FabSwingers.com forum: Is the UK...

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

No. This idea by many that everything the UK does is smeared at by everyone else around the is just as misplaced and wrong as the opposite British Exceptionalism belief shown by many others in regard to the BREXIT debate.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

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By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago

atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

Europe, just like the rest of the World, really don't think about the UK very much at all on a day-to-day basis. Just like you are 'not' thinking about Finland right now.

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By *hrista BellendWoman
over a year ago

surrounded by twinkly lights

Only when its Eurovision time

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By *ancs_tgirl_38TV/TS
over a year ago

Blackpool

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

People are concerned for the people here, is my experience, just as with brexit

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By *arakiss12TV/TS
over a year ago

Bedford

Every country has laughable instances.

The danger is when a country thinks it's better than everyone else then it's asking to be laughed at when things go wrong.

Britain tends to be envied and laughed at the same time. A victim of it's own success. WW1 WW2 World Cup66 all no easy feats but set it up to be knocked too.

Also making it's previous leaders at successful time harder to follow.

Boris ain't no Churchill.

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By *en_Dover79Man
over a year ago

Oswaldtwistle

I think the people are the problem... govt has advised what we should do but too many stupid people in the UK... we are on our arse as a nation.. thank god we aren't declared war on..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think the people are the problem... govt has advised what we should do but too many stupid people in the UK... we are on our arse as a nation.. thank god we aren't declared war on.. "

By whom ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

When this is over we will see who's the first to build up and help restart the world economy, don't hold your breath waiting for the EU. Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again. But I'm sure there will be plenty of doom and gloom to knock us back.

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By *tticusukMan
over a year ago

Formby

"When this is over we will see who's the first to build up and help restart the world economy, don't hold your breath waiting for the EU. Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again. But I'm sure there will be plenty of doom and gloom to knock us back. "

We will be propped up by trumps chlorinated chicken and cheap farm imports.

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

" Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again. "

How ?

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By *ntelligent Gent.Man
over a year ago

.....

As someone who works with people around the world.

Generally the feeling is shock and dismay. They thought the UK had clever people and great resources. We knew were a bit of a mess at times. Just it has damaged us reputationally. But not irreparably. Will take a while.

There's those that hate the UK's empire past already. But there's so much love for Britain too.

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By *yn drwgMan
over a year ago

Camarthen

I'm not defending this countries politics from all parties but if you think that countries like Italy, Spain and Greece are ahead of the game you are very. Much mistaken corruption has killed these countries economies for decades.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

The main problem with the Uk are the people that make silly posts trying to decry the Uk and all it’s worth.

Britain is a fantastic country, sadly so many want to see it fail from the inside. The rest of the World don’t feel the same. Most look up to us

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again.

How ?"

Bull dog spirt? The Uk always pulls together when it’s needed the most. Just look at terrorist attacks. When we need it the most, we all dig in

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

The main problem with the Uk are the people that make silly posts trying to decry the Uk and all it’s worth.

Britain is a fantastic country, sadly so many want to see it fail from the inside. The rest of the World don’t feel the same. Most look up to us "

Yes I see a lot of british putting our country down constantly.

If it is such bad place to be, why do so many want to come and settle here ?

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By *kstallionMan
over a year ago

milton keynes

Top health systems like those in Italy and Spain collapsed under the weight of the virus. The NHS did not even come close to capacity. Ventilators were in short supply in all countries. With a national effort that was quickly resolved to the point we have more than needed. Germany and France at the start refused to send supplies to fellow EU countries. Then the richer northern EU countries did not want to help out Italy with thier finacal problems. They wanted to have the EU give them a loan and impose harsh terms to have the money paid back. Thankfully they came to see that for the folly it was.

of course we have made mistakes but its not unique to the UK. Also remember the government cant do it all - it all relies on the people

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

Indeed not to mention the Dominic Cummings saga I’ve totally lost respect now

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By *urocougarCouple
over a year ago

watton

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

Indeed not to mention the Dominic Cummings saga I’ve totally lost respect now

I’m sure Britain will bounce back without Yr respect for it

You could always move somewhere else if you not happy with the uk

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By *nertsmateMan
over a year ago

Between Trumpton and Camberwick Green

I can't believe that we've got so many people that are happy with a government that have presided over us having a higher death rate than the rest of the EU put together,that want us all to give our data away with few controls and no time limit and then want to blame the people for their own total ineptitude! When the people that I have contact with in Europe stop laughing at the mess that we are heading towards, they feel sorry for the ones that didn't vote the buffon in !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I can't believe that we've got so many people that are happy with a government that have presided over us having a higher death rate than the rest of the EU put together,that want us all to give our data away with few controls and no time limit and then want to blame the people for their own total ineptitude! When the people that I have contact with in Europe stop laughing at the mess that we are heading towards, they feel sorry for the ones that didn't vote the buffon in !

Sorry, higher death rate than of the EU put together?!?!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Spain 27,000

Italy 33,000

France 29,000

......

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By *kstallionMan
over a year ago

milton keynes

How do you come to the conclusion we have a higher death rate than rest of EU together

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

For a electing Boris ? Yes, in the same way we laugh at trump.

That's what people were saying to me in Gran Canaria anyway

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think we have done ok really.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"People are concerned for the people here, is my experience, just as with brexit "
What has Brexit got to do with it?

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By *eeBee67Man
over a year ago

Masked and Distant

Wonder if the rest of the worlds press puts as much effort into running down their countries and only focusing on negatives.

Look at how the NHS is pulling together and handling things.

Look at teachers continuing they fit vulnerable, at risk and key worker children.

Look at how strangers are now talking in queues for the supermarkets. Supermarkets that have never shut.

Look at the hundreds of thousands of volunteers helping others.

Yeh, a laughing stock..... dont think so.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Spain 27,000

Italy 33,000

France 29,000

......"

So not greater than the EU put together then or even close

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Haha exaggerate much.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wonder if the rest of the worlds press puts as much effort into running down their countries and only focusing on negatives.

Look at how the NHS is pulling together and handling things.

Look at teachers continuing they fit vulnerable, at risk and key worker children.

Look at how strangers are now talking in queues for the supermarkets. Supermarkets that have never shut.

Look at the hundreds of thousands of volunteers helping others.

Yeh, a laughing stock..... dont think so.

That just a few fab experts on here that do that.

Run down our country that is.

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By *uicy jonesMan
over a year ago

near a big hill in s/ shropshire NOT in

[Removed by poster at 07/06/20 00:03:39]

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Wonder if the rest of the worlds press puts as much effort into running down their countries and only focusing on negatives.

Look at how the NHS is pulling together and handling things.

Look at teachers continuing they fit vulnerable, at risk and key worker children.

Look at how strangers are now talking in queues for the supermarkets. Supermarkets that have never shut.

Look at the hundreds of thousands of volunteers helping others.

Yeh, a laughing stock..... dont think so.

That just a few fab experts on here that do that.

Run down our country that is."

Yes fabs own self confessed experts

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

I have friends in Germany, Canada, China, Australia, Saudi & South Korea. They're not laughing at the UK , just utterly aghast.

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead"

Still obsessed I see.

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

". Most look up to us "

How delusional could you be

A perfect example of UK's inflated sense of its place in the world

That has brought them down the dark hole of brexit

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead"

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

Still obsessed I see."

You must have a hard time defending Boris now

This thread is about the laughing stock of the world that he is and most agree

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke"

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

Still obsessed I see.

You must have a hard time defending Boris now

This thread is about the laughing stock of the world that he is and most agree"

most agree eh? so you have the opinion of 7 billion people? think the majirity of the world are to busy living there lifes to give a shit what the uk is doing.fuck ther are plenty in the uk who dont give a shit

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 07/06/20 09:37:23]

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

"
hahaha ny ilk i didnt vite for him so assuming things eh.and again why do u care he not your p.m.and a hard on for you? nah your really not my type.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

I have never defended boris once.

Lol my ilk ?

You have a true obsession with him.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The UK does currently have a higher death rate than the EU combined:

https://metro.co.uk/2020/06/04/uk-reported-deaths-yesterday-27-eu-nations-combined-12803278/amp/

Note - this is current daily death rate, not all time.

The handling of the virus has been an omnishambles.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

". Most look up to us

How delusional could you be

A perfect example of UK's inflated sense of its place in the world

That has brought them down the dark hole of brexit"

The Boris crush is still going then and as usual brexit included

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By *ebwizMan
over a year ago

Clevedon

All countries are different. Our issue here that does not help is a high population count on a relatively small footprint with huge people density in urban areas. London spiking early was a good example of lots of people living, working, and commuting together.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I find Boris hilarious. Like something out of a badly written cartoon comedy sketch. On the plus side though, he is nowhere near as much of a laughing stock as our friend across the pond. These are some of the most politically powerful people on the planet. They're not really meant to be seen as funny

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By *arkus1812Man
over a year ago

Lifes departure lounge NN9 Northamptonshire East not West MidlandsMidlands

"Spain 27,000

Italy 33,000

France 29,000

......"

These figures are meaningless as they take no account of populations of the 3 countries. What is more realistic are the deaths per million of the population.

Belgium 828

U.K. 597

Spain 580

Italy 560

France 447

Holland 351

Germany 105

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No, but MSM want you to think that we are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Spain 27,000

Italy 33,000

France 29,000

......

These figures are meaningless as they take no account of populations of the 3 countries. What is more realistic are the deaths per million of the population.

Belgium 828

U.K. 597

Spain 580

Italy 560

France 447

Holland 351

Germany 105"

They are not meaningless, that’s the numbers of deaths. Your stats are meaningless if you take into account population of town and city’s

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

Yes. For at least 25 years.

Total joke.

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

"No, but MSM want you to think that we are. "

Oh here we go

Make Britain Great Again

Speaking of laughing stocks

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By *arkus1812Man
over a year ago

Lifes departure lounge NN9 Northamptonshire East not West MidlandsMidlands

"Spain 27,000

Italy 33,000

France 29,000

......

These figures are meaningless as they take no account of populations of the 3 countries. What is more realistic are the deaths per million of the population.

Belgium 828

U.K. 597

Spain 580

Italy 560

France 447

Holland 351

Germany 105

They are not meaningless, that’s the numbers of deaths. Your stats are meaningless if you take into account population of town and city’s "

Towns and cities are irrelevant the figures I have quoted are for every million people in the country, The population for UK is around 67 million and for each million there are 596 deaths.

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By *ihimbiherCouple
over a year ago

lightwater

Yep

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

population density, the Uk have one of the highest in EU

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By *rofessor_MarcusMan
over a year ago

Chorley

A weak and feeble minded little country that still thinks it is 1900. So much so it sends a 'gun boat' to deal with Johnny foreigner. It treats its citizens not much better than serfs or forelock tugging imbeciles.

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By *he Happy ManMan
over a year ago

Merseyside

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

Laughing stock of the world. Other countries cannot believe how badly we handled the virus.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it's been handle well. We are all still receiving money to live on while this happens. Some countries are not so lucky. Mostly everyone has pulled together to get through this. We were never completely locked down but we're given a bit of freedom, some countries weren't trusted with this. The problem is that some people are given an inch and take a mile. Our government is relying on us to think for ourselves and the safety of others. It's everyone's responsibility. So I don't blame the government but the minority of people that don't follow the rules. Maybe Boris should of watched Jeremy Kyle before giving us an inch.

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By *mnipotent_BehemothMan
over a year ago

near Merry Hill shopping centre

" Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again.

How ?"

I did wonder that myself, we were a nation built on industry but we have sold it all off most of the companies who could build national wealth are now governed and owned from board rooms In foreign nations, we have no UK car industry, steel industry, power generation even our postal service is owned oversea, our utility and public transport networks are almost all foreign, what do we have left BT and the government appears to be hell bent on breaking that up so it will be vulnerable to take over by foreign competition. Other than SME’s what major British industry the kind that creates wealth not service industry do we have left?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

hahaha ny ilk i didnt vite for him so assuming things eh.and again why do u care he not your p.m.and a hard on for you? nah your really not my type."

No, you didn't have the balls to vote at all.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The thing that I get from this thread is people think we handled it well. I can't really see how this government could of done much worse. Just wait to see the shambles they make of Brexit, it's gonna be laughable.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have made mistakes during this outbreak, but do not make the EU countries to be perfect. Italy still controlled by mafia corruption. Greece nepotism, and tax avoidance (20 gardeners for Athens public building that has no garden!). Germany AFD party. France over Union control. GC try to buy a bar in the main shopping centres without paying a 10% plus "cash bonus" to the landlords.

We still have beautiful country, and hopefully we come out at sometimes better, and not so up our own ass. Unfortunately I think people will have short memory. Stay safe

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

hahaha ny ilk i didnt vite for him so assuming things eh.and again why do u care he not your p.m.and a hard on for you? nah your really not my type.

No, you didn't have the balls to vote at all. "

like i told you before every on e has a choice and mine is nit to vote.ooooo it takes real balls to put a cross in a box lol .you wana go vote for the clowns thats your choice id rather not.balls indeed. pah

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

hahaha ny ilk i didnt vite for him so assuming things eh.and again why do u care he not your p.m.and a hard on for you? nah your really not my type.

No, you didn't have the balls to vote at all.

You shouldn't bite mate.

It's what they want.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"No one is laughing now

We all laughed at UK when you elected in that stupid blonde lying TV personality of a cunt Boris on a wave of xenophobia helped along by that moronic slogan "let's get Brexit done"

But no one laughs when he presides over 50,000 dead

why do you have such a hard on for boris he not even your p.m.i personaly think the bloke is a dick but you seem to be obsesed by the bloke

And why have you a hard on for me?

This thread is about how much Boris has fucked up and is a laughing stock of the world and you and your ilk just attack me

hahaha ny ilk i didnt vite for him so assuming things eh.and again why do u care he not your p.m.and a hard on for you? nah your really not my type.

No, you didn't have the balls to vote at all.

Although I would prefer you to vote as feel its important. What's more important is you have a choice whether to vote or not.

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic"

Yes but not just because of the coronavirus virus and the death toll. I often travel on the continent and people are genuinely taking the piss at the UK since Brexit. But people who holiday in Southend or Blackpool probably don’t realise it and don’t care about it. It’s quite embarrassing to be honest.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think it's been handle well. We are all still receiving money to live on while this happens. Some countries are not so lucky. Mostly everyone has pulled together to get through this. We were never completely locked down but we're given a bit of freedom, some countries weren't trusted with this. The problem is that some people are given an inch and take a mile. Our government is relying on us to think for ourselves and the safety of others. It's everyone's responsibility. So I don't blame the government but the minority of people that don't follow the rules. Maybe Boris should of watched Jeremy Kyle before giving us an inch.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

I travel alot on the continent also.

I have never felt embarrassed about being british .

Not once.

In fact I proud of my Country.

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

Remember the state of the UK in the 70s before we joined the EU or do you have a selective memory. When it comes to reinvent itself and pull together, what Germany has done since WW2 is incredible. And it also had to absorb East Germany. The UK won’t restart the world economy more than it has à world beating trace and track system. It’s all waffle and empty words. Let’s get on our feet before trying to show the EU of anybody else who’s the boss. At the moment, our stats look pathetic and there’s nothing to be proud of.

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By *emma HoldenTV/TS
over a year ago

Ramsey

Exactly right & total common sense. I've watched the news in disbelief at the behaviour of the uk public in recent weeks trying to break lockdown & pouring on to beaches & leaving tonnes of litter behind & ruining the countryside. So yes, the uk will be a laughing stock to foreigners who must be stood there watching them make a mess of the rules. And as for these protests, they know the social distancing rules & how vulnerable BAME people are to the virus but if they clearly don't care about their own health of that of their families etc, why should anyone else give them a second thought. Why the uk thinks it's different to any other part of the world defies belief and I'm so glad I live somewhere that's not part of it.

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

Well we havent got much choice re the eu

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

" Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again.

How ?

Bull dog spirt? The Uk always pulls together when it’s needed the most. Just look at terrorist attacks. When we need it the most, we all dig in"

Do people actually believe this bull dog spirit fairy tale?

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By *ionelhutzMan
over a year ago

liverpool

"Wonder if the rest of the worlds press puts as much effort into running down their countries and only focusing on negatives.

Look at how the NHS is pulling together and handling things.

Look at teachers continuing they fit vulnerable, at risk and key worker children.

Look at how strangers are now talking in queues for the supermarkets. Supermarkets that have never shut.

Look at the hundreds of thousands of volunteers helping others.

Yeh, a laughing stock..... dont think so.

And the NHS for its efforts is facing a 2 year pay freeze?

Still go team boris.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Britain can pull together and drag it's self up, we done it before I'm sure we can do it again.

How ?

Bull dog spirt? The Uk always pulls together when it’s needed the most. Just look at terrorist attacks. When we need it the most, we all dig in

Do people actually believe this bull dog spirit fairy tale?"

Oh absolutely, hurrah, hurrah God save the Queen , Land of hope and Glory. Rule Britannia

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By *V-AliceTV/TS
over a year ago

Ayr

"The laughing stock of Europe?

Everything the government announced /does has been shambolic

I have friends in Germany, Canada, China, Australia, Saudi & South Korea. They're not laughing at the UK , just utterly aghast. "

This is probably closest to the mark. Not sure we're laughed at. Doubt if we're looked up to much, though.

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