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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." What is the treatment for covid? Winston | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing." There are many different reasons why additional support would be required beside Covid. Such as dementia, other infections diseases the immunosuppressed etc. The only reason Covid numbers are reported on this way is because it's easier and scarier for the public. The numbers that matter for policy making are those being treated for it. Not those treated with it. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. What is the treatment for covid? Winston" There are many different treatments for Covid depending on the symptoms and severity, ranging from basic antoviral drugs and steroids up to full mechanical breathing. But you already know this so please explain what point you are trying to make? | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.." And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid. 
Winston | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston"
As my sister was and father in law, the former due to COPD not to be mechanically ventilated if it got to that who sat there writing letters of goodbye just in case.. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston"The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums."I don't believe anyone would be in hospital with Covid and not be treated for it. Winston | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. What is the treatment for covid? Winston" According to our government and it's masterplan its "stay at home til you're on deaths door then we'll try and save you" Y'know cause waiting til any disease has a massive hold on you is always the best way to go about treating you. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing." But how is that the same as being treated with covid. I get its extra man power but how is it helpful to people knowing how severe covid actually is when from a statistical point of view the two are not separated? | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. What is the treatment for covid? Winston" I have no idea Winston, as i thankfully have not had to find out. i would imagine its alot different to being treated for a broken arm. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. There are many different reasons why additional support would be required beside Covid. Such as dementia, other infections diseases the immunosuppressed etc. The only reason Covid numbers are reported on this way is because it's easier and scarier for the public. The numbers that matter for policy making are those being treated for it. Not those treated with it." But people with dementia and immunosuppressed people can still be treated on an open ward with other patients. They do not need the extra care of barrier nursing and their own area etc. As already explained above covid patients need to be nursed separately to everyone else and this is a drain on resources even if they do not need extra treatment for the covid itself. For example a covid ward has to be opened, resulting in less beds for other non covid patients, the ward needs staffing, so nurses are redeployed from other wards meaning normal wards have less staff resulting in an inability to accept the normal number of patients on the normal wards. It's long and drawn out but even asymptomatic covid positive patients in hospital are an extra drain on the NHS. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.." Cant see how you have come that conclusion. Please explain how from a statistical point of view in measuring how severe new Variants are when you count hospitalizations on people being treated with other issues who test positive with covid but who are not being treated for covid itself. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing." I won't dispute that covid positive patients require a different type of care or that it requires additional resources but that isn't the point. The point is that to correctly evaluate the risk FROM covid we need to know not 'how many people are in hospital with covid' but 'how many people were admitted to hospital because of covid'. Those are two very different numbers and have two very different implications when assessing and managing Covid risk. Much like the situation in Scotland (which was what prompted this post) - while there are lots of people 'with' covid in hospital very few are there 'because' of covid. That's got huge implications for the proportionality or otherwise of any control measures. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. Cant see how you have come that conclusion. Please explain how from a statistical point of view in measuring how severe new Variants are when you count hospitalizations on people being treated with other issues who test positive with covid but who are not being treated for covid itself." Because regardless of whether they're being treated for covid or not, they're in a Covid ward. A ward solely dedicated to patients with covid. They're therefore counted as being in hospital, with covid. Winston | |||
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"Omicron in Scotland : 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that for 1 ICU admission and no deaths. In what way can that be considered proportionate? Surely we need to be asking some very serious & searching questions about the conduct of our leaders now. How can this be anything other than political? " Back to the OP....not sure if the restrictions are proportionate to the level of infection or the restrictions are keeping the infection level down? | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. But how is that the same as being treated with covid. I get its extra man power but how is it helpful to people knowing how severe covid actually is when from a statistical point of view the two are not separated?" Do you understand that hospitals have vulnerable people in them? And staff move from patient to patient? And so staff could spread the COVID from Alan, age 25 being treated for a broken leg, to Enid, age 82 and originally admitted because she fell at home? Alan might not experience much in the way of COVID symptoms, but once Alan's infection reaches Enid on the adjacent ward, she's a goner. People with COVID have to be barrier nursed and separated and treated by staff working in full PPE. But I've already explained this, about four times over the past couple of days. Read up on isolation and barrier nursing. And to the person who thinks it's no different to staffing needs for dementia and other diseases - absolutely wrong. Dementia is not contagious. No additional staff are routinely placed with dementia patients. There's no other infections disease currently doing the rounds that's a) anywhere near as contagious and b) so widespread in the community. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. I won't dispute that covid positive patients require a different type of care or that it requires additional resources but that isn't the point. The point is that to correctly evaluate the risk FROM covid we need to know not 'how many people are in hospital with covid' but 'how many people were admitted to hospital because of covid'. Those are two very different numbers and have two very different implications when assessing and managing Covid risk. Much like the situation in Scotland (which was what prompted this post) - while there are lots of people 'with' covid in hospital very few are there 'because' of covid. That's got huge implications for the proportionality or otherwise of any control measures." Exactly this, couldn't have worded it any better. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. I won't dispute that covid positive patients require a different type of care or that it requires additional resources but that isn't the point. The point is that to correctly evaluate the risk FROM covid we need to know not 'how many people are in hospital with covid' but 'how many people were admitted to hospital because of covid'. Those are two very different numbers and have two very different implications when assessing and managing Covid risk. Much like the situation in Scotland (which was what prompted this post) - while there are lots of people 'with' covid in hospital very few are there 'because' of covid. That's got huge implications for the proportionality or otherwise of any control measures." It is the point though. If hospitals have lots and lots of COVID positive people, they need more staff (who might be in short supply due to COVID isolation). They need more isolation areas. They need more PPE. They need more cleaning (these people may also be unavailable due to COVID isolation). Etc. So, trying to minimise the numbers of COVID positive people in hospital for any reason is important. One way that can be achieved is by minimising COVID spread in the community. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. And it's already been explained to you why ANY COVID positive people in hospital, including asymptomatic people, are an issue. Anyone who tests positive for COVID must be barrier nursed, in a separate area from the non COVID positive people and this is very time, equipment and staff intestive. It is NOT normal open ward nursing. But how is that the same as being treated with covid. I get its extra man power but how is it helpful to people knowing how severe covid actually is when from a statistical point of view the two are not separated? Do you understand that hospitals have vulnerable people in them? And staff move from patient to patient? And so staff could spread the COVID from Alan, age 25 being treated for a broken leg, to Enid, age 82 and originally admitted because she fell at home? Alan might not experience much in the way of COVID symptoms, but once Alan's infection reaches Enid on the adjacent ward, she's a goner. People with COVID have to be barrier nursed and separated and treated by staff working in full PPE. But I've already explained this, about four times over the past couple of days. Read up on isolation and barrier nursing. And to the person who thinks it's no different to staffing needs for dementia and other diseases - absolutely wrong. Dementia is not contagious. No additional staff are routinely placed with dementia patients. There's no other infections disease currently doing the rounds that's a) anywhere near as contagious and b) so widespread in the community. " As said before im fully aware with man power issues. But you have completely ignored my question regarding measuring how severe covid is in regards to those needing hospital treatment for purely covid related illness. In simpler terms those who are solely hospitalised for covid. | |||
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" It is the point though. If hospitals have lots and lots of COVID positive people, they need more staff (who might be in short supply due to COVID isolation). They need more isolation areas. They need more PPE. They need more cleaning (these people may also be unavailable due to COVID isolation). Etc. So, trying to minimise the numbers of COVID positive people in hospital for any reason is important. One way that can be achieved is by minimising COVID spread in the community. " I'm not disputing the impact on resources but that is not the point I'm making. We cannot assess the risk FROM covid because we don't have the information to allow us to do so. If 100 people out of 200 are hospitalised because they caught Covid it's clearly a greater risk than if 1 out of 200 is. Incidental risks (ie. staffing issues etc.) shouldn't be ignored but without the base data on how likely COVID is to land people in hospital we're only being shown part of the picture. When dealing with such an important issue we need all the data to fairly assess whether the government are acting correctly or nor. | |||
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" It is the point though. If hospitals have lots and lots of COVID positive people, they need more staff (who might be in short supply due to COVID isolation). They need more isolation areas. They need more PPE. They need more cleaning (these people may also be unavailable due to COVID isolation). Etc. So, trying to minimise the numbers of COVID positive people in hospital for any reason is important. One way that can be achieved is by minimising COVID spread in the community. I'm not disputing the impact on resources but that is not the point I'm making. We cannot assess the risk FROM covid because we don't have the information to allow us to do so. If 100 people out of 200 are hospitalised because they caught Covid it's clearly a greater risk than if 1 out of 200 is. Incidental risks (ie. staffing issues etc.) shouldn't be ignored but without the base data on how likely COVID is to land people in hospital we're only being shown part of the picture. When dealing with such an important issue we need all the data to fairly assess whether the government are acting correctly or nor." you will get the same answer for a 5th time! | |||
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"People who test positive for COVID upon admission for a different reason are NOT treated on the same sort of open ward alongside COVID negative people. People who are all COVID positive and not requiring specialist respiratory intervention (e.g the guy with the broken leg) CAN be nursed in a multi bedded bay, but that bay must be isolated from non-COVID positive people and staff must use completely separate equipment and completely doff and don PPE to move from a COVID positive area to a COVID negative area. Isolation of patients is not just within individual rooms, it can be within designated areas of a hospital. Please read the Government document at the link below, with the pertinent sentence being: "These PCR testing regimes [testing upon admission] will detect asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection in patients who then need to be isolated and managed in a ‘High-Risk COVID-19 Care Pathway" https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-within-hospitals-and-discharging-covid-19-patients-from-hospital-to-home-settings/guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-and-discharging-covid-19-patients" I don't think anyone is disputing that, they are more asking why these stats are lumped together and not split to give people a better idea of the actual risks involved rather than a blanket number flung out there with no context | |||
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"People who test positive for COVID upon admission for a different reason are NOT treated on the same sort of open ward alongside COVID negative people. People who are all COVID positive and not requiring specialist respiratory intervention (e.g the guy with the broken leg) CAN be nursed in a multi bedded bay, but that bay must be isolated from non-COVID positive people and staff must use completely separate equipment and completely doff and don PPE to move from a COVID positive area to a COVID negative area. Isolation of patients is not just within individual rooms, it can be within designated areas of a hospital. Please read the Government document at the link below, with the pertinent sentence being: "These PCR testing regimes [testing upon admission] will detect asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection in patients who then need to be isolated and managed in a ‘High-Risk COVID-19 Care Pathway" https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-within-hospitals-and-discharging-covid-19-patients-from-hospital-to-home-settings/guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-and-discharging-covid-19-patients" No one is desputing that. | |||
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"People who test positive for COVID upon admission for a different reason are NOT treated on the same sort of open ward alongside COVID negative people. People who are all COVID positive and not requiring specialist respiratory intervention (e.g the guy with the broken leg) CAN be nursed in a multi bedded bay, but that bay must be isolated from non-COVID positive people and staff must use completely separate equipment and completely doff and don PPE to move from a COVID positive area to a COVID negative area. Isolation of patients is not just within individual rooms, it can be within designated areas of a hospital. Please read the Government document at the link below, with the pertinent sentence being: "These PCR testing regimes [testing upon admission] will detect asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection in patients who then need to be isolated and managed in a ‘High-Risk COVID-19 Care Pathway" https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-within-hospitals-and-discharging-covid-19-patients-from-hospital-to-home-settings/guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-and-discharging-covid-19-patientsI don't think anyone is disputing that, they are more asking why these stats are lumped together and not split to give people a better idea of the actual risks involved rather than a blanket number flung out there with no context" Just because someone tests positive incidentally to their hospital admission for gout or an infected toe nail or the after effects of being hit by that bus they've dodged since lockdown 1, it doesn't mean that their entire stay will be untinged by treatment for their COVID positive status. We know people who have had their oxygen sats suddenly drop from 98 or above to 80-odd percent but in the form of silent hypoxia which seems to characterise COVID. One minute they did not need supportive oxygen therapy and the next, they did. Do you think there's time to be informing the DHSC every five minutes about whether someone is receiving direct COVID intervention or just "other" intervention? | |||
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"People who test positive for COVID upon admission for a different reason are NOT treated on the same sort of open ward alongside COVID negative people. People who are all COVID positive and not requiring specialist respiratory intervention (e.g the guy with the broken leg) CAN be nursed in a multi bedded bay, but that bay must be isolated from non-COVID positive people and staff must use completely separate equipment and completely doff and don PPE to move from a COVID positive area to a COVID negative area. Isolation of patients is not just within individual rooms, it can be within designated areas of a hospital. Please read the Government document at the link below, with the pertinent sentence being: "These PCR testing regimes [testing upon admission] will detect asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection in patients who then need to be isolated and managed in a ‘High-Risk COVID-19 Care Pathway" https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-within-hospitals-and-discharging-covid-19-patients-from-hospital-to-home-settings/guidance-for-stepdown-of-infection-control-precautions-and-discharging-covid-19-patientsI don't think anyone is disputing that, they are more asking why these stats are lumped together and not split to give people a better idea of the actual risks involved rather than a blanket number flung out there with no context Just because someone tests positive incidentally to their hospital admission for gout or an infected toe nail or the after effects of being hit by that bus they've dodged since lockdown 1, it doesn't mean that their entire stay will be untinged by treatment for their COVID positive status. We know people who have had their oxygen sats suddenly drop from 98 or above to 80-odd percent but in the form of silent hypoxia which seems to characterise COVID. One minute they did not need supportive oxygen therapy and the next, they did. Do you think there's time to be informing the DHSC every five minutes about whether someone is receiving direct COVID intervention or just "other" intervention? " WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. " Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic? | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic?" What about dave who broke his arm, got tested positive for covid. Arm was treated and he was discharged? | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic? What about dave who broke his arm, got tested positive for covid. Arm was treated and he was discharged?" Counted twice when he comes back for his follow up and catches the next new variant. Fucking dave... | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic?" Day 1,Dave goes to hospital with a broken leg. Day 2,Dave gets a positive covid test but apart from the sniffles he's fine. Day 3, Dave gets released and gets killed by a car while crossing the road. Day 4, Dave is one of the many who died within 28 days of a positive covid test and is recorded as such on the death certificate. | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic? What about dave who broke his arm, got tested positive for covid. Arm was treated and he was discharged?" That wasn't Dave. It was his twin brother, Harry | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums.
I don't believe anyone would be in hospital with Covid and not be treated for it.
Winston"Really? I have Covid at the moment. For me, I had a couple of days with a sore throat, tiredness and headache - nothing more (I'm triple jabbed so may have helped symptoms). If I broke my leg today I would be tested upon arrival and would be added to the number of people that are in hospital with Covid. I would not need any treatment for Covid. Same with many others. The governments own numbers estimate that around 40 percent of those in hospital with Covid are not being treated for it. | |||
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"Omicron in Scotland : 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that for 1 ICU admission and no deaths. In what way can that be considered proportionate? Surely we need to be asking some very serious & searching questions about the conduct of our leaders now. How can this be anything other than political? " 150000 dead... give or take a few broken legs and we still read this nonsense. Ok Op whats your big plan? | |||
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" WE GET THAT. But we are not talking about hospital covid infection control. We are talking about statistics for solely covid hospitalizations. Try again. Day 1 in the COVID admissions area and Dave has been categorised as "asymptomatic COVID positive on arrival." He is mainly in hospital because he nailed his cock to his hand by accident (don't ask). Day 2 - Dave is starting to get a bit of a cough but is otherwise fine. Well, apart from the fact he definitely ISN'T hitting the loo when taking a pee. Day 2.5 - Dave's oxygen sats suddenly dropped and he required treatment for symptomatic COVID infection via an oxygen mask. At what point would you like Dave to appear in the "in hospital with COVID due to COVID" instead of the "in hospital with COVID but actually not being treated for COVID but for something else"? Because that's what you're asking for. Day 3 - Dave's cock really hurts now, but at least he can neither smell nor taste the food.... Tune in later for more on Dave's condition. Will his penis ever work again? Will he ever finish the DIY? Will he need ICU treatment for his burgeoning COVID infection? Will he become just another statistic? What about dave who broke his arm, got tested positive for covid. Arm was treated and he was discharged? That wasn't Dave. It was his twin brother, Harry "Yes, no way that Dave could break his arm while he's in hospital with it nailed to his cock. They're a bloody feckless family though. | |||
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"The government website is suggesting different figures https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-daily-data-for-scotland/" That shows total figures. OP was only looking at omicron and I'm not sure where those numbers came from. Over 1000 people in hospital with any covid variant is quite high imo and it's increasing. Add to that the staff shortages, I can kind of understand why they're still cautious x | |||
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"The government website is suggesting different figures https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-daily-data-for-scotland/ That shows total figures. OP was only looking at omicron and I'm not sure where those numbers came from. Over 1000 people in hospital with any covid variant is quite high imo and it's increasing. Add to that the staff shortages, I can kind of understand why they're still cautious x" And link for omicron stats was a few comments down  Next time I'll try to read it all, but was scrolling as fast as i coukd past all the broken leg / not really covid comnents and missed it | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums.
I don't believe anyone would be in hospital with Covid and not be treated for it.
Winston
Really?
I have Covid at the moment. For me, I had a couple of days with a sore throat, tiredness and headache - nothing more (I'm triple jabbed so may have helped symptoms).
If I broke my leg today I would be tested upon arrival and would be added to the number of people that are in hospital with Covid. I would not need any treatment for Covid. Same with many others.
The governments own numbers estimate that around 40 percent of those in hospital with Covid are not being treated for it.
"Studies of bone growth and healing indicate that covid infection can have an undesirable negative effect. If you are unlucky enough to break your leg while you have covid, you might find that your bone healing will take longer and possibly be unsatisfactory. There is a possibility of long term bone weakness, early osteoporosis, brittle bones. It is very likely that you will tie up hospital resources for longer. You will also tie up a bone specialist in the "infected" side of the hospital, making them less available for treating uninfected bone patients. If your infection spreads to the "uninfected" side of the hospital there is a probability of severe negative outcomes for patients with otherwise very treatable conditions. If an uninfected bone patient has to be moved to the "infected" side in order to receive treatment, then they are extremely likely to become infected and suffer the same negative outcome for their bone healing as you will, plus if they happen to have other perfectly treatable conditions such as diabetes or cancer in remission, the covid infection may well kill them. The presence of covid infections within hospitals has severe medical and financial implications, the outcomes for every patient are affected, the costs of keeping the hospital running are vastly increased. High rates of covid omicron in the population makes it a certainty that there will be people requiring treatment for other conditions who have also got covid. Allowing these people into hospital means that segregation and much higher infection control measures are needed, otherwise the virus will certainly spread to people who have otherwise very treatable conditions, and some of them will die. The alternative is not to let anybody into the hospital if they have got covid; if you have covid and you break your leg then you get to be crippled; if you have covid, didn't stay at home and get into a car accident then you get to be dead. This is obviously not acceptable - but as the prevalence of covid omicron increases through the population, and hospitals become increasingly overwhelmed, it may have to be something that has to be discussed by society. Hospitalisation of patients with covid, regardless of what actual reason they need to be in hospital, increases the risk for all other patients. Inevitably there will be situations where the man showing only minor covid symptoms who nails his dick to his hand, will ultimately result in the death of the 35 year old woman who has spent the last two years avoiding all contact with her family because she has a kidney condition requiring regular treatment, but in the absence of covid could easily have lived to be 90. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." This is silly so how can anyone trust the figures? It makes me sad  | |||
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"Omicron in Scotland : 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that for 1 ICU admission and no deaths. In what way can that be considered proportionate? Surely we need to be asking some very serious & searching questions about the conduct of our leaders now. How can this be anything other than political? " Have you considered that the numbers are so low because of restrictions?? | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.." Well, you can, but you’d have to be a right monster. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. Well, you can, but you’d have to be a right monster." Perhaps hobble in time when passing.. | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. " Well you're no fun.
Winston | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. Well you're no fun.
Winston"On the other hand, my brother Harry.. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums."Not really. If someone has covid, they are a risk as they may infect others. And if they have omicron then that risk increases significantly. I am not part of any “bubble of insecurity”. I am quite optimistic about 2022. As soon as we get the cast majority of adults boosted, we will be in a good place and able to drive forward with normal lives, push the economy forward and free the nhs up to concentrate on other treatments. I also expect further game changers in terms of treatments for covid, further improving things. | |||
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"Gotta bump up those covid numbers so they can dish out the contracts to build those Nightingale hospitals...again. Then some more contracts to tear them down in 3 months when they weren't needed after all." Seriously? You are suggesting deliberately killing people? | |||
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"Apparently the numbers for those in hospital with covid include people locked up in mental homes or anywhere that can be classified as a hospital who happen to pick it up " So the covid numbers include all people who have covid? Thanks for clearing that up | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." Tell us more about your learnings. Would this patient be being treated on a broken leg ward or a covid ward? | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums.
I don't believe anyone would be in hospital with Covid and not be treated for it.
Winston
Really?
I have Covid at the moment. For me, I had a couple of days with a sore throat, tiredness and headache - nothing more (I'm triple jabbed so may have helped symptoms).
If I broke my leg today I would be tested upon arrival and would be added to the number of people that are in hospital with Covid. I would not need any treatment for Covid. Same with many others.
The governments own numbers estimate that around 40 percent of those in hospital with Covid are not being treated for it.
"I don’t see the problem. The main thing is consistency of measuring policy so that trends are clear. Numbers have gone up in the past few weeks, that much is clear, and that’s the most important thing. Also, as previous posters have said, if someone is in hospital and has tested positive, then that increases workload compared to a potent who and my tested positive. And the biggest reason for counting hospital cases is to ensure that the nhs does not become overrun, and positive patients are an increased drain on resource, so i do see the relevance of including them in the numbers | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. This is silly so how can anyone trust the figures? It makes me sad "The most important thing is trends. So doesn’t massively matter what is recorded as a covid case, what matters most is whether cases are going up, stable or coming down. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. Tell us more about your learnings. Would this patient be being treated on a broken leg ward or a covid ward?" Read above for the answer. | |||
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"I believe the Covid response in Scotland, Wales and NI has all too often been driven by political motives rather than medical. By that, I mean the desire to do something 'different' from England. imho a national response would have been cheaper, more efficient, clearer and more effective. (ps I'm Welsh)." Welcome to the concept of devolution, which was demanded by the countries you mention ... demanded the right to decide what happens locally instead of being dictated to by Westminster, then did something different to Westminster (quite possibly to show that they could do so, particularly wee Nicola), and then moan about o consistent approaches. Devolution is guaranteed to create these inconsistencies | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. Tell us more about your learnings. Would this patient be being treated on a broken leg ward or a covid ward? Read above for the answer." Oh as a covid nurse for the last 2 years I know the answer..just wondered what thee new found "learnings" were | |||
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"Apparently the numbers for those in hospital with covid include people locked up in mental homes or anywhere that can be classified as a hospital who happen to pick it up So the covid numbers include all people who have covid? Thanks for clearing that up " All people who walk through a hospital door for any form of treatment are tested for covid, if it comes back positive then you are classed as being hospitalised with covid. | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. Tell us more about your learnings. Would this patient be being treated on a broken leg ward or a covid ward? Read above for the answer." Are you happy that you have a link to the precious stats you have been seeking? Link shared last night on NHS England. PS: Dave is doing okay but his little chap will never be the same again  | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. All you've just said there is that even after 21 or so months you still do not understand the difference between a broken leg and covid.. Really? Here's a clue, I can't pass on my broken leg if we're are in adjoining hospital beds.. And you're not just "statistically in hospital with covid", you're actually in hospital with covid.
Winston
The metric that matters is whether they are being treated FOR Covid or not. The rest is noise to fuel the media and those bubbles of insecurity like these forums.
I don't believe anyone would be in hospital with Covid and not be treated for it.
Winston
Really?
I have Covid at the moment. For me, I had a couple of days with a sore throat, tiredness and headache - nothing more (I'm triple jabbed so may have helped symptoms).
If I broke my leg today I would be tested upon arrival and would be added to the number of people that are in hospital with Covid. I would not need any treatment for Covid. Same with many others.
The governments own numbers estimate that around 40 percent of those in hospital with Covid are not being treated for it.
Studies of bone growth and healing indicate that covid infection can have an undesirable negative effect. If you are unlucky enough to break your leg while you have covid, you might find that your bone healing will take longer and possibly be unsatisfactory. There is a possibility of long term bone weakness, early osteoporosis, brittle bones.
It is very likely that you will tie up hospital resources for longer. You will also tie up a bone specialist in the "infected" side of the hospital, making them less available for treating uninfected bone patients. If your infection spreads to the "uninfected" side of the hospital there is a probability of severe negative outcomes for patients with otherwise very treatable conditions. If an uninfected bone patient has to be moved to the "infected" side in order to receive treatment, then they are extremely likely to become infected and suffer the same negative outcome for their bone healing as you will, plus if they happen to have other perfectly treatable conditions such as diabetes or cancer in remission, the covid infection may well kill them.
The presence of covid infections within hospitals has severe medical and financial implications, the outcomes for every patient are affected, the costs of keeping the hospital running are vastly increased. High rates of covid omicron in the population makes it a certainty that there will be people requiring treatment for other conditions who have also got covid. Allowing these people into hospital means that segregation and much higher infection control measures are needed, otherwise the virus will certainly spread to people who have otherwise very treatable conditions, and some of them will die.
The alternative is not to let anybody into the hospital if they have got covid; if you have covid and you break your leg then you get to be crippled; if you have covid, didn't stay at home and get into a car accident then you get to be dead. This is obviously not acceptable - but as the prevalence of covid omicron increases through the population, and hospitals become increasingly overwhelmed, it may have to be something that has to be discussed by society.
Hospitalisation of patients with covid, regardless of what actual reason they need to be in hospital, increases the risk for all other patients. Inevitably there will be situations where the man showing only minor covid symptoms who nails his dick to his hand, will ultimately result in the death of the 35 year old woman who has spent the last two years avoiding all contact with her family because she has a kidney condition requiring regular treatment, but in the absence of covid could easily have lived to be 90.
"Brilliantly explained. Thanks for taking the time to do so. I think that some people are either unaware of the potential full effects of covid, or fancy their chances because they are not old or vulnerable, so dismiss covid as a bit of a sniffle and can’t see what the fuss is about. A combination of complacency, ignorance and not caring about others. | |||
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"Apparently the numbers for those in hospital with covid include people locked up in mental homes or anywhere that can be classified as a hospital who happen to pick it up So the covid numbers include all people who have covid? Thanks for clearing that up All people who walk through a hospital door for any form of treatment are tested for covid, if it comes back positive then you are classed as being hospitalised with covid." I know. And as I had posted, the most important thing is consistency on this point so that trends are accurate. And as posted elsewhere, if someone is admitted for a different reason bjt tests positive, then there is an increased workload in relation to that patient, which is completely relevant in measuring stress in the nhs. And that’s why numbers are being recorded, flexing policy that ensure that the nhs is not overloaded. | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. Well you're no fun.
Winston
On the other hand, my brother Harry.."Not the one who got run over by the bus?
Winston | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. Well you're no fun.
Winston
On the other hand, my brother Harry..
Not the one who got run over by the bus?
Winston"In fairness he was trying to evade an escaped alligator.. | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. Well you're no fun.
Winston
On the other hand, my brother Harry..
Not the one who got run over by the bus?
Winston
In fairness he was trying to evade an escaped alligator.."So cries of “nail the croc” were misunderstood? | |||
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"Just to add what I feel is appropriate balance.. As someone who does DIY and us called Dave I've never felt the need to nail anything in the vicinity of my genitals.. Well you're no fun.
Winston
On the other hand, my brother Harry..
Not the one who got run over by the bus?
Winston
In fairness he was trying to evade an escaped alligator..
So cries of “nail the croc” were misunderstood? "Very good.. | |||
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" 150000 dead... give or take a few broken legs and we still read this nonsense. Ok Op whats your big plan?" Firstly, there are not 150,000 dead in Scotland. Next, how many of those would be dead anyway? I don't mean to be harsh but the reality is that covid primarily kills those with pre-existing morbidities that put them at far higher risk of death from any cause. Saying covid killed 150000 is simply untrue. Finally, have you looked at the other costs? The non-covid excess death rate is through the roof. It's easy to forget that restrictions have costs too. It's easy to forget the mental health problems, the suicides, the missed diagnoses, the lost incomes, the destroyed businesses... they don't make 72 point headlines like covid deaths do. But they matter. This is now a question about how we want to live. Do we want to live in a restricted, safety-obsessed and limited world forever or don't we. That's our choice because Covid is going nowhere. Choose wisely. | |||
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" 150000 dead... give or take a few broken legs and we still read this nonsense. Ok Op whats your big plan? Firstly, there are not 150,000 dead in Scotland. Next, how many of those would be dead anyway? I don't mean to be harsh but the reality is that covid primarily kills those with pre-existing morbidities that put them at far higher risk of death from any cause. Saying covid killed 150000 is simply untrue. ." Pre existing conditions are not always life threatening, you can live happily for many years with a condition. This " well those people were going to die anyway" idea is a very cold point of view | |||
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" Pre existing conditions are not always life threatening, you can live happily for many years with a condition. This " well those people were going to die anyway" idea is a very cold point of view" It's also not what I said. I'm well aware that not all conditions are life threatening and I'm not suggesting that only those with life threatening conditions died due to covid, or even that all those with life-threatening conditions who caught covid died. And nowhere did I say anyone was going to die anyway. The point, again, is that the data provided is deliberately vague and clearly intended to produce a desired response - fear. Same as the hospital data. Almost every metric associated with covid that's widely reported is provided without context and framed in the most alarmist way possible. Why? | |||
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" Pre existing conditions are not always life threatening, you can live happily for many years with a condition. This " well those people were going to die anyway" idea is a very cold point of view It's also not what I said. I'm well aware that not all conditions are life threatening and I'm not suggesting that only those with life threatening conditions died due to covid, or even that all those with life-threatening conditions who caught covid died. And nowhere did I say anyone was going to die anyway. The point, again, is that the data provided is deliberately vague and clearly intended to produce a desired response - fear. Same as the hospital data. Almost every metric associated with covid that's widely reported is provided without context and framed in the most alarmist way possible. Why? " Fear generates compliance in the many, although anyone who knows anything knows to make major decisions driven by fear is irrational. Fear is also a massive contributor to lowering the effectiveness of the immune system leading to more susceptibility to illness and death. As the professionals know about the placebo effect they know the same applies for nocebo. | |||
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" Pre existing conditions are not always life threatening, you can live happily for many years with a condition. This " well those people were going to die anyway" idea is a very cold point of view It's also not what I said. I'm well aware that not all conditions are life threatening and I'm not suggesting that only those with life threatening conditions died due to covid, or even that all those with life-threatening conditions who caught covid died. And nowhere did I say anyone was going to die anyway. The point, again, is that the data provided is deliberately vague and clearly intended to produce a desired response - fear. Same as the hospital data. Almost every metric associated with covid that's widely reported is provided without context and framed in the most alarmist way possible. Why? " Have you seen the link provided last night that gives all the data sought on "admitted due to COVID", "admitted with incidental COVID" etc? Yes, it's for NHS England because that's where I was looking at midnight last night but NHS Scotland is very likely to publish exactly the same data. The covering statement that I also shared explained why it's not straightforward to classify patients as being in hospital directly due to COVID or "just" with incidental/asymptomatic COVID. Remember, long COVID is a thing and it doesn't seem to be proportionate to the severity of the disease so it's important to "measure" ALL COVID infection, whether severe, mild or otherwise. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. " That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? " Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. " Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. " The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need? | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need?" OK you do you and ill wait it's peaked then make my choice. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need? OK you do you and ill wait it's peaked then make my choice. " Do you take that cautious attitude with all seasonal respiratory illnesses. Omicron is no worse than these - I have it at the moment. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need? OK you do you and ill wait it's peaked then make my choice. Do you take that cautious attitude with all seasonal respiratory illnesses. Omicron is no worse than these - I have it at the moment." Is your experience of the disease the same as everyone else's? We both had very mild COVID in 2020. Our son had it (mild) in July '21. My brother and his wife had it over Christmas. Mr KC was left with massively swollen lymph nodes which had to be surgically removed. I'm waiting for investigation on possible Sjögren syndrome triggered by COVID. Our son's hearing in one ear was impaired during his period of illness and has not come back 6 months later. Bro and wife seem okay so far. My Grandad had COVID in Jan 2021. He died. My stepfather had COVID in Jan 2021. He died. All experiences and subsequent impact - completely different for all of us. | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need?" Please post a link or more info on this irrefutable data ? | |||
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"The better question would be, if the restrictions were lifted would the statistics change for the worse? e.g. more in ICU, more deaths etc. That doesn't fit his narrative though does it? I did notice there were no alternative plans offered, no solutions offered just continual moaning about what scotgov is doing. Surely then post itself is politically driven then? Very true. I understand people can get frustrated with restrictions, but yes they never offer a different way of dealing with the pandemic. Fact is, no one is 100% sure of the best approach, from what I'm seeing, I'd rather err on the side of caution till we have a better idea of the fallout from this variant. If it proves to be as harmless as some claim, fabulous, happy days but we don't know yet. The data is clear, both from SA and domestically. How long do you need? OK you do you and ill wait it's peaked then make my choice. Do you take that cautious attitude with all seasonal respiratory illnesses. Omicron is no worse than these - I have it at the moment." I'm happy to hear you are not adversely affected and wish you a full recovery however, anecdotal, individual experiences isn't what guides my decision. You've clearly made your choice as I wish to do also or, is that not allowed? Are my choices less valid because they don't fit your version of 'facts'? | |||
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"Allow me to rephrase that for you Omicron in Scotland There are only 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Because of the fact Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that and thankfully 1 ICU admission and no deaths. There that's it fixed now. " If prisons were empty would we be able the get rid of police and the court systems? | |||
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"Allow me to rephrase that for you Omicron in Scotland There are only 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Because of the fact Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that and thankfully 1 ICU admission and no deaths. There that's it fixed now. If prisons were empty would we be able the get rid of police and the court systems? " No. Not every crime warrants a custodial sentence. | |||
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" Pre existing conditions are not always life threatening, you can live happily for many years with a condition. This " well those people were going to die anyway" idea is a very cold point of view It's also not what I said. I'm well aware that not all conditions are life threatening and I'm not suggesting that only those with life threatening conditions died due to covid, or even that all those with life-threatening conditions who caught covid died. " Then I am confused as to what you meant by this. "Firstly, there are not 150,000 dead in Scotland. Next, how many of those would be dead anyway? I don't mean to be harsh but the reality is that covid primarily kills those with pre-existing morbidities that put them at far higher risk of death from any cause. Saying covid killed 150000 is simply untrue." | |||
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"Allow me to rephrase that for you Omicron in Scotland There are only 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Because of the fact Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that and thankfully 1 ICU admission and no deaths. There that's it fixed now. " Simply untrue and you know it. I'm not even prepared to dignify that with a rebuttal. | |||
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"Allow me to rephrase that for you Omicron in Scotland There are only 1 in ICU 91 in hospital 0 dead Because of the fact Pubs restricted. Restaurants restricted. Queues outside shops again. Clubs closed Live events cancelled Theaters closed Sports stadia closed Masks mandated almost everywhere. Pensioners arrested for dancing. All of that and thankfully 1 ICU admission and no deaths. There that's it fixed now. Simply untrue and you know it. I'm not even prepared to dignify that with a rebuttal." And yet.....you did.
Winston | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it." Actually they produce 2 separate sets of figures… one for those who came in with a different issue and were found to have covid (as your example) , and those who came into hospital because of covid symptoms Those treated WITH… and those treated FROM….. The “from” covid cases… those that come in specifically because they had the symptoms far far outweigh those Coming in being treated otherwise who happened to have covid….. Witty does a good job of explaining those in the briefings | |||
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"Learnt the other day that if you are in hospital with broken leg and you test positive whilst in hospital you are statistically in hospital with covid despite not being treated for it. Actually they produce 2 separate sets of figures… one for those who came in with a different issue and were found to have covid (as your example) , and those who came into hospital because of covid symptoms Those treated WITH… and those treated FROM….. The “from” covid cases… those that come in specifically because they had the symptoms far far outweigh those Coming in being treated otherwise who happened to have covid….. Witty does a good job of explaining those in the briefings" he certainly does. He has no political agenda, just tells it as it is and clearly explains to the people asking stupid questions why they are wrong. | |||
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