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"There seems to be a misnomer among some of the women on here that, by expressing an interest in pick up, I must be looking to cynically trick lots of women into bed. For a start it's odd that that's a problem on a site seemingly devoted to letting guys do precisely that. But moreso it's just flat wrong. I'm interested in pick up for two big reasons 1) Learning about how to approach strangers, use effective body language, read their signs, maintain good eye contact, etc are all invaluable tools in life, whether it be networking for business or just making friends. A person can significantly improve on the quality of their life and on their chances of all kinds of success by improving these skills 2) I'm looking to date and hopefully fall in love with and maybe even marry a woman I'm deeply attracted to. I fully sympathise that for most women reading this they won't get what the problem is... just go up to that super attractive woman, be yourself, and just ask her out... But from the man's point of view, for whatever reason, that whole thing is easier said than done. So much so that apparently the average US male only asks out about 4 women in his whole life. Since I brought up the whole pickup thing it seems some shit has stuck to me. People seem to have got it in their heads that I'm some kind of awful serial dater. I'm hoping this washes some of the misnomers off. On a final note I'm also increasingly interested in attracting women offline rather than online. It cuts so many corners when I see a woman I'm attracted to and can already sense chemistry with. It seems obvious to me that if I improve my offline skills and retreat a bit from relying on easy online connections it's likely to massively improve my odds Just sayin "I seem to remember one of your first forum posts said that you want to " pretend to be in love" Just sayin' | |||
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"I seem to remember one of your first forum posts said that you want to " pretend to be in love" Just sayin'" Well at least I made a memorable entrance haha. Jeez that was like my first post when I was still trying to get my head round what I'm on here for. Do women literally never forget?  | |||
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"I seem to remember one of your first forum posts said that you want to " pretend to be in love" Just sayin' Well at least I made a memorable entrance haha. Jeez that was like my first post when I was still trying to get my head round what I'm on here for. Do women literally never forget? "I have a VERY good memory. Not much escapes me Apart from the ability to understand why people post stuff on the internet, and seemingly forget that other humans read it It is a constant mystery Ho hum | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’?" A vehicle with an open flat bed back | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’?" Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’? Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women "Totally understand. Putting myself in the firing line of men looking to pick-up women (or men on the pull) was my hobby between the age of 18 and 29. I learnt to be an expert at it! 
Mrs | |||
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" Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. " Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across? | |||
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" Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across?" Do you know, I think he is | |||
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"For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. " But it's actually not in this reality. Op, I'm certain there are some positive transferable skills from the pick up 'industry' (is that the right term? I don't know sorry) that you've taken and adapted them to not be creepy/overbearing etc. It's just a bit too simplistic and daft to ignore the many facets of the pua community and what it 'teaches' its members (I think that's the right term) and choose the nicer sounding one. The other less pleasant sides are the reason why some may think  about you being such a keen advocate for it. | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’? Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women "I don't want to attract a man who thinks I'm game because I'm showing my cleavage and I have never walked into a room and picked a man out of all that are in there. I don't know which reality you live in, but it's a million miles from mine. | |||
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"Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across?" Err  As a guy who's aware of the reality that women go out men hunting? As a guy who's sensitive to hypocrisy and double standards? What makes me think you're judgement of me is neither likely to be as positive nor as grounded in evidence  | |||
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"Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across? Err As a guy who's aware of the reality that women go out men hunting? As a guy who's sensitive to hypocrisy and double standards? What makes me think you're judgement of me is neither likely to be as positive nor as grounded in evidence "Some women...that one word makes a huge difference. Maybe you should surround yourself with people who are more grounded and over all of the game playing tactics you seem to hone in on. It might alter your rather skewed perceptions | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’? Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women "by the look of the length of your posts you spend your life here | |||
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"by the look of the length of your posts you spend your life here "I come and go. At the moment I'm coming but I'll soon go and you can all comment on someone else's weird ramblings | |||
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"Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across? Err As a guy who's aware of the reality that women go out men hunting? As a guy who's sensitive to hypocrisy and double standards? What makes me think you're judgement of me is neither likely to be as positive nor as grounded in evidence
Some women...that one word makes a huge difference.
Maybe you should surround yourself with people who are more grounded and over all of the game playing tactics you seem to hone in on.
It might alter your rather skewed perceptions "I didn't write all women. The absence of that one word has the same effect. I'm not interested in game playing tactics. That's not what pickup is for me. The purpose of this thread was to try and clarify that. Read the op | |||
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"I don't want to attract a man who thinks I'm game because I'm showing my cleavage and I have never walked into a room and picked a man out of all that are in there. I don't know which reality you live in, but it's a million miles from mine. " My point was that if you wanted to pick up a guy that's all you'd have to do. You've got to admit that right? Whereas for men to pickup is more complicated and involves learning about body language, eye contact etc. The point was merely that both genders do pick up (you can't deny that surely) but male pick up has a bad rep as being about tricking women into bed when it isn't about that anymore. It also has a bad rep, and rightly so, as being about serial dating and just bedding tonnes of women. Which as we know is a sin against Jehovah so we definitely shouldn't do that should we But regardless of the hypocrisy of frowning on this on an nsa sex swinging site, the whole purpose of this thread was to clarify that I'm not into pick up for that reason.
I guess this shit ain't going to wash off by throwing more shit at it Oh well... as you were | |||
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"The purpose of the thread sounds to me like you are trying to learn to be something that you aren't already. That to me is game playing." Game playing can be fun though | |||
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"The question is if you are making an effort to control your body language to be confident, are you confident, or faking it ? If you present yourself as the (and I hate this term but know it’s used in the community) alpha, yet aren’t ... are tricking people ?" For me if someone gets me into bed by acting in a way that I consider sexy, it really doesn’t matter to me if they are a boring fart when they are at work. All that matters to me is that they give me a good time. And I’m not ashamed to admit that I will play the same games to make men think I’m worth bedding. I can assure everyone that no one wants to fuck me when I’m at work, or at the school gate. | |||
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"Are there any aspects of pickup you find distasteful Soulful or do you think it's a good ethos to live by?" Oh I find almost all of it distasteful. I started this thread because I think some on here have mentally connected me as being a pick up artist and misogynistic serial dater. My assumption is that this view has come from my posts expressing interest in some of the things discussed in pick up videos. I was merely trying to explain that, for me, the aspects of it that interest me are about use of body language, mental states, self acceptance, and setting yourself up to succeed in life... and that I'm looking to apply these things broadly in my life and in seeking out my soul mate. I've long had a fascination for books like "How to win friends and influence people". They are fascinating reads and can really help improve your people skills. As someone who is an entrepreneur, I find alot of that stuff quite useful and surprisingly zen. Thanks for asking me the question... perhaps you were trying to help me dig myself out of this hole haha | |||
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"The purpose of the thread sounds to me like you are trying to learn to be something that you aren't already. That to me is game playing." I'm trying to grow and improve. Is that game playing? | |||
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"The purpose of the thread sounds to me like you are trying to learn to be something that you aren't already. That to me is game playing. I'm trying to grow and improve. Is that game playing? " It seems to be mostly in relation to wooing a woman. So yes...it is ...in my opinion | |||
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"I can only speak for myself when I say that if all it took for me to pick up ( i fucking hate that term) a guy was a flash of cleavage and a flutter of eyelashes, then that guy wouldn't be the guy for me. Even on a site like this. I'm pretty sure there are many more women who think along similar lines" I think I'm general the mating "game" that goes on in the bars each weekend (not my thing btw) involves men doing a courtship dance and women choosing which they're willing to try out. It's a push pull relationship where the power of the woman, as on here, is mainly in selection. Men get chastised for learning how to better do the dance. But if the boot was on the other foot women would want to learn what to do to attract the most attractive men too. That was the point I was trying to make | |||
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" Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. Are you really completely unaware of how this makes you come across? Do you know, I think he is" Bugger clothes, I just wear a thong and parade around town, waiting to be picked up by some neananderal man & thrown over his shoulder. I have to do this cause I’m online, hence unattractive. 
OP by all means, follow your own observation and pop on those revealing clothes and join me - we can do ‘pick-up’ together | |||
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"The purpose of the thread sounds to me like you are trying to learn to be something that you aren't already. That to me is game playing. I'm trying to grow and improve. Is that game playing? It seems to be mostly in relation to wooing a woman. So yes...it is ...in my opinion" Did you not read the op? I think improving body language skills and mentality in social situations can have a broad and positive aspect on all aspects of your life, from business networking to making friends... and that's my primary interest in this, not wooing a woman. I've been in a 20 Yr relationship. So I'm pretty confident I've got a well grounded understanding of what that involves and that's quite different. | |||
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"I can only speak for myself when I say that if all it took for me to pick up ( i fucking hate that term) a guy was a flash of cleavage and a flutter of eyelashes, then that guy wouldn't be the guy for me. Even on a site like this. I'm pretty sure there are many more women who think along similar lines I think I'm general the mating "game" that goes on in the bars each weekend (not my thing btw) involves men doing a courtship dance and women choosing which they're willing to try out. It's a push pull relationship where the power of the woman, as on here, is mainly in selection. Men get chastised for learning how to better do the dance. But if the boot was on the other foot women would want to learn what to do to attract the most attractive men too. That was the point I was trying to make " OP I’m sure blokes choose women too and are not just fodder. I think it’s insulting to men to say they get chosen, as if they aren’t discerning either. I’ve seen many men put their A-game on in bars to get the lady of their choice. | |||
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"I can only speak for myself when I say that if all it took for me to pick up ( i fucking hate that term) a guy was a flash of cleavage and a flutter of eyelashes, then that guy wouldn't be the guy for me. Even on a site like this. I'm pretty sure there are many more women who think along similar lines I think I'm general the mating "game" that goes on in the bars each weekend (not my thing btw) involves men doing a courtship dance and women choosing which they're willing to try out. It's a push pull relationship where the power of the woman, as on here, is mainly in selection. Men get chastised for learning how to better do the dance. But if the boot was on the other foot women would want to learn what to do to attract the most attractive men too. That was the point I was trying to make " Like I said before...surround yourself with more grounded people. And for the sake of balance...women get 'chastised' if they end up with the guy who only needs a flash of cleavage to be attracted, and then realise he's not all that | |||
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"The purpose of the thread sounds to me like you are trying to learn to be something that you aren't already. That to me is game playing. I'm trying to grow and improve. Is that game playing? It seems to be mostly in relation to wooing a woman. So yes...it is ...in my opinion Did you not read the op? I think improving body language skills and mentality in social situations can have a broad and positive aspect on all aspects of your life, from business networking to making friends... and that's my primary interest in this, not wooing a woman. I've been in a 20 Yr relationship. So I'm pretty confident I've got a well grounded understanding of what that involves and that's quite different. " You should have made your primary interest a little more prominent then | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’..." That's because so much of it is frighteningly close to abuse like the following quote "Simply keep kinoing her but in more sexual places, like her stomach, legs face and waist. Don’t assume she doesn’t like being touched, just keep touching until she pulls away or says something." The op has rejected the more distasteful aspects of pickup. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... That's because so much of it is frighteningly close to abuse like the following quote "Simply keep kinoing her but in more sexual places, like her stomach, legs face and waist. Don’t assume she doesn’t like being touched, just keep touching until she pulls away or says something." The op has rejected the more distasteful aspects of pickup." I think calling it “pickup” makes me feel uneasy, too. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... That's because so much of it is frighteningly close to abuse like the following quote "Simply keep kinoing her but in more sexual places, like her stomach, legs face and waist. Don’t assume she doesn’t like being touched, just keep touching until she pulls away or says something." The op has rejected the more distasteful aspects of pickup. I think calling it “pickup” makes me feel uneasy, too. " Me too. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’..." The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous " Ah come on...you don't get to claim what other folks views are so specifically without them at least using those words | |||
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"I suspect where some people struggle is that if you’re looking for self improvement etc there are other places to go for this." This is why I bring pickup up. It's actually a surprising source of insight and self growth. I do yoga, meditation, etc. And have an interest in spiritual growth. But at the moment pickup is giving me significant steps forward that I think will help my spiritual growth even more. If that sentiment seems weird to you you're not alone... I'm just as surprised | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous " It's distasteful to the "nsa brigade" because generally we approach our interactions with our casual partners with a degree of honesty. I don't think anybody thinks of you as a misogynistic game player. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous Ah come on...you don't get to claim what other folks views are so specifically without them at least using those words" It's my thread I can do what I want. Nah nah n nah nah | |||
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"I can only speak for myself when I say that if all it took for me to pick up ( i fucking hate that term) a guy was a flash of cleavage and a flutter of eyelashes, then that guy wouldn't be the guy for me. Even on a site like this. I'm pretty sure there are many more women who think along similar lines"  | |||
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"I suspect where some people struggle is that if you’re looking for self improvement etc there are other places to go for this. This is why I bring pickup up. It's actually a surprising source of insight and self growth. I do yoga, meditation, etc. And have an interest in spiritual growth. But at the moment pickup is giving me significant steps forward that I think will help my spiritual growth even more. If that sentiment seems weird to you you're not alone... I'm just as surprised " I’m not ashamed to say I’ve read this stuff. Despite having my shit together everywhere else I had body issues when I was younger. Good for you if you’ve found the few threads which do support a healthier lifestyle. But most of it is pseudo psychology and tricks coupled with gross simplifications. Which is why I think people struggle with what you’re saying. | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’? Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women ""In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going on line." ....I am trying to work out whether that was a sly little insult or just a misstep. The former seems more likely given other posts. Imo obviously. | |||
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"It's distasteful to the "nsa brigade" because generally we approach our interactions with our casual partners with a degree of honesty. I don't think anybody thinks of you as a misogynistic game player." I think the women go to the bars to get laid and the guys go to pull them. It's not my thing but that's what happens in every town bar on every weekend. It's pretty friggin honest. It's both sexes putting out and pulling for fun. We, on here may not be into it, but it's pretty bloomin clear most people in their 20s are. So why the allergy in here to what's the normal approach to nsa out there? I'm not advocating it as I'm not even into nsa on here. I just don't get the double standards. As for other people's opinions. Not that it particularly matters to me but I got accused of being a serial dater by someone on here (which I had to Google but it didn't end up being particularly favourable) and it seems a few people think I'm into playing games and faking being someone else. I was worried these opinions were getting contagious. Thanks for making me feel they aren't | |||
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""In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going on line." ....I am trying to work out whether that was a sly little insult or just a misstep. The former seems more likely given other posts. Imo obviously. "You'll have to forgive me but it's my assumption that very attractive women are usually batting off men all the time and so have little (or no) need of online dating or sex sites like this. They just pick whoever they like who's throwing themselves at them in real life. It wasn't meant to be anything more than that. I wasn't saying the opposite... that only ugly women go online. I was merely saying attractive women *probably* don't need to. As a man who hasn't got a clue on this, I'm quite happy to concede that this may be a complete misconception. Apologies if it sounded like a slur | |||
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"What’s ‘pick up’? Pick up is the "art" of picking up women. Women don't need such an art to pick up men. They just don some revealing clothing and head out to a nearby bar and pick one. So women pick up men all the time. In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going online. For some reason, however, when men want to do this and learn how to it's like they've broken an unwritten rule and taken an unfair shortcut or something. In reality pickup is just the art of body language. Women are masters of body language. Guys can be completely blind to it, both picking up the woman's signs and realising what signs they're giving off. I think a mastery of body language skills can produce big and important changes in your whole life, helping you to live a happier life making more friends. It's not limited to picking up women
"In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going on line." ....I am trying to work out whether that was a sly little insult or just a misstep. The former seems more likely given other posts. Imo obviously. "maybe it’s a neg | |||
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"I suspect where some people struggle is that if you’re looking for self improvement etc there are other places to go for this. This is why I bring pickup up. It's actually a surprising source of insight and self growth. I do yoga, meditation, etc. And have an interest in spiritual growth. But at the moment pickup is giving me significant steps forward that I think will help my spiritual growth even more. If that sentiment seems weird to you you're not alone... I'm just as surprised I’m not ashamed to say I’ve read this stuff. Despite having my shit together everywhere else I had body issues when I was younger. Good for you if you’ve found the few threads which do support a healthier lifestyle. But most of it is pseudo psychology and tricks coupled with gross simplifications. Which is why I think people struggle with what you’re saying." Ahh yes that could be it. I'm pretty good at separating wheat from chaff in the world of ideas (it's kinda my job). I can see how without giving examples people wouldn't know that I'm doing a huge amount of selective learning when it comes to what I'm picking up from this stuff. I haven't read any of the books. I just idldy watch the odd YouTube video. The other day, for example, I got a great insight into eye contact which I'm now trying out with considerable success. But the insight I got wasn't actually in the video at all. It was in me reflecting on it afterwards. So the insight is actually my own to a degree, albeit stimulated by a cheesy YouTube pickup video | |||
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"It's distasteful to the "nsa brigade" because generally we approach our interactions with our casual partners with a degree of honesty. I don't think anybody thinks of you as a misogynistic game player. I think the women go to the bars to get laid and the guys go to pull them. It's not my thing but that's what happens in every town bar on every weekend. It's pretty friggin honest. It's both sexes putting out and pulling for fun. We, on here may not be into it, but it's pretty bloomin clear most people in their 20s are. So why the allergy in here to what's the normal approach to nsa out there? I'm not advocating it as I'm not even into nsa on here. I just don't get the double standards. As for other people's opinions. Not that it particularly matters to me but I got accused of being a serial dater by someone on here (which I had to Google but it didn't end up being particularly favourable) and it seems a few people think I'm into playing games and faking being someone else. I was worried these opinions were getting contagious. Thanks for making me feel they aren't "Pickup isn't normal. People are inclined to discuss your opinions with you quite forcefully because you have a habit of describing anything that you say you don't understand in faintly derogatory terms. "Nsa sex brigade" for instance. | |||
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"I don't want to attract a man who thinks I'm game because I'm showing my cleavage and I have never walked into a room and picked a man out of all that are in there. I don't know which reality you live in, but it's a million miles from mine. My point was that if you wanted to pick up a guy that's all you'd have to do. You've got to admit that right? Whereas for men to pickup is more complicated and involves learning about body language, eye contact etc. The point was merely that both genders do pick up (you can't deny that surely) but male pick up has a bad rep as being about tricking women into bed when it isn't about that anymore. It also has a bad rep, and rightly so, as being about serial dating and just bedding tonnes of women. Which as we know is a sin against Jehovah so we definitely shouldn't do that should we But regardless of the hypocrisy of frowning on this on an nsa sex swinging site, the whole purpose of this thread was to clarify that I'm not into pick up for that reason.
I guess this shit ain't going to wash off by throwing more shit at it Oh well... as you were "Do you honestly think it's that easy? Men aren't the dumb, hormone -driven animals you think they are. Well, you may be, but where I go out they aren't. | |||
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"Op...is it really such a difficult concept for you to understand that some women (and I'm pretty sure some men) go to bars to have a drink, some chat and some fun with friends? Not to see who they can pull or who throws themselves at who. Even the single ones." Of course. Did I ever make a sweeping universal claim that all women go out to bars to pull on the weekends? If so I was wrong | |||
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""In fact it's probably the norm for most attractive women, rather than going on line." ....I am trying to work out whether that was a sly little insult or just a misstep. The former seems more likely given other posts. Imo obviously.
You'll have to forgive me but it's my assumption that very attractive women are usually batting off men all the time and so have little (or no) need of online dating or sex sites like this. They just pick whoever they like who's throwing themselves at them in real life. It wasn't meant to be anything more than that. I wasn't saying the opposite... that only ugly women go online. I was merely saying attractive women *probably* don't need to. As a man who hasn't got a clue on this, I'm quite happy to concede that this may be a complete misconception. Apologies if it sounded like a slur "Let's say, for argument's sake that I did have men throwing themselves at me when I go out. Did it not occur to you that I might not be attracted to any of them? | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous " So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. | |||
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"Similarly, I got a great insight into this stuff from the thread I started on Fab on body shape (it turned out to be about body language). And, again, that comes from me reacting to other's ideas with my own. So much spiritual growth is about developing inner happiness. Whilst this is definitely vital it's a bit mad if you pair that up with being an anti social git who can't make or keep any friends. Sometimes things like inner happiness come from outer things that naturally put us in a happier place... like making friends and living a friendly way in a friendly world "Maybe it’s inner peace you need to look for. Happiness is relevant on how you perceive conditions (as positive); inner peace doesn’t need conditions. | |||
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"It's distasteful to the "nsa brigade" because generally we approach our interactions with our casual partners with a degree of honesty. I don't think anybody thinks of you as a misogynistic game player. I think the women go to the bars to get laid and the guys go to pull them. It's not my thing but that's what happens in every town bar on every weekend. It's pretty friggin honest. It's both sexes putting out and pulling for fun. We, on here may not be into it, but it's pretty bloomin clear most people in their 20s are. So why the allergy in here to what's the normal approach to nsa out there? I'm not advocating it as I'm not even into nsa on here. I just don't get the double standards. As for other people's opinions. Not that it particularly matters to me but I got accused of being a serial dater by someone on here (which I had to Google but it didn't end up being particularly favourable) and it seems a few people think I'm into playing games and faking being someone else. I was worried these opinions were getting contagious. Thanks for making me feel they aren't "Lots of sweeping statements again. There will always be people going out looking to pull, equally many aren’t. I know 20 year olds and most are married with kids. The majority of people I know go to bars to meet friends, watch live gigs, eat food, have a dance etc... | |||
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"Op...is it really such a difficult concept for you to understand that some women (and I'm pretty sure some men) go to bars to have a drink, some chat and some fun with friends? Not to see who they can pull or who throws themselves at who. Even the single ones. Of course. Did I ever make a sweeping universal claim that all women go out to bars to pull on the weekends? If so I was wrong " There’s plenty that do , and every Friday night at the busiest pubs and clubs local to us we see it . So much so , that we do it too and have an absolute blast ! Face to face interaction with real people , you just can’t beat it | |||
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Mrs | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. " I don’t find the concept of being ‘picked up’ distasteful. It’s something I used to enjoy happening to me when I was young and single, and given the circumstances I would do it again. Or to turn it around, I might have gone looking to pick up men. Whereas I respect that people have different ways they like to play, I don’t understand why this is so wrong. It was fun and nobody got hurt. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. I don’t find the concept of being ‘picked up’ distasteful. It’s something I used to enjoy happening to me when I was young and single, and given the circumstances I would do it again. Or to turn it around, I might have gone looking to pick up men. Whereas I respect that people have different ways they like to play, I don’t understand why this is so wrong. It was fun and nobody got hurt. " It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices. | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. I don’t find the concept of being ‘picked up’ distasteful. It’s something I used to enjoy happening to me when I was young and single, and given the circumstances I would do it again. Or to turn it around, I might have gone looking to pick up men. Whereas I respect that people have different ways they like to play, I don’t understand why this is so wrong. It was fun and nobody got hurt. It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices." I hate the concept that predatory males use tricks to ‘lure’ a woman. Players of that game are best avoided in my opinion | |||
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"I don't want to attract a man who thinks I'm game because I'm showing my cleavage and I have never walked into a room and picked a man out of all that are in there. I don't know which reality you live in, but it's a million miles from mine. My point was that if you wanted to pick up a guy that's all you'd have to do. You've got to admit that right? Whereas for men to pickup is more complicated and involves learning about body language, eye contact etc. The point was merely that both genders do pick up (you can't deny that surely) but male pick up has a bad rep as being about tricking women into bed when it isn't about that anymore. It also has a bad rep, and rightly so, as being about serial dating and just bedding tonnes of women. Which as we know is a sin against Jehovah so we definitely shouldn't do that should we But regardless of the hypocrisy of frowning on this on an nsa sex swinging site, the whole purpose of this thread was to clarify that I'm not into pick up for that reason.
I guess this shit ain't going to wash off by throwing more shit at it Oh well... as you were "Actually it's bad rep is about harassment and sexual assault but you crack on with your apparent indoctrination...you really do swallow stuff and then regurgitate it undigested don't you? | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. I don’t find the concept of being ‘picked up’ distasteful. It’s something I used to enjoy happening to me when I was young and single, and given the circumstances I would do it again. Or to turn it around, I might have gone looking to pick up men. Whereas I respect that people have different ways they like to play, I don’t understand why this is so wrong. It was fun and nobody got hurt. It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices." Ok fair enough. I’ve never heard of it. When I asked him earlier in the thread what ‘pick-up’ was he explained something along the lines of perfecting the art of picking up women, or my by language ‘going out on the pull’. I thought that’s what he was talking about. Mrs | |||
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"Oh I thought this thread was going to be about a Toyota Hi-Lux or a Ford Ranger." Now someone's talking my language phwoar | |||
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"This is a strange thread. I almost feel a little uneasy by it, but maybe that’s because you hear so much bad stuff that comes with the whole PUA ‘scene’... The whole ethos of the scene (to sleep your way through or serially date women) is distasteful to me (although I don't see why it's distasteful to the nsa sex brigade). But the actual issues discussed in the videos (people's psychology, body language, dispelling negative mindsets and social phobias) are fascinating and can be applied broadly to most life scenarios. They involve approaching and making friends with strangers. The purpose of the op was to try and clarify that that's what interests me about it and try and dissuade some people from the view they seem to be forming of me as a misogynistic game playing faking it serial dater... which is just so not me it's ridiculous So why reference the pick up part so much? It almost sounds predatory. It’s going to be distasteful to everyone, even the NSA brigade because of what the term stands for. I don’t find the concept of being ‘picked up’ distasteful. It’s something I used to enjoy happening to me when I was young and single, and given the circumstances I would do it again. Or to turn it around, I might have gone looking to pick up men. Whereas I respect that people have different ways they like to play, I don’t understand why this is so wrong. It was fun and nobody got hurt. It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices. Ok fair enough. I’ve never heard of it. When I asked him earlier in the thread what ‘pick-up’ was he explained something along the lines of perfecting the art of picking up women, or my by language ‘going out on the pull’. I thought that’s what he was talking about. Mrs " Me too | |||
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"Op..wasnt you boasting about having ten dates from dating site? If thats not seriel dating i dont no what is" What's with all these women who remember what people said on previous threads
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"Op..wasnt you boasting about having ten dates from dating site? If thats not seriel dating i dont no what is What's with all these women who remember what people said on previous threads
"Oh, we remember | |||
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"Op..wasnt you boasting about having ten dates from dating site? If thats not seriel dating i dont no what is What's with all these women who remember what people said on previous threads
Oh, we remember "Indeed we do | |||
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"Op..wasnt you boasting about having ten dates from dating site? If thats not seriel dating i dont no what is What's with all these women who remember what people said on previous threads
"You’d be surprised what people remember . I started a thread years ago about graveyard dogging and still people recall that one  | |||
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"With all this remembering going on - you would hope there just might be some space for us to reflect on the error of our ways -time to perhaps learn from our mistakes and hopefully move on -or is this strictly a "cast out to the wilderness forevermore" kind of forum "Some people DO reflect And learn from past mistakes Thats why we can spot bullshit when we read it | |||
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" Thats why we can spot bullshit when we read it" I find that is often the problem when writing ones thoughts out -especially in short message spurts like forums -a lot of the nuance of what you are saying can be lost when you cant read the face behind a statement. There's a lot to be said for a wink, a nod ora facial expression. | |||
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" Thats why we can spot bullshit when we read it I find that is often the problem when writing ones thoughts out -especially in short message spurts like forums -a lot of the nuance of what you are saying can be lost when you cant read the face behind a statement. There's a lot to be said for a wink, a nod ora facial expression." Lack of intonation causes wars | |||
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"Lack of intonation causes wars" Sounds like a good title for a chapter -maybe even a book | |||
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" Thats why we can spot bullshit when we read it I find that is often the problem when writing ones thoughts out -especially in short message spurts like forums -a lot of the nuance of what you are saying can be lost when you cant read the face behind a statement. There's a lot to be said for a wink, a nod ora facial expression. Lack of intonation causes wars" Especially when people put their own feelings into a post. | |||
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"With all this remembering going on - you would hope there just might be some space for us to reflect on the error of our ways -time to perhaps learn from our mistakes and hopefully move on -or is this strictly a "cast out to the wilderness forevermore" kind of forum
Some people DO reflect
And learn from past mistakes
Thats why we can spot bullshit when we read it"Get this | |||
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"Op..wasnt you boasting about having ten dates from dating site? If thats not seriel dating i dont no what is" Serial dating is a term that's applied to guys who cynically go on dates with absolutely no intention of getting into a relationship with anyone but just taking them to bed. I am not a serial dater... I'm just a good looking sensitive and interesting guy who lots of women want to date (no "blow my own trumpet" emoji so these will have to do ) | |||
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"Until you are happy with yourself you aren’t gonna find a relationship Stop self anaylising stop over thinking. Get off internet sites get out and say hello "Funnily enough that's exactly the advice in these pick up videos I couldn't agree more | |||
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But if it works for you then crack on ....
Hugs x | |||
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"It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices." This is incorrect in several ways. Firstly I'd guess almost all the lads going out on a Saturday night have consumed pickup advice and are practicing it. So pickup is most assuredly "going out to pull". Also you've portrayed pickup in a wholly negative way (much as I did nsa sex). Bad cynical psychological game playing pickup is now looked down on by what seems to be the majority of pickup advice videos. Women have also got involved in the scene, perhaps sick of the way it was. Its been forced to evolve into something alot more honest. Its no longer about *appearing* attractive. It's about trying to help guys to *be* attractive... and that, as you can imagine, is a lot more about inner development than playing dumb cynical games with people. I will admit though that pickup is still very much focused on sleeping through women and I'm really not into that personally. I'll also admit that there is still a nasty wing to pickup and the remnants of the bad old style out there. And I totally hate both of these. But moreover... please don't think of me as the guy who's into picking up women. I only bought up pickup in the first place because I was surprised by the newer stuff being quite thought provoking. I'm not using it to bag women. I'm applying it's better lessons across all my life, for business and for friendships, lessons which will help me be more myself and come across better in social situations. And of course I'm hoping it will help me be more comfortable and confident in the company of women I find highly attractive. But I'm not a broad defender of either pickup culture nor of all the advice and opinions coming out of it. If you've been thinking of me as that serial dating pickup guy you've got me all wrong | |||
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"It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices. This is incorrect in several ways. Firstly I'd guess almost all the lads going out on a Saturday night have consumed pickup advice and are practicing it. So pickup is most assuredly "going out to pull". Also you've portrayed pickup in a wholly negative way (much as I did nsa sex). Bad cynical psychological game playing pickup is now looked down on by what seems to be the majority of pickup advice videos. Women have also got involved in the scene, perhaps sick of the way it was. Its been forced to evolve into something alot more honest. Its no longer about *appearing* attractive. It's about trying to help guys to *be* attractive... and that, as you can imagine, is a lot more about inner development than playing dumb cynical games with people. I will admit though that pickup is still very much focused on sleeping through women and I'm really not into that personally. I'll also admit that there is still a nasty wing to pickup and the remnants of the bad old style out there. And I totally hate both of these. But moreover... please don't think of me as the guy who's into picking up women. I only bought up pickup in the first place because I was surprised by the newer stuff being quite thought provoking. I'm not using it to bag women. I'm applying it's better lessons across all my life, for business and for friendships, lessons which will help me be more myself and come across better in social situations. And of course I'm hoping it will help me be more comfortable and confident in the company of women I find highly attractive. But I'm not a broad defender of either pickup culture nor of all the advice and opinions coming out of it. If you've been thinking of me as that serial dating pickup guy you've got me all wrong "Ok. I haven't been thinking of you as a serial dating pickup guy. | |||
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"It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices. This is incorrect in several ways. Firstly I'd guess almost all the lads going out on a Saturday night have consumed pickup advice and are practicing it. So pickup is most assuredly "going out to pull". Also you've portrayed pickup in a wholly negative way (much as I did nsa sex). Bad cynical psychological game playing pickup is now looked down on by what seems to be the majority of pickup advice videos. Women have also got involved in the scene, perhaps sick of the way it was. Its been forced to evolve into something alot more honest. Its no longer about *appearing* attractive. It's about trying to help guys to *be* attractive... and that, as you can imagine, is a lot more about inner development than playing dumb cynical games with people. I will admit though that pickup is still very much focused on sleeping through women and I'm really not into that personally. I'll also admit that there is still a nasty wing to pickup and the remnants of the bad old style out there. And I totally hate both of these. But moreover... please don't think of me as the guy who's into picking up women. I only bought up pickup in the first place because I was surprised by the newer stuff being quite thought provoking. I'm not using it to bag women. I'm applying it's better lessons across all my life, for business and for friendships, lessons which will help me be more myself and come across better in social situations. And of course I'm hoping it will help me be more comfortable and confident in the company of women I find highly attractive. But I'm not a broad defender of either pickup culture nor of all the advice and opinions coming out of it. If you've been thinking of me as that serial dating pickup guy you've got me all wrong "After now Googling ‘pickup’, I am still feeing pretty clueless about what it is, and there is nothing that jumps out at me on Google other than it being a term associated with ‘going on the pull’. I asked my husband (who’s done business related courses on bettering oneself via verbal and non-verbal language), and he’s never heard of ‘pickup’ either. But I guess I’m missing something somewhere that everybody seems to know about. Picking people up, in relation to going on the pull, I would have thought is one way of securing nsa sex, therefore probably not your cup of tea anyway? For all intents and purposes I have no issues with men (or women) making themselves more sexually appealing, whether that be by using body language, talking in a certain way, or having a good Fab profile. I also have no issues with serial dating - I used to be a serial dater myself, so uncertain as to why that is something that you need to defend yourself for. I’m guessing that a lot of people who choose to use a swingers site, find the ‘dating game’ too dishonest and by definition too much of a ‘game’. I, on the other hand, dislike the honesty of swinging, and would much rather be seduced by a smooth talker with clever body language. Mrs | |||
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"It's the concept of "pickup" or pua that is marketed as a practice that apparently enables men to get the most beautiful women by a series of to me, distasteful psychological tricks. Th op has picked out the things that are useful to him in daily life and wants nothing to do with the darker side of this. Pickup isn't the normal going out on a saturday night to indulge in the pleasurable practice of boy meets girl. To me its far more sinister and actually debased women and the men who follow its more cynical practices. This is incorrect in several ways. Firstly I'd guess almost all the lads going out on a Saturday night have consumed pickup advice and are practicing it. So pickup is most assuredly "going out to pull". Also you've portrayed pickup in a wholly negative way (much as I did nsa sex). Bad cynical psychological game playing pickup is now looked down on by what seems to be the majority of pickup advice videos. Women have also got involved in the scene, perhaps sick of the way it was. Its been forced to evolve into something alot more honest. Its no longer about *appearing* attractive. It's about trying to help guys to *be* attractive... and that, as you can imagine, is a lot more about inner development than playing dumb cynical games with people. I will admit though that pickup is still very much focused on sleeping through women and I'm really not into that personally. I'll also admit that there is still a nasty wing to pickup and the remnants of the bad old style out there. And I totally hate both of these. But moreover... please don't think of me as the guy who's into picking up women. I only bought up pickup in the first place because I was surprised by the newer stuff being quite thought provoking. I'm not using it to bag women. I'm applying it's better lessons across all my life, for business and for friendships, lessons which will help me be more myself and come across better in social situations. And of course I'm hoping it will help me be more comfortable and confident in the company of women I find highly attractive. But I'm not a broad defender of either pickup culture nor of all the advice and opinions coming out of it. If you've been thinking of me as that serial dating pickup guy you've got me all wrong
After now Googling ‘pickup’, I am still feeing pretty clueless about what it is, and there is nothing that jumps out at me on Google other than it being a term associated with ‘going on the pull’. I asked my husband (who’s done business related courses on bettering oneself via verbal and non-verbal language), and he’s never heard of ‘pickup’ either. But I guess I’m missing something somewhere that everybody seems to know about.
Picking people up, in relation to going on the pull, I would have thought is one way of securing nsa sex, therefore probably not your cup of tea anyway? For all intents and purposes I have no issues with men (or women) making themselves more sexually appealing, whether that be by using body language, talking in a certain way, or having a good Fab profile. I also have no issues with serial dating - I used to be a serial dater myself, so uncertain as to why that is something that you need to defend yourself for. I’m guessing that a lot of people who choose to use a swingers site, find the ‘dating game’ too dishonest and by definition too much of a ‘game’. I, on the other hand, dislike the honesty of swinging, and would much rather be seduced by a smooth talker with clever body language.
Mrs"Google "8 pickup artist techniques you need to master" | |||
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"My ex has a degree in NLP and due to this he has a forever restraining order as the police said it makes him more of a threat then him actually stabbing me again. I know its a bit more then just pick up artist but not to different and still something to stay away from!" Why does it make him more of a threat? | |||
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"My ex has a degree in NLP and due to this he has a forever restraining order as the police said it makes him more of a threat then him actually stabbing me again. !" Wow -that is shocking with or without knowing what NLP stands for -your locstion as stated on your profile is if anything understatement of the year -hope things are ok for you now. | |||
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"OP, sorry to go off topic, but are you sure you are into a degree of nsa? You said yesterday you were on a Fab to play with couples, and that’s also reflected in your profile. Although you might develop a friendship with the couple you play with, it’s highly unlikely to be anything more than nsa, which you say you don’t like. Mrs" I just wanted to reply to this publicly. To my mind NSA seems to be about setting up a sexual relationship with the agreement at the heart of it that you won't develop feelings for each other. Firstly I believe that's an impossibility. You will always develop feelings for someone you fuck on a regular basis. So my own personal take on nsa is not that I won't develop feelings, I will, but that I won't let them get in the way or act on them. I am more than happy to enter into this kind of relationship agreement with a couple or married woman. Firstly it makes total sense in that context but secondly I know that's what I have to do to even have those experiences. I have to be mature with my feelings. I would do this because these scenarios are super kinky and that's what I'm getting in return. But I really don't see the point of making the effort of chasing after a single woman on here only to enter into a dead end nsa agreement with her. Why not let feelings get in the way or act on them? We're both single! | |||
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"Then Google Best Pua Training and note the not so subtle use of language." Whilst I'm commenting I should say that I did this and was reminded about how distasteful most pickup is. The psychological manipulation stuff is pure evil. I can't stand that stuff. Hence why I've never bought a book on pickup and likely never will. Perhaps I'm just mining one thin vein of interesting pickup on YouTube in amongst a sea of despicable bullshit? Maybe
Oh well... the key point of this thread has been for me to try and emphasise that I'm not a serial dating psychological gaming player who only wants to bed loads of women. Even if the thread has been a shambles on that front... at least its given me the opportunity to say it.
Anyway I'm off to enjoy some more of my chicken oriental yum yum | |||
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"Anyway I'm off to enjoy some more of my chicken oriental yum yum "Why is he/ she chicken ? | |||
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"I've literally never Googled "pickup". So I don't know what you're getting from that. All I know is what YouTube is sending me. I haven't watched the following video in full but the first 10 mins are interesting and representative of what I've been talking about. Watching it is a little like coming on here. Which is why I brought it up. I was just interested that there wasn't a culture of recommending them on here as they cover very similar territory... https://youtu.be/ynZMAKXWG9E I should add that I've not watched anything else by this guy. Also, whilst seeking out a good video to share I trawled through tonnes which have moments of insight imo but which also have content which I'd ignore personally but which I know I'd get roasted for on here. So, yes, pickup is a dubious source of insight into things... But of all the places in the world where I thought there'd be some receptiveness to that and some ability to separate the wheat from the chaff it's on here. It's soooo similar to the forums "I've watched some of that video. I will watch the rest later. So far my opinion is that this guy is using the same techniques that pua advises, just putting a different spin on them to make it look as of he's not cynically out to "seduce" women. He's using the same means, e.g. not texting, accepting a woman's refusal to sleep with him but asking minutes later. If you think it's helpful to you Soulful, carry on. To be honest I think it's going to lead you away from what you profess to want. | |||
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"I've literally never Googled "pickup". So I don't know what you're getting from that. All I know is what YouTube is sending me. I haven't watched the following video in full but the first 10 mins are interesting and representative of what I've been talking about. Watching it is a little like coming on here. Which is why I brought it up. I was just interested that there wasn't a culture of recommending them on here as they cover very similar territory... https://youtu.be/ynZMAKXWG9E I should add that I've not watched anything else by this guy. Also, whilst seeking out a good video to share I trawled through tonnes which have moments of insight imo but which also have content which I'd ignore personally but which I know I'd get roasted for on here. So, yes, pickup is a dubious source of insight into things... But of all the places in the world where I thought there'd be some receptiveness to that and some ability to separate the wheat from the chaff it's on here. It's soooo similar to the forums
I've watched some of that video. I will watch the rest later. So far my opinion is that this guy is using the same techniques that pua advises, just putting a different spin on them to make it look as of he's not cynically out to "seduce" women. He's using the same means, e.g. not texting, accepting a woman's refusal to sleep with him but asking minutes later.
If you think it's helpful to you Soulful, carry on. To be honest I think it's going to lead you away from what you profess to want."The guy says he's naturally the type who falls in love easily and comes across too needy. Without having any other info on the guy I'm quite happy to take him at face value on that. I'm not detecting him "putting a different spin on them to make it look as if he's not cynically out to seduce women". It feels to me that you're being a bit like a conspiracy theorist here, reading some dark alterior motive between the lines and projecting that onto everything. Do you get that lots of guys look to this kind of stuff with entirely noble intentions? They're looking for love. They clam up around attractive women. And they're looking for insights and tools to help them overcome that. Or is this whole area just sick twisted machievellian scheming in your eyes? Maybe, being such a noble intentioned guy, I lack some of the scepticism you're bringing to this. On the subject of no means no. It certainly does. But in a social situation where you're getting on quite well with a woman and there's an attraction there, which I assume is what happened to this guy in the video, no doesn't always mean go away. It may just mean no for now... seduce me a little more and I may reconsider. Again, I don't see that in a darkly sinister light | |||
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"One of the disturbing concerns I have with people's reaction to this on here is the worry that pickup is essentially the art of seduction" No it isn't. The only thing you'll pick up by approaching random women in public is chlamydia. | |||
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"One of the disturbing concerns I have with people's reaction to this on here is the worry that pickup is essentially the art of seduction No it isn't. The only thing you'll pick up by approaching random women in public is chlamydia. " Wow that's a really weird comment. I certainly don't see women in that way. And "in public" I tend to have a much better sense of the calibre of person I'm addressing my attention to | |||
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"I've literally never Googled "pickup". So I don't know what you're getting from that. All I know is what YouTube is sending me. I haven't watched the following video in full but the first 10 mins are interesting and representative of what I've been talking about. Watching it is a little like coming on here. Which is why I brought it up. I was just interested that there wasn't a culture of recommending them on here as they cover very similar territory... https://youtu.be/ynZMAKXWG9E I should add that I've not watched anything else by this guy. Also, whilst seeking out a good video to share I trawled through tonnes which have moments of insight imo but which also have content which I'd ignore personally but which I know I'd get roasted for on here. So, yes, pickup is a dubious source of insight into things... But of all the places in the world where I thought there'd be some receptiveness to that and some ability to separate the wheat from the chaff it's on here. It's soooo similar to the forums
I've watched some of that video. I will watch the rest later. So far my opinion is that this guy is using the same techniques that pua advises, just putting a different spin on them to make it look as of he's not cynically out to "seduce" women. He's using the same means, e.g. not texting, accepting a woman's refusal to sleep with him but asking minutes later.
If you think it's helpful to you Soulful, carry on. To be honest I think it's going to lead you away from what you profess to want.
The guy says he's naturally the type who falls in love easily and comes across too needy. Without having any other info on the guy I'm quite happy to take him at face value on that. I'm not detecting him "putting a different spin on them to make it look as if he's not cynically out to seduce women". It feels to me that you're being a bit like a conspiracy theorist here, reading some dark alterior motive between the lines and projecting that onto everything.
Do you get that lots of guys look to this kind of stuff with entirely noble intentions? They're looking for love. They clam up around attractive women. And they're looking for insights and tools to help them overcome that. Or is this whole area just sick twisted machievellian scheming in your eyes? Maybe, being such a noble intentioned guy, I lack some of the scepticism you're bringing to this.
On the subject of no means no. It certainly does. But in a social situation where you're getting on quite well with a woman and there's an attraction there, which I assume is what happened to this guy in the video, no doesn't always mean go away. It may just mean no for now... seduce me a little more and I may reconsider. Again, I don't see that in a darkly sinister light "You and I will never see eye to eye on this. I guess you missed the bit where he says he meets women and fucks them in the arse within an hour and a half. I'm happy to be considered a conspiracy theorist on this. I wish you well in your endeavours | |||
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"One of the disturbing concerns I have with people's reaction to this on here is the worry that pickup is essentially the art of seduction and swinging is so lacking in seduction that it is actually, as a culture, averse to it. If that's the case no wonder I'm a bit chicken oriental. For me seduction is the best bit. Sorry to pick you out _loswingers but I'm with them on their love of going out into the real world and actually trying to seduce someone into a pleasurable sexual experience. Why the heck should there be so much aversion to this on here? It's utterly baffling "I’m not going to comment on ‘pickup’ because I know nothing about it. But I think it’s interesting to consider the art of seduction. Is seduction a good thing, or is it too much like playing games? I agree with you, for me seduction is the best bit, and I do think it’s lacking if not frowned upon in the swing scene. Mrs | |||
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"I've literally never Googled "pickup". So I don't know what you're getting from that. All I know is what YouTube is sending me. I haven't watched the following video in full but the first 10 mins are interesting and representative of what I've been talking about. Watching it is a little like coming on here. Which is why I brought it up. I was just interested that there wasn't a culture of recommending them on here as they cover very similar territory... https://youtu.be/ynZMAKXWG9E I should add that I've not watched anything else by this guy. Also, whilst seeking out a good video to share I trawled through tonnes which have moments of insight imo but which also have content which I'd ignore personally but which I know I'd get roasted for on here. So, yes, pickup is a dubious source of insight into things... But of all the places in the world where I thought there'd be some receptiveness to that and some ability to separate the wheat from the chaff it's on here. It's soooo similar to the forums
I've watched some of that video. I will watch the rest later. So far my opinion is that this guy is using the same techniques that pua advises, just putting a different spin on them to make it look as of he's not cynically out to "seduce" women. He's using the same means, e.g. not texting, accepting a woman's refusal to sleep with him but asking minutes later.
If you think it's helpful to you Soulful, carry on. To be honest I think it's going to lead you away from what you profess to want.
The guy says he's naturally the type who falls in love easily and comes across too needy. Without having any other info on the guy I'm quite happy to take him at face value on that. I'm not detecting him "putting a different spin on them to make it look as if he's not cynically out to seduce women". It feels to me that you're being a bit like a conspiracy theorist here, reading some dark alterior motive between the lines and projecting that onto everything.
Do you get that lots of guys look to this kind of stuff with entirely noble intentions? They're looking for love. They clam up around attractive women. And they're looking for insights and tools to help them overcome that. Or is this whole area just sick twisted machievellian scheming in your eyes? Maybe, being such a noble intentioned guy, I lack some of the scepticism you're bringing to this.
On the subject of no means no. It certainly does. But in a social situation where you're getting on quite well with a woman and there's an attraction there, which I assume is what happened to this guy in the video, no doesn't always mean go away. It may just mean no for now... seduce me a little more and I may reconsider. Again, I don't see that in a darkly sinister light
You and I will never see eye to eye on this.
I guess you missed the bit where he says he meets women and fucks them in the arse within an hour and a half.
I'm happy to be considered a conspiracy theorist on this.
I wish you well in your endeavours "Cool. No worries. It was just a discussion. It's not important enough for me to get upset over or fall out with anyone over
Maybe you can take away from it that some guys (intelligent guys) are sifting through this stuff, separating the wheat from the chaff, for entirely noble reasons. Even if you don't agree that the dude online is doing that hopefully you can sense that I am.
I find the whole issue of body language fascinating and always have. Open up a copy of Cosmo or most other women's magazines and they're full of all this psychoanalyzing relationships and men and stuff too. It's fun stuff imo. But not welcomed on the forums apparently. Oh well never mind | |||
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"One of the disturbing concerns I have with people's reaction to this on here is the worry that pickup is essentially the art of seduction and swinging is so lacking in seduction that it is actually, as a culture, averse to it. If that's the case no wonder I'm a bit chicken oriental. For me seduction is the best bit. Sorry to pick you out _loswingers but I'm with them on their love of going out into the real world and actually trying to seduce someone into a pleasurable sexual experience. Why the heck should there be so much aversion to this on here? It's utterly baffling
I’m not going to comment on ‘pickup’ because I know nothing about it. But I think it’s interesting to consider the art of seduction. Is seduction a good thing, or is it too much like playing games? I agree with you, for me seduction is the best bit, and I do think it’s lacking if not frowned upon in the swing scene.
Mrs"For me seduction is the art of taking a woman who is in a completely neutral everyday state and luring her slowly and deeply enticingly into a state of sexual desire. It's what men should be doing at socials. But the vast majority are either utterly incompetent at it or can't be bothered. For me seduction is part of foreplay and it suggests, as well as helps improve the chances, that sex will be great Pickup is usually connoted with cynical psychological tricks men can play to help lure a woman into a sexual mood. I'm actually so repulsed by the thought of this that I've never read up on those tricks so am not a good person to ask about them. But pickup advice can often carry with it insights about eye contact and body language which, as you'd probably agree, are core to seduction. It's these that interest me and the guys I chat to about this. Becoming aware of them helps you improve your skills at being genuinely and honestly seductive... not in a cynical manipulative way | |||
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"I've literally never Googled "pickup". So I don't know what you're getting from that. All I know is what YouTube is sending me. I haven't watched the following video in full but the first 10 mins are interesting and representative of what I've been talking about. Watching it is a little like coming on here. Which is why I brought it up. I was just interested that there wasn't a culture of recommending them on here as they cover very similar territory... https://youtu.be/ynZMAKXWG9E I should add that I've not watched anything else by this guy. Also, whilst seeking out a good video to share I trawled through tonnes which have moments of insight imo but which also have content which I'd ignore personally but which I know I'd get roasted for on here. So, yes, pickup is a dubious source of insight into things... But of all the places in the world where I thought there'd be some receptiveness to that and some ability to separate the wheat from the chaff it's on here. It's soooo similar to the forums
I've watched some of that video. I will watch the rest later. So far my opinion is that this guy is using the same techniques that pua advises, just putting a different spin on them to make it look as of he's not cynically out to "seduce" women. He's using the same means, e.g. not texting, accepting a woman's refusal to sleep with him but asking minutes later.
If you think it's helpful to you Soulful, carry on. To be honest I think it's going to lead you away from what you profess to want.
The guy says he's naturally the type who falls in love easily and comes across too needy. Without having any other info on the guy I'm quite happy to take him at face value on that. I'm not detecting him "putting a different spin on them to make it look as if he's not cynically out to seduce women". It feels to me that you're being a bit like a conspiracy theorist here, reading some dark alterior motive between the lines and projecting that onto everything.
Do you get that lots of guys look to this kind of stuff with entirely noble intentions? They're looking for love. They clam up around attractive women. And they're looking for insights and tools to help them overcome that. Or is this whole area just sick twisted machievellian scheming in your eyes? Maybe, being such a noble intentioned guy, I lack some of the scepticism you're bringing to this.
On the subject of no means no. It certainly does. But in a social situation where you're getting on quite well with a woman and there's an attraction there, which I assume is what happened to this guy in the video, no doesn't always mean go away. It may just mean no for now... seduce me a little more and I may reconsider. Again, I don't see that in a darkly sinister light
You and I will never see eye to eye on this.
I guess you missed the bit where he says he meets women and fucks them in the arse within an hour and a half.
I'm happy to be considered a conspiracy theorist on this.
I wish you well in your endeavours
Cool. No worries. It was just a discussion. It's not important enough for me to get upset over or fall out with anyone over
Maybe you can take away from it that some guys (intelligent guys) are sifting through this stuff, separating the wheat from the chaff, for entirely noble reasons. Even if you don't agree that the dude online is doing that hopefully you can sense that I am.
I find the whole issue of body language fascinating and always have. Open up a copy of Cosmo or most other women's magazines and they're full of all this psychoanalyzing relationships and men and stuff too. It's fun stuff imo. But not welcomed on the forums apparently. Oh well never mind "I don't read women's magazines or go in for psychoanalysing relationship stuff. I simply don't buy in to any of it. I know it's just a discussion. I don't seek approval for my views | |||
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"I find the whole issue of body language fascinating and always have. Open up a copy of Cosmo or most other women's magazines and they're full of all this psychoanalyzing relationships and men and stuff too. It's fun stuff imo. But not welcomed on the forums apparently. Oh well never mind
I don't read women's magazines or go in for psychoanalysing relationship stuff.
I simply don't buy in to any of it.
I know it's just a discussion. I don't seek approval for my views "Please don't feel I'm arguing. I just wanted to say that I've always loved the junk in magazines like Cosmo. It's that combination of reading utter shit that's laughably bad but with the odd surprising gem in the middle of it. I think that also sums up my morbid trashy fascination with pickup videos. They're sometimes insightful... but even when they're not they're amusingly awful. Perhaps that's one step "common denominator" too far for some of the people on here. But it's my guilty secret haha | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in”" This thread or the video? | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? " This whole subjects you are looking to do | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do " Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? " No if i want to learn myself new skills i look into things and not on forums. Yes i might browse but its just more feedback. You seem to be looking for “dating, love”. This can be found on here but its a primarily a swing site. Try twatter or faceache or even write a blog | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? No if i want to learn myself new skills i look into things and not on forums. Yes i might browse but its just more feedback. You seem to be looking for “dating, love”. This can be found on here but its a primarily a swing site. Try twatter or faceache or even write a blog " The fab forum is somewhat unique in my experience as being a place where men and women talk quite frankly about sex and stuff. That's the value it brings to me... besides being a giggle sometimes. I don't come here to learn. But I'm always open to learning from unusual sources. And I'm always curious to ask what people think of sex and stuff like that on here. I don't usually do that in real life. This is my outlet for that. My reason for bringing up advice on seducing women is that I feel a common complaint from the women on here is that men are so inept at it. I also find the swinging culture where there's no seduction distasteful. So it seemed seduction tips were a good idea. Wrong haha | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? No if i want to learn myself new skills i look into things and not on forums. Yes i might browse but its just more feedback. You seem to be looking for “dating, love”. This can be found on here but its a primarily a swing site. Try twatter or faceache or even write a blog The fab forum is somewhat unique in my experience as being a place where men and women talk quite frankly about sex and stuff. That's the value it brings to me... besides being a giggle sometimes. I don't come here to learn. But I'm always open to learning from unusual sources. And I'm always curious to ask what people think of sex and stuff like that on here. I don't usually do that in real life. This is my outlet for that. My reason for bringing up advice on seducing women is that I feel a common complaint from the women on here is that men are so inept at it. I also find the swinging culture where there's no seduction distasteful. So it seemed seduction tips were a good idea. Wrong haha "So, Soulful how would you go about seducing a woman? | |||
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"So, Soulful how would you go about seducing a woman?" Haha you don't half ask some questions The only thing I'm interested in pickup for is the very first hurdle i.e approaching and opening a conversation with an attractive woman. The goal of this is to be entirely relaxed and comfortable with who you are. If she blows you off just brush it off. If she accepts your attention don't get flustered.
Once I'm past that stage it's all about good eye contact, good body language, deciding if you actually like this woman as a person, and seeking common ground. Some of this stuff is covered by pickup videos too. But I'm naturally quite good from here on anyway. So I don't really need this advice as much.
I'm not going to walk through a scenario as it'll make it look like I have a patter which I follow. I don't. It's all about being genuinely in the moment, being flirtatious and gentlemanly and attractive, and leading the evening on slowly from breaking the ice to having a laugh to being more relaxed to flirting to being a bit suggestive and on to seeing if there's any openness to some degree of physicality. It's like couples dancing, where the man takes the lead but gives the woman the space to enjoy the dance and show off her beauty. It's about moving things forward and helping the evening slowly take a more physical side. Once touching begins and lingering lustful eye contact then it's time to start thinking about a kiss.
For me it's really a delicious improvisatory dance with a woman which we both make up as we go along. That's why I see it as integral to foreplay and ultimately sex. I *love* it | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? " That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. " | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. " Hmm I'm just looking at a brochure for adult learning courses in Dorset and I can see a course entitled "communication skills for success". Are you telling me they're scientologists?
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. Hmm I'm just looking at a brochure for adult learning courses in Dorset and I can see a course entitled "communication skills for success". Are you telling me they're scientologists?
"Notice it isn't called "how to pull skanks off the street" | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. Hmm I'm just looking at a brochure for adult learning courses in Dorset and I can see a course entitled "communication skills for success". Are you telling me they're scientologists?
Notice it isn't called "how to pull skanks off the street""Jeez dude. You have a really low opinion of women "skanks"?! | |||
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"Man and woman get chatting They get along Find aspects of each other they like and even fancy They decide they'd like to do it again They do...and they have sex It really doesn't need to be anymore complicated than that " I agree... unless you're one of those people who can't get to the "Man and woman get chatting" stage, let alone get beyond it. If so, I'm guessing your advice would be "go crawl under a rock and die". You can't forgive them for seeking something more constructive than that | |||
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"Sorry this reads like a player and as much this might upset “looking to lure more in” This thread or the video? This whole subjects you are looking to do Do you think there's a place for learning and developing better social skills? Or are you a big believer in just being as good or as awful at it as life has fated you to be? That is literally a line or agument that scientologists use to sell courses on how to walk through walls. Hmm I'm just looking at a brochure for adult learning courses in Dorset and I can see a course entitled "communication skills for success". Are you telling me they're scientologists?
Notice it isn't called "how to pull skanks off the street"
Jeez dude. You have a really low opinion of women "skanks"?! "Just ones that fall for pick up lines. The same way i have a low opinion of people who buy from door to door salesmen. | |||
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"Man and woman get chatting They get along Find aspects of each other they like and even fancy They decide they'd like to do it again They do...and they have sex It really doesn't need to be anymore complicated than that I agree... unless you're one of those people who can't get to the "Man and woman get chatting" stage, let alone get beyond it. If so, I'm guessing your advice would be "go crawl under a rock and die". You can't forgive them for seeking something more constructive than that "Nothing you've said to espouse your views on the pick up stuff would indicate that you agree. And your recent dating adventures indicate you at least get to the chatting stage. Maybe you should let things play out more naturally. Savvy women know when something isn't 'just happening' | |||
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"Gosh it's all very complicated these days isn't it? And 'pick up' what awful terminology!! What ever happened to just being yourself, going with the flow and if things work out....great. (Sorry, I haven't read the whole thread. Thats probably already been said!)" Some folk just like to make it complicated | |||
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"There seems to be a misnomer among some of the women on here that, by expressing an interest in pick up, I must be looking to cynically trick lots of women into bed. For a start it's odd that that's a problem on a site seemingly devoted to letting guys do precisely that. But moreso it's just flat wrong. I'm interested in pick up for two big reasons 1) Learning about how to approach strangers, use effective body language, read their signs, maintain good eye contact, etc are all invaluable tools in life, whether it be networking for business or just making friends. A person can significantly improve on the quality of their life and on their chances of all kinds of success by improving these skills 2) I'm looking to date and hopefully fall in love with and maybe even marry a woman I'm deeply attracted to. I fully sympathise that for most women reading this they won't get what the problem is... just go up to that super attractive woman, be yourself, and just ask her out... But from the man's point of view, for whatever reason, that whole thing is easier said than done. So much so that apparently the average US male only asks out about 4 women in his whole life. Since I brought up the whole pickup thing it seems some shit has stuck to me. People seem to have got it in their heads that I'm some kind of awful serial dater. I'm hoping this washes some of the misnomers off. On a final note I'm also increasingly interested in attracting women offline rather than online. It cuts so many corners when I see a woman I'm attracted to and can already sense chemistry with. It seems obvious to me that if I improve my offline skills and retreat a bit from relying on easy online connections it's likely to massively improve my odds Just sayin "OMG you see the deeper reasoning behind things like me . | |||
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"Gosh it's all very complicated these days isn't it? And 'pick up' what awful terminology!! What ever happened to just being yourself, going with the flow and if things work out....great. (Sorry, I haven't read the whole thread. Thats probably already been said!)" Haha You know it's just me complicating the fuck out of everything yet again don't you _ady lick
As for your advice of just being yourself I completely agree... it's just a question of if you can do that and which self are you going to be | |||
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"OMG you see the deeper reasoning behind things like me . "Wow someone agrees Didn't see that one coming. Thanks dude. But I think we're alone on this one. Still... good to know there's at least two of us | |||
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V x | |||
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"Man and woman get chatting They get along Find aspects of each other they like and even fancy They decide they'd like to do it again They do...and they have sex It really doesn't need to be anymore complicated than that I agree... unless you're one of those people who can't get to the "Man and woman get chatting" stage, let alone get beyond it. If so, I'm guessing your advice would be "go crawl under a rock and die". You can't forgive them for seeking something more constructive than that
Nothing you've said to espouse your views on the pick up stuff would indicate that you agree.
And your recent dating adventures indicate you at least get to the chatting stage.
Maybe you should let things play out more naturally.
Savvy women know when something isn't 'just happening'"My strengths are when I've got past the initial hurdle. I'm a really honest and open guy. So I find it really easy to slip into comfortable attractive flirtatious conversation with a woman. Being totally natural and relaxed. Since starting swinging 5 years ago I've found that, left to their own devices alot of meets will end in nothing if I don't clearly express an interest and take the lead in some way. So I don't buy into the "go with the flow" ethos. I believe in seduction and being seduced and if that works then go for it and if not stick the car in reverse. Too many people bottle it and need a degree of confident but unpushy leading. My weakness is currently around women I find stunningly attractive. I get quite literally stunned by them. Old style pick up revolves around techniques for bring the woman down to your level. Negging her. This is disgusting imo. The new technique involves trying to raise your own view of yourself to her level. It's more about self development and building better self worth. Both things that are no brainers and help in all aspects of life imo. In short, what you outlined at the top of my reply here is exactly how it should be. But for some guys there are aspects of it that are easier said than done when it comes to high pressure social interactions, say with very attractive women and multi millionaire investors. So we do agree. I've been trying to convince you of that. But you seem to have a fixed picture of me as something I'm not and saying things I'm not | |||
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"So if I pop in and say I kinda understand your position and reasoning OP (although admittedly with slightly crass terminology, but I suspect you enjoy stirring the hornets’ nest)." Who me?
"However surely there’s a better and less stressful view which just lets you enjoy the journey and see where it goes. As Lady Lick said, far less complicated.
V x "Shh don't undermine the whole thread  | |||
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"We don't agree at all Obvious displays of seduction or overtly flirtatious behaviour I find immensely fickle and impersonal It gives my fanny the heebies! "Who said anything about obvious? | |||
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" It gives my fanny the heebies! "IS that a new fangled STD | |||
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"We don't agree at all Obvious displays of seduction or overtly flirtatious behaviour I find immensely fickle and impersonal It gives my fanny the heebies!
Who said anything about obvious? "You...none if it would be natural if you're following some mantra | |||
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"We don't agree at all Obvious displays of seduction or overtly flirtatious behaviour I find immensely fickle and impersonal It gives my fanny the heebies!
Who said anything about obvious? "Apologies wellinever but I hope you're better at listening to people when you meet them for real or else you're going to be pretty awful at letting things go with the flow. People who come with fixed ideas of what other people are just can't hear them and instead force conversations to go down bizarre routes that only have anything to do with their mental image of them and not the reality before them... And no... I didn't pick that up in a pick up video... but I could've | |||
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"Why don't you believe that going with flow and seduction can't work together? If I'm having a social with someone and I find them attractive and I'm getting those vibes from him I will naturally go into flirt mode rather than being conscious about my body language and my 'pick up' technique!! If it's not working then I will get the hell out. I hope you don't mind me saying but you definitely over think things. If that comes across when you're out with a woman I'm not sure how anyone would be able to relax in your company!!!" As I've said before I massively over think things on here. That's because that's what I enjoy the forums for... picking stuff apart and asking curious questions about life. There is no way *at all* that I'm like this when I meet a woman. What a buzz killer that would be. My experience of going with the flow was with couples and I had a 100% failure rate through that which so perplexed me that I decided to try seducing them instead. After that I've had an almost 100% success rate. The nerves of the situation with couples often means they don't know how to get from having a nice drink to getting naked and they're quite relieved when someone takes the lead. I'm sure this doesn't translate to meeting women. But I still bring a little of what I've learnt from that to some meets if I feel the woman is seeking to have sex from it. I don't date women using this approach. | |||
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"We don't agree at all Obvious displays of seduction or overtly flirtatious behaviour I find immensely fickle and impersonal It gives my fanny the heebies!
Who said anything about obvious?
Apologies wellinever but I hope you're better at listening to people when you meet them for real or else you're going to be pretty awful at letting things go with the flow. People who come with fixed ideas of what other people are just can't hear them and instead force conversations to go down bizarre routes that only have anything to do with their mental image of them and not the reality before them... And no... I didn't pick that up in a pick up video... but I could've "I'm listening...i just hear you shouting the same thing Going with the flow worka for me...im not looking to change how I interact- here, or in real life I'm happy just 'being' me | |||
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"We don't agree at all Obvious displays of seduction or overtly flirtatious behaviour I find immensely fickle and impersonal It gives my fanny the heebies!
Who said anything about obvious?
Apologies wellinever but I hope you're better at listening to people when you meet them for real or else you're going to be pretty awful at letting things go with the flow. People who come with fixed ideas of what other people are just can't hear them and instead force conversations to go down bizarre routes that only have anything to do with their mental image of them and not the reality before them... And no... I didn't pick that up in a pick up video... but I could've
I'm listening...i just hear you shouting the same thing
Going with the flow worka for me...im not looking to change how I interact- here, or in real life
I'm happy just 'being' me"We're the same. Social anxiety isn't me. Neither is approach anxiety. I'm looking to overcome these things so that I can get out of the way of myself and let the real me shine
But I'm sure you're going to insist that, for some reason I'm yet to fathom, we're not in agreement on this. That's what I mean by not being able to listen | |||
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If you need an online tutorial on how to be you...it's not you
I'm out | |||
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"You should try listening
If you need an online tutorial on how to be you...it's not you
I'm out"I think you actually may need advice on getting out of the way of yourself even more than me Ok that's cool. You can't say I didn't try Maybe you'll discover the real me over time xx | |||
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"Man and woman get chatting They get along Find aspects of each other they like and even fancy They decide they'd like to do it again They do...and they have sex It really doesn't need to be anymore complicated than that I agree... unless you're one of those people who can't get to the "Man and woman get chatting" stage, let alone get beyond it. If so, I'm guessing your advice would be "go crawl under a rock and die". You can't forgive them for seeking something more constructive than that
Nothing you've said to espouse your views on the pick up stuff would indicate that you agree.
And your recent dating adventures indicate you at least get to the chatting stage.
Maybe you should let things play out more naturally.
Savvy women know when something isn't 'just happening'"But according to the pua philosophy they don't and according to the OPs interpretation of it no doesn't mean no...it means harrass me some more... | |||
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"Man and woman get chatting They get along Find aspects of each other they like and even fancy They decide they'd like to do it again They do...and they have sex It really doesn't need to be anymore complicated than that I agree... unless you're one of those people who can't get to the "Man and woman get chatting" stage, let alone get beyond it. If so, I'm guessing your advice would be "go crawl under a rock and die". You can't forgive them for seeking something more constructive than that
Nothing you've said to espouse your views on the pick up stuff would indicate that you agree.
And your recent dating adventures indicate you at least get to the chatting stage.
Maybe you should let things play out more naturally.
Savvy women know when something isn't 'just happening'
But according to the pua philosophy they don't and according to the OPs interpretation of it no doesn't mean no...it means harrass me some more..."Jeez What did I do to deserve these ridiculous reactions? If you're not going to engage with what I actually said and instead insist on portraying me as some awful jerk... well... err... well I'll have to start more annoying threads! Ha! Now there's a threat | |||
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"Jeez What did I do to deserve these ridiculous reactions? "Just keep talking mate... the whole is nearly ready for you to bury yourself in | |||
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"Jeez What did I do to deserve these ridiculous reactions?
Just keep talking mate... the whole is nearly ready for you to bury yourself in "Haha I had thought it's already 6ft deep by now. I seem to be doing a good job of cultivating an online persona as a right piece of work... a real charlatan player over thinker. I think some people are going to be a bit surprised when they meet me. But heck I've only brought it on myself. I had hoped people would just forget with time but the women on this thread have put paid to any hope of that so my only hope is to keep talking and see what happens haha
Wish me luck... I need it | |||
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You're not giving me the creeps, I believe what I think you're talking about (like Hitch). Of course you could be an utterly clever psycho - I'm always open to having my mind changed but I'm not feeling that about you. Yet. | |||
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"Looks like your techniques aren't working on Sappy! Maybe time to read The Game again... "but if you know anything about "game" is that "game recognises game"..........
me... i specialise in "no game" game........ no need to be hating but just need to no let people know everything you know.....
and hear endeth the lesson......... | |||
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"Looks like your techniques aren't working on Sappy! Maybe time to read The Game again...
but if you know anything about "game" is that "game recognises game"..........
me... i specialise in "no game" game........ no need to be hating but just need to no let people know everything you know.....
and hear endeth the lesson......... "Shh no game game is the new game | |||
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"Put it this way OP, if there was a reality TV show based on your love life - I'd watch it" Haha | |||
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"OP this thread reminds me of Hitch. The scene in the speed dating bar where Hitch is trying to explain his business and why he does it. I like the discussion.
You're not giving me the creeps, I believe what I think you're talking about (like Hitch). Of course you could be an utterly clever psycho - I'm always open to having my mind changed but I'm not feeling that about you. Yet. "Thanks Steel We seem to get on well. Perhaps you'd like to come and see my extensive axe collection sometime | |||
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"OP this thread reminds me of Hitch. The scene in the speed dating bar where Hitch is trying to explain his business and why he does it. I like the discussion.
You're not giving me the creeps, I believe what I think you're talking about (like Hitch). Of course you could be an utterly clever psycho - I'm always open to having my mind changed but I'm not feeling that about you. Yet.
Thanks Steel We seem to get on well. Perhaps you'd like to come and see my extensive axe collection sometime "
I actually would if you were closer. | |||
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"If you want to be taken with a bit more credibility please don’t say opening a conversation. How about start ? I also take a bit of umbrage about the idea of bringing yourself up to the level of an attractive women. Attractive people are on no different level to anybody else. And you’re projecting false ideals onto her. Although I get the nerves bit. That was me. I still get nervous... but on the second date, when i know she’s a cool person. " When they talk about bringing yourself up to an attractive woman's level it's all in your head. You've put her on that pedestal. Personally I think it’s a better approach than negging her so you can deflate your image of her. That's just horrible and abusive. I'm lucky. I only suffer from approach anxiety in public. But I try to push myself every day to be friendly and chatty to everyone I meet to help me get out of my bubble. I was brought up by a mum who suffered severe social phobia and even though I don't have that I think some of it rubbed off on me. After I get through that initial hurdle I'm not at all nervous. | |||
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"If you want to be taken with a bit more credibility please don’t say opening a conversation. How about start ? I also take a bit of umbrage about the idea of bringing yourself up to the level of an attractive women. Attractive people are on no different level to anybody else. And you’re projecting false ideals onto her. Although I get the nerves bit. That was me. I still get nervous... but on the second date, when i know she’s a cool person. When they talk about bringing yourself up to an attractive woman's level it's all in your head. You've put her on that pedestal. Personally I think it’s a better approach than negging her so you can deflate your image of her. That's just horrible and abusive. I'm lucky. I only suffer from approach anxiety in public. But I try to push myself every day to be friendly and chatty to everyone I meet to help me get out of my bubble. I was brought up by a mum who suffered severe social phobia and even though I don't have that I think some of it rubbed off on me. After I get through that initial hurdle I'm not at all nervous. " you say *they*. I was responding to your post where you talked about your nerves. I never thought of begging as deflating your image of her. More deflating her image of your image of her. (If that makes sense). Interesting perspective. But still makes me think your starting point is of her on a pedestal as it’s stll all about direction. You’re equals. Until proven otherwise. | |||
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"If you want to be taken with a bit more credibility please don’t say opening a conversation. How about start ? I also take a bit of umbrage about the idea of bringing yourself up to the level of an attractive women. Attractive people are on no different level to anybody else. And you’re projecting false ideals onto her. Although I get the nerves bit. That was me. I still get nervous... but on the second date, when i know she’s a cool person. When they talk about bringing yourself up to an attractive woman's level it's all in your head. You've put her on that pedestal. Personally I think it’s a better approach than negging her so you can deflate your image of her. That's just horrible and abusive. I'm lucky. I only suffer from approach anxiety in public. But I try to push myself every day to be friendly and chatty to everyone I meet to help me get out of my bubble. I was brought up by a mum who suffered severe social phobia and even though I don't have that I think some of it rubbed off on me. After I get through that initial hurdle I'm not at all nervous. you say *they*. I was responding to your post where you talked about your nerves. I never thought of begging as deflating your image of her. More deflating her image of your image of her. (If that makes sense). Interesting perspective. But still makes me think your starting point is of her on a pedestal as it’s stll all about direction. You’re equals. Until proven otherwise. " Yeah but bringing yourself up to the level you imagine she's at is not my advice it's theirs. That's why I said they. I totally get that the whole pedestal thing is in my head. It's a work in progress... as is much of the stuff I post on here. Some people can see I'm changing my mind on stuff as I go... others seem to be building a weird aggregate picture of me as someone who simultaneously holds all the views I've ever asked questions about | |||
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I’m closing it. | |||
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"Its just that attempting to imitate the inputs of people who are naturally charismatic and confident appears cynical and sinister " And what about all the fraudulence on the female side? The push up bras? The corsets? The botox? At least adopting techniques to help boost your confidence and charisma aren't inherently fraudulent. It's still you... It's just you presented in the best possible light. In comparison some women are so fake they're almost robocop | |||
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