FabSwingers.com forum: vaccines for all makes no sense

By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

Can anyone explain to me why you would need to vaccinate everyone for a virus 99.5% of people will recover from with paracetamol? Is it because paracetamol is cheap to buy? Why not just vaccinate the at risk groups?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Do you really have to ask?? Seriously?

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By *elshsunsWoman
over a year ago

Flintshire

No vaccine for me thank you !!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would suggest if you're struggling with this basic concept... then probably not.

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By *lk GuyMan
over a year ago

sheffield

I’ve always said something don’t seem right

It’s a virus and you can’t stop it

Even with flu vaccine people still catch it

And if it doesn’t effect kids

I’m sure they build up or tolerances level for when older

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

Because in a population of 66 million that little 0.5% mortality rate is enough to to kill up to 330,000 people

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

Though I take the point. Vaccinating the oldest 30% of the population should be sufficient to reduce further deaths to a couple of thousand.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’ve always said something don’t seem right

It’s a virus and you can’t stop it

Even with flu vaccine people still catch it

And if it doesn’t effect kids

I’m sure they build up or tolerances level for when older"

Flu is not just one particular virus, flu vaccine only stops you getting what they think are going to be the most prevalent strains that particular year. Therefore you can still catch others. Also, with Covid, there is not currently any evidence that once you have Covid and recover that you are immune for life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Step away from the keyboard and go do some basic reading on how a vaccine works.

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By *eavenNhellCouple
over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

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By *arksxMan
over a year ago

Leicester / London

I think we are all curious,exacerbated and fed with trolls and conspiracy theories on here.

However if your question is from on honest place. Learning how the transmission of a virus spreads through the r0 is a good place to start.

We are 6 months into this now and I'm still shocked how American and UK governments can relay a simple explanation. Steven soderberg explained twice in a 90 minute film.

https://youtu.be/X-YR3UlH3aA

(if) a vaccine can be found.

The priority should not be rich countries or those with existing medical infrastructure.

It should be africa, India places with a large population and little or now medical facilities

Where social distancing is hard to maintain because of socio-economic factors.

Undoubtedly though president mango man will buy all the stock piles up and find another way to break and already insane an American health care model.

Just think about that when all the big brexit and America trade deals are talked about.

Because you can kiss goodbye to the NHS as we know it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think we are all curious,exacerbated and fed with trolls and conspiracy theories on here.

However if your question is from on honest place. Learning how the transmission of a virus spreads through the r0 is a good place to start.

We are 6 months into this now and I'm still shocked how American and UK governments can relay a simple explanation. Steven soderberg explained twice in a 90 minute film.

https://youtu.be/X-YR3UlH3aA

(if) a vaccine can be found.

The priority should not be rich countries or those with existing medical infrastructure.

It should be africa, India places with a large population and little or now medical facilities

Where social distancing is hard to maintain because of socio-economic factors.

Undoubtedly though president mango man will buy all the stock piles up and find another way to break and already insane an American health care model.

Just think about that when all the big brexit and America trade deals are talked about.

Because you can kiss goodbye to the NHS as we know it

The UK has already secured doses of I believe 4 of the most promising vaccines.

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Step away from the keyboard and go do some basic reading on how a vaccine works. "

If only...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense.

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"I’ve always said something don’t seem right

It’s a virus and you can’t stop it

Even with flu vaccine people still catch it

And if it doesn’t effect kids

I’m sure they build up or tolerances level for when older"

And you're basing that well thought out statement on your obviously extensive scientific knowledge and research?

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

We don't know who would be offered the vaccine on the NHS, if one materialises. The flu vaccine is offered only to certain at risk groups - if I want one, I have to buy it from Boots etc. It might be the same with the SARS-COV-2 vaccine - at risk groups only or at least in the first wave of vaccination. There might be the chance for people in lower risk groups to buy it in Boots. We don't know because we haven't actually got a confirmed, working vaccine yet. We have candidates with varying levels of promise, but nothing fully ready. Why speculate before anyone knows anything?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense."

its because... depending on the variant... you may need more than one dose for you to be protected....

ta daaaaaaa!!!!!!!!

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

I imagine that the UK will target it's older and shielded groups first. The most vulnerable will take priority unless there is so much of the stuff that anyone and everyone can get it. Of course it will be like Kryptonite to some. It will give some a feeling of immortality. Some already have that feeling. Of course there will be people who will decline a vaccination and that's their choice.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Vaccination can eliminate the virus, then, no one is at risk. “It’s just a little prick”, as my old girlfriend used to say far too regularly (she was a nurse).

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Nobody is going to force all to take it anyway.

I don’t know why people get so het up about vaccines. Exercise your right not to have one simple

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We don't know who would be offered the vaccine on the NHS, if one materialises. The flu vaccine is offered only to certain at risk groups - if I want one, I have to buy it from Boots etc. It might be the same with the SARS-COV-2 vaccine - at risk groups only or at least in the first wave of vaccination. There might be the chance for people in lower risk groups to buy it in Boots. We don't know because we haven't actually got a confirmed, working vaccine yet. We have candidates with varying levels of promise, but nothing fully ready. Why speculate before anyone knows anything? "

Definitely your last sentence

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

I don't think we will be forced to be injected but maybe a government incentive like a £25 John Lewis voucher maybe

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Nobody is going to force all to take it anyway.

I don’t know why people get so het up about vaccines. Exercise your right not to have one simple "

Or just have one...

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Intetesting points though. Children are vaccinated before they are old enough to give consent. What about vulnerable people in institutions. Who decides ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Exactly and when people start saying it’s so you don’t infect the sick, taking that stance is admitting the vaccine will not offer protection to the already vaccinated at risk group, who will still be able to catch it even with vaccine.

Personally I want to see the insert, which will list the side effects, risks associated with the vaccine and the mortality rate. If the chance of severe adverse reaction is more than 0.5% then it would be a no from me

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

"Nobody is going to force all to take it anyway.

I don’t know why people get so het up about vaccines. Exercise your right not to have one simple

Or just have one... "

I don’t believe they should be forced on all. Although my position is I will happily have an approved one.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

The trouble is,

If you read the insert and looked at possible side effects then you wouldn't take any medicine.

The insert seems to be a way for the manufacturer to avoid liability if you get a reaction

There won't be enough data at the start of the vaccination.

If 80% of us take it then we don't know if it will poison us

It's like a game of Russian Roulette except we don't know how many chambers are in the revolver and if there are any bullets

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Intetesting points though. Children are vaccinated before they are old enough to give consent. What about vulnerable people in institutions. Who decides ?"

The Mental Capacity Act covers them.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

If there are more than one vaccines brought to market then which one do you choose. Do you have a choice..

Bit like Nike or Adidas...

Which performs the best.?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

No vaccine is 100% effective. Some people will not be able to have the vaccine due to for example allergies to certain ingredients. The main point of most vaccines is not to protect the person who has the vaccine it to protect everyone. If enough people are vaccinated you achieve herd immunity so everyone is protected even people who don't have the vaccine. Alternatively wait for natural herd immunity which could take 100s of years.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

It will either be made mandatory through direct legislation or (more likely) through indirect legislation such as mandating that people carry certificates of vaccination in order to be able to leave house arrest. "

Well to be fair it might be that countries insist on vaccination passports in order to travel on planes. Don't they do that with dogs ?

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Doubt it.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

To be fair they already vaccinate us without consent for the so called greater good. They put fluoride in our tap water and something in flour. Even our bread is tainted. Home made or not.

Next step could be forced vaccination

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

To be fair they already vaccinate us without consent for the so called greater good. They put fluoride in our tap water and something in flour. Even our bread is tainted. Home made or not.

Next step could be forced vaccination"

You do know fluoride isn't a vaccine and is B vitamins they add to flour which again are rather good for us!

There will be no forced vaccinations there's no need as thankfully the 70% who have commonsense and don't get our information from Facebook would result in enough heard immunity.

I really wish some people could be sent back to the 1930 prior to vaccination programmes when simple diseases like measles killed in their thousands would make them see why vaccinations are a good thing.

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

To be fair they already vaccinate us without consent for the so called greater good. They put fluoride in our tap water and something in flour. Even our bread is tainted. Home made or not.

Next step could be forced vaccination

You do know fluoride isn't a vaccine and is B vitamins they add to flour which again are rather good for us!

There will be no forced vaccinations there's no need as thankfully the 70% who have commonsense and don't get our information from Facebook would result in enough heard immunity.

There's enough people here old enough to remember Polio.

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

Oh bloody hell, they need a face palm emote.

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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago

near ipswich

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Poll today in uk papers showing only 53% would definitely take a corovavirus vaccine.

I'm sure this figure will continue to fall as time goes on.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There probably wont be a vaccine in our life time, so something to make the symptoms better and manage it, is more likely to be what will happen, like they are researching polvo I think it is called with the asthma inhalers

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By *est Wales WifeCouple
over a year ago

Near Carmarthen

Paracetamol is not a treatment for Covid 19. There is some evidence that hydroxychloroquine is effective but there are also side affects for some people with certain conditions which is why it got some bad press.

The reason to vaccinate everyone is so that big Pharma can make a lot of money that's why they have been resisting more research into hydroxychloroquine.

If a vaccine is developed (a big if) it's safety may be questionable as they have skipped stage 1 and 2 trials, it may lose efficacy because of mutations and it may only be partially effective (Flu vaccines are only about 40-50% effective).

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk."

They force us to drink fluoride in our drinking water whether we like it or not and tamper with natural flour. Who knows what else these mad scientists do in the name of our health

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Apparently Stockholm is nearing herd immunity.

That may be our only realistic way out. Which is bad

new for those still shielding etc.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Can anyone explain to me why you would need to vaccinate everyone for a virus 99.5% of people will recover from with paracetamol? Is it because paracetamol is cheap to buy? Why not just vaccinate the at risk groups? *face slap* because thats 350,000 people just in the UK and roughly 40m world wide. The world economy has ground to a halt, lives are turned upside down, health services are collapsing and millions will die ... why wouldnt you have a vaccine?

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"Poll today in uk papers showing only 53% would definitely take a corovavirus vaccine.

I'm sure this figure will continue to fall as time goes on."

PMSL - one minute the media is 'brainwashing the unthinking masses' but then it's suddenly acceptable if it helps add weight to a selective narrative...

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Apparently Stockholm is nearing herd immunity.

That may be our only realistic way out. Which is bad

new for those still shielding etc. "

When rat poison is laid then it kills most of the rats. Some survive, some had a low dose and build up some immunity which is passed onto the baby rats.. that's why, over time, rat poison stops working.. that's pretty much herd immunity.

Just hope I am one of the lucky rats eh ?

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By *est Wales WifeCouple
over a year ago

Near Carmarthen

If people want to know why I won't be having a vaccine it's probably for the same reason vaccine manufacturers have made sure that they are exempt from liability.

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

"Apparently Stockholm is nearing herd immunity.

That may be our only realistic way out. Which is bad

new for those still shielding etc.

Just hope I am one of the lucky rats eh ?

Fingers crossed

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By *az080378Woman
over a year ago

Cromer

I don't understand where the concept of mandatory vaccination has come from and why people are so focused on it!

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By *arksxMan
over a year ago

Leicester / London

"I imagine that the UK will target it's older and shielded groups first. The most vulnerable will take priority unless there is so much of the stuff that anyone and everyone can get it. Of course it will be like Kryptonite to some. It will give some a feeling of immortality. Some already have that feeling. Of course there will be people who will decline a vaccination and that's their choice.

Wow of all the of frankly "out there" comments in this thread.

This one has the least scientific grounding.

You don't inoculation those at risk first, you inoculation those who are most likely to spread the virus first.

That's why countries which could be described as 3rd world or LEDC.

Should take priority.

The main aim is to limit the spread and hopefully corral the virus into pockets. Which will allow containment and with actual working track and trace programs to limit the spread further.

The reason N. America, UK, EU have "committed" not actually bought vacations is to allow a supply chain to be created.

The irony is undoubtedly (if) a vaccine can be found. It will be produced in china or India.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If people want to know why I won't be having a vaccine it's probably for the same reason vaccine manufacturers have made sure that they are exempt from liability."

Couldn't care less actually.

I assume the majority of leaflets of meds are written to provide indemnity to the company without actually stating it (and their insurance covers the rest). Into holistic therapies are we?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?"

And again: the mental capacity act.

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By *arksxMan
over a year ago

Leicester / London

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?"

Sneak chemicals?

Are you talking about fluoride?

Err this has been public knowledge since it was first introduced.

And was done so for numerous medical reasons.

If you don't like it, you cna but bottled mineral water.

Or the new craze of water without minerals... You know the good stuff in water

Have heard what other countries say about British teeth?

I don't blame them either.

Oral hygiene is poor in the uk

And so are generally the condition of most peoples teeth

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?

Sneak chemicals?

Are you talking about fluoride?

Err this has been public knowledge since it was first introduced.

And was done so for numerous medical reasons.

If you don't like it, you cna but bottled mineral water.

Or the new craze of water without minerals... You know the good stuff in water

Have heard what other countries say about British teeth?

I don't blame them either.

Oral hygiene is poor in the uk

And so are generally the condition of most peoples teeth "

Failed experiment then...

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"I don't understand where the concept of mandatory vaccination has come from and why people are so focused on it!

The only time I've seen the word 'mandatory' in the context of vaccination has been in posts by wannabe leaders and armchair revolutionaries.

Common sense goes out of the window.

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?"

'Sneaking' as in telling us what they're putting in and listing it in the ingredients?

As a dastardly masterplan it's a little bit shit...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk."

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

As I said the most likely scenario is it won't be "forced" in the truest sense of the word. There will be some who are both independently wealthy enough not to need to work and reclusive enough not to need to engage with society. They can refuse if they wish. The rest will have no choice in the matter, compliance or exile.

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By *az080378Woman
over a year ago

Cromer

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

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By *arksxMan
over a year ago

Leicester / London

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?

Sneak chemicals?

Are you talking about fluoride?

Err this has been public knowledge since it was first introduced.

And was done so for numerous medical reasons.

If you don't like it, you cna but bottled mineral water.

Or the new craze of water without minerals... You know the good stuff in water

Have heard what other countries say about British teeth?

I don't blame them either.

Oral hygiene is poor in the uk

And so are generally the condition of most peoples teeth

Failed experiment then..."

Or limited and improved how bad things could have been.

It must be hard work to wake up and be as pessimistic and facetious as you tom.

Not everything in the world is bad or due to some secret government plot

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?

Sneak chemicals?

Are you talking about fluoride?

Err this has been public knowledge since it was first introduced.

And was done so for numerous medical reasons.

If you don't like it, you cna but bottled mineral water.

Or the new craze of water without minerals... You know the good stuff in water

Have heard what other countries say about British teeth?

I don't blame them either.

Oral hygiene is poor in the uk

And so are generally the condition of most peoples teeth

Failed experiment then...

Or limited and improved how bad things could have been.

It must be hard work to wake up and be as pessimistic and facetious as you tom.

Not everything in the world is bad or due to some secret government plot"

But they do exist

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever....."

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

If your job can be done 100% from home, and you never intend to leave your house, ever, then yes technically it's not mandatory for you. But only in the sense that you can chose to not be a part of society.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"If people want to know why I won't be having a vaccine it's probably for the same reason vaccine manufacturers have made sure that they are exempt from liability."

Not true unless you live in the US. Certainly in the EU you can sue vaccine manufacturers. I presume that would be carried over in UK law once we leave. There is a uk vaccine fund to pay out to anyone but in the EU you can still sue.

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By *ounty durham bbw coupleCouple
over a year ago

darlington

vaccines need a near 100 percent take up to be affective look what is happening with measles in areas of America with low vaccine numbers

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By *az080378Woman
over a year ago

Cromer

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory. "

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

I could say I'm going to be a recluse and avoid a mandatory vaccination and then go shopping or work anyway, therefore the system would be completely pointless,unless you are insinuating that in order to walk into a shop I would need to provide paperwork as proof that I had a jab....?

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

"Apparently Stockholm is nearing herd immunity.

That may be our only realistic way out. Which is bad

new for those still shielding etc. "

This is generally the only way to get rid of a virus, either by natural immunity or a vaccine.

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford

I wont b having the vaccine even though I'm high risk being asthmatic/diabetic and my age x

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"Apparently Stockholm is nearing herd immunity.

That may be our only realistic way out. Which is bad

new for those still shielding etc. "

No one has any idea how many people have to have had covid to develop herd immunity, seen guesses from 60% to 90%. The problem is that we have no idea how long immunity lasts if at all. Herd immunity in europe to bubonic plague developed naturally but took over 400 years.

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"Because in a population of 66 million that little 0.5% mortality rate is enough to to kill up to 330,000 people

So give it to the at risk groups - not everyone

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

"Because in a population of 66 million that little 0.5% mortality rate is enough to to kill up to 330,000 people

So give it to the at risk groups - not everyone"

So, come on, whats wrong with people having the vaccine?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

Not paperwork, Bill Gates has said a "digital certificate" will be required as proof of vaccination.

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

Not paperwork, Bill Gates has said a "digital certificate" will be required as proof of vaccination."

Except he hasn't said anything of sort and he is as far as i know not leader of any country.

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By *az080378Woman
over a year ago

Cromer

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

Not paperwork, Bill Gates has said a "digital certificate" will be required as proof of vaccination."

Oh dear

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

To be fair they already vaccinate us without consent for the so called greater good. They put fluoride in our tap water and something in flour. Even our bread is tainted. Home made or not.

Next step could be forced vaccination

You do know fluoride isn't a vaccine and is B vitamins they add to flour which again are rather good for us!

There will be no forced vaccinations there's no need as thankfully the 70% who have commonsense and don't get our information from Facebook would result in enough heard immunity.

Assuming not wanting a vaccine puts me in the 30% with no common sense? Very judgemental? X

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By *az080378Woman
over a year ago

Cromer

"Because in a population of 66 million that little 0.5% mortality rate is enough to to kill up to 330,000 people

So give it to the at risk groups - not everyone

So, come on, whats wrong with people having the vaccine? "

In my opinion, nothing, I'm glad that there are vaccines and grateful that myself and my family have been able to be protected from nasty diseases.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

Not paperwork, Bill Gates has said a "digital certificate" will be required as proof of vaccination.

Except he hasn't said anything of sort and he is as far as i know not leader of any country."

Don't lie, he has said it exactly...

"Eventually we will have some digital certificates to show who has recovered or been tested recently or when we have a vaccine who has received it."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You buy a dog or a cat and the first thing you do is take it to the vets for its vaccine, as thier is plenty of nasties out there that can kill them.

We do it because we dont want our pets to die...why would we not do the same for our kids?

Or does Bill Gates just want to control the movement of our pets too

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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago

Dudley

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

Not paperwork, Bill Gates has said a "digital certificate" will be required as proof of vaccination.

Except he hasn't said anything of sort and he is as far as i know not leader of any country.

Don't lie, he has said it exactly...

"Eventually we will have some digital certificates to show who has recovered or been tested recently or when we have a vaccine who has received it."

So he didn't say it will be required, just that he thinks it might happen?

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

You cannot be so unimformed can you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

So if vaccination becomes mandatory but I say I'm gonna stay at home and avoid people,that means it won't be mandatory for me?...

What you have said makes no sense whatsoever.....

If you can't parse that then that's on you, not me. The statement makes perfect sense.

It will be made a prerequisite for ordinary life. If you want to work (or more likely need to work) then you will have to get the vaccine. It's that simple.

Need to shop for groceries? Better have that vaccine.

Want to access medical treatment for your diabetes, your broken leg, your epilepsy? Certainly sir/ma'am, just present your vaccination certificate.

For 99% of people, such a system is effectively mandatory.

But where (officially) has it stated that it will become mandatory to have a vaccination for covid19.

I'm not insinuating it, I'm outright saying it. It's right there in the post.

Where was it stated that masks would be mandatory? Are you under the impression that nothing can happen that hasn't been telegraphed by the government ahead of time? They could make the announcement tomorrow, or on the day after the vaccine is announced. It won't make any difference.

I'm not making a value judgement about whether mandatory vaccinations are ethical in these circumstances, I have very mixed feelings, but the idea that it won't happen is hugely complacent.

We have the technology now to make it not only possible, but easy. All it takes is a QR reader at the shop entrance and an email sent to your phone. That's literally it. It would actually be easier to enforce than the mask requirements.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

Wow the ignorance and lack of knowledge on this thread is beyond my comprehension

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All those people on here declaring you won't have the vaccine - do you honestly think any of us care?

All I would say is hold your horses until one is available and then make an informed decision with the information available.

I think those people getting het up about it now is a pointless exercise - a cortisol boosting event that quite frankly you don't need (anxiety induced hormone that is detrimental to your health if in a prolonged state).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"All those people on here declaring you won't have the vaccine - do you honestly think any of us care?

All I would say is hold your horses until one is available and then make an informed decision with the information available.

I don't have any issue taking the vaccine if it's been adequately tested. But to be ethical my instincts say it absolutely has to be voluntary. Allowing governments to mandate invasive administration of medication to the general population is a very dangerous precedent to set. Particularly over a virus with this degree of lethality.

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By *arksxMan
over a year ago

Leicester / London

"Wow the ignorance and lack of knowledge on this thread is beyond my comprehension "

I watched the film contagain for the first time in 2017. I wasn't even aware of it before then.

And thought wow, that seems so real... but time has changed since 2011 humanity is more enlightened in 2017.

We are more immune to bullshit on the Internet.

Nope.... If the film has one major inaccuracy it underplayed how dumb the general public is

(Alan Krumwiede) is real and so are the nutjob theories (Forsythia)

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"Because in a population of 66 million that little 0.5% mortality rate is enough to to kill up to 330,000 people

That's 0.5 who get it. Not everyone will catch it.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Morbidity matters too.

Thank you for coming to my TED talk.

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

I think we are all curious,exacerbated and fed with trolls and conspiracy theories on here.

However if your question is from on honest place. Learning how the transmission of a virus spreads through the r0 is a good place to start.

We are 6 months into this now and I'm still shocked how American and UK governments can relay a simple explanation. Steven soderberg explained twice in a 90 minute film.

https://youtu.be/X-YR3UlH3aA

(if) a vaccine can be found.

The priority should not be rich countries or those with existing medical infrastructure.

It should be africa, India places with a large population and little or now medical facilities

Where social distancing is hard to maintain because of socio-economic factors.

Undoubtedly though president mango man will buy all the stock piles up and find another way to break and already insane an American health care model.

Just think about that when all the big brexit and America trade deals are talked about.

Because you can kiss goodbye to the NHS as we know it

The UK has already secured doses of I believe 4 of the most promising vaccines. "

So four vaccines that may not work?

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense.

its because... depending on the variant... you may need more than one dose for you to be protected....

ta daaaaaaa!!!!!!!!

Not having one so more than one is a definite no no

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense.

its because... depending on the variant... you may need more than one dose for you to be protected....

ta daaaaaaa!!!!!!!!

Not having one so more than one is a definite no no"

Good, you'll leave an extra one available

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense.

its because... depending on the variant... you may need more than one dose for you to be protected....

ta daaaaaaa!!!!!!!!

Not having one so more than one is a definite no no"

Let's hope this sneaky government ruled by the king of the world Bill Gates dont bring in euthanasia to all the unvaccinated ones

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

Looks like Sweden have achieved herd immunity 100's of years earlier than that

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk."

Name one time people have been droned for walking their dog in the middle of nowhere

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The premise is that you assume 99.5% will recover fully from this virus.

This is sadly not true. Co morbidities are in line with previous SARS like viruses- which are going to be quite significant in numbers.

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"I don't understand where the concept of mandatory vaccination has come from and why people are so focused on it!

Flatten the curve Johnson fired the first volley when he said people with concerns about vaccine damage were nutters. It was made to look impromptu but was obviously planned

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"UKGov are buying 60 million doses from a French company and 100 million from Astra Zenica.

And no, it doesn't make sense.

its because... depending on the variant... you may need more than one dose for you to be protected....

ta daaaaaaa!!!!!!!!

Not having one so more than one is a definite no no

Good, you'll leave an extra one available

Fill your boots

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that "

Because it mutated, became totally harmless within months....so they stopped wasting money looking. Or didn't you follow that story?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

In the old USSR is that....Jeez!!

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

Looks like Sweden have achieved herd immunity 100's of years earlier than that"

They haven't achieved herd immunity no one knows the level needed to achieve herd immunity. Sweden has killed more of its vunerable people than pretty much every country on earth and the population are practicing hygiene and social distancing which has caused the death rate to drop not herd immunity.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Poll today in uk papers showing only 53% would definitely take a corovavirus vaccine.

I'm sure this figure will continue to fall as time goes on."

As more and more swallow the guff on facebook et al??

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By *isaB45Woman
over a year ago

Fabville

"I’ve always said something don’t seem right

It’s a virus and you can’t stop it

Even with flu vaccine people still catch it

And if it doesn’t effect kids

I’m sure they build up or tolerances level for when older"

Maybe find out how viruses work before saying such ignorant remarks.

You clearly know nothing about antigenic drift and shift, for example...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The reason to vaccinate everyone is so that big Pharma can make a lot of money that's why they have been resisting more research into hydroxychloroquine.

Follow the story....do you even have a clue what stage 1 and 2 trials are? (Which were not skipped by Oxford or anyone else btw...I actually volunteered for Oxford stage 2 but turned down as too old!)

Anyone else getting bored with the abject nonsense copied from facebook garbage etc directly to here as though it is gospel??

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I don't understand where the concept of mandatory vaccination has come from and why people are so focused on it!

Because some idiot posted it on the book of face? Then someone read it and passed it on to someone else on twatter and hey....suddenly it must be true!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The trouble is,

If you read the insert and looked at possible side effects then you wouldn't take any medicine.

The insert seems to be a way for the manufacturer to avoid liability if you get a reaction

There won't be enough data at the start of the vaccination.

If 80% of us take it then we don't know if it will poison us

It's like a game of Russian Roulette except we don't know how many chambers are in the revolver and if there are any bullets "

My problem is that vaccine is not as heavily regulated as prescription drugs, and you can’t sue the makers, hence UK vaccine damage payment scheme is paid for by the Tax payers, they are exempt from prosecution

No conspiracy here, all facts easy for anyone with a keyboard to research if they want to

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

Name me another pandemic that has lead to this level of restrictions.

The precise same logic behind our being forced to wear masks can and will be used to force vaccination. In fact I'd say it's fairly disingenuous to support one without the other.

Spanish flu in 1918/19 had a big lockdown....then a release...then a second wave.

Obviously lockdown was different then as no big global travel industry (well ships).

There hasn't been another comparable pandemic (unless you count bubonic plague in middle ages)

SARS and MERS never got to global pandemic stage as they mutated and basically buggered off on there own.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"vaccines need a near 100 percent take up to be affective look what is happening with measles in areas of America with low vaccine numbers "

Exactly..

People dying because the good folk still believe the bullshit about vaccines from (ex) Dr Wakefield

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"vaccines need a near 100 percent take up to be affective look what is happening with measles in areas of America with low vaccine numbers

Exactly..

People dying because the good folk still believe the bullshit about vaccines from (ex) Dr Wakefield"

And all the other grifting cranks.

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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago

near ipswich

"We already are not clear what decisions will be reached on those poor souls who lack the capacity to make their own decisions.

If they sneak chemicals in our bread and water then who knows ?"
You dont have to drink tap water or eat the bread for that matter i was asking when the uk has ever forced a nation to be vaccinated and why some nutters think that will happen.If people dont want the vaccine thats their choice i for one will if they get one

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

I don't see why they can't just hide the medicine in our food like they do with flour and water. After all, it's for our own good..

It's just that sometimes they get it wrong...

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By *den-Valley-coupleCouple
over a year ago

Cumbria

Big money..

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

The trouble is,

If you read the insert and looked at possible side effects then you wouldn't take any medicine.

The insert seems to be a way for the manufacturer to avoid liability if you get a reaction

There won't be enough data at the start of the vaccination.

If 80% of us take it then we don't know if it will poison us

It's like a game of Russian Roulette except we don't know how many chambers are in the revolver and if there are any bullets

No conspiracy here, all facts easy for anyone with a keyboard to research if they want to

Wrong the rules are even tighter for vaccines than most other medicines. Vaccines are given to well people so much milder side effects than for example hydroxychloroqinine which has fairly nasty side effects such as increased chance of heart damage, but if someone is sick with lupus or malaria the chance of those side effects is worth the risk.There is a vaccine damage fund but if you in the EU you can sue vaccine manufacturers as well. I presume this will still be the same when we leave the EU.

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"Big money.."

Wrong the big money comes from finding a drug that lots people have to take everyday for the whole of their lives. No big profits in vaccines hence why until recently wasn't loads of research into them. Vaccine development is most often driven by governments and organisations like WHO.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I don't see why they can't just hide the medicine in our food like they do with flour and water. After all, it's for our own good..

It's just that sometimes they get it wrong... "

Will someone stop winding up this gramophone

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's just come to me. All you against are scared of needles.....come on admit it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's just come to me. All you against are scared of needles.....come on admit it

And yet it's just a little prick

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"It's just come to me. All you against are scared of needles.....come on admit it

I am.

I'll be getting the jab

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Generally, any type of person can infect any other type of person, so preventing anyone from getting infected, via vaccine use, helps to prevent the highly vulnerable from being infected by any other types of people. Of course, with covid-19 the importance is not just to prevent deaths amongst the most highly vulnerable people in the population, but any death by anyone as well as the prevention of other harms to health.

The virus can kill anyone, ranging from a new born baby, to an aged person with other health impairments. Likewise it can inflict severe damage to anyone too - organ(s) damage and failure, including brain damage and cognitive impairments. These may often be irreversible. We also don't know what impacts multiple successive infections of covid-19 would cause, if these were to occur. Without vaccine use, repeated viral infections could attack and destroy much of someone's physical and mental health. Multiple milder reinfections may cause death, where someone recovered from a single infection, albeit with lasting damage or no known damage.

This virus is readily transmitted to other people, much more so when people spend a greater proportion of their time in confined spaces indoors. The UK has great seasonal weather variations, so is likely to experience more intensive infection levels in winter, when several other health conditions, including flu, may harm people and cause burdens on health services.

We are weakest at our most vulnerable points. This would most likely be during winter time, especially if a flu epidemic was particularly severe and not countered by the current flu vaccines. Countering the potential for flu and covid-19 cases being especially prevalent is thus wise. Of course, flu and other infections can also kill - this may be exacerbated by covid-19 infection damage.

We can ignore what we already know, as well as the understanding that we still are in the infancy of understanding covid-19 infection and implications for health - that would be a choice. It should be accepted that our choices have implications. We've seen already how health service resources are easily overwhelmed and how this impacts on people needing treatment for other issues - this may include additional losses of lives.

This disease isn't just something that affects a very tiny minority of our population. We are also ignorant of how much more damage this can cause to our population, than the already considerable harm that it's caused much in excess of sub 1% of the population.

Herd immunity may be achieved by below 100% of the population having immunity, gained from vaccines or prior infections. Ideally we'd aim to get as close to 100% as possible, as we're still ignorant of the duration of immunity from infections.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Generally, any type of person can infect any other type of person, so preventing anyone from getting infected, via vaccine use, helps to prevent the highly vulnerable from being infected by any other types of people. Of course, with covid-19 the importance is not just to prevent deaths amongst the most highly vulnerable people in the population, but any death by anyone as well as the prevention of other harms to health.

As close to 100% as possible?

There's no chance of that.

In the Uk it's down to 53% and in the USA as low as 33% willing to take the rushed vaccine.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation."

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation."

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth. "

You're still believing every single word the government, newspapers, media tell you?

They have never lied ever

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

You're still believing every single word the government, newspapers, media tell you?

They have never lied ever

Goodness, did you know it's possible to think critically without being a conspiracy theorist?

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

You're still believing every single word the government, newspapers, media tell you?

They have never lied ever

The Daily Mail et al are not sources of education. Beli it or not, there are people here who use peer reviewed scientific evidence to inform themselves. I know that will be difficult to comprehend.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

You're still believing every single word the government, newspapers, media tell you?

They have never lied ever

The Daily Mail et al are not sources of education. Beli it or not, there are people here who use peer reviewed scientific evidence to inform themselves. I know that will be difficult to comprehend. "

I'm sure there's some sites that will tell you the truthiest truth THEY don't want you to know, and all global governments, The Daily Mail, The Guardian, and doctors are all in on the conspiracy, and if you don't believe the truthiest truth you're a tool for the man.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

You're still believing every single word the government, newspapers, media tell you?

They have never lied ever

The Daily Mail et al are not sources of education. Beli it or not, there are people here who use peer reviewed scientific evidence to inform themselves. I know that will be difficult to comprehend.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

As close to 100% as possible?

There's no chance of that.

In the Uk it's down to 53% and in the USA as low as 33% willing to take the rushed vaccine."

In the perfect world we would have as close to 100% of the population with immunity. It's likely that herd immunity could be achieved at below that level, ss too few people without immunity would exist and be able to infect others.

Any intelligent thinking process would take the decision only where we actually have any vaccine and it would be in the context of that particular moment, including -

* The research evidence of the vaccine, including its safety and efficacy levels

* Other vaccine options that may exist, as alternatives

* Their personal circumstances, including health details

* The prevalence of the virus at that point

We've seen the benefits of herd immunity gained and lost, from changes to the levels of immunity against mumps in the UK and elsewhere. It's a simple, effective strategy. We don't even have an available, effective vaccine for covid-19 at present, so I'll be evaluating my options at the time, should it happen.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Sophie, I think you're assuming that we all share a common goal of suppressing the pandemic.

I fear you're mistaken...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’ve always said something don’t seem right

It’s a virus and you can’t stop it

Even with flu vaccine people still catch it"

Well, yes. It's not flu, so the flu vaccine doesn't stop it. A COVID-19 specific vaccine would be designed to stop COVID-19.

"And if it doesn’t effect kids

I’m sure they build up or tolerances level for when older"

Who says it doesn't affect kids? The official line from the NHS is: "Children can get coronavirus (COVID-19), but they seem to get it less often than adults and it's usually less serious".

So: yes, they can get it, no, it probably won't kill them. They might well pass it on to your parents, though.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that "

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality."

Research stopped for the SARS 1 virus because the disease burned out.

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality."

They think if you throw enough money at something you will get a good result even if there is no reason to think what you are throwing money at is achievable.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"Sophie, I think you're assuming that we all share a common goal of suppressing the pandemic.

I fear you're mistaken..."

Thanks

I understand that there is a range of outlooks and desires. I don't believe that everyone will decide to have any of the vaccines, if any of them prove to be effective, as much as it could be great for society.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality."

The reality is that we have no current licenced vaccine. We have no certainty that there will never be 1.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality.

Research stopped for the SARS 1 virus because the disease burned out."

They were still working on it in 2016, 13 years after the virus disappeared. Finally they gave up it was costing millions and they were getting nowhere. The other main corona virus is a common cold, not virus for that one yet either

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"wouldnt hold out to much hope for a vacine this is varient of the sars virus from 2002 and they still have no vaccine for that

Exactly. There is never (ever) going to be a vaccine or a green light, I don’t know why some people don’t understand this basic reality.

The reality is that we have no current licenced vaccine. We have no certainty that there will never be 1. "

There's no certainty of anything.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus "

Thats isn't strictly true. There are vaccines for dogs and cats for the particular coronaviruses that effect them.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus "

That may superficially seem that they're all very much the same but they are unique and we today's context is different too. Do you have expertise in this area and thus are able to conclusively make your statements based on that? If not, your sources for evidence?

Drivers for eradication of the common cold have probably never been as highly prioritised as for covid-19, due to its impact on the world.

Current technologies are also vastly superior to those of the past. Our DNA sequencing of the virus was incredibly quick, in part due to modern facilities etc. We also have new genetics-based options for vaccines, never formerly unavailable.

Today's environment is very different.

If you outline your expertise and evidence sources, it will highlight any strengths behind your posts.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation."

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth. "

There is only one truth...

Who do you trust..?

Government .. not me

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

And there are vulnerable people who will be told or persuaded to be injected ..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Intetesting points though. Children are vaccinated before they are old enough to give consent. What about vulnerable people in institutions. Who decides ?"

My mum is in a nursing home. She's unable to decide. My siblings and me have LPOA so we would decide for her.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

And those without family or relatives ?

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There are sinister forces at work I fear

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

There is only one truth...

Who do you trust..?

Government .. not me"

Did I say at any point that I trusted the government? Or have other people assumed that?

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions "

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway."

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl "

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"There are sinister forces at work I fear "

How exciting.

Do they have a secret underground base and armed guards dressed in black roll neck jumpers...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?"

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"There are sinister forces at work I fear

How exciting.

Do they have a secret underground base and armed guards dressed in black roll neck jumpers..."

Yes. They also have Dobermans

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"There are sinister forces at work I fear

How exciting.

Do they have a secret underground base and armed guards dressed in black roll neck jumpers..."

No.. that's the mob patrolling Brixton to stamp out racism

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects .."

... So no, you don't understand, then.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then."

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"There are sinister forces at work I fear

How exciting.

Do they have a secret underground base and armed guards dressed in black roll neck jumpers...

Yes. They also have Dobermans

Oh I liked them, can't beat 70's music...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think..."

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means."

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus

Drivers for eradication of the common cold have probably never been as highly prioritised as for covid-19, due to its impact on the world.

Today's environment is very different.

If you outline your expertise and evidence sources, it will highlight any strengths behind your posts. "

If something can't be done - it can't be done

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus

Drivers for eradication of the common cold have probably never been as highly prioritised as for covid-19, due to its impact on the world.

Today's environment is very different.

If you outline your expertise and evidence sources, it will highlight any strengths behind your posts.

If something can't be done - it can't be done"

If you asked people a hundred years ago if it was possible to converse immediately with people on the opposite side of the globe, using a tiny little handheld techno device, they'd have thought it was impossible. It's only impossible until we figure things out.

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

[Removed by poster at 10/08/20 21:33:54]

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus

Drivers for eradication of the common cold have probably never been as highly prioritised as for covid-19, due to its impact on the world.

Today's environment is very different.

If you outline your expertise and evidence sources, it will highlight any strengths behind your posts.

If something can't be done - it can't be done

Science often creates more problems than it solves..

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

If something can't be done - it can't be done"

That speaks volumes, but not in the way you intended.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *moothman2000Man
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"Vaccine* not virus! No vaccine has ever been found for any type of corona virus

Drivers for eradication of the common cold have probably never been as highly prioritised as for covid-19, due to its impact on the world.

Today's environment is very different.

If you outline your expertise and evidence sources, it will highlight any strengths behind your posts.

If something can't be done - it can't be done

Science often creates more problems than it solves.. "

Is that in any way relevant to the topic or are you trying to be all wise and mysterious?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"... which is why we need education and reassurances to counter misinformation.

I totally agree, we need truthful education instead of the government misinformation.

You and I have very different perceptions of truth.

There is only one truth...

Who do you trust..?

Government .. not me"

No we don't trust you Tom

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

It is simply illogical to take the example of something that has been done as evidence all other problems have a solution

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

It is simply illogical to take the example of something that has been done as evidence all other problems have a solution"

Jeez. The point being that some things seem impossible at one point in time, but are then not impossible at a later date. It's called progress. I'm afraid my crystal ball prevents me from citing an example of something that is currently impossible but will become possible at some point in the future. For example, it might be possible in the future to holiday on Mars. However, unless I travel into the future, I cannot decide if that is just impossible now, or impossible forever and ever. Perhaps your crystal ball is more efficacious than mine?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons "

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

It is simply illogical to take the example of something that has been done as evidence all other problems have a solution

Why would anyone want to holiday on Mars. Appreciate what you have here...

Some people seek what is actually on their doorstep..

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science."

look outside your comfortable life bubble.. what can you see ?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science.

look outside your comfortable life bubble.. what can you see ?

Engineering, medicine, agriculture... Things that keep our country going.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science.

look outside your comfortable life bubble.. what can you see ?

Engineering, medicine, agriculture... Things that keep our country going."

And the developing world... ?

Poverty famine disease ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science.

look outside your comfortable life bubble.. what can you see ?

Engineering, medicine, agriculture... Things that keep our country going.

And the developing world... ?

Poverty famine disease ?"

... Goodness. I wonder what might fix that.

Agriculture, medicine, vaccination, political and economic sciences...

It's almost like science can help people...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

There is no information...

This vaccine could harm millions

Doesn't really matter what information is given, if it doesn't match your narrative you'll disregard it anyway.

It needs trial over time..

Many won't want to be a guinea fowl

Do you understand how clinical trials work?

Yes.. they inject us and see if it works ... It might work..

It might not work..

Or horrendous side affects ..

... So no, you don't understand, then.

It matters not if I understand..

It's what the people think...

Science is not and will never be a democracy.

Fortunately there's a process which is being followed (with some variation), checks and balances, and there'll be a lot of data available to be scrutinised by those who understand what it means.

Fill your boots with vaccine...

47% won't according to one poll...

No trust in authority or loons

The problem is that people trust loons. That's precisely the problem.

Our comfortable lives depend entirely upon science.

look outside your comfortable life bubble.. what can you see ?

Engineering, medicine, agriculture... Things that keep our country going.

And the developing world... ?

Poverty famine disease ?

... Goodness. I wonder what might fix that.

Agriculture, medicine, vaccination, political and economic sciences...

It's almost like science can help people..."

Pity that people get on the way... Science and industrial development has fucked this planet big style...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

Name me one vaccine that is or has been mandatory in the uk.

They force us to drink fluoride in our drinking water whether we like it or not and tamper with natural flour. Who knows what else these mad scientists do in the name of our health "

Not my drinking water they don’t and I’m no more or less messed up than the rest of you...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago

birmingham

It is simply illogical to take the example of something that has been done as evidence all other problems have a solution

Why would anyone want to holiday on Mars. Appreciate what you have here...

Some people seek what is actually on their doorstep.. "

It ain't the kind of place to raise your kids

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

It is simply illogical to take the example of something that has been done as evidence all other problems have a solution

Why would anyone want to holiday on Mars. Appreciate what you have here...

Some people seek what is actually on their doorstep..

It ain't the kind of place to raise your kids"

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"It's amusingly naive the amount of people who still believe that a vaccine will be optional if it arrives.

This scenario wouldn't surprise me. The government are passing new laws and legislation under the guise of covid without the public knowing about it.

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By *tallion and fillyCouple
over a year ago

Barrow in Furness

I think we are all curious,exacerbated and fed with trolls and conspiracy theories on here.

However if your question is from on honest place. Learning how the transmission of a virus spreads through the r0 is a good place to start.

We are 6 months into this now and I'm still shocked how American and UK governments can relay a simple explanation. Steven soderberg explained twice in a 90 minute film.

https://youtu.be/X-YR3UlH3aA

(if) a vaccine can be found.

The priority should not be rich countries or those with existing medical infrastructure.

It should be africa, India places with a large population and little or now medical facilities

Where social distancing is hard to maintain because of socio-economic factors.

Undoubtedly though president mango man will buy all the stock piles up and find another way to break and already insane an American health care model.

Just think about that when all the big brexit and America trade deals are talked about.

Because you can kiss goodbye to the NHS as we know it

In honesty, you would have thought the areas in the world where there are tight packed communities, ie India, Africa China, ect would have been decimated. But the reality is they are relatively unscathed.

The UK set up precautionary measures with the field hospitals as they expected it to completly wipe many of us out, I am convinced of that. This virus while deadly to some the rest of us habe got away with it very lightly.

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