Join us FREE, we're FREE to use
Web's largest swingers site since 2006.
Already registered?
Login here
Join us FREE, we're FREE to use
Web's largest swingers site since 2006.
Already registered?
Login here
 | Back to forum list |
| Back to Virus |
| Jump to newest |  |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"No, it's not just you. "  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. " No I agree with you 100% and find it frushtrating.I alo get angry when friends on here are not being carefull and flouting the rules. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It's not just you. I hear of pubs which had "secret" lockins during lockdown. And now swinging clubs officially with social distancing but actually turning a blind eye to play. Plenty of fabbers looking for meets - unambiguously not distanced social meets. Anti-maskers, anti-vaxxers. The human race has probably peaked. " I think it seems particularly bad in England, I k ow we don't necessarily get news reported from other countries accurately or as much. But I have friends spread far and wide in most European countries and they dont seem to have quite so many people blatantly ignoring the rules. Hopefully karma will reward those of us doing our best for our communities. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm old enough to remember when they said lockdown was to save NHS and to flattern the curve, talk about mission creep... Companys are now even struggling to get the lazy ass furloughed back to work, welcome to socialism. What else did you expect. " Socialism?!  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. " The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. " Sorry couldn’t disagree with you more .....we need to just get on ! | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." Why were people not able to access the NHS?.... | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." well said so many people not getting appointments at hospitals only half the expected new cancer cases since Covid | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." Theyhave no idea what the agendas are. Not are they unwilling to dig. Nor are they willing to even consider anything else except what the powers that be dictate to us. There is no scientific irrefutable proof that viruses do what they claim they do. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It's not just you. I hear of pubs which had "secret" lockins during lockdown. And now swinging clubs officially with social distancing but actually turning a blind eye to play. Plenty of fabbers looking for meets - unambiguously not distanced social meets. Anti-maskers, anti-vaxxers. The human race has probably peaked. " It's all happening out there.  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. " And do you not think that having months of "lockdown" has led to this scenario ? Do you think for a moment if things went back to "normal" we wouldn't go back to thousands of hospitalisations and deaths ? | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? " Me. It was fucking miserable. I also know people who've lost people from it. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
The very next night saw a repeat 
There are countless other examples
We don't really have the systems or infrastructure to allow for personal space (that annoyed me pre covid)
The media also doesn't help. Showing images of beach crowds that were actually old images and showing people in close proximity (again just one example of many)
Humans are social creatures, our systems, habits and government are designed for a tinned sardine approach, which now is assisting covid contamination | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It's not just everyday people not social distancing though. Heathrow airport arrivals was packed and not because the people or airport wanted it, border force won't staff the gates
The very next night saw a repeat
There are countless other examples
We don't really have the systems or infrastructure to allow for personal space (that annoyed me pre covid)
The media also doesn't help. Showing images of beach crowds that were actually old images and showing people in close proximity (again just one example of many)
Humans are social creatures, our systems, habits and government are designed for a tinned sardine approach, which now is assisting covid contamination "We need improved systems, not just expecting people to adapt. (I'm agreeing with you) | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? Me. It was fucking miserable. I also know people who've lost people from it." think we’ve been pretty lucky in my part of the East Midlands, I’ve not known or heard of anyone getting it .. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? Me. It was fucking miserable. I also know people who've lost people from it.think we’ve been pretty lucky in my part of the East Midlands, I’ve not known or heard of anyone getting it .. " I hope people are sensible enough that it stays that way. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." Agreed. I can’t believe people have been so accepting to just fall in line and not question this and think for themselves. That’s way more scary than this virus. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. Sorry couldn’t disagree with you more .....we need to just get on ! " Well we could not disagree with you more. Selfish point of view. Think of others. Novel concept that. People that have under linning issues they need protection. All this lets go to the pub and holidays abroad. All about me me | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. " Conspiracy theories seem to be doing great business at the moment. It's as simple as this. It's a relatively unknown, quite contagious disease with serious or deadly immediate effects on some, debilitating medium term effects on a larger number, and completely unknown long term effects. The way we stop contagious respiratory diseases is by stopping them spreading: hygiene, distancing, covering orifices. Whatever the government is or isn't saying, these things are true (the paragraph before) and have been known for longer than any of us have been alive. I've been ignoring the government since April. I'm finding out what I can about the virus and trying to reduce my risk to others. It's not about government compliance, it's about controlling this disease so we can get our lives back and not cost more lives. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." I have been lucky as i have found it far easier to access the NHS during this pandemic, i have had many GP phone call consultations, various blood tests, phone call consultations with several hospital clinics, several visits to hospitals for tests. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I think the majority of people are still behaving intelligently, keeping distance, wearing masks in shops, washing hands etc. Perception is skewed by the media, as we each only get to see a tiny few people around us and so just have media coverage to infer what's going on. The public though has lost confidence in those who lead and make decisions not based on the greater good. Letting aides break rules at the worst times of the crisis without punishment, £multi-million contracts going to friends, without competitive tender, many of these expensive contracts delivering atrocious results, such as the tracking phone app. Without confidence from the masses, they create fragmentation and greater division in society. To some extent it seems that they have wasted to foster division recently. Cummings who directs everything for us revels in and prefers destructive change for the country. There's plenty going very well for some. The public deserve great direction and leadership. With people at the helm who aren't particularly willing to give them this and partly due to their poor skillset, we should probably expect the next few months to grow worse. We can individually take responsibility for us and our fellow citizens, showing the respect that we would like too. Never lower yourself to other's levels. " | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. Sorry couldn’t disagree with you more .....we need to just get on ! " | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. " Because until it affects that person in some way on a personal level they think it's not their concern. Not saying everyone thinks this way but obviously some do. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. Because until it affects that person in some way on a personal level they think it's not their concern. Not saying everyone thinks this way but obviously some do." *Public* health seems to be lost on many. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. " | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. why are So many people, out there disregarding their social responsibilities to help reduce the effects of virus spread. How many times have we seen this disregard occasion at pubs or overcrowded Parks and beaches. It’s frustrating for so many of us that are trying to do the right thing , to watch those selfish and irresponsible people spoil the hard work achieved by so many . Shameful to the extreme. " I say we lock everyone down, keep all schools closed and have everyone on furlow until we clear this virus. Mandatory face masks and 4 meter social distancing. The economy may not survive but we can have China buy us and show us the new normal. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. " I saw him sitting with "M" in tbe pub | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. Conspiracy theories seem to be doing great business at the moment. It's as simple as this. It's a relatively unknown, quite contagious disease with serious or deadly immediate effects on some, debilitating medium term effects on a larger number, and completely unknown long term effects. The way we stop contagious respiratory diseases is by stopping them spreading: hygiene, distancing, covering orifices. Whatever the government is or isn't saying, these things are true (the paragraph before) and have been known for longer than any of us have been alive. I've been ignoring the government since April. I'm finding out what I can about the virus and trying to reduce my risk to others. It's not about government compliance, it's about controlling this disease so we can get our lives back and not cost more lives." This is at odds with your previous post saying people should follow the guidelines.... is that people other than you? You appear to be making your own decisions and ignoring the government, others are making theirs! | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. Conspiracy theories seem to be doing great business at the moment. It's as simple as this. It's a relatively unknown, quite contagious disease with serious or deadly immediate effects on some, debilitating medium term effects on a larger number, and completely unknown long term effects. The way we stop contagious respiratory diseases is by stopping them spreading: hygiene, distancing, covering orifices. Whatever the government is or isn't saying, these things are true (the paragraph before) and have been known for longer than any of us have been alive. I've been ignoring the government since April. I'm finding out what I can about the virus and trying to reduce my risk to others. It's not about government compliance, it's about controlling this disease so we can get our lives back and not cost more lives. This is at odds with your previous post saying people should follow the guidelines.... is that people other than you? You appear to be making your own decisions and ignoring the government, others are making theirs!" I'm going beyond the guidance because I believe the government are not doing the right thing. People should do what's in the interests of public health. Not their own short term interests. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"No, it's not just you. " +1 | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? " Loads - I’m a teacher ten of twenty staff were out with it in March week before lockdown. One staff member lost her husband to it another her uncle. Kids in my class lost grandparent (3) .... the list goes on | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"This idea on Fab that all decisions are equally valid and defensible, and that public health is about individual choices, is risible. We need to stop the spread. Following government guidance is the bare bloody minimum. Yes I'm forging my own path. But there's no minimum of pub going, shop going and gym going. There's no government guidelines making me leave my house. I'm doing more to protect people. "I won't get really ill, I'll do what I like" is not at all the same." The UK govt response is very obviously through a particular ideological prism. They were reluctant to issue clear guidance preferring to suggest. To be blunt, people are selfish, there's no greater good or civic responsibility. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"This idea on Fab that all decisions are equally valid and defensible, and that public health is about individual choices, is risible. We need to stop the spread. Following government guidance is the bare bloody minimum. Yes I'm forging my own path. But there's no minimum of pub going, shop going and gym going. There's no government guidelines making me leave my house. I'm doing more to protect people. "I won't get really ill, I'll do what I like" is not at all the same. The UK govt response is very obviously through a particular ideological prism. They were reluctant to issue clear guidance preferring to suggest. To be blunt, people are selfish, there's no greater good or civic responsibility. " I know. Which is why I despair and why it's the bare minimum. I feel fucking civic responsibility so I do more. Which is totally the same as doing less  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"This idea on Fab that all decisions are equally valid and defensible, and that public health is about individual choices, is risible. We need to stop the spread. " Can I ask just how you propose to achieve that when up to 80% of infections are asymptomatic yet contagious? Do you propose to close everything indefinately, lock everyone in their houses and have men in hazmat suits deliver sealed bags of disinfected groceries once a week? Because if you don't you will NOT stop the spread of Covid. You might slow it down but you won't stop it. And as soon as you start allowing people to do anything it will bounce right back up again. LOCKDOWNS DO NOT STOP HIGHLY INFECTIOUS DISEASES. The can slow them down, they can buy time to an extent but in all but the most isolated cases they cannot stop the progress of the disease. That's why lockdowns long term are pointless. They are simply delaying the inevitable and doing so at a huge cost socially, physically and economically. If anyone can seriously explain how we can function as a society that's both economically viable and worth living in u der lockdown restrictions for the next 5 or 10 years, please feel free. And anyone who things I'm exaggerating, go look at the WHO's latest statement - even they don't see an end to Covid in the forseeable future. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Wear masks, keep distance, don't take unnecessary risks, high vaccine uptake. What's the alternative, let it rip and let lots of people die and more suffer unknown disability?" The alternative is to accept the fact this disease is here. It's not going away. There is no certaintly there will be a workable vaccine. People who consider themselves to be at significant risk from the virus will need to take precautions indefinately, just as they do to avoid other potentially life threatening illnesses. The rest of the population will pretty much carry on as normal, yes. I would expect general cleanliness & personal hygine to remain better and I'd anticipate a greater societal pressure for those ill to stay at home but that's about it. You cannot get away from the fact that for the majority Covid is not a serious, life threatening or long term illness. Sad though it may be we cannot shape our society solely around the protection of the vulnerable minority - it simply won't work. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Wear masks, keep distance, don't take unnecessary risks, high vaccine uptake. What's the alternative, let it rip and let lots of people die and more suffer unknown disability? The alternative is to accept the fact this disease is here. It's not going away. There is no certaintly there will be a workable vaccine. People who consider themselves to be at significant risk from the virus will need to take precautions indefinately, just as they do to avoid other potentially life threatening illnesses. The rest of the population will pretty much carry on as normal, yes. I would expect general cleanliness & personal hygine to remain better and I'd anticipate a greater societal pressure for those ill to stay at home but that's about it. You cannot get away from the fact that for the majority Covid is not a serious, life threatening or long term illness. Sad though it may be we cannot shape our society solely around the protection of the vulnerable minority - it simply won't work." Couldn't agree more | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Wear masks, keep distance, don't take unnecessary risks, high vaccine uptake. What's the alternative, let it rip and let lots of people die and more suffer unknown disability? The alternative is to accept the fact this disease is here. It's not going away. There is no certaintly there will be a workable vaccine. People who consider themselves to be at significant risk from the virus will need to take precautions indefinately, just as they do to avoid other potentially life threatening illnesses. The rest of the population will pretty much carry on as normal, yes. I would expect general cleanliness & personal hygine to remain better and I'd anticipate a greater societal pressure for those ill to stay at home but that's about it. You cannot get away from the fact that for the majority Covid is not a serious, life threatening or long term illness. Sad though it may be we cannot shape our society solely around the protection of the vulnerable minority - it simply won't work." Thing is, there are lives that have been lost of those that aren't seen to be vulnerable at all,those that are young,fit and healthy before the virus took over their body. The question is would you feel differently if it claimed the life of someone young and healthy that you loved? | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm sorry you feel that way. " There's no need to feel sorry. I make no apologies for saying what so many are afraid to say. I am very well aware it's unpalatable. It's also, unfortunately, true. Our society is built around the needs of the majority. As a developed society we also care for our vulnerable, poor and underpriviliged but the needs of the majority are the major motivators. To expect that society as a whole is going to turn itself inside out indefinately is I'm afraid entirely unrealistic. If there were a defined end, a goal after which normality would be restored then things would be very different but there's not; there's just an endless path with no benefit to most. The result, sooner or later lockdown will end. Whether with or without government sanction it will end. Normality will return & the virus will spread. I beleive we should accept that, build resources and plans to cope with it, encourage sensible behaviour with good personal risk management and accept the inevitable. I am not an idiot. I wear a mask where necessary, maintain an appropriate distance and practice good personal hygine. I have no wish to catch Covid. I'm also realist enough to know that barring a miracle there is an almost 100% chance that I will eventually catch it. I'm not going looking for it but I'm not goimg to hide away forever either. Life needs to go on and needs to be worth living. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" The question is would you feel differently if it claimed the life of someone young and healthy that you loved?" All sorts of diseases, from flu to meningitis and many more do this all the time. Covid is not unique in killing people, even young, fit & healthy people. Every life lost is a horrible no matter how old, young, ill or fit they are. It's never nice, never welcome but it's part of being human and not something we can change. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm sorry you feel that way. There's no need to feel sorry. I make no apologies for saying what so many are afraid to say. I am very well aware it's unpalatable. It's also, unfortunately, true. Our society is built around the needs of the majority. As a developed society we also care for our vulnerable, poor and underpriviliged but the needs of the majority are the major motivators. To expect that society as a whole is going to turn itself inside out indefinately is I'm afraid entirely unrealistic. If there were a defined end, a goal after which normality would be restored then things would be very different but there's not; there's just an endless path with no benefit to most. The result, sooner or later lockdown will end. Whether with or without government sanction it will end. Normality will return & the virus will spread. I beleive we should accept that, build resources and plans to cope with it, encourage sensible behaviour with good personal risk management and accept the inevitable. I am not an idiot. I wear a mask where necessary, maintain an appropriate distance and practice good personal hygine. I have no wish to catch Covid. I'm also realist enough to know that barring a miracle there is an almost 100% chance that I will eventually catch it. I'm not going looking for it but I'm not goimg to hide away forever either. Life needs to go on and needs to be worth living. " There are so many incorrect assumptions I really don't where or is there any point in refuting your claims. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm sorry you feel that way. There's no need to feel sorry. I make no apologies for saying what so many are afraid to say. I am very well aware it's unpalatable. It's also, unfortunately, true. Our society is built around the needs of the majority. As a developed society we also care for our vulnerable, poor and underpriviliged but the needs of the majority are the major motivators. To expect that society as a whole is going to turn itself inside out indefinately is I'm afraid entirely unrealistic. If there were a defined end, a goal after which normality would be restored then things would be very different but there's not; there's just an endless path with no benefit to most. The result, sooner or later lockdown will end. Whether with or without government sanction it will end. Normality will return & the virus will spread. I beleive we should accept that, build resources and plans to cope with it, encourage sensible behaviour with good personal risk management and accept the inevitable. I am not an idiot. I wear a mask where necessary, maintain an appropriate distance and practice good personal hygine. I have no wish to catch Covid. I'm also realist enough to know that barring a miracle there is an almost 100% chance that I will eventually catch it. I'm not going looking for it but I'm not goimg to hide away forever either. Life needs to go on and needs to be worth living. " “... sooner or later lockdown will end...” ——————— Why do you keep talking about lock down when it has already ended weeks ago? We are not locked down anymore. All we are doing now is taking measures to reduce the spread of the virus. Measures like social distancing, mask, hygiene, - measure which you yourself say you are currently adopting. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" Why do you keep talking about lock down when it has already ended weeks ago? We are not locked down anymore. All we are doing now is taking measures to reduce the spread of the virus. Measures like social distancing, mask, hygiene, - measure which you yourself say you are currently adopting. " Because despite the easing it is not over. There are still businesses closed. There are still people unable to work. There are still entire industries closed. There are still serious restrictions on civil liberties. No, lockdown is not over. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" Why do you keep talking about lock down when it has already ended weeks ago? We are not locked down anymore. All we are doing now is taking measures to reduce the spread of the virus. Measures like social distancing, mask, hygiene, - measure which you yourself say you are currently adopting. Because despite the easing it is not over. There are still businesses closed. There are still people unable to work. There are still entire industries closed. There are still serious restrictions on civil liberties. No, lockdown is not over." Lockdown is over. What you describe above are just after effects of a virus pandemic. Those affect effects you mention also occur after a civil war or some other natural disasters. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" Why do you keep talking about lock down when it has already ended weeks ago? We are not locked down anymore. All we are doing now is taking measures to reduce the spread of the virus. Measures like social distancing, mask, hygiene, - measure which you yourself say you are currently adopting. Because despite the easing it is not over. There are still businesses closed. There are still people unable to work. There are still entire industries closed. There are still serious restrictions on civil liberties. No, lockdown is not over." This may come as a shock to you, but life will not be the same as it was. For an idea of the scale, think ww1 or ww2. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"The alternative is to accept the fact this disease is here. It's not going away. There is no certaintly there will be a workable vaccine. People who consider themselves to be at significant risk from the virus will need to take precautions indefinately, just as they do to avoid other potentially life threatening illnesses. The rest of the population will pretty much carry on as normal, yes. I would expect general cleanliness & personal hygine to remain better and I'd anticipate a greater societal pressure for those ill to stay at home but that's about it. You cannot get away from the fact that for the majority Covid is not a serious, life threatening or long term illness. Sad though it may be we cannot shape our society solely around the protection of the vulnerable minority - it simply won't work." I actually think this contains a lot of well measured and thoughtful input. I do however think there’s perhaps two points we need to remember. The NHS/Care-giver deaths give an insight into the true picture of this virus. There’s 500 odd in total. All the ‘vulnerable status’ staff where taken out of frontline work, so whilst on paper some of these people hand underlying conditions, be aware they where all deemed fit and healthy and able to work, all of them had many years of life ahead of them. This ‘protect the vulnerable’ statement doesn’t really wash, in Covid-19 terms “vulnerable” probably equates to well over half the nation in total. The second point is the long. Forgotten “protect the NHS”. We neared capacity in the early stages of this pandemic, we could very easily ramp back up to that status once again. If we let people “crack on” it’s almost inevitable that will happen. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm old enough to remember when they said lockdown was to save NHS and to flattern the curve, talk about mission creep... Companys are now even struggling to get the lazy ass furloughed back to work, welcome to socialism. What else did you expect. " Lazy ass furloughed?! Who had no choice in the matter? Who lost most of their earnings?! Yeh alright!  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm old enough to remember when they said lockdown was to save NHS and to flattern the curve, talk about mission creep... Companys are now even struggling to get the lazy ass furloughed back to work, welcome to socialism. What else did you expect. Lazy ass furloughed?! Who had no choice in the matter? Who lost most of their earnings?! Yeh alright! "I concur... that was quite a lazy ass comment. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" This may come as a shock to you, but life will not be the same as it was. For an idea of the scale, think ww1 or ww2. " Utter nonsense. WW1 : 895000 dead from the UK WW2 : 449700 dead from the UK Covid : 46299 confirmed deaths Care to explain just how those compare? | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" I actually think this contains a lot of well measured and thoughtful input. I do however think there’s perhaps two points we need to remember. The NHS/Care-giver deaths give an insight into the true picture of this virus. There’s 500 odd in total. All the ‘vulnerable status’ staff where taken out of frontline work, so whilst on paper some of these people hand underlying conditions, be aware they where all deemed fit and healthy and able to work, all of them had many years of life ahead of them. This ‘protect the vulnerable’ statement doesn’t really wash, in Covid-19 terms “vulnerable” probably equates to well over half the nation in total. The second point is the long. Forgotten “protect the NHS”. We neared capacity in the early stages of this pandemic, we could very easily ramp back up to that status once again. If we let people “crack on” it’s almost inevitable that will happen. " I doubt the total of vulnerable is truly that high, I know the UK is often considered the sick man of europe but 50% is probably stretching it a bit. Perhaps 10 - 15% would be closer, still a significant number but much more manageable. And I'm not suggesting all but the most at risk take extreme precautions, all of us are (as others have pointed out) at risk to some extent and we'll all need to determine for ourselves how much risk we're willing to take. As for the NHS, we as a country need to accept that healthcare will need far morr resources going forward to manage this new illness and the addito9nal workload it will create. That's the real reality of Covid. We can't and shouldn't try to suppress it with highly disruptive social restrictions, we need to adjust our risk management & national spending priorities to live with it | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" This may come as a shock to you, but life will not be the same as it was. For an idea of the scale, think ww1 or ww2. Utter nonsense. WW1 : 895000 dead from the UK WW2 : 449700 dead from the UK Covid : 46299 confirmed deaths Care to explain just how those compare?" I wasn't comparing death tolls, WW1 & WW2 lead to irreversible societal changes I said 'life will not be the same'. How we live, work, learn, study, travel, have sex and maybe choose governments will all change. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I think the majority of people are still behaving intelligently, keeping distance, wearing masks in shops, washing hands etc. Perception is skewed by the media, as we each only get to see a tiny few people around us and so just have media coverage to infer what's going on. The public though has lost confidence in those who lead and make decisions not based on the greater good. Letting aides break rules at the worst times of the crisis without punishment, £multi-million contracts going to friends, without competitive tender, many of these expensive contracts delivering atrocious results, such as the tracking phone app. Without confidence from the masses, they create fragmentation and greater division in society. To some extent it seems that they have wasted to foster division recently. Cummings who directs everything for us revels in and prefers destructive change for the country. There's plenty going very well for some. The public deserve great direction and leadership. With people at the helm who aren't particularly willing to give them this and partly due to their poor skillset, we should probably expect the next few months to grow worse. We can individually take responsibility for us and our fellow citizens, showing the respect that we would like too. Never lower yourself to other's levels. " Sorry but I have to disagree, living in what is now a tourist "must visit" destination. Some of our small towns & villages are overrun with little to no social distancing, people arguing with management whether they can go into shops/restaurants etc and a huge percentage acting exactly as they did pre lockdown. Many I'm sure have packed their essentials, but left their brains behind. Whether or not govt advisers or the members of the government stretch out break "the rules" shouldn't have any influence over the vast majority of the population. If you know what you should be doing/have been asked, bloody well do it and stop looking for ways out or ways to circumnavigate the system. It's not difficult. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It's not just you. I hear of pubs which had "secret" lockins during lockdown. And now swinging clubs officially with social distancing but actually turning a blind eye to play. Plenty of fabbers looking for meets - unambiguously not distanced social meets. Anti-maskers, anti-vaxxers. The human race has probably peaked. " | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? " Yes. A close friend lost her grandmother and uncle. A work colleague got it and passed it to his parents and brother, his dad still hasn't fully recovered (infected in March). Another acquaintance got it in late March and took three months to recover (mid 30s, strong as an ox etc). My wife's manager got it in April and it back to work but still not at full strength. An online friend has had it and is still recovering over two months on. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
 | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"that's the best bit of fact/common sense on here for a long time, the virus wont ever go away it will run its course, that's the nature of the beast and it most certainly wont be the last on this overcrowded planet "you reckon we need a cull of occupants on this overcrowded planet then? I'll wait until everyone on forum does themselves in then i promise i'll do the same 
A good way to get the numbers down and make more room on the bus for those allowed to stay doncha fink? | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I think the majority of people are still behaving intelligently, keeping distance, wearing masks in shops, washing hands etc. Perception is skewed by the media, as we each only get to see a tiny few people around us and so just have media coverage to infer what's going on. The public though has lost confidence in those who lead and make decisions not based on the greater good. Letting aides break rules at the worst times of the crisis without punishment, £multi-million contracts going to friends, without competitive tender, many of these expensive contracts delivering atrocious results, such as the tracking phone app. Without confidence from the masses, they create fragmentation and greater division in society. To some extent it seems that they have wasted to foster division recently. Cummings who directs everything for us revels in and prefers destructive change for the country. There's plenty going very well for some. The public deserve great direction and leadership. With people at the helm who aren't particularly willing to give them this and partly due to their poor skillset, we should probably expect the next few months to grow worse. We can individually take responsibility for us and our fellow citizens, showing the respect that we would like too. Never lower yourself to other's levels. Sorry but I have to disagree, living in what is now a tourist "must visit" destination. Some of our small towns & villages are overrun with little to no social distancing, people arguing with management whether they can go into shops/restaurants etc and a huge percentage acting exactly as they did pre lockdown. Many I'm sure have packed their essentials, but left their brains behind. Whether or not govt advisers or the members of the government stretch out break "the rules" shouldn't have any influence over the vast majority of the population. If you know what you should be doing/have been asked, bloody well do it and stop looking for ways out or ways to circumnavigate the system. It's not difficult. " See ....I think I know what I should be doing... it’s not necessarily what I’ve been asked...and the ‘system’ is flawed. So.... bloody well doing it may not look like your version so there’s an issue between us. Tie that in with the breaking of rules, not following guidance by the people who delivered said rules and said you’d be fined if you didn’t .... you get to difficult. If I take the guidance, prior knowledge and learning since the outbreak and decide what ‘I should do’ is that ok? | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" The question is would you feel differently if it claimed the life of someone young and healthy that you loved? All sorts of diseases, from flu to meningitis and many more do this all the time. Covid is not unique in killing people, even young, fit & healthy people. Every life lost is a horrible no matter how old, young, ill or fit they are. It's never nice, never welcome but it's part of being human and not something we can change. " ---------- Nice deflection but you didn't answer the question. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Or have we lost the plot completely. When the scientific and medical fronts are trying their best to fight this thing.. The pathogen will progress through a community in its normal manner until herd immunity (natural or a vaccine) is reached. Anything else is just changing the rate of spread. Cases are immaterial the only thing that matters is hospitalisations and excess deaths, the latter being below the 5 year average for several weeks now. It can actually be argued that the more young people, who are mostly not affected, who catch the virus the better as they will contribute to the herd immunity count. Are you suggesting that we should continue the lockdown debacle that is causing thousands of collateral deaths (routine NHs treatments and tests not being done together with the thousands who will die because of the economic collapse) - no one seems to be bothered about them at all even though they will eventually surpass CV19 deaths by a large margin. It is frustrating that people do not question this evident harm done to countless people who must have suffered and died unable to access the NHS since March. And why are more people not outraged about the erosion of civil liberties! It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on." If a vaccine is found then it won't "pass through the community in a normal manner" at all will it? It will have been halted by the vaccine. Duh. For someone who is the only one who knows what is going on, you didn't see the news during the lockdown that many hospitals were urging people with other problems to attend? Easy to make sweeping statements about being the only one who knows what is going on but refusing to "expand" on it. Just makes you look stupid frankly. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I'm old enough to remember when they said lockdown was to save NHS and to flattern the curve, talk about mission creep... Companys are now even struggling to get the lazy ass furloughed back to work, welcome to socialism. What else did you expect. " The furloughed aren’t lazy ass, their employers put them there (through necessity in most cases). I’ve been furloughed for four months, I’d rather be working and earning 100% as would everyone I know, because while those who haven’t been think we’re all on a jolly the reality is we’re all stressing about money and the future. Some of us have managed to pick up part time work elsewhere others haven’t because it’s tough out there. Lazy we aren’t. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
 | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I know two people that refused to return to work from furlough. One of them told their company that they had made social plans over the next couple of weeks so couldn't go back to work yet" couple of weeks so couldn't go back to work yet" Everyone I know on furlough, and its a lot, is desperate to get back to work because the fear of unemployment is very real. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anyone here had it or know anyone who’s had it ? Yes. A close friend lost her grandmother and uncle. A work colleague got it and passed it to his parents and brother, his dad still hasn't fully recovered (infected in March). Another acquaintance got it in late March and took three months to recover (mid 30s, strong as an ox etc). My wife's manager got it in April and it back to work but still not at full strength. An online friend has had it and is still recovering over two months on. " Maybe you are the carrier ?  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I know two people that refused to return to work from furlough. One of them told their company that they had made social plans over the next couple of weeks so couldn't go back to work yet" They should be made to take those planned social events as holidays then, when an employer asks for people to go back then you would think the work is now there for them, seems a lot of people on Furlough just think it’s a free ride. For a lot of people yet to go back from Furlough I would imagine won’t be having a job to go back to  | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I think the majority of people are still behaving intelligently, keeping distance, wearing masks in shops, washing hands etc. Perception is skewed by the media, as we each only get to see a tiny few people around us and so just have media coverage to infer what's going on. The public though has lost confidence in those who lead and make decisions not based on the greater good. Letting aides break rules at the worst times of the crisis without punishment, £multi-million contracts going to friends, without competitive tender, many of these expensive contracts delivering atrocious results, such as the tracking phone app. Without confidence from the masses, they create fragmentation and greater division in society. To some extent it seems that they have wasted to foster division recently. Cummings who directs everything for us revels in and prefers destructive change for the country. There's plenty going very well for some. The public deserve great direction and leadership. With people at the helm who aren't particularly willing to give them this and partly due to their poor skillset, we should probably expect the next few months to grow worse. We can individually take responsibility for us and our fellow citizens, showing the respect that we would like too. Never lower yourself to other's levels. Sorry but I have to disagree, living in what is now a tourist "must visit" destination. Some of our small towns & villages are overrun with little to no social distancing, people arguing with management whether they can go into shops/restaurants etc and a huge percentage acting exactly as they did pre lockdown. Many I'm sure have packed their essentials, but left their brains behind. Whether or not govt advisers or the members of the government stretch out break "the rules" shouldn't have any influence over the vast majority of the population. If you know what you should be doing/have been asked, bloody well do it and stop looking for ways out or ways to circumnavigate the system. It's not difficult. See ....I think I know what I should be doing... it’s not necessarily what I’ve been asked...and the ‘system’ is flawed. So.... bloody well doing it may not look like your version so there’s an issue between us. Tie that in with the breaking of rules, not following guidance by the people who delivered said rules and said you’d be fined if you didn’t .... you get to difficult. If I take the guidance, prior knowledge and learning since the outbreak and decide what ‘I should do’ is that ok? " So you're not doing what you've been asked as I presume you think you know better? Again, the actions of others shouldn't influence what we have been told whether MP's /advisers or whatever have gone against the rules. It is a shame that there hadn't been more fines including some high profile ones. However will have to agree to disagree. I still don't think anything that has been asked of us has been difficult to do. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
" The question is would you feel differently if it claimed the life of someone young and healthy that you loved? All sorts of diseases, from flu to meningitis and many more do this all the time. Covid is not unique in killing people, even young, fit & healthy people. Every life lost is a horrible no matter how old, young, ill or fit they are. It's never nice, never welcome but it's part of being human and not something we can change. " But we do our best to protect ourselves from flu, meningitis etc... So if wearing a mask protects us I'm all for it, yes it's not100% but if it helps it's worth a minor inconvenience. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"I think the majority of people are still behaving intelligently, keeping distance, wearing masks in shops, washing hands etc. Perception is skewed by the media, as we each only get to see a tiny few people around us and so just have media coverage to infer what's going on. The public though has lost confidence in those who lead and make decisions not based on the greater good. Letting aides break rules at the worst times of the crisis without punishment, £multi-million contracts going to friends, without competitive tender, many of these expensive contracts delivering atrocious results, such as the tracking phone app. Without confidence from the masses, they create fragmentation and greater division in society. To some extent it seems that they have wasted to foster division recently. Cummings who directs everything for us revels in and prefers destructive change for the country. There's plenty going very well for some. The public deserve great direction and leadership. With people at the helm who aren't particularly willing to give them this and partly due to their poor skillset, we should probably expect the next few months to grow worse. We can individually take responsibility for us and our fellow citizens, showing the respect that we would like too. Never lower yourself to other's levels. Sorry but I have to disagree, living in what is now a tourist "must visit" destination. Some of our small towns & villages are overrun with little to no social distancing, people arguing with management whether they can go into shops/restaurants etc and a huge percentage acting exactly as they did pre lockdown. Many I'm sure have packed their essentials, but left their brains behind. Whether or not govt advisers or the members of the government stretch out break "the rules" shouldn't have any influence over the vast majority of the population. If you know what you should be doing/have been asked, bloody well do it and stop looking for ways out or ways to circumnavigate the system. It's not difficult. See ....I think I know what I should be doing... it’s not necessarily what I’ve been asked...and the ‘system’ is flawed. So.... bloody well doing it may not look like your version so there’s an issue between us. Tie that in with the breaking of rules, not following guidance by the people who delivered said rules and said you’d be fined if you didn’t .... you get to difficult. If I take the guidance, prior knowledge and learning since the outbreak and decide what ‘I should do’ is that ok? So you're not doing what you've been asked as I presume you think you know better? Again, the actions of others shouldn't influence what we have been told whether MP's /advisers or whatever have gone against the rules. It is a shame that there hadn't been more fines including some high profile ones. However will have to agree to disagree. I still don't think anything that has been asked of us has been difficult to do." Some may find those things difficult ... yes I believe I know what I need to do. You seem very keen on blindly following what you’re told, without question! I don’t take what others, who make the rules, have done contrary to their own insistence as a guide or my reason for non conformance .... they are a bunch of fuckwits when telling me what to do so I don’t listen ... I do what I believe I need to. Similarly I don’t take their example and say they can do I can.... I do what I believe I need to! | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Does anyone have a link to the list of pubs and swingers clubs having lockins? Asking for a freind. " Of course you are | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"It is clear that we are led towards a massive ‘reset’ – economically, politically and socially. I could expand on this but won't suffice to say most people don't have a clue as to what is really going on. You honestly expect me to believe that you've got an insight into what 'is really going on' that nobody else has? Get a grip ffs. " The reset thing is a conspiracy theory... Another one. | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
| Post new Message to Thread |
| back to top |  |
