FabSwingers.com forum: Perspective

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

just putting covid 19 into perspective..the worldwide deaths total 799,000 the majority of whom had existing serious medical issues. Malaria, and other mosquito transmitted diseases kill over 1 million every year and the majority of these are healthy people...the average death rate worldwide for flu each year is 650,000 yet neither the flu or mosquito born diseases cause the wide spread panic that covid 19 has done.

Just our thoughts...

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"just putting covid 19 into perspective..the worldwide deaths total 799,000 the majority of whom had existing serious medical issues. Malaria, and other mosquito transmitted diseases kill over 1 million every year and the majority of these are healthy people...the average death rate worldwide for flu each year is 650,000 yet neither the flu or mosquito born diseases cause the wide spread panic that covid 19 has done.

Just our thoughts..."

And there was just a podcast from LSHTM on the strain that Covid-19 will put on health resources and the knock on effects that will have for malaria. Antimalarial drugs are produced in India, which is quite hard hit.

It's a good reason to all do our bit to contain it, so that we don't increase the burden on those at risk of other serious diseases.

Good point. Stay safe, stay distance, wear a mask, save lives

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

Just our thoughts..."

Do you think some of the reaction is because it is new and unknown? And we haven't yet got through 12 months yet to understand what may happen. So there's an element of fear in the unknown.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just our thoughts..."

So... you're asking why we're more concerned about something that has killed 799,000 people in 8 months so far than something that usually kills 650,000 people in a year? I think the clue is in the question.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

While we're at it, working out how to contain Covid-19 will also help with HIV treatment and the eradication of polio.

It's good to point out how we can all do our bit to help huge global problems old and new, isn't it, OP?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

It'll be amazing to see the lessons of Covid containment and research applied to other illnesses too

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By *lan157Man
over a year ago

a village near Haywards Heath in East Sussex

More people die in the UK from smoking related diseases each year that the virus this year so far . I not making any point other than context about numbers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"More people die in the UK from smoking related diseases each year that the virus this year so far . I not making any point other than context about numbers. "

Well, yes. Smoking is generally acknowledged as a bad thing that people shouldn't do.

Is this whole thread going to be a list of things that are bad for people's health?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just our thoughts..."

So what are you saying? We shouldn't have had lockdown?

According to studies, without government intervention Covid-19 would have killed 40 million people in 2020 alone.

There's perspective for you.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

Just our thoughts..."

It's good to think..

Comparison is fine if you look at all examples equally, eg flu does kill yes but some of those will also have underlying health issues too..

Similarly people dying from malaria by definition are mainly in the do called third world where life expectancy is lower in general and the health systems nowhere like the west etc..

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

Just our thoughts..."

Just as well nearly every country on the planet had lockdown then, imagine it would have been a lot more than 799000

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

We have a lot of threads started that like a new perspective on this. Some of them are rooted in the conspiracy theories and denial that have been spawned typically by extremist political groups and often the orange US one repeats them, as they somehow support his do almost nothing to provide real help stance.

Often other large issues are brought in to the posts, perhaps because it can be difficult for some to accept the horrific realities of the current epidemic.

How you are personally affected by this has some bearing. Your employment, assets, investments, business interests, political mantras and voting history, amongst them.

We have to do the right thing with this virus, something that has been in short supply in many countries of the world. These repetitive memes etc are often non-specific in what approaches have been superior, their stance on the New Zealand strategy and how we could have had an outcome closer to theirs.

Certainly, the approach in the extremist USA, Brazil and others is something to take immediate decisions on, so that we don't act similarly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just our thoughts..."
Those are my thoughts as well, stay safe all

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Wearing a mask dosent work the virus is not ad bad as people and the mass media and controlling govt are making out. Its all about control and subservient. Watch the classic film They Live it will open your eyes and hopefully wake up the majority of sheep

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just our thoughts...

It's good to think..

Comparison is fine if you look at all examples equally, eg flu does kill yes but some of those will also have underlying health issues too..

Similarly people dying from malaria by definition are mainly in the do called third world where life expectancy is lower in general and the health systems nowhere like the west etc..

How do you compare a relatively ignored disease to a virus that's had more attention paid to it than any other virus in human history.

If you want to compare apples with apples you need to compare malaria with the numbers Covid-19 would have taken without intervention.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

2 hours for the first wake up sheeple.... Yay!

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Wearing a mask dosent work the virus is not ad bad as people and the mass media and controlling govt are making out. Its all about control and subservient. Watch the classic film They Live it will open your eyes and hopefully wake up the majority of sheep"

Baa. I understand science. Baa.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"2 hours for the first wake up sheeple.... Yay! "

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"2 hours for the first wake up sheeple.... Yay! "

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By *iddle ManMan
over a year ago

Walsall

Just our thoughts...

It's good to think..

Comparison is fine if you look at all examples equally, eg flu does kill yes but some of those will also have underlying health issues too..

Similarly people dying from malaria by definition are mainly in the do called third world where life expectancy is lower in general and the health systems nowhere like the west etc..

How do you compare a relatively ignored disease to a virus that's had more attention paid to it than any other virus in human history.

If you want to compare apples with apples you need to compare malaria with the numbers Covid-19 would have taken without intervention. "

Another part to play is the regions that maleria tends to hit most. A lot of the so called developed world is not impacted as much by maleria and so we tend to be blinkered, similar to other outbreaks of diseases and virus, if they aren't causing us bother we are all guilty of brushing it all under the carpet. Covid has not been contained and as had a huge impact globally, therefore has had much more coverage and a lot more noticeable even despite most people have zero symptoms.

I think only time will tell as how effective the world has tackled his pandemic and it seems a race now for each country to put on a brave face and claim were back to normal and get the economy going. Its important in a world scale as those that linger behind will have their future economy thrown into the dark ages as the rest of the covid free or vaccinated world will push on. Like I said though only time will tell and nonone knows how it will pan out.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

The podcast I listened to on malaria and Covid (LSHTM Viral) said the areas that are most impacted by malaria haven't had significant outbreaks yet.

But that Covid related disruption could double the death rate from malaria in places like Nigeria, and in general set the death toll back 20 years.

So we need to fight Covid to save poorer nations from a really vile plight.

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count. "

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

Which lab are you associated with and what qualifications do you have to allow you to research effectively?

Or do you mean "look stuff up on Google that doesn't fit what the media are telling you?"

That's not research, that's internet searching and motivated reasoning with a side of Dunning Kruger.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

It's time we call out "do your own research" for what it is.

The internet contains a lot of junk masquerading as information.

If you look, you'll find it.

If you don't know how to vet sources and you don't understand what you're reading, you might believe it.

It's quite literally the job of scientists to figure this stuff out. If you don't have training in critical thinking, source analysis, statistics, and many other things besides, you probably don't know what you're talking about and should probably leave it to people who do.

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By *all me FlikWoman
over a year ago

Galaxy Far Far Away

....and its this kind of belief that will mean we are in this for longer, more people will lose their jobs, more people will die etc. Its dangerous and irresponsible and sadly easily spread on the Internet.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

Would you like us to go back to having more people die from the virus then. Would that make you happy? Because those are your choices. A few people being affected by mental health issues or millions being affected by Covid-19.

Restrictions are not in place because someone thought they would be fun. They are in place because they are they lesser of two evils. And compared to lockdowns other countries have in place they are seriously relaxed.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

I don't need to do research to check bullshit.

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By *rank speakerMan
over a year ago

Worcester

Just our thoughts...

Do you think some of the reaction is because it is new and unknown? And we haven't yet got through 12 months yet to understand what may happen. So there's an element of fear in the unknown. "

Very much this! And the unknown long term after effects which seem very varied? Good call!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

When you have have fudged the figures so badly that your reported stats go negative then more people have been killed by falling pianos than Covid-19.

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By *esireXposedMan
over a year ago

East sussex

But Tattooed Guy is right though!

They Live is a great film

Fact Checked 22.08.20 by my mum.

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By *etcplCouple
over a year ago

Gapping Fanny

I'm sure Hot Rod is looking down on us with his maniacal laugh at "They Live" being called a "classic".

What next, Escape from New York being the business plan for Trumps border wall?

The virus is real. Its killing a lot of people despite all the measures put in place. Without them it would be a blood bath.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure Hot Rod is looking down on us with his maniacal laugh at "They Live" being called a "classic".

What next, Escape from New York being the business plan for Trumps border wall?

The virus is real. Its killing a lot of people despite all the measures put in place. Without them it would be a blood bath.

I didn't realise the inability to distinguish fiction from reality was such a common problem.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"It's time we call out "do your own research" for what it is.

The internet contains a lot of junk masquerading as information.

If you look, you'll find it.

If you don't know how to vet sources and you don't understand what you're reading, you might believe it.

This

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Bless

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"Watch the classic film They Live it will open your eyes..."

--------------------------

Yes it opens the eyes of idiots who think - this is all about control and subservient.

I wonder what criteria was used to describe it as a 'classic film'

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

So the gmnt are making themselves look,even more, completely incompetent and exaggerating the death rate so they look even worse..in.order for us to be more subservient?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?"

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

That is complete fiction..

Several weeks ago the virus was killing just under a thousand every day..

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

If it is an allowed link yes, but to be fair I knew the answer would be a hell of a lot higher, I was just asking the OP to see if she knew

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By *ebbie69Couple
over a year ago

milton keynes

Just our thoughts..."

Spain and Italy have superb health systems but both collapsed under covid. I don't think flu or malaria could have done that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

If it is an allowed link yes, but to be fair I knew the answer would be a hell of a lot higher, I was just asking the OP to see if she knew

Well here it is:

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/196496/coronavirus-pandemic-could-have-caused-40/

It makes interesting reading for those who don't get how bad things could have been.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

If it is an allowed link yes, but to be fair I knew the answer would be a hell of a lot higher, I was just asking the OP to see if she knew

Well here it is:

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/196496/coronavirus-pandemic-could-have-caused-40/

It makes interesting reading for those who don't get how bad things could have been."

I heard that public health aims to look like it's overreacted. Because it's better than the alternative

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'

That is complete fiction..

Several weeks ago the virus was killing just under a thousand every day..

People have very short memories.

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry

Do your own research = 20+ hours of weapons grade batshit video coupled with a side order of disinformation via facebook.

I'm past feeling sorry for these enlightened imbeciles, by now I might just rise to contempt. The saddest part of these brainwashed fools is the cost in human lives.

Just my thoughts...

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'

That is complete fiction..

Several weeks ago the virus was killing just under a thousand every day..

People have very short memories. "

I remember the ancient history of February or March when the massive, newly four figure death toll in Italy was regarded as shocking and outrageous. It could never happen here.

And now tens of thousands of deaths later and it's just a sniffle and we should let people get on with it.

It baffles me.

I even remember the distant (to me) fear of the original SARS, from the vantage point of Australia. And that was 18-ish years ago.

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

"Watch the classic film They Live it will open your eyes..."

--------------------------

Yes it opens the eyes of idiots who think - this is all about control and subservient.

I wonder what criteria was used to describe it as a 'classic film'

In watched the Incredibles, but I don't actually beleive in stretchy people

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"Watch the classic film They Live it will open your eyes..."

--------------------------

Yes it opens the eyes of idiots who think - this is all about control and subservient.

I wonder what criteria was used to describe it as a 'classic film'

In watched the Incredibles, but I don't actually beleive in stretchy people

Well if we are talking classic films.. The wizard of oz was good...

Fucking tin men taking over the world... I saw it in a film once

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 22/08/20 21:48:15]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why do some people keep trying to downplay Covid?

It's killed a hell of a lot of people around the world, despite the fact a lot of the world took measures to minimise its death toll. Imagine how much worse it would have been if we'd all just shrugged it off as no big deal. How many would have died then? How many national healthcare systems would have crumbled?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Why do some people keep trying to downplay Covid?

A combination of not wanting to confront how scary it is, and callousness. They'll probably (*they think definitely) be fine, therefore it's inconvenient.

It'd have been devastating on the economy, on health, on education if it had just ripped through without the intervention we took. Much more than it is.

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By *J647Couple
over a year ago

Daventry

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

Such a word could, dose not meen it will happen, people now look at the word could & think this is what would have happened, no one really knows what will or won't happen, most experts look at the figures coming in & make their best gues

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

By guess, you mean they examine the data and create models based upon what they know?

It's not the same as making it up.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

Identify your credible sources. Peer reviewed research evidence, published in reputable scientific literature, is credible.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

**"... most experts look at the figures coming in.."**

--------------

And that's what experts do; they look at figures (data) and make calculations based on that. They don't make wild guesses from thin air like conspiracy theorists do.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

**"... most experts look at the figures coming in.."**

--------------

And that's what experts do; they look at figures (data) and make calculations based on that. They don't make wild guesses from thin air like conspiracy theorists do."

Sadly it's not just conspiracy theorists. I remember Gove publicly stating people had had quite enough of experts. People like him helped erode trust in facts and experts.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

Have you ever done any statistics work? We learned fractions aged 9-10 and basic statistics a lot later. It would be illuminating to hear of your expertise level in statistics. I've got some numbers that I've crunched and it would be great to get a second opinion before publication.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

**"... most experts look at the figures coming in.."**

--------------

And that's what experts do; they look at figures (data) and make calculations based on that. They don't make wild guesses from thin air like conspiracy theorists do.

Sadly it's not just conspiracy theorists. I remember Gove publicly stating people had had quite enough of experts. People like him helped erode trust in facts and experts."

Our comfortable safe lives depend entirely on facts and experts.

Jesus wept.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

I've been taught enough statistics to know I don't want to go anywhere near that

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

Hi, degree level mathematics and physics here, with 40 years experience in software engineering, a keen interest in biological processes and genetics, and a lifetime of logical reasoning. Back in February/March when most people were denying it would hit the UK, I was posting 90% accurate predictions of the virus spread in this forum.

There is in fact a ridiculously simple method of estimating what the eventual global death toll would be if no efforts at all were made to slow the progress of the disease. It has been seen that it is incredibly infectious, with case numbers doubling every two to four days when social interaction is uncontrolled. When intensive health care is available, only about 1% of those infected die. When no health care is available, or health resources are overwhelmed by patients, then death rate is much higher, possibly in the range of 5 to 10%. Under these circumstances there will also be consequential deaths amongst those with other health problems who are unable to receive the care and drugs they require.

At a conservative estimate, if unchecked eventually at least 50% of the world population would be infected - and as we have seen, with exponential growth this would occur very quickly and health resources would certainly be overwhelmed. Of those infected, somewhere between 1% and 10% would certainly die, ie. somewhere between 0.5% to 5% of the global population.

World population is currently just over 7.5 billion - giving a minimum death toll of 37.5 million people, maximum death toll of 375 million people.

The ONLY reason that the current death toll is much lower is because of the extreme measures that have been taken in every country on earth. Huge amounts of money have been spent - to avert at the very least the deaths of ten of millions, and prevent the certainty of global economic collapse.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

World population is currently just over 7.5 billion - giving a minimum death toll of 37.5 million people, maximum death toll of 375 million people.

Very good to see clear facts. Thank you.

(Expect somebody to pop by soon and say they heard something down the pub that trumps your facts and expertise.)

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By *ungblackbullMan
over a year ago

scotland

Congratulations.

Wrong on every single count.

No im not do your own research, more people have died during this lockdown each week due to suicide and mental health than those weekly from the 'Virus'"

Seriously engage your brain and think about what you have written...

Just over 6,000 suicides year in uk.

A claim that suicides up 200% during lockdown has been dismissed by the Samaritans.

You say more deaths EACH week which suggests that every week there has been more deaths from suicide than the virus. Sorry, but I very much doubt that mid April which was just 3 weeks after lockdown started there were more deaths than the peak of the virus in terms of deaths. This claim might be true now deaths have been significantly reduced and people have have had 5 months of lockdown.

So, there is my research and application of some common sense!

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By *ungblackbullMan
over a year ago

scotland

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

World population is currently just over 7.5 billion - giving a minimum death toll of 37.5 million people, maximum death toll of 375 million people.

Almost agree with this. The exception being the figures. The death rate is likely below 1%. The maximum death toll would be 37.5m but I suspect that death rate would never be that high because the old and vulnerable would always be protected even if we let the virus do its thing...

It's still a ridiculous number of deaths and anyone who compares this to flu or malaria and dimisses your points needs to engage their brain.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"How many deaths do you think there would have been if there had been no lock downs in most countries?

"Coronavirus pandemic could have caused 40 million deaths if left unchecked"

From Imperial College London. I can provide a link if it's allowed.

World population is currently just over 7.5 billion - giving a minimum death toll of 37.5 million people, maximum death toll of 375 million people.

It's still a ridiculous number of deaths and anyone who compares this to flu or malaria and dimisses your points needs to engage their brain."

Hmm. The death rate is below 1% now, with some effective treatment and health systems that can cope.

Early on we didn't know how to treat it so the death rate was higher. If it'd been left to rip through we'd have seen more of that.

Additionally, if a health system collapses, people will die who will otherwise be saved.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

Yesterday in England we are told 18 died of covid.What is the total of people who died in England yesterday?I would guess a few thousand

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"Yesterday in England we are told 18 died of covid.What is the total of people who died in England yesterday?I would guess a few thousand"

I suggest you read the above again about prevention, and try again.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus."
Glad we have mainstream media then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.Glad we have mainstream media then"
Yes and no, it depends how they report it, by saying 3 cases and it is escalating. I wouldnt use the word escalating there.

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By *reeman76Man
over a year ago

oldbury

There’s a lot to the this virus that we just don’t know yet, there seems to be a group of people who have recovered from virus who are still having long term debilitating health issues like blood clotting, heart damage, arrhythmia, lung scarring etc. It’s not the common cold or the flu to some people.

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By *reeman76Man
over a year ago

oldbury

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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago

leeds

Just our thoughts...

So what are you saying? We shouldn't have had lockdown?

According to studies, without government intervention Covid-19 would have killed 40 million people in 2020 alone.

There's perspective for you."

Agree lockdown was essential

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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago

leeds

Tell the 65k families this year additional deaths All in the imagination.

Totally disrespectful to them you should be ashamed

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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago

leeds

"Yesterday in England we are told 18 died of covid.What is the total of people who died in England yesterday?I would guess a few thousand

I suggest you read the above again about prevention, and try again."

Most people take over 4 eeks to due ventilator etc so not counted on stats anymore. Called fixing the figures

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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago

leeds

Take 4 weeks to die

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By *on12xxMan
over a year ago

leeds

By the way the earth earth isn't flat!!!!

This is serious open your eyes

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus."

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

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By *egasus NobMan
over a year ago

Merton

Just our thoughts..."

Perspective is Covid 19 was unknown and how it transfer from one person to another was and still probably unknown, flu and malaria are known. If you look at the history of major virus like smallpox, Spanish flu, measles I think you might have another perspective.

Now is it as bad as the media says well that is subjective.

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By *eastAndTheHarlotCouple
over a year ago

Hartlepool

You people really won't give a shit until it's YOUR family dying.

Yes other diseases kill and that's why people do everything in their power to prevent it. Mosquito nets, treatment, vaccines etc.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication. "
They do hype it up tho, it is good not to just rely on one source but to look on many and then form your own conclusions over it.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication. They do hype it up tho, it is good not to just rely on one source but to look on many and then form your own conclusions over it."

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"Yesterday in England we are told 18 died of covid.What is the total of people who died in England yesterday?I would guess a few thousand

I suggest you read the above again about prevention, and try again.

Most people take over 4 eeks to due ventilator etc so not counted on stats anymore. Called fixing the figures "

**"...Most people take over 4 weeks to die ..."**

----------

That's true, some people take more than 28 days in hospital before they die of Covid.

Now those people will not be included in the covid deaths - meaning that the true number of covid death will always be higher than what we are told.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific."
That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

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By *lackCherry...Woman
over a year ago

North East

Just our thoughts...

Just as well nearly every country on the planet had lockdown then, imagine it would have been a lot more than 799000

This ^^^^ people are quoting the death toll but seem to be forgetting this is after most of the world went into lockdown. Without world wide lockdown and precautions being taken the death toll would be much higher

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself there

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself there"
In what way there? If I hear something on the mainstream news I look also elsewhere about it.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself thereIn what way there? If I hear something on the mainstream news I look also elsewhere about it."

From your first comment to your in between and last. The media are not doing the right thing to they are getting it right

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication. "

I dislike that impression 'mainstream media' Its a US import loaded with negative meaning and indicates a particular prejudice when knowing and purposefully used. That said the current conservative cabinet were shown to incompetent, dithering and unprepared in their daily briefings and media appearances. Paxman has retired, in 2020 Piers Morgan was the man they feared. That says it all.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Quite.

The media are a source of information. How reliable, up for debate

And I hate how it's some sort of perjorative. The mainstream media as opposed to... websites set up by anyone?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself thereIn what way there? If I hear something on the mainstream news I look also elsewhere about it.

From your first comment to your in between and last. The media are not doing the right thing to they are getting it right"
I didnt say that. I said you had to look around and not just rely on one media source.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Cant stand him but he was the only holding them to account.

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By *apiomanMan
over a year ago

Shipley

The reality is malaria affects developing (ie poor) nations, and flu affects that number of people with a vaccine available. If we hadn’t made massive efforts across the globe to slow the spread of COVID-19 these figures would be far worse.

It is also dangerous to think it is only people who are already nearly dead who will die. I know two people who have died, one who was very healthy and young.

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By *iventake84Man
over a year ago

Manchester

It is fascinating how influencial public perception / reaction is.

Is it the government who control us or the media?

MPs want your votes and editors want to sell their stories.

The political landscape and media industry that we currently have is ultimately a result of our behaviour.

I honestly believe that how us plebs behave does ultimately shape the world we live in.

So don't feel controlled, feel empowered.

Don't discriminate, see commonality.

Be less self centred and more considerate of others.

Be positive and do your bit.

Even if every single person just stopped littering, that would be a result!

This is my perspective, for what it's worth.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself thereIn what way there? If I hear something on the mainstream news I look also elsewhere about it.

From your first comment to your in between and last. The media are not doing the right thing to they are getting it rightI didnt say that. I said you had to look around and not just rely on one media source."

You said "also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus."...now you are saying you find your news from other sources.

If you found your Covid news from other sources then you are contradicting yourself

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Cant stand him but he was the only holding them to account."

But his ego is enormous, he thinks if he posts on Twitter, then they do a U turn that they did it because of him

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Cant stand him but he was the only holding them to account."

He was the only one on TV, they knew to avoid C4 news and Newsnight. The Today programme on R4 did make Grant Shapps wish that he died as a young child. They disembowelled him and left him out for the dogs.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Cant stand him but he was the only holding them to account.

But his ego is enormous, he thinks if he posts on Twitter, then they do a U turn that they did it because of him

He is a massive bellend...but it was quite funny seeing him roast every clueless idiot they put out

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

The (non mainstream media) reports I've heard from the front lines have been absolutely harrowing. The fact that you or I weren't personally hurt by it doesn't mean it wasn't absolutely horrific.That is also right and that goes as well for other news, not just about the virus, to see what is going on

You contradicted yourself thereIn what way there? If I hear something on the mainstream news I look also elsewhere about it.

You said "also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus."...now you are saying you find your news from other sources.

If you found your Covid news from other sources then you are contradicting yourself

"
I see, maibe its abit confusing there. I dont think I do as I am comparing the sources? I think one way what the mainstream media does and one way what the alternative media does.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just our thoughts..."

I think the issue for my health and well-being is not so much the death rate but the long-term effects of Covid such as organ failure, respiratory failure, blood clotting and maybe brain damage as well. Yes it is a virus that kills but it actually is as much as a virus that disables long-term. If one contracts flu or malaria, there are sufficient therapies to recover a reasonable quality of life.

At the moment, COVID has the upper hand and wlll continue to do so until a vaccine and other medications are developed. As much as it’s frustrating and screwing up my sex life, I’m happy to maintain the current restrictions until we know everything is gonna be a lot safer.

This is of course my own opinion and as I’m only responsible for my own health, I have no opinion how others see it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I voted to remain in the EU so our economy wouldn’t go down the drain, you lot voted to leave.

I’m against the lockdown so our economy doesn’t go down the drain, but you’re all for a lockdown.

I’m starting to think Fab doesn’t really understand economics.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

Just our thoughts...

This is of course my own opinion and as I’m only responsible for my own health, I have no opinion how others see it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I voted to remain in the EU so our economy wouldn’t go down the drain, you lot voted to leave.

I’m against the lockdown so our economy doesn’t go down the drain, but you’re all for a lockdown.

I’m starting to think Fab doesn’t really understand economics."

Wow generalisations abound.

We HAD a form of lockdown (which worked) - get over it.

We're leaving the EU - get over it.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"It is fascinating how influencial public perception / reaction is.

Is it the government who control us or the media?

MPs want your votes and editors want to sell their stories.

The political landscape and media industry that we currently have is ultimately a result of our behaviour.

I honestly believe that how us plebs behave does ultimately shape the world we live in.

So don't feel controlled, feel empowered.

Don't discriminate, see commonality.

Be less self centred and more considerate of others.

Be positive and do your bit.

Even if every single person just stopped littering, that would be a result!

This is my perspective, for what it's worth. "

Great comment

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"I voted to remain in the EU so our economy wouldn’t go down the drain, you lot voted to leave.

I’m against the lockdown so our economy doesn’t go down the drain, but you’re all for a lockdown.

I’m starting to think Fab doesn’t really understand economics."

I voted to remain in the EU. We're leaving, I think it'll be a disaster, but, that's the way it's gone.

I think the economy serves humanity and not the other way around, and lots of dead people would be disastrous for the economy. I also think that that's where the evidence points.

Nice generalisations, point not so well made.

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"I voted to remain in the EU so our economy wouldn’t go down the drain, you lot voted to leave.

I’m against the lockdown so our economy doesn’t go down the drain, but you’re all for a lockdown.

I’m starting to think Fab doesn’t really understand economics."

So you'd rather we hadn't had the lockdown and just dug fucking great holes to tip the bodies into?

Way to go Mr Economics Expert...

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

"I also want to add that if it wasnt for the "mainstream" media, you wouldnt notice there was a virus.

Quite the opposite.

You should say thank you to the mainstream media which has helped convey the details we need to adhere to in order prevent the spread of the virus.

Without the mainstream media, the problem would have been worse due to lack of communication.

Cant stand him but he was the only holding them to account.

Great, all well and good that the media... Some of the media make fools of politicians... But our democracy demands her majesties opposition hold government to account. There's been neer a peep from them or indeed our second chamber, the house of Lords.

I'm all for the govt being reported but the job is that of the opposition and the second chamber. Its sad when a tweet from some jumped up ego maniac like piers Morgan does more to shape policy than a proper debate in our political Chambers by those650 mps who we elected to serve us

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"I voted to remain in the EU so our economy wouldn’t go down the drain, you lot voted to leave.

I’m against the lockdown so our economy doesn’t go down the drain, but you’re all for a lockdown.

I’m starting to think Fab doesn’t really understand economics.

So you'd rather we hadn't had the lockdown and just dug fucking great holes to tip the bodies into?

Way to go Mr Economics Expert..."
Maybe the majority is right,there is a lot more to life than economics,look around you

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