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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... " But do you understand that all of the hospitality sector including Pubs, restaurants, hotels etc account for just 3% of covid incidents. Lets put that into perspective. The Education Sector which includes schools, Universities and colleges are responsible for approx 50% of covid incidents. Even our supposed super safe workplaces account for 20-25% of covid incidents. The government is beating down on the pubs because it knows economy wise and public opinion they can't touch the education sector or normal workplaces. Oh I don't drink or go to the pub. KJ Mr | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... " Exactly... | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... "  | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? " What in the world could be Whitty and Vallances agenda? What could they possibly gain from an agenda? | |||
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"Its amazing what conspiracy theories people want to believe when their personal agenda is to go to the pub and get blathered till midnight. "Or maybe it's because they are concerned for their jobs, their families jobs and their friends jobs? Decimating the hospitality industry doesn't just cause job losses in pubs, bars and restaurants but across a wide range of businesses and industries. Maybe it's because people are sick of having their freedoms and liberties ripped away from them with no tangible benefit and on the back of shoddy, unreliable and non-resistant scientific basis. Also consider this, while the the government takes a sledgehammer to thousands and thousands of livlihoods MPs are now in line for a 3k pay increase each. We're all in this together ain't we? | |||
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"Its amazing what conspiracy theories people want to believe when their personal agenda is to go to the pub and get blathered till midnight.
Or maybe it's because they are concerned for their jobs, their families jobs and their friends jobs? Decimating the hospitality industry doesn't just cause job losses in pubs, bars and restaurants but across a wide range of businesses and industries.
Maybe it's because people are sick of having their freedoms and liberties ripped away from them with no tangible benefit and on the back of shoddy, unreliable and non-resistant scientific basis.
Also consider this, while the the government takes a sledgehammer to thousands and thousands of livlihoods MPs are now in line for a 3k pay increase each. We're all in this together ain't we? "Could not agree more, it is across all industry and livlyhoods, everyone will feel a strain. MPs are human too and realiity is they look after their own back irrespective of which party Therefore we should all do the same but with respect for others. Power to the people I say | |||
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"I feel more at risk in supermarkets. Gone are the days of queuing to get in. Out of the 400k plus cases not heard of one supermarket closing because of an outbreak. So you are telling me none of those 400k work in a supermarket? Yet there's multiple pubs closing per week to deep clean due to an outbreak " I had to queue last weekend at the supermarket, they had a trolley queue and a basket queue, for ten minutes they only let the trolley queue enter leaving all those in the basket queue standing in the rain, when we I got inside the supermarket was really empty other than those with a trolley queuing up the aisle for trolley tills  | |||
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"From the table of contacts and the tracers, the pub or restaurant was the most listed places people with covid had been in the last 5 days. I'm not sure about the most, but it must be something to do with not having to wear a mask at these places for long periods of time with a lot of strangers in the same rooms. Plus the fact people get smashed and forget all the rules. " Pubs and restaurants will be most listed as they take people’s contact details, the supermarket doesn’t. | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? Telegraph says figures indicate home contacts are much more important for spreading the virus. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pubs-restaurants-really-driving-rise-165308606.html " This is nothing to do with transmission. It's all about instilling fear to drive compliance. People had become too relaxed for their liking, they were starting to ask awkward questions and demand answers that the government don't want to give. Worse, they were starting to actually see through the nonsense and realise that the whole thing's been blown way out of proportion. Solutjon... make life feel scary again. Close the pubs, make people wait in the rain outside shops again, make them feel uneasy.. It's nonsense. There's virtually no evidence that's been released showimg hospitality is the source of the problem, if indeed there is actually a problem at all. Infections may be up, but mortality remains low, hospital occupancy remains low & there's no reason to think there will be anything like the impact we saw in March. There will, obviously, be an impact. Will it be enough to justify yet another round of lockdowns.. I don't think so. | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? " Of course they do They're trying to save a bunch of dumbfucks from infecting the rest of us | |||
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"Its amazing what conspiracy theories people want to believe when their personal agenda is to go to the pub and get blathered till midnight.
Or maybe it's because they are concerned for their jobs, their families jobs and their friends jobs? Decimating the hospitality industry doesn't just cause job losses in pubs, bars and restaurants but across a wide range of businesses and industries.
Maybe it's because people are sick of having their freedoms and liberties ripped away from them with no tangible benefit and on the back of shoddy, unreliable and non-resistant scientific basis.
Also consider this, while the the government takes a sledgehammer to thousands and thousands of livlihoods MPs are now in line for a 3k pay increase each. We're all in this together ain't we? "Exactly. Far too many folk ready to dismiss pubs as somewhere alkys go to get pissed. For starters alkys don't tend to go to pubs, folk seeking social interaction do. Pub staff also go there of course and among other depending on a pub are brewery staff, beer mat makers, the boy who services the pumps, the guy who supplies the fruit machine, the guy who supplies the crisps and nuts, the guy who takes the empty bottles away. I could go on and and on. | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? Telegraph says figures indicate home contacts are much more important for spreading the virus. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pubs-restaurants-really-driving-rise-165308606.html This is nothing to do with transmission. It's all about instilling fear to drive compliance. People had become too relaxed for their liking, they were starting to ask awkward questions and demand answers that the government don't want to give. Worse, they were starting to actually see through the nonsense and realise that the whole thing's been blown way out of proportion. Solutjon... make life feel scary again. Close the pubs, make people wait in the rain outside shops again, make them feel uneasy.. It's nonsense. There's virtually no evidence that's been released showimg hospitality is the source of the problem, if indeed there is actually a problem at all. Infections may be up, but mortality remains low, hospital occupancy remains low & there's no reason to think there will be anything like the impact we saw in March. There will, obviously, be an impact. Will it be enough to justify yet another round of lockdowns.. I don't think so." I guess you were off for all of your maths lessons in school. | |||
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" I guess you were off for all of your maths lessons in school. " No, I wasn't. Thanks for the insult though, I'll add it to my collection. | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... But do you understand that all of the hospitality sector including Pubs, restaurants, hotels etc account for just 3% of covid incidents. Lets put that into perspective. The Education Sector which includes schools, Universities and colleges are responsible for approx 50% of covid incidents. Even our supposed super safe workplaces account for 20-25% of covid incidents. The government is beating down on the pubs because it knows economy wise and public opinion they can't touch the education sector or normal workplaces. Oh I don't drink or go to the pub. KJ Mr" Nor do I at the moment... I see your point but statistically wise are those figures from track n trace, for example did the student catch sars-cov-2 then test positive at uni and its placed as a uni contact incident when infact the transmission was elsewhere and I don't mean caught just from the hospitality sector  | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? Telegraph says figures indicate home contacts are much more important for spreading the virus. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pubs-restaurants-really-driving-rise-165308606.html This is nothing to do with transmission. It's all about instilling fear to drive compliance. People had become too relaxed for their liking, they were starting to ask awkward questions and demand answers that the government don't want to give. Worse, they were starting to actually see through the nonsense and realise that the whole thing's been blown way out of proportion. Solutjon... make life feel scary again. Close the pubs, make people wait in the rain outside shops again, make them feel uneasy.. It's nonsense. There's virtually no evidence that's been released showimg hospitality is the source of the problem, if indeed there is actually a problem at all. Infections may be up, but mortality remains low, hospital occupancy remains low & there's no reason to think there will be anything like the impact we saw in March. There will, obviously, be an impact. Will it be enough to justify yet another round of lockdowns.. I don't think so." | |||
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"Let's face it,the Government are grabbing at straws.The testing has been ,at best,poor.From Boris saying 'we would be world leaders in testing 'Its been one disaster after another." We are still 5th in the world for testing thats pretty good don't you think... China Usa India Russia Uk Source worldometer | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... But do you understand that all of the hospitality sector including Pubs, restaurants, hotels etc account for just 3% of covid incidents. Lets put that into perspective. The Education Sector which includes schools, Universities and colleges are responsible for approx 50% of covid incidents. Even our supposed super safe workplaces account for 20-25% of covid incidents. The government is beating down on the pubs because it knows economy wise and public opinion they can't touch the education sector or normal workplaces. Oh I don't drink or go to the pub. KJ Mr Nor do I at the moment... I see your point but statistically wise are those figures from track n trace, for example did the student catch sars-cov-2 then test positive at uni and its placed as a uni contact incident when infact the transmission was elsewhere and I don't mean caught just from the hospitality sector "The high numbers in the student population seems to be coming from the spread in shared accodation. It's less clear where the patient zero of the house became infected. I dont have stats to back it up but I do have a son at uni with COVID, who's best mates at uni with COVID and who's girlfriend is at Uni with COVID. All in separate accommodation with several housemates with COVID. I guess it's part of the PLAN | |||
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"Not saying i think this is the thing to do BUT how many would go along with the government having no restrictions and when the hospitals are full just send people home and let it run it's course" I think it should run its course. Let people get on in life. Wear the mask for shopping etc, but learn to live with it. This country is a shambles now . The government has handled it all wrong from the beginning | |||
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"Not saying i think this is the thing to do BUT how many would go along with the government having no restrictions and when the hospitals are full just send people home and let it run it's course I think it should run its course. Let people get on in life. Wear the mask for shopping etc, but learn to live with it. This country is a shambles now . The government has handled it all wrong from the beginning " I think mask wearing is helping it spread to be honest. Which ironically is a good thing, we need cases rising so it spreads through the population creating immunity, so we can get back to normal. Only realistic way out of this mess. | |||
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"It's not down to Whitty, Vallance, pubs or restaurants....it's down to people." | |||
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"Not saying i think this is the thing to do BUT how many would go along with the government having no restrictions and when the hospitals are full just send people home and let it run it's course" Many people would be happy with dead bodies piled into mass graves by a dumper truck as long as they can fuck strangers and go to the pub. | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? Telegraph says figures indicate home contacts are much more important for spreading the virus. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pubs-restaurants-really-driving-rise-165308606.html " To be fair, the 3% is a bit of a lie... they account for all 3% (the industry's lowest estimate) of cases in the uk, but for 3 months of this time they were all closed. On the other hand they are being unfairly burdened with controlling the virus. Yes it makes sense to restrict random people intermingling, but if restrictions are needed, then it should be everywhere... and if places can be exempt from restrictions because they can prove themselves to be "made safe" then all industries should have the right to do that. Cal | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... " agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top | |||
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"Check out the flu report from last week, week 40 On page 2 it details outbreaks v Covid cases in primary care. Nursing homes, education settings and workplaces top the pile. It ain’t pubs and restaurants, just as it wasn’t in August and early September. It’s the kids And ironically we are about to start phase 3 vaccination testing next week, without a virus in society how can we test it? Back in August the experts were saying the virus was too low to challenge any vaccination. Come on..." It was announced earlier this week, that covid-19 was responsible for more deaths than Flu & Pneumonia combined this year so far... although flu season will start again soon. | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top" I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted? | |||
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"Check out the flu report from last week, week 40 On page 2 it details outbreaks v Covid cases in primary care. Nursing homes, education settings and workplaces top the pile. It ain’t pubs and restaurants, just as it wasn’t in August and early September. It’s the kids And ironically we are about to start phase 3 vaccination testing next week, without a virus in society how can we test it? Back in August the experts were saying the virus was too low to challenge any vaccination. Come on..." The concept that the virus is being manipulated to allow for testing vaccines is just hilarious. You do know that they don't just vaccinate their subjects and send them to the pub to try & catch it... the scientists will have controlled virus samples to infect their subjects with. | |||
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" Back in August the experts were saying the virus was too low to challenge any vaccination. " You need to keep up ... This is OCTOBER !!! | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted?" i don't attend cabinet meetings but my guess would be 1. covid need interaction to spread , cases are rising so we currently have too many interactions 2. yep unis have been a cause of the spread (although realistically it probably was introduced to halls from a pub visit and then went rampant round the shared living and parties) but these people have already paid for their courses, and signed up to annual rent agreements and classes have started and its all gone too far to pull it back now without the absolute shit storm we would get if they cancelled the entire academic year 3. so we need to looks at another source of reducing interactions ... where else are people meeting up with folk from outside their household? pubs! couple that with the fact people arent as good at social distancing once they are pissed and their inhibitions come down, restrictions can be dialled up or down as and when needed without committing now to a decision for the whole year too ... so just now its a curfew, then it might be a 2 week close down, then it might be open again food only no alcohol ... its much more flexible restrictions than closing unis | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted? i don't attend cabinet meetings but my guess would be 1. covid need interaction to spread , cases are rising so we currently have too many interactions 2. yep unis have been a cause of the spread (although realistically it probably was introduced to halls from a pub visit and then went rampant round the shared living and parties) but these people have already paid for their courses, and signed up to annual rent agreements and classes have started and its all gone too far to pull it back now without the absolute shit storm we would get if they cancelled the entire academic year 3. so we need to looks at another source of reducing interactions ... where else are people meeting up with folk from outside their household? pubs! couple that with the fact people arent as good at social distancing once they are pissed and their inhibitions come down, restrictions can be dialled up or down as and when needed without committing now to a decision for the whole year too ... so just now its a curfew, then it might be a 2 week close down, then it might be open again food only no alcohol ... its much more flexible restrictions than closing unis " I know its anecdotal but the 2 times I've been out ,the pubs have been quiet quiet and the strict measures were adhered too. Obviously I cant speak for everywhere but I think this narrative that everyone is blatantly ignoring the rules is skewed. I do think it's more of a case that they cant really go after schools or places of work and they have to be seen to be doing something. | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted? i don't attend cabinet meetings but my guess would be 1. covid need interaction to spread , cases are rising so we currently have too many interactions 2. yep unis have been a cause of the spread (although realistically it probably was introduced to halls from a pub visit and then went rampant round the shared living and parties) but these people have already paid for their courses, and signed up to annual rent agreements and classes have started and its all gone too far to pull it back now without the absolute shit storm we would get if they cancelled the entire academic year 3. so we need to looks at another source of reducing interactions ... where else are people meeting up with folk from outside their household? pubs! couple that with the fact people arent as good at social distancing once they are pissed and their inhibitions come down, restrictions can be dialled up or down as and when needed without committing now to a decision for the whole year too ... so just now its a curfew, then it might be a 2 week close down, then it might be open again food only no alcohol ... its much more flexible restrictions than closing unis I know its anecdotal but the 2 times I've been out ,the pubs have been quiet quiet and the strict measures were adhered too. Obviously I cant speak for everywhere but I think this narrative that everyone is blatantly ignoring the rules is skewed. I do think it's more of a case that they cant really go after schools or places of work and they have to be seen to be doing something. " Same here the 3 times I have been out for a meal it has been really quiet and everyone was following the guidelines. | |||
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"Or do Whitty and Vallance have their own agenda ? Telegraph says figures indicate home contacts are much more important for spreading the virus. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pubs-restaurants-really-driving-rise-165308606.html This is nothing to do with transmission. It's all about instilling fear to drive compliance. People had become too relaxed for their liking, they were starting to ask awkward questions and demand answers that the government don't want to give. Worse, they were starting to actually see through the nonsense and realise that the whole thing's been blown way out of proportion. Solutjon... make life feel scary again. Close the pubs, make people wait in the rain outside shops again, make them feel uneasy.. It's nonsense. There's virtually no evidence that's been released showimg hospitality is the source of the problem, if indeed there is actually a problem at all. Infections may be up, but mortality remains low, hospital occupancy remains low & there's no reason to think there will be anything like the impact we saw in March. There will, obviously, be an impact. Will it be enough to justify yet another round of lockdowns.. I don't think so." tell that to the doctors and nurses who,s hospitals are filling up again. | |||
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"Not saying i think this is the thing to do BUT how many would go along with the government having no restrictions and when the hospitals are full just send people home and let it run it's course" I certainly would not. They have done badly, much worse than was reasonable for us to have expected. We're a very wealthy nation and can afford to do it right, putting people as the priority. | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though "On 67 % of my basic wage ? That wouldn't work for me. | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote." I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted? i don't attend cabinet meetings but my guess would be 1. covid need interaction to spread , cases are rising so we currently have too many interactions 2. yep unis have been a cause of the spread (although realistically it probably was introduced to halls from a pub visit and then went rampant round the shared living and parties) but these people have already paid for their courses, and signed up to annual rent agreements and classes have started and its all gone too far to pull it back now without the absolute shit storm we would get if they cancelled the entire academic year 3. so we need to looks at another source of reducing interactions ... where else are people meeting up with folk from outside their household? pubs! couple that with the fact people arent as good at social distancing once they are pissed and their inhibitions come down, restrictions can be dialled up or down as and when needed without committing now to a decision for the whole year too ... so just now its a curfew, then it might be a 2 week close down, then it might be open again food only no alcohol ... its much more flexible restrictions than closing unis I know its anecdotal but the 2 times I've been out ,the pubs have been quiet quiet and the strict measures were adhered too. Obviously I cant speak for everywhere but I think this narrative that everyone is blatantly ignoring the rules is skewed. I do think it's more of a case that they cant really go after schools or places of work and they have to be seen to be doing something. " i agree partly with the fact they cant go after schools and workplaces ... its about what we need (education and income) for a while rather than what we want (social interaction) but i dont agree with them just needing to be SEEN to do something ... i dont think its just visual , opportunities for interaction need cut somewhere also without trying to be rude i promise .., do you think that at 48 you maybe choose a different kind of drinking establishments from the young crowd and thats why your anecdotal experience is different from the demographic where it is most spreading at the moment? i might be wrong but would assume you are past the phase in life where everything revolves around a party and “the sesh” ... thats shown by the fact you gave only been out twice you likely have a massively different mentality from many (not all) people in a much younger life stage and if follows your behaviour around how much you drink snd actions when d*unk would be hugely different too | |||
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"If people went to a pub, socially distanced and washed/sanitised hands, sat down with mates and had a few pints, said goodbye, left the pub and went straight home then it would be fine but.... They have a few too many, leave the pub and hug, kiss, crowd together, fight, fall over in the street, cry because all is wrong in the world and go home with each other for sex..... agreed i also dont understand the logic of these hidden agenda theories so this hidden agenda to close the pubs one ... lets shut down an economy, have to pay more furlough, or bail outs or when they lose their jobs pay benefits... alcohol is one of the most heavily taxed items in the uk and that revenue stream is now gone ... so what is this hidden agenda? another “hidden agenda” is apparently cases rising since they told us to wear masks (as though people think the masks are causing the increase) ... if the agenda was to increase cases you would just let people roam free and the virus would be rampant ... no extra scheming required personally i dont think we have hidden agendas... just fools agendas ... the fools being the government for thinking the british people would follow a set of guidelines and the other fools being the ones circumventing them for not realising it just results in harsher and harsher rules being laid on top I dont agree with hidden agendas..but..its clear the cases are going up due to schools/unis and workplace. So why are pubs being targeted? i don't attend cabinet meetings but my guess would be 1. covid need interaction to spread , cases are rising so we currently have too many interactions 2. yep unis have been a cause of the spread (although realistically it probably was introduced to halls from a pub visit and then went rampant round the shared living and parties) but these people have already paid for their courses, and signed up to annual rent agreements and classes have started and its all gone too far to pull it back now without the absolute shit storm we would get if they cancelled the entire academic year 3. so we need to looks at another source of reducing interactions ... where else are people meeting up with folk from outside their household? pubs! couple that with the fact people arent as good at social distancing once they are pissed and their inhibitions come down, restrictions can be dialled up or down as and when needed without committing now to a decision for the whole year too ... so just now its a curfew, then it might be a 2 week close down, then it might be open again food only no alcohol ... its much more flexible restrictions than closing unis I know its anecdotal but the 2 times I've been out ,the pubs have been quiet quiet and the strict measures were adhered too. Obviously I cant speak for everywhere but I think this narrative that everyone is blatantly ignoring the rules is skewed. I do think it's more of a case that they cant really go after schools or places of work and they have to be seen to be doing something. i agree partly with the fact they cant go after schools and workplaces ... its about what we need (education and income) for a while rather than what we want (social interaction) but i dont agree with them just needing to be SEEN to do something ... i dont think its just visual , opportunities for interaction need cut somewhere also without trying to be rude i promise .., do you think that at 48 you maybe choose a different kind of drinking establishments from the young crowd and thats why your anecdotal experience is different from the demographic where it is most spreading at the moment? i might be wrong but would assume you are past the phase in life where everything revolves around a party and “the sesh” ... thats shown by the fact you gave only been out twice you likely have a massively different mentality from many (not all) people in a much younger life stage and if follows your behaviour around how much you drink snd actions when d*unk would be hugely different too " I cant help but agree with most things you say. Yes at my age I dont usually go where the younger ones drink unless me and the wife are away for the weekend or away on holiday. So in main everyone where we eat out are well behaved and follow the guidelines. | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go. "Only on holiday when we feel young  | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go. "sorry  . but you get my point of why you might not have witnessed it right? | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go.
sorry . but you get my point of why you might not have witnessed it right? "I'm off out for a game of dominoes tonight. | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go.
sorry . but you get my point of why you might not have witnessed it right?
I'm off out for a game of dominoes tonight."aha ... nothing wrong with a game of dominos  but i wasn't even suggesting that extreme
there is still a big difference between a fairly quiet local, or even a mid price restaurant ... and a city centre shots based bar running freshers nights | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go.
sorry . but you get my point of why you might not have witnessed it right?
I'm off out for a game of dominoes tonight.
aha ... nothing wrong with a game of dominos but i wasn't even suggesting that extreme
there is still a big difference between a fairly quiet local, or even a mid price restaurant ... and a city centre shots based bar running freshers nights "But that's linked to universities and keeping them lock downed is clearly creating more problems? | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though "A full lockdown. Lol. Think about it. The countries that had the strictest lockdowns - France & Spain. Their infections have risen. Why do you think this is? Because their population weren’t exposed to the virus back in the Spring... because they were locked down. A lockdown is counter intuitive. A lockdown is the complete opposite of what you need now. You have to build a level of immunity through a population for this virus to recede. How much longer before people realise this. | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ?" Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. | |||
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"I am slightly offended. I go where all the hip cool cats go.
sorry . but you get my point of why you might not have witnessed it right?
I'm off out for a game of dominoes tonight.
aha ... nothing wrong with a game of dominos but i wasn't even suggesting that extreme
there is still a big difference between a fairly quiet local, or even a mid price restaurant ... and a city centre shots based bar running freshers nights
But that's linked to universities and keeping them lock downed is clearly creating more problems?"its not really, young people will socialise wether they are at college/ work / uni, stayed at home/ moved away ... you don't have to be a student to drink in your late teens/ early twenties | |||
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"The main problem is that people don’t do what they say they would do - less than 20% of people with symptoms actually isolate and just over 10% do if they’re told that they have been in contact with someone who has tested positive. There’s loads of different reasons for that but a big one is money - needing to earn - and another big one is the totally confusing messages coming out from gov added to the Cummings debacle. Check out the Corsair report and the report from the Foresight Group (links below) https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.09.15.20191957v1.full.pdf https://www.ntu.ac.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0027/1177902/NTU-C19-NFG-Report-0920-Communications-and-the-Covid-19-Pandemic-Rapid-Report.pdf " i like to think of myself as fairly intelligent so maybe i'm doing a disservice to other people but i dont think people are that thick you cant tell me honestly that people can't understand the instructions or think dominic cummings is a reason to ignore them ... even with different rules across the country it takes minutes to google and read up on your local ones, and every time you turn on the tv, the radio, social media they are being reminded and clarified on the news + via local govt ads anyone who still doesn’t understand its because its suits them not to | |||
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"The virus is everywhere. It’s not pubs and restaurants to blame and the 10pm closure is forcing people to be together more after the pubs have closed! It’s ridiculous. " its not forcing anything... people should be more than capable of heading hone at 10pm ... if they get together afterwards its completely by choice why does nobody have any sense of personal accountability for their actions | |||
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"The virus is everywhere. It’s not pubs and restaurants to blame and the 10pm closure is forcing people to be together more after the pubs have closed! It’s ridiculous. its not forcing anything... people should be more than capable of heading hone at 10pm ... if they get together afterwards its completely by choice why does nobody have any sense of personal accountability for their actions " Maybe ‘forcing’ was the wrong word to use but people are meeting after the pubs have closed, for some it’s a natural activity. | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. " So who ? | |||
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"The virus is everywhere. It’s not pubs and restaurants to blame and the 10pm closure is forcing people to be together more after the pubs have closed! It’s ridiculous. its not forcing anything... people should be more than capable of heading hone at 10pm ... if they get together afterwards its completely by choice why does nobody have any sense of personal accountability for their actions Maybe ‘forcing’ was the wrong word to use but people are meeting after the pubs have closed, for some it’s a natural activity." well these people are either extremely thick or do not give a toss about the wider community either way there is no way the government can control that.  | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. So who ?" If your voting for a ruling government there is only a choice of two parties that will rule come the next election. One is the Tories and the other is Labour. Flouting voters must know this surely? | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. So who ? If your voting for a ruling government there is only a choice of two parties that will rule come the next election. One is the Tories and the other is Labour. Flouting voters must know this surely?" Yep both as bad as each other. Looks like I wont be voting next general election again. | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. So who ? If your voting for a ruling government there is only a choice of two parties that will rule come the next election. One is the Tories and the other is Labour. Flouting voters must know this surely? Yep both as bad as each other. Looks like I wont be voting next general election again. " Hey nigel could make a comeback with his new "close our borders party" by then....so dont give up hope just yet | |||
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"Please remember how useless this Tory government has been when you are next going to vote. I am a floating voter so who should I vote for ? Not the Tories. To be fair you have some very poor options in England, which means the UK has absolutely dire outcomes when it comes to 'Leadership' but surely you all must know the Tories only represent themselves and rich friends. So who ? If your voting for a ruling government there is only a choice of two parties that will rule come the next election. One is the Tories and the other is Labour. Flouting voters must know this surely? Yep both as bad as each other. Looks like I wont be voting next general election again. Hey nigel could make a comeback with his new "close our borders party" by then....so dont give up hope just yet "Hahaha | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though "Do you mean like France and Spain did. Were they needed permission to leave the house. How are they doing now. Lockdown now and all you’re going to do is push the virus into the winter. | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though
On 67 % of my basic wage ?
That wouldn't work for me."I'm up for the restrictions on the virus being spread but not a promoter of people being punished for decisions taken by and that benefit the state. | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though
Do you mean like France and Spain did. Were they needed permission to leave the house.
How are they doing now. Lockdown now and all you’re going to do is push the virus into the winter."It always depends on what measures are taken in full, rather than 1 isolated element, that may be counteracted by others. Our largest success here, as well as elsewhere was typically during full or partial lockdown. If we accept that our health services are unable to cope, managing virus related problems as well as the other health needs that people have, if we get rapid exponential growth in infection levels, then some form of restrictions are necessary. Winter is an especially harsh time for health care, so it's important to minimise the system load that must deal with it. There are a few people who don't want anything done, as long as they can live without any limits, as mad as it is. | |||
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"I think we need a full lockdown, as we had in the spring - not that it was as complete as in other countries. I think it's probably the only way to make a substantial reduction in the numbers. It needs test and tracing to be working though
On 67 % of my basic wage ?
That wouldn't work for me.
I'm up for the restrictions on the virus being spread but not a promoter of people being punished for decisions taken by and that benefit the state. "so does that mean in non covid time you are against increasing tax? or do we pick and choose when people receiving less of their wage is punishment? i dont think a lockdown would be for the benefit of the state ... its for the benefit of your neighbour | |||
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"Report in the FT today that 80% of cases here now are a variation which came from Spain in the summer, pretty sure it's safe to say it was bars and clubs etc where the virus was spread then brought back here.. High percentage of cases in other European countries of the same variant.." I read about this variant months ago it actually originated in south east Asia. It is said to be 10 times more infectious but 10 times less lethal. Which rings true now. | |||
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