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Scrap social distancing in June to give people control of their lives, 22 scientists open letter

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Scrap social distancing in June to give people control of their lives, say scientists inc Prof Heneghan & Prof Anthony Brookes along with 20 others

Open letter says that 'a good society cannot be created by obsessive focus on a single cause of ill-health'

Social distancing should be abolished in June to allow people "to take back control of their own lives", a letter signed by 22 leading scientists and academics says.

The open letter states that "a good society cannot be created by obsessive focus on a single cause of ill-health" and calls for all restrictions to be lifted on June 21 – the final date in Boris Johnson's roadmap out of lockdown.

Mass community testing is also unnecessary, say the signatories, who favour a more targeted approach along with encouraging hand-washing and surface cleaning.

They are also urging the Government to scrap vaccine passports as Covid "no longer requires exceptional measures of control in everyday life".

Ending social distancing restrictions would allow family members from different households to meet up inside and give many grandparents the opportunity to hug their grandchildren for the first time in months.

The scientists – from a broad range of specialities and all sides of the political spectrum – insist the "theoretical risk" of vaccine-immune strains or a new virus surge should not outweigh the harms caused by lockdown rules, including damage to children's education and the nation's mental health.

Their comments come as it was announced that more than half the UK population has now received at least one dose of a coronavirus vaccine. Real-world data from the UK has shown the extraordinary success of the jabs, which slash infection and are also likely to cut transmission of the virus.

A number of scientists who advise the Government have signed the letter including Robert Dingwall, professor of sociology at Nottingham Trent University, who sits on the New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (Nervtag).

Other signatories include Prof Carl Heneghan, the director of the Centre for Evidence Based Medicine at Oxford University, and Prof Anthony Brookes, geneticist and health data scientist at the University of Leicester.

The scientists say face masks should not be mandatory come June 21 and that the recommendation of face coverings for schoolchildren should never have been extended after Easter. Calling for masks to be ended in classrooms by May 17, they warn that the damage to society will be too great if the current Covid control measures continue into the autumn.

Experts have warned that repeated lockdowns and restrictions have led to a mental health crisis, especially among young people. Children's mental health referrals have hit a record high.

Their calls come after senior government scientists said masks may not be needed this summer thanks to the success of the vaccine and levels of herd immunity. The optimism comes despite suggestions from some public health figures that "lower-level restrictions", like masks, could last for years.

The open letter states: "We are being told simultaneously that we have successful vaccines and that major restrictions on everyday life must continue indefinitely. Both propositions cannot be true. We need to give more weight to the data on the actual success of the vaccines and less to theoretical risks of vaccine escape and/or surge in a largely vaccinated population."

Citing official data, the letter says the vaccine programme will almost totally eliminate deaths and hospitalisations from coronavirus and become "demonstrably less fatal than seasonal influenza viruses".

It adds: "We can be very confident that they [the vaccines] will reduce Covid deaths by around 98 per cent and serious illness by 80-85 per cent" once uptake of the vaccine among vulnerable groups is completed in the forthcoming weeks.

It says face coverings should no longer be worn by schoolchildren after May 17, and "all exceptional measures to control the virus should cease no later than June 21" because unproven benefits are outweighed by "damage to mental health, education of children and young people, to people with disabilities, new entrants to the workforce and to the spontaneous personal connections from which innovation and enterprise emerge".

It adds: "All consideration of immunity documentation should cease" before concluding: "It is time to recognise that, in our substantially vaccinated population, Covid-19 will take its place among the 30 or so respiratory viral diseases with which humans have historically co-existed.

"For most vaccinated and other low-risk people, Covid-19 is now a mild endemic infection, likely to recur in seasonal waves which renew immunity without significantly stressing the NHS. Having endured the ravages of 2020, things are very different as we enter the spring of 2021. It is more than time for citizens to take back control of their own lives."

--

Source Telegraph (posted as it maybe behind a paywall for some).

I work for a local authority and all the noise come down from central goverment is we need to be ready to fully open up come the end of June.

The focus seems to be very much on finally scrapping social distancing with a full return to normal life inside the UK whilst protecting / monitoring the boarders against variants etc until other nations get to the same point.

Very much seems like the light at the end of this dark tunnel is finally in view.

KJ

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait."

June is still a while off lets see what happens one step at a time

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time.

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

Absolutely, we cannot live with homosapienophobia leading socialital rules.

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

Covid19 passport should only be used to travel overseas as their are different variants of the virus and the passport would verify what was given to you should you fall unwell as a vaccine but people need to remember there are those who are against the vaccine and this having the passport covers the airline and the passengers safety and your destination obviously will be people saying they don't want to sit on the plane if the person sitting close to them haven't had the vaccine and so on

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By *hagTonightMan
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

[Removed by poster at 25/04/21 11:10:16]

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By *hagTonightMan
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

I agree, keep it as business as usual

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Thank you for posting this OP. Many times I've been hit by the Telegraph paywall. Maybe I should pay.

I wish lockdowns and everything would end and it all be over. Realistically unlikely for a few years yet.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Nice of them to write a letter and we can't overlook the Telegraph"s ultra right wing bias in this.

I'm not sure they're saying very much though. They probably would have said much the same a year ago. A lot of people arrange a taxi to pick them up, whilst on the train, before they get to their destination, as the odds are more likely that they'll be on time.

We're a few weeks away from projected arrival at 21st June. That was supposed to be the point of ending restrictions, subject to the infections being under control.

I'm almost surprised that they didn't use the term 'muzzled', amongst the long winded narrative.

The UK has just 2 tools to counter the virus - restrictions and vaccines. Without them, the UK would be like Brazil and India. They aren't attractive places to be. We didn't get to where we are without those 2 measures, restrictions and vaccines and it's foolish to stop either of those at the wrong point.

Economy or population health? The economy is nothing without the health of the people - it's stupid to pretend otherwise and it's a rehash of the argument we've heard from the start.

I hope that the expert advice to the government remains appropriate and that the government takes it. It may mean that we have some fine tuning but we've got millions of vaccinations still to do, before we can even think about getting towards herd immunity, which is a useful conceptual goal, even if it's not attained. I'd prefer to not bow to pressure to do the wrong things yet again, as we end lockdown and restrictions. It has been set as the final restrictions period, not 1 to trash and have to repeat.

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By *atnip make me purrWoman
over a year ago

Reading

I hope for this to happen. I know some people are deeply fearful but we need now to be put in charge of the decisions. If not June then when?

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By *ynecplCouple
over a year ago

Newcastle upon Tyne

There comes a point where restrictions have to be lifted and I would say that is when everyone has been offered the first vaccine. After that we have to move on and manage our lives with covid as a possible illness like so many others.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

I think it's naive to say "open it up" and that things will just be wonderful. Disease will rise - and yes, large portions of older people might be vaccinated, but it'll then hit the young who are the tax base (less likely to die, but these people always omit disability from their calculations). I sure as fuck won't go out under those circumstances.

Responsible community groups would probably go remote again, wreaking utter havoc on the mental health of those they serve.

The health system would be put back under strain - and fuck, haven't we put the NHS through enough?!

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I hope for this to happen. I know some people are deeply fearful but we need now to be put in charge of the decisions. If not June then when? "

When it's safe at a population level, as determined by the *data*.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

but also health cannot function without economy. hand in hand. I see the opposing views come from people who have been locked inside rather than people who have been out and about.

conditions like cancer and dementia and so many others have suffered sometimes mother nature culls her offspring.

i support measures and have worked front line in the Covid fight but the line in the sand is very near

d

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

Naaa I'm good thanks OP I am willing to wait a few more weeks.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"but also health cannot function without economy. hand in hand. I see the opposing views come from people who have been locked inside rather than people who have been out and about.

conditions like cancer and dementia and so many others have suffered sometimes mother nature culls her offspring.

i support measures and have worked front line in the Covid fight but the line in the sand is very near

d"

People have been saying "line in the sand" for so long. Until what? More people throw their toys out of the pram?

Health relies on the economy, economy relies on health. And here we are, with a good vaccination program, getting ever closer to a point where we might be able to put it all behind us.

I'm sick of this too. I know I'm a big lockdown lover around here, or so I'm labelled - but I want this to be over. The difference between the "tiny risk of death, open it up" crowd and me is that I'm worried about the casualties.

Cancer - treatment reduces your immune system. So are they safe to be treated without this disease under control?

Dementia - age reduces your immune system. So Ethel (random name) has been jabbed, good - but her body hasn't built an immune response. Her granddaughter who is caring for her catches Covid, Ethel dies an agonising death.

... Or we can wait a bit longer until the risk is much lower.

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock

The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up.

I’ve visited 6 hospitals since the start of January to look at refurbishment works and I expected to be issued with a hazmat suit to enter, but all I got was a slash of sanitiser, roll your sleeves up and wear a mask and these were in live hospitals and 3 of them in A&E departments, yes the hospitals were busy at the start of the year but not once did I get the impression I was in a war zone field hospital like in MASH and what the media keep ramming down our throat !

The more the media and the government keep pushing we are still not safe yet message the harder it will ever be for people to live a like of normality again. Restrictions will be pushed back and back and then it’s autumn again and we all have to lockdown because we need to protect the NHS, even though we’ve never done that ever, even when we had 60,000 excess flu death s a couple of years back.

People including the government and SAGE have loved the controlling power they have had over the population and their movements, can you see the ‘COVID Marshalls’ as I witnessed yesterday at an open air market give that control up in a hurry ? - I can’t see it myself.

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By *imes_berksMan
over a year ago

Bracknell


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait."

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded "

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

Vaccine manufacturers are corrupt and can't possibly tell the truth about anything ever, except vaccine side effect inserts, they're Gospel truth sent from God because vaccines are icky

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By *oubleswing2019Man
over a year ago

Colchester

If you want an idea of where this will lead, look no further than the other main news regarding Delhi at the moment.

But wait you say, with the high uptake of vaccinations, we don't get to that level.

And yes, I agree with you.

But factor in new variants that have vaccine-evading mutations, and our trajectory for infections will sky-rocket.

You don't win a war until the enemy had been effectively neutralised. Covid-19 has not been neutralised.

It's like waves of enemies attacking a fortified position. We may have seen a few waves off, but the enemy is still out there, and formulating new angles of attack (mutations).

We are far from over with this.

Another other point in the article

It adds: "We can be very confident that they [the vaccines] will reduce Covid deaths by around 98 per cent and serious illness by 80-85 per cent" once uptake of the vaccine among vulnerable groups is completed in the forthcoming weeks.

This does not address Long Covid.

It's throwing human lives to the wolves.

And what would you do, Mr DS, before anyone asks ?

Entrench, Fortify, Protect, Defend, Assess, and take measured and careful steps to research existing and new variants so we are ready for the next waves. No surprises. Each time we advance, we do on solid ground.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Unlock everything now! Virtually no one is being admitted to hospital and certainly very few deaths. Remember that the figures are deaths WITH Covid not OF Covid. All the elderly and vulnerable have now been vaccinated (the group we were told protect) and even if the younger people get it they very rarely get ill.

Enough with all the negatiivity in the MSM. You never hear anyone in the MSM saying 'well done' we've done everything that's been asked of us. In a week where we were told we are no longer in a pandemic what do the MSM focus on.... India! Whilst it's awful what's happening there, it ain't happening here and as long as anyone entering our country is regulated, as they appear to be, then it won't be an issue.

In the words of the author Stephen King "it's time to get busy living or get busy dying"

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By *irky_coupleCouple
over a year ago

kirky

Was talking to a friend who was helping me with my business while he was on furlough about this and he made what I thought was a valid point. How are all those that have sat on their arse for the past year getting 80% wages going to manage having to get back into the work ethic for a full wage? I'm all for precautions when necessary but there's going too far and cause a whole heap of problems on the other side.

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock


"Was talking to a friend who was helping me with my business while he was on furlough about this and he made what I thought was a valid point. How are all those that have sat on their arse for the past year getting 80% wages going to manage having to get back into the work ethic for a full wage? I'm all for precautions when necessary but there's going too far and cause a whole heap of problems on the other side."

5 million at the moment and I bet a lot of those hope for another wave as furlough has become the latest lifestyle choice !

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By *hagTonightMan
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.


"Unlock everything now! Virtually no one is being admitted to hospital and certainly very few deaths. Remember that the figures are deaths WITH Covid not OF Covid. All the elderly and vulnerable have now been vaccinated (the group we were told protect) and even if the younger people get it they very rarely get ill.

Enough with all the negatiivity in the MSM. You never hear anyone in the MSM saying 'well done' we've done everything that's been asked of us. In a week where we were told we are no longer in a pandemic what do the MSM focus on.... India! Whilst it's awful what's happening there, it ain't happening here and as long as anyone entering our country is regulated, as they appear to be, then it won't be an issue.

In the words of the author Stephen King "it's time to get busy living or get busy dying" "
This

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

Need to get back to normal soon as , we have the vaccine the older people are now protected, those who want to wear masks they can just carry on but for those who have never thought there anything but Looking like the Government can actually control the virus we should now stop wearing them . Get everything open as well

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"Was talking to a friend who was helping me with my business while he was on furlough about this and he made what I thought was a valid point. How are all those that have sat on their arse for the past year getting 80% wages going to manage having to get back into the work ethic for a full wage? I'm all for precautions when necessary but there's going too far and cause a whole heap of problems on the other side.

5 million at the moment and I bet a lot of those hope for another wave as furlough has become the latest lifestyle choice !"
That’s right plenty of people don’t want this lockdown lark to end

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up. "

that really has nothing to do with covid, the lockdown just sped up what had been progressing for a long time and forced companies to concede it was possible

you could open tomorrow of in 5 years time and it wont change those attitudes as its based on cost cutting for business and a work life balance for employees

personally i want to be back in an office , but trying to lay blame for this on covid is just stupid

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Was talking to a friend who was helping me with my business while he was on furlough about this and he made what I thought was a valid point. How are all those that have sat on their arse for the past year getting 80% wages going to manage having to get back into the work ethic for a full wage? I'm all for precautions when necessary but there's going too far and cause a whole heap of problems on the other side."

Good point. I was only furloughed for a few months but it was great. Like being retired! Money issues were bad but it was difficult having to go back to work. I'd rather just sit on my arse all day.

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By *orty-coupleCouple
over a year ago

Leyland

Damn right, open every thing up as per normal. The scared ones can stay at home as long as they like.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Big problem with scrapping social distancing is some people are stupid and we’ll end up, same as other countries have, back in full lockdown again, younger people are catching the new strains of Covid, we need to think carefully and I know people won’t like me saying that, we’re all fed up with the situation but common sense is called for and two sniffs of the barmaid apron , people turn into idiots, we’ve all seen the photos

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


" The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up.

that really has nothing to do with covid, the lockdown just sped up what had been progressing for a long time and forced companies to concede it was possible

you could open tomorrow of in 5 years time and it wont change those attitudes as its based on cost cutting for business and a work life balance for employees

personally i want to be back in an office , but trying to lay blame for this on covid is just stupid "

Convenient rhetoric.

Air pollution? Covid

Cancer? Covid

Rise of Amazon? Covid

Unrest in Northern Ireland? Covid

North Korea is a hell hole? Covid

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

"

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

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By *lex46TV/TS
over a year ago

Near Wells

I completely agree, life needs to return to some kind of normality as soon as possible.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this"

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness."

That is human nature, we want to go back to what we all enjoyed doing, it doesn't have to be the same thing and it is no less important.

If you don't like others trivialising what you say maybe don't do the same thing to others.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

That is human nature, we want to go back to what we all enjoyed doing, it doesn't have to be the same thing and it is no less important.

If you don't like others trivialising what you say maybe don't do the same thing to others.

"

I think it's hilarious and telling.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

Maybe they think the same

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By *arakiss12TV/TS
over a year ago

Bedford

Shame the rest of the world isn`t at our level. India, Brasil Africa, Middle East and America now Japan are highly infected still with new variants sprouting up all over the place.

Luton is up 17% which in real terms is probably around 25-30%.

People sneeking in and out of the country, yep I`ve heard their planes at 2, 3 in the morning.

The scientists should know better, the dinglings.

I`m not planning meeting until 2022 and then that depends on the rest of the world.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

"

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"Maybe they think the same

"

Then I'm sure we'll continue to amuse one another.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then"

And that is your right to do so. What I don't want is other people castagating those who don't do the same.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Shame the rest of the world isn`t at our level. India, Brasil Africa, Middle East and America now Japan are highly infected still with new variants sprouting up all over the place.

Luton is up 17% which in real terms is probably around 25-30%.

People sneeking in and out of the country, yep I`ve heard their planes at 2, 3 in the morning.

The scientists should know better, the dinglings.

I`m not planning meeting until 2022 and then that depends on the rest of the world."

cargo flights have always run at night - sure we have too many people freely moving over the border but they are not being sneaked in under the cover of dark

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then

And that is your right to do so. What I don't want is other people castagating those who don't do the same. "

Then I suggest you don't look. Opinions exist which differ from yours.

I can and will be staying away - what are we doing for those whose livelihoods cannot be carried out from home, who are afraid for themselves and loved ones, in a situation which is not yet over?

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then

And that is your right to do so. What I don't want is other people castagating those who don't do the same. "

I didn't

However, if they say we have to keep a social distance and people ignore that I would be castigating then

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"Maybe they think the same

Then I'm sure we'll continue to amuse one another."

Don't you see that it doesn't help the discussion from either party?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"Maybe they think the same

Then I'm sure we'll continue to amuse one another.

Don't you see that it doesn't help the discussion from either party?"

I'm at a loss to what will. Genuinely. We are so close and we've all suffered so much - myself included. I desperately want some semblance of normality. I want to hug my mum and see my living grandparent again, and I'm starting to wonder if that'll happen before 2023 (for those who say "just go back to Australia", you got a spare $A6-20k I can have, plus completely restarting my fairly new indefinite leave in the UK, plus a way to make me skip the queue of 40 000 stranded Australians?). I want the vulnerable people I serve in the community to feel and be safe to come out again. And I live alone and barely leave the house. I'm *suffering*. But I'm doing what I can to not make this worse.

We're unlocking. It's getting better. But if we go too quickly the long term effects could be devastating.

I'd rather suffer more and come out safely in June, or October, or whatever, than let it rip now and have another hard lockdown in a few months. No one wants another lockdown. No one.

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By *ornucopiaMan
over a year ago

Bexley


"... two sniffs of the barmaid apron , people turn into idiots, we’ve all seen the photos "

'turn into idiots'? Predisposed, more likely.

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By *heHookyMonsterMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time."

Absolutely. We're close enough to stay the course now. I'm not in favour of us dropping our guard and risking going into yet another rise that results in the risk of a lockdown. Let's make this current one the last.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"

We're unlocking. It's getting better. But if we go too quickly the long term effects could be devastating.

I'd rather suffer more and come out safely in June, or October, or whatever, than let it rip now and have another hard lockdown in a few months. No one wants another lockdown. No one."

This I do agree with

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By *ucka39Man
over a year ago

Newcastle

The UK has just 2 tools to counter the virus - restrictions and vaccines. Without them, the UK would be like Brazil and India. They aren't attractive places to be. We didn't get to where we are without those 2 measures, restrictions and vaccines and it's foolish to stop either of those at the wrong point.

Economy or population health? The economy is nothing without the health of the people - it's stupid to pretend otherwise and it's a rehash of the argument we've heard from the start.

This I totally agree with as you can't have one without the other the economy is created by humans without you get left with more debts and would fail miserably because deaths cause depression and anxiety you have to save the population to maintain a good standard of economy so the wheel keep turning the economy can suffer but also rebuilt.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 25/04/21 13:28:23]

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

All this report to me anyway is saying that come June 21st when the government road map plans to unlock the UK fully and end social distancing is that it needs to happen then (not right this minute).

All the data shows the vaccines are doing an incredible job and daily covid deaths have been at the level we have always accepted for flu for a while now.

Schools going back haven't increased figures in fact daily infections are lower now than just before the schools opened a month back.

If the hospital rates continue to hold and daily death figures remain low / stable then yes we need to get back to our normal lives.

By the end of July every adult in the UK will have had the chance of a vaccine.

In my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st.

KJ

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"... two sniffs of the barmaid apron , people turn into idiots, we’ve all seen the photos

'turn into idiots'? Predisposed, more likely."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

All this report to me anyway is saying that come June 21st when the government road map plans to unlock the UK fully and end social distancing is that it needs to happen then (not right this minute).

All the data shows the vaccines are doing an incredible job and daily covid deaths have been at the level we have always accepted for flu for a while now.

Schools going back haven't increased figures in fact daily infections are lower now than just before the schools opened a month back.

If the hospital rates continue to hold and daily death figures remain low / stable then yes we need to get back to our normal lives.

By the end of July every adult in the UK will have had the chance of a vaccine.

In my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st.

KJ"

Agree with this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" n my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st. "

i am not sure if it was purposefully implied , but this suggests you only think those who had to leave the house to go to work did any work for the last year

ive also worked the whole way through, at some points almost double the hours i would have pre lockdown (and we don’t get over time) , i work from home and i hate it , i also live alone so i am isolated and have struggled more with my mental health than i ever have before in my life

but yes i still think we need to be sensible about what opens and when rather than just throw everything wide to the world because some folk have a bee in their bonnet about the fact they have had to be out in the open all the way through - you fail to have taken into account there were less people around you because half of us were at home and everyone has been doing their bit which also kept you safer

this suggesting that folk at home have had the time of their life sat on their ass stuff is just lazy and short sighted

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By *oubleswing2019Man
over a year ago

Colchester


"In my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue."

And some folks have worked fully from home, created nice work environments to do so and are happy and more productive in their labours.

Mrs. DS's company have saved over a million quid in the last 12 months by not having to pay staff expenses for travelling to work. That's pure profit on the bottom line.

The bean-counters at her place of work have noticed this, as have the Directors, and it's highly debatable if they really need the office space any more.

Cost-savings for insurance/heating & utilities / security and other building ownership costs are not factored in to that million quid either, so if they do ditch their premises, greater savings are there for the taking.

They have even discussed opening a smaller "drop in hub" for the few who do require an office and don't have the space at home. (As well as the weird extrovert types who positively must have other humans around them to do their work) #tongueincheek

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


" n my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st.

i am not sure if it was purposefully implied , but this suggests you only think those who had to leave the house to go to work did any work for the last year

ive also worked the whole way through, at some points almost double the hours i would have pre lockdown (and we don’t get over time) , i work from home and i hate it , i also live alone so i am isolated and have struggled more with my mental health than i ever have before in my life

but yes i still think we need to be sensible about what opens and when rather than just throw everything wide to the world because some folk have a bee in their bonnet about the fact they have had to be out in the open all the way through - you fail to have taken into account there were less people around you because half of us were at home and everyone has been doing their bit which also kept you safer

this suggesting that folk at home have had the time of their life sat on their ass stuff is just lazy and short sighted "

I make no suggestions and imply nothing.

We have over 1000 employees of which roughly 3 quarters are working from home full time or furloughed. I work with many of them directly and the union who represents them. It's a fact that almost 80% disagree with the Boris roadmap and the expectation that they need return to their normal place of work on June 21st.no opinion just a fact as its recently been assessed via staff surveys.

Now about a quarter of staff (key workers, social care, mental health teams, essential services etc) have all been back since may 2020. Of that group over 95% believe in the governments roadmap and lifting of all restrictions on June 21st.

All I have done is related the facts as per my workplace that has a wide cross section of different types of jobs / workers.

I have not disclosed my own personal opinion in my post you responded to but I'll say this, I was extremely thankful to fall into the group who worked right the way through the pandemic.

KJ

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" n my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st.

i am not sure if it was purposefully implied , but this suggests you only think those who had to leave the house to go to work did any work for the last year

ive also worked the whole way through, at some points almost double the hours i would have pre lockdown (and we don’t get over time) , i work from home and i hate it , i also live alone so i am isolated and have struggled more with my mental health than i ever have before in my life

but yes i still think we need to be sensible about what opens and when rather than just throw everything wide to the world because some folk have a bee in their bonnet about the fact they have had to be out in the open all the way through - you fail to have taken into account there were less people around you because half of us were at home and everyone has been doing their bit which also kept you safer

this suggesting that folk at home have had the time of their life sat on their ass stuff is just lazy and short sighted

I make no suggestions and imply nothing.

We have over 1000 employees of which roughly 3 quarters are working from home full time or furloughed. I work with many of them directly and the union who represents them. It's a fact that almost 80% disagree with the Boris roadmap and the expectation that they need return to their normal place of work on June 21st.no opinion just a fact as its recently been assessed via staff surveys.

Now about a quarter of staff (key workers, social care, mental health teams, essential services etc) have all been back since may 2020. Of that group over 95% believe in the governments roadmap and lifting of all restrictions on June 21st.

All I have done is related the facts as per my workplace that has a wide cross section of different types of jobs / workers.

I have not disclosed my own personal opinion in my post you responded to but I'll say this, I was extremely thankful to fall into the group who worked right the way through the pandemic.

KJ"

well you referred to your group as “the group” that worked all the way the through, that in turn implies you don’t think people in other groups including those at home were working

the staff survey you see the results of about returning to offices really has absolutely nothing to do with covid - those changes are happening now wether we like it or not (speaking as someone desperate to get back to an office), the flexible/ remote working genie is out of the bottle and the office life 9-5 is something we are not likely to see again in many industries

look at your wording, you are crossing over 2 issues and selling them as one - group 1 have expressed they disagree with boris opinion that they need to be back in their place of work in june , group 2 agree with the roadmap to lift restrictions - these are not 2 mutually exclusive activities or view points but you have pitted them against each other

confusing peoples opinions on covid health measures with what they want their work life balance to look like going forward isn’t helpful

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Person A says something

Person B says you meant xyz

Person A says I didn’t say xyz

Person B says I think it’s what you meant.

The internet.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


" n my place of work there are some still on furlow and many working from home full time. They majority of them tend to make up the group of employees that want lockdowns, restrictions, working from home, furlough to continue.

I fall into the group of staff who have worked right throughout the pandemic and they pretty much to a person want life to return to normal come June 21st.

i am not sure if it was purposefully implied , but this suggests you only think those who had to leave the house to go to work did any work for the last year

ive also worked the whole way through, at some points almost double the hours i would have pre lockdown (and we don’t get over time) , i work from home and i hate it , i also live alone so i am isolated and have struggled more with my mental health than i ever have before in my life

but yes i still think we need to be sensible about what opens and when rather than just throw everything wide to the world because some folk have a bee in their bonnet about the fact they have had to be out in the open all the way through - you fail to have taken into account there were less people around you because half of us were at home and everyone has been doing their bit which also kept you safer

this suggesting that folk at home have had the time of their life sat on their ass stuff is just lazy and short sighted

I make no suggestions and imply nothing.

We have over 1000 employees of which roughly 3 quarters are working from home full time or furloughed. I work with many of them directly and the union who represents them. It's a fact that almost 80% disagree with the Boris roadmap and the expectation that they need return to their normal place of work on June 21st.no opinion just a fact as its recently been assessed via staff surveys.

Now about a quarter of staff (key workers, social care, mental health teams, essential services etc) have all been back since may 2020. Of that group over 95% believe in the governments roadmap and lifting of all restrictions on June 21st.

All I have done is related the facts as per my workplace that has a wide cross section of different types of jobs / workers.

I have not disclosed my own personal opinion in my post you responded to but I'll say this, I was extremely thankful to fall into the group who worked right the way through the pandemic.

KJ

well you referred to your group as “the group” that worked all the way the through, that in turn implies you don’t think people in other groups including those at home were working

the staff survey you see the results of about returning to offices really has absolutely nothing to do with covid - those changes are happening now wether we like it or not (speaking as someone desperate to get back to an office), the flexible/ remote working genie is out of the bottle and the office life 9-5 is something we are not likely to see again in many industries

look at your wording, you are crossing over 2 issues and selling them as one - group 1 have expressed they disagree with boris opinion that they need to be back in their place of work in june , group 2 agree with the roadmap to lift restrictions - these are not 2 mutually exclusive activities or view points but you have pitted them against each other

confusing peoples opinions on covid health measures with what they want their work life balance to look like going forward isn’t helpful "

The reason people don't want to return to the office has a great deal to do with covid sorry. If you read the reports and reasons stated by the first group this would be clear as day.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56795862.amp

Many sectors including ourselves has found that remote working has not been all it was thought in the early days of the pandemic. Many people simply don't have the discipline to do it effectively and after an early surge productivity is down across the board in my workplace. Many companies I work with are desperate to get thier staff back into the office.

Personal greater flexibility and blended working (part office part home) is a more likely legacy.

Even most of silicone valley has done an about turn on home working now.

KJ

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By *xhib12Man
over a year ago

Blyth


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait."

You need to understand exactly what HCID means. It's not as straightforward as some people think. It has a very specific meaning which is why covid was no longer considered.

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By *ee And MikeCouple
over a year ago

Cannock


" The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up.

that really has nothing to do with covid, the lockdown just sped up what had been progressing for a long time and forced companies to concede it was possible

you could open tomorrow of in 5 years time and it wont change those attitudes as its based on cost cutting for business and a work life balance for employees

personally i want to be back in an office , but trying to lay blame for this on covid is just stupid "

That’s totally incorrect, BT took a lease on 8 floors of new offices in Birmingham before the pandemic startedand the Manchester skyline was littered with new build office buildings, most pre-let. The pandemic might have changed the ‘working from home’ mindset but that wasn’t the case before it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up.

that really has nothing to do with covid, the lockdown just sped up what had been progressing for a long time and forced companies to concede it was possible

you could open tomorrow of in 5 years time and it wont change those attitudes as its based on cost cutting for business and a work life balance for employees

personally i want to be back in an office , but trying to lay blame for this on covid is just stupid

That’s totally incorrect, BT took a lease on 8 floors of new offices in Birmingham before the pandemic startedand the Manchester skyline was littered with new build office buildings, most pre-let. The pandemic might have changed the ‘working from home’ mindset but that wasn’t the case before it."

it was the mindset of more progressive companies, and it was on the cards just maybe a decade down the line

lots of companies already ran offices at 80% capacity where you had to work from home on a rota because it gave them a cost saving while still having most of the control of the schedule , the reason it wasn’t more time at home was largely down to fear that without the on site supervision the work wouldn’t get done - companies were scared to take the chance and the leap until a pandemic forced them to

BT are running mostly contact centres which yes might be slightly different from just general office working

anyway i don’t want to get into an argument pro home working because actually i hate it so am not the person to do that , but i am not naive enough to kid myself on that the across the board resistance to go back to an office is covid related or that we should expect the board room and the workforce to have the same thoughts on this because obviously their interests are competing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" The problem is that the ‘cult of Covid19’ propagation is still rife in our society.

We have friends in the public and private sectors that want to work from home forever, not worrying that the infrastructure of businesses around where they used to work will collapse and fold up.

that really has nothing to do with covid, the lockdown just sped up what had been progressing for a long time and forced companies to concede it was possible

you could open tomorrow of in 5 years time and it wont change those attitudes as its based on cost cutting for business and a work life balance for employees

personally i want to be back in an office , but trying to lay blame for this on covid is just stupid

That’s totally incorrect, BT took a lease on 8 floors of new offices in Birmingham before the pandemic startedand the Manchester skyline was littered with new build office buildings, most pre-let. The pandemic might have changed the ‘working from home’ mindset but that wasn’t the case before it.

it was the mindset of more progressive companies, and it was on the cards just maybe a decade down the line

lots of companies already ran offices at 80% capacity where you had to work from home on a rota because it gave them a cost saving while still having most of the control of the schedule , the reason it wasn’t more time at home was largely down to fear that without the on site supervision the work wouldn’t get done - companies were scared to take the chance and the leap until a pandemic forced them to

BT are running mostly contact centres which yes might be slightly different from just general office working

anyway i don’t want to get into an argument pro home working because actually i hate it so am not the person to do that , but i am not naive enough to kid myself on that the across the board resistance to go back to an office is covid related or that we should expect the board room and the workforce to have the same thoughts on this because obviously their interests are competing "

oh and the company i work for are one of those big companies putting a new office building in my cities skyline currently - but we have atill been getting emails for a year now where the tone has very heavily been towards permanent home working now , only with huge pushback from the staff are we getting sounds that we might get closer to a more flexible approach but still unlikely to even be 50/50

it has benefits and drawbacks both for employers and employees , but all of the chats about office working we have start with “after covid” - lockdown might have started the behaviour but it is no longer driving this conversation

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There’s a reason why companies pay premium city centre rental, it’s because they want to give the impression that they are a premium company.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"I hope for this to happen. I know some people are deeply fearful but we need now to be put in charge of the decisions. If not June then when?

When it's safe at a population level, as determined by the *data*."

Problem with the data , it’s all rubbish. I mean matt Hancock couldn’t even count in pairs could he? Spend any time in any public sector area and you will see how an incompetent civil service produces whatever data the private companies that run things tell them

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By *ancelot1633Man
over a year ago

weybridge

Opinions are like arses, we all have them, some look great and can certainly turn our heads but in many cases they are better kept to yourself and sat upon. Why are the crazy ones always the loudest ?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I hope for this to happen. I know some people are deeply fearful but we need now to be put in charge of the decisions. If not June then when?

When it's safe at a population level, as determined by the *data*.

Problem with the data , it’s all rubbish. I mean matt Hancock couldn’t even count in pairs could he? Spend any time in any public sector area and you will see how an incompetent civil service produces whatever data the private companies that run things tell them"

I didn't say "the data produced by politicians".

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

I thought this was the plan already?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I thought this was the plan already? "

I think it’s just a counter argument to some in the scientific field that are more pessimistic.

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley


"I thought this was the plan already?

I think it’s just a counter argument to some in the scientific field that are more pessimistic."

Oh I see. Well, things seem to be heading in the right direction so I can't see why the roadmap won't happen as planned.

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By *lym4realCouple
over a year ago

plymouth

Seems that everyone is a "Expert" since this all started ?? and mrs4 pet theory on blood flow is being proved more right as this drags on ..and don't blame the "Scientists " if you want to cast blame ?? blame Boris and co for this awful mess we find ourselves in as due to their in action ......

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central


"I hope for this to happen. I know some people are deeply fearful but we need now to be put in charge of the decisions. If not June then when?

When it's safe at a population level, as determined by the *data*.

Problem with the data , it’s all rubbish. I mean matt Hancock couldn’t even count in pairs could he? Spend any time in any public sector area and you will see how an incompetent civil service produces whatever data the private companies that run things tell them"

The Office for National Statistics is 1 of the key bodies producing data. We have the data that we have, so unless we want to bury our heads in the sand, that's what we have to work with.

The infection levels are falling, as are deaths. The opposite is true for the rising number of people who have been vaccinated and have immunity.

This unusual letter, seems like deja vu, akin to the many desperate calls to open things up. The fact that they seem to be asking for what's planned is a bit of a non-story.

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid "

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid?

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

[Removed by poster at 25/04/21 19:00:10]

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid?"
let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??"

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill?

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill?"
82.4 what don’t you understand?

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??"

Oh, they DESERVED to die, tough luck... OK fine, I'm converted.

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

Oh, they DESERVED to die, tough luck... OK fine, I'm converted. "
who said they deserved to die ? don’t make things up 82. 4 is the average age of death from Covid

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill? 82.4 what don’t you understand? "

You don't seem to understand it's actually 80.4 according to the ONS on January 11th.

If you're going to make such supposedly self evident points, you could at least use the right number. A number that is LOWER than the average life expectancy, so is therefore reasonable to state IS killing people "before their time" statistically.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill? 82.4 what don’t you understand?

You don't seem to understand it's actually 80.4 according to the ONS on January 11th.

If you're going to make such supposedly self evident points, you could at least use the right number. A number that is LOWER than the average life expectancy, so is therefore reasonable to state IS killing people "before their time" statistically."
82.4 unless you prove otherwise

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness."

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill? 82.4 what don’t you understand? "

I understand plenty.

What don't *you* don't understand about medium to long term disability and the effect it'll have on the economy? People who might not be able to work again because Covid meant they lost 10+ IQ points or are left with delirium, people who need to take three breaks to get up a flight of stairs because their lungs have been basically destroyed.

Ok, most of the people who die are old, and for whatever reason you think that means it's unimportant. Does that mean that it's ok for working age adults or children to be saddled with disabilities?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe"

I'm suffering too. As noted.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill? 82.4 what don’t you understand?

You don't seem to understand it's actually 80.4 according to the ONS on January 11th.

If you're going to make such supposedly self evident points, you could at least use the right number. A number that is LOWER than the average life expectancy, so is therefore reasonable to state IS killing people "before their time" statistically. 82.4 unless you prove otherwise "

Read at the ONS report on January 11th, just like I said. How the hell do you get state 82.4 without providing evidence and then refuse to consider you might be wrong without someone else providing evidence to the level you didn't offer either?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe"

That is NOT "THE" problem.

And a lot of people are NOT suffering because of it. A lot of people have found it to be a MASSIVE boost to their mental health for a myriad of other reasons. Don't cling on to presumptions about mental health to try and support your flimsy cases.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

To be honest, all of the wants/demands where ever they come from are largely irrelevant. The government will know what various people want and what their scientific advice says... then they will do whatever they want. The letters/protests will not make any difference.

Cal

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

So disability doesn't matter? Most people with long Covid are working age, even children. What will that do to the economy? The benefits bill? 82.4 what don’t you understand?

You don't seem to understand it's actually 80.4 according to the ONS on January 11th.

If you're going to make such supposedly self evident points, you could at least use the right number. A number that is LOWER than the average life expectancy, so is therefore reasonable to state IS killing people "before their time" statistically. 82.4 unless you prove otherwise

Read at the ONS report on January 11th, just like I said. How the hell do you get state 82.4 without providing evidence and then refuse to consider you might be wrong without someone else providing evidence to the level you didn't offer either?"
God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"To be honest, all of the wants/demands where ever they come from are largely irrelevant. The government will know what various people want and what their scientific advice says... then they will do whatever they want. The letters/protests will not make any difference.

Cal"

Agreed.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted."

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 "

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with".

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted.

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all "

Ok, so I overstated it.

We've got something with unknown long term effects and a way to limit it. I'm well aware there'll be sequelae from lockdown, but I believe they're largely reversible. Death, significant lung damage, neurological damage (seizures, psychosis, significant IQ loss), etc - generally isn't.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted.

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all "

India has car parks full of burning funeral pyres and bodies starting to line the streets, and you don't think an effective lock-down achieved anything?

Christ, these people...

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with"."

11 January 2021 FOI on ONS says 80.4 mean age of death, further split by gender, median also exists.

Long Covid, less clear, but appears to be working age women most at risk.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with"."
ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted.

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all

India has car parks full of burning funeral pyres and bodies starting to line the streets, and you don't think an effective lock-down achieved anything?

Christ, these people... "

I think people don't realise that we came close

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude"

I gave 1 number and cited one source. You gave 2 different numbers, with no source.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude

I gave 1 number and cited one source. You gave 2 different numbers, with no source."
Ha ha you are so out of touch, 82.2 is the average age of Covid death, been on here for at least a year , obviously your a newcomer LOL

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude

I gave 1 number and cited one source. You gave 2 different numbers, with no source. Ha ha you are so out of touch, 82.2 is the average age of Covid death, been on here for at least a year , obviously your a newcomer LOL "

So why did you keep saying 82.4 earlier? Why do lots of news articles from last year also state 82.4? Why did the ONS state in January 11th that it is 80.4?

Why would you even think that an average age would not potentially change over a year? Sorry, do't worry about that, it's all too subtle for you clearly.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude

I gave 1 number and cited one source. You gave 2 different numbers, with no source. Ha ha you are so out of touch, 82.2 is the average age of Covid death, been on here for at least a year , obviously your a newcomer LOL

So why did you keep saying 82.4 earlier? Why do lots of news articles from last year also state 82.4? Why did the ONS state in January 11th that it is 80.4?

Why would you even think that an average age would not potentially change over a year? Sorry, do't worry about that, it's all too subtle for you clearly."

Imagine thinking that data changes evidence. What a silly thought

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude

I gave 1 number and cited one source. You gave 2 different numbers, with no source. Ha ha you are so out of touch, 82.2 is the average age of Covid death, been on here for at least a year , obviously your a newcomer LOL

So why did you keep saying 82.4 earlier? Why do lots of news articles from last year also state 82.4? Why did the ONS state in January 11th that it is 80.4?

Why would you even think that an average age would not potentially change over a year? Sorry, do't worry about that, it's all too subtle for you clearly."
Boring 82.4 or 82.2

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted.

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all

India has car parks full of burning funeral pyres and bodies starting to line the streets, and you don't think an effective lock-down achieved anything?

Christ, these people... "

You've deliberately misinterpreted what I said

I agreed lockdown has kept people safe from Covid, but I am compassionate enough to acknowledge it has also caused a lot of harm to a lot of people due to various other reasons

But you twist it how you like if it makes you feel better

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago

Northampton Somewhere

A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?"

* What people want and what's a good idea aren't necessarily the same thing

* Politicians make decisions based on multiple factors (popularity, the economy) which might not be in line with what's best for public health (any politician, I'm not swiping at Tories)

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?"

2 words

populist government

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"

You've deliberately misinterpreted what I said

I agreed lockdown has kept people safe from Covid, but I am compassionate enough to acknowledge it has also caused a lot of harm to a lot of people due to various other reasons

But you twist it how you like if it makes you feel better "

OK, fair enough. If you literally mean not *everybody* then yes, I agree, that much is self evident, but of course part of a far larger picture.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *heHookyMonsterMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


"I entirely agree.covid was downgraded from HCID in march 2020,so why the wait.

Ffs 13 months ago and you still don’t understand why it was downgraded

Suits the agenda.

The government are lying liars who lie except when they say Covid isn't serious, wake up sheeple wanna go pub

To be fair, people just want to live their lives as the old normal, it isn't just about pubs and it sounds like trivialising peoples opinions when people only mention this

We all do - but we can't until it's safe. I think people are prioritising small wants (which we all want) over actual need.

Meanwhile my "I want everyone to be safe" is regularly called bed wetting or mental illness.

The problem is a lot of people are suffering as a direct result of lockdown

It isn't keeping everyone safe

I'm suffering too. As noted.

Just the assumption that lockdown "keeps everyone safe" seems a little inaccurate

'Safe' from Covid maybe, but there are so many other issues that have been caused or exacerbated by lockdown, that lockdown really hasn't kept everyone safe at all

India has car parks full of burning funeral pyres and bodies starting to line the streets, and you don't think an effective lock-down achieved anything?

Christ, these people...

You've deliberately misinterpreted what I said

I agreed lockdown has kept people safe from Covid, but I am compassionate enough to acknowledge it has also caused a lot of harm to a lot of people due to various other reasons

But you twist it how you like if it makes you feel better "

It's definitely true to say that the isolation has been very tough for some. No doubt about it!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

You've deliberately misinterpreted what I said

I agreed lockdown has kept people safe from Covid, but I am compassionate enough to acknowledge it has also caused a lot of harm to a lot of people due to various other reasons

But you twist it how you like if it makes you feel better

OK, fair enough. If you literally mean not *everybody* then yes, I agree, that much is self evident, but of course part of a far larger picture."

I did literally mean not everyone

Every single person is as important as the next in my view So I think it is important to also recognise the harm lockdown has caused to some people, and potentially deaths, in the same way we acknowledge and grieve those lost to Covid

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Person A says something

Person B says you meant xyz

Person A says I didn’t say xyz

Person B says I think it’s what you meant.

The internet."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??"

You don't care about long covid or you don't understand what it is?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

You don't care about long covid or you don't understand what it is? "
Got any proof ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

You don't care about long covid or you don't understand what it is? Got any proof ? "

Are you d*unk?

Many of your thread responses give that suggestion tbh.

Edit - Your status update says you started on the beers 7 hours ago so it makes sense now.

KJ

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

What about the 1.1 million in the UK with long Covid? let the fact sink in 82.4 average age of death from Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81 , nothing left to say ??

You don't care about long covid or you don't understand what it is?

Got any proof ? "

Of your intelligence or empathy?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago

Northampton Somewhere


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?

* What people want and what's a good idea aren't necessarily the same thing

* Politicians make decisions based on multiple factors (popularity, the economy) which might not be in line with what's best for public health (any politician, I'm not swiping at Tories)

"

Hmmmmmmmm. Out of all of them I have felt Whitty has kept it pretty 'real' since the beginning.

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By *asIsaCouple
over a year ago

harrow


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then"

Neither is social distancing after 21st June. All that has been said is no limits on social contacts.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?

* What people want and what's a good idea aren't necessarily the same thing

* Politicians make decisions based on multiple factors (popularity, the economy) which might not be in line with what's best for public health (any politician, I'm not swiping at Tories)

Hmmmmmmmm. Out of all of them I have felt Whitty has kept it pretty 'real' since the beginning. "

Yeah. But Whitty doesn't make the decisions - the government does. The government does what they do for a bunch of reasons which aren't all public health related. Whitty is one of many voices that the government will consider when it makes its choices

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By *asIsaCouple
over a year ago

harrow


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then"

Neither is social distancing after 21st June. All that has been said is no limits on social contacts.

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley


"God you are so left behind ,82.2 has been around forever , even those trying to prolong lockdown can’t disagree , 82.2 average age of Covid ,average age of U.K. life expectancy 81

Oh so it's 82.2 now, not 82.4? Yeah dude, you're really sounding credible with your data that "everyone agrees with". ha ha .0.2 is that the best you can come with Dude"

I'd actually appreciate a link to where you got this information please?

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By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago

Northampton Somewhere


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?

* What people want and what's a good idea aren't necessarily the same thing

* Politicians make decisions based on multiple factors (popularity, the economy) which might not be in line with what's best for public health (any politician, I'm not swiping at Tories)

Hmmmmmmmm. Out of all of them I have felt Whitty has kept it pretty 'real' since the beginning.

Yeah. But Whitty doesn't make the decisions - the government does. The government does what they do for a bunch of reasons which aren't all public health related. Whitty is one of many voices that the government will consider when it makes its choices "

I know he just an adviser. Poor bastard, they never listen to him

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By *heHookyMonsterMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


"A massive proportion society want to do away with masks and social distancing from mid June, I've read somewhere that the government have spoken about it. I also remember Chris Whitty saying that they fully expect another wave in the Autumn/Winter. So I don't understand why they are talking about getting rid of these things. Can anyone explain that?

* What people want and what's a good idea aren't necessarily the same thing

* Politicians make decisions based on multiple factors (popularity, the economy) which might not be in line with what's best for public health (any politician, I'm not swiping at Tories)

Hmmmmmmmm. Out of all of them I have felt Whitty has kept it pretty 'real' since the beginning. "

Having spent some time around him during this process I can say that the guy is as genuine as it gets - works incredibly hard, isn't remotely political about things and just wants to do the very best he can for people. I think the stress of this will have been incredibly hard on him, his colleagues and our care system. Got to be 'Professor Sir Chris Whitty' at the end of this.

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs

Apparently chicken pox is now more prevalent than coronavirus

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"Apparently chicken pox is now more prevalent than coronavirus"

Sources and your point..?

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"I thought that is what he is aiming for anyway, no social distancing. They are doing trials with groups o people as we speak with the hope of opening up more in June

PS I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed. The virus will not have gone away by then

Neither is social distancing after 21st June. All that has been said is no limits on social contacts. "

"I won't be going for the no social distancing in June whatever they tell us what is allowed."

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Apparently chicken pox is now more prevalent than coronavirus"

When someone has chickenpox... What do they do?

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By *ogerBottomsMan
over a year ago

Aberdare


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time."

Yep. It's the same bunch.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I absolutely agree with a lot of what they are saying. However I've been very much of the opinion that lockdowns cause more harm than good all along.

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"I absolutely agree with a lot of what they are saying. However I've been very much of the opinion that lockdowns cause more harm than good all along.

"

Hahahahha. No. Literally millions of lives saved.

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By *ingle ex cuckMan
over a year ago

chester

Went the pub today and sat in beer garden freezing

I googled why I can’t sit inside of pub and drink

And answer was because I will die of covid if I do

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By *ntrepid ExplorersCouple
over a year ago

Birmingham


"Went the pub today and sat in beer garden freezing

I googled why I can’t sit inside of pub and drink

And answer was because I will die of covid if I do"

Seems your Google skills are really bloody poor.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Confused. Who has lost control of their lives and who needs to take back control. Everyone has had control of their lives all the time. Simple facts. Obey the rules put in place to help you get back to the old normality as quickly as possible. There is no conspiracy, there is no agenda, its a pandemic. What is the problem, what is the rebellion. Don't get it.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Went the pub today and sat in beer garden freezing

I googled why I can’t sit inside of pub and drink

And answer was because I will die of covid if I do"

Perhaps take a jumper/coat next time? It's not like it was unexpected to have to sit outside, eh?

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

Also in a town awfully close to Chester, I sat out in the garden at lunchtime and had to retreat into the shade for fear of burning. I wore a vest top only, so a tad confused how it was so different in Chester?

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By *hatawasteMan
over a year ago

stafford

No doubt some credibility out thee now with an end to this..

I would caution though people don't keep treating it like brewing your own beer.. You need to wait till its ready before you start drinking it..or you just end up with bad guts and the runs..

Also suggesting no social distancing in June?. And no masks in schools from May?

Will they let the teachers wear them at least? Creating a super spreader environment and not allowing employees to protect themselves?

If the government don't keep the social distancing going for a while yet we will be locked down again for Halloween.. Or sooner..

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By *ete1260Man
over a year ago

Evesham

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid "

Death is 1 outcome of the infection. I note that you have failed to include the details of the other ages of people suffering other devastating health tragedies -

Organ damage,

Organ failure: heart, brain, kidney, lung

A selection of the devastation hitting people, as well as long Covid, that sufferers have no clue when they may feel some recovery.

As the virus is attacking people of many ages, mutations can shift who's vulnerable and how people get hit, we'll be myopic to look at just a little bit of what's already happened.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Death is 1 outcome of the infection. I note that you have failed to include the details of the other ages of people suffering other devastating health tragedies -

Organ damage,

Organ failure: heart, brain, kidney, lung

A selection of the devastation hitting people, as well as long Covid, that sufferers have no clue when they may feel some recovery.

As the virus is attacking people of many ages, mutations can shift who's vulnerable and how people get hit, we'll be myopic to look at just a little bit of what's already happened.

"

Apparently that doesn't matter to some people, they just want to get back to shagging strangers.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Death is 1 outcome of the infection. I note that you have failed to include the details of the other ages of people suffering other devastating health tragedies -

Organ damage,

Organ failure: heart, brain, kidney, lung

A selection of the devastation hitting people, as well as long Covid, that sufferers have no clue when they may feel some recovery.

As the virus is attacking people of many ages, mutations can shift who's vulnerable and how people get hit, we'll be myopic to look at just a little bit of what's already happened.

"

"But it won't happen to me", says Paul/Pauline of Prudhoe. Paul and Pauline also don't want the vaccines because of the estimated risk of 4 in a million of blood clots...

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech

Same old faces who are hell bent on trying to discredit veteran professionals and experts,yet favour the opinions of a professor with no medical quifications but has a clever algorithm.

I've read the letter and it's got more qualified signatures on it than the decrepit members that make up sage. Bottom line is this; if you're choosing a mathematicians theory over a renowned virologist or epidemiologist then you are are part of the problem. When people instantly dismiss the finding of UCL because they don't align with imperial college,then have the brass neck to discredit them as covid deniers, you know it's no longer possible to engage in educated debate.

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By *7EVE123Man
over a year ago

sheffield soon


"Naaa I'm good thanks OP I am willing to wait a few more weeks."

why...1600.die a day fro..cancer strokes.. alzheimers.. nobody.is dying of man made covid/ bad flu...not done for weeks now..infact only 1300 or so have.. its all a big plan.. youtube event201.. october 2019.. all planned and bill gates the ringleader...nhs and gov stats freely.avaiable.. lockdown ends..test jabs are illegal again

digital currency (pound) is next...

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By *oubleswing2019Man
over a year ago

Colchester

^ Do not feed the troll. It's just a wind-up.

Hope folks had pleasant weekends.

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley


"^ Do not feed the troll. It's just a wind-up.

Hope folks had pleasant weekends."

I couldn't feed it if I wanted to, my mind is boggled even trying to make sense of it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The virus forum is fast becoming the perfect filter for “people to avoid post covid”, some of the nugget answers on here are truly astonishing

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

"

Whilst it is true that the average age of those who died due to Covid in the UK is 80.4, this is largely due to the measures put in place and the quality of the UK's medical response.

If we look at India as an example of what "could" have been in the UK without the restrictions, around 50% of their deaths have been aged under 65.

We ARE coming out if the restriction, in a slow controlled manner which will allow for the data to show the impact of each stage.

The only real "ongoing" restriction will be on travel, and this will obviously be controlled by how well other countries controll their virus situation.

Cal

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Went the pub today and sat in beer garden freezing

I googled why I can’t sit inside of pub and drink

And answer was because I will die of covid if I do

Perhaps take a jumper/coat next time? It's not like it was unexpected to have to sit outside, eh?"

England in April. Chilly. Who'd have thought it? Compulsory pub going. It's another conspiracy. There'll be compulsory holidays next. Ohh my freedoms.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Whilst it is true that the average age of those who died due to Covid in the UK is 80.4, this is largely due to the measures put in place and the quality of the UK's medical response.

If we look at India as an example of what "could" have been in the UK without the restrictions, around 50% of their deaths have been aged under 65.

We ARE coming out if the restriction, in a slow controlled manner which will allow for the data to show the impact of each stage.

The only real "ongoing" restriction will be on travel, and this will obviously be controlled by how well other countries controll their virus situation.

Cal"

Absolutely.

Also to add to that whilst under the age of 80 has good chances of survival we should be aware survival and recovery are two very different terms.

I have lost count of the young and middle aged people who have eventually come off ventilation in our trust carrying long term of permanent serious health conditions or disabilities.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ugRollersCouple
over a year ago

Newcastle

June is around the corner. We’ve waited this long what’s a couple more months. I honestly think come June all restrictions will lift and it’ll be like normal. If it’s not I think people will do their own thing anyhow as the majority are now anyway. I think once it’s more like normal in June they’ll not lockdown any more in the future. They’ve said that numerous repeated times that we are just going to have to live with it and it’ll always be around like a cold. Apart from we will be better protected ...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Listen to the science

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Confused. Who has lost control of their lives and who needs to take back control. Everyone has had control of their lives all the time. Simple facts. Obey the rules put in place to help you get back to the old normality as quickly as possible. There is no conspiracy, there is no agenda, its a pandemic. What is the problem, what is the rebellion. Don't get it."

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Death is 1 outcome of the infection. I note that you have failed to include the details of the other ages of people suffering other devastating health tragedies -

Organ damage,

Organ failure: heart, brain, kidney, lung

A selection of the devastation hitting people, as well as long Covid, that sufferers have no clue when they may feel some recovery.

As the virus is attacking people of many ages, mutations can shift who's vulnerable and how people get hit, we'll be myopic to look at just a little bit of what's already happened.

Apparently that doesn't matter to some people, they just want to get back to shagging strangers. "

LOL

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By *rufinWoman
over a year ago

notts

may as well make the most of the summer months and enjoy it as much as we can

can't see next autumn/winter being as bad as last autumn/winter but it will feel difficult to get through if we haven't had a bit of respite from the endless tedium while we had a chance. Too much caution and we're going to be even more exhausted heading into autumn/winter lockdown-lite

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"may as well make the most of the summer months and enjoy it as much as we can

can't see next autumn/winter being as bad as last autumn/winter but it will feel difficult to get through if we haven't had a bit of respite from the endless tedium while we had a chance. Too much caution and we're going to be even more exhausted heading into autumn/winter lockdown-lite"

Yes, I wish I'd made more of last summer. I will this year - but this year I know much more and we've been able to do much more to protect people

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By *uckandbunnyCouple
over a year ago

In your bed

Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

"

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ?

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ? "

The issue is more that they have written a letter asking for something that has already been planned, it's pointless.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Whilst it is true that the average age of those who died due to Covid in the UK is 80.4, this is largely due to the measures put in place and the quality of the UK's medical response.

If we look at India as an example of what "could" have been in the UK without the restrictions, around 50% of their deaths have been aged under 65.

We ARE coming out if the restriction, in a slow controlled manner which will allow for the data to show the impact of each stage.

The only real "ongoing" restriction will be on travel, and this will obviously be controlled by how well other countries controll their virus situation.

Cal

Absolutely.

Also to add to that whilst under the age of 80 has good chances of survival we should be aware survival and recovery are two very different terms.

I have lost count of the young and middle aged people who have eventually come off ventilation in our trust carrying long term of permanent serious health conditions or disabilities."

"...we should be aware survival and recovery are two very different terms...."

----------------------

This

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"All the data agree 82.4 is average age of death of Covid

Whilst it is true that the average age of those who died due to Covid in the UK is 80.4, this is largely due to the measures put in place and the quality of the UK's medical response.

If we look at India as an example of what "could" have been in the UK without the restrictions, around 50% of their deaths have been aged under 65.

We ARE coming out if the restriction, in a slow controlled manner which will allow for the data to show the impact of each stage.

The only real "ongoing" restriction will be on travel, and this will obviously be controlled by how well other countries controll their virus situation.

Cal

Absolutely.

Also to add to that whilst under the age of 80 has good chances of survival we should be aware survival and recovery are two very different terms.

I have lost count of the young and middle aged people who have eventually come off ventilation in our trust carrying long term of permanent serious health conditions or disabilities.

"...we should be aware survival and recovery are two very different terms...."

----------------------

This "

Indeedy.

I survived my last pregnancy. But it left me requiring a wheelchair because I can no longer weight bear on my left side.

But I survived, eh?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ?

The issue is more that they have written a letter asking for something that has already been planned, it's pointless. "

I think the point of the open letter is to counter the opposition to the goverments plan to unlock all businesses and end social distancing on June 21st.

KJ

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ?

The issue is more that they have written a letter asking for something that has already been planned, it's pointless. "

The estimated cost to our economy is around £500 million per day ( look it up, not hard to find), this letter questions the need to keep the current measures in place over the financial and social implications it brings with it.

Also, if we are saying that 22 out of thousands is reasonably dismissed, then this also applies to the SAGE outfit. There are many peer reviewed studies that show Fergusons computer modeling to be massively flawed, but because you can see him on the bbc and not YouTube he's far more credible than virologists that don't have the same platform ?

Ask any mp to back up their "data" with evidence and see what answer you get.

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ?

The issue is more that they have written a letter asking for something that has already been planned, it's pointless.

The estimated cost to our economy is around £500 million per day ( look it up, not hard to find), this letter questions the need to keep the current measures in place over the financial and social implications it brings with it.

Also, if we are saying that 22 out of thousands is reasonably dismissed, then this also applies to the SAGE outfit. There are many peer reviewed studies that show Fergusons computer modeling to be massively flawed, but because you can see him on the bbc and not YouTube he's far more credible than virologists that don't have the same platform ?

Ask any mp to back up their "data" with evidence and see what answer you get. "

The big issue is this:

The government has been consistently criticised for doing "too little, too late". At the moment, the recommended strategy has done what was required and it is "VERY" obvious that a cautious exit is safer than a hurried one. The return to "normal" is coming, and is being handled in a semi-scientific manner (limiting the number of variables) so as to keep an eye on the data. Boris' "Road Map" has been defined with the earliest dates that things will change, and for him to jump ahead would just add to the public criticism if his handling of the situation.

Cal

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By *eedsmale36Man
over a year ago

Leeds

I have just one question....when’s eat out to help out coming back, I’m fancying a nice Thai feast and it always tastes nicer with money off

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"Wow a whole 22 people from the scientific community of 1000's recommending that social distancing end 1 month before it is due to end already.

Hardly a huge divergence from what is already planned.

Some scientists clearly have too much time on their hands, withdraw their government funding for mickey mouse projects and see if they still have time to write letters.

And herein lies the problem. Let's dismiss any other professional and call it a mickey mouse project. Doesn't matter that those whose signed off on the letter are more qualified and better suited in the field in question, as a mathematics nerd with a computer says different.

What qualities do sage possess that these others do not ?

The issue is more that they have written a letter asking for something that has already been planned, it's pointless.

The estimated cost to our economy is around £500 million per day ( look it up, not hard to find), this letter questions the need to keep the current measures in place over the financial and social implications it brings with it.

Also, if we are saying that 22 out of thousands is reasonably dismissed, then this also applies to the SAGE outfit. There are many peer reviewed studies that show Fergusons computer modeling to be massively flawed, but because you can see him on the bbc and not YouTube he's far more credible than virologists that don't have the same platform ?

Ask any mp to back up their "data" with evidence and see what answer you get.

The big issue is this:

The government has been consistently criticised for doing "too little, too late". At the moment, the recommended strategy has done what was required and it is "VERY" obvious that a cautious exit is safer than a hurried one. The return to "normal" is coming, and is being handled in a semi-scientific manner (limiting the number of variables) so as to keep an eye on the data. Boris' "Road Map" has been defined with the earliest dates that things will change, and for him to jump ahead would just add to the public criticism if his handling of the situation.

Cal"

Safe is reasonable, but this is overkill. The govt have consistently dodged the question of evidence to back the data which stinks of the whole 'yellowhammer ' debacle. All this crap about data not dates, yet Wales and Scotland are already bringing plans forward. If Bojo and co showed this evidence and allowed it to be peer reviewed outside of sage, then perhaps people would be more likely to conform? The longer they hide away their reasoning, the more they will struggle to convince.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

what are scotland bringing forward? we only got round to opening beer gardens, gym, shops and beauty salons today

also you say the longer his goes on , when there is only 7 weeks left til june 21st so the timeline is already known and really not that long - seems just like an impatient child tbh

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By *ylon pussyMan
over a year ago

leeds

22 scientists?

What about the opinion of the other 200,000 ??

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"what are scotland bringing forward? we only got round to opening beer gardens, gym, shops and beauty salons today

also you say the longer his goes on , when there is only 7 weeks left til june 21st so the timeline is already known and really not that long - seems just like an impatient child tbh "

7 weeks at a cost of £500m per day, is hardly being impatient. Some may question the need to keep these restrictions in place when there's zero evidence to prove they are necessary. The rest of details are all easily found, most answered in some form on this very thread, the rest you'll find by foi and search engines.

Also, 7 weeks is roughly what time we have to find a new home since lockdown cost us our house and business.

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By *onty the martianMan
over a year ago

Censored boy

[Removed by poster at 26/04/21 22:48:23]

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By *onty the martianMan
over a year ago

Censored boy


"22 scientists?

What about the opinion of the other 200,000 ??"

Please can you tell me where the figure of 200 000 came from?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"what are scotland bringing forward? we only got round to opening beer gardens, gym, shops and beauty salons today

also you say the longer his goes on , when there is only 7 weeks left til june 21st so the timeline is already known and really not that long - seems just like an impatient child tbh

7 weeks at a cost of £500m per day, is hardly being impatient. Some may question the need to keep these restrictions in place when there's zero evidence to prove they are necessary. The rest of details are all easily found, most answered in some form on this very thread, the rest you'll find by foi and search engines.

Also, 7 weeks is roughly what time we have to find a new home since lockdown cost us our house and business. "

excellent response let me throw out a vague random piece of bait with no real detail or even point then tell people to go fish and find what i mean on google

im very sorry for your loss of material things , it must be frustrating to lose what you worked hard for, but plenty on this thread have lost much less replaceable things, like for example members of their family to this disease

but hey as long as you get to swingathon i’m sure all will be great

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time."

This "crowd" are all eminant scientists and you don't give them any credibility?

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"what are scotland bringing forward? we only got round to opening beer gardens, gym, shops and beauty salons today

also you say the longer his goes on , when there is only 7 weeks left til june 21st so the timeline is already known and really not that long - seems just like an impatient child tbh

7 weeks at a cost of £500m per day, is hardly being impatient. Some may question the need to keep these restrictions in place when there's zero evidence to prove they are necessary. The rest of details are all easily found, most answered in some form on this very thread, the rest you'll find by foi and search engines.

Also, 7 weeks is roughly what time we have to find a new home since lockdown cost us our house and business.

excellent response let me throw out a vague random piece of bait with no real detail or even point then tell people to go fish and find what i mean on google

im very sorry for your loss of material things , it must be frustrating to lose what you worked hard for, but plenty on this thread have lost much less replaceable things, like for example members of their family to this disease

but hey as long as you get to swingathon i’m sure all will be great "

Queer really that Boris and co have Done exactly what you have accused me of, yet their lack of transparency and evidence is OK in this circumstance. Surprised you actually took the bait so quickly, although it was nicely tee'd up.

How very kind of you to wish me well. Sadly I don't think I will reciprocate.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time.

This "crowd" are all eminant scientists and you don't give them any credibility?"

Nope. Fallible humans one and all, who have been very fallible throughout all of this.

Idgaf what "scientists" say. I care what "the science" says.

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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago

St Neots/Wisbech


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time.

This "crowd" are all eminant scientists and you don't give them any credibility?"

Well said. Ferguson and his model vs proper virologists and medical professionals.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time.

This "crowd" are all eminant scientists and you don't give them any credibility?

Well said. Ferguson and his model vs proper virologists and medical professionals. "

Global scientific consensus versus a few people with a political agenda to decimate public health.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport


"It's the same sort of crowd who've been saying no to lockdowns all along. I don't give this much credibility.

The time will come and hopefully soon, but I don't think this crowd are a good indicator that it's time.

This "crowd" are all eminant scientists and you don't give them any credibility?"

No, they're all a bunch of nutters or psychopaths who have been screaming about the interruption to their personal life from the start. We've had what, is it around 170 thousand dead now? I stopped looking some time ago because it has been giving me crippling anxiety about something that the UK was in the perfect position to avoid, if it hadn't been for the assholes that are running this country.

There's a grain of truth, no we certainly cannot keep locked up forever. But after more than twelve months of huge sacrifices we're in the phases of carefully getting everything going again, and this is exactly the wrong time to throw away all the gains that have been made since the vaccinations began. It's like children screaming that they want a sweetie and they want it now and if they don't get it they're going to hold their breath and die. TBH I'm at the point that I really don't care if the protesters do catch covid and die, at least it would raise the average intelligence of the human race. But I do care about the damage that they are doing to everyone else. I am very very fortunate to not have lost anybody immediately close to me, if I had, my words would be much harsher than this. But people who do mean a lot to me have lost people of theirs, which hurts them and thus hurts me. Somebody I care very much about is stuck in a country which is being ravaged by this disease right now. And by the time it is all over I absolutely know that there will be friends that I will never have seen again, because either they, or me, will no longer be here.

So please, don't give me all the shit about cancer treatment and mental health and companies going bankrupt, when the only reason we got to this point is because over a year ago too many people said it was their divine right to have their foreign holiday, to go to the pub, that just wearing a bit of cloth over their face was too hard, that even making the slightest tiny miniscule effort to delay the spread of the virus was an imposition that they just would not stand for!

You think I want this? No, it's the ones that behave like babies that are the ones that have done this. Me, I'm just god tired of being put in the position of the responsible adult, trying to stop the children from hurting themselves...

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