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"Should we close oure borders and get the covid under controle .or as cummings testified to the house of comons about england gov runing a herd imunity reasoning whear we all get ill and its survival of the fitest.it seems the gove want open borders and us all to get everything thats going round and the weakest die.pity we carnt close oure borders like the french and look after oure own" Sure, I think we should have done. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline???" totally off topic but that avatar pic is fantastic! | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline???" Yep the main issue here is immigration. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. " Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. | |||
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"The french are stoping uk frome entering eu. They say indiant variant is out of controle in uk and only a good reason will get you into the eu.uk say everything is ok Who do you think is telling the true facts" They are... What exactly leads anyone to the conclusion we have any control over it.? .. We don't...and are seemingly unable so to do. We are still flying in full direct flights from New Delhi at the rate of 10 to 15 per week. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees." People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? " They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. | |||
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"The french are stoping uk frome entering eu. They say indiant variant is out of controle in uk and only a good reason will get you into the eu.uk say everything is ok Who do you think is telling the true facts" The French are acting responsibly for their country to protect all those who live there it's how you contain and control a global pandemic it's a procedure that is supposed to be maintained for safety reasons | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline???" These boats are not monitored and sneak past but if their country wasn't blown up by bombs their never would be a migrant crisis these countries and other countries wasn't a war besides having a puppet who they could work alongside | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? These boats are not monitored and sneak past but if their country wasn't blown up by bombs their never would be a migrant crisis these countries and other countries wasn't a war besides having a puppet who they could work alongside " Didnt realise France was being blown up by bombs. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. " And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy?" And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel." You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. | |||
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"Can we stay on topic, if you want an immigration dig dong, create your own threads. " Absolutely... Travel spreads it. Reduce the spread with less travel. Makes perfect sense. Please Spain, Greece, Italy, portugal et al close borders too. | |||
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"Can we stay on topic, if you want an immigration dig dong, create your own threads. Absolutely... Travel spreads it. Reduce the spread with less travel. Makes perfect sense. Please Spain, Greece, Italy, portugal et al close borders too. " I'm expecting them to do so.. I'm waiting to be able to go to Sicily but it's going to have to wait a little longer x | |||
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"Our countries lack of proper effective border control has been ridiculous to say the least like others have said we should have closed down our borders and got things under control before opening up again." I've traveled twice during all this. Once to Malta and once to Sicily. In malta they were testing and checking temperatures.. making sure you had all the correct paper work... and double checking everything. Masks worn even in outdoor public spaces. In Sicily they were the same. Had scanners for peoples temperatures etc... checking your paper work. Masks were enforced everywhere. Fly back to the UK. Had us queuing with quarantine countries flights... no checks xx just asked what flight we had got off | |||
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"Our countries lack of proper effective border control has been ridiculous to say the least like others have said we should have closed down our borders and got things under control before opening up again. I've traveled twice during all this. Once to Malta and once to Sicily. In malta they were testing and checking temperatures.. making sure you had all the correct paper work... and double checking everything. Masks worn even in outdoor public spaces. In Sicily they were the same. Had scanners for peoples temperatures etc... checking your paper work. Masks were enforced everywhere. Fly back to the UK. Had us queuing with quarantine countries flights... no checks xx just asked what flight we had got off " Exactly this it is ridiculous that we are not even carrying out the proper checks on arrival to the UK, and queuing you with people from risk countries is plan idiotic as its put you at risk aswell even though you have travelled from what sounds like a country's that has got it's shit together unlike ours. | |||
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"Our countries lack of proper effective border control has been ridiculous to say the least like others have said we should have closed down our borders and got things under control before opening up again. I've traveled twice during all this. Once to Malta and once to Sicily. In malta they were testing and checking temperatures.. making sure you had all the correct paper work... and double checking everything. Masks worn even in outdoor public spaces. In Sicily they were the same. Had scanners for peoples temperatures etc... checking your paper work. Masks were enforced everywhere. Fly back to the UK. Had us queuing with quarantine countries flights... no checks xx just asked what flight we had got off " And there's the big problem... Because we "say" we are doing something.... Doesn't mean it is actually happening effectively. Just because some twonk in govt says "our policy is to check and test and its great".. Doesn't mean that its being done or that people with slightest of motivations can circumvent them. It's the same old story. And yet here we go again. | |||
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"Our countries lack of proper effective border control has been ridiculous to say the least like others have said we should have closed down our borders and got things under control before opening up again. I've traveled twice during all this. Once to Malta and once to Sicily. In malta they were testing and checking temperatures.. making sure you had all the correct paper work... and double checking everything. Masks worn even in outdoor public spaces. In Sicily they were the same. Had scanners for peoples temperatures etc... checking your paper work. Masks were enforced everywhere. Fly back to the UK. Had us queuing with quarantine countries flights... no checks xx just asked what flight we had got off And there's the big problem... Because we "say" we are doing something.... Doesn't mean it is actually happening effectively. Just because some twonk in govt says "our policy is to check and test and its great".. Doesn't mean that its being done or that people with slightest of motivations can circumvent them. It's the same old story. And yet here we go again. " I to be fair have not been away since last August.. so they may have improved x | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. " In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control? | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control?" Gate and bull springs to mind | |||
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" Mrs4 are just so happy we've taken back "Control" and have a fair drinks to celebrate the fact and seems funny that the large majority fail to realise we are a island so anyone attempting to enter are some what limited on the methods for doing it ?? and using a thing called a "Boat" or anything that can harness science to "Float" is and will always quite popular ?? and of course it then avoids the tricky question of "Why" far easier to demonise them though ?? and as a parent i can only imagine the utter desperation of a parent willing to take such risks ?? and i would then quite like to have a conversation with them to find out the "Why" and again it is the total lack of informed opinion that is most shocking and one of the saddest and deeply ironic things is that this hatred/misinformation is being stoked up by a female who if the rules she has happily/merrily and shouted about and bragged about were in place when her parents wouldn't have been allowed to come here and so she wouldn't be a British citizen ?? but always the same sadly the ones who have benefited the most do all they can to stop other having the same level of benefits they themselves enjoyed ?? "I think you will find many Indian and Pakistani families were awarded U.K. passports because of being in our Empire. So they had the right to live in U.K. | |||
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" Mrs4 are just so happy we've taken back "Control" and have a fair drinks to celebrate the fact and seems funny that the large majority fail to realise we are a island so anyone attempting to enter are some what limited on the methods for doing it ?? and using a thing called a "Boat" or anything that can harness science to "Float" is and will always quite popular ?? and of course it then avoids the tricky question of "Why" far easier to demonise them though ?? and as a parent i can only imagine the utter desperation of a parent willing to take such risks ?? and i would then quite like to have a conversation with them to find out the "Why" and again it is the total lack of informed opinion that is most shocking and one of the saddest and deeply ironic things is that this hatred/misinformation is being stoked up by a female who if the rules she has happily/merrily and shouted about and bragged about were in place when her parents wouldn't have been allowed to come here and so she wouldn't be a British citizen ?? but always the same sadly the ones who have benefited the most do all they can to stop other having the same level of benefits they themselves enjoyed ??
I think you will find many Indian and Pakistani families were awarded U.K. passports because of being in our Empire. So they had the right to live in U.K. "I don't think the poster is disputing that. | |||
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"Apparently people visiting here and going through Heathrow will use the same terminal as those from other countries. Great stuff." Are you suggesting that each country in the world should have its own terminal at Heathrow? | |||
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"Apparently, Heathrow has today opened a dedicated terminal for passengers on flights from red list countries, thereby avoiding mixing with those from green and amber countries. Helpful " | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control?" Control of our borders? It would appear not. Control would imply we know who is coming in and going out and control in covid times would imply we also know they are infected or not infected. I think the frustration for some is the bullshit spouted that we have or will have Co trol when very obviously we never have had and possibly because we have not really ever made a proper attempt to do so. It would have a semblance of credibility if they were to just come out and state what their ambitions are. I'm intrigued why we continue to operate travel to Red list countries at all. A red traffic light stops traffic... | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control? Control of our borders? It would appear not. Control would imply we know who is coming in and going out and control in covid times would imply we also know they are infected or not infected. I think the frustration for some is the bullshit spouted that we have or will have Co trol when very obviously we never have had and possibly because we have not really ever made a proper attempt to do so. It would have a semblance of credibility if they were to just come out and state what their ambitions are. I'm intrigued why we continue to operate travel to Red list countries at all. A red traffic light stops traffic... " I really don't want to get into politics but the big reason for brexit was taking back control Anyway it appears the big fuck up was india when Hancock lied about when they closed the borders. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control? Control of our borders? It would appear not. Control would imply we know who is coming in and going out and control in covid times would imply we also know they are infected or not infected. I think the frustration for some is the bullshit spouted that we have or will have Co trol when very obviously we never have had and possibly because we have not really ever made a proper attempt to do so. It would have a semblance of credibility if they were to just come out and state what their ambitions are. I'm intrigued why we continue to operate travel to Red list countries at all. A red traffic light stops traffic... I really don't want to get into politics but the big reason for brexit was taking back control Anyway it appears the big fuck up was india when Hancock lied about when they closed the borders." Not only that... The fact that we have had 80 to 100 direct commercial flights from India since we "closed borders" to them (source flight checker) not counting the private flights and the indirect flights via frankfurt, dubai, Paris, Amsterdam, et al... The notion that 100 flights times 200 pax per flight (20k pax) are quarantining in hotels is madness. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control? Control of our borders? It would appear not. Control would imply we know who is coming in and going out and control in covid times would imply we also know they are infected or not infected. I think the frustration for some is the bullshit spouted that we have or will have Co trol when very obviously we never have had and possibly because we have not really ever made a proper attempt to do so. It would have a semblance of credibility if they were to just come out and state what their ambitions are. I'm intrigued why we continue to operate travel to Red list countries at all. A red traffic light stops traffic... I really don't want to get into politics but the big reason for brexit was taking back control Anyway it appears the big fuck up was india when Hancock lied about when they closed the borders. Not only that... The fact that we have had 80 to 100 direct commercial flights from India since we "closed borders" to them (source flight checker) not counting the private flights and the indirect flights via frankfurt, dubai, Paris, Amsterdam, et al... The notion that 100 flights times 200 pax per flight (20k pax) are quarantining in hotels is madness. " I thought the stuff which Cummings came out with over the borders last week was glossed over somewhat. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. People are allowed to have different concerns aren't they? They are ..I'm sure a few dozen desperate people arriving on a dhingy dwarfes that of a deadly virus. And you know that it's only a few dozen on a dhingy? And what if it's not? They are rounded up by the lovely ms patel. You're the one belittling others concerns about lack of border control. I'm just suggesting if we don't know the size of the problem it's rather prejudiced to state it is a small problem. In not belittling anyone. Just find it a bit odd the major concern in a pandemic is immigration. Anyway.. havent we took back control? Control of our borders? It would appear not. Control would imply we know who is coming in and going out and control in covid times would imply we also know they are infected or not infected. I think the frustration for some is the bullshit spouted that we have or will have Co trol when very obviously we never have had and possibly because we have not really ever made a proper attempt to do so. It would have a semblance of credibility if they were to just come out and state what their ambitions are. I'm intrigued why we continue to operate travel to Red list countries at all. A red traffic light stops traffic... I really don't want to get into politics but the big reason for brexit was taking back control Anyway it appears the big fuck up was india when Hancock lied about when they closed the borders. Not only that... The fact that we have had 80 to 100 direct commercial flights from India since we "closed borders" to them (source flight checker) not counting the private flights and the indirect flights via frankfurt, dubai, Paris, Amsterdam, et al... The notion that 100 flights times 200 pax per flight (20k pax) are quarantining in hotels is madness. I thought the stuff which Cummings came out with over the borders last week was glossed over somewhat." I think a lot of what he came out with has been glossed over... It all had a bit of stage management about it like his press conference a year ago. Thing is he's the boy who cried wolf isn't he... Its like that old riddle about 2 people... One always tells the truth... One always lies... What question do you ask and to whom to identify the one who tells the truth. | |||
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"Apparently people visiting here and going through Heathrow will use the same terminal as those from other countries. Great stuff. Are you suggesting that each country in the world should have its own terminal at Heathrow? " Perhaps having a quarantine ‘red’ list from day one and making use of all of Heathrow’s hotel capacity would have been a sensible plan. If only we had people smart enough in Govt to look at the risks & do something to mitigate them. I mean, is it possible that the virus transmits via people travelling…? 
Withoutthis Govts idiocy and criminal negligence, we would have had less people dead in this country (& other countries) and less lockdown restrictions. Led by Donkeys, is being very unkind to Donkeys | |||
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"Is it REALLY about the virus? If it were, surely Polish, Spanish, etc nationals that live in the UK but carry EU passports would be disallowed. But they aren't. Nor do they have to fill out the forms, or prove their case for travel to France from the UK. On top of that, France's vaccination rate is well below ours and their infection rate is higher. Evidently it is more political than anything else. " I don't think that France would be allowed to prevent EU citizens from coming & going, without getting it approved by Brussels. Personally, I think it would be a good idea for all countries to close their borders for a while to prevent the spread of new strains. Cal | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? totally off topic but that avatar pic is fantastic!" It is, that's why I've just FAB'd it. | |||
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"Is it REALLY about the virus? If it were, surely Polish, Spanish, etc nationals that live in the UK but carry EU passports would be disallowed. But they aren't. Nor do they have to fill out the forms, or prove their case for travel to France from the UK. On top of that, France's vaccination rate is well below ours and their infection rate is higher. Evidently it is more political than anything else. I don't think that France would be allowed to prevent EU citizens from coming & going, without getting it approved by Brussels. Personally, I think it would be a good idea for all countries to close their borders for a while to prevent the spread of new strains. Cal" Cal.... Its the French, they can do what they please... And do most years when the blockade the seaports when the schools break up for summer and the ar traffic control / air space in August. | |||
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"Goodness me this thread has stirred up some prejudices hasn't it? It's obviously been the amount of traffic between here and India that has exposed us to this new threat, and we really should have at the very least checked all the returnees even taking out the new variant threat? Are there any figures relating to the ethnicity of the new burst in cases? Apart from that,going back to the original question, I'm of the opinion that the French are probably using the variant as an excuse for being difficult with us as usual. They've not forgiven us for Warterloo yet and having the audacity to leave the E.U. has really annoyed them, (despite the fact they objected to us joining in the first place?) Sour grapes is the phrase that comes to mind?" Was your 1st paragraph meant to be ironic? | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? These boats are not monitored and sneak past but if their country wasn't blown up by bombs their never would be a migrant crisis these countries and other countries wasn't a war besides having a puppet who they could work alongside Didnt realise France was being blown up by bombs. " Or Italy or Germany and a load of other possible countries they have travelled through to get to the UK. After all it's not Rocket Science why they are coming here. | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us "You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? These boats are not monitored and sneak past but if their country wasn't blown up by bombs their never would be a migrant crisis these countries and other countries wasn't a war besides having a puppet who they could work alongside Didnt realise France was being blown up by bombs. Or Italy or Germany and a load of other possible countries they have travelled through to get to the UK. After all it's not Rocket Science why they are coming here. " Please enlighten us..considering we are behind the likes of turkey and Germany in the number of immigrants we take? | |||
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"The french are stoping uk frome entering eu. They say indiant variant is out of controle in uk and only a good reason will get you into the eu.uk say everything is ok Who do you think is telling the true facts" Given that UK is currently averaging about 3000 cases a day a d France a out 30000 I think it's a bit rich. That's why France is nowhere near being on our green list. | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers"So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…  | |||
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"They're only doing what we should have done last March, and don't start me in the feking shambles that's led to this decision by them in us allowing 42,000 people to come back from India and not be quarantined.."
As far as I can see it any UK person can go where they like. But do 14 days at there cost in a hotel on return. Protect where we can. | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box… "The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules? | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees." They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals" You will find that most refugees travel to a country where they have large communities already settled. This is normally due to historic ties to the nation they are travelling from; Britain likely had control over it in the past, maybe killed a large number of its population, stole a loads of natural resources and then installed a dictatorship to run the place when we left. What you view is that of a simple minded racist who struggles to read The Scum, but what he can read is enough to tell him refugees are bad | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. " | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. " It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
"Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons)" Wow!! Your one of those people | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Yep, giving shit to bigots and racists and watching as the poor little snowflakes get upset. I’d rather do it face to face, but sadly lockdown put a stop to that. But I’ll soon be getting naughty with fascists again Wow!! Your one of those people" | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Wow!! Your one of those people" A non racist? | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Yep, giving shit to bigots and racists and watching as the poor little snowflakes get upset. I’d rather do it face to face, but sadly lockdown put a stop to that. But I’ll soon be getting naughty with fascists again Wow!! Your one of those people" Where was I a racist and all the other names your calling? Wow you need to cool down Mr Facebook ban man or you be in the cells doing time | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Wow!! Your one of those people A non racist?" Are you blind or stupid your a teacher! I was only staying the difference between a refugee and a illegal what's the racist in that?? | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Wow!! Your one of those people A non racist? Are you blind or stupid your a teacher! I was only staying the difference between a refugee and a illegal what's the racist in that??" Oh dear. | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Yep, giving shit to bigots and racists and watching as the poor little snowflakes get upset. I’d rather do it face to face, but sadly lockdown put a stop to that. But I’ll soon be getting naughty with fascists again Wow!! Your one of those people Where was I a racist and all the other names your calling? Wow you need to cool down Mr Facebook ban man or you be in the cells doing time" Your view is that of a racist. Also if you want to live in our country, then learn our language; it’s you’re (you are) not your (ownership). | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. It’s like reading the comments section on the Daily Fail website or the Facebook comments on their page. Having had a load of 90 day bans on Facey I’m holding back (I now have a separate Facey account to attack Gammons) Wow!! Your one of those people A non racist?" Sorry to disillusion people. But without going to the trouble of going through the individual critics of mine to see where they actually live I do wonder if they have ever met either a member of an ethnic minority or refugee? I've many friends and in the past employed both types so feel I speak from actual real life interaction and not media led propoganda, so please don't accuse me of being a newspaper led moron. It's a well known fact that asian families are much closer than us home grown 'snowflakes'. In general this is to be admired leading to the frailer members of the community being taken care of at home rather than being consigned to a care home, alas in the current situation it's meant their more elderly have been in a more exposed position due to the mixing of age groups in the one property? Surely this is patently obvious to anyone with the slightest knowledge of culture and not a blind prejudice? Hopefully the morons howling from the sidelines will familiarise themselves with culture before criticising in the future?(although I doubt it as a kneejerk reaction seems to be their go to position?) And regards the government reaction to travel, I've been saying for a long time we're an island for a reason and that fact has protected us in the past and would've helped now if the authorities had reacted competently? After all the most recent example was WW2? Thankfully we had the R.A.F then so border control should have been simple? It's the lack of will and fear of financial repercussions that have led to the current mess as instead of thinking long term concessions were made to immediate protests of interested parties it's now gone on and caused far more difficult than could have been expected? | |||
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"They're only doing what we should have done last March, and don't start me in the feking shambles that's led to this decision by them in us allowing 42,000 people to come back from India and not be quarantined.." Spot on | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? These boats are not monitored and sneak past but if their country wasn't blown up by bombs their never would be a migrant crisis these countries and other countries wasn't a war besides having a puppet who they could work alongside Didnt realise France was being blown up by bombs. Or Italy or Germany and a load of other possible countries they have travelled through to get to the UK. After all it's not Rocket Science why they are coming here. Please enlighten us..considering we are behind the likes of turkey and Germany in the number of immigrants we take?" Thank god for that. Just look at the unrest that was caused when this happened. Especially in East Germany whee a lit of them settled. There were riots every night and no go areas. Merkle even today realises the mistake she made. Don't get me wrong. I am as diverse as they come and married to a black women. No easy answers to any of this. Maybe we should allow a lot of them to settle in the good old USA. After all it was their involvement mainly which has added to the chaos around the round. Biggest terrorists going if you ask me. | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
"The gov have made mistakes as have all governments, the care home issue we have been through before, not sure if I've asked you the question but if not then where would you have sent them ? Hospitals needed the beds, the nightingales werent open and we didnt have the testing capacity to test them, no one who criticises that decision seems to know what else could have been done. As for travel it would be interesting to know how many of the 15 million were brits returning home or business travelers as opposed to " unnecessary "travel, all those in planes and airports should have been wearing masks, I suspect the cause of any new variant numbers increase is because they didnt obey the rules, | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals You will find that most refugees travel to a country where they have large communities already settled. This is normally due to historic ties to the nation they are travelling from; Britain likely had control over it in the past, maybe killed a large number of its population, stole a loads of natural resources and then installed a dictatorship to run the place when we left. What you view is that of a simple minded racist who struggles to read The Scum, but what he can read is enough to tell him refugees are bad" Got to love a bit of irony and there is loads in that post. Perhaps a visit to a dictionary and the word bigot might be in order. | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals" Refugees and Asylum seekers are allowed to seek help in any country they choose. There is an international agreement that all countries will take a fair share of Asylum seekers, so they don't all end up being in the same place. Even so, the countries that are bordering the war-torn areas are taking 99% of the world's refugees | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals Refugees and Asylum seekers are allowed to seek help in any country they choose. There is an international agreement that all countries will take a fair share of Asylum seekers, so they don't all end up being in the same place. Even so, the countries that are bordering the war-torn areas are taking 99% of the world's refugees" | |||
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"I wonder if they’ll enforce it as well as they do the migrant boats leaving their coastline??? Yep the main issue here is immigration. Indeed, who cares about covid as long as we don't let in any refugees. They are not refugees .a refugee is going to the first safe country not traveling through 5 safe country's. They are illegals Refugees and Asylum seekers are allowed to seek help in any country they choose. There is an international agreement that all countries will take a fair share of Asylum seekers, so they don't all end up being in the same place. Even so, the countries that are bordering the war-torn areas are taking 99% of the world's refugees" My only bit on that post I quoted the difference between refugees and illegals only But if that's right what you quoted I stand corrected | |||
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"The Daily Mail is strong in this thread. " | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
The gov have made mistakes as have all governments, the care home issue we have been through before, not sure if I've asked you the question but if not then where would you have sent them ? Hospitals needed the beds, the nightingales werent open and we didnt have the testing capacity to test them, no one who criticises that decision seems to know what else could have been done.
As for travel it would be interesting to know how many of the 15 million were brits returning home or business travelers as opposed to " unnecessary "travel, all those in planes and airports should have been wearing masks, I suspect the cause of any new variant numbers increase is because they didnt obey the rules, "I think the crux of my point is that Project Cygnus assumed 400,000 excess deaths from a Covid type Pandemic. It would therefore have concluded that additional beds, ICU, Oxygen, PPE would have been needed and it would have highlighted the issue of Care Homes. Of course if this test of the system hadn’t been carried out, one could say rightly that the Govt had nothing to go on and therefore it was making the best of a bad job - however, lessons had been learnt from Cygnus, they just weren’t implemented. So I don’t accept that the Govt didn’t know what to do, they knew 3 years in advance and then did not do what was required. Part of this is Tersa May’s responsibility, part of it BJ’s, but all ogf it is the Tory Government - strangely Brexit was seen as more important… Lets have a real inquiry now, it is time we all knew how much of a cock up this has really been | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
The gov have made mistakes as have all governments, the care home issue we have been through before, not sure if I've asked you the question but if not then where would you have sent them ? Hospitals needed the beds, the nightingales werent open and we didnt have the testing capacity to test them, no one who criticises that decision seems to know what else could have been done.
As for travel it would be interesting to know how many of the 15 million were brits returning home or business travelers as opposed to " unnecessary "travel, all those in planes and airports should have been wearing masks, I suspect the cause of any new variant numbers increase is because they didnt obey the rules,
I think the crux of my point is that Project Cygnus assumed 400,000 excess deaths from a Covid type Pandemic. It would therefore have concluded that additional beds, ICU, Oxygen, PPE would have been needed and it would have highlighted the issue of Care Homes.
Of course if this test of the system hadn’t been carried out, one could say rightly that the Govt had nothing to go on and therefore it was making the best of a bad job - however, lessons had been learnt from Cygnus, they just weren’t implemented.
So I don’t accept that the Govt didn’t know what to do, they knew 3 years in advance and then did not do what was required. Part of this is Tersa May’s responsibility, part of it BJ’s, but all ogf it is the Tory Government - strangely Brexit was seen as more important…
Lets have a real inquiry now, it is time we all knew how much of a cock up this has really been "So the assumption of the test planning was three times more than reality, just imagine the outcry at the cost of all the ppe etc, most of which would have been out of date so wouldnt have been used anyway due to the stupidity of use by dates. Having an inquiry now would be like sending the jury out two thirds of the way through a trial, | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
The gov have made mistakes as have all governments, the care home issue we have been through before, not sure if I've asked you the question but if not then where would you have sent them ? Hospitals needed the beds, the nightingales werent open and we didnt have the testing capacity to test them, no one who criticises that decision seems to know what else could have been done.
As for travel it would be interesting to know how many of the 15 million were brits returning home or business travelers as opposed to " unnecessary "travel, all those in planes and airports should have been wearing masks, I suspect the cause of any new variant numbers increase is because they didnt obey the rules,
I think the crux of my point is that Project Cygnus assumed 400,000 excess deaths from a Covid type Pandemic. It would therefore have concluded that additional beds, ICU, Oxygen, PPE would have been needed and it would have highlighted the issue of Care Homes.
Of course if this test of the system hadn’t been carried out, one could say rightly that the Govt had nothing to go on and therefore it was making the best of a bad job - however, lessons had been learnt from Cygnus, they just weren’t implemented.
So I don’t accept that the Govt didn’t know what to do, they knew 3 years in advance and then did not do what was required. Part of this is Tersa May’s responsibility, part of it BJ’s, but all ogf it is the Tory Government - strangely Brexit was seen as more important…
Lets have a real inquiry now, it is time we all knew how much of a cock up this has really been
So the assumption of the test planning was three times more than reality, just imagine the outcry at the cost of all the ppe etc, most of which would have been out of date so wouldnt have been used anyway due to the stupidity of use by dates.
Having an inquiry now would be like sending the jury out two thirds of the way through a trial, "But instead of getting in supplies for 400k deaths, they did nothing - which is worse? In terms of an inquiry, given they take forever anyway, starting now is a good place. I don’t accept that the incompetent should be allowed 5 extra minutes, let alone 12 months. It is time we correct the mistakes, not let them go on longer | |||
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"If only we had done that last year!!! Our country is a joke. Good on the French. " | |||
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" One more fact; immigrants contribute to the economy through taxes, far more than they take out. " Fact. Checked. https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2018/09/26/migrants-contribute-more-to-britain-than-they-take-and-will-carry-on-doing-so | |||
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"It seems that 15million people have travelled through our airports since March 2020. As of today our wonderfully inept Govt have made Terminal 3 at Heathrow ‘Red Zone’ only, so all that mixing in passport & immigration queues might stop now! What complete and utter morons we have governing us
You do realise that anyone entering the country has to have a negative test before getting on a plane and are subject to quarantine for ten days including two negative tests in that time, the rules are there, it's not the government's fault if people choose to break the rules, perhaps it would be better if people blamed the rule breakers
So 15m people can be trusted to quarantine? Call me cynical, but thats never going to happen. I like your thinking though, lets just get rid of customs& immigration controls and rely on an honesty box…
The vast majority of rules and laws rely on honesty, self assessment tax returns and indeed custom control both rely on honesty. The point is the rules are there, its people who are the problem, should honest people be punished for those who break the rules?
Well that is a can of worms - the Govt seems to apply a rule where if you are rich and/or powerful, then the rules don’t apply to you. If wecould actually have rules which apply equally & fairly then I’m all for it
Coming back to travel, even during lockdown we did not close the borders and 15 million people travelled through the UK. This is patently lunacy. Whilst we all try our hardest to limit spread within the UK, the Govt just let’s people travel in and out. As we know, testing negative does not mean you do not have Covid, it just means it hasn’t shown up. Flow tests are far from perfect & with the volume of travel, it wascertain that the virus would travel.
Would putting a stricter’closed border’ policy in place have stopped new variants? No, this is unlikely. But, it would have delayed their spread and reduced impact and probably deaths and illness.
This is just another example, like Care Homes, where the Govt did the wrong thing and caused more deaths.
In any commercial organisation, you are supposed to look at risks, consider the consequences and probability, then put together a plan to mitigate them. As I understand it, the Conservative Govt did a run through of this:
“Exercise Cygnus was a three-day simulation exercise carried out by NHS England in October 2016 to estimate the impact of a hypothetical H2N2 influenza pandemic on the United Kingdom.”
The findings have not been published.
Given the lack of PPE, the lack of ICU beds, the lack of a plan to test people before they were moved to Care Homes, the lack of an anywhere near effective Test & Trace programme and an absurd idea that ‘herd immunity’ at Cheltenham Festival would help, it is no wonder that our idiot Govt can’t ‘control our borders’. If other countries can & have put in place stricter border controls, why have we not? It has clearly reduced desths and illness in those countries.
Why has it taken nearly 15 months before the Govt makes people travelling from Red List countries go through Terminal 3 only? Why was this not in place day 1?
I get that people make mistakes. But, Project Cygnus was an excercise to test our readiness against a Pandemic that would cause many excess deaths. It highlighted areas where Britain would be found wanting. But our Govt has not published the report, leaks suggest the findings were not implemented & evidence over the padt 15 months suggests the leaks are right.
We should not have had 126,000 ‘official’ Covid deaths, nor many 10’s of thousands of additional excess deaths in this country. Our Govt have failed the country.
Who has blood on their hands - Teresa May was PM when Cygnus was run. Boris followed her. So we have continuous Tory leadership letting us all down.
This is not about Politics, it is about recognising people in power have continuously failed to do the right thing, causing immense death & suffering.
End of rant, lets hope Boris gets arrested one day for failing in his duties
The gov have made mistakes as have all governments, the care home issue we have been through before, not sure if I've asked you the question but if not then where would you have sent them ? Hospitals needed the beds, the nightingales werent open and we didnt have the testing capacity to test them, no one who criticises that decision seems to know what else could have been done.
As for travel it would be interesting to know how many of the 15 million were brits returning home or business travelers as opposed to " unnecessary "travel, all those in planes and airports should have been wearing masks, I suspect the cause of any new variant numbers increase is because they didnt obey the rules,
I think the crux of my point is that Project Cygnus assumed 400,000 excess deaths from a Covid type Pandemic. It would therefore have concluded that additional beds, ICU, Oxygen, PPE would have been needed and it would have highlighted the issue of Care Homes.
Of course if this test of the system hadn’t been carried out, one could say rightly that the Govt had nothing to go on and therefore it was making the best of a bad job - however, lessons had been learnt from Cygnus, they just weren’t implemented.
So I don’t accept that the Govt didn’t know what to do, they knew 3 years in advance and then did not do what was required. Part of this is Tersa May’s responsibility, part of it BJ’s, but all ogf it is the Tory Government - strangely Brexit was seen as more important…
Lets have a real inquiry now, it is time we all knew how much of a cock up this has really been
So the assumption of the test planning was three times more than reality, just imagine the outcry at the cost of all the ppe etc, most of which would have been out of date so wouldnt have been used anyway due to the stupidity of use by dates.
Having an inquiry now would be like sending the jury out two thirds of the way through a trial,
But instead of getting in supplies for 400k deaths, they did nothing - which is worse?
In terms of an inquiry, given they take forever anyway, starting now is a good place. I don’t accept that the incompetent should be allowed 5 extra minutes, let alone 12 months. It is time we correct the mistakes, not let them go on longer "Its already been put back till next year Dont worry Alex and his chums will be long gone before even the merest rumour of what a total catastrophe it's been,sees the light. | |||
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"See France have now said they will let Europeans in who have been double jabbed from a few weeks time. Whilst it's good that vaccines are potentially unlocking normality... I wonder how they will police that and how (if other countries have followed our way of vaccinating by age, with youngest not getting a sniff yet) maman et papa double jab will get their no jab yet kids in? " Maybe they have a better way of tracking vaccination than we do. (Scanner on the deltoids to look for the microchip ) | |||
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