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"Interesting that caring or empathy didn't come up more. I once had a young lady looking for a Domme message me and say she was confused so I asked why. She said your verifications talk of how lovely and caring you are but your profile is so intimidating and extreme. I replied if you don't care and do the stuff I do then you're likely just a psychopath. A subs welfare and wellbeing is a top one for me " perfectly put! | |||
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"Interesting that caring or empathy didn't come up more. I once had a young lady looking for a Domme message me and say she was confused so I asked why. She said your verifications talk of how lovely and caring you are but your profile is so intimidating and extreme. I replied if you don't care and do the stuff I do then you're likely just a psychopath. A subs welfare and wellbeing is a top one for me "Ironic looking back at this 3 week old post, and how prescient. The Dom I found for a D/s relationship had little caring or empathy. Luckily I found out fairly early but it still took a while to get my head back. Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without | |||
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"Interesting that caring or empathy didn't come up more. I once had a young lady looking for a Domme message me and say she was confused so I asked why. She said your verifications talk of how lovely and caring you are but your profile is so intimidating and extreme. I replied if you don't care and do the stuff I do then you're likely just a psychopath. A subs welfare and wellbeing is a top one for me
Ironic looking back at this 3 week old post, and how prescient. The Dom I found for a D/s relationship had little caring or empathy. Luckily I found out fairly early but it still took a while to get my head back.
Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without " | |||
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" Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without "Yep. Sadly I know a couple of subs who have been messed up in the head (physical wounds heal) by wannabe Don's who just thought D/she was all about control and hitting your sub. | |||
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"What would be the biggest values and behaviours you would expect?" The dynamics would vary as much as any other relationship. Personally I'd expect to give obedience, receive discipline and protection. | |||
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"Communication is key, trust is an absolute. And support to push boundaries and explore desires and needs. T" the right amounts | |||
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" Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without
Yep. Sadly I know a couple of subs who have been messed up in the head (physical wounds heal) by wannabe Don's who just thought D/she was all about control and hitting your sub. "Sadly I know a couple too. I described what mind control and games my mind was hit with, luckily for not very long, to an experienced Dom I know and he said he didn’t sound like a wannabe or a bad Dom but more a psychopath in the technical sense. The Dom blamed trust issues but a lack of caring and empathy are very different. It put me in bed for 3 days and affected my work but luckily it’s done now and I’m out. It helped me process the before and after I experienced by writing prose under ‘juxtaposition’ in stories and fantasies. I’m sure you’d enjoy it. I hate to think what might happen with less experienced or savvy subs faced with such powerful mind capabilities. | |||
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"Communication and respect." This. Communication is paramount. And the trust and respect comes with time. | |||
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" Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without
Yep. Sadly I know a couple of subs who have been messed up in the head (physical wounds heal) by wannabe Don's who just thought D/she was all about control and hitting your sub. "Don't I know it. It can be hard to spot when you're new to the lifestyle. | |||
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" Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without
Yep. Sadly I know a couple of subs who have been messed up in the head (physical wounds heal) by wannabe Don's who just thought D/she was all about control and hitting your sub.
Don't I know it.
It can be hard to spot when you're new to the lifestyle. "Especially if they are not emotionally ready, or in the right place. | |||
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" Never underestimate the value of a Dom with empathy. Never underestimate the danger of one without
Yep. Sadly I know a couple of subs who have been messed up in the head (physical wounds heal) by wannabe Don's who just thought D/she was all about control and hitting your sub.
Don't I know it.
It can be hard to spot when you're new to the lifestyle. "Yes it certainly can. I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". Or my former sub who trialled for a couple who completely ignored her health issues leaving her very unwell and without basic care.... And who did downright dangerous stuff with her like electro play with current passed across her chest. It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. " No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do. | |||
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"Complete trust. 100%. Respect, affection, openess & honesty, communication, faith. If you're going to give someone the potential power to abuse you, you need to know that power won't be abused " This comes back to the question on where do you cross the line I mentioned in two threads recently from my own experiences and the sexual harassment that’s in the news. I referred to the statement by Louis CK as I think that’s relevant. What happens when that line is drawn in different places to two parties? One persons abuse could be another’s playing. Or it could be someone being strict in their control and saying ‘this is how it is, like it or lump it’. Or ‘be sub or fuck off’ as I was rather elegantly told. That was meant to be fun too apparently 
You can say a line has been crossed but if the other party is in complete denial and disagreement there’s no progress to be made, it’s stalemate - you give in and continue in an unhealthy toxic damaging relationship or you get out.
Many sexual harassment complaints went nowhere for this reason, shut up or put up. In D/s I get that a Dom is the position of power but continuing after that line has been crossed, even if they disagree, is abusive. When I brought up safe sane and consensual parameters I was just told my safe wouldn’t grow me and he continued. Abuse of power in my view but I’m sure he’d disagree and find some rationale for it.
This is so much wider than my own person experiences and I’d be interested to hear other opinions on when two parties views of crossing the line is in different places | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do." Yes there’s a difference between a D/s relationship and sceneing. Even if scene by scene or play by play in a club there are still limits and boundaries and respect for safewords | |||
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"Complete trust. 100%. Respect, affection, openess & honesty, communication, faith. If you're going to give someone the potential power to abuse you, you need to know that power won't be abused This comes back to the question on where do you cross the line I mentioned in two threads recently from my own experiences and the sexual harassment that’s in the news. I referred to the statement by Louis CK as I think that’s relevant. What happens when that line is drawn in different places to two parties? One persons abuse could be another’s playing. Or it could be someone being strict in their control and saying ‘this is how it is, like it or lump it’. Or ‘be sub or fuck off’ as I was rather elegantly told. That was meant to be fun too apparently
You can say a line has been crossed but if the other party is in complete denial and disagreement there’s no progress to be made, it’s stalemate - you give in and continue in an unhealthy toxic damaging relationship or you get out.
Many sexual harassment complaints went nowhere for this reason, shut up or put up. In D/s I get that a Dom is the position of power but continuing after that line has been crossed, even if they disagree, is abusive. When I brought up safe sane and consensual parameters I was just told my safe wouldn’t grow me and he continued. Abuse of power in my view but I’m sure he’d disagree and find some rationale for it.
This is so much wider than my own person experiences and I’d be interested to hear other opinions on when two parties views of crossing the line is in different places "If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do." Even if you 'play and go', if it is a new partner there should be a pre play negotiation or checklist to ascertain what both parties want out of the play and if there are any issues (particularly medical conditions or emotional responses) to be taken into account. I don't want to have someone tied up and gagged and pull out my normally non threatening pinwheel and she freaks out because she is scared of sharps. Bad stuff ex doms did but had started off innocently. But now innocent toys or actions are loaded with memories. Any rope with a new play partner you need to know joint flexibility. Back on point, I think respect for the humanity of the person you are playing with or in a relationship. This covers communication and empathy. I take the view that if you are going to break someone down you have to know how to put them back together. You can't do that without knowing the person or having empathy. | |||
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" No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do." No. This thread is not about playing with random people at clubs, it is about entering into a D/she relationship. | |||
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"Complete trust. 100%. Respect, affection, openess & honesty, communication, faith. If you're going to give someone the potential power to abuse you, you need to know that power won't be abused This comes back to the question on where do you cross the line I mentioned in two threads recently from my own experiences and the sexual harassment that’s in the news. I referred to the statement by Louis CK as I think that’s relevant. What happens when that line is drawn in different places to two parties? One persons abuse could be another’s playing. Or it could be someone being strict in their control and saying ‘this is how it is, like it or lump it’. Or ‘be sub or fuck off’ as I was rather elegantly told. That was meant to be fun too apparently
You can say a line has been crossed but if the other party is in complete denial and disagreement there’s no progress to be made, it’s stalemate - you give in and continue in an unhealthy toxic damaging relationship or you get out.
Many sexual harassment complaints went nowhere for this reason, shut up or put up. In D/s I get that a Dom is the position of power but continuing after that line has been crossed, even if they disagree, is abusive. When I brought up safe sane and consensual parameters I was just told my safe wouldn’t grow me and he continued. Abuse of power in my view but I’m sure he’d disagree and find some rationale for it.
This is so much wider than my own person experiences and I’d be interested to hear other opinions on when two parties views of crossing the line is in different places "My lines are clearly drawn. That is where 100% trust comes in. Getting to know someone, communicating, discussing boundaries, agreeing on safe words or hand gestures, knowing your partner will respect them. If for 1 minute, I had any doubts, thought those would be ignored, my wishes disregarded, then I wouldn't even be in a position where it could possibly happen. I have 100% trust & faith in my Dom, which was built over months, before anything physical even happened. | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do. Even if you 'play and go', if it is a new partner there should be a pre play negotiation or checklist to ascertain what both parties want out of the play and if there are any issues (particularly medical conditions or emotional responses) to be taken into account. I don't want to have someone tied up and gagged and pull out my normally non threatening pinwheel and she freaks out because she is scared of sharps. Bad stuff ex doms did but had started off innocently. But now innocent toys or actions are loaded with memories. Any rope with a new play partner you need to know joint flexibility. Back on point, I think respect for the humanity of the person you are playing with or in a relationship. This covers communication and empathy. I take the view that if you are going to break someone down you have to know how to put them back together. You can't do that without knowing the person or having empathy. " Totally agree, both have to be open and honest, not hide things. | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do. Even if you 'play and go', if it is a new partner there should be a pre play negotiation or checklist to ascertain what both parties want out of the play and if there are any issues (particularly medical conditions or emotional responses) to be taken into account. I don't want to have someone tied up and gagged and pull out my normally non threatening pinwheel and she freaks out because she is scared of sharps. Bad stuff ex doms did but had started off innocently. But now innocent toys or actions are loaded with memories. Any rope with a new play partner you need to know joint flexibility. Back on point, I think respect for the humanity of the person you are playing with or in a relationship. This covers communication and empathy. I take the view that if you are going to break someone down you have to know how to put them back together. You can't do that without knowing the person or having empathy. Totally agree, both have to be open and honest, not hide things. " Then no one gets hurt..... | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is." Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. " You did right, if you don't feel safe you withdraw. | |||
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" I switch, and on one occasion I got chatting to a couple who expressed interest in dominating me. I decided to request a non-play meet so we could all get to know each other and see if we were compatible.... Their reply "no. We don't want to get to know you. We just want to fuck you up". ... It is surely a Don's responsibility to get to know the sub, find out their needs and fulfil them while directing the sub to fulfil the needs of the Domme. There may be a need to cede power, but it will have limits. No, some people like 'play and go' meets in the BDSM scene. I play like that at clubs quite happily. I am more often than not entirely uninterested about 'getting to know' someone before playing with them in a club other than their expectations for the scene and what they are willing to do. Even if you 'play and go', if it is a new partner there should be a pre play negotiation or checklist to ascertain what both parties want out of the play and if there are any issues (particularly medical conditions or emotional responses) to be taken into account. I don't want to have someone tied up and gagged and pull out my normally non threatening pinwheel and she freaks out because she is scared of sharps. Bad stuff ex doms did but had started off innocently. But now innocent toys or actions are loaded with memories. Any rope with a new play partner you need to know joint flexibility. Back on point, I think respect for the humanity of the person you are playing with or in a relationship. This covers communication and empathy. I take the view that if you are going to break someone down you have to know how to put them back together. You can't do that without knowing the person or having empathy. Totally agree, both have to be open and honest, not hide things. Then no one gets hurt....." The key phrase was ‘you can’t do that without knowing the person or having empathy’ | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. You did right, if you don't feel safe you withdraw. " I did do right but it made me ill before I got out. The issue for me is the lack of care and caring. Lack of empathy. Scary. | |||
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" Totally agree, both have to be open and honest, not hide things. " I was completely open and honest. Not that I was believed. " Then no one gets hurt....." I was. Not that they cared. Bad combination. Time to close this. | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. You did right, if you don't feel safe you withdraw. I did do right but it made me ill before I got out. The issue for me is the lack of care and caring. Lack of empathy. Scary. "Obviously you never knew the person, things like that is never good. Hope it works out. | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. You did right, if you don't feel safe you withdraw. I did do right but it made me ill before I got out. The issue for me is the lack of care and caring. Lack of empathy. Scary.
Obviously you never knew the person, things like that is never good. Hope it works out. "All I could go on was the response or lack of to me saying it was making me ill and safewording out twice. If they carry on regardless and show little caring to the impact on me then I can only take it that that is indeed the person they are. I gave plenty of chances to find out different because I wanted it to work out. It clearly didn’t. | |||
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" If the line is crossed, it's unhealthy - move on. If it's miscommunication, or semantic differences, then communication need to be more precise. It's if it feels totally wrong, that's what it is. Is is really that simplistic, that black and white? First one, cross a line move on. Does this mean people who are subjected to sexual harassment at work should just leave, lose their job through no fault of their own? In the D/s relationship example does someone literally just walk away from what could have been an amazing match or try to discuss and find common ground rather than just throw toys out the park and walk away? Second one, miscommunication or semantics. Many of the victims of sexual harassment have said how many times they tried to raise the issue with the person and the organisation concerned without progress. I tried to communicate in many different ways to try to find a way round what could have been miscommunication. Many times without success so unlikely miscommunication so the option walk away is there. Thats a deeply unsatisfying outcome as you have no idea what really happened to process it. Third part, it feels totally wrong that’s what it is. It’s always good to clarify intent and meaning but sometimes you don’t get any. Continuing after safewords called twice, trying to right things and communicate differently without any progression then yes it was clearly wrong. Still no idea what the fuck happened to go from amazing to awful in a matter of days. Or maybe I just pulled back the veil to see reality. Like the sexual harassment cases, the person affected loses out, through no fault of their own. Yes there’s always two sides, in my case I held up to the values the other person asked for but nothing was ever good enough. And that does feel totally wrong. You did right, if you don't feel safe you withdraw. I did do right but it made me ill before I got out. The issue for me is the lack of care and caring. Lack of empathy. Scary.
Obviously you never knew the person, things like that is never good. Hope it works out.
All I could go on was the response or lack of to me saying it was making me ill and safewording out twice. If they carry on regardless and show little caring to the impact on me then I can only take it that that is indeed the person they are. I gave plenty of chances to find out different because I wanted it to work out. It clearly didn’t. "At best, misunderstanding, at worst, manipulation. For safety, taking the “every silver lining has a cloud” route is more ecological than “ever cloud has a silver lining”. | |||
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