FabSwingers.com forum: Number of deaths

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

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By *ntelligent Gent.Man
over a year ago

.....

Dementia.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman
over a year ago

South

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Don’t think we will ever know ... if she contracted covid in hospital and that’s what she died of then how else can it be recorded? Like contracting MRSA while in for a broken leg I guess.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off"

Source for that?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Are you sure about that? How did it appear? Was it 1a Covid-19 1b Traumatic head injury? Because that would be fine.

Or are you saying that they couldn't do a post mortem because they were covid-19 positive? Because again that would be fine as you dint really need a post mortem

Or are you saying that the traumatic head injury wasnt on the certificate at all. Because given a traumatic injury needs to be referred to the Coroner and even if it wasn't by the hospital the registrar would I'm not sure what you are saying is 100% accurate

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By *teveuk77Man
over a year ago

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off"

So are we blaming freak accidents for the 60,000 excess deaths?

Something doesn't add up with that situation. Are you talking horseshit?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off"

When did they test for covid-19?

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Are you sure about that? How did it appear? Was it 1a Covid-19 1b Traumatic head injury? Because that would be fine.

Or are you saying that they couldn't do a post mortem because they were covid-19 positive? Because again that would be fine as you dint really need a post mortem

I know a guy whose brother said his cousin heard that his mate was talking so somebody who knew a policeman that told him his sister was passing by a car crash where the guy went through the windscreen and died of covid19. ... Strange times

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Covid deaths are people who died with covid, not necessarily from covid. That much has been made clear for a long time.

However, for every death for which covid might not have been the direct cause, I would expect that there are several for which covid was the undiagnosed direct cause.

The numbers are still almost certainly heavily understated.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Do you personally know her?...cos I'm sure this has been posted before here and on other media...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate "

What do you mean "homes just put covid on the certificate"?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Covid deaths are people who died with covid, not necessarily from covid. That much has been made clear for a long time.

However, for every death for which covid might not have been the direct cause, I would expect that there are several for which covid was the undiagnosed direct cause.

The numbers are still almost certainly heavily understated."

They had several relatives on radio show, and all felt their parent was not killed by covid but was still recorded as such. Make of that what you will.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Except we have hard evidence to prove these stories, I’ll just treat them as hearsay.

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By *ntelligent Gent.Man
over a year ago

.....

Anecdotal evidence doesn't really work for me. Needs a lot more then that people.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

There are quite a lot of threads discussing and disputing the numbers.

The official numbers reported daily are well below many others that rely on average mortality levels etc.

Ultimately, we're not writing the death certificates, we leave that to people who are qualified and know the circumstances. The horse kick death was discovered on another thread. I assume that her family know the full circumstances and it's the loss of their daughter which is bothering them.

Chaotic crisis points enable what are often crude responses. The ONS data is a little in arrears, as registering deaths etc takes time. They are your best source for comparisons between other years.

It's a complex issue, where managing stretched services and keeping the wellbeing of the nation are the important priorities. Often the death levels are being used as a an alternative to the likes of 5G and other connevtioms, that may help towards a distraction from priority being given to putting people, not the economy first. We need to focus on people's lifestyles, doing all that we can to keep the R level as low as possible. It's also helpful to have a national plan that's equal, as people don't always fit into separate regions 100% of their lives, making regional lockdowns etc difficult to deploy and manage.

The lockdown here has saved many lives, based on the trajectory of infection levels when it was imposed. If it had been 2 weeks earlier, approx 20,000 lives could have been saved plus if care homes hadn't been excluded by the government for attention, many elderly people wouldn't have suffered as much.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman
over a year ago

South

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Are you sure about that? How did it appear? Was it 1a Covid-19 1b Traumatic head injury? Because that would be fine.

Or are you saying that they couldn't do a post mortem because they were covid-19 positive? Because again that would be fine as you dint really need a post mortem

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By *oncupiscence73Woman
over a year ago

South

"There are quite a lot of threads discussing and disputing the numbers.

The official numbers reported daily are well below many others that rely on average mortality levels etc.

Chaotic crisis points enable what are often crude responses. The ONS data is a little in arrears, as registering deaths etc takes time. They are your best source for comparisons between other years.

This

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The statistics apparently will show the picture by end of year, according to statistics expert, what he said made sense, there is always a first wave of deaths over winter, it was smaller than normal and covid has picked off those in a second wave of deaths...... Bumping that spike up. By end of year we'll be able to compare the overall death rate to average yearly death rate, obviously.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Except we have hard evidence to prove these stories, I’ll justtreat them as hearsay. Family friend so yes"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Anybody honestly believe Italy have fewer deaths than us?

I worked for a business owned byan Italian family for 7 years, a long time ago. But it gave a useful insight into Italian attitudes.

They have no respect for official authority. Taxes are optional. The black economy is vast.

If it benefits an individual to lie to, or conceal something from the govt then they will do. Without pause.

I doubt they even have accurate population numbers. Census must be an official nightmare. They sure as shit won't know of all covid infections or deaths.

Adherence to lockdown was sparse at best to start with.

Now view this in the context of the reports and images of carnage we all saw from Italian hospitals, bearing in mind that theirs is a system at least as advanced and well funded as ours.

And you are left to wonder just how nany Italians have REALLY died.

I do not trust them.

And don't get me started on Spain and Greece...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Except we have hard evidence to prove these stories, I’ll justtreat them as hearsay. Family friend so yes"

Cool. So you can answer my earlier post about what was actually on the death certificate then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Anybody honestly believe Italy have fewer deaths than us?

I worked for a business owned byan Italian family for 7 years, a long time ago. But it gave a useful insight into Italian attitudes.

They have no respect for official authority. Taxes are optional. The black economy is vast.

If it benefits an individual to lie to, or conceal something from the govt then they will do. Without pause.

I doubt they even have accurate population numbers. Census must be an official nightmare. They sure as shit won't know of all covid infections or deaths.

Adherence to lockdown was sparse at best to start with.

Now view this in the context of the reports and images of carnage we all saw from Italian hospitals, bearing in mind that theirs is a system at least as advanced and well funded as ours.

And you are left to wonder just how nany Italians have REALLY died.

I do not trust them.

And don't get me started on Spain and Greece...

So you know this to be true for every Italian in every village, every town, every city? Or are you just stereo typing

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Did you see the death certificate?

Why would a doctor state a false cause of death when there's apparently no reason to do so?

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By *teveuk77Man
over a year ago

"Anybody honestly believe Italy have fewer deaths than us?

I worked for a business owned byan Italian family for 7 years, a long time ago. But it gave a useful insight into Italian attitudes.

They have no respect for official authority. Taxes are optional. The black economy is vast.

If it benefits an individual to lie to, or conceal something from the govt then they will do. Without pause.

I doubt they even have accurate population numbers. Census must be an official nightmare. They sure as shit won't know of all covid infections or deaths.

Adherence to lockdown was sparse at best to start with.

Now view this in the context of the reports and images of carnage we all saw from Italian hospitals, bearing in mind that theirs is a system at least as advanced and well funded as ours.

And you are left to wonder just how nany Italians have REALLY died.

I do not trust them.

And don't get me started on Spain and Greece...

The media images showing carnage was Lombardy region which was particularly badly hit. The Italians imposed lockdown quickly. Not all regions were hit like this.

Of course , italian figures are off the true figure but so are ours. Excess deaths will show a figure closer to the truth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Anybody honestly believe Italy have fewer deaths than us?

I worked for a business owned byan Italian family for 7 years, a long time ago. But it gave a useful insight into Italian attitudes.

They have no respect for official authority. Taxes are optional. The black economy is vast.

If it benefits an individual to lie to, or conceal something from the govt then they will do. Without pause.

I doubt they even have accurate population numbers. Census must be an official nightmare. They sure as shit won't know of all covid infections or deaths.

Adherence to lockdown was sparse at best to start with.

Now view this in the context of the reports and images of carnage we all saw from Italian hospitals, bearing in mind that theirs is a system at least as advanced and well funded as ours.

And you are left to wonder just how nany Italians have REALLY died.

I do not trust them.

And don't get me started on Spain and Greece...

So you know this to be true for every Italian in every village, every town, every city? Or are you just stereo typing

Don't be absurd. I do know it to a reasonable generalisation tho. But obviously not everyone is identical.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate "

You can't 'just put covid' on the certificate unless there's evidence to support it.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

They had several relatives on radio show, and all felt their parent was not killed by covid but was still recorded as such. Make of that what you will."

I make from that the victim's family are probably not medical practitioners.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate

You can't 'just put covid' on the certificate unless there's evidence to support it."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate

You can't 'just put covid' on the certificate unless there's evidence to support it.

Yes this is true.

The nursing home where the mrs works had 19 deaths 13 had tested positive a thd remaining 6 had symptoms but never got tested before they died.

But the whole 19 were recorded as covid 19 deaths.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate

You can't 'just put covid' on the certificate unless there's evidence to support it.

Actually you can. Though the evidence doesn't need to be a positive swab. The cause is only ever to the best of the certifying doctor's knowledge and belief. In a care home someone symptomatic and with other residents having tested positive it would meet the criteria."
So the figures are whatever they want them to be, some are saying if you have a high rate of C19 you can claim extra funding?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Thousands like that my friend died of a heart attack on his death certificate covid.

He had no underlying health issues ether.

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By *arakiss12TV/TS
over a year ago

Bedford

There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

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By *udistcpl1Couple
over a year ago

Wirral

"There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

Just add to the list;

Controlling nonsense on threads like this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

Just add to the list;

Controlling nonsense on threads like this."

Not sure I get the point you're trying to make with this?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Thousands like that my friend died of a heart attack on his death certificate covid.

He had no underlying health issues ether."

How do you know they died if a heart attack? Or are you confusing cardiac arrest with a heart attack?

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

The cause is only ever to the best of the certifying doctor's knowledge and belief. In a care home someone symptomatic and with other residents having tested positive it would meet the criteria."

That was the 'evidence', I was referring to, the existence of symptoms indicating the illness, I doubt being kicked in the head by a horse would be amongst them!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

I didn't realise we had so many horses.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The doctor told his wife it was a heart attack but he had to write covid on the certificate under instructions by NHS Scotland

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

This has been an issue from the start. The figures include those that died with covid or even suspected of having having (like in care homes) covid regardless of actual cause of death. A few weeks ago a doctor interviewed on the radio confirmed this when angry relatives phoned in.

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The doctor told his wife it was a heart attack but he had to write covid on the certificate under instructions by NHS Scotland "

Sorry but that's simply not true. Or at best you are not telling the whole story.

If someone tests positive for covid-19 then a post mortem is not possible so the death ends up being recorded as covid-19. Which admittedly is not ideal. But if the doctor knew that they had suffered a heart attack then they would issue for that.

Again I suspect you are confusing cardiac arrest with heart attack

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This has been an issue from the start. The figures include those that died with covid or even suspected of having having (like in care homes) covid regardless of actual cause of death. A few weeks ago a doctor interviewed on the radio confirmed this when angry relatives phoned in.

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible"

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario"

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll"

It would go at best in 2 as a contributing which when looking at the cause of death it clearly is.

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

Some death certificates will have Covid wrongly and some that should have Covid mentioned don’t have it. My guess, as I have nothing to prove this is that it probably even itself out. We have horrendous numbers which is grim.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off"

Just a layman myself but why would anyone carry out a test for covid on a person who has died from the trauma caused by coming off the horse..?

Doesn't ring true..

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll

It would go at best in 2 as a contributing which when looking at the cause of death it clearly is. "

Well I'm only saying what the doc said so take it he knows given its his job

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By *yn drwgMan
over a year ago

Camarthen

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off"

Sorry to hear that she passed away, did she get a postmortem as I've heard of many cases that if covid 19 is on the death certificate a mostmortem would not have been carried out.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just started playing doubles tennis again last week. A lot of peeps in the 60s and 70s playing again as singles was too much for them and glad to be back out there for their mental well being.

Most of us reckon we had something in Jan/feb or March which may have been Covid. One of my mates daughter works in Geriatrics and he said they have been very quiet for last 4 weeks with very little to do. It confirms a lot of what I've been thinking that this whole thing is starting to get very fishy about the numbers.

I bet a load of these so called covid deaths are people that would have died anyway. And now even more draconian measures are around the corner thanks to WHO meddling regarding face masks. I am not a fab expert by the way, just anecdotal and someone that doesn't believe all the hype we are being fed every day.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll

It would go at best in 2 as a contributing which when looking at the cause of death it clearly is.

Well I'm only saying what the doc said so take it he knows given its his job"

It's been a common complaint since this whole thing started. So many people phoned in with the same sort of thing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll"

The government are doing their best to hide the true number of deaths as it is. Why on earth would they want Covid-19 appearing as the cause of death when it quite clearly wasn't? If anything the opposite would be true. Some of the 'evidence' quoted on here is little more than biased ignorant tittle tattle.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"The doctor told his wife it was a heart attack but he had to write covid on the certificate under instructions by NHS Scotland "

I work for NHS Scotland and have never heard of that instruction. There are also legal and ethical reasons that would make it unlikely.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"The doctor told his wife it was a heart attack but he had to write covid on the certificate under instructions by NHS Scotland "

Because the heart failure may have happened as a result of covid, that’s one of the way it kills.

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By *udistcpl1Couple
over a year ago

Wirral

"There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

Just add to the list;

Controlling nonsense on threads like this.

Not sure I get the point you're trying to make with this?"

What do I mean? If you read the thread, most of it appears to be unproven, conspiracy theory style clap trap.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "
Probasbly many and feel that our figures show higher because more genuine,this country has its faults and one is its honest openness.

If you lok at the state of the hospitals in Italy being overrun and Spain to it seems to me that they had much bigger problems than here yet less deaths,I doubt it.

The French I never trust.

We also have higher density of population that could be a factor.

All I know is that I know two people who work in the local hospital and where told they had the virus,went into quarenteen then returned to work both convinced they did not have it and test results false.One is a covid nurse.

The truth will take years to come out but lets stay safe together and get through this

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll

Like you I not happy to see such things happen and if you read my original post I say it's terrible.

I'm not saying if the figures are higher or lower than they should be.

I am simply saying what many have reported and what a serving doctor confirmed.

To me it seems odd to class someone who dies from an accident being included in the covid death toll but that's what seems to be happening.

I would have thought there would be an international standard way to do the figures but seems country's do it in lots of different ways

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By *teveuk77Man
over a year ago

An example given is you feel unwell,get tested that is positive so you self isolate. Then while at home you trip over something and fall down the stairs breaking your neck.

As you had a positive covid test it will be entered on the death certificate at 1b. This means you go on the figures even though its not what killed you.

Anyway whichever way you count the numbers are terrible

There is no way on earth that covid would appear in 1b in that scenario

According to the doctor that's exactly what is being done.

Then because there is a mention of covid on the certificate it is added to the death toll

Completely agree with this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else Probasbly many and feel that our figures show higher because more genuine,this country has its faults and one is its honest openness.

If you lok at the state of the hospitals in Italy being overrun and Spain to it seems to me that they had much bigger problems than here yet less deaths,I doubt it.

The French I never trust.

We also have higher density of population that could be a factor.

The truth will take years to come out but lets stay safe together and get through this"

Totally with you on Italy, Spain and France. Greece too I suspect. See my earlier post.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This was on radio, first not many died over winter from flu, due to it not being that bad this year, so many of the ones that dodged that bullet got hit by covid instead,

plus like people are saying, plenty of homes etc just put covid on certificate

You can't 'just put covid' on the certificate unless there's evidence to support it.

Yes this is true.

The nursing home where the mrs works had 19 deaths 13 had tested positive a thd remaining 6 had symptoms but never got tested before they died.

But the whole 19 were recorded as covid 19 deaths."

That's what people were saying on radio, the gist was mummy was very ill anyway and most likely just died but has been lumped in with others....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think like a lot of jobs, when there is a deluge, things start to get rushed, there is only so many hours in a day.........

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

in my opinion, unless there is a positive coving test and no other life threatening problems, the death can't be down to just covid 19 and should count towards the daily count, also I don't believe that the death toll is as relevant to the reduction of the virus, the daily infection rate is more important, or to put it in simple terms every positive result could result in a death

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By *itty9899Man
over a year ago

Craggy Island

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

Covid-19 was probably easier to write then kicked in head by horse and it made the woman look good.

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By *hongguyMan
over a year ago

heckmondwike

"There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

yrs id like to think on the lines of maybe 8 month max or else life aint gonna be worth living over a fecking virus that as killed less than .02 of our pop its a virus live your life cos your gonna die at some point ffs

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have said it all the time, there are alot more of that going on.

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By *utualpleasure42Man
over a year ago

enter location here

I call bullshit on that one. Prove me wrong please.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nope the doctor said there was no trace of covid end of

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?"

Its been a common problem from the start and has led to many complaints from angry relatives. I guess they had to come up with some system and have chosen to include any mention of Covid on the death cert in the figures.

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

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By *herryblossom_BJWoman
over a year ago

Oxfordshire/Hampshire

My friends aunty fell over. Went into hospital. Died there and was classed as covid

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By *moothdickMan
over a year ago

stoke

My thought process all the way through this pandemic, will they please give us the number of deaths caused by covid only ... no underline health conditions just the poor ppl who have died of the virus only ...

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it"

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"My thought process all the way through this pandemic, will they please give us the number of deaths caused by covid only ... no underline health conditions just the poor ppl who have died of the virus only ...

Having underlying health conditions won't kill you on it's own, people live with conditions for many years, they are not terminal just because you have a health condition.

Getting Covid might make things worse with certain conditions and you can die, but if you hadn't had the covid you may not have died and happily lived for a good many years more

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse"

I expect only those that come up with it could answer that for you. I am not so sadly can not help.

However as said the UK is not alone in doing it this way. It has caused many complaints from relatives but as said before the doctors confirm this is how its being done.

Totally agree with you about the underlying health conditions by the way

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse"

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

It seems a really strange thing to do if it is happening

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think like a lot of jobs, when there is a deluge, things start to get rushed, there is only so many hours in a day........."

What are you implying?

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By *he James gangCouple
over a year ago

NEWTOWNABBEY

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

Are you sure about that? How did it appear? Was it 1a Covid-19 1b Traumatic head injury? Because that would be fine.

Or are you saying that they couldn't do a post mortem because they were covid-19 positive? Because again that would be fine as you dint really need a post mortem

Just what I was thinking, brilliant!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it"

The death certification process of detailing direct causes and contributing factors is pretty much used throughout the entire world

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

Were they symptomatic?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"It seems a really strange thing to do if it is happening"

It does though I dont know if this has always been the case for other problems like a really bad flu year for example.

Some countries are really strict and will only declare those where it was the virus that killed them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

Were they symptomatic?"

Yes they had some symptoms.

But without a test it could of been flu.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is another common complaint. people dying in care homes without any covid sympton are put down on the covid toll if other residents have died of the virus.

It does seem a reasonable assumption but an assuption all the same

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It seems a really strange thing to do if it is happening

It does though I dont know if this has always been the case for other problems like a really bad flu year for example.

Some countries are really strict and will only declare those where it was the virus that killed them.

Which countries do that?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is another common complaint. people dying in care homes without any covid sympton are put down on the covid toll if other residents have died of the virus.

It does seem a reasonable assumption but an assuption all the same"

That categorically does not happen. No doctor would sign that as the cause if they were asymptomatic.

Where are these common complaints being made?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is another common complaint. people dying in care homes without any covid sympton are put down on the covid toll if other residents have died of the virus.

It does seem a reasonable assumption but an assuption all the same

That categorically does not happen. No doctor would sign that as the cause if they were asymptomatic.

Where are these common complaints being made?"

It was part of a radio program several weeks ago. I think it was radio 2.

The doctor confirmed to callers who goes on the death figures and thats what I have stated on here. The care homes situation came up breifly but again was confirmed that they have to make an assumption that they had covid if fellow residents had been positive. They are not saying it was the main cause of death but it was a reasonable assumption if the virus was present in the home the deceased would be infected. then they go on the daily figures for covid. It seems if covid is mentioned on the death cert then those people are added to the covid death toll regardless of actual cause of death.

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By *allySlinkyWoman
over a year ago

Leeds

So will the man shot dead in Hackney yesterday have his death recorded as Covid19 ?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?

The UK is not alone in this - several other do as far as I know Italy have a similar system. Others only record those that actually died of the virus as opposed to dying with it

That doesn't answer the question though. I don't know why anyone would want to inflate the number of dying, it makes things look worse

I can't answer why would they do it.

But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is another common complaint. people dying in care homes without any covid sympton are put down on the covid toll if other residents have died of the virus.

It does seem a reasonable assumption but an assuption all the same

That categorically does not happen. No doctor would sign that as the cause if they were asymptomatic.

Where are these common complaints being made?

It was part of a radio program several weeks ago. I think it was radio 2.

here is a snipet from BBC just a quick example between 2 different countries

Germany counts deaths in care homes only if people have tested positive for the virus. Belgium, on the other hand, includes any death in which a doctor suspects coronavirus was involved.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So will the man shot dead in Hackney yesterday have his death recorded as Covid19 ?"

Only if he tests positive during autopsy.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"So will the man shot dead in Hackney yesterday have his death recorded as Covid19 ?"

if the death cert mentions covid at all then yes. Why they would test him having being shot - who knows

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

"It seems a really strange thing to do if it is happening

It does though I dont know if this has always been the case for other problems like a really bad flu year for example.

Some countries are really strict and will only declare those where it was the virus that killed them.

How do you know this happens?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"It seems a really strange thing to do if it is happening

It does though I dont know if this has always been the case for other problems like a really bad flu year for example.

Some countries are really strict and will only declare those where it was the virus that killed them.

How do you know this happens?"

It was reported at the beginning of the crisis and has been confirmed by serving doctors. Like you I don't know why its done this way but that's how its being done. Not all countries follow the same reasoning. I would have thought all countries would do it in a standard way but sadly not. Further up I showed a quick example of 2 countries reporting care home deaths differently from the BBC

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By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

Do we have any links for it? I would be interested to read them ( allowed links of course )

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By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths a

re something else "

You should be ashamed of the lies you're peddling

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Do we have any links for it? I would be interested to read them ( allowed links of course )"

The item was a radio show radio 2 I think with the doctor as guest answering people's questions. The quote from a few posts above is from the BBC website. I showed it as an example of how things differ between countries

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "
Really,why?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I dont think that the number of deaths is of a consistent measure across different countries.

Surely the number of new cases is the real telling number isn't it?

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

Here's 2 things to consider when your looking at stats and gov figures.

“Facts are stubborn things, but statistics are pliable.” ~ Mark Twain

“There are three types of lies – lies, damn lies, and statistics.” ~ Benjamin Disraeli

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Here's 2 things to consider when your looking at stats and gov figures.

“Facts are stubborn things, but statistics are pliable.” ~ Mark Twain

“There are three types of lies – lies, damn lies, and statistics.” ~ Benjamin Disraeli

Maybe he can work it out why they use this system then lol

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

However you look at it, whatever might be written on any individual death certificate, there have been a shitload more deaths since March than in the similar period for any recent previous year. Of course, maybe it's all just one really bad tempered horse that is going around kicking people's heads in...

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By *dam_TinaCouple
over a year ago

Hampshire

I know an old lady who swallowed a fly.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

Recording the cause of death as covid, or 'mentioning' it where the patient has been exhibiting the relevant symptoms is perfectly permissible, especially in the circumstances you describe, where in a relatively closed environment you have a high number of deaths which are confirmed covid and others dying who have shown the symptoms.

This is quite different from an otherwise healthy individual being kicked in the head by a horse and covid being recorded as the cause of death, which the OP has stated.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is quite different from an otherwise healthy individual being kicked in the head by a horse and covid being recorded as the cause of death, which the OP has stated.

And yet if the person tests positive it goes on the death cert and on the figures. If no positive test or assumed positive like in a care home it does not

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?"
I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

Just seen on the news Brazil now refuse to publish their total death figures. They now have the second highest infection rate in the world

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine."

Bill Gates & vaccines....hmm something up there he's a computer person not a medical one....Nano chips more like.

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By *D835Man
over a year ago

London

"But they do it .

They did it with 6 residents of the nursing home my wife works at.

19 deaths 13 tested positive and 6 had symptoms but never got tested.

But those 6 were put down as covid deaths.

This is quite different from an otherwise healthy individual being kicked in the head by a horse and covid being recorded as the cause of death, which the OP has stated.

This

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Bill Gates & vaccines....hmm something up there he's a computer person not a medical one....Nano chips more like. "
Yes, he have already used it in nigeria and india.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine."

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?

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By *aul happyMan
over a year ago

tilgate crawley

sadly,,,,,, we will never know the true death figures...…. like most things goverments do are massage the figures to suit the situation ,,,,,,,

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By *eddy and legsCouple
over a year ago

the wetlands

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?"

I hate to burst your bubble but bill gates doesn't make vaccines

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By *ymguy1966Man
over a year ago

Port Talbot

Kinda what Elon is saying

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By *ymguy1966Man
over a year ago

Port Talbot

IMO and a few top USA pro's that I'm in correspondence with think that the fit and healthy have NOTHING to worry about

Personally I'm carrying on as normal.

I'm a VERY hygienic person anyway so that side is nothing new

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?

I hate to burst your bubble but bill gates doesn't make vaccines "
He have a vaccine program.

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By *on_mclaneMan
over a year ago

manchester

Watched a few of Dr Vernon Coleman YouTube videos and he’s saying that invected people with the Covids were places in care homes by the government from hospitals knowing they would kill more in the care homes, he’s just been on a radio show and stated that point again.

Not sure exactly what’s going on but there’s something not right.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So easy to come up with these bunkum theories and accuse the government of heinous crimes. We do not know how lucky we are, Just been watching Al jezeera and it looks like pakistan and india have given up trying to stop it and are just telling their people to live with it because their economies cannot stand any more form of lockdown. Living with it is to be normalised.

Tough decisions being made by poor countries which make our government look like a pinic in the park. We should be thankful for the help and support we have had to get through this. A lot of people in these poor countries would give their right arms for the support we have been given.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?

I hate to burst your bubble but bill gates doesn't make vaccines "
That's like saying Branson doesn't fly airplanes.

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?

I hate to burst your bubble but bill gates doesn't make vaccines "

He does, I get your thinking though. There's no way you'd go to a computer guy with medical issues...therefore I can only suspect there's something more sinister at work like tracking Nano chips within the vaccine.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So easy to come up with these bunkum theories and accuse the government of heinous crimes. We do not know how lucky we are, Just been watching Al jezeera and it looks like pakistan and india have given up trying to stop it and are just telling their people to live with it because their economies cannot stand any more form of lockdown. Living with it is to be normalised.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are probably a few lonely folk who've passed at home and not been discovered yet.

At the end of the day numbers never tell the true story. 1 death is 1 too many.

I wouldn't use false accounting as basis to be complacent.

This won't be the last wave and it won't be the last pandemic.

Important lessons to be learned especially preperation. Supermarkets controling shoppers and stocks.

Crowd control. Care homes and schools. Transport and the economy.

Will be interesting to see how it all pans out and what life is like in a few years. Hopefully.

www.metro.co.uk/2020/06/08/bodies-people-who-died-alone-lockdown-werent-found-two-weeks-12819196/

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Why do you think they would inflate the figures to make it look worse?I think it is political to get through bill gates vaccine.

Why would the British government collude with Bill Gates to get his vaccine through?

Why would they inflate UK death figures in order to do so when it places the government in potential jeopardy?

I hate to burst your bubble but bill gates doesn't make vaccines "

I think you've misquoted me, I didn't claim Bill Gates made vaccines!

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By *elnkazCouple
over a year ago

cheshire

Yep. Cancer

Dementia

Old age

All patients of mine on pathwayd dying anyway. Death cert said covid

Numbers def not right. Btw these people died at home. No hospital admissions were isolating and only certain fam members allowed in with ppe on .k

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You're not comparing like with like though are you. We're not a third world country, not yet anyway, we're the 5th largest economy in the world, and it's absolutely right that the government is held to account for the avoidable mistakes it's made in the handling of this crisis.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Yep. Cancer

Dementia

Old age

All patients of mine on pathwayd dying anyway. Death cert said covid

Numbers def not right. Btw these people died at home. No hospital admissions were isolating and only certain fam members allowed in with ppe on .k"

If they weren't exhibiting covid symptoms the coroner will be interested.

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

The Telegraph states today that the UK has suffered 63,500 excess deaths since Covid 19 was detected in the UK. One or two of them might be horse related accidents, but we have had a mildwinter, a great spring and less road accidents.

Unless someone can come up with a clear alternative, the UK has lost 63,500 to Covid 19!

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By *hilMan
over a year ago

HOUGHTON LE SPRING

Government now sticking the blame on scientists according to Health Minister

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

The majority, coupled with the fact that the NHS have been handing out DNR forms like confetti and they get cash for alleged C-19 fatalities.

There's a test case going through for a chap who died of non C-19 heart failure but was recorded as a C-19 death.

His family are taking it to court to have the DC changed to the actual cause of death.

My dad was taken into hospital after an injury, they didn't test because he'd had a flu jab last autumn, took his temp,normal, admitted him and asked me to sign DNR consent.

I refused. Dad's still in, still C-19 free, I get the impression they want to keep him there until he catches it.

Not going to happen.

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else

The majority, coupled with the fact that the NHS have been handing out DNR forms like confetti and they get cash for alleged C-19 fatalities.

There's a test case going through for a chap who died of non C-19 heart failure but was recorded as a C-19 death.

His family are taking it to court to have the DC changed to the actual cause of death.

My dad was taken into hospital after an injury, they didn't test because he'd had a flu jab last autumn, took his temp,normal, admitted him and asked me to sign DNR consent.

I refused. Dad's still in, still C-19 free, I get the impression they want to keep him there until he catches it.

Not going to happen."

Glad your Dad’s ok, maybe you have new explanation for 63,500 excess deaths over the normal UK death rate in a 3 month period?

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By *elnkazCouple
over a year ago

cheshire

"Yep. Cancer

Dementia

Old age

All patients of mine on pathwayd dying anyway. Death cert said covid

Numbers def not right. Btw these people died at home. No hospital admissions were isolating and only certain fam members allowed in with ppe on .k

If they weren't exhibiting covid symptoms the coroner will be interested."
they werent

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

6th largest economy. The tories keep banging on us being fifth but it’s been a while since France became 5th.

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

[Removed by poster at 09/06/20 17:01:05]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off

So are we blaming freak accidents for the 60,000 excess deaths?

Something doesn't add up with that situation. Are you talking horseshit?"

60,000 now. Gosh the figures vary from 40,000 then 50,000 now 60,000 is this like the fisherman that caught the BIG FISH lol

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By *al2001Man
over a year ago

kildare

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off

So are we blaming freak accidents for the 60,000 excess deaths?

Something doesn't add up with that situation. Are you talking horseshit?

60,000 now. Gosh the figures vary from 40,000 then 50,000 now 60,000 is this like the fisherman that caught the BIG FISH lol"

Yes 40 50 then 60 thousand deaths

It's called increasing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/06/20 17:24:19]

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"The Telegraph states today that the UK has suffered 63,500 excess deaths since Covid 19 was detected in the UK. One or two of them might be horse related accidents, but we have had a mildwinter, a great spring and less road accidents.

Unless someone can come up with a clear alternative, the UK has lost 63,500 to Covid 19!

A truly horrific figure indeed. Do we know the excess deaths for similar countries for comparison

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

I’ve heard one of the gvt ministers telling us a month ago that we have the best statistician in the world and that could explain why we are on top. These clowns would stop at nothing to make this disaster not look as dreadful as it is. As if the Germans, the Greeks or the French couldn’t add up!

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

Unless someone can come up with a clear alternative, the UK has lost 63,500 to Covid 19!

A truly horrific figure indeed. Do we know the excess deaths for similar countries for comparison"

Do we need comparisons? Isn’t one extra death too many?

63,500 extra is tantamount to ‘corporate manslaughter’

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Unless someone can come up with a clear alternative, the UK has lost 63,500 to Covid 19!

A truly horrific figure indeed. Do we know the excess deaths for similar countries for comparison

Do we need comparisons? Isn’t one extra death too many?

63,500 extra is tantamount to ‘corporate manslaughter’

Oh my god, we could all be dead by Christmas, wtf is the government doing!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

40,000 tested positive .

10,000 C19 on death certificate but not tested.

13,000 unknown; they think deaths due to lockdown ;

C19 deaths falling. Unknown deaths raising.

Could be years before all the numbers come out. But C19 falling so getting there.

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By *icplshropsCouple
over a year ago

Rock

1. ONS website, check it out for yourselves, guidance is that if someone dies and is noted to have influenza, pneumonia or COVID-19, then COVID-19 goes down as cause of death, as pneumonia can follow COVID-19 (true)...but completely ignoring the fact that pneumonia is what is responsible for most 'flu deaths' (maybe up to 60% in the Spanish 'flu pandemic) and frequently follows 'flu. I've 30+ years of working with 'flu, so argue with me if you wish...

2. My father died in March following a head injury. My mother has been under pressure to agree that he might have had COVID-19 symptoms. We have not acquiesced...but we still have no death certificate. This is a personal experience, not hearsay or speculation .

3. People are asking why would a government inflate figures? Governments do this every single day of course, fundamentally because all politicians are duplicitous charlatans with an all-consuming self-interest...but to the point about COVID-19...why? Well, how about 'control'? - I believe a lot of the 'measures' we are being subjected to are here to stay. And how about an attack on certain 'lifestyles'? Thought about that? I've posted before about the annual number of deaths in the UK (550,000 in 2018, or 1506 per day - source: ONS) - 12.8% of these were from dementia. COVID-19 will not reach that figure.

Now, this is a virus that has the potential to cause serious disease in some people, no doubt and I am am empirical scientist, but folks (and this may be my last post in the subject, tbh, as there is some much speculation and scaremongering) there is something not quite right with the figures and the whole episode has been hijacked for other agendas, IMHO.

Mr Bicpl

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

Unless someone can come up with a clear alternative, the UK has lost 63,500 to Covid 19!

A truly horrific figure indeed. Do we know the excess deaths for similar countries for comparison

Do we need comparisons? Isn’t one extra death too many?

63,500 extra is tantamount to ‘corporate manslaughter’

Indeed 1 is to many I doubt anyone would disagree.

Reason for a comparison is that's what has been spoken about on here for many weeks So to compare we need the same data from other countries.

Also you need to know the true situation of other countries in order to know which systems work and which do not

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By *wilightTeaseCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

That is 100% not correct. It is a criminal offence to do this and saves absolutely no time writing up. I don't know a single doctor that would do this. They hear these rumours all the time and it is 100% fake and the sole purpose of these rumours is to make people think covid is less risky than it is. Please refrain from spreading this further. Thanks

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By *wilightTeaseCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

Forgot to mention that TWO doctors have to fill out the death certificate independently that are not working in the same team. They can quite literally go to prison for making a false statement. It's just not a thing...

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

"I know a girl kicked in the head by a horse she died cause the injury. But on her death certificate it said covid. How many of these covid deaths are something else "

I’m not sure I have even seen a close relatives death cert, I have certainly never seen one of ‘a girl I know’.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Forgot to mention that TWO doctors have to fill out the death certificate independently that are not working in the same team. They can quite literally go to prison for making a false statement. It's just not a thing..."

A serving doctor on a radio interview confirmed if corona is mentioned on the death cert then that person is added to the figures. He also said that in care homes they put corona on the death cert if they suspect it but without a test to prove it. Again goes on the figures.

Would never say this virus is not deadly serious just what is being done according to doctors

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

If this is the case please contact your local coroner's office, they'd be very interested. It's not for a deceased's relatives to determine the cause of death or be pressurised into agreeing with a doctor's determination of death.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"She didnt make it to hospital died on way there and no1 in family had covid. Think numbers mite b well off

Source for that?"

Think we've known this for some time now !

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By *arentsgonebadCouple
over a year ago

sheffield

Just a heads up for the op and anyone else who thinks thisb -a death certificate is a legal document. No doctor or ANP is going to put a diffrent cause of death down without concrete proof.their must be clear documention within the clinical notes to suggest what has causes or what is the cause of death. If their is an coronors inquest it will be their registration under question.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

I don't doubt it at all but that's not what's being said. It has been reported and confirmed that if corona is on the death cert anywhere then that person is added to the daily death figures. It does not have to be the cause of death just having a positive test or suspected positive the the case of care homes is enough to have it added to the daily figures

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Just a heads up for the op and anyone else who thinks thisb -a death certificate is a legal document. No doctor or ANP is going to put a diffrent cause of death down without concrete proof.their must be clear documention within the clinical notes to suggest what has causes or what is the cause of death. If their is an coronors inquest it will be their registration under question. "
They was putting C19 on death certificate because they didn't have the capacity to check everyone and moving infected body's around. So no post mortem done,could not work on body if C19 about. So inquests waste of time without the body.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too"

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

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By *arkb73Man
over a year ago

Cheshire/Staffs

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

What the hell is an “excess” death?

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By *ljamMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

What the hell is an “excess” death? "

I believe it means the number of deaths in excess of the average death rate. We've had around 60,000 deaths more than we normally would have had.

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

There is no such thing as excess deaths in nature & this virus is nature, like a lion, hyena or any other predator it takes the old, sick & helpless.

You are aware that from 1920's there has been a MASSIVE boom in global human population from approx 2 billion to a whooping 8.3 billion & still growing!

The increase is largely due to industry & medical advances that are extending life beyond what it should be naturally.

That's a massive increase & more than what the world can handle & allow biodiversity at the same time....our population world wide is too big & nature is fighting back, it has to fight to save other species instead of the most destructive species on earth.

I'm sorry if anyone has lost loved ones, however death is a part of life and we all get touched by it at some point.

As mean as the above may sound, it is the truth.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

There is no such thing as excess deaths in nature & this virus is nature, like a lion, hyena or any other predator it takes the old, sick & helpless.

You are aware that from 1920's there has been a MASSIVE boom in global human population from approx 2 billion to a whooping 8.3 billion & still growing!

The increase is largely due to industry & medical advances that are extending life beyond what it should be naturally.

I'm sorry if anyone has lost loved ones, however death is a part of life and we all get touched by it at some point.

As mean as the above may sound, it is the truth. "
so why don't the world's nations adopt China's policy of one child per family ? Would it work do you think ? If so how ?

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By *eoeclipseWoman
over a year ago

glasgow

"They have had a look at deaths over the last five years at a certain time and so far there are over fifty thousand more deaths this year during the virus thats more than the goverment says

Indeed the excess deaths is probably going to be closer though not 100 percent. To compare we will need excess deaths of other countries too

Again, surely 1 excess death is too many? 64000+ is not just too many, it is also pretty evident already that other than the US and Brazil, our Govt has really fucked up, really, really fucked up...

There is no such thing as excess deaths in nature & this virus is nature, like a lion, hyena or any other predator it takes the old, sick & helpless.

You are aware that from 1920's there has been a MASSIVE boom in global human population from approx 2 billion to a whooping 8.3 billion & still growing!

The increase is largely due to industry & medical advances that are extending life way beyond what it should be naturally & life expectancy is rising every year too.

I'm sorry if anyone has lost loved ones, however death is a part of life and we all get touched by it at some point.

As mean as the above may sound, it is the truth. so why don't the world's nations adopt China's policy of one child per family ? Would it work do you think ? If so how ? "

Because stupid humans think their rights are held high above any other species.

You can have your dog, cat, horse etc neutered but not a human who has had several children taken off them already for neglect/abuse...not even a pedo can be sterilised, why human rights.

China failed on their one child policy by valuing boys over girls...now it's a nation full of men.

You can have your pet put to sleep to save them from extreme pain & suffering like incurable cancer or other disease, if you don't you can be charged with cruelty - not a human, why we think we are above other species.

We also put them to sleep for absolutely nothing, just because they don't have a human home.

We keep animals in cages for life for our viewing - we only do that to humans committing horrible crimes, other walk free.

We'll happily cull foxes, badgers, rats, squirrels, birds, bees, plants(known as s)...anything really for population control or to make it look nice for us but not our own populations - why? Humans above all else narratives.

We take animal babies away way before their mothers would turn them away & long before their mothers have taught them social skills - we expect them to learn our ways & our words and your vilified if you teach them how their mothers would, warnings then smacked/bit/kicked (horses). I obviously understand abuse extremities. We also breed them at our will.

We destroy forests, dredge the seas, rip up land to get to minerals...all destroying someone's home - yet if you do that to people it's war & against human rights to forcibly remove people from their homes never mind with big bloody machines

We quite happily perform medical tests on animals against their will for scientific advances, torturing & killing with untested vaccines & drugs, probes, psychological harm to analyse the brain etc - we don't do any of this to humans despite the medicine being for humans...intact we shut down every place like that because of the cruelty & torture other humans faced for science.

Alot of drugs are actually taken from nature such as opium=poppies=morphine, omega 3 & 6 =fish oils, blood thinners=coka plant=cocaine etc (there's loads but my minds went blank) and the synthetic versions are not great & cause side effects needing more synthetic drugs. Importance of vitamins, minerals, varied diet & moderation are way under valued by most medical professions.

We are the only species who create non-compostable/degradable waste & spread it every where...even in space where we can't live.

The best how is the problem with humans, if you leave us to decide we are likely to pick our personal family/peers and wipe out those that are spoke about in degrading ways (differs from culture to culture) largely sex based (male/female) racist, sectarianism based on status I.e rich, formally educated, job type etc.

Viruses, diseases, famine are nature's control regardless of species.

The vast majority of humans are extremely ignorant of how humans behave towards other species & how much damage we cause to the planet for greed, convenience or knowledge.

Simply We've forgotten what nature gives us & how to live in harmony with it.

I personally would leave it to nature to decide who lives & dies as that is the fairest way without human influence & ignorance towards one another.

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

1 excess death is still one too many...

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By *ssex_tomMan
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Not sure we will ever have a true total .

Some die of Covid, Some die with Covid.

Bless every one of them and their families.

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By *kstallionMan
over a year ago

milton keynes

"1 excess death is still one too many..."

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