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It's doing my head in already. | |||
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"What site is petition on it’s so confusing 20 mph here 30 mph there ffs " Go to the Senedd site and scroll down to petitions. | |||
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"It's not a blanket 30 though is it? Up to Local Authorities to set different speed limits. Working fine in RCT. Less dead children is a good thing to me. Give it time. No one thought anyone would wear seat belts. No one thought d*unk driving would be both illegal and socially acceptable. Spain have done it. Don't be afraid to be different to England. Don't be a pawn sucked in by the Conservatives in Wales. There is no blanket 20 mph. It's 20 if there are street lights unless stated otherwise. Rant over. "I agree, there's a few roads here where it's a bit ridiculous doing 20 and the local councilor is already on the case. Rest of the roads I do really think should stay 20. Some roads had been 20 for over a decade. Good example of awful delays it makes was yesterday. Car pulled away from be in a 20 which should really be a 30. Couple of miles later I was back behind the same car waiting at a junction. So me doing 20 made naff all difference. I don't get the bile some are throwing around about it. Does it really impact your civil liberties that much to drive a bit slower? Some people are acting like toddlers | |||
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"221,241 signed……we are getting to 500,000??" Because people respond to soundbites and not facts. It's like Brexit again. Remember the NHS bus? All sucked in again by the right. | |||
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"221,241 signed……we are getting to 500,000?? Because people respond to soundbites and not facts. It's like Brexit again. Remember the NHS bus? All sucked in again by the right. "Ummm no, just because people take a contrary view to you does not mean they ignorant sheep. | |||
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"221,241 signed……we are getting to 500,000?? Because people respond to soundbites and not facts. It's like Brexit again. Remember the NHS bus? All sucked in again by the right.
Ummm no, just because people take a contrary view to you does not mean they ignorant sheep. "*they’re | |||
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"221,241 signed……we are getting to 500,000?? Because people respond to soundbites and not facts. It's like Brexit again. Remember the NHS bus? All sucked in again by the right.
Ummm no, just because people take a contrary view to you does not mean they ignorant sheep. "Baaaaaaaaaa | |||
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"The bbc (not famed for right wing retoric) have said welsh goverment admit it will cost wales 1.5 billion in lost revenue and folded buisneses over 10 years, thats a lot of hospital ,that could of saved even more lives than the predicted 10 a year + added polution they admit as well . loose loose wales" Where did the British Broadcasting Corporation broadcast that? Lots of billions for a speed limit. | |||
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"Where did the British Broadcasting Corporation broadcast that? Lots of billions for a speed limit." https://www.gov.wales/introducing-20mph-speed-limits-frequently-asked-questions#130675 That's the Welsh Assembly's own page where it states the cost could be £4.5 billion, 3 times the earlier figure. And their own words say: "So, the estimated cost to the economy of £4.5 billion over 30 years may not be an accurate reflection of the true cost." Even if the figure is 'just' half that value, by their own admission they say it will cost the Welsh economy over the next couple of decades. You have been quite confrontational, quite argumentative and provocative with your posts on a thread about a petition. It's not a thread about the justification of the new limit. There is already one on the Wales forum where that debate has started. | |||
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"Where did the British Broadcasting Corporation broadcast that? Lots of billions for a speed limit. https://www.gov.wales/introducing-20mph-speed-limits-frequently-asked-questions#130675 That's the Welsh Assembly's own page where it states the cost could be £4.5 billion, 3 times the earlier figure. And their own words say: "So, the estimated cost to the economy of £4.5 billion over 30 years may not be an accurate reflection of the true cost." Even if the figure is 'just' half that value, by their own admission they say it will cost the Welsh economy over the next couple of decades. You have been quite confrontational, quite argumentative and provocative with your posts on a thread about a petition. It's not a thread about the justification of the new limit. There is already one on the Wales forum where that debate has started. " From said article: "So, the estimated cost to the economy of £4.5 billion over 30 years may not be an accurate reflection of the true cost. The slightly longer travel time was the only negative economic impact identified. It is estimated that the casualty prevention savings, including the reduced impact on NHS and emergency services, could be up to £92m every year." We only argue against false information. | |||
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"It's an emotive topic. I can truly understand those who commute by car or rely on a vehicle being annoyed. It has certainly slowed driving in my area. It may only add 1 minute to the average journey but anyone commuting or using a vehicle for work is not making an average journey. On the other hand if it encourages cycling / walking to school etc it could be a good thing. I don't think it'll do that. The roads will remain just as busy only now you'll have a slow moving stream of traffic to contend with. And just as many kids will be dropped of at school by car. Depending on what figures you believe it (may) will save up to 10 lives a year. I can't recall the last time I saw any ads on TV promoting road safety in the way we used to (remember those?). I wonder if a hard hitting campaign to encourage kids (and adults) to actually look both ways before crossing a road instead of blindly walking across while playing on a phone wouldn't save more lives. Agree or disagree, a petition isn't going to change anything. Policy is driven by the powerful minority -politicians & the press. Only a change at the Senydd could do that. Are people prepared to vote with this one issue in mind....I doubt it. " I am a lifelong labour supporter but if they do not scrap this policy I cannot vote for them in 2026 | |||
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"20, 30, 40, 50 mph. It doesn't matter. People just want to go faster and make their journeys quicker. Just one question, if there was a road traffic accident and it involved a family member, a mate, a person, how would you feel if you had gone a little slower then it could have been avoided. Is a life more important than a journey taking some more time." Well in that case why not make it 10mph? I understand your sentiment. It's a matter of where to draw the line. 15 people were sadly killed in accidents involving crossings on the Railways in 2021/2022 (that excludes the equally sad 261 that died as a result of suicides). Does that justify a 20mph limit around crossings / bridges and rail platforms? Maybe we should all dump our vehicles which are capable of 90mph plus and be made to replace them with a Citroen Ami....it wouldn't make much difference to drivers in Cardiff now!!!  | |||
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"Maybe we should all dump our vehicles which are capable of 90mph plus and be made to replace them with a Citroen Ami....it wouldn't make much difference to drivers in Cardiff now!!! "Would make parking a whole lot easier mind, they are legal to park bumper-to-kerb . | |||
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"221,241 signed……we are getting to 500,000?? Because people respond to soundbites and not facts. It's like Brexit again. Remember the NHS bus? All sucked in again by the right.
Ummm no, just because people take a contrary view to you does not mean they're ignorant sheep.
Baaaaaaaaaa"Well that devastating riposte really put me in my place  | |||
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If you lose your licence don't come running to me . . . Get a taxi | |||
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"It's not a blanket 30 though is it? Up to Local Authorities to set different speed limits. Working fine in RCT. Less dead children is a good thing to me. Give it time. No one thought anyone would wear seat belts. No one thought d*unk driving would be both illegal and socially acceptable. Spain have done it. Don't be afraid to be different to England. Don't be a pawn sucked in by the Conservatives in Wales. There is no blanket 20 mph. It's 20 if there are street lights unless stated otherwise. Rant over. "I wouldn't say it's working fine in my area. Too many conflicting signs. I don't have a problem doing 20 where it's marked clearly, but I just wish they wouldn't confuse people by having several signs, with different speeds limits in fairly close proximity | |||
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"It’s an absolute joke, like most we all agree yes it’s needed around schools and narrow streets. A blanket 20mph on every street and road how ever is a joke! My evening shift in work 5-11pm is now taking me an extra hour because of the twits who seem they have to drive around varying from 15-18mph. Turning up to put an elderly person to bed at 11.30pm when 10.30 was already late enough for them. The care industry is already in crisis and now this is extra pressure on drivers to rush calls to be back on the road to the next. The alternative, have less clients so we have driving time and then even more elderly bed blocking in hospital. ^ clearly saving money for the nhs there!" I totally get where you're coming from. A lot of service users need carers to go in at set times to assist with personal care as well as back to bed assistance. The carers are only given a set time to be with service users, and rarely get adequate travelling time allocated either. I'm all for sticking to speed limits etc, but as you say 20mph isn't needed on all roads. There were even people doing 20-30mph at 5am this morning on the A470 for gods sake  | |||
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"20 outside schools and colleges, but not everhywere, but another thing that concerns me is the fact they going to spend 15 million per anum on more members to the senedd, havent we got enough muppets and jobs for the boys already. During the height of the cold war in the 60s, a ratio of 1 in 8 Russian people were employed by the gouverment, now in wales the ratio is 1 in 5, thats nearly 50 % more, we need to spend that money on helping existing and setting up more manufacturing jobs and companies in wales, were to dependant on outside sources, which in turn can up their prices at any given time, which can be disastrous to our economy." Are 1 in 5 employed by the Welsh Government or the wider UK Civil Service? Useful to set the context before aiming your ire at the Senedd. I agree that Wales needs a stronger economy. Unfortunately the Welsh Government have no real levers to stimulate the economy, but the Westminster does. | |||
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"Signed twice, personal and work email address it's a joke " Proving that the petition has very little credibility. See also the spike in Google searches for Welsh postcodes since the petition was launched. I'm neither massively in favour or against the 20mph initiative but the faux outrage has been amazing to watch. | |||
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"ITVX News reported yesterday that The Senedd (still The Assembly to me) have confirmed that they find "no evidence of large scale duplication or tampering" of the petition against. Knock off 10% and that still massively outweighs the previous record against the banning supermarkets from selling us a pen and crossword book to pass away the 23 hours a day indoors in between permitted exercise sessions." It’ll be a susbstantial amount of people completing the survey, and I say that as someone who supports the 20mph policy (had no issues driving around many new 20mph zones this week). It would be interesting to know how many people getting their hair off about this (as opposed to the ones offering reasoned arguments) voted for parties who endorsed the policy at the last election, or didn’t vote at all. | |||
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"Needs to reach a million I would guestimate, signed anyway. Major reason being an errosion of liberty. I get that 20mph is a good thing on housing estates, around schools, hospitals, churches, and the high streets, but some of the signage makes no sense." Can you explain how this is zn erosion of liberty? You are free to choose if you obey the speed limit or not, on any road. | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members" Different argument, but you think Wales is better served solely by Westminster? | |||
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"It's not really about 20 or 30 mph though. It’s about what speed does a child die not die? & how fast does the average person drive in a 30mph zone.. “IF” We all drove at 30mph or slightly under this most likely would not have come about, but we don’t or I should say didn’t. A long term study found that over 60% of drivers drove between 33-37mph in a 30 limit. At above 35mph a child of five is almost certain to die when hit by a car. The same area was given a blanket 20mph & once they’d got used to it the average was around 50% travelled between 22-25mph. At 25mph that child is almost certain to live. This result can then obviously be extrapolated down through the whole range of injuries from death to minor bump & obviously covers everyone, not just children. One conclusion could be drawn that those complaining the most were more likely to be the ones breaking the 30 limit anyway & it’s why they are more vocal about the new 20 As atm it’s a drop to many of them of up to 17mph which might make a substantial difference in their travel time. For those who stuck to 30 or just under it has less effect. Atm though, I think we should be allowed to legally euthanise on the spot anyone who does 15mph in a 20. ?? S "If they really cared about saving lives, then why has funding for road safety campaigns and Bike proficiency been slashed? When was the last time you saw a "green cross code" or similar advert on the tv? If children are taught how to behave in a safer manner near roads, surely that in itself will lead to fewer casualties? If they want to reduce casualties, why not reduce the top speed on roads to say 30 mph, currently cars driving at 60mph can collide at a combined speed of 120mph...no-one is walking away from that? Its not the limiting of speeds on certain roads I object to, in some cases there is a genuine need, like near schools etc, its the general blanket approach from a govt that hates cars and personal liberty, they spent millions on improving roads like the one from Gilwern to the Heads of the Valleys, and then slapped a blanket 50 mph speed limit along it, despite the origional less-safe road being 60 mph! | |||
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"Half the time this week I wouldn't of been able to tell the speed limit dropped with the way some people have been driving Plus a simple solution if you are travelling in the same town as where you living like how other countries that have lowered their speed limit and have adapted to either walk or cycle " I work 10 miles away, we live fairly rural, and my hubby drives about 40-100 miles a day for work, cycling is not an option. | |||
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"It's not really about 20 or 30 mph though. It’s about what speed does a child die not die? & how fast does the average person drive in a 30mph zone.. “IF” We all drove at 30mph or slightly under this most likely would not have come about, but we don’t or I should say didn’t. A long term study found that over 60% of drivers drove between 33-37mph in a 30 limit. At above 35mph a child of five is almost certain to die when hit by a car. The same area was given a blanket 20mph & once they’d got used to it the average was around 50% travelled between 22-25mph. At 25mph that child is almost certain to live. This result can then obviously be extrapolated down through the whole range of injuries from death to minor bump & obviously covers everyone, not just children. One conclusion could be drawn that those complaining the most were more likely to be the ones breaking the 30 limit anyway & it’s why they are more vocal about the new 20 As atm it’s a drop to many of them of up to 17mph which might make a substantial difference in their travel time. For those who stuck to 30 or just under it has less effect. Atm though, I think we should be allowed to legally euthanise on the spot anyone who does 15mph in a 20. ?? S
If they really cared about saving lives, then why has funding for road safety campaigns and Bike proficiency been slashed?
When was the last time you saw a "green cross code" or similar advert on the tv?
If children are taught how to behave in a safer manner near roads, surely that in itself will lead to fewer casualties?
If they want to reduce casualties, why not reduce the top speed on roads to say 30 mph, currently cars driving at 60mph can collide at a combined speed of 120mph...no-one is walking away from that?
Its not the limiting of speeds on certain roads I object to, in some cases there is a genuine need, like near schools etc, its the general blanket approach from a govt that hates cars and personal liberty, they spent millions on improving roads like the one from Gilwern to the Heads of the Valleys, and then slapped a blanket 50 mph speed limit along it, despite the origional less-safe road being 60 mph!
"Maybe they don’t care about the lives themselves but hasn’t he said that it’s cost £34m to change all the road signs etc. but will save the Welsh NHS £93m a year? Now that, they would care about.. S | |||
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"I'll just park my cars up as 20mph is first gear in 2 of them. Could anyone tell me the percentage rate of children/adults getting killed on these 20 mph zones as it is now the old 30 mph zones? " The trial of it in Edinburgh saw a 40% reduction in collisions, a 39% reduction in casualties and a 23% reduction in fatalities | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members" Spot on | |||
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"Signatures at moment is 411,075" Isn't that about 25% of adults in Wales? Forgive my scepticism here but I'm not sure 1 in 4 adults in Wales have bothered to sign it. | |||
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"Signatures at moment is 411,075 Isn't that about 25% of adults in Wales? Forgive my scepticism here but I'm not sure 1 in 4 adults in Wales have bothered to sign it. " 3,107,500 so just about to reach 1 in 7 | |||
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"Signatures at moment is 411,075 Isn't that about 25% of adults in Wales? Forgive my scepticism here but I'm not sure 1 in 4 adults in Wales have bothered to sign it. 3,107,500 so just about to reach 1 in 7 " Around 20% of the population is under 17. So unless you're counting people signing for their children as well as their neighbours and pets. It's not really a reliable statistic. | |||
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"Half the time this week I wouldn't of been able to tell the speed limit dropped with the way some people have been driving Plus a simple solution if you are travelling in the same town as where you living like how other countries that have lowered their speed limit and have adapted to either walk or cycle I work 10 miles away, we live fairly rural, and my hubby drives about 40-100 miles a day for work, cycling is not an option. "Ah just leave a 'bit' earlier.....you are going to have to anyway now!!! | |||
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"Signatures at moment is 411,075 Isn't that about 25% of adults in Wales? Forgive my scepticism here but I'm not sure 1 in 4 adults in Wales have bothered to sign it. 3,107,500 so just about to reach 1 in 7 Around 20% of the population is under 17. So unless you're counting people signing for their children as well as their neighbours and pets. It's not really a reliable statistic." Children from 14 can vote so 14-17 year olds can sign the petition. I know my children (14+) would if I sent the link to them. Even my under 14s have moaned about driving so slow and ‘people need to stop walking out in the road then they won’t get killed’ | |||
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"Agreed scarlet my kids say the exact same " Witnessed a crash this morning, pedestrian walked straight out on the road without looking. Car1 did an emergency stop, car2 - electric, also emergency stop but the weight of his vehicle meant he didn’t stop quick enough, rear ended car1, which shunted forward and hit said above pedestrian! | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members" Completely agree. I regularly find myself feeling embarrassed by the Welsh governments insistence on ridiculous ideas to try and stay relevant and different to England. | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members Completely agree. I regularly find myself feeling embarrassed by the Welsh governments insistence on ridiculous ideas to try and stay relevant and different to England." As ridiculous ideas go, it's not really that ridiculous and compared to the ideas and embarrassment levels of current Government in England they're not even close. | |||
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"Signatures at moment is 411,075 Isn't that about 25% of adults in Wales? Forgive my scepticism here but I'm not sure 1 in 4 adults in Wales have bothered to sign it. 3,107,500 so just about to reach 1 in 7 Around 20% of the population is under 17. So unless you're counting people signing for their children as well as their neighbours and pets. It's not really a reliable statistic. Children from 14 can vote so 14-17 year olds can sign the petition. I know my children (14+) would if I sent the link to them. Even my under 14s have moaned about driving so slow and ‘people need to stop walking out in the road then they won’t get killed’" My under 14 loves cars but I know he wouldn't sign it since he also has to cross roads and likes riding his bike. 'People need to stop driving cars then they won't kill others' if you want to use that type of logic. | |||
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"And this is why we should never discuss politics on a sex forum. " My thoughts exactly | |||
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"Welsh gov won’t take there decision back, this is here to stay "It's a dictatorship. But people will still vote them back in. | |||
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"Welsh gov won’t take there decision back, this is here to stay
It's a dictatorship. But people will still vote them back in."it is a few years until the next synod election a lot can happen but as things stand I could not vote labour | |||
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"And this is why we should never discuss politics on a sex forum. " Thought this was a forum for discussing topics relating to Wales, didn't realise it was restricted purely to sex or have you decided that on behalf of the rest of us. | |||
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"And this is why we should never discuss politics on a sex forum. Thought this was a forum for discussing topics relating to Wales, didn't realise it was restricted purely to sex or have you decided that on behalf of the rest of us." OK it takes so long to get home from work there is less time for sex | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members" I couldn't agree more, as a born and bred Welsh speaker, I was a bit of a Welsh Nationalist in my younger days, but all the assembly has done is impoverish Wales, we get more money for public services per capita than England,but it's all wasted on admin etc in the senedd. A government who think Wales doesn't exist beyond Cardiff and some adjoining valleys. They are even hell bent on destroying the Welsh farming industry...our means to feed ourselves... we really need to start a new political party,and stop the rot from within...or nothing will ever change for the bette | |||
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"And this is why we should never discuss politics on a sex forum. " Allways good to have an interesting discussion after sex..only if it gives bone time to recover for round two | |||
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"Welsh gov won’t take there decision back, this is here to stay
It's a dictatorship. But people will still vote them back in."That's what's hard to understand why the hell do people keep voting labour. | |||
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"And this is why we should never discuss politics on a sex forum. " This section is not just for sex Mr bottoms . I think this issue has angered quite a lot of us Welsh peeps.
Mr | |||
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"Personally I feel the whole devolved nation in Wales a total waste of money and they now want to introduce 30 odd more MS members I couldn't agree more, as a born and bred Welsh speaker, I was a bit of a Welsh Nationalist in my younger days, but all the assembly has done is impoverish Wales, we get more money for public services per capita than England,but it's all wasted on admin etc in the senedd. A government who think Wales doesn't exist beyond Cardiff and some adjoining valleys. They are even hell bent on destroying the Welsh farming industry...our means to feed ourselves... we really need to start a new political party,and stop the rot from within...or nothing will ever change for the bette" no political party independant representetives, we have enough of those usless corupt political partys already. | |||
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