FabSwingers.com forum: "Pushing Limits"

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Since I'm into kink, I get contacted by a fair few people who say that they'd like to 'push my boundaries' or 'push my limits' (or similar phrases that mean the same thing).

I don't really understand why this has become such a common phrase and approach on swinging/sex sites (it's less common in my experience on kink sites, but does still happen on occasion).

If I set boundaries, I don't want them pushed. The boundaries are there for a reason, it's because I don't want to do 'more' at that time with that person.

I guess it's the same as the idea that if someone says no, you just have to ask them a few more times until they say yes. That they didn't really mean what they said the first time and that they'll back down if you push them.

Now, I'm quite a hard player when it comes to BDSM. I've had relationships that involve challenging concepts like consensual non-consent and so forth. But I think if anything, that's made me much more hard-line on the idea of consent and *not* pushing boundaries if you've not agreed to that previously.

I don't really know where I'm going with this. I guess maybe I hope that people will stop saying 'I want to push your boundaries' if they don't actually mean 'I want to ignore what you said I couldn't do'. But it's similar to phrases like 'I want to ruin you' - they don't want to actually break your body for future use, it's just a horrible phrase that has come into common use.

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By *lik and PaulCouple
over a year ago

cahoots

I think you hit the nail on head when they basically want to ignore your boundaries....that is simply about someone else getting what they want and not caring about you in any way....best avoided, which I'm sure you do. Xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm not sure everyone understands or respects boundaries. As you say, they are supposed to be your accepted and acknowledged limits to which you will go. It always seems strange to us when we get similar messages. We know where we draw the line and that line is not to be crossed.

I think sometimes these people have an over inflated sense of their own designs and think that pushing you into something you don't want or need is sexy?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I think sometimes these people have an over inflated sense of their own designs and think that pushing you into something you don't want or need is sexy? "

Oh yes, I think so.

It's quite common in my experience for them to say 'but you will enjoy it' (yesterdays message about this was how much I'd enjoy being 'forced' to squirt).

No - I don't enjoy it. Not with new people anyway. So that's why I said 'I don't want to do X'.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think we actually use the phrase on our profile. What I meant when I wrote it is that we've lead a pretty sheltered life sexually, there are (were) lots of things we hadn't tried. Before joining Fab we'd have probably laughed and thought many things weren't for us. But now our eyes have been opened and if we meet people with the knowledge and experience to make us feel secure to try new things that are just outside our comfort zone we'll consider that. We do still have hard boundaries but in other areas we're open to exploring. We're certainly not looking for demanding people who want to try and inflict a particular type of play on us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's just the latest catchphrase used to make it sound like they know what they are doing

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

I think people get confused on the meaning of "limit" and "boundary".

I most often hear people saying they want to push their own boundaries or limits, I think they really mean they want to find out what they are rather than do things they don't want to do.

Clarity in communication and an understanding of consent are key in my opinion.

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By *axandbooCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Unfortunately we have had a few idiots message us that...

Boo has her hard limits and soft limits...she is also only submissve to me.

The fact they inbox making a ridiculous statement just shows how unaware they are of the commitment a sub makes to their Dom, the trust involved, how much has been done behind the scenes to get to the point we are at now.

I have been on the bdsm scene now for over 20 years and found it one of the most enligtening paths i have ever taken

Dax

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think we actually use the phrase on our profile. What I meant when I wrote it is that we've lead a pretty sheltered life sexually, there are (were) lots of things we hadn't tried. Before joining Fab we'd have probably laughed and thought many things weren't for us. But now our eyes have been opened and if we meet people with the knowledge and experience to make us feel secure to try new things that are just outside our comfort zone we'll consider that. We do still have hard boundaries but in other areas we're open to exploring. We're certainly not looking for demanding people who want to try and inflict a particular type of play on us."

Yes i would like to think that most people using this phrase mean to say "explore boundaries" rather than "disregard boundaries". There are a lot of people on here that have not experienced enough BDSM to know where their limits lie and are eager to explore and find out.

I think the real failure is that so many who propose link on here do not have the presence of mind to ask "Are you into this? What is your experience? Are you sub Dom or what?" Instead they jump to their own assumptions or wishful thinking - the "you will enjoy it" falls in this fantasy. Therefore OP I think your irritation stems more from people approaching you inappropriately, and entirely failing to acknowledge the depth of your experience (which is a serious source of respect in bdsm communities, hence ignoring it can be experienced as disrespect).

Yes there are some Dom types who will deliberately aim to test or even destroy your stated soft and hard limits, but I think they are a minority. The rest is, as I said, wishful thinking at best, bravado at worst. Feel free to educate the people that use the phrase on a case by case basis!

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By *atasha_DavidCouple
over a year ago

Slough

They want to be more than the rest, to do with you what others cannot.

It is in our experience a sign of lack of knowledge or experience and is therefore an instant avoid

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I most often hear people saying they want to push their own boundaries or limits, I think they really mean they want to find out what they are rather than do things they don't want to do."

Yes this, succinctly put! Though to use this phrase for yourself is not the same as proposing it to someone else (a stranger even), which is OP's complaint.

I also wanted to point out the common equivalent for approaching subs: "I have no limits".

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 10/04/17 09:42:22]

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester

Over the years we have had so many men / women / couples and single bi females who have asked us to help them push their boundaries as they feel safe and comfortable with us . This is very different to the op though , as she is more into the bdsm scene , and we aren't .

It's not always a negative within the swinging scene as there are so many opportunities to explore what may add to the experience with the right people . Add to that the fact that as one gets more comfortable one may want the right people to help push limits . These limits or boundaries are obviously very different though , we aren't talking pain or anything .

We fully appreciate that many swingers are happy with their boundaries , and don't want then pushed . However , if we didn't want to push ours , we would still be putting in a show in our car at dogging sites , with no touching from anyone else as that's how we started six years ago . That doesn't mean we want guys insisting they can make my wife squirt ( she can't , and doesn't want anyone trying to prove she can ) , or that we should try bareback anal . Certain limits are there for a bloody good reason , but over the years we are glad we've had our boundaries pushed with the right people in the right circumstances .

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By *iffaWoman
over a year ago

wherever

another non squirter here, some seem to take it as a challenge. It's not. I always wonder what exactly they mean when they talk about pushing boundaries though?

I mean really how far can you go? I think I'm still very innocent compared to some

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I understand the term 'pushing boundaries'.

If I hadn't been encouraged to push mine then I would still be extremely vanilla. I love 'pushing boundaries' and exploring new ideas and experiences.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Over the years we have had so many men / women / couples and single bi females who have asked us to help them push their boundaries as they feel safe and comfortable with us . This is very different to the op though , as she is more into the bdsm scene , and we aren't .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Since I'm into kink, I get contacted by a fair few people who say that they'd like to 'push my boundaries' or 'push my limits' (or similar phrases that mean the same thing).

I don't really understand why this has become such a common phrase and approach on swinging/sex sites (it's less common in my experience on kink sites, but does still happen on occasion).

If I set boundaries, I don't want them pushed. The boundaries are there for a reason, it's because I don't want to do 'more' at that time with that person.

Brilliant post, OP.

I have written on my profile that I'm shy. I am. Yet the most common approach I have in messages is -- you don't look shy, or I've seen your pics you're definitely not shy etc -- I don't engage further with someone who says this. It may seem harsh but already they've decided I can't possibly know myself better than they perceive me. Even if it's a gentle joke, it's misplaced and highlights to me a lack of awareness of how they could be perceived and the potential impact of that. Extrapolate this to conversations around boundaries and actual play, this is not someone I feel I can communicate effectively with and hence would not play with.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I also wanted to point out the common equivalent for approaching subs: "I have no limits"."

I always ask if they're ok with limb removal. They very quickly find some limits. (And then often we play - but I can't be doing with people who want to be all things to all people).

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

" Add to that the fact that as one gets more comfortable one may want the right people to help push limits . These limits or boundaries are obviously very different though , we aren't talking pain or anything ."

So, I think this is the problem. A boundary is like a fence. I put a fence around some activities because I don't want to do them with some people. Like for example - I am happy to have strap on sex with one of my partners, but I do not want to have strap on sex with casual fucks I meet on the internet.

So I say 'it is a limit that I will not have strap on sex with you'. And then 90% of the time the guy will be like 'pushing boundaries is fun, lets see if you enjoy it'.

And that's not the correct response. The correct response is 'ok, I respect your boundaries'.

What YOU are referring to is 'trying new things'. 'I am interesting in trying new things that I have not tried before' is very different to 'I have tried this thing before and I didn't enjoy it and do not want to do it again'.

You're not really pushing boundaries so much as exploring new activities. There's no boundary there - if there was a boundary or a limit then you wouldn't want to do it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm still yet to understand the fascination with making a woman squirt.

If it happens cool, but why the fuck so guys feel the need to finger blast like a jackhammer to try and achieve it?

Had guys try it with Mrs and she ends up telling them to stop

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I'm still yet to understand the fascination with making a woman squirt.

If it happens cool, but why the fuck so guys feel the need to finger blast like a jackhammer to try and achieve it?

Had guys try it with Mrs and she ends up telling them to stop "

I had a guy so determined that he almost ripped one of my piercings out. And my piercings are all at least 4mm stretches. Go figure.

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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago

yumsville

I think there as degrees of boundaries here. When people say this it usually means they are open to ideas, i.e. they would like to try a woman or group sex but haven't found the right partner to try it with. That they wouldn't automatically walk into a group full of women, strip naked and start rolling around but given the right circumstances would try.

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By *AA123Couple
over a year ago

Lichfield

Some no doubt will chance a boundary push when they are hard at it in the meet, which would then take a confident No! to stop it and potentially end the meet.

Rob

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have found this discussion puzzling for two reasons. Firstly I suppose it is because I don't see boundaries and non consent as the same thing, as there hard and soft limits although for some people boundaries are the same as non consent. Secondly and most importantly, don't people have a thorough pre play negotiation in which hard and soft limits are discussed, the nature and intensity of play are discussed and agreed as are the agreed safe words? If that is done each time a person plays one can gauge the nature of the play person. The fact it is not mentioned should be a warning.

Additionally in my view any dom who ignores the safe word and or does not comply with agreed limits or introduces play that was not discussed (because who knows what phobias people have) deserves more than a strong word. However a sub who changes their limits mid way is a menace to an inexperienced dom.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I have found this discussion puzzling for two reasons. Firstly I suppose it is because I don't see boundaries and non consent as the same thing, as there hard and soft limits although for some people boundaries are the same as non consent. Secondly and most importantly, don't people have a thorough pre play negotiation in which hard and soft limits are discussed, the nature and intensity of play are discussed and agreed as are the agreed safe words? If that is done each time a person plays one can gauge the nature of the play person. The fact it is not mentioned should be a warning.

I approach things in a very different way to you - clearly!

I don't do hard and soft limits. Just limits. There are things you will do with a person, and things you won't do with a person. There might also be things you'd prefer not to do with a person - but they are not limits, they are preferences.

I'm talking about pre-play discussion. When you say 'I am interested in XYZ but not ABC' and someone says 'I'd like to push your boundaries on ABC' or something roughly along those lines. I don't think it's ok to say that kind of thing.

Safe words - I don't use them. I don't need to. I only play with people who say 'yes' and 'no' and 'stop' and 'a little less please'.

I'm not talking about ignoring or changing limits. I'm talking about people who say 'I want to push your limits' when you say 'these are my limits'. IMO, it's not an ok mindset to have.

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester

So I say 'it is a limit that I will not have strap on sex with you'. And then 90% of the time the guy will be like 'pushing boundaries is fun, lets see if you enjoy it'.

And that's not the correct response. The correct response is 'ok, I respect your boundaries'.

You're not really pushing boundaries so much as exploring new activities. There's no boundary there - if there was a boundary or a limit then you wouldn't want to do it."

I get your point , and did explain that the limits in a swinging sense are something that many like to push . Perhaps you're right , they may not be limits as such , more things we would like to try but need a push to explore them .

So with the making my wife squirt , or bareback , or anal we wouldn't want those limits pushed, any more than you would with your no no's .

We all have limits and some are there for our own reasons , whether safety , or simply because we really don't want to do this that or the other . What I was trying to say was that there are things we do want to try , and need a push to try them . As do others , and it's a fine line to know whether to push the limits sometimes .

Many times we have conversed after a meet , and the people have asked why we didn't do this that or the other , and when we say well watersports isn't on your list of likes , or the female said she was straight etc.... we get told , but we thought you guys would help us push our limits !

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By *axandbooCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

I approach things in a very different way to you - clearly!

Safe words - I don't use them. I don't need to. I only play with people who say 'yes' and 'no' and 'stop' and 'a little less please'.

I'm not talking about ignoring or changing limits. I'm talking about people who say 'I want to push your limits' when you say 'these are my limits'. IMO, it's not an ok mindset to have."

for some the yes/no thing is a part of play, hence the safe word system being used....but once limits/boundaries or however you wish to term it are put down, they should be respected and kept to.

but again i guess those that cannot comprehend certain things only show ignorance to those aspects and on here it means two choices, 1 - enlighten or 2 - ignore and block.... number 2 is the option we take because sometimes you cannot enlighten someone no matter how hard you try

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm finding this a really interesting discussion, surg two threads I can see.

One is the semantics of it, to me a boundary is movable - electoral boundaries change all the time, and property boundaries can creep over time. Our boundary when we started was x, now we've tried and enjoyed certain things it is y but on the way I'd say we've found our limits on z.

The other issue seems to be people who irrespective of the wording just seen intent on persuading others to do things they clearly state they aren't interested in. Why don't they understand that if you can't take no for an answer on a message that it doesn't bode well for how you'll behave in the bedroom faced with a No!

And squirting, what is the obssession? It's a new pressure to put on a woman, expecting their body to perform a certain way so they can boast about making women squirting is the way it comes across.

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