the money comes from every EU country. Not just the UK. Open your eyes

Do you understand what net contributor means in laymans teams we put more money in than we take out my friend "

On paper we put more money in, for the membership (which by the way is heavily discounted due to our status at 150 million rather than the bullshit 350 million) however through this we get access to free trade and all that comes with it. We need this! We are a tiny nation, albeit with a very large economy - we don't have the 'market power' we used to have however. We are better off in

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In for me.

Would you trust a government run by boris to keep the employment laws we currently have. No chance.

I dont fancy standing around a bonfire of working rights as one tory mp has stated.

Our current employment laws were not written by the EU - just saying.

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"Just copied this from someone's post. It gives food for thought and worth thinking about

Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant.

Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant.

Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.

Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant.

British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales.

Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan.

Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200.

M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan.

Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants.

Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant.

Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant.

Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant.

Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding.

Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing.

UK airports are owned by a Spanish company.

Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company.

Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies.

Labour is cheaper overseas. This has nothing to do with the EU, and everything to do with Cost of production in the UK versus other nations. Irrelevant to this discussion "

Irrelevant I think not dude. Besides the real issue here is democracy what's the point of us even bothering to vote in elections when our elected politicians must answer to a unelected suit in Brussels who then decides what we can and can't do..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" On paper we put more money in, for the membership (which by the way is heavily discounted due to our status at 150 million rather than the bullshit 350 million) however through this we get access to free trade and all that comes with it. We need this! We are a tiny nation, albeit with a very large economy - we don't have the 'market power' we used to have however. We are better off in"

Actually it is £250 Million and of that we get back £80 million and are told what to spend it on! We never ever see £170 million per week ever again!

We had trade deals before the EU and can have trade deals after! They need us a damn site more than we need them. As an example BMW export £3bn worth of cars to the Uk every year, that is just one manufacturer.

Our total car exports to the EU are £1bn, they need us a lot more than we need them and they will not wish to lose our trade!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata, the same company who have trashed our steel works and emptied the workers pension funds.

I believe that it was cheap steel from China flooding the EU that trashed our steel works rather than Tata.

That said, the EU prevented our own Government from taking action and saving it!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar! "

I voted for which British people were to have a seat on the EU. After that, it's all up to them. It would cost a hell of a lot of money to organise a vote so large to vote who we want to run the EU

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar! "

If you honestly believe that the current government would redistribute that money equitably, then I've got some magic beans I'd like to sell you to grow beans talks with. Wales particularly benefits hugely from EU funds.

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above"

Most the so called grants we get from the EU (basically a little of our money given back to us) is spent on arts and culture projects or flower pots in Pontypool dude lol

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722 "

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

Welsh labour overseeing 17 years of the worst education and health service in Britain Carwyns doing a sterling job i think not lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ill be voting to stay in as will my 18 year old.

I have to be honest listening to her and the arguments she has made for staying in is why Im voting yes.

People moan about immigrants coming to this country and yes I do agree there should be a better system, like in say Australia.But when all is said and done we need immigrants in the UK.

I dont see many people moaning about the Filipions coming her to fill the nurses jobs which we cant fill ourselves.

There is good and bad on both sides of the argument but only time will tell if the right decision will be made on the 23rd. At least the choice has been given to us and not left to people in parliament to decide for us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above

Most the so called grants we get from the EU (basically a little of our money given back to us) is spent on arts and culture projects or flower pots in Pontypool dude lol"

EU grants have just paid for the upgrade of housing stock in Neath/Port Talbot area, and doubtless other area's throughout the valley's. Insulation/kitchen's/roof's/double glazing, in my area all the work was carried out by local companies, doesn't that benefit the community, and Wales in general?

I hope the people of Pontypool appreciate their plant pots as much as I appreciate my new roof

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above

Most the so called grants we get from the EU (basically a little of our money given back to us) is spent on arts and culture projects or flower pots in Pontypool dude lol

I hope the people of Pontypool appreciate their plant pots as much as I appreciate my new roof"

Exactly. The EU do so much more than people say they do.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

Welsh labour overseeing 17 years of the worst education and health service in Britain Carwyns doing a sterling job i think not lol "

NHS Wales is in far better shape than England. Do you have any actual stats to back up any of your claims?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

Welsh labour overseeing 17 years of the worst education and health service in Britain Carwyns doing a sterling job i think not lol

NHS Wales is in far better shape than England. Do you have any actual stats to back up any of your claims?"

Personally, I don't like Labour or the Conservatives

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above"

Wales benefits by the EU returning a fraction of what we have paid in!

To make it simpler for you, here is an example: I go in to Tesco's and give them £50. Tesco's say thank you here have a £10 cake. I say that I do not want a £10 cake, I want bread. There is no bread!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

Welsh labour overseeing 17 years of the worst education and health service in Britain Carwyns doing a sterling job i think not lol

NHS Wales is in far better shape than England. Do you have any actual stats to back up any of your claims?"

There are lies and then there are Statistics. Statistics are useless in Wales. They schedule your operation even though it can not be carried out. They then cancel it and put you back on the waiting list.

Statistics say that you have only been waiting a month or two, when in fact it is a year or two.

David Davies, MP for Monmouthshire proved it!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And where are all the statistics collated ?

Newport

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above

Wales benefits by the EU returning a fraction of what we have paid in!

Wrong. To use your analogy the UK as a whole puts in £50, £8 of which comes from Wales. The U.K. then gets back £40, £18 of which goes to Wales, and the U.K. as a whole gets preferential free trade access with the buying power of the whole EU combined

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wales and the EU http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-calls-claim-wales-11450722

dude your posting from walesonline a left wing labour supporting paper nuff said

Welsh labour overseeing 17 years of the worst education and health service in Britain Carwyns doing a sterling job i think not lol

NHS Wales is in far better shape than England. Do you have any actual stats to back up any of your claims?

Statistics say that you have only been waiting a month or two, when in fact it is a year or two.

David Davies, MP for Monmouthshire proved it! "

Oh that's weird, seeming how when I go in for my operations, they see me within weeks. But perhaps that's because I have a condition that can ruin my way of life

I know noone who has to wait years to get an operation, unless it's cosmetical. My grandfather got told he had to have somethimg removed and they operated on him after three days. So please, show me these statistics to say I am wrong, even though I have experienced it.

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

"We are 100% Brexit!

Why would you want to give £250 million (£350 million before rebate/discount) per week to never ever see £170 million of it ever again every week.

Of that £250 million we get back £80 million, but we are told where and how to spend it!

Would it not be better to keep the £250 million per week to ourselves and spend it how we wish?

Why would you support the EU, a body that you have never voted for? A body that has never balanced its books, a body that is corrupt, a body that is failing.

Voting to remain is also a vote for Cameron, a proven liar!

A vote to remain is not a vote for Cameron, that is irrelevant to the referendum debate. If we do exit however then you are genuinely handing power to Boris, Gove and IDS. Good luck with that

On your other points, read the articles I posted above

Wales benefits by the EU returning a fraction of what we have paid in!

Report after report has shown that Wales is a net beneficiary, so it's not returning a fraction. Even leave campaign leaders acknowledge this.

Sure the EU stipulates what the money goes on, but billions of money have gone on projects I'd thought any sane Welsh person would be extremely grateful for things like funding towards the dualling of the Heads of the Valleys road to stimulate economic activity and improve access to markets.

To reduce it to cake and bread as if the EU gives us useless stuff is way to simplistic and unfair. If we leave, we'll just have another bunch of politicians deciding how much money struggling areas get and what they can spend it on anyway.

The EU is far from perfect, but has transformed former declining industrial areas like Baden-Wurttenburg in Germany through structural funding. I don't think a perpetual right/wing, market obsessed UK government will shown anything remotely like that effort, concern or financial backing. The market will be King.

It's madness you think a former city trader like Farage really cares, and will intervene.

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By *appy campersCouple
over a year ago

cardiff

100% out for us......

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

You are not voting to leave the EEA or WTO, meaning all of the UK's trade and benefit agreements will remain unchanged should we leave, until such a time that the UK decides to renegotiate them for any reason.

You are not voting to leave NATO, meaning our security agreements remain unchanged. Should we receive an act of hostility from a non-NATO member, then NATO countries are obliged to come to our assistance. This does not change.

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

You are not voting to leave Europe!! The UK will still, geographically, be part of Europe. Non political organisations aligned to Europe will still extend membership to the UK (i.e. sports governing bodies, and so on).

You are not voting to stop recognising Interpol, Europol and neither are you voting for SIS / MI6 to stop dealing with other intelligence services in the fight against terrorism and global, organised crime.

You are not voting against being able to travel to Europe, contrary to the belief of some fools recently on TV. The UK has always maintained stricter border and passport controls than many EU members. This will not change. You will still use a passport to go on holiday and you will still be allowed entry to countries in Europe. You may even get chance to skip queues by using the non--EU queues at the airport (the only point so far that is my opinion, and not necessarily a fact).

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

Medical and science research will not simply stop. The UK pays into the EU to then get money back in the form of funding. The UK will now be in control of this money and can choose to fund whatever UK based medical, science, art or other research it chooses.

Farming will not lose money because of EU funding being cut. The UK negotiated a rebate of some monies that the UK pays to the EU, in order to subsidise UK farmers. Instead of asking for our money back, we can give it straight to farmers. No change there.

You are not voting against human rights. The EU Convention on, and European Court of Human Rights are not part of the EU. Until parliament passes a new bill of rights for the UK, these will still apply, as will precedents already passed down to UK courts from Brussels.

You are not voting to kick anyone out of the UK or block access to anyone. Neither are you voting to stop recruiting valuable European workers into things like the NHS. Like my other point about passports for travel, the UK is already outside of the Schengen zone and so migrant workers must enter the UK with a valid passport before and after June 23rd. That will not change. British borders maintain full control of who comes and goes. Should someone have the skills to apply to work in the NHS, then they will still be permitted travel and given an opportunity to apply for a job. Worst case, points based assessment, like the US, Canada and Australia use, will come into effect. The UK is likely to negotiate freedom of labour movement though, in exchange for freedom of goods movement.

You are not voting to move jobs nor production out of the UK! The EU actually helped fund the move of Ford Transit production from the UK to Turkey... Yes, the EU helped give UK jobs to people in Turkey by giving Ford a loan of £80m with very generous terms!

What you are voting for is UK SOVEREIGNTY. You are voting to bring back CONTROL to our own country and to our elected leaders.

You are voting to stay in or leave a political union of leaders and representatives that you British people did not elect. You are voting against a commission of unelected, elite men that nobody at all voted for and yet they make decisions on our behalf. You are simply voting to bring sovereignty back to Westminster, and that is all.

If you worry about that because you don't like the Conservative government, look at the reality. Their majority in parliament is very slim. They have been blocked on big decisions already. You are therefore not giving sovereignty to David Cameron, but to the UK House of elected representatives (Parliament).

Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

How can I prove it? It has happened to me and members of my family. With both of us it was cancer, for me it was cancer twice! I know how long it was that we waited and it may have been longer if David Davies had not stepped in.

If I searched hard enough, I might find statistics, but then there are lies and then there are statistixs, they are fudged.

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"100% out for us......

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

What you are voting for is UK SOVEREIGNTY. You are voting to bring back CONTROL to our own country and to our elected leaders.

Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future."

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

"100% out for us......

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

What you are voting for is UK SOVEREIGNTY. You are voting to bring back CONTROL to our own country and to our elected leaders.

Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"100% out for us......

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

What you are voting for is UK SOVEREIGNTY. You are voting to bring back CONTROL to our own country and to our elected leaders.

Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future.

We are the 5th largest economy in the world and to maintain that if we come out we will be taxed more I detest the EU but fear for tax rises fuel duty Increases VAT going up no free tv licence for the elderly no fuel allowance free school dinners no family tax credit....that's why I say stay in that's all I'm concerned fir the working man, elderly and infirm and the kids coming out will cost the tax payer more

I hate myself for backing camoron yeah that's the right spelling

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Been a interesting thread this and i would say most here say leave as do about 90 percent of the people i've spoken too do also.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Been a interesting thread this and i would say most here say leave as do about 90 percent of the people i've spoken too do also."

Definitely out. We can survive without the EU

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

"Been a interesting thread this and i would say most here say leave as do about 90 percent of the people i've spoken too do also."

Yeah, it's been good. I'm implacably opposed to leaving, but I don't mind listening to people on the other side who can argue their case politely and coherently, rather than just shouting "out" (or "in" for that matter).

Personally, I think it will be at best a negative step and at possibly a disaster or Wales and the UK to leave.

We should reconvene on this thread in two years, five years and ten years time and honestly see where we stand if (as I think we will) we leave.

I'm happy to be proved wrong and genuinely hope I'm sat here going "it's way better than I thought. Right now the future post-leave worries me immensely!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

out for me I don't trust Cameron or Osbourne.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out definately for me

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

One theory I heard is if we leave, Wales, Scotland and Ireland band together and make a Celtic Coalition, and leave England.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Much of this is incorrect

"100% out for us......

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

*This is not true. If we exit we will have to renegotiate ALL our existing trade agreements, EU & wider, as per Point 50 of the Lisbon Treaty*

*Correct. No-one's mentioned NATO though*

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

*As above*

*Incorrect. At present we share information with our fellow EU nations, and co-operate across borders in terms of fighting terrorism / chasing crime. This WOULD change*

*Incorrect. Our relationship in terms of travel would change, both in terms of entering EU nations, definitely in terms of trade relations, and also in terms of the current EU Health Card: right now we're entitled to European wide free health care when on holiday / travelling. This WOULD stop - skiers, beware.

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

*Total bollocks. On leaving we would immediately re-enter recession. There will definitely be a downturn in the market / lack of confidence in both the UK and EU. In the short term this will hurt all our pockets. In the long term, we might benefit of the gamble goes according to plan, but it would be the year 2030 at earliest before we saw that*

*The government of the day can yes. If we leave, that government would be Boris, Gove and IDS, who would immediately need all spare cash to bolster the economy. Good luck*

*No true. We could give it to our farmers, but the government won't. In the present climate UK farms require subsidy to the tune of 19%. They lose money. For the reasons in the previous point they would suffer - no question*

*Read the Brexit economic reports. Our current working hours / rights, protected by the EU, would have to change to make British trade profitable. We would all work harder for less*

*Immigration would change - in fact it would, by necessity, actually increase under Brexit

*Its the cost of production in the UK that pushes production abroad. Unless we abandon minimum wage, and people get paid less, this won't change*

What you are voting for is UK SOVEREIGNTY. You are voting to bring back CONTROL to our own country and to our elected leaders.

*Did you vote for our current leaders? I didn't. Most people reading this didn't. What you would be doing is giving the Tories total control over us. Good luck again

*Much is made of the sprawling bureaucracy in the EU. It's a myth. It's actually the size of a middle sized UK council

*Again most people reading this (Welsh) didn't vote for those currently in power in Westminster. Why would we want to give them total power over us.

*You said it yourself. They have a majority. Post Brexit they would swing further right, and allied with UKIP the right would have control. Get real.

Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future."

*Please do think about your families. We've just been through recession, through austerity, and Brexit would definitely bring us more of this. We've seen the results of gambling on a national scale with the bankers: voting to exit would be gambling again, on an even greater scale. Please, do your research, and vote wisely. I for one don't wish to see us gamble again, or to pay the price. Brexit will hurt our economy. No question

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Points and corrections are interspersed throughout the above, marked with *

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By *lan dynamoCouple
over a year ago

neath

We are voting out we can no longer deport rapists or murders or any euro criminal. We can't even government our own waters no more, Has we can not keep any sea bass between January to June. but foreign boats have been aloud to catch an extra one tonne of fish a mouth in our waters.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"We are voting out we can no longer deport rapists or murders or any euro criminal. We can't even government our own waters no more, Has we can not keep any sea bass between January to June. but foreign boats have been aloud to catch an extra one tonne of fish a mouth in our waters.

Deportation is a human rights issue and nothing to do with being in the EU

66% of British fishing is exported & 7 of the top 10 countries we export to are in the EU. Brexit would harm this trade! Fishing rights also go back hundreds of years and far precede the Common Fisheries Agreement.

The reality of a Brexit wouldn't be as straightforward as many of you posting here would like to believe.

The fishing industry would still face fishing quotas, which would be negotiated by the same politicians they've long accused of letting them down. They'd still have to trade with our European neighbours - a massive market for our fishing industry, but without the preferential tariffs and power in Europe.

There are few guarantees in Leaving and the particular irony in this post is that this vote comes just as this particular industry is enjoying increasing profits!

Please! Do your research

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with.

Who's beating them? Just don't want to open our borders to let them in. .. "

Can you explain how leaving the eu will stop immigrants coming into the uk.

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with.

Who's beating them? Just don't want to open our borders to let them in. ..

Can you explain how leaving the eu will stop immigrants coming into the uk. "

Simple.

As part of the EU, we can be FORCED to accept a quota of immigrants, plus with the free movement of people across Europe, more are attempting to get into the UK from France for economic reasons.

So, if we leave the EU, we can regulate how many immigrants we take.

Secondly, we can decide who qualifies to enter the UK (an Australian style points system has been suggested).

Thirdly, we can refuse anyone who comes to the UK any access to benefits etc, (something the EU stops us doing currently) to make it less economically attractive for them.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

My dad served in world war two, and he would be turning in his grave at the thought of people using that as a stick to beat immigrants with.

Who's beating them? Just don't want to open our borders to let them in. ..

Can you explain how leaving the eu will stop immigrants coming into the uk.

Simple.

As part of the EU, we can be FORCED to accept a quota of immigrants, plus with the free movement of people across Europe, more are attempting to get into the UK from France for economic reasons.

So, if we leave the EU, we can regulate how many immigrants we take.

Secondly, we can decide who qualifies to enter the UK (an Australian style points system has been suggested).

Thirdly, we can refuse anyone who comes to the UK any access to benefits etc, (something the EU stops us doing currently) to make it less economically attractive for them."

Not so. It is highly unlikely that leaving the EU would significantly reduce the numbers of people coming here - not least because more than half of migration is of people from outside the EU!

Figures from the Office of National Statistics show that 277,000 people from outside the EU settled in the UK in 2015, a figure that would NOT be affected by Brexit.

The equivalent figure from the EU nations was 270,000 - and, whatever the political make up here post Brexit (even if UKIP got in) we would have to accept a significant level of free movement for EU nationals as part of any trade deal if we left the EU, just as indeed Norway and Switzerland do today.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Let me make an important point on what we think we are all reading every day as "facts". Over 80% of UK newspapers are owned by five right-wing media billionaires: Lord Rothermere (Daily Mail), Rupert Murdoch (Sun/Times), Richard Desmond (Express), and the Barclay Brothers (Telegraph). Murdoch is an Australian living in New York and Rothermere lives in France, while the Barclay Brothers live in the tax havens of Monaco and Guernsey. All of them use tax haven entities to avoid UK taxes. And guess who wants to stop billionaires using tax havens to avoid paying their taxes? That's right, the EU. So of course British newspapers are trying to persuade us to leave the EU; it benefits their owners personally. Please, don't gather your views from newspapers. Do your research, as per all my posts in this thread

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

"Let me make an important point on what we think we are all reading every day as "facts". Over 80% of UK newspapers are owned by five right-wing media billionaires: Lord Rothermere (Daily Mail), Rupert Murdoch (Sun/Times), Richard Desmond (Express), and the Barclay Brothers (Telegraph). Murdoch is an Australian living in New York and Rothermere lives in France, while the Barclay Brothers live in the tax havens of Monaco and Guernsey. All of them use tax haven entities to avoid UK taxes. And guess who wants to stop billionaires using tax havens to avoid paying their taxes? That's right, the EU. So of course British newspapers are trying to persuade us to leave the EU; it benefits their owners personally. Please, don't gather your views from newspapers. Do your research, as per all my posts in this thread"

Says the man who was posting links from walesonline

as you can see from this thread you are clearly in the minority with your views dude

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Says the man who was posting links from walesonline

as you can see from this thread you are clearly in the minority with your views dude "

I don't see that no. I see people asking questions, who want information. I see other people who have read misinformation, and yes I also see some people of opposing views. We all have a choice. It's not for you or I to determine others for them. It's for people to make their own choice, but hopefully based on reasoned debate and evidence, not spin and propaganda, neither one way nor the other

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By *ay rickMan
over a year ago

cardiff

I'm same you missp--my view on all things political is chill the fuck out no matter what anyone says WE don't decide anyway-it's already been decided!!!-in or out don't care-who runs country red or blue I don't care they're all the same nothing changes it just means they fuck us in a different position that all lmao

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"I'm same you missp--my view on all things political is chill the fuck out no matter what anyone says WE don't decide anyway-it's already been decided!!!-in or out don't care-who runs country red or blue I don't care they're all the same nothing changes it just means they fuck us in a different position that all lmao

They are all the same, I agree. This isn't an ejection though, this is a referendum on relative stability or a massive gamble

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Ejection? Election!

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

For those of you who don't have the time / inclination to find out all the facts about the EU referendum (I don't blame you) and are possibly unsure which way to vote, perhaps knowing how other notable people are thinking may help.

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx

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By *ilthyjackcoupleCouple
over a year ago

Swansea

"For those of you who don't have the time / inclination to find out all the facts about the EU referendum (I don't blame you) and are possibly unsure which way to vote, perhaps knowing how other notable people are thinking may help.

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx"

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx"

You need to add England football hooligans to that list.

I believe the song in Marseille went:

"F*** off Europe, we're voting out"

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

I forgot Putin too... He's a Brexiteer as well

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx

You need to add England football hooligans to that list.

I believe the song in Marseille went:

"F*** off Europe, we're voting out"

I bet they spent hours choosing those lyrics

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx

You need to add England football hooligans to that list.

I believe the song in Marseille went:

"F*** off Europe, we're voting out"

I bet they spent hours choosing those lyrics

Don't mock, it was a feat of mental exertion MissP. Kinda like Tolstoy writing War and Peace or something.

In all fairness, there are people I could add to the list of Brexiters I do think can argue a case well and fairly - there's a few on Fab even actually. It's not a completely one-sided list in my world.

I can't deny the idea of Katie Hopkins celebrating a leave vote next week is enough to make me ill though!

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx"

All signed up members of project fear dude with to many backhanders to lose if we leave i will just remind you that our greatest leaders Churchill and Thatcher were very Anti European union

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx

All signed up members of project fear dude with to many backhanders to lose if we leave i will just remind you that our greatest leaders Churchill and Thatcher were very Anti European union"

There's scaremongering on both sides. "Our greatest leaders: Thatcher". Turn it in fella...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

Here are a few that strongly believe the UK should remain a member of the EU:

• Governor of the Bank of England

• International Monetary Fund

• Institute for Fiscal Studies

• Confederation of British Industry

• Leaders/heads of state of every single other member of the EU

• President of the United States of America

• Eight former US Treasury Secretaries

• President of China

• Prime Minister of India

• Prime Minister of Canada

• Prime Minister of Australia

• Prime Minister of Japan

• Prime Minister of New Zealand

• The Chief Executives of the majority of the top 100 companies in the UK

• Kofi Annan, the former Secretary General of the United Nations

• All living former Prime Ministers of the UK (from both parties)

• A huge swathe of reputable and recognised economists

• The Prime Minister of the UK

• The Leader of the Labour Party

• The Leader of the Liberal Democrats

• The Leader of the Green Party

• The Leader of the Scottish National Party

• The Leader of Plaid Cymru

• Leader of Sinn Fein

• Martin Lewis (that money saving bloke on TV)

• The Secretary General of the TUC

• Unison

• National Union of Students

• National Union of Farmers

• Professor Stephen Hawking

• Chief Executive of the NHS

• 300 of the most prominent international historians

• Director of Europol

• David Anderson QC, Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation

• Former Directors of GCHQ

• Secretary General of NATO

• Church of England

• Church in Scotland

• Church in Wales

• Friends of the Earth

• Greenpeace

• Director General of the World Trade Organisation

• WWF

• World Bank

• OECD

• Sir David Attenborough

On the Brexit side, the following think we should leave the EU:

• Boris Johnson, who knows he’ll become Prime Minister if the country votes to leave

• IDS: The former Secretary of State for Work and Pensions who carried out a brutal regime of cuts to benefits and essential support for the poorest in society as well as the disabled and sick

• Gove: the idiot that was Education Secretary and every single teacher in the country hated with a passion for the damage he was doing to the education system

• Nigel Farage, Leader of UKIP

• The BNP

• Britain First

• Donald Trump

• Keith Chegwin

• David Icke

As I said, if you don't have time to look into the full facts and implications of all this in/out stuff, perhaps just pick the list you trust most.

And if you are unsure about leaving, I would suggest don't. Why gamble? xx

All signed up members of project fear dude with to many backhanders to lose if we leave i will just remind you that our greatest leaders Churchill and Thatcher were very Anti European union

There's scaremongering on both sides. "Our greatest leaders: Thatcher". Turn it in fella..."

Greatest leader this little island of ours has had in my life time

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By *r_bootneckMan
over a year ago

london

Its a very simple out for me. I've served for queen and country all over this planet and I believe that we should be in control of our own destiny however that works out. I don't think that we should be dictated to by the un-elected masses in Brussels who are only interested in lining their own pockets. As it stands right now half the people i fought against are now strolling the streets of this once great britain

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Its a very simple out for me. I've served for queen and country all over this planet and I believe that we should be in control of our own destiny however that works out. I don't think that we should be dictated to by the un-elected masses in Brussels who are only interested in lining their own pockets. As it stands right now half the people i fought against are now strolling the streets of this once great britain"

Are we truly dictated to though? What can't you as an individual do today because of the EU?

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

The "unelected masses" in Brussels given masses of help to the economically declining parts of Wales and other parts of the EU. I have more faith in them continuing to do than the likes of Boris or Farage. To accuse the EU of just lining their own pockets is deeply unfair. It does happen, but they've done provided masses of great investment.

It amazes me how people have suddenly developed this love of our whiter-than-white UK politicians, who wouldn't dream of lining their own pockets

Presumably these people you fought against aren't EU citizens unless you are in your 80s. We've been able to control non-EU migration all along. The referendum changes nothing in that respect. If too many have come, that's the failure of UK politicians - the very ones so many people are desperate to hand the power to when we "take back control". You won't see any difference.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

It amazes me how people have suddenly developed this love of our whiter-than-white UK politicians, who wouldn't dream of lining their own pockets

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Watch " Brexit the movie" on YouTube. Then decide.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

In fairness, I watched it. I then watched The Propaganda Game on Netflix. That put it in perspective.

There are undeniable points on both sides. The EU does need reformation, but we are better off inside the tent pissing out than the reverse.

I do hate to harp on, but Brexit is a gamble. The economy would be hit hard and we'd all spend the next 15-20 years paying for it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Objective one funding for Wales is not guaranteed when the next round and rules are finalised in a couple of years time.

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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago

West Wales and Cardiff

"Objective one funding for Wales is not guaranteed when the next round and rules are finalised in a couple of years time."

No-one has said its guaranteed. It's more we're saying that it's been a huge source of help to the poorest parts of Wales and it's shocking that the "EU have done nothing for us" brigade don't at least acknowledge the help received.

We may not get Objective One again. It's a scandal that we still may qualify for it really. Whose fault is that - the very UK politicians everyone seems so keen to "give back control" to.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Objective one funding for Wales is not guaranteed when the next round and rules are finalised in a couple of years time.

We may not get Objective One again. It's a scandal that we still may qualify for it really. Whose fault is that - the very UK politicians everyone seems so keen to "give back control" to."

So you acknowledge that in future we may not qualify. Of course being bribed with our own money. However if we no longer qualify that means those nasty politicians in Westminster who continue to subsidise Wales more than the EU ever does are all wicked (not).

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Wales' EU Funding is guaranteed until 2020 if we stay in, and as per the recent study by the Wales Governance Centre shows, Wales currently receives c.£245m more from the EU than it pays in. Fact

There is no reason to suggest that EU funding would be withdrawn after 2020. We have areas with high levels of deprivation, which is exactly what the EU funds are there to support

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By *Psaucy67Man
over a year ago

Swansea

"Out!!!

77 million Turks given EU travel rights... even though Turkey isn't in the EU.

£350 million paid to the EU .... EVERY WEEK... we could do so much for the NHS, education etc. with that.

Italy now wants a referendum on leaving the EU, and they wont be the last to follow suit, the EU is doomed.

I could go on, but you should do your own research.

Well said

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To all of you who intend to vote Leave...MAKE SURE YOU GO AND VOTE.

To all of you who intend to vote Remain...there's some really great telly on on the 23rd.

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By *ruckerGuyMan
over a year ago

Cwmcarn

"What's your views on this guys?? I ain't got a fucking clue. I am leaning towards out but haven't really taken enough notice of either argument yet to decide for definite

OUT OUT OUT ALL THE WAY

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By *oxicpinkdrinkWoman
over a year ago

Cardiff

"We are voting out, we can no longer deport rapists or murders or any euro criminal. We can't even government our own waters no more.... we can not keep any seabass between January to June"

I too dream of a Britain where the victims of rape, and haddock, can exist in freedom and solidarity. Right on!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wales' EU Funding is guaranteed until 2020 if we stay in, and as per the recent study by the Wales Governance Centre shows, Wales currently receives c.£245m more from the EU than it pays in. Fact

There is no reason to suggest that EU funding would be withdrawn after 2020. We have areas with high levels of deprivation, which is exactly what the EU funds are there to support

A number of poorer countries have joined since so its almost a certainty that come 2020 Wales EU grants will fall overall.

In any case £245m is small beer in the context of a UK NET contribution of £10bn and rising.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I honestly don't think that anything will change either way, cuts to civil services will continue aslong as the torys are in charge "/

Even if we get out I think we will have access to the single market, there will just be a delay.

Immigration will stay the same, regardless of whatever they threaten will happen.

There aren't many facts out there, mostly speculation!

I think I'm going with the numerous business's out there (ford etc.) and vote in.

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By *tsallaroundMan
over a year ago

merthyr

Out

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

You're all intelligent people. Forget the bullshit and look at the facts: there is not one single independent study out there that states we will be the same as we are now, or better off, in the event of Brexit. Not. One.

Our economy will be hit. Fact. We will all foot the bill - fact - just as we did with the banking crisis in 2008 and the ERM exit (Black Wednesday) in 1992.

Why o why would you want to re-enter recession, and put an even further right wing Conservative government in complete control of our current finances & financial future through to 2020 (the next general election)? I simply cannot fathom it.

Brexit = gambling, with our national economy, on a global scale. What for...?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out unless you want blonde hair and blue eyes just like your neighbour....OUT OUT OUT.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Lord bamford of JCB who has one of the most successful british companies in the world has said hes voting out as it makes our exports stronger and our buying power stronger.

He said look at it this way. If we leave, Europe will still sell goods to us as if they don't they face economic ruin. We can dictate how.much we are willing to pay for those goods and also dictate that by buying a British product they pay more but get better quality.

Would you stop buying bread from your local shop if it changed it's name ?

Would you buy a child seat for your car just because it's cheap ? Or would you buy a quality checked one for more money because it's safe ?

Leaving gives the country more power in the market place and remember that we primarily sell luxury items as we don't have a strong manufacturing industry anymore due to Europe...e.g. steel ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lord bamford of JCB who has one of the most successful british companies in the world has said hes voting out as it makes our exports stronger and our buying power stronger.

Would you stop buying bread from your local shop if it changed it's name ?

Would you buy a child seat for your car just because it's cheap ? Or would you buy a quality checked one for more money because it's safe ?

Leaving gives the country more power in the market place and remember that we primarily sell luxury items as we don't have a strong manufacturing industry anymore due to Europe...e.g. steel ?"

Anthony Bamford the billionaire Tory lord, who has world wide manufacturing plants, who made several wage/job cuts, and probably voted for benefit cuts for the disabled?

I'm undecided as of yet, there are no guarantee's no matter which way it goes, there isn't an historical example for us either, you can't simply say we were Ok before, times have changed.

All that draws me toward the remain vote is the diatribe scripted by EDL or similar, used by many on here to disparage migrants, well that and Boris saying he'll spend the cost of the EU on the NHS, yeah 'course ya will

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

197 UK business leaders signed a letter a few weeks ago backing Britain to remain a member of the EU. Those listed included:

Nicholas Judd, Founder & Head of Investment, 90 North Real Estate Partners LLP

Matt McLaren, Executive Director, Access Ambition Consultancy Services Ltd

Tony Fernandes, GCEO, AirAsia and Founder, Tune Group

Paul Kahn, President, Airbus Group UK

Jacqueline Gold CBE, CEO, Ann Summers

Andy Clarke, Chief Executive, Asda

Pascal Soriot, CEO, AstraZeneca

Sir Adrian Montague CBE, Chairman, Aviva

Paul Evans, Group CEO, AXA UK & Ireland

Peter Rogers, CEO, Babcock International

Sir Roger Carr, Chairman, BAE Systems

Saghir Munir, Partner/Director, Baker & Coleman Solicitors Ltd

Richard John Carter, Managing Director, BASF plc

Ian Baxter, Chairman, Baxter Freight Limited

Una Driscoll, Managing Director, Belt up Kidz Ltd

Helen Gibbons, Director, Bizlang Limited

Dr Ian Robertson, Board Member, BMW AG

Helena Boas, Co-Founder, Bodas

Bob Dudley, CEO, BP plc

Chris Grigg, CEO, British Land

Sir Alan Parker, Chairman, Brunswick Group

Gavin Patterson, CEO, BT Group plc

Sir Mike Rake, Chairman, BT Group plc

Christopher Bailey MBE, CEO, Burberry Group plc

Sir John Peace, Chairman, Burberry Group plc and Standard Chartered

George Iacobescu CBE, Chairman and CEO, Canary Wharf Group

Philip Green, Chairman, Carillion

Alex Mitchell, Director, Causarma Limited

Iain C. Conn, CEO, Centrica

Sarah Golding, CEO and Partner, CHI & Partners

Christopher Satterthwaite, Chief Executive, Chime Communications Group

Laurent Lacassagne, Chairman and CEO, Chivas Brothers

Phil Smith, Chief Executive UK and Ireland, Cisco

Sonny Leong, Chief Executive Officer, Civil Service College Ltd

Stephen Clarke, Partner/Director, CJCH Ltd

Ian Breminer, Managing Director, Complete Coffee Ltd

Professor Geeta Nargund, Founder and CEO, CREATE Health Limited

Tidjane Thiam, CEO, Credit Suisse

Cathy Owens, Director, Deryn Consulting Limited

Ivan Menezes, CEO, Diageo

Peter Callahan, Director, Diamond Dispersions Ltd

Seb James, CEO, Dixons Carphone

Martha Lane Fox CBE, Founder, Doteveryone and co-founder, Lucky Voice and Lastminute.com

Tim Gentles, Chief Executive Officer, Drill Board Worldwide Limited

Dame Carolyn McCall, CEO, EasyJet

Lindsley Ruth, CEO, Electrocomponents plc

Liz Weatherill, Managing Director, Enable2 C.I.C

Amjad Bseisu, Chief Executive, EnQuest plc

Damien Croft, Director, Esplora Limited

Charlie Shaw, Managing Director, Esteiro Business Solutions Limited

Adam Shuter, Managing Director, Exact Logistics Limited

Roland Rudd, Chairman, Finsbury

James Farley, Executive Vice President and President, Europe, Ford

Nacho Morais, Director, Frank Consulting Ltd

Michael Keegan, Executive Director EMEIA Region, Fujitsu

Stewart Wingate, CEO, Gatwick Airport Ltd

Mark Elborne, UK CEO, General Electric

Nigel Stein, Chief Executive, GKN

Hazel Pegg, Director, Glastonbury Online Ltd

Richard Gnodde, Co-CEO, Goldman Sachs International

Michael Sherwood, Co-CEO, Goldman Sachs International

Tom Gosnell, Managing Director, Gosnells Beverages Ltd

Juliette Polge de Combret, Director, Green Rendez-Vous Ltd

Sir Andrew Witty, CEO, GSK

Jenny Halpern Prince, CEO, Halpern

David Atkins, Chief Executive, Hammerson plc

John Holland-Kaye, CEO, Heathrow

Allen Hogan, Managing Director, Hogan's Cider Ltd

Ashley Govier, Managing Director, Hotel Services Group Ltd

Stuart Gulliver, CEO, HSBC

Douglas Flint CBE, Chairman, HSBC

Mark Hutchinson, Managing Director, Hutchinson Aerotech

Christian Salbaing, Deputy Chairman, Hutchison Whampoa

Julian Smith, Director, I Am Enterprises Ltd

David Stokes, CEO, IBM

Dan Hydes, Managing Director, Ignite Data Ltd

Ralf Speth KBE, CEO, Jaguar Land Rover

Mahmood Faiz, Director, James William Estate Agents

Jane Field, Owner/Founder, Jonny’s Sister

Katharine Pooley, Chief Executive and Owner, Katharine Pooley Interior Design

Kelly Hoppen MBE, Director, Kelly Hoppen Interiors

Martin Dare-Edwards, Chief Executive Officer, Ketonex Ltd

Veronique Laury, CEO, Kingfisher plc

Neil Clifford, Chief Executive, Kurt Geiger

Ian Walker, Director, LaundryRepublic Ltd

Sir Julian Horn-Smith, Advisory Board Member, LetterOne Technology

John Nelson, Chairman, Lloyd’s of London

Christopher Parker, Managing Director, London and Scottish International Ltd

Xavier Rolet KBE, CEO, London Stock Exchange

Debbie Wosskow, Chief Executive Officer, Love Home Swap Ltd

Tim Allen, Managing Director, M J Allen Group Ltd

Jess Burley, Global CEO, M/Six

Mark Reynolds, Chief Executive, Mace Group

Charlie Cornish, Chief Executive, Manchester Airports Group

Martin Lamb, Director, Maple Consulting Ltd

Christopher Peer, Managing Director, Maritime House Limited

Rick Haythornthwaite, Chairman, Mastercard

Ron Dennis CBE, Chairman and CEO, McLaren Technology Group

Clare Hornby, Founder and Creative Director, ME+EM

Sir Nigel Rudd, Chairman, Meggitt

Doug Dooley, Managing Director, MICC & TRM Ltd

Byron Dixon, Chief Executive Officer, Micro-Fresh International

Kanya King MBE, CEO and Founder, MOBO Organisations Ltd

Rana Harvey, Managing Director, Monster Group (UK) Ltd

Fraser Smeaton, Chief Executive, Morphsuits

Alan Parker CBE, Chairman, Mothercare

Dean Finch, CEO, National Express Group

Mary Nelson, Director, Nelson Browne Management Ltd

Sam Laidlaw, Chairman, Neptune Oil and Gas

Miisa Mink, Chairperson, Nordic Bakery Limited

Andrew Mitchell, Chief Executive, North East Finance Ltd

Geeta Sidhu-Robb, CEO and Founder, Nosh Detox

Tim Steiner, CEO, Ocado Group

Stuart Rose, Chairman, Ocado Group

Christina Richardson, CMO, Openr

Charlie Thuillier, Managing Director, Oppo Brothers Limited

Pia Marocco, Managing Director, Osborne & Partners

Luke Brynley-Jones, Managing Director, Our Social Times Ltd

Paul Simpson, Director, Paul Simpson Ltd

John Fallon, CEO, Pearson

Ayman Asfari, CEO, Petrofac

Graham Spencer, Executive Director, Plants for Europe Ltd

Scott Rowland, Chief Executive Officer, Precept (UK) Ltd

Mike Wells, Group Chief Executive, Prudential plc

Steve Wadey, CEO, QinetiQ

Mary Quicke, Managing Director, Quickes Traditional Ltd

Raman Sehgal, Director, Ramarketing & PR Ltd

Sir Peter Rigby, CEO & Chairman, Rigby Group PLC

Jan du Plessis, Chairman, Rio Tinto Group

Warren East CBE, CEO, Rolls Royce

Ben Van Beurden, CEO, Royal Dutch Shell

Stephen Hester, CEO, RSA Insurance

Michael O’Leary, Chief Executive, Ryanair

Alan Clark, CEO, SABMiller

Alison Edgar, Managing Director, Sales Coaching Solutions Ltd

Nathan Bostock, CEO, Santander UK

Shriti Vadera, Chair, Santander UK

Caroline Cole, Director, Savoir Faire Accounting Ltd

Tori Chilcott, Co-Founder, Scoota

Rupert Soames OBE, CEO, SERCO

Juergen Maier, UK CEO, Siemens

Mark Lyndon, Director, Signature Marketing Limited

Simon Barrow, Director, Simon Barrow Associates

Melanie Goldsmith, Director, Smith & Sinclair Ltd

Jonathan Grubin, CEO, SoPost Ltd

Doug Squires, Director, Squires Gear and Engineering Limited

Bill Winters, CEO, Standard Chartered

Ian Barnett, Director, Surfanic International Ltd

Dr Heather McGregor CBE, CEO, Taylor Bennett

Ronan Dunne, Chief Executive, Telefonica O2 UK

Sara Bell, CEO, Tempus Energy

Billy Walker, Managing Director, The Benriach Distillery Company Ltd

Daniel Williams, Managing Director, The Bottle Shop (Penarth) Ltd

Jay Risbridger, Director, The Green Stationery Company Ltd

Sally Greene OBE, Chief Executive, The Old Vic

Margo Marrone, Co-Founder, The Organic Pharmacy

Rory Curnock Cook, Director, The Profs Tuition Ltd

Lady Ruth Rogers MBE, Owner, The River Café

Niamh Barker, Managing Director, The Travelwrap Company Ltd

John Harries, Proprietor, Three Horseshoes Inn

Stephen Weil, Managing Director, TI Partners

Bernardo Ivo Cruz, Global Managing Partner, True Bridge Consultancy

Peter Long, Supervisory Board Member & former Chief Executive, TUI Travel

Olivier Dochez, Chief Executive Officer, Two Guys From Brussels

Paul Polman, CEO, Unilever

Lucian Grainge CBE, Chairman and CEO, Universal Music Group

Kate Unsworth, Founder and CEO, Vinaya

Peter Berry, Managing Partner, VIP Labels

Tom Mockridge, Chief Executive, Virgin Media

Jayne-Anne Gadhia, CEO, Virgin Money

Ian Taylor, CEO and President, Vitol

Vittorio Colao, CEO, Vodafone

Sir Peter Kendall, Director, W J Kendall Contracting Limited

Kasim Ali, Director, Waterloo Tea Limited

Keith Cochrane, Chief Executive, Weir Group

Sir Terence Matthews, Chairman, Wesley Clover

Karren Brady, Vice-Chairman, West Ham FC

Dr Uwe Kruger, Chief Executive, WS Atkins

Rich Clothier, Managing Director, Wyke Farms

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Oh and the Bank of England has just come out and stated that Brexit is the single biggest risk to the economy at present.

Brexit poses global financial risk, Bank of England warns:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36548460

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By *ax-BangingMan
over a year ago

town

All doing as old Dave has asked how's about we not be sheep and think for ourselves for a change mister I know better than everybody else your a sheep for the remind lot learn to think for yourself!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oooh the irony

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Gove, Duncan Smith and Boris Jonson.

all want to privatise the NHS.

if we go out they will be in ..goodbye NHS it was nice knowing you

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By *ickablecoupleCouple
over a year ago

West Glamorgan

Staying in! Wales has benifited from billions from EU funding that has created jobs which Wales needs!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm undecided personally, one minute I'm "in" and then i read something else and I'm "out"

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By *tu griffMan
over a year ago

bridgend

Wales does benefit from European funding that's s fact, but we are not exactly thriving these days and most of the talk is that Europe is a failing system with no obvious sign that's it's going to improve.

I have been a remainer but I saw Michael grove and I'm far from a fan of his but he and boris do make many good points.

It is a risk if we leave but surly ax 'great' Britain we can do at least ax well as the Aussies and Canada and the other stand along countries?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Definitely out !!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Propaganda flying around certainly doesn't help.

Its probably a one question debate.

Decide if you think Britain is resourceful enough to stand and compete alone. That in itself will point you to the right box.

Personally in....but I have a feeling the result will be different.

It's certainly got the nation talking, even if confused.

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Oooh the irony"

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Staying in! Wales has benifited from billions from EU funding that has created jobs which Wales needs! "

This is a fact

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wales does benefit from European funding that's s fact, but we are not exactly thriving these days and most of the talk is that Europe is a failing system with no obvious sign that's it's going to improve.

I have been a remainer but I saw Michael grove and I'm far from a fan of his but he and boris do make many good points.

It is a risk if we leave but surly ax 'great' Britain we can do at least ax well as the Aussies and Canada and the other stand along countries?"

Australia in in a unique position it has vast resources and most of the worlds population wants to emigrate there.we on the other hand are a tiny island built on a former empire.we make next to nothing anymore .left with a service economy that is on the bottom end of the ladder for income.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Vote In is a vote for camoron (spelt right) he's a twat

vote out and it's a vote for farage who is a racist bigot

Loving the choice

I go with the twat

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By *JJJJxMan
over a year ago

Cardiff

Twats vs c*nts every time

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Im the same. I don't know enough about it. What I do know is making me lean to the out brigade.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Twats vs c*nts every time

right on

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By *ancubsaMan
over a year ago

Newport

Pop onto Youtube and search for "Brexit the movie". It's an hour and ten mins but worth the watch. Yes it was made by the brexit campaign but just listen to what they have to say.

It's not just about the immigrants, that is such a small part or it. It's not about whether you parents fought in the war (but I do thank them for that with all my heart). You have to realise that this is a small little island and we have been stripped of everything by the EU... watch the movie guys. As much as I think Farage is an idiot, when I watched the "debate" between Dave and Nige (well it wasn't a debate), neither were given time to answer any decent questions and Dave gave the same polished runaround answers he always gives which tells you nothing!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Interesting thread! Couple of points to add:

- Immigration is a separate debate. We have: (A) immigration from outside of the EU. This is completely within our reach to control today and probably won't be affected much if we leave the EU. (B) Immigration of EU citizens. Our ability to control numbers will likely not be changed by a Brexit: if we want to be a part of the trading block, which is vital for our economic survival, we will probably have to accept free movement of people like Norway has to now. Anyone who says we will be free to call the shots and negotiate our way out of this is talking pie in the sky - our hand isn't that strong.

- A Brexit is much like a divorce. We have a hugely intertwined and very complicated set of arrangements with Europe. Even trade agreements with parts of the world outside the EU are predicated on our membership of the EU and these would be invalidated as soon as we leave. Even if the work to split us from Europe can be done in two years, it's going to take much much longer to establish trading deals with something like 70 countries. For one thing, our civil service is physically capable of doing only one or two of these per year. This will inevitably cause massive disruption to businesses both here and across the world, for at least the next 10 years.

- We have plenty of evidence of what happens when there is disruption to markets: just think back to the ERM exit and the banking crisis, which both lead to serious recessions. The stock markets will fall, the pound will devalue, businesses will fail, jobs will be lost, house prices will probably fall, pension funds will lose a lot of money, the Treasury will lose income which will lead to tax rises and cuts in public services etc etc. A few people will get rich off the disruption but the rest of us will poorer.

- Keep in mind that the EU was set up to create stability in Europe and help countries to do business with each other for everybody's benefit. We've had 70 years of peace and prosperity after what was the darkest period in the history of the world, so I would say that in this respect it has achieved its goal. Along with France and Germany, we have a major influence on the decisions that takes Europe forward because we are one of the big three. As soon as we leave - if it survives - then Europe will have more control over us than it does today. Better to be inside the tent pissing out than the other way round. If the EU unravels as a result of the ball that Brexit may start rolling - I think this is a real risk - then Europe is vulnerable to the next ultra right-wing nutter that wants to seize power and God knows where that will take us. Churchill was all for Europe as an entity that works together, and I for one would like to see that continue.

- A lot has been said about the costs of being in Europe. There are different figures being banded about, but even if you take the £350 million-a-week headline figure, it's only a fiver per person per week. Sure, the EU is bureaucratic, probably corrupt, inefficient and annoying, but for the price of a mobile phone subscription it provides good value for money. This is going to be the biggest decision of a generation, so I would urge everyone to learn as much about it as you can and vote with your head rather than your heart. My personal opinion is that we are in danger of cutting off our nose to spite our face, but I can see that opinions here differ! After all else, let's raise our glasses to democracy and make the best of whatever decision comes out on Thursday.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Interesting thread! Couple of points to add:

I agree

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

OUT simply because everyone always talks about how things need to change and how we are not a *great Britain* anymore this is the chance to make a change.

Things don't happen over night they take time and effort so.. definitely out x

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By *asokittyWoman
over a year ago

Nr Worksop

"OUT simply because everyone always talks about how things need to change and how we are not a *great Britain* anymore this is the chance to make a change.

Things don't happen over night they take time and effort so.. definitely out x"

You think Cameron and his cronies will make it 'great' again....u likely.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"OUT simply because everyone always talks about how things need to change and how we are not a *great Britain* anymore this is the chance to make a change.

Things don't happen over night they take time and effort so.. definitely out x

You think Cameron and his cronies will make it 'great' again....u likely. "

Nope if we do leave the EU then Cameron is next to go..

I want what everyone else does Britain to be powerful and wealthy again.. atm were not and Cameron is just a little bitch when he represents the UK nobody takes that man seriously..

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By *inky-MinxWoman
over a year ago

Grantham

For me it's not about the people saying stay or go. It's about what the EU really means to this country. Not Europe, not the Europeans but the EU itself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gILTIDr4Ra8

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The rest of your claims hold about as much water as a collander"

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By *inky-MinxWoman
over a year ago

Grantham

"Nope if we do leave the EU then Cameron is next to go..

I want what everyone else does Britain to be powerful and wealthy again.. atm were not and Cameron is just a little bitch when he represents the UK nobody takes that man seriously.. "

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