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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. " Always  | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always "Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy! | |||
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" We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. " Who's "we" Where did they find this out ? | |||
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"The article gives two areas of increase v 2019 Covid: 38k Healthcare issus: 21k (based on mid point of 400pw) That's almost 60k 2022 saw 650k of deaths. 9pc more than 2019. Suggesting 2019 was 596k and so 2022 had 54k extra deaths. So that predicted by COVID and healthcare crisis. And if I'm being sexist, which group of people do o think will say "fuck it" when faced with a queue at hospital. Men. Who's most at risk of premature death. Middle aged ppl. So who is more likely to have a spike from poor health care. Middle age men. " Facts. The conspiratorial cabal like facts to distract from the jibby conspiracy jabby  | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always
Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy!"Nah. I just know how human behaviour works. Chaotic good  | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." Say you don't understand something without saying you don't understand something...... If I had a quid for every time you've posted that the vaccines don't stop you getting covid and it's been explained to you, I'd gave more money than Pfizer. 
Winston | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth!" You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.)" Mary Poppins? Winston | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston " Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name." Mary Poppins or Winston? | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston?" | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston?" Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that)" Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff. | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff." | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff. "Or the underground fanfic: Dobby does Dumbledore. (I'm almost scared to google that in case something like it actually exists lol.) | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff.
Or the underground fanfic: Dobby does Dumbledore.
(I'm almost scared to google that in case something like it actually exists lol.)"Rule 34. If it exists, there's porn of it. | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff.
Or the underground fanfic: Dobby does Dumbledore.
(I'm almost scared to google that in case something like it actually exists lol.)
Rule 34. If it exists, there's porn of it."Master has given Dobby socks. But... now master is taking off his clothes. Oh... and now Dobby sees why master has such a long beard. It's to hide master's enormous... (I need to stop and wash my brain out with soap now.) | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." The vaccine was not to stop someone catching COVID. Vaccines are to prepare your body for after you catch the virus. | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff.
Or the underground fanfic: Dobby does Dumbledore.
(I'm almost scared to google that in case something like it actually exists lol.)
Rule 34. If it exists, there's porn of it.
Master has given Dobby socks. But... now master is taking off his clothes. Oh... and now Dobby sees why master has such a long beard. It's to hide master's enormous...
(I need to stop and wash my brain out with soap now.)" I'm going to have nightmares | |||
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"Whatever the reason its Covid or Covid vaccinations related. Its bee suggested its delayed diagnosis or failure to get medication in time bur thus is not explaining folks who have been well enough but just suddenly dropping dead. Whatever the reason we won't be told the truth! You can't handle the truth! (Sorry, I was just watching a film.) Mary Poppins? Winston Thinking about it... that actually sounds a bit like a porn star name. Mary Poppins or Winston? Mary Poppins Does Winston? (It's not quite Debby does Dallas. I'll concede that) Or the lesser known sequel: Carys does Cardiff.
Or the underground fanfic: Dobby does Dumbledore.
(I'm almost scared to google that in case something like it actually exists lol.)
Rule 34. If it exists, there's porn of it.
Master has given Dobby socks. But... now master is taking off his clothes. Oh... and now Dobby sees why master has such a long beard. It's to hide master's enormous...
(I need to stop and wash my brain out with soap now.)
I'm going to have nightmares "I'm so sorry hahaha | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." I remember your post's right at the beginning of covid and even then you was claiming it's a secret government plan. Clearly your agenda hasn't changed. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." Or... It could be that it stopped SOME people from catching covid and stopped SOME people from getting ill and it stopped SOME people from dying a hideous gasping death.? Could it? I agree there's lots of smelly stuff all around this episode but from a pure analysis of that story.. Your conclusion is fairly agenda led. | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always
Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy!
Nah. I just know how human behaviour works. Chaotic good "You know how human behaviour work's but didn't you say you got duped into the testing you were doing lol | |||
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"Pretty obvious that it was the ludicrous lockdowns that has broken the NHS. The NHS closing down key non-Covid parts of the NHS, leading to no appointments, missed diagnoses, zero radiotherapy, broke the NHS. The backlog is now 7.2 million. The death toll is climbing far higher than covid ever managed even after they massively massaged the stats. How it's not a national scandal and people like Whitty and Hancock aren't in jail I'll never know." Well... Yes. Take a service running at 100 % capacity. Basically then prevent access to it for 2 years... What's going to predictably happen? | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always
Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy!
Nah. I just know how human behaviour works. Chaotic good
You know how human behaviour work's but didn't you say you got duped into the testing you were doing lol"No, I didn't expect the head of a vaccine trial to be ok with dead children lol | |||
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"Pretty obvious that it was the ludicrous lockdowns that has broken the NHS. The NHS closing down key non-Covid parts of the NHS, leading to no appointments, missed diagnoses, zero radiotherapy, broke the NHS. The backlog is now 7.2 million. The death toll is climbing far higher than covid ever managed even after they massively massaged the stats. How it's not a national scandal and people like Whitty and Hancock aren't in jail I'll never know. Well... Yes. Take a service running at 100 % capacity. Basically then prevent access to it for 2 years... What's going to predictably happen? " Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all." No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. Most of the NHS stopped working during the lockdowns. Absolute scandal and the figures are backing it up. What is also a scandal is that the mainstream media aren't reporting these figures in full , in just the same way they reported every death with covid , with relish. Funny eh? | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always
Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy!
Nah. I just know how human behaviour works. Chaotic good
You know how human behaviour work's but didn't you say you got duped into the testing you were doing lol
No, I didn't expect the head of a vaccine trial to be ok with dead children lol"Was this a medical/science person, or somebody politically placed? It's exactly what I would expect of a political position. Though tbh we have seen the pandemic bring out the worst traits of humanity even in a huge number of medical & scientific people who I always thought would be better. | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. Always
Hang on... you epected this? That's really suspicious. If I didn't know better, I'd expect you were involved in some vaccine conspiracy!
Nah. I just know how human behaviour works. Chaotic good
You know how human behaviour work's but didn't you say you got duped into the testing you were doing lol
No, I didn't expect the head of a vaccine trial to be ok with dead children lol
Was this a medical/science person, or somebody politically placed? It's exactly what I would expect of a political position. Though tbh we have seen the pandemic bring out the worst traits of humanity even in a huge number of medical & scientific people who I always thought would be better."Both. A scientist with political power and positions. I yanked myself as soon as I found out. Of course, being wrong about an individual has no bearing on how groups behave with regard to conspiracy theories, but hey whatevs | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. " This is bollocks. The figures say the NHS budget had been consistently falling in real terms since the tories came in. If you understand what ‘In real terms’ means. It was in crisis long before covid. Underfunded and now understaffed because the stupid brexiters sent all the foreign doctors and nurses home. Not to mention the government cutting nursing training bursaries. They’re running it down deliberately so they can privatise it and make money. Just like they did the rail network, the post office… and look how well that’s going. As for covid vaccine conspiracy bollocks… it’s bollocks. Just like all stupid right wing conspiracies. | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. Most of the NHS stopped working during the lockdowns. Absolute scandal and the figures are backing it up. What is also a scandal is that the mainstream media aren't reporting these figures in full , in just the same way they reported every death with covid , with relish. Funny eh? " Most of the NHS certainly didn't stop working during the lockdown periods, that's a ridiculous claim to make. | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. This is bollocks. The figures say the NHS budget had been consistently falling in real terms since the tories came in. If you understand what ‘In real terms’ means. It was in crisis long before covid. Underfunded and now understaffed because the stupid brexiters sent all the foreign doctors and nurses home. Not to mention the government cutting nursing training bursaries. They’re running it down deliberately so they can privatise it and make money. Just like they did the rail network, the post office… and look how well that’s going. As for covid vaccine conspiracy bollocks… it’s bollocks. Just like all stupid right wing conspiracies. "  | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. Most of the NHS stopped working during the lockdowns. Absolute scandal and the figures are backing it up. What is also a scandal is that the mainstream media aren't reporting these figures in full , in just the same way they reported every death with covid , with relish. Funny eh? Most of the NHS certainly didn't stop working during the lockdown periods, that's a ridiculous claim to make." Just couldn't get access to it then for whatever reason. Apart from a and e by appointment only. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." No the article highlighted that people have been missing appointments for coronary problems that would usually be screened out. The figures show that there are 10s of thousands of people who are missing diagnosis and medication. They’re basically ticking time bombs. | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. This is bollocks. The figures say the NHS budget had been consistently falling in real terms since the tories came in. If you understand what ‘In real terms’ means. It was in crisis long before covid. Underfunded and now understaffed because the stupid brexiters sent all the foreign doctors and nurses home. Not to mention the government cutting nursing training bursaries. They’re running it down deliberately so they can privatise it and make money. Just like they did the rail network, the post office… and look how well that’s going. As for covid vaccine conspiracy bollocks… it’s bollocks. Just like all stupid right wing conspiracies. ""The figures" suggest otherwise NHS England resource spending in real terms in 2014/15 and forecast to 2024/25, based on 2021/22 prices(in billion GBP) 2024/25* 152 2023/24* 150 2022/23* 147.8 2021/22 136.1 2020/21 125.1 2019/20 131.1 2018/19 124 2017/18 121.2 2016/17 119 2015/16 115.7 2014/15 112.4 As regards privatisation , the Tories have been in government for 44 of the 74 years of its existence , never privatised it or did any meaningful reform and therefore its still a shambles. No other country in the world has copied our health system. Its 3rd world heathcare with a first world budget. | |||
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"Seems you didn't read the article you posted properly. Ah well. Bring on the conspiracy theories again. " I'd wager; didn't read the article at all, probably just scanned it for parts that relate into the never-ending 'chronicles' of a conspirator.  | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. Most of the NHS stopped working during the lockdowns. Absolute scandal and the figures are backing it up. What is also a scandal is that the mainstream media aren't reporting these figures in full , in just the same way they reported every death with covid , with relish. Funny eh? Most of the NHS certainly didn't stop working during the lockdown periods, that's a ridiculous claim to make. Just couldn't get access to it then for whatever reason. Apart from a and e by appointment only. " I have a chronic illness, have been treated by the hospital for years, and had no issues during lockdowns either to continue that care. Same goes for family members, next door neighbours hip op and someone at work having surgery. Don't make stuff up, just because you had an issue does not mean everyone else did "because of covid", easy cop out using it. | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. Most of the NHS stopped working during the lockdowns. Absolute scandal and the figures are backing it up. What is also a scandal is that the mainstream media aren't reporting these figures in full , in just the same way they reported every death with covid , with relish. Funny eh? Most of the NHS certainly didn't stop working during the lockdown periods, that's a ridiculous claim to make. Just couldn't get access to it then for whatever reason. Apart from a and e by appointment only. I have a chronic illness, have been treated by the hospital for years, and had no issues during lockdowns either to continue that care. Same goes for family members, next door neighbours hip op and someone at work having surgery. Don't make stuff up, just because you had an issue does not mean everyone else did "because of covid", easy cop out using it." I'm glad it worked for you. Equally don't make up stuff that it was all OK for the last two year just because your experience has been good. It's been far from good for most people. For my mum and dad who lost their lives, my other family members one had to go privately or die, the other could not afford to do so. | |||
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"Are we arguing that the NHS should not have seen disruption during a global pandemic? This seems a bit crazy. Of course any healthcare system will struggle under those circumstances. (I deliberately avoided healthcare for quite some time, and got scolded for being overdue for my tests. I'm speaking only to my own experience, not saying anything about anyone else)" No we aren't arguing that at all. We are arguing that it very much was disrupted (save for the one above who said it was all working fine for the last 2 years), that it continues to be disrupted, and that the disruptions have had and continue to have a massive effect on the nations health. | |||
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"Pretty obvious that it was the ludicrous lockdowns that has broken the NHS. The NHS closing down key non-Covid parts of the NHS, leading to no appointments, missed diagnoses, zero radiotherapy, broke the NHS. The backlog is now 7.2 million. The death toll is climbing far higher than covid ever managed even after they massively massaged the stats. How it's not a national scandal and people like Whitty and Hancock aren't in jail I'll never know." I agree that Hamcock et Al should be in jail but there are excess deaths across Europe. Netherlands 25% over normal and they have functional healthcare | |||
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"Are we arguing that the NHS should not have seen disruption during a global pandemic? This seems a bit crazy. Of course any healthcare system will struggle under those circumstances. (I deliberately avoided healthcare for quite some time, and got scolded for being overdue for my tests. I'm speaking only to my own experience, not saying anything about anyone else) No we aren't arguing that at all. We are arguing that it very much was disrupted (save for the one above who said it was all working fine for the last 2 years), that it continues to be disrupted, and that the disruptions have had and continue to have a massive effect on the nations health. " Ok, fair enough. I suspect it's an intersection of disruptions, underfunding as compared to demand, Brexit exodus of staff, and Covid itself. (I'm sure that side effects of vaccines are an effect here, but I'm unsure that that rises to statistical significance* across the entire system) * I'm not saying that side effects of vaccines aren't significant for those who experience them. I'm saying that they are not a high enough percentage of patient contacts to have a noticeable effect on the service as a whole) | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep!" How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? | |||
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"Erm...check out the excess death stats" And how is lockdown killing all these people? Trusted source that demonstrates as much? | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source?" Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. " How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that. | |||
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"Erm...check out the excess death stats" There are more people dying. The cause of that isn't entirely clear. The longer it goes since the few months of half measure lockdowns we had, the sillier this argument sounds. | |||
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"It's a conspiracy of course. Cannot possibly be true. They woukdent lie to us-would they! "No way could two or more people conspire together, and as for politicians/government lying to people, I'd never believe it  | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that." Yes agreed. I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated hard facts to show why more people are dying now. But in my opinion it's one of a few things that have been different in the last few years that have led to changes... so believe it's one of a few contributory factors. We don't need scientists to tell us everything. It makes perfect sense that if someone is unable to attend 2 years ago to get heart or cancer (or other) diagnoses and treatments.. And we let illness go undiagnosed and untreated for 2 years... Then people will get sicker and some unfortunately will die. Unless we are of the opinion that delaying diagnosis and treatment has no material impact... In which case you'd kind of question the need for huge chunks of the nhs. | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that. Yes agreed. I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated hard facts to show why more people are dying now. But in my opinion it's one of a few things that have been different in the last few years that have led to changes... so believe it's one of a few contributory factors. We don't need scientists to tell us everything. It makes perfect sense that if someone is unable to attend 2 years ago to get heart or cancer (or other) diagnoses and treatments.. And we let illness go undiagnosed and untreated for 2 years... Then people will get sicker and some unfortunately will die. Unless we are of the opinion that delaying diagnosis and treatment has no material impact... In which case you'd kind of question the need for huge chunks of the nhs. " delayed diagnosis can kill people. Absolutely. I suspect the underfunded & overworked NHS is more the issue there than lockdown. | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that. Yes agreed. I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated hard facts to show why more people are dying now. But in my opinion it's one of a few things that have been different in the last few years that have led to changes... so believe it's one of a few contributory factors. We don't need scientists to tell us everything. It makes perfect sense that if someone is unable to attend 2 years ago to get heart or cancer (or other) diagnoses and treatments.. And we let illness go undiagnosed and untreated for 2 years... Then people will get sicker and some unfortunately will die. Unless we are of the opinion that delaying diagnosis and treatment has no material impact... In which case you'd kind of question the need for huge chunks of the nhs. delayed diagnosis can kill people. Absolutely. I suspect the underfunded & overworked NHS is more the issue there than lockdown." Genuine question. 1.5m nhs employees. How many are overworked? And what does that really mean? Lots of people work hard and long hours in many businesses. But aren't used as a reason for poor performance. | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that. Yes agreed. I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated hard facts to show why more people are dying now. But in my opinion it's one of a few things that have been different in the last few years that have led to changes... so believe it's one of a few contributory factors. We don't need scientists to tell us everything. It makes perfect sense that if someone is unable to attend 2 years ago to get heart or cancer (or other) diagnoses and treatments.. And we let illness go undiagnosed and untreated for 2 years... Then people will get sicker and some unfortunately will die. Unless we are of the opinion that delaying diagnosis and treatment has no material impact... In which case you'd kind of question the need for huge chunks of the nhs. delayed diagnosis can kill people. Absolutely. I suspect the underfunded & overworked NHS is more the issue there than lockdown. Genuine question. 1.5m nhs employees. How many are overworked? And what does that really mean? Lots of people work hard and long hours in many businesses. But aren't used as a reason for poor performance. " Googling NHS jobs shows a different figure, but never mind I guess. How many are overworked? Feel free to go ask them all if you like. You can google what the word overworked meaks if you like too. And I suspect it's a bit different to work in an average business as opposed to working in eg A&E after years of Tories runing the NHS into the ground while people die around you day after day. | |||
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"Government scientists were on our televisions with horrific graphs and outrageous predictions almost every night. Now thousands are dying from their lockdown policies? Not a peep! How are thousands dying from lockdown policies now? Source? Isn't that the excess deaths story? That's all over the news? So the source would be the ons. How is lockdown killing people though? Pretty sure the link at the start of the thread does not show that. Yes agreed. I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated hard facts to show why more people are dying now. But in my opinion it's one of a few things that have been different in the last few years that have led to changes... so believe it's one of a few contributory factors. We don't need scientists to tell us everything. It makes perfect sense that if someone is unable to attend 2 years ago to get heart or cancer (or other) diagnoses and treatments.. And we let illness go undiagnosed and untreated for 2 years... Then people will get sicker and some unfortunately will die. Unless we are of the opinion that delaying diagnosis and treatment has no material impact... In which case you'd kind of question the need for huge chunks of the nhs. delayed diagnosis can kill people. Absolutely. I suspect the underfunded & overworked NHS is more the issue there than lockdown. Genuine question. 1.5m nhs employees. How many are overworked? And what does that really mean? Lots of people work hard and long hours in many businesses. But aren't used as a reason for poor performance. Googling NHS jobs shows a different figure, but never mind I guess. How many are overworked? Feel free to go ask them all if you like. You can google what the word overworked meaks if you like too. And I suspect it's a bit different to work in an average business as opposed to working in eg A&E after years of Tories runing the NHS into the ground while people die around you day after day." Good argument. So just make up emotive words and keep repeating them until you convince yourself they are facts. | |||
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"There’s very little evidence suggesting a cause of the excess deaths. It is likely to be multi factorial but the one thing we know it isn’t is access to things like blood pressure medication from GPs. Prescribing data shows no drop over the lockdown periods. I wonder if it has more to do with lockdown preventing a lot of elective care (which has now either become an emergency or still elective with 2y wait) or a culture shift. It is now acceptable to take 5 days off if you have a cold where previously this was not the case. Further, COVID working fragged a lot of healthcare professionals who now have gone to less than full time contracts. That won’t have been workforce planned so will have led to a workforce shortfall. I know NHS funding is political but I really don’t think it’s a funding issue. I could be wrong - I have no evidence either way - but I think it’s something more. On the plus side, it looks like flu numbers are definitely on the wane now. " Funnily enough, this story just popped up this morning regarding prescribing for heart conditions. Half a million people apparently missed out on medication for heart conditions. And it's going to take time to catch up. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64330670 Now you presumably have the diametrically opposed story from somewhere which kind of questions how things are reported and why they get reported the way they do. | |||
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"I do - see https://trusttheevidence.substack.com/p/is-everyone-dying-of-statin-starvation?r=1lcx51&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web from Prof Henegan of the University of Oxford. " That's an interesting read. Which seems to point the finger at ambulances and lack of access. Interestingly they both site bhf as sources. The last paragraph says it all really... Let's hope that 22k excess cardiac related deaths will eventually be enough for a proper investigation. "Given all its resources, the government could and should do better to get to the bottom of what is driving the excess in cardiovascular deaths. We’ll keep digging." | |||
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"Surprise surprise "Enlighten me | |||
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"Good old JC, the idiot's idiot https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbell-youtube-singapore-children/" So, let's continually quote on arricle to nullify everything he says thereafter. I am asking for people to tell me what's wrong with his content on the excess deaths and lack of debate. He shows gov statistics from around the world, includes clips from politicians asking for this to be debated at the highest levels and only adds a small amount of opinion. So, if any of you can sully yourselves for 15 mins or so, I would love to hear the objective crtlitique of this. | |||
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"Good old JC, the idiot's idiot https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbell-youtube-singapore-children/ So, let's continually quote on arricle to nullify everything he says thereafter. I am asking for people to tell me what's wrong with his content on the excess deaths and lack of debate. He shows gov statistics from around the world, includes clips from politicians asking for this to be debated at the highest levels and only adds a small amount of opinion. So, if any of you can sully yourselves for 15 mins or so, I would love to hear the objective crtlitique of this. " He's getting plenty of click-cash from you and your cohort, he doesn't need mine | |||
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"Surprise surprise
Enlighten me "I very much doubt you will be enlightened at any point during this incarnation tbh. | |||
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"Poor little winky sends me a PM then blocks me All you need to know" If you are referring to me...I block all men. And I haven't pmd you. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." How about the jab reduced the number catching covid, and the jab reduced the number dying from covid? But because of all the fuckwits that refused point blank to do anything else to help reduce the spread of an airborne disease - like maybe cleaning the air and using whatever type of filtering methods to reduce the amount of virus even getting into the air - the epidemic remained spreading. And because of all the fuckwits that spouted the crap about "herd immunity by catching covid" nearly every person in the country deliberately exposed themselves to it. And because the rate of mutation directly depends on the number catching the disease, this virus has been able to mutate faster than any other virus in history. And because it's been allowed to mutate so fast, the vaccines are near as dammit useless now even though they were quite good initially. And because the vaccines are now almost ineffective against the vastly mutated virus, and anybody that wears a mask is told that they are "bedwetting scaredy cat nutcases", nearly everyone in the country has had covid twice, three times, four times or more. And because covid fucks over every system in your body, even when there are little external symptoms, and especially your vascular system and heart, there is no fucking wonder whatsoever that there is now an epidemic of heart failure. Newsflash: It's going to get worse. Newsflash: The blame for it is square on the shoulders of every covid minimiser, mask refuser, lockdown breaker, vaccine conspiracy spreader, "it's my human right to go to the pub" wanker. And that's you, and you, and you, and you. But not you and you that tried hard, and not me, who tried hard. If you're in the first lot of you and you and you, then I'm sorry but if you get sick you brought it on yourselves. If you're with me in the second lot, then you tried hard, and I think you're bloody heroes for trying hard, and I just hope that we can ride it out long enough for the rest of the world to regain some fucking intelligence. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How about the jab reduced the number catching covid, and the jab reduced the number dying from covid? But because of all the fuckwits that refused point blank to do anything else to help reduce the spread of an airborne disease - like maybe cleaning the air and using whatever type of filtering methods to reduce the amount of virus even getting into the air - the epidemic remained spreading. And because of all the fuckwits that spouted the crap about "herd immunity by catching covid" nearly every person in the country deliberately exposed themselves to it. And because the rate of mutation directly depends on the number catching the disease, this virus has been able to mutate faster than any other virus in history. And because it's been allowed to mutate so fast, the vaccines are near as dammit useless now even though they were quite good initially. And because the vaccines are now almost ineffective against the vastly mutated virus, and anybody that wears a mask is told that they are "bedwetting scaredy cat nutcases", nearly everyone in the country has had covid twice, three times, four times or more. And because covid fucks over every system in your body, even when there are little external symptoms, and especially your vascular system and heart, there is no fucking wonder whatsoever that there is now an epidemic of heart failure. Newsflash: It's going to get worse. Newsflash: The blame for it is square on the shoulders of every covid minimiser, mask refuser, lockdown breaker, vaccine conspiracy spreader, "it's my human right to go to the pub" wanker. And that's you, and you, and you, and you. But not you and you that tried hard, and not me, who tried hard. If you're in the first lot of you and you and you, then I'm sorry but if you get sick you brought it on yourselves. If you're with me in the second lot, then you tried hard, and I think you're bloody heroes for trying hard, and I just hope that we can ride it out long enough for the rest of the world to regain some fucking intelligence. " And the evidence for the many claims you make is found where ? | |||
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" Plus ten years of austerity and decades of neglect. Lockdown just sped up the process is all. No, don't really agree with that. The NHS has never been better funded in real terms. " Really? I beg to differ. I've never had to pay more for a car than now. I've never paid more for a pound of Cheddar than now. The NHS has never faced higher costs. Advances in treatments that cost more. Highest population ever. Highest percentage of elderly (who obviously put more demand on the service). Grossly under maintained premises many of which would be condemned if in the private sector. A diminishing birth rate which means less income in tax and earnings to fund the elderly. So maybe funding is at a high....even if you ignore some of the double accounting that the government does. But "in real terms"....I think not. | |||
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"Shouldnt the debate be about the facts rather than one individual who some seem to dislike? " That's my point. But some are soo right that they are above looking at what might be true and different. Like I said, please look at current content and let me know what is not true, because it seems pretty honestly presented to me. | |||
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"Shouldnt the debate be about the facts rather than one individual who some seem to dislike? That's my point. But some are soo right that they are above looking at what might be true and different. Like I said, please look at current content and let me know what is not true, because it seems pretty honestly presented to me. " What does John Campbell have to do with an article from the BBC from 2022? If your point is "why is this about one individual", why are you bringing him up? John Campbell is as relevant to Covid information for me as James Charles. | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? " This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. " If you're agreeing with Backformore that it's not about an individual, then why did you resurrect a thread not about an individual to talk about an individual? | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? " no. Please can you summarise his pertinent points? | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." Clue: It has nothing to do with the vaccines | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. If you're agreeing with Backformore that it's not about an individual, then why did you resurrect a thread not about an individual to talk about an individual?" I didn't. I mentioned a YT vid which deals with the original subject of Excess Death. The fact that it is presented by someone who many refuse to actually watch means that all the statistics and points mentioned (too many to give a synopsis but suffice to say there are way too many excess deaths and they don't seem to be as a direct result of the disease itself) are just swatted away without investigation. It's not about the individual, it's about the facts and how we interpret them. Unfortunately, there are many who would rather cut their nose off... | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. If you're agreeing with Backformore that it's not about an individual, then why did you resurrect a thread not about an individual to talk about an individual? I didn't. I mentioned a YT vid which deals with the original subject of Excess Death. The fact that it is presented by someone who many refuse to actually watch means that all the statistics and points mentioned (too many to give a synopsis but suffice to say there are way too many excess deaths and they don't seem to be as a direct result of the disease itself) are just swatted away without investigation. It's not about the individual, it's about the facts and how we interpret them. Unfortunately, there are many who would rather cut their nose off... " what was the ex death attributed to. From other analysis it's a combo of not catching illness earlier with strain on health services. Rather than anything sinister. Also, did they do any work on his far above the 5 yr average or was and/or how far above the high water mark of the 5 year period we are ? | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. If you're agreeing with Backformore that it's not about an individual, then why did you resurrect a thread not about an individual to talk about an individual? I didn't. I mentioned a YT vid which deals with the original subject of Excess Death. The fact that it is presented by someone who many refuse to actually watch means that all the statistics and points mentioned (too many to give a synopsis but suffice to say there are way too many excess deaths and they don't seem to be as a direct result of the disease itself) are just swatted away without investigation. It's not about the individual, it's about the facts and how we interpret them. Unfortunately, there are many who would rather cut their nose off... " Your initial post was "Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ?" You seem to be centring Campbell in your comments, rather than his analysis. Why can't you say, I saw this analysis (that made these pertinent points), I found it enlightening? But you're dealing with a personality. I'd rather deal with data and analysis. | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. " Yeah well that's perhaps because anything put out by John Campbell is about as pertinent to the reality of covid 19 as would be anything written by John Campbell (1821–1885), scholar of Celtic folklore and language, inventor; or John Campbell (1862–1924), mathematician credited for the Campbell-Hausdorff formula; or John Campbell (1880–1957), American financier; or John Campbell (1653–1728), pioneer colonial American journalist; or John Campbell (1910–1971), American science fiction writer and magazine editor; or John Campbell (1855–1921), brigadier, Sutherland Highlanders, served in First World War; or John Campbell (1576–1642), Scottish nobleman and knight. In fact I'm pretty damn sure that anything written by any other John Campbell in the history of the Campbell family would be more intelligent and useful in the era of a world wide pandemic than the bollocks spouted by your John Campbell on YouTube. | |||
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"You have a good point. I think I was anticipating the procession of deniers that I have replied to previous posts I have made regarding similar issues. I wish the content had come from elsewhere but it didn't. I think the stats are interesting and some can be painted differently then he does. For example the increase in cardiac deaths may be linked to sluggish health provision and lack of treatment. But only a small part of it, surely ? But the overall aim of the vid is to ask why no one is investigating what is going on. We are told that is is "not the vaccine". But do we know that ? Are there lessons we can learn ? I am not saying I know, vut I know that the silence on the subject from press and government is very suspicious. " I think the government and the press have a vested interest in "moving on" from Covid, because their priority is the economy. Regardless of where you come down on vaccines. They want to put it behind them. In the abstract, you'd look at a sample (I'm vaguely familiar with statistics and I'm spitballing what it might look like): cardiac outcomes in an average year before 2019 (we don't know exactly when Covid began spreading, but we're pretty sure it wasn't before the beginning of 2019). You'd look at the cardiac events in the same area before vaccines were available. You'd look at cardiac events in the same area after vaccines were rolled out, perhaps both in a short time frame after vaccine administration and after a longer period. You might do something like, look at a community where vaccines were rolled out before there was widespread Covid spread (the state of Western Australia comes to mind). In addition, there'd need to be analysis of the mechanisms via which cardiac events might happen for Covid versus vaccination (and obviously differentiate between the different vaccines). I don't think it's true that no one is investigating. I just did two Google scholar searches for "cardiac effects Covid" and "cardiac effects Covid vaccination" respectively. Even limiting my results to just 2023, I got over 17k results for each. | |||
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"You have a good point. I think I was anticipating the procession of deniers that I have replied to previous posts I have made regarding similar issues. I wish the content had come from elsewhere but it didn't. I think the stats are interesting and some can be painted differently then he does. For example the increase in cardiac deaths may be linked to sluggish health provision and lack of treatment. But only a small part of it, surely ? But the overall aim of the vid is to ask why no one is investigating what is going on. We are told that is is "not the vaccine". But do we know that ? Are there lessons we can learn ? I am not saying I know, vut I know that the silence on the subject from press and government is very suspicious. " I've watched quite a few of his videos and compare it to an illusion He reads through a paragraph highlighting various numbers and words to present his argument but he totally ignores the other words and numbers which would present the true meaning of the report he is analysing. If out if 10 people, 4 died of COVID, 1 dies of a vaccine side effect and the rest survive he stresses that 10% died of the vaccine not that there's a possibility that the vaccine saved the lives of 50% of people. Total illusion swallowed by his followers. | |||
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"You have a good point. I think I was anticipating the procession of deniers that I have replied to previous posts I have made regarding similar issues. I wish the content had come from elsewhere but it didn't. I think the stats are interesting and some can be painted differently then he does. For example the increase in cardiac deaths may be linked to sluggish health provision and lack of treatment. But only a small part of it, surely ? But the overall aim of the vid is to ask why no one is investigating what is going on. We are told that is is "not the vaccine". But do we know that ? Are there lessons we can learn ? I am not saying I know, vut I know that the silence on the subject from press and government is very suspicious. " why surely only a small part? According to BHF, the number of people waiting for time-sensitive cardiac care is at a record high. The response time of ambulances for heart attacks and strokes breached 90 mins. The old target was 18, increasing to 30 for 23/24. And then we have the fact that covid itself seems to have long-term effects. Finally, there is no such thing as the vaccine. There were different vaccines with different delivery methods. The commanility was the underlying virus. | |||
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"Anyone seen the latest John Campbell vid regarding excess deaths and the lack of debate? Any of JC deniers want to watch it and tell me exactly where he is misrepresenting facts, gaining money or spreading fear ? This was my first post. The content is pertinent to the OP and I reanimated the old thread. But, apparently anything put out by JC is below contempt...or contemplation at least. If you're agreeing with Backformore that it's not about an individual, then why did you resurrect a thread not about an individual to talk about an individual? I didn't. I mentioned a YT vid which deals with the original subject of Excess Death. The fact that it is presented by someone who many refuse to actually watch means that all the statistics and points mentioned (too many to give a synopsis but suffice to say there are way too many excess deaths and they don't seem to be as a direct result of the disease itself) are just swatted away without investigation. It's not about the individual, it's about the facts and how we interpret them. Unfortunately, there are many who would rather cut their nose off... " Excess deaths - horrid terminology as it sounds like deaths that should not have occurred. If it's an increase in mortality, then it should be stated as such. And JC... I'm neither a supporter or denier. | |||
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" We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. Who's "we" Where did they find this out ?" That fountain of all knowledge, youtube.... | |||
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" Excess deaths - horrid terminology as it sounds like deaths that should not have occurred. If it's an increase in mortality, then it should be stated as such. And JC... I'm neither a supporter or denier. " "Excess deaths" are actually called "Excess Mortality" in the official documentation. - "Excess mortality is calculated as the observed minus the expected number of deaths" | |||
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"Neither of us had the experimental vaccine, and we are both perfectly healthy." I did have it, as did all my family. We’re all perfectly healthy as well. What’s your point? | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? | |||
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"The article gives two areas of increase v 2019 Covid: 38k Healthcare issus: 21k (based on mid point of 400pw) That's almost 60k 2022 saw 650k of deaths. 9pc more than 2019. Suggesting 2019 was 596k and so 2022 had 54k extra deaths. So that predicted by COVID and healthcare crisis. And if I'm being sexist, which group of people do o think will say "fuck it" when faced with a queue at hospital. Men. Who's most at risk of premature death. Middle aged ppl. So who is more likely to have a spike from poor health care. Middle age men. " Don't use logic and facts...that's unfair | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? " You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade." Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." There is not enough longitudinal data to state that what happened in 2022 was to do with COVID vaxes or any other variable. At this point we can only speculate | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence." You are clearly not interested in research and evidence | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence." Stuff Covid does that isn't respiratory. No URLS, per forum rules. Source for search, Google Scholar. Paolini et al, Brain correlates of subjective cognitive complaints in COVID-19 survivors: A multimodal magnetic resonance imaging study, European Neuropsychopharmacology Volume 68, March 2023, Pages 1-10 Ignas Badaras and Agne Laucyte-Cibulskiene, Vascular Aging and COVID-19, Angiology, Volume 74, Issue 4 This one was pretty memorable: Martinez-Marmol et al, SARS-CoV-2 infection and viral fusogens cause neuronal and glial fusion that compromises neuronal activity, SCIENCE ADVANCES 7 Jun 2023 Vol 9, Issue 23 Brogan and Ross, COVID-19 and Kidney Disease, Annual Review of Medicine, Vol. 74:1-13 (Volume publication date January 2023) Soheil Tavakolpour and Taha Rakhshandehroo, Lymphopenia during the COVID-19 infection: What it shows and what can be learned, Immunol Lett. 2020 Sep; 225: 31–32. For example. A google scholar search with words like "complications" or "sequelae", words like "mild" or "asymptomatic" and the name of a lot of different organ systems return results indicating that stuff has been found that means a bit more than pulmonary concerns. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence. You are clearly not interested in research and evidence" I love people making incorrect assumptions about me .
I've recently graduated with a bachelor of science honours degree, got a first. Now tell me I'm not interested in research evidence.
Questioning someone's opinion isn't necessarily opposing their opinion but seeking clarification of it. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence. Stuff Covid does that isn't respiratory. No URLS, per forum rules. Source for search, Google Scholar. Paolini et al, Brain correlates of subjective cognitive complaints in COVID-19 survivors: A multimodal magnetic resonance imaging study, European Neuropsychopharmacology Volume 68, March 2023, Pages 1-10 Ignas Badaras and Agne Laucyte-Cibulskiene, Vascular Aging and COVID-19, Angiology, Volume 74, Issue 4 This one was pretty memorable: Martinez-Marmol et al, SARS-CoV-2 infection and viral fusogens cause neuronal and glial fusion that compromises neuronal activity, SCIENCE ADVANCES 7 Jun 2023 Vol 9, Issue 23 Brogan and Ross, COVID-19 and Kidney Disease, Annual Review of Medicine, Vol. 74:1-13 (Volume publication date January 2023) Soheil Tavakolpour and Taha Rakhshandehroo, Lymphopenia during the COVID-19 infection: What it shows and what can be learned, Immunol Lett. 2020 Sep; 225: 31–32. For example. A google scholar search with words like "complications" or "sequelae", words like "mild" or "asymptomatic" and the name of a lot of different organ systems return results indicating that stuff has been found that means a bit more than pulmonary concerns." I know too well (a year before lockdown) that a respiratory virus can result in neuro complications (a) viral particles (being tinier than bacteria) can pass the blood brain barrier, or (b) cause an overreaction by the immune system (a one off autoimmune event, attacking the brain cells). I have encephalitis sequelae from (b). The Spanish flu resulted in copious cases of encephalitis lethargica. You can bet your bottom dollar COVID-19 will also (the encephalitis society is doing research). | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence. Stuff Covid does that isn't respiratory. No URLS, per forum rules. Source for search, Google Scholar. Paolini et al, Brain correlates of subjective cognitive complaints in COVID-19 survivors: A multimodal magnetic resonance imaging study, European Neuropsychopharmacology Volume 68, March 2023, Pages 1-10 Ignas Badaras and Agne Laucyte-Cibulskiene, Vascular Aging and COVID-19, Angiology, Volume 74, Issue 4 This one was pretty memorable: Martinez-Marmol et al, SARS-CoV-2 infection and viral fusogens cause neuronal and glial fusion that compromises neuronal activity, SCIENCE ADVANCES 7 Jun 2023 Vol 9, Issue 23 Brogan and Ross, COVID-19 and Kidney Disease, Annual Review of Medicine, Vol. 74:1-13 (Volume publication date January 2023) Soheil Tavakolpour and Taha Rakhshandehroo, Lymphopenia during the COVID-19 infection: What it shows and what can be learned, Immunol Lett. 2020 Sep; 225: 31–32. For example. A google scholar search with words like "complications" or "sequelae", words like "mild" or "asymptomatic" and the name of a lot of different organ systems return results indicating that stuff has been found that means a bit more than pulmonary concerns. I know too well (a year before lockdown) that a respiratory virus can result in neuro complications (a) viral particles (being tinier than bacteria) can pass the blood brain barrier, or (b) cause an overreaction by the immune system (a one off autoimmune event, attacking the brain cells). I have encephalitis sequelae from (b). The Spanish flu resulted in copious cases of encephalitis lethargica. You can bet your bottom dollar COVID-19 will also (the encephalitis society is doing research). " It seemed like you doubted what Polly was saying about other effects within the body - there's a huge amount of evidence out there, and, as you know, viruses can have a sting in the tail. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. How can they possibly know what caused it. Covid itself has been shown in some people to damage cardiac muscle and cause clots. The majority of the population had the vaccine and most (if they know it or not) have had covid too so how can you say which is to blame? You can say which is to blame because proper medical studies show that covid infection can cause major damage to all bodily systems and that the damage is cumulative with mutiple infections. Meanwhile studies of vaccination show that there is more danger of choking to death on your morning cornflakes. "How can you say which is to blame?" furthers the covid deniers aim of casting doubt upon medical science by suggesting that equal weight should be given to both possibilities, when in fact the extraordinary claim that death is due to vaccination should require extraordinary levels of evidence, evidence that is simply never provided by the anti-science brigade. Where is the evidence that it affects multiple systems? And are you saying it affects multiple systems simultaneously? Primarily it's a respiratory disease. However, doctors sometimes like to use non medical jargon (or did historically and say oh you have a stomach cold. Which, using medical common sense means the common cold coronavirus has gone to the intestines. So I can imagine COVID-19 can also wander elsewhere. As for accumulation of damage, it shouldn't happen in healthy people but those who have, for example, weakened/diseased lungs, yes I can see it causing further damage I'd be interested in the research evidence. Stuff Covid does that isn't respiratory. No URLS, per forum rules. Source for search, Google Scholar. Paolini et al, Brain correlates of subjective cognitive complaints in COVID-19 survivors: A multimodal magnetic resonance imaging study, European Neuropsychopharmacology Volume 68, March 2023, Pages 1-10 Ignas Badaras and Agne Laucyte-Cibulskiene, Vascular Aging and COVID-19, Angiology, Volume 74, Issue 4 This one was pretty memorable: Martinez-Marmol et al, SARS-CoV-2 infection and viral fusogens cause neuronal and glial fusion that compromises neuronal activity, SCIENCE ADVANCES 7 Jun 2023 Vol 9, Issue 23 Brogan and Ross, COVID-19 and Kidney Disease, Annual Review of Medicine, Vol. 74:1-13 (Volume publication date January 2023) Soheil Tavakolpour and Taha Rakhshandehroo, Lymphopenia during the COVID-19 infection: What it shows and what can be learned, Immunol Lett. 2020 Sep; 225: 31–32. For example. A google scholar search with words like "complications" or "sequelae", words like "mild" or "asymptomatic" and the name of a lot of different organ systems return results indicating that stuff has been found that means a bit more than pulmonary concerns. I know too well (a year before lockdown) that a respiratory virus can result in neuro complications (a) viral particles (being tinier than bacteria) can pass the blood brain barrier, or (b) cause an overreaction by the immune system (a one off autoimmune event, attacking the brain cells). I have encephalitis sequelae from (b). The Spanish flu resulted in copious cases of encephalitis lethargica. You can bet your bottom dollar COVID-19 will also (the encephalitis society is doing research). It seemed like you doubted what Polly was saying about other effects within the body - there's a huge amount of evidence out there, and, as you know, viruses can have a sting in the tail. " Polly can be overly dramatic when relaying info. It's part of her charm. And I like to play devil's advocate . | |||
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"From my logic, covid was a nasty form of flu which normal winter jabs couldn't cope with. After all the lockdowns of varying sizes, everyone's immune systems were weakened as a result of not sharing smaller parts of diseases when being close to someone. That then leads the more vulnerable to still being high risk as commoner colds and flus will be higher risk to them. " There is logic to your post, however, CoV 2 is not a flu type virus. Also, it's not that people's immune system was weakened but by lacking exposure to common (mutating) viruses, but that the immune system wasn't "strengthened" by creating antigens and lymphocytic killer/memory cells upon exposure. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? " When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc." Our condolences | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat." Oh come on now... Re immunity it was exposure and/or vaccines. Or do you have an alternative? | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc." Sorry for your loss, sadly there were many (and possibly more to come) as a result of cancelled and delayed appointments. I was fortunate as I havent been affected as severely as that and I count myself lucky in that aspect. | |||
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" There is logic to your post, however, CoV 2 is not a flu type virus. Also, it's not that people's immune system was weakened but by lacking exposure to common (mutating) viruses, but that the immune system wasn't "strengthened" by creating antigens and lymphocytic killer/memory cells upon exposure." I agree with you there, I'm no doctor (God give strength to anyone that takes my health advice). | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat." Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits. | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc." Sorry to hear that. Condolences | |||
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"What are 'excess deaths'?" Excess deaths are basically the number of deaths actually recorded during a period, minus the number of deaths that occurred during a previous representative period. So the number of deaths that occurred more than would be normally expected. There's a bit more to it than that because there's a correction for the increase in population, and it's not always easy to judge what is a good "representative period". But basically if say you look how many people died during April for each of the last ten years, and it's pretty much a constant amount, then you get an April where a lot more people died, you can figure that there must be something special about the April where more people died. It doesn't tell you why they died, just that there were more deaths than in a normal April. In the year when covid started, pretty well all countries that keep good records of births and deaths noted a lot more deaths than usual during every month. The number of these "excess deaths" was greater, per thousand heads of population, in countries that were late in introducing masking mandates, lockdowns, movement controls etc. And were lower in countries that did enforce stricter control measures. The excess deaths reduced for a while when covid vaccination programmes started, then increased again when the virus mutated into new variants that the existing vaccines are less effective against. Hope that this helps understand. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits." I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits.I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go." Lucky mutation? Re transmission, as the virus bounded around in copious numbers, it's natural to take time to start reducing those numbers. Surely you didn't think the vaccine was like going around in a hazmat suit? I agree with you about the powers that be flouting the rules and some of the rules being non-sensical.  | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc." I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man... | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man..." Who are you to judge? | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man... Who are you to judge? " I am not judging. Just making an observation. | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man..." What should he be looking for oh judge? | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man... What should he be looking for oh judge? " He can look for whatever he wants but I would have thought that a man in his 60s who has lost his wife would have also included woman in his profile. See where I am coming from? | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man... What should he be looking for oh judge? He can look for whatever he wants but I would have thought that a man in his 60s who has lost his wife would have also included woman in his profile. See where I am coming from?" I'd stop digging yourself a hole now if I were you. It's best not to speculate the whys and wherefores of others or their profiles. The latter is most definitely against the rules. | |||
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"Covid killed my wife. She did not die of Covid but because of the problems it caused. Cancelled hospital appointments, lack of access to medical treatment etc. I would have thought that a man losing his wife would come on here looking for something different than a man... What should he be looking for oh judge? He can look for whatever he wants but I would have thought that a man in his 60s who has lost his wife would have also included woman in his profile. See where I am coming from?" I'd mind your own business rather than trying to play detective about people's lives you know absolutely nothing about. | |||
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" Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go." To add some context, there's no evidence that any scientific findings or advice was followed to what say, one of their experts in virology for example, had to say about it. Many decisions were political and weren't strictly governed or decided by what logical approach would have been best. So when you say "science" like that, I assume you mean that in an ironic sense. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits.I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. Lucky mutation? Re transmission, as the virus bounded around in copious numbers, it's natural to take time to start reducing those numbers. Surely you didn't think the vaccine was like going around in a hazmat suit? I agree with you about the powers that be flouting the rules and some of the rules being non-sensical. "Lucky mutation as in it mutated to a milder albeit more contagious form. It could have been worse. As for transmission, no one I know who is vaccinated didn't end up with covid. Regardless of the amount of vaccinations. In turn their whole households ended up infected too. This is contrary to the initial lies told by the media regarding the vaccines ability to stop transmission. "Get your vaccine to save granny" and other baldfaced lies told by politicians and many others. It's also a big part of why myself and many others got vaccinated in the first place. I'd already had covid by time vaccines were rolled out and wasn't particularly worried about catching it again. Unknowingly infecting vulnerable relatives or elderly neighbours I was doing a lot of running around for was terrifying. In hindsight, Given that it does little to stop anyone catching or spreading I might as well have not bothered. | |||
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" Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. To add some context, there's no evidence that any scientific findings or advice was followed to what say, one of their experts in virology for example, had to say about it. Many decisions were political and weren't strictly governed or decided by what logical approach would have been best. So when you say "science" like that, I assume you mean that in an ironic sense." I say "science" because that was the claim throughout by those in charge. The rest of my post pretty much sums up why I think that's was bullshit. I'd say most decisions were based on how much they could skim off the top with jobs for the boys. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits.I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. Lucky mutation? Re transmission, as the virus bounded around in copious numbers, it's natural to take time to start reducing those numbers. Surely you didn't think the vaccine was like going around in a hazmat suit? I agree with you about the powers that be flouting the rules and some of the rules being non-sensical. Lucky mutation as in it mutated to a milder albeit more contagious form. It could have been worse.
As for transmission, no one I know who is vaccinated didn't end up with covid. Regardless of the amount of vaccinations. In turn their whole households ended up infected too.
This is contrary to the initial lies told by the media regarding the vaccines ability to stop transmission. "Get your vaccine to save granny" and other baldfaced lies told by politicians and many others.
It's also a big part of why myself and many others got vaccinated in the first place. I'd already had covid by time vaccines were rolled out and wasn't particularly worried about catching it again. Unknowingly infecting vulnerable relatives or elderly neighbours I was doing a lot of running around for was terrifying. In hindsight, Given that it does little to stop anyone catching or spreading I might as well have not bothered."Was it advertised as STOPPING transmission? Slow it, yes. I have a bullshit filter, especially regarding politicians, so I may have ignored it. Same as protection against catching it. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits.I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. Lucky mutation? Re transmission, as the virus bounded around in copious numbers, it's natural to take time to start reducing those numbers. Surely you didn't think the vaccine was like going around in a hazmat suit? I agree with you about the powers that be flouting the rules and some of the rules being non-sensical. Lucky mutation as in it mutated to a milder albeit more contagious form. It could have been worse.
As for transmission, no one I know who is vaccinated didn't end up with covid. Regardless of the amount of vaccinations. In turn their whole households ended up infected too.
This is contrary to the initial lies told by the media regarding the vaccines ability to stop transmission. "Get your vaccine to save granny" and other baldfaced lies told by politicians and many others.
It's also a big part of why myself and many others got vaccinated in the first place. I'd already had covid by time vaccines were rolled out and wasn't particularly worried about catching it again. Unknowingly infecting vulnerable relatives or elderly neighbours I was doing a lot of running around for was terrifying. In hindsight, Given that it does little to stop anyone catching or spreading I might as well have not bothered."Pfizer made it clear that there was no testing on transmission. If the media lied or over exaggerated are you surprised? Regardless of who said what, the vaccine gave vulnerable people a better chance of coming out of infection as well as they were before. The vaccine gave the immune system the opportunity to create antibodies etc which would undoubtedly reduce the severity because it could fight the virus faster. Because it could fight the virus faster the victim would be contagious for a shorter period which means reduces the spread. Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits. | |||
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"Is there only one answer? When it comes to questioning the spoon fed "vaccines were the only answer, how dare you suggest otherwise, eat your cut price mcdonalds and be happy"? Yes, any other way means you only watch YouTube videos while wearing a tin foil hat. Depends what you mean by "only answer" We could have locked the borders and had longer and stricter lockdowns until the virus couldnt spread and locked up anyone breaking curfew for a year. We could have let the elderly die and only treated under 50s when hospitals were overwhelmed... The vaccine allowed us to cope with the virus in terms of the NHS. It saved lives. Those who didnt get it still got the social benefits.I fully believe that without the lucky mutation to the milder strain, the vaccine would have had minimal impact at best. Its effect on transmission was shakey from the off. Any additional measures would have been better than the ones we got. Instead we got nonsensical rules with unjust fines while those in charge flaunted those self same rules with no consequences. I could work with same people for 12 hours but couldn't sit at same table with them in a pub/resteraunt, covid apparently doesn't transmit either after 10pm or when you are sat down. Let's also not forget the genius of closing gyms at the same time as giving cut price junk food during a pandemic that obesity was a major contributing factor in having a poor outcome. Yeah, it's safe to say I had zero confidence in the powers that be and the "science" they were supposedly following from the get go. Lucky mutation? Re transmission, as the virus bounded around in copious numbers, it's natural to take time to start reducing those numbers. Surely you didn't think the vaccine was like going around in a hazmat suit? I agree with you about the powers that be flouting the rules and some of the rules being non-sensical. Lucky mutation as in it mutated to a milder albeit more contagious form. It could have been worse.
As for transmission, no one I know who is vaccinated didn't end up with covid. Regardless of the amount of vaccinations. In turn their whole households ended up infected too.
This is contrary to the initial lies told by the media regarding the vaccines ability to stop transmission. "Get your vaccine to save granny" and other baldfaced lies told by politicians and many others.
It's also a big part of why myself and many others got vaccinated in the first place. I'd already had covid by time vaccines were rolled out and wasn't particularly worried about catching it again. Unknowingly infecting vulnerable relatives or elderly neighbours I was doing a lot of running around for was terrifying. In hindsight, Given that it does little to stop anyone catching or spreading I might as well have not bothered.
Was it advertised as STOPPING transmission? Slow it, yes. I have a bullshit filter, especially regarding politicians, so I may have ignored it. Same as protection against catching it."Ehm, yes it was massively suggested that getting the jab would stop you giving it to someone else. Both the media and those "following the science" were all over the fact that you "get the jab and the virus stops with you". | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits." I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around." Think you are right. At the time i tried to do the right thing. If i had a magic wand id go back and do it differently for me and my kids especially. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show. There is not enough longitudinal data to state that what happened in 2022 was to do with COVID vaxes or any other variable. At this point we can only speculate " I am sure there will be a video on YT now, stating just that fact. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around." I don't know a single person who has had any side effects from the virus that weren't expected (I.e. the same as any other vaccine has some side effects). Whenever steps are taken to prevent a situation its always the same. "Oh, the so called experts said x would happen but it didnt". That's what we have seen with the vaccine. Unfortunately your average Joe doesn't understand that. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around." "The next pandemic will get their attention this time". - Bill Gates. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221" So what is the BBC reporting here. There were 650000 deaths in 2022 which is 9% more than 2019. Rough working out without a calculator puts that at about 597000 deaths in 2019. (Really that should be worked out and on the article because hubby is lazy). It is frustrating when state news which champions investigating things doesn't even bother to investigate more before it makes the aspersion that deaths are due to long wait times. They can't make that claim as they don't know what people are dieing from, or what groups, or where. Sounds like state bull shit propaganda to spread fear, disguise from real issues, and totally fail to investigate what could be causing the issue. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around. I don't know a single person who has had any side effects from the virus that weren't expected (I.e. the same as any other vaccine has some side effects). Whenever steps are taken to prevent a situation its always the same. "Oh, the so called experts said x would happen but it didnt". That's what we have seen with the vaccine. Unfortunately your average Joe doesn't understand that." ...and I don't know a single person who had more than a miserable few days from covid, guess all those people didnt really die then 
Just because it hasn't happened in your circle doesn't mean it isn't happening. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So what is the BBC reporting here. There were 650000 deaths in 2022 which is 9% more than 2019. Rough working out without a calculator puts that at about 597000 deaths in 2019. (Really that should be worked out and on the article because hubby is lazy). It is frustrating when state news which champions investigating things doesn't even bother to investigate more before it makes the aspersion that deaths are due to long wait times. They can't make that claim as they don't know what people are dieing from, or what groups, or where. Sounds like state bull shit propaganda to spread fear, disguise from real issues, and totally fail to investigate what could be causing the issue." Yep. Guesswork at best | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So what is the BBC reporting here. There were 650000 deaths in 2022 which is 9% more than 2019. Rough working out without a calculator puts that at about 597000 deaths in 2019. (Really that should be worked out and on the article because hubby is lazy). It is frustrating when state news which champions investigating things doesn't even bother to investigate more before it makes the aspersion that deaths are due to long wait times. They can't make that claim as they don't know what people are dieing from, or what groups, or where. Sounds like state bull shit propaganda to spread fear, disguise from real issues, and totally fail to investigate what could be causing the issue." No. The only uk media which is state run(except that's murky: does the state, ie the government, 'run them',or do the media run the government?lets just say they have an alignment in wjat they both want) As you put it is less likely to be the BBC, and is more likely to be the Sun, the mail, the express ,the daily telegraph, the Times,London evening standard. And probably even the mirror eventually. God knows what the Independent is these days apart from a mess. Only as near to dammit independent news outlets in these enlightened times are Channel 4 news, the Guardian, and, yes, the BBC. And possibly Al Jeezeera. Think of it like this: the ones I've mentioned suck the governments cock amd blast all opposition, the others don't do that, or not as much. If you accept that para then which do you think are more likely to be 'state sponsored'? Ps China and North Korea actually DO have state news by the way. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around. I don't know a single person who has had any side effects from the virus that weren't expected (I.e. the same as any other vaccine has some side effects). Whenever steps are taken to prevent a situation its always the same. "Oh, the so called experts said x would happen but it didnt". That's what we have seen with the vaccine. Unfortunately your average Joe doesn't understand that....and I don't know a single person who had more than a miserable few days from covid, guess all those people didnt really die then
Just because it hasn't happened in your circle doesn't mean it isn't happening."There is a typo in what I wrote. Virus = vaccine. I guess making typos must be a symptom of covid which I have now. I know of a number of people who died because of covid. They would more than likely have still been around today. They died pre-vaccine. Of those people I know who have had covid (and didnt die), their symptoms ranged from cold symptoms to being in their bed for a couple of days. I know some people who reacted badly to the vaccine. I.e. it made them feel shit for a few days including high temperatures. Whilst this is my anecdotal evidence, it fits in with the wider data. | |||
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". Whatever you think, whilst not being the exact answer we wanted, the vaccine provided some significant benefits.I personally don't know a single person who, if given the option to do it all over with what they know now, would make the same choice. I also have a friend who's life is in tatters because of clots from his third jab. I'm sure he'd disagree massively about any significant benefits considering he went from super fit athlete to being unable to walk up a flight of stairs unaided. Usually his plight is dismissed as "it only happens to a miniscule percentage" Hopefully we don't see another pandemic in my lifetime because I fully believe that it would take a metric fuckton of deaths to convince your average joe on the street to comply with any measures put it place or to willingly sign up to a medical intervention next time around. I don't know a single person who has had any side effects from the virus that weren't expected (I.e. the same as any other vaccine has some side effects). Whenever steps are taken to prevent a situation its always the same. "Oh, the so called experts said x would happen but it didnt". That's what we have seen with the vaccine. Unfortunately your average Joe doesn't understand that....and I don't know a single person who had more than a miserable few days from covid, guess all those people didnt really die then
Just because it hasn't happened in your circle doesn't mean it isn't happening.
There is a typo in what I wrote. Virus = vaccine. I guess making typos must be a symptom of covid which I have now.
I know of a number of people who died because of covid. They would more than likely have still been around today. They died pre-vaccine. Of those people I know who have had covid (and didnt die), their symptoms ranged from cold symptoms to being in their bed for a couple of days. I know some people who reacted badly to the vaccine. I.e. it made them feel shit for a few days including high temperatures.
Whilst this is my anecdotal evidence, it fits in with the wider data."I thankfully don't know anyone who didn't have more than a miserable few days with covid. Myself included. The cough lasted a bit longer and was annoying but I was plagued with chest infections as a youngster(and even now occasionally) so it wasn't anything I hadn't dealt with. | |||
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"Bbc article here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221 So there has been a huge increase in excess deaths, up 9% from 2019. It's not covid doing it. One of the things they point out is that there has been a huge increase in cardiac problems. We know the covid jabs cause heart and clotting issues. But no according to the BBC it's not the vaccine, it's covid itself. But say hypothetically that's true, that means that not only did the jab fail to stop you getting covid, it failed to stop you dying from covid either. What a clown show." all bullshit in my humble opinion | |||
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"The amount of access deaths is shocking. What ever the cause." Are they, what’s your source? | |||
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"To many people living on this planet now,mother nature will always have the last say" I think people who believe that shouldn't be hypocritical about it and do the world a favour. Nevermind, the world leaders are sorting out your little problem. | |||
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"The amount of access deaths is shocking. What ever the cause." People round my way are saying now that flies are dropping like people. Did you see the latest excess death admittance from the WHO? | |||
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"The amount of access deaths is shocking. What ever the cause. Are they, what’s your source?" Source for what lmao? | |||
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"The amount of access deaths is shocking. What ever the cause. People round my way are saying now that flies are dropping like people. Did you see the latest excess death admittance from the WHO?" I did https://www.who.int/data/stories/global-excess-deaths-associated-with-covid-19-january-2020-december-2021 | |||
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"To many people living on this planet now,mother nature will always have the last say I think people who believe that shouldn't be hypocritical about it and do the world a favour. Nevermind, the world leaders are sorting out your little problem." Bloody well said! | |||
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"To many people living on this planet now,mother nature will always have the last say I think people who believe that shouldn't be hypocritical about it and do the world a favour. Nevermind, the world leaders are sorting out your little problem." Well. Charming. | |||
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