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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-38-days-when-britain-sleepwalked-into-disaster-hq3b9tlgh

Just wondering if anybody has read the full thing? Sounds pretty damning..

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By *ering SeaMan
over a year ago

Penicuik

Fabio just posted a thread on the article

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Does not make great reading.

Needs to come out from behind the paywall.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not a subscriber but think its same as many other reviews after the events. It's all good to look back in hind sight and review what if we had done ?? At the time of the initial outbreak china wasnt giving the full picture. The UK and most of the world didnt have laws where they could ban travel or access. It's just more of the press trying to sell itself with sensationalism again..

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Not a subscriber but think its same as many other reviews after the events. It's all good to look back in hind sight and review what if we had done ?? At the time of the initial outbreak china wasnt giving the full picture. The UK and most of the world didnt have laws where they could ban travel or access. It's just more of the press trying to sell itself with sensationalism again.."

Or, let's just not learn from mistakes...

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By *uxinteriorMan
over a year ago

south west , continental


"https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-38-days-when-britain-sleepwalked-into-disaster-hq3b9tlgh

Just wondering if anybody has read the full thing? Sounds pretty damning.."

Governments can only respond with adequate information and advice from outside sources. The WHO were also confusing and slow in their release of vital information. I am of the belief that's what the WHO are there for, to advise the world on health issues. We can proportion blame to a lot of areas. Governments are the first port of call. Sure call out all governments handling of the issue. However there is a government that is getting rather less accountability attention and that's the CCP.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

no uk goverment would have got this right ... they would have followed the science and medical experts no matter what ... dont see anyone moaning about them and as for w.h.o well what a mess they were ...china is still lying ... and not sure how germany have got it right ..so far

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Meanwhile the Dailymail is concentrating on the fridge seals at the virology lab in Wuhan.

I’m sure there has to be a full enquiry after this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am a subscriber and read the article last night. It is quite damning.

I’m going to throw something out there. All governments for the past 20 years have been pretty diabolical and afraid of making decisions.

Why is that and does it coincide with rise of social media? Just a thought.

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks


"I am a subscriber and read the article last night. It is quite damning.

I’m going to throw something out there. All governments for the past 20 years have been pretty diabolical and afraid of making decisions.

Why is that and does it coincide with rise of social media? Just a thought. "

I see what you are saying.

But.

I would rather be dammed for doing than dammed for not doing.

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By *tingly ByronMan
over a year ago

In a town Fab forgot


"Not a subscriber but think its same as many other reviews after the events. It's all good to look back in hind sight and review what if we had done ?? At the time of the initial outbreak china wasnt giving the full picture. The UK and most of the world didnt have laws where they could ban travel or access. It's just more of the press trying to sell itself with sensationalism again.."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I am a subscriber and read the article last night. It is quite damning.

I’m going to throw something out there. All governments for the past 20 years have been pretty diabolical and afraid of making decisions.

Why is that and does it coincide with rise of social media? Just a thought.

I see what you are saying.

But.

I would rather be dammed for doing than dammed for not doing. "

But would we in their position? I know this is harking back to a former argument, but look at Brexit. Boris looked for which was the most popular horse before jumping on the Brexit nag. Corbyn wouldn’t say which horse he favoured as he was trying to keep both sides happy.

On this, I’m sure the government took notice of the science, but I bet more than one eye was on the Twitterati.

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

If you want to read the article Owen Jones is working himself up to a frenzy on his Twitter page with some snippets.

It’s not a good look.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"no uk goverment would have got this right ... they would have followed the science and medical experts no matter what ... dont see anyone moaning about them and as for w.h.o well what a mess they were ...china is still lying ... and not sure how germany have got it right ..so far "

The trouble is, the science we were following seemed different from the science others were following. We are not even told who is in this SAGE group. I can well believe they didn't take is seriously, Johnson is well known for being light on detail. Loves to try ape his idol with Churchillian rhetoric, but doesn't care for intricacies. Perversely, him catching the damn thing has given him a free pass I fear. There will be enquiries but they will be whitewashed and those who need not of died will be forgotten. Any time people try and scrutinize this government's shoddy response, there seems to be a 'well, they did their best' approach....The Times clearly thinks not.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Boris Johnson skipped five Cobra meetings on the virus, calls to order protective gear were ignored and scientists’ warnings fell on deaf ears. Failings in February may have cost thousands of lives

third Friday of January a silent and stealthy killer was creeping across the world. Passing from person to person and borne on ships and planes, the coronavirus was already leaving a trail of bodies.

The virus had spread from China to six countries and was almost certainly in many others. Sensing the coming danger, the British government briefly went into wartime mode that day, holding a meeting of Cobra, its national crisis committee.

But it took just an hour that January 24 lunchtime to brush aside the coronavirus threat. Matt Hancock, the health secretary, bounced out of Whitehall after chairing the meeting and breezily told reporters the risk to the UK public was “low”.

This was despite the publication that day of analarming study by Chinese doctors in the medical journal The Lancet. It assessed the lethal potential of the virus, for the first time suggesting it was comparable to the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic, which killed up to 50 million people.

Unusually, Boris Johnson had been absent from Cobra. The committee — which includes ministers, intelligence chiefs and military generals — gathers at moments of great peril such as terrorist attacks, natural disasters and other threats to the nation and is normally chaired by the prime minister.

Johnson went on to miss four further Cobra meetings on the virus. As Britain was hit by unprecedented flooding, he completed the EU withdrawal, reshuffled his cabinet and then went away to the grace-and-favour country retreat at Chevening where he spent most of the two weeks over half-term with his pregnant fiancée, Carrie Symonds.

“There’s no way you’re at war if your PM isn’t there,” the adviser said. “And what you learn about Boris was he didn’t chair any meetings. He liked his country breaks. He didn’t work weekends. It was like working for an old-fashioned chief executive in a local authority 20 years ago. There was a real sense that he didn’t do urgent crisis planning. It was exactly like people feared he would be.”

We have talked to scientists, academics, doctors, emergency planners, public officials and politicians about the root of the crisis and whether the government should have known sooner and acted more swiftly to kick-start the Whitehall machine and put the NHS onto a war footing.

They told us that, contrary to the official line, Britain was in a poor state of readiness for a pandemic. Emergency stockpiles of PPE had severely dwindled and gone out of date after becoming a low priority in the years of austerity cuts. The training to prepare key workers for a pandemic had been put on hold for two years while contingency planning was diverted to deal with a possible no-deal Brexit.

Members of the government advisory group on pandemics are said to have felt powerless. “They would joke between themselves, ‘Ha-ha, let’s hope we don’t get a pandemic’, because there wasn’t a single area of practice that was being nurtured in order for us to meet basic requirements for a pandemic, never mind do it well,” said the source.

“If you were with senior NHS managers at all during the last two years, you were aware that their biggest fear, their sweatiest nightmare, was a pandemic, because they weren’t prepared for it.”

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 19/04/20 08:20:49]

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Boris Johnson skipped five Cobra meetings on the virus, calls to order protective gear were ignored and scientists’ warnings fell on deaf ears. Failings in February may have cost thousands of lives

third Friday of January a silent and stealthy killer was creeping across the world. Passing from person to person and borne on ships and planes, the coronavirus was already leaving a trail of bodies.

The virus had spread from China to six countries and was almost certainly in many others. Sensing the coming danger, the British government briefly went into wartime mode that day, holding a meeting of Cobra, its national crisis committee.

But it took just an hour that January 24 lunchtime to brush aside the coronavirus threat. Matt Hancock, the health secretary, bounced out of Whitehall after chairing the meeting and breezily told reporters the risk to the UK public was “low”.

This was despite the publication that day of analarming study by Chinese doctors in the medical journal The Lancet. It assessed the lethal potential of the virus, for the first time suggesting it was comparable to the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic, which killed up to 50 million people.

Unusually, Boris Johnson had been absent from Cobra. The committee — which includes ministers, intelligence chiefs and military generals — gathers at moments of great peril such as terrorist attacks, natural disasters and other threats to the nation and is normally chaired by the prime minister.

Johnson went on to miss four further Cobra meetings on the virus. As Britain was hit by unprecedented flooding, he completed the EU withdrawal, reshuffled his cabinet and then went away to the grace-and-favour country retreat at Chevening where he spent most of the two weeks over half-term with his pregnant fiancée, Carrie Symonds.

“There’s no way you’re at war if your PM isn’t there,” the adviser said. “And what you learn about Boris was he didn’t chair any meetings. He liked his country breaks. He didn’t work weekends. It was like working for an old-fashioned chief executive in a local authority 20 years ago. There was a real sense that he didn’t do urgent crisis planning. It was exactly like people feared he would be.”

We have talked to scientists, academics, doctors, emergency planners, public officials and politicians about the root of the crisis and whether the government should have known sooner and acted more swiftly to kick-start the Whitehall machine and put the NHS onto a war footing.

They told us that, contrary to the official line, Britain was in a poor state of readiness for a pandemic. Emergency stockpiles of PPE had severely dwindled and gone out of date after becoming a low priority in the years of austerity cuts. The training to prepare key workers for a pandemic had been put on hold for two years while contingency planning was diverted to deal with a possible no-deal Brexit.

Members of the government advisory group on pandemics are said to have felt powerless. “They would joke between themselves, ‘Ha-ha, let’s hope we don’t get a pandemic’, because there wasn’t a single area of practice that was being nurtured in order for us to meet basic requirements for a pandemic, never mind do it well,” said the source.

“If you were with senior NHS managers at all during the last two years, you were aware that their biggest fear, their sweatiest nightmare, was a pandemic, because they weren’t prepared for it.”"

Uncomfortable reading for No.10 this morning...

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks


"Boris Johnson skipped five Cobra meetings on the virus, calls to order protective gear were ignored and scientists’ warnings fell on deaf ears. Failings in February may have cost thousands of lives

third Friday of January a silent and stealthy killer was creeping across the world. Passing from person to person and borne on ships and planes, the coronavirus was already leaving a trail of bodies.

The virus had spread from China to six countries and was almost certainly in many others. Sensing the coming danger, the British government briefly went into wartime mode that day, holding a meeting of Cobra, its national crisis committee.

But it took just an hour that January 24 lunchtime to brush aside the coronavirus threat. Matt Hancock, the health secretary, bounced out of Whitehall after chairing the meeting and breezily told reporters the risk to the UK public was “low”.

This was despite the publication that day of analarming study by Chinese doctors in the medical journal The Lancet. It assessed the lethal potential of the virus, for the first time suggesting it was comparable to the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic, which killed up to 50 million people.

Unusually, Boris Johnson had been absent from Cobra. The committee — which includes ministers, intelligence chiefs and military generals — gathers at moments of great peril such as terrorist attacks, natural disasters and other threats to the nation and is normally chaired by the prime minister.

Johnson went on to miss four further Cobra meetings on the virus. As Britain was hit by unprecedented flooding, he completed the EU withdrawal, reshuffled his cabinet and then went away to the grace-and-favour country retreat at Chevening where he spent most of the two weeks over half-term with his pregnant fiancée, Carrie Symonds.

“There’s no way you’re at war if your PM isn’t there,” the adviser said. “And what you learn about Boris was he didn’t chair any meetings. He liked his country breaks. He didn’t work weekends. It was like working for an old-fashioned chief executive in a local authority 20 years ago. There was a real sense that he didn’t do urgent crisis planning. It was exactly like people feared he would be.”

We have talked to scientists, academics, doctors, emergency planners, public officials and politicians about the root of the crisis and whether the government should have known sooner and acted more swiftly to kick-start the Whitehall machine and put the NHS onto a war footing.

They told us that, contrary to the official line, Britain was in a poor state of readiness for a pandemic. Emergency stockpiles of PPE had severely dwindled and gone out of date after becoming a low priority in the years of austerity cuts. The training to prepare key workers for a pandemic had been put on hold for two years while contingency planning was diverted to deal with a possible no-deal Brexit.

Members of the government advisory group on pandemics are said to have felt powerless. “They would joke between themselves, ‘Ha-ha, let’s hope we don’t get a pandemic’, because there wasn’t a single area of practice that was being nurtured in order for us to meet basic requirements for a pandemic, never mind do it well,” said the source.

“If you were with senior NHS managers at all during the last two years, you were aware that their biggest fear, their sweatiest nightmare, was a pandemic, because they weren’t prepared for it.”

Uncomfortable reading for No.10 this morning..."

Be absolute scenes in Chequers.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Boris Johnson skipped five Cobra meetings on the virus, calls to order protective gear were ignored and scientists’ warnings fell on deaf ears. Failings in February may have cost thousands of lives

third Friday of January a silent and stealthy killer was creeping across the world. Passing from person to person and borne on ships and planes, the coronavirus was already leaving a trail of bodies.

The virus had spread from China to six countries and was almost certainly in many others. Sensing the coming danger, the British government briefly went into wartime mode that day, holding a meeting of Cobra, its national crisis committee.

But it took just an hour that January 24 lunchtime to brush aside the coronavirus threat. Matt Hancock, the health secretary, bounced out of Whitehall after chairing the meeting and breezily told reporters the risk to the UK public was “low”.

This was despite the publication that day of analarming study by Chinese doctors in the medical journal The Lancet. It assessed the lethal potential of the virus, for the first time suggesting it was comparable to the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic, which killed up to 50 million people.

Unusually, Boris Johnson had been absent from Cobra. The committee — which includes ministers, intelligence chiefs and military generals — gathers at moments of great peril such as terrorist attacks, natural disasters and other threats to the nation and is normally chaired by the prime minister.

Johnson went on to miss four further Cobra meetings on the virus. As Britain was hit by unprecedented flooding, he completed the EU withdrawal, reshuffled his cabinet and then went away to the grace-and-favour country retreat at Chevening where he spent most of the two weeks over half-term with his pregnant fiancée, Carrie Symonds.

“There’s no way you’re at war if your PM isn’t there,” the adviser said. “And what you learn about Boris was he didn’t chair any meetings. He liked his country breaks. He didn’t work weekends. It was like working for an old-fashioned chief executive in a local authority 20 years ago. There was a real sense that he didn’t do urgent crisis planning. It was exactly like people feared he would be.”

We have talked to scientists, academics, doctors, emergency planners, public officials and politicians about the root of the crisis and whether the government should have known sooner and acted more swiftly to kick-start the Whitehall machine and put the NHS onto a war footing.

They told us that, contrary to the official line, Britain was in a poor state of readiness for a pandemic. Emergency stockpiles of PPE had severely dwindled and gone out of date after becoming a low priority in the years of austerity cuts. The training to prepare key workers for a pandemic had been put on hold for two years while contingency planning was diverted to deal with a possible no-deal Brexit.

Members of the government advisory group on pandemics are said to have felt powerless. “They would joke between themselves, ‘Ha-ha, let’s hope we don’t get a pandemic’, because there wasn’t a single area of practice that was being nurtured in order for us to meet basic requirements for a pandemic, never mind do it well,” said the source.

“If you were with senior NHS managers at all during the last two years, you were aware that their biggest fear, their sweatiest nightmare, was a pandemic, because they weren’t prepared for it.”

Uncomfortable reading for No.10 this morning...

Be absolute scenes in Chequers. "

Malcolm Tucker.....swearfest!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"no uk goverment would have got this right ... they would have followed the science and medical experts no matter what ... dont see anyone moaning about them and as for w.h.o well what a mess they were ...china is still lying ... and not sure how germany have got it right ..so far "

Because Germany are a manufacturing economy and not reliant on China for PPE, testing materials, ventilators etc. Look to the past for the root of many problems.

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