FabSwingers.com forum: Matt Hancock..

By *amiss OP Couple
over a year ago

chelmsford

...on Sky news...

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By *oved Up 2Couple
over a year ago

nottingham

Lying through his teeth I'm sure

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By *amiss OP Couple
over a year ago

chelmsford

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure"

Yep, not much to add really, just lots of waffling!

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

...is a pratt

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Tbf..it was nice too see them all laughing in parliament before

The lighter side of covid

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

Unfortunately and very sadly it's the lesser of two evils.

Which is no help to the families concerned but think of how bad the covid deaths would be if it had been left to run rife unhindered with lockdown and the vaccination program?

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

Without

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Unfortunately and very sadly it's the lesser of two evils.

Which is no help to the families concerned but think of how bad the covid deaths would be if it had been left to run rife unhindered with lockdown and the vaccination program?"

Yes, to me it's like, I'm sorry your loved one died because

a) The surgeons worked tirelessly and there's nothing more they could do, or

b) The surgeon decided he'd rather play golf.

All interventions have risk, but ten deaths compared to over 100 000...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Matt Hancock is just as big a criminal as Tony Blair

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By *ierre1Man
over a year ago

Hinckley

I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech

Absolute weasel of a human. Asked three times if he signed off on the care home plan knowing it couldn't be put into place, then avoided answering the question by saying how proud he was of building a testing centre.

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is.

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By *ovebjsMan
over a year ago

Bristol

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths"

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths"

Source?

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By *otsossieMan
over a year ago

Chesterfield

10 deaths is tragic, but against how many COVID deaths per day at the peak?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Surgeons dont deal with medical cases hope this helps lol

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Surgeons dont deal with medical cases hope this helps lol"

It's an analogy. Ta

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Absolute weasel of a human. Asked three times if he signed off on the care home plan knowing it couldn't be put into place, then avoided answering the question by saying how proud he was of building a testing centre.

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is. "

Watch any of them.

They all do the same thing

They are asked a question and they simply waffle shite.

The speaker is supposed to.make them answer questions ..you.may aswell get the cat to do it .

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By *uHorny1Man
over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better."

I'm sure most of us would. Hancock has no background in Health or Social care. He had plenty of advisors but chose his own path. Also we wouldn't be helping friends and family to furnish their own pockets by supplying PPE to the NHS.

And I wouldn't be lying to anyone...

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

Matt Hancock should have been fired when he counted individual gloves as items of PPE instead of pairs , he’s smug little cunt who thinks he’s smarter than everyone else but he’s actually quite dim,,he has a larger budget than when he was Education and BIS so those in the private sector love him, thick and lots of money to give away

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better."

To be fair the No.10 cat could have done a better job!

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

And I wouldn't be lying to anyone..."

To be fair hunt did exactly the same , he made millions selling spurious ‘data services” back to the government that they didn’t want or need.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/26/firm-co-founded-by-jeremy-hunt-broke-law

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By *aitonelMan
over a year ago

Travelling

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is.

Watch any of them.

They all do the same thing

They are asked a question and they simply waffle shite.

The speaker is supposed to.make them answer questions ..you.may aswell get the cat to do it ."

The thing with Hancock is that, you can see he is spineless and has no confidence in his lies, you can see how weak and how much of a coward he is when put on the spot.

That is not a man that should have any kind of power. Half the time he doesn't even lie, he just seems to change subject but does so as if that is the answer to the question despite there being zero connection.

His answers in interviews leave you baffled.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better."

Agreed!

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is.

Watch any of them.

They all do the same thing

They are asked a question and they simply waffle shite.

The speaker is supposed to.make them answer questions ..you.may aswell get the cat to do it .

The thing with Hancock is that, you can see he is spineless and has no confidence in his lies, you can see how weak and how much of a coward he is when put on the spot.

His answers in interviews leave you baffled. "

The way he avoided the questions there today was an absolute disgrace..there was not 1 ounce of contrition.

I think whatever you think.of Cummings, he has played that brilliantly.

When the public enquiry comes around,Hancock would have no doubt be thrown under the bus.

Johnson cant do that now ,without Cummings saying I told you so.

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By *aitonelMan
over a year ago

Travelling

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

Agreed!"

No I couldn't, but I'm not the one who went in for the job and ended up woefully out of their depth and has clearly proven to be not fit for the role.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better."

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough

Roll on the next general election.

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better."

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

What are you basing that on?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Roll on the next general election."

Why ?

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

What are you basing that on?"

Lack of confidence in the competence of any political party in particular Corbyn who was still in charge at the start of the pandemic.

In all honesty I can't see any of them being able to do any better than the current shower.

We can only hope that they learn from all of this and any wrongdoing is brought to account.

But doubt that will happen.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

What are you basing that on?

Lack of confidence in the competence of any political party in particular Corbyn who was still in charge at the start of the pandemic.

In all honesty I can't see any of them being able to do any better than the current shower.

We can only hope that they learn from all of this and any wrongdoing is brought to account.

But doubt that will happen."

I genuinely dont think anyone would have done worse.Even if half of what Cummings has said was true, its been an utter car crash.

There certainly would have been less millions going missing.

I think the big difference would have probally more decisions made by the scientists..which prob wouldd have meant stricter and longer lockdowns.

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By *uHorny1Man
over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

And I wouldn't be lying to anyone...

To be fair hunt did exactly the same , he made millions selling spurious ‘data services” back to the government that they didn’t want or need.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/26/firm-co-founded-by-jeremy-hunt-broke-law"

Hunt is a nasty git, but 2 wrongs don't make a right

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Matt Hancock should have been fired when he counted individual gloves as items of PPE instead of pairs , he’s smug little cunt who thinks he’s smarter than everyone else but he’s actually quite dim,,he has a larger budget than when he was Education and BIS so those in the private sector love him, thick and lots of money to give away "

To be fair, gloves are supplied singly and not in pairs as they can used on either hand. Individual items is the only way to count because of different box sizes etc. End of pendantry

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

What are you basing that on?

Lack of confidence in the competence of any political party in particular Corbyn who was still in charge at the start of the pandemic.

In all honesty I can't see any of them being able to do any better than the current shower.

We can only hope that they learn from all of this and any wrongdoing is brought to account.

But doubt that will happen.

I genuinely dont think anyone would have done worse.Even if half of what Cummings has said was true, its been an utter car crash.

There certainly would have been less millions going missing.

I think the big difference would have probally more decisions made by the scientists..which prob wouldd have meant stricter and longer lockdowns."

And everyone whinging about their freedoms, protesting and so on ,I'm not trying to argue or disagree but it's been proved that people these days just don't like to be told what to do. So whoever was in charge would still be wrong.

And those wasted millions would have probably ended up being sent to foreign aid or to bolster the EU's fat pockets.

So still no better off.

In my humble and probably wrong opinion.

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By *ockdownerMan
over a year ago

Preston

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is. "

Cummings only confirmed what the unbiased sensible members of the general public already pretty much knew.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

What are you basing that on?

Lack of confidence in the competence of any political party in particular Corbyn who was still in charge at the start of the pandemic.

In all honesty I can't see any of them being able to do any better than the current shower.

We can only hope that they learn from all of this and any wrongdoing is brought to account.

But doubt that will happen."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is. "

Could be worse. Could have personally signed off of moving covid POSITIVE patients back into carehomes resulting in insane death rates like Nicoliar and her merry band of 'civic nationalists'

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By *aughtynigel02121980Man
over a year ago

Brandon

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure"
certainly is, his lips are moving

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Much as I dislike Cummings I can't help but believe him when he said how much of a liar Hancock is.

Could be worse. Could have personally signed off of moving covid POSITIVE patients back into carehomes resulting in insane death rates like Nicoliar and her merry band of 'civic nationalists'"

Is that relevant to what happened to care homes in England.?

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By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago

Beyond the shadows.

Is he not the nations sweetheart then ?

At least his mate Hunt left the NHS in a good state to deal with a pandemic.

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By *etWetWet453Couple
over a year ago

CAMBERLEY

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths"

I think you`ll find that there are more cases of thrombosis in women on the contraceptive pill that there are with the vaccine

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Quote of the day:

Hancock: “he doesn’t have time because he’s busy saving lives.”

Yes Matthew, busy saving lives in the same way Jeff Bezos is busy delivering parcels! Fuckwit.

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By *andare63Man
over a year ago

oldham

"Quote of the day:

Hancock: “he doesn’t have time because he’s busy saving lives.”

Yes Matthew, busy saving lives in the same way Jeff Bezos is busy delivering parcels! Fuckwit."

Is that why my new kettle hasn't arrived?

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By *igNick1381Man
over a year ago

BRIDGEND

Honestly, if I was on fire and screaming 'fuck me, I'm on fire' and a politician pointed and said 'you're on fire man' I would instantly question if I was actually on fire

Bunch of cunts

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By *hat BlokeMan
over a year ago

Harrogate

…Yet people are still saying “ I don’t think anyone else could do any better”. Have you actually seen the man who is Prime Minister and presiding over this whole shit show!

I will say no more.

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By *emmabTV/TS
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Quite Dim is being complementary to him. Total lying incompetent twat more like it.

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By *moothdickMan
over a year ago

stoke

He’s the fall guy ....

Cummins is a cunt, just like cambell was

And boris has won the 2020/21 hide and seek competition

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

I think you`ll find that there are more cases of thrombosis in women on the contraceptive pill that there are with the vaccine"

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on "

The vaccine is a slaughterhouse? Are you high?

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

I think you`ll find that there are more cases of thrombosis in women on the contraceptive pill that there are with the vaccine"

Might be the case but the vaccine just adds to that risk as well now,but which would act first the pill or the vaccine and they'll blame the pill even if it's caused by the vaccine

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on

The vaccine is a slaughterhouse? Are you high?"

Hmmm they were aware of the dangers but never put this risk out because people would've declined on getting the vaccine

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on "
have you ever read the possible side effects of paracetamol ?

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on have you ever read the possible side effects of paracetamol ? "

I know it damages the liver I avoid taking them and any other, I have read somewhere that paracetamol can cause liver disorder and possible cancer

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By *rauntonbananaMan
over a year ago

Braunton

"Roll on the next general election."

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By *rauntonbananaMan
over a year ago

Braunton

"Roll on the next general election."

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

Quite - everything has risks

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

Quite - everything has risks"

Like the general election

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

Quite - everything has risks

Like the general election

Don't blame me I voted and not for the Tories

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

How many would actually drink water so much it they know the actual colour of it

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By *he Ring WraithMan
over a year ago

Bradford

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure"

He is a politician of course he lies, why does anyone ever expect a politician or a journalist to tell the truth about anything never mind covid, they all have their own agendas and will say what gets them elected or makes them look good in print or on screen, why let the truth get in the way of a story (not even a good one)

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

Quite - everything has risks

Like the general election

Don't blame me I voted and not for the Tories

Didn't vote for them either but the best option was to at least attempt for a change to vote rather than it going in their favour should be a by-election due to ongoing enquiries and investigations.

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By *hatawasteMan
over a year ago

stafford

Hancock is who if he wasn't t in the role he is in would have got a good 'shoeing' from someone in the pub a long time ago..

He is a pathological liar and pretends he is an empath to try and cover it.. ..He is the weasel of the Tory party IMHO along with Rees Mogg .. And yes.. There are many who could have done a better job of the last years shenanigans than he has..

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

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By *amiss OP Couple
over a year ago

chelmsford

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

Yes he told a couple of porkies!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

I think Cummings was being fucked over longtime ago to a certain degree so with him already at a loss and nothing to lose and having to explain being the first one, made it or tried to make it easier on him rather than face same consequences spoke up and got the ball rolling with them now juggling words trying to explain without a positive explanation left chewing their words I noticed Boris has lost that cheeky grin all of a sudden.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

I don't

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So from a man who is never going to vote conservativ! what a job Hancock got given. You can be the health minister then a worldwide pandemic hits. Then a guy who breaks the rules brings up private conversations and runs you down

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By *ockdownerMan
over a year ago

Preston

"Quote of the day:

Hancock: “he doesn’t have time because he’s busy saving lives.”

It's fucking embarrassing.

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By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago

Beyond the shadows.

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

We don't he's not telling us much that we didn't already know.

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By *ockdownerMan
over a year ago

Preston

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

He's been long-established as the fall guy, so he'll be usefully kept in his role for some time.

Misdirecting half answers. The whole team were supporting an incoherent, dangerous mess, that put millions at risk, until the NHS vaccine success.

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job. "

But hasn't he already lied? He was hung, drawn and quartered when the whole Barnard castle fiasco happened, now suddenly he's a beacon of virtue and is single handedly bringing the government down? I think not. They all lie, let's not pretend Cummings is doing this out of concern for the UK.

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By *arakiss12TV/TS
over a year ago

Bedford

I'm not impressed with him or the government. Non of them represented us at Event 201 in October 18th 2019 as seen on YouTube. No one from our government took on board the recommendations, which would have prepared us.

Where was the Mod aren't they supposed to be monitoring chemical/ viral attacks a la recent Salisbury incident. Did they warn the goverment and were ignored?

Was the container lorry with dead illegal immigrants in October 2019 infected with virus carriers?

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

Because they want to believe what he's saying because it supports their beliefs and prejudices. Nobody is covering themselves in glory.. And continuing to lie and obfuscate is not helping anyone. I want to hear them say... We made some wrong / mistakes / bad decisions at the time we thought it was right because xyz but sorry we got it wrong.... Or it's my job to do this and I fucked up... Please forgive me but with what I've learned it helps me do a better job for you now. Etc... Nothing wrong with admitting mistakes and learning from them. We are all human.

What I find most dismaying is that as a country our institutions and processes seem to be made of feathers stick together with sticky tape. And that's on the civil service and institutions too. We wouldn't have to go to private company's all the time if we had some expertise in house. But some of the garbage that professes to be world beating systems wouldn't pass a secondary school test.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

I agree with your points but politics is very unique in that they aren’t trained to deal with stuff that arises. So I personally think we should give them a break sometimes I don’t want there job

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Probably the worst of all the ministers hancock is sly no experience in the role when are we going to see a nhs man in charge only then would you see the difference and as for saying the labour party would have been worse no one will ever know because they never got the chance

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"Probably the worst of all the ministers hancock is sly no experience in the role when are we going to see a nhs man in charge only then would you see the difference and as for saying the labour party would have been worse no one will ever know because they never got the chance"

Hancock maybe what you say. But the thought that anything or anyone from the nhs would do better is delusional. We need to stop looking at brand nhs through rise tinted glasses. Almost Every experience I have with the nhs is of poor quality and questionable clinical benefit. It is institutionalised mediocrity and we buy it all the time. There's some good. There's a lot that is bad or need improvements.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

I agree with your points but politics is very unique in that they aren’t trained to deal with stuff that arises. So I personally think we should give them a break sometimes I don’t want there job "

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By *andy 1Couple
over a year ago

northeast

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

Here here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's irrelevant to say 'Labour' or for that matter, anyone else ,would have done worse job than the current government.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

They dont.

He was a malign influence before and he is a malign influence now.

Which begs the question

. Why was is in such an exalted position before?

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

No one does.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"It's irrelevant to say 'Labour' or for that matter, anyone else ,would have done worse job than the current government. "

Course it is and not one person has an iota of evidence as it didnt happen.

They cant even provide 1 shred of evidence to say how exactly, it could be worse.

Its blatant diversion to divert attention from the car crash they are 100%responsible for.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

How Hancock is still in his role is beyond me.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

@Backformore100 that is an unusually naive comment from you!

As someone who owns a business that secures a lot of work from central Govt and has first hand experience of Civil Servants (at all levels) I can honestly tell you that there are some very intelligent, hard working and quite brilliant Civil Servants in the lower and middle mgt ranks.

The issue is that the CS doesn’t allow for career progression into the most senior roles while retaining your specialist skillset. The further up you want to go the more of a generalist you need to be. A jack of all trades but expert in none.

The other issue is pay/remuneration. During the Labour Govt there was recognition if you want the best you have to compete with private sector. In 2010 the Coalition froze CS pay and started to erode the value of the pension and other benefits because the public apparently don’t want our public sector workers to be highly paid (ie they should be grateful to work for all of us).

This led to a gradual exodus of talent who were either head hunted by the big consultancies or set up their own businesses.

There is still talent but it often gets crushed by, most often, the demands of Ministers who literally know nothing about their area of responsibility but are driven by self interest and short term “career defining” goals. Quite simply they lack long term strategic plans (as they do not fit with the political cycle).

If you want world class systems etc you need to pay for them. It seems many people are more comfortable with a smaller bill for Civil Service/public sector and large scale lucrative contracts going to private sector. You can’t have it both ways. You want better in-house expertise then pay for it through higher taxes (though that would not be great for my business).

As for NHS, I understand your personal frustration as I believe you lost your mother last year (condolences) and did not have a good experience with the NHS. That will obviously influence your perception of the NHS.

Again what I will say is that a big part of the NHS problem is the tinkering by successive govts (blue and red) that has led to increasing fragmentation and bureaucracy at the expense of a fuller focus on patient care. Partial privatisation and the “internal market” has actually created opportunities to fleece money and resource from front line care into the pockets of shareholders. The classic example is one PCT being charged £300 to change a light bulb by their private facilities contractors. Why not, you know, hire a care taker/facilities manager full time? Oh but that increases the NHS wage bill which for some reason many find unacceptable.

Govt is running down the NHS so it reaches a point where the public are in agreement it is not fit for purpose and support full privatisation.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

I don’t agree.

Corbyn and his Momentum cronies were a disaster driven by ideology rather than pragmatism. But in this case I honestly believe they would have had more compassion for the weak, poor and vulnerable.

They would have been more (overly) cautious and lockdowns would have happened sooner as their primary concern would have been people not economy. They certainly would not have been so gung ho and reckless.

They would be less influenced by big business (as not their donors) and less open to lobbying. They would also have not given over vast amounts of public money to their “friends” because they didn’t have many. Instead thing like PPE procurement would have followed the right channels (but perhaps a bit slower but cheaper and ultimately the right standard).

They would have made mistakes but probably different mistakes.

They certainly would not have been worse! I can’t see how that is possible.

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By *hat BlokeMan
over a year ago

Harrogate

Because he was right in the middle of the little nest of shit. Now he has been kicked out. He knows that if he just spouts lies and slander. It will go nowhere. So he is hitting them with the truth. It may still go nowhere… for now, but in 5 or 10 years it will all come out.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

@Backformore100 that is an unusually naive comment from you!

This led to a gradual exodus of talent who were either head hunted by the big consultancies or set up their own businesses.

Govt is running down the NHS so it reaches a point where the public are in agreement it is not fit for purpose and support full privatisation. "

I actually think we are in agreement. I have always believed you pay peanuts you get monkeys. And if you want the best you have to pay for it... And you don't deliver the best with well meaning monkeys... As you have written. At no point have I said anything different. And like all institutions I am sure there is a broad range of quality from excellence through to awful. What I have seen is the contact points between delivery and strategy are very often not staffed with people who have a clue about writing contracts, plans, budgetary Control (endless IT systems is one of many examples of this), selection, management and exit from delivery partners, change management, payment schedules and other aspects you'd expect from a half competent manager. As for the NHS.... Youre correct I did indeed lose my mum and I'm at the anger point of my cycle now... And thanks once again for your kind thoughts.. However what that has done is open my eyes.. We generally are made to feel huge appreciation, like winning the lottery when we actually get an appointment, if it runs to time it's an absolute miracle, if its with someone who is able and who is motivated to help you its even more of a miracle, every day at the moment I'm either experiencing first hand or hearing from direct family or friends of dreadful situations that could easily have been avoided and is down to a culture of accepting mediocrity is the best we can do and expect and feeling we are blessed to have got an appt let alone a remedy. We pay for this with our hard earned taxes and should expect better. And I don't believe throwing increasing money at it is the answer or even close to it. There is a cultural revolution needed... It matters... Its important... We pay for it... So start delivering it better and stop tolerating anything less. As with most things a culture of excellence and an environment that encourages delivery of it would be a good start and we all have a part to play in creating that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings?

Because he's no longer under Boris's oath of allegiance to keep his job.

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By *mmaAndDavidHornyFuckersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Out of curiosity, why does everyone suddenly believe Cummings? "

The guy believes his story to be true which is fascinating. Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson gave this guy access to everything and even backed up his Barnard Castle story. So it shows how great a judge Alexander really is whether you believe Cummings or not because he also backs Hancock now.

Long story short they are all maniacs backed by the Prime Minister at some point. Both probably aren't that reliable paragons of truth but they were put into positions of power by the PM.

Just wait and see where the money is flowing to see the real story on this and it make take decades to come out.

Wars and Viruses are great ways to justify spending public money via companies you have an interest in because the public will accept it.

They've all done it on all side of the political debate.

Have a look at Adam Curtis Oh Dear on YouTube made a while back and it really shows why people like Alexander remain popular.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

@Backformore100 not going to full quote as thread will get closed for being too long!

“What I have seen is the contact points between delivery and strategy are very often not staffed with people who have a clue about writing contracts, plans, budgetary Control (endless IT systems is one of many examples of this), selection, management and exit from delivery partners, change management, payment schedules and other aspects you'd expect from a half competent manager.”

Yes and no. The problems you identify are rife but comes back to the peanuts/monkeys.

Corporate entities pay handsomely for commercial/contracts lawyers. In any govt pitch the bidding companies are awash with them. They tie the overworked, under resourced, under skilled govt procurement people in knots. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

The highly competent who do join either do so deliberately as a stepping stone into private world commercial (inside track on lucrative contracts / play the system) or get “seduced” across.

As for NHS, I want to be careful here because for you particularly right now, things must be very raw and I would hate to say something insensitive.

So I will just say that all the consultants, GPs and nursing staff I know (I do not know loads but a fair few) are incredibly demoralised, over worked, feel under appreciated by their employer and crushed by a bureaucratic system that puts money/budget (savings) above patient care and treatment.

As a result of Brexit they have seen a huge number of EU colleagues depart. As a result of govt funding cuts they have seen a reduction in skilled people (removed grant status for nursing training) and now an ever growing vacancy list.

Again it comes down to whether the UK wants to properly fund public services. Efficiency only goes so far, eventually you have to properly invest.

People often cite Germany as a good example of a health system (with private insurance). Look at what German Govt spends per capita on healthcare compared to UK.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

* actually let me save you the time...this from ONS...

“...of the G7 group of large, developed economies, UK healthcare spending per person was the second-lowest, with the highest spenders being France (£3,737), Germany (£4,432) and the United States (£7,736).”

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Matt Hancock.. the number of vaccinations happening right now is phenomenal in bolton

Tens of thousands every single day..speech to parliament 27/05/2021

Actual figure provided by ons

The average figure is 2605..the most in 1 day is 4905.

It would be nice if someone could actually point this out

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"* actually let me save you the time...this from ONS...

We agree on much. And it's why I believe we should fundamentally alter how we fund and deliver health care. But it is too politicised to have a constructive debate. Saying the nhs needs to change is like insulting the prophet. Saying we need better Healthcare and maintenance is obvious. Saying the nhs can be some none or all of that solution. blows a lot of people's gaskets. Were our govt to fund the nhs to the similar amount as those other nations. Taxes would have to increase considerably. We won't ever accept that. We the great public won't pay fair value for anything. We know the cost and try and achieve the cheapest... And then make it cheaper. We pay 9.99 for a Ryan Air flight and then moan because its crap. Haggling and bargaining and yet know the value of nothing. We moan about customer service but demand cheaper and more product and stuff. If someone said its going to take a 10 year plan and 300 billion extra on the balance sheet to provide the healthservice we are told we need. Its just never going to happen.

Having said that. I still am far from convinced that with a bottomless pit of money, a magic wand would be waved and suddenly the three rude and ignorant reception staff at my eye consultants appt yesterday would be anything other than rude and ignorant.that the sanitizer would have been full and not empty at 930 am.. That the 4 text messages and 3 letters I received in the space of 2 weeks would have been any more accurate. And the 930 appt would have actually been at 930 and not 30 minutes late. And that the consultant would have actually washed his hands and equipment before touching me with it. None of the above is about money, its about culture.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

@Backformore100 yep I’m with you on that. This sounds defensive but it really isn’t mean to be... culture change is powerful but it has to be driven from the top and lived and breathed at every layer of an organisation.

If workers are repeatedly shown they are not valued by the government who employ them and many of the people they service, they will not have any incentive to behave in a more positive manner.

The man at the top (see what I did there - back on topic) is clearly a lying, deceitful, useless, murdering bastard whose only real interest is how he can monetise the pandemic to the benefit of self, family and friends. With him at the wheel it will be impossible to affect a positive culture change!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"…Yet people are still saying “ I don’t think anyone else could do any better”. Have you actually seen the man who is Prime Minister and presiding over this whole shit show!

I will say no more."

i think its down to a lack of faith in any of our politicians rather than a show of faith for the ones currently in power tbh

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By *andare63Man
over a year ago

oldham

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

I don’t agree.

Corbyn and his Momentum cronies were a disaster driven by ideology rather than pragmatism. But in this case I honestly believe they would have had more compassion for the weak, poor and vulnerable.

They would have made mistakes but probably different mistakes.

They certainly would not have been worse! I can’t see how that is possible."

And you know all that for a fact?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A lot of the policies that the incumbent government have implemented are socialist in nature so its quite likely that Labour may well have done more or less the same which would mean similar results.

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By *utchyjackMan
over a year ago

Newquay

Why did he wait so long to call Hancock a liar, if he didn't like what was going on he should have said at the time, he was clearly happy to go along with things at the time. Sounds like sour grapes to me.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

I don’t agree.

Corbyn and his Momentum cronies were a disaster driven by ideology rather than pragmatism. But in this case I honestly believe they would have had more compassion for the weak, poor and vulnerable.

They would have made mistakes but probably different mistakes.

They certainly would not have been worse! I can’t see how that is possible.

And you know all that for a fact? "

Nope but just as much a fact as someone stating they would have been “10 times worse”. We will never know. But we can have an informed view based on knowledge of their policies and priorities.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"A lot of the policies that the incumbent government have implemented are socialist in nature so its quite likely that Labour may well have done more or less the same which would mean similar results."

Agreed except when it comes to lockdown and border closures. Corbyn led Labour would likely have acted sooner as they would not have been able to be lobbied as hard by big businesses due to their donor base being different. Look back at what unions were calling for and that is a good indicator.

Lower death rate, worse economic impact.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

10 times worse how?

Are you saying (for example) there would have been up to now around 1,270,000 deaths, thats worse than even the worse case scenario of doing nothing (that was 500,000 deaths).

A sweeping generalisation needs some rounding out.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Lower death rate, worse economic impact. "

I heard about a study today saying that those who locked down sooner, aiming for elimination, have scored better not only on health, but also economic recovery and civil liberties.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Lower death rate, worse economic impact.

I heard about a study today saying that those who locked down sooner, aiming for elimination, have scored better not only on health, but also economic recovery and civil liberties."

i dont think something like that will ever be prove-able either way - we all have such different make up of our economy to begin with, then you lay on top different timings, strategy and problems during dealing with covid, same again with vaccine roll out, so you just diverge further and further away from being able to narrow down which part impacted what to make it comparable

its always going to be comparing apples and oranges

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Lower death rate, worse economic impact.

I heard about a study today saying that those who locked down sooner, aiming for elimination, have scored better not only on health, but also economic recovery and civil liberties.

its always going to be comparing apples and oranges"

Maybe, but they looked at it. Generally these kinds of things they think about confounding factors

Paper is Lazarus et al, SARS-CoV-2 elimination, not mitigation, creates best outcomes for health, the economy, and civil liberties, in The Lancet

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

Politics is about argument, opinion and dealing with complex matters where 'truth' isn't black and white. That's not the same as lying. I do agree that deliberately misleading people and giving 'alternative facts' is wrong and to be condemned.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

yes there are some good ethical politicians , but generally the successful ones that end up in positions of power are career politicians and the are very economical with the truth because their priority is re election and rising up the ranks

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

however we can only blame ourselves - its the public that continue to vote for them and that continue to buy papers where journalists put out click bait rubbish - it seems we get exactly what we want wether it seems like it or not

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

It's a vicious cycle. If the public placed much greater value on being a politician or journalist then more able people would be attracted to do these jobs. As you say, we get what we expect. But we should always remember that they're people with flaws just like you and me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

Flawed, idiot and corrupt?

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

You are correct, there are indeed some good and ethical politicians, on both sides of house, just a shame NONE of them are in the current Cabinet!

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By *incsladyandscotsmanCouple
over a year ago

North fife

Never in my life have I seen such a slimy, deceitful, corrupt wank as Hancock. I thought gove was bad. This guy trumps him. The fact he is utterly clueless just magnifies the issue.

Poor Johnson cannot use him as the fall guy for 150k deaths now. Cummings saw to that.

However let's put the rogues gallery up, Patel, Johnson, gove, Hancock, bullies, liars, corupt christ they even lie to the Queen!

But the English keep voting them in....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

With a number of medical practitioners now also MP’s you would think that perhaps one of them would be a better choice as Secretary for Health.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"With a number of medical practitioners now also MP’s you would think that perhaps one of them would be a better choice as Secretary for Health."

Yep you’d have thought there should be some experience and qualifications required to be a minister (just as there is for ALL other jobs). But all that is needed is that you agree with the PM of the day!

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better.

A chimps tea party would have handled it better.

I don't hold any allegiance to any political party,but I do think that labour would have been 10 time's worse if they where in power.

I don’t agree.

Corbyn and his Momentum cronies were a disaster driven by ideology rather than pragmatism. But in this case I honestly believe they would have had more compassion for the weak, poor and vulnerable.

They would have made mistakes but probably different mistakes.

They certainly would not have been worse! I can’t see how that is possible.

And you know all that for a fact? "

How would it have been worse?

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Why did he wait so long to call Hancock a liar, if he didn't like what was going on he should have said at the time, he was clearly happy to go along with things at the time. Sounds like sour grapes to me."

He told his boss at the time

What else could he do?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Matt cock*

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By *leasure4leisureMan
over a year ago

south

Just watch what will happen next

Gove and Cummings working to replace Boris ?

Even worse ;(

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By *ymguy1966Man
over a year ago

Port Talbot

"Roll on the next general election."

Why?

They are all the same ...full of bullshit with very little common sense

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Roll on the next general election.

Why?

They are all the same ...full of bullshit with very little common sense

I find it bizarre where this comes from.

If everyone thought this way we would be have a coalition gmnt every single election.

But we dont.

They are as bad as each other,yet the conservatives consistently get into power.

That makes no sense.

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By *host63Man
over a year ago

Bedfont Feltham

Anyone who voted this shower in Is a Gullible fool as far as I am concerned. You voted for us to be lied to.

And The old. "It would be worse under Labour", excuse wont hold water either. At least Corbyn cared about everyday people.

This Lot only care about themselves.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Anyone who voted this shower in Is a Gullible fool as far as I am concerned. You voted for us to be lied to.

And The old. "It would be worse under Labour", excuse wont hold water either. At least Corbyn cared about everyday people.

This Lot only care about themselves."

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

He certainly wouldnt have said of rather see dead bodies piled high in the streets than have another lockdown

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock

Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

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By *ammskiMan
over a year ago

lytham st.annes

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet."

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department)."

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

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By *ittleMissCaliWoman
over a year ago

all loved up

"Roll on the next general election.

Why ?"
I was thinking that.. as I am sure in local elections the Tories gained seats

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !"

But they dont make policy

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Roll on the next general election.

Why ? I was thinking that.. as I am sure in local elections the Tories gained seats"

Labour lost Durham Council for the first time in a 100 year which is very damning.

They have abandoned their heartlands In the North chasing the middle class vote down south.

I can't see them getting back in power unless they change that.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !"

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it."

i thought each nhs district (sorry can’t remember the proper terminology after a few drinks) did set their own policy to an extent - they just had to meet service targets set by govt? isn't that why for example folk in some places can get their std test posted to home, whereas others on here don’t get that service, and it can be a bit of postcode lottery on what options are available to you for some illnesses

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it.

Each Primary Care Trust has a high degree of delivery autonomy to determine how to allocate resources according to local conditions and priorities. What you describe is delivery strategy but when talking about Govt (in UK) that is not what “policy” means. Healthcare policy is set by Dept Health.

Same with policing. Each police force in the UK (45 of them) has autonomy to allocate budget and spend resources as they see fit (based on local priorities/conditions). But the laws and policies for crime prevention, detention etc are determined by the Home Office.

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it."

We every news article I’ve ever read in the media and that’s probably over 20 constantly claims that Wankcock’s department issued guidelines to NHS Trusts telling them to discharge patients back to care homes without mentioning testing first.

If it wasn’t true surely the government would be suing every media outlet that has reported this !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it.

If it wasn’t true surely the government would be suing every media outlet that has reported this !"

Anything media related should be taken with a pinch of salt

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"Wankcock is the most slimiest piece of scum ever put on this earth !

Oversaw the NHS sending back thousands of people with Covid19 back to care homes to infect other residents and killing them !

Never mind protecting the NHS, we need protecting from it !

Staff on the ground always do their best, but the NHS is full of some of the most incompetent policy makers on this planet.

Policy is designed and set by Department of Health (Matt Hancock is the Minister)

NHS is the delivery agency for healthcare (not a government department).

The NHS is totally funded by 20% of our income tax that we pay every month, I would say that makes it fully accountable to the government !

A) It is approx just under 19% but let’s not split hairs

B) Of course delivery agencies are accountable to Govt! They still do not make policy!

MoD make military policy to be delivered by army, navy or air force.

Home Office make policy related to crime but the police forced deliver it.

If it wasn’t true surely the government would be suing every media outlet that has reported this !

Anything media related should be taken with a pinch of salt "

Cummings said it at the Select Committee. If he is proven to have lied then he is in contempt of Parliament. He is despicable but he won’t have made such claims without evidence!

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

ONS give the figure of 66,800,000 people in the uk. 23 of them are cabinet ministers along with 4 other non-cabinet ministers who attend cabinet. any of the other 66,799,973 people in the country could done the job of managing the pandemic more effctively than those lacking in the skills who are currently in post.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

I'm really left with, what do I have the power to change?

Politics? Fuck all. I'll vote, I'll write to my MP, but they'll do what they'll do.

Economy? I'm spending locally

Local community? Volunteering

Public health? I can do a lot as an individual. I can keep my germs to myself and get jabbed.

I'm trying to put politicians in the "fuck it" box. They're gonna do what they're gonna do. I'll focus on what I can do.

(This doesn't mean I'm going to stop talking about anything though)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

Flawed, idiot and corrupt?"

No more so than the rest of the population. You find such people in all walks of life, it's just some are reported on more than most giving us a skewed view. Does your line of work not have any flawed, idiotic or corrupt people?

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

Flawed, idiot and corrupt?

Yes but they arent in the highest position in the land and responsible for our wellbeing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

Flawed, idiot and corrupt?

Yes but they arent in the highest position in the land and responsible for our wellbeing."

Then we need to take politics more seriously, make it a respectable role and attract the best. We only have ourselves to blame.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure you arm chair Health secretary's could do fucking better."

Here here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"ONS give the figure of 66,800,000 people in the uk. 23 of them are cabinet ministers along with 4 other non-cabinet ministers who attend cabinet. any of the other 66,799,973 people in the country could done the job of managing the pandemic more effctively than those lacking in the skills who are currently in post.

What a stupid comment

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"Lying through his teeth I'm sure

I think it's this sort of view that undermines democracy. There are some very good ethical politicians and journalists and some who are not. Just as you find in all walks of life.

i agree with your first paragraph but i think your second gives them too much credit

you only have to look at how they stab each other even in their own parties in the back at the first opportunity to demonstrate their only loyalties are to themselves

Flawed, idiot and corrupt?

Yes but they arent in the highest position in the land and responsible for our wellbeing.

Then we need to take politics more seriously, make it a respectable role and attract the best. We only have ourselves to blame."

There was a study many years back... About the salaries paid to politicians in different countries and also the comparative roles. The conclusion very loosely was... You pay peanuts you get monkeys. And that the going rate for ministers was much much higher. I subscribe to that viewpoint. Let's pay people and attract the best to the role. We get the politicians we deserve because we are begrudging of people being well paid for doing a good job.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

I agree. IMO MPs should be paid £120k per year BUT they should be forbidden by law from:

- Having 2nd jobs

- Accepting bungs from lobby groups/donors - oops I mean donations from supporters

- Being allowed to provide consultancy

- Being allowed to join any company for 5 years that will have won tenders/contracts while the MP (or more accurately the Minister) was in a position to influence outcomes.

- Be allowed to flip their primary residence.

There should be much stricter controls on what is and is not an acceptable expense (duck houses and heating the stables are NOT).

All MPs and candidates should have strict controls on what they can spend during an election (in fact they should all be capped and provided the same amount from a central pot).

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"I agree. IMO MPs should be paid £120k per year BUT they should be forbidden by law from:

- Having 2nd jobs

- Accepting bungs from lobby groups/donors - oops I mean donations from supporters

- Being allowed to provide consultancy

- Being allowed to join any company for 5 years that will have won tenders/contracts while the MP (or more accurately the Minister) was in a position to influence outcomes.

- Be allowed to flip their primary residence.

There should be much stricter controls on what is and is not an acceptable expense (duck houses and heating the stables are NOT).

All MPs and candidates should have strict controls on what they can spend during an election (in fact they should all be capped and provided the same amount from a central pot).

Politicians salaries... 2019..

UK: $102,364 (£77,379)

The basic salary for a member of the UK's parliament is $102,364 (£77,379). However politicians' salaries are expected to rise by a further $2,620 (£2,000) a year from April 2019.

Japan: $274,000 (£206,495)

Members of Parliament in Japan reportedly earn up to $274,000 (£206,495). Its politicians are often closely scrutinised because of their high pay and there have been recent allegations of corruption. According to the OECD, the average wage in Japan is $40,863 (£30,878), so MPs are paid over six times more than the citizens they represent.

New Zealand: $196,300 (£150,000)

New Zealand politicians are under a pay freeze enacted by current Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern in 2018, but this still leaves the average politician with a salary of NZ$288,900 (US$196,300/£150,000), according to Stuff NZ. Ardern said a pay freeze was not a matter of cutting costs but the right thing to do to increase equality in society.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

To many people £77k sounds a lot but it simply isn’t if you want to attract the best.

Ministers obviously get more but not a lot more.

Problem with today’s system is that most are not doing it for the salary or even the expenses/perks. They do it as a step along their career path knowing full well how many doors it opens and how many opportunities for self enrichment it can bring.

Hancock is a prime example. He simply cannot believe his luck! He wouldn't last 10mins in a middle mgt role in any company I have ever worked for let alone holding the top job!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"To many people £77k sounds a lot but it simply isn’t if you want to attract the best.

Ministers obviously get more but not a lot more.

Hancock is a prime example. He simply cannot believe his luck! He wouldn't last 10mins in a middle mgt role in any company I have ever worked for let alone holding the top job! "

Equally, many accomplished business people founder in politics. They find having to deal with ambiguity and competing priorities very difficult.

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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago

Brighton

"To many people £77k sounds a lot but it simply isn’t if you want to attract the best.

Ministers obviously get more but not a lot more.

Hancock is a prime example. He simply cannot believe his luck! He wouldn't last 10mins in a middle mgt role in any company I have ever worked for let alone holding the top job!

Equally, many accomplished business people founder in politics. They find having to deal with ambiguity and competing priorities very difficult. "

Some do yes but I also think there should be a law that prevents “career politicians” ie those who leave uni and become SpAds before moving on MPs. They have little or no experience of the topic areas or people they are supposed to represent. Ie no specialist skills or knowledge.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"To many people £77k sounds a lot but it simply isn’t if you want to attract the best.

Ministers obviously get more but not a lot more.

Hancock is a prime example. He simply cannot believe his luck! He wouldn't last 10mins in a middle mgt role in any company I have ever worked for let alone holding the top job!

Equally, many accomplished business people founder in politics. They find having to deal with ambiguity and competing priorities very difficult.

I also think there needs to be room for those... As you say.. Who have zero specialist or vertical knowledge but there are some, a rare few, who are just bloody good politicians.

The area of external, non democratically elected advisors also needs better policing...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"To many people £77k sounds a lot but it simply isn’t if you want to attract the best.

Ministers obviously get more but not a lot more.

Hancock is a prime example. He simply cannot believe his luck! He wouldn't last 10mins in a middle mgt role in any company I have ever worked for let alone holding the top job!

Equally, many accomplished business people founder in politics. They find having to deal with ambiguity and competing priorities very difficult.

I also think there needs to be room for those... As you say.. Who have zero specialist or vertical knowledge but there are some, a rare few, who are just bloody good politicians.

The area of external, non democratically elected advisors also needs better policing... "

I agree about a mix of MPs and Ministers. And that SpAds need regulating more.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

So...... Is he hopeless ?

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"So...... Is he hopeless ? "

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail "
so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Because he's setting up Hancock as the scapegoat for his own failures.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Good question

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Because he's setting up Hancock as the scapegoat for his own failures. "

Spot on

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Because he's setting up Hancock as the scapegoat for his own failures. "

Cummings has made that a bit problematic now

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Because he's setting up Hancock as the scapegoat for his own failures. "
yes most likely but do you think the British public would be hoodwinked so easily ? I'm certainly not and to me it's a reflection on the PM

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on "

Sad to say there will be lots more deaths too

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"So...... Is he hopeless ?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-homes-health-secretary

He should be in jail so why did De peffer leave him in charge of the health of the nation during the biggest pandemic of our times ?

Because he's setting up Hancock as the scapegoat for his own failures. yes most likely but do you think the British public would be hoodwinked so easily ? I'm certainly not and to me it's a reflection on the PM "

Yep quite easily tbh

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on "
you went to the slaughterhouse off your own free will . Silly sausage

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

I know it damages the liver I avoid taking them and any other, I have read somewhere that paracetamol can cause liver disorder and possible cancer "
obesity springs to mind for some reason ??

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

I know it damages the liver I avoid taking them and any other, I have read somewhere that paracetamol can cause liver disorder and possible cancer obesity springs to mind for some reason ??"

Paracetamol causes obesity? That's a new one

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Paracetamol damages the liver - if you overdose on it. Take it as intended and it’s harmless. So stop scaring people.

Take the vaccine or don’t - your choice - but stop making shit up and getting annoyed when others call you out on it.

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths

That’s a good man concentrate on the positives

What's positive about it we have all been sent to the slaughter house with them clearly knowing risks involved but we're saying it's clearly fine safe and so on

Sad to say there will be lots more deaths too"

There will, mostly in or because of those who choose not to get vaccinated.

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By *igboi27888Man
over a year ago

crowborough

Government are lying cunt and vaccines isn’t safe

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By *wistedTooCouple
over a year ago

Frimley

"325 cases of clots due to AZ and 10 deaths"

A very small number fortunately

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By *wistedTooCouple
over a year ago

Frimley

"Government are lying cunt and vaccines isn’t safe "

Yes, mr scientist, thank you for your incredibly knowledgeable information….

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By *wistedTooCouple
over a year ago

Frimley

"Matt Hancock is just as big a criminal as Tony Blair"

Ugh, this opinion and other paranoid ones like it are incredibly boring.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

[Removed by poster at 23/06/21 10:52:59]

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

Oh give the guy a break !

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