FabSwingers.com forum: Are you trans if you wear your partners undies

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The more I read and think about it, the more offended (for want of a better word) I am that cross-dressers and transsexuals are lumped together. This isn't the only site I've seen it on, either. It seems that no one really knows where to 'put' trans people - when really it's a 'thing' all of its own.

I'm really not a high-horse type of guy, so I won't stay on mine for long, but how is this even being tolerated?

Yup, I like putting on women's clothes from time to time to be thoroughly dominated, but I LOVE my cock and totally identify as a man. It's just kinky fun for me.

Wouldn't dream of classing myself as trans.

So for someone going through the realisation and process of changing their perceived sex to be lumped in with someone like me? Well it must be awful for them. It's a completely different ballgame (pun can be intended if you want). Yes, the two can link, but so can liking your bum fingered and being gay.

This is the kind of attitude that seems to permeate much of the vanilla world, and I can't imagine how difficult it must make it for trans people wanting to seek support and guidance.

I'm sure I saw a similar post a little while back but I can't find it now...

And sorry for the rant.... I just cannot understand how this hasn't been sorted out by now.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

There is a thread of a similar train of thought in the site feedback section of the forum.

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

That's where I saw it! Cheers

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Great post there op..it needed to be said..i feel the same. Yes i dress up from time to time and my wife does my makeup and we make it all work..but its a different situation to the trans world..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The more I read and think about it, the more offended (for want of a better word) I am that cross-dressers and transsexuals are lumped together. This isn't the only site I've seen it on, either. It seems that no one really knows where to 'put' trans people - when really it's a 'thing' all of its own.

I'm really not a high-horse type of guy, so I won't stay on mine for long, but how is this even being tolerated?

Yup, I like putting on women's clothes from time to time to be thoroughly dominated, but I LOVE my cock and totally identify as a man. It's just kinky fun for me.

Wouldn't dream of classing myself as trans.

This is the kind of attitude that seems to permeate much of the vanilla world, and I can't imagine how difficult it must make it for trans people wanting to seek support and guidance.

I'm sure I saw a similar post a little while back but I can't find it now...

And sorry for the rant.... I just cannot understand how this hasn't been sorted out by now.

In order to go through any form of gender reassignment (surgery/official recognition) it is required that a person first undergos a lengthy process of psychological/psychiatric evaluation.This is law in most countries including Thailand,where you cannot just go to a back street surgeon and say 'sharpen up your scalpel please,,,here's a grand,,no questions asked',,contrary to some peoples beliefs.

One aspect of life that is gone through in great (exhaustive) is whether the need to change is motivated in any way by any kind of sexual desire.If a person is motivated byt the feel of sensuous fabrics against the skin then it is highly unlikely that they would get through these evaluations.(believe me,,,these Dr.s know exactly how to get truthful answers out of you,,,,you're not going to pull the wool over their eyes.

So,in short,I agree,,,transvestism or crossdressing are definitely NOT the same as transsexualism.

However,,,if seeking a guy,who is seeking a woman,,,I have found ,on occasion,that telling that guy about exactly what kind of woman I am can send them running to the hills (not always and I find this a little odd,,,we all have things in our past,don't we).

I find it useful,,on fab at least,,to check on a guys profile what their attitude is to Tv/Ts..if they have indicated an interest in Tv/Ts then it is less likely that they will get sniffy with me.So,in that way,putting Tv/Ts together in a category can be useful.

(I find it extremely rare to find a guy who is interested primarily in post op Ts women).

Hope this has helped answer some of the question. xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is a thread of a similar train of thought in the site feedback section of the forum.

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV! "

I often wonder if its because the site wont support another catagory lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just cheap....buy your own underwear lol!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's not as crushingly bad as you might imagine. Lol.

I point out pretty much straight away on my profile that I'm not a tranny and being called one is pretty offensive to me.

I'm transgendered and proud of it.

I don't really care what label fab insists I have next to my profile.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm just fabulous

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We're all entitled to have an opinion, of course

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By *raceytvcdTV/TS
over a year ago

mansfield

Who cares,just have fun

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By *inzi LTV/TS
over a year ago

The Garden of Eden in Beautiful North Wales

I'd consider myself to be a Crossdresser or novice Tgirl... basically because I like the term tgirl and think of it as a collective word. However transsexual/trasgendered girls are definitely in a different catagory. These girls have gone through so much to change their life to suit what/who they really are... A woman.

I was quite disgusted a few weeks ago when I found out the authorities jailed 2 transgendered girls in mens prisons and both committed suicide.

This is where things really need to change and also for society to accept other people's choices.

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By *inzi LTV/TS
over a year ago

The Garden of Eden in Beautiful North Wales

Oops, wrong thread!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

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By *iss_Samantha_LovecockTV/TS
over a year ago

bmth /poole sometimes blandford

well that makes u a transvestite then ,nothing to be ashamed of .

most people with a brain know the difference .

so as this isnt a trans site best not to get to hung up on it

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By *iss_Samantha_LovecockTV/TS
over a year ago

bmth /poole sometimes blandford

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV! "

not really I'd sooner have the straight and bi guys in there own category..i cant see it causing and distress or confusion

wd be good if we had our own site tho

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

You've taken the shower I suggested?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Slightly misleading title to the thread??

In answer to the question in the title and ignoring the first post that doesnt seem to have anything to do with the afore mentioned question, no wearing your partners underwear does not make you trans. Possibly a cross dresser, maybe just a bit kinky, but I think you need to wear more than a pair of knickers to be a transvestite and transgender is, as your rant states OP, a whole nother ball game.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Slightly misleading title to the thread??

The title was to emphasise the fact that wearing your partner's undies doesn't mean you're trans, highlighting why I think TV and TS should be separated.

Are you trolling now, or did you seriously not understand that?

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By *adystephanieTV/TS
over a year ago

glos

ok so I have read things need to change, not sure however that relabelling or adding catagories to segregate the differing forms of transgender would achieve anything.

In my opinion things have changed enormously, gone are the days of the 70's and early 80's when it was just plain dangerous to go out dressed up to have fun or even dream of going out shopping, when getting spat at in night clubs or beaten and raped after a night out was commonplace.......

Things have changed because society has changed its attitude and more so in the younger generation, this I feel is due to a greater awareness and tolerance of gender fluid groups and indeed the efforts of the LGBT society as a whole for standing together and highlighting these issues.

Nobody particularly likes being labelled, but it actually is a key factor in the freedom that we enjoy today and 'Trans' does not actually refer to any particular stage of transvestism but suggests only a group, I have evolved with this over quite some time and I know for sure that any trans just starting out owe their freedom to those that have made society aware that they exist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Slightly misleading title to the thread??

The title was to emphasise the fact that wearing your partner's undies doesn't mean you're trans, highlighting why I think TV and TS should be separated.

Are you trolling now, or did you seriously not understand that?"

Not trolling, no that did not come across. Trans can mean transvestite or transexual so the header question doesnt relate to the point you were making. A fair point but not a point relating to your question.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can't say I've ever heard anyone, who knows anything about this, refer to a transvestite as trans.

Trans refers to transsexual or transgender. Male or female.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Trans" vestite "Trans" gender etc etc I think thats why the site has them all under one group.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The site may understand swingers but, if they're like you, they don't know much about our scene. Xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

"
your even more fabulous now x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

your even more fabulous now x"

She showered.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was made to think about this today when two children were talking in the car about trannies. They were having a debate about what they were and asked me. I deduced that someone who dresses as the opposite gender but keeps the original genitalia is transvestite. Someone who has their genitalia changed to the opposite sex are transsexuals. Vest-vestments. Sex-sexual organs. The original thinking by one of them was a person born with both male and female genitalia. No idea where they got that from.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

your even more fabulous now x

She showered.

Drank

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

""Trans" vestite "Trans" gender etc etc I think thats why the site has them all under one group."

"Trans" ylvania, "Trans" port, etc, etc

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We didn't go into cross dressers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We didn't go into cross dressers. "

Did you cover transgender?

M to f?

F to m?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 28/12/15 22:26:05]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd welcome 'transgender' being an addition to the category rather than it's own category.

Gender: Female, Male, Other

Status: Transgender, Cisgender

Interests: Crossdressing, Crossdressers

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I was made to think about this today when two children were talking in the car about trannies. They were having a debate about what they were and asked me. I deduced that someone who dresses as the opposite gender but keeps the original genitalia is transvestite. Someone who has their genitalia changed to the opposite sex are transsexuals. Vest-vestments. Sex-sexual organs. The original thinking by one of them was a person born with both male and female genitalia. No idea where they got that from. "

Some intersex people are born with both male and female genitals. They are often considered transgender because they are medically changed to have one gender characteristic as more pronounced.

FYI:

Trannies is a rather offensive word to many.

Transvestite and transexuals are very old fashioned words and again, can be quite offensive.

Crossdressers enjoy dressing in a manner that is non-traditional for their self-identified gender.

Transgender people are those who are transitioning to be a different gender to the one they were diagnosed with at birth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Personally I'm not really concerned about the label fab puts on my profile.

I object to being incorrectly refered to as a transvestite, that's all. This isn't a kink. I don't get turned on by what I wear. I feel sexy, yes.

Other people ( some) get turned on by my attire.

I would have been termed transsexual as a child but I've learned to accept my physical gender and the life built around it.

I'm happy with my gender disomorphia. My family are all happy with it too.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV!

not really I'd sooner have the straight and bi guys in there own category..i cant see it causing and distress or confusion

wd be good if we had our own site tho "

But you can already do this in the advanced search by clicking the bisexual/bi-curious button.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV!

not really I'd sooner have the straight and bi guys in there own category..i cant see it causing and distress or confusion

wd be good if we had our own site tho

But you can already do this in the advanced search by clicking the bisexual/bi-curious button. "

Have you tried to search for a couple where the guy is bi only?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV!

not really I'd sooner have the straight and bi guys in there own category..i cant see it causing and distress or confusion

wd be good if we had our own site tho

But you can already do this in the advanced search by clicking the bisexual/bi-curious button.

Have you tried to search for a couple where the guy is bi only?"

I can't say that I have, no. From your post I thought you were talking about single guys. It would require a few more couple categories to search like that I guess.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Come on Fab, its time we separated TS/TV!

not really I'd sooner have the straight and bi guys in there own category..i cant see it causing and distress or confusion

wd be good if we had our own site tho

But you can already do this in the advanced search by clicking the bisexual/bi-curious button.

Have you tried to search for a couple where the guy is bi only?

I can't say that I have, no. From your post I thought you were talking about single guys. It would require a few more couple categories to search like that I guess.

It wasn't my post but the search could do with a few more options.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I also think it doesn't cover transgender who are female - male. Everyone assumes tv/ts on fab are male to female.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also think it doesn't cover transgender who are female - male. Everyone assumes tv/ts on fab are male to female. "

Not everyone xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No, not at all! My ex used to wear a bit of lingerie and a dab of eye make up. It was hot.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My wife doesn't do girly unless cornered. She wears jeans and trainers but I don't think that's trans

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also think it doesn't cover transgender who are female - male. Everyone assumes tv/ts on fab are male to female.

Not everyone xx"

Sorry the majority. It just made me wonder as I have a friend who's transitioning to a male and it made me think I don't think I have seen any transitioning males on fab

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've worn my partners in the past and a few more items with her. I now own my own, does this make me trans or a cross dresser??

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By *eepster69Man
over a year ago

Dumfries

I'm really not a high-horse type of guy, so I won't stay on mine for long, but how is this even being tolerated?

Yup, I like putting on women's clothes from time to time to be thoroughly dominated, but I LOVE my cock and totally identify as a man. It's just kinky fun for me.

Wouldn't dream of classing myself as trans.

This is the kind of attitude that seems to permeate much of the vanilla world, and I can't imagine how difficult it must make it for trans people wanting to seek support and guidance.

I'm sure I saw a similar post a little while back but I can't find it now...

And sorry for the rant.... I just cannot understand how this hasn't been sorted out by now.

Whatever way you look at it, If you wear womens clothes for sexual pleasure you are TRANSvestite. That is the dictionary defintion of it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm really not a high-horse type of guy, so I won't stay on mine for long, but how is this even being tolerated?

Yup, I like putting on women's clothes from time to time to be thoroughly dominated, but I LOVE my cock and totally identify as a man. It's just kinky fun for me.

Wouldn't dream of classing myself as trans.

This is the kind of attitude that seems to permeate much of the vanilla world, and I can't imagine how difficult it must make it for trans people wanting to seek support and guidance.

I'm sure I saw a similar post a little while back but I can't find it now...

And sorry for the rant.... I just cannot understand how this hasn't been sorted out by now.

Whatever way you look at it, If you wear womens clothes for sexual pleasure you are TRANSvestite. That is the dictionary defintion of it."

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?"

Scotsmen?

{Runs and hides...}

Mr ddc

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?

Scotsmen?

{Runs and hides...}

Mr ddc"

Lol. Winner!

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By *eepster69Man
over a year ago

Dumfries

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?"

Using an online dictionary this is what it says for trabsvestite.

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/transvestite

And this for Cross Dresser.

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/cross-dressing#crossdressing_1

I'd guess the difference is the CD derives no sexual pleasure from it.

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By *eepster69Man
over a year ago

Dumfries

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?

Scotsmen?

{Runs and hides...}

Mr ddc"

PMSL! Kilt!!!...What happened to the last fecker that called it a skirt!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?

Scotsmen?

{Runs and hides...}

Mr ddc

Lol. Winner!

Oddly enough I do have a proper kilt, sporran and even a wee knife for my sock. The tenners worth of 2 pence coins in my sporran takes care of sexual urges.

Joking apart, its two completely different parts of my life, id never think of wearing lingerie with my kilt!

Or my sporran with a mini !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I also think it doesn't cover transgender who are female - male. Everyone assumes tv/ts on fab are male to female. "

Which is why I'm no longer in the tv/st category. I used to be.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Would it not be more correct to drop TS as a description and simply refer to them as the gender they present in, i.e. male or female, as UK law dictates they are perfectly entitled to be accepted as? Just saying....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Would it not be more correct to drop TS as a description and simply refer to them as the gender they present in, i.e. male or female, as UK law dictates they are perfectly entitled to be accepted as? Just saying.... "

I think it's fair, for those of us who are transitioning, to let people know on a sex site that our bodies might not match what they expect. If someone doesn't understand and meets us, were at a high risk of violence if we present in a way they don't expect.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We didn't go into cross dressers.

Did you cover transgender?

M to f?

F to m?

Yes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some intersex people are born with both male and female genitals. They are often considered transgender because they are medically changed to have one gender characteristic as more pronounced.

FYI:

Trannies is a rather offensive word to many.

Transvestite and transexuals are very old fashioned words and again, can be quite offensive.

Crossdressers enjoy dressing in a manner that is non-traditional for their self-identified gender.

Transgender people are those who are transitioning to be a different gender to the one they were diagnosed with at birth."

I know trannies is an offensive word to some,children often use offensive words because they think it's funny and don't realise some people can be offended. We all use words that someone will find offensive at some point in our lives,unless you own the bible of offensive language in the 21st Century and stick to it rigidly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I know trannies is an offensive word to some,children often use offensive words because they think it's funny and don't realise some people can be offended. We all use words that someone will find offensive at some point in our lives,unless you own the bible of offensive language in the 21st Century and stick to it rigidly. "

That's why I was pointing out that it can be hurtful. Because if you don't know, then you could continue to use it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That's why I was pointing out that it can be hurtful. Because if you don't know, then you could continue to use it."

I'm well aware of hurtful uses of certain words,however to explain that children were using the word I had to write it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I guess there are less categories for the sake of brevity.

There is a sliding scale, as far as most of society is concerned with the chap that likes to wear his missus panties at one end and the people who have their genitals surgically modified at the other; and loads of permutations in between.

It's just easier to have one category, it indicates to the people who are interested, what might be in store. They can then enquired with in for the details.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Call me mr thicko but what does your post mean. Can I have an idiots guide please.

Sorry

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If people read profiles there could be an explanation on there. If they read them.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have an expert in our midst.

Can you tell everyone what those who crossdress but get no sexual pleasure from it are then?

Using an online dictionary this is what it says for trabsvestite.

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/transvestite

And this for Cross Dresser.

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/cross-dressing#crossdressing_1

I'd guess the difference is the CD derives no sexual pleasure from it."

Stop guessing.

Look up transgender and gender queer. It's not about clothes or sex for many of us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Call me mr thicko but what does your post mean. Can I have an idiots guide please.

Sorry"

That by being in thier own TS catagory theres no chance of a man turning up thinking theyre a genetic woman then getting violent at being "fooled".

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple"

Thats a very open minded viewpoint and extremely helpful...

Welcome to my blocklist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm really not a high-horse type of guy, so I won't stay on mine for long, but how is this even being tolerated?

Yup, I like putting on women's clothes from time to time to be thoroughly dominated, but I LOVE my cock and totally identify as a man. It's just kinky fun for me.

Wouldn't dream of classing myself as trans.

This is the kind of attitude that seems to permeate much of the vanilla world, and I can't imagine how difficult it must make it for trans people wanting to seek support and guidance.

I'm sure I saw a similar post a little while back but I can't find it now...

And sorry for the rant.... I just cannot understand how this hasn't been sorted out by now.

Whatever way you look at it, If you wear womens clothes for sexual pleasure you are TRANSvestite. That is the dictionary defintion of it."

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

Crossdressers and TVs are another category again.... many CDs are happy to pull on a pair of knickers and not attempt to look feminine in any way at all..... and if thats what their happy with then thats fine their not harming anyone...

But they are different to a genuine TV who puts the effort into their appearance. Also many TVs do not dress for sexual pleasure, they may have gender dysphoria but dont wish a sex change, the not wanting to transition is what stops them being transexual...

The TV who dresses for non sexual reasons and may go out and about dressed and socialises in this manner is usually known as Tgirl..

Trans is taken from transgender which is an umbrella term used to include anyone regardless of where they are on the spectrum CD/TV/Tgirl/TS

But yes the categories are outdated and transexuals at least should have a seperate category....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some intersex people are born with both male and female genitals. They are often considered transgender because they are medically changed to have one gender characteristic as more pronounced.

FYI:

Trannies is a rather offensive word to many.

Transvestite and transexuals are very old fashioned words and again, can be quite offensive.

Crossdressers enjoy dressing in a manner that is non-traditional for their self-identified gender.

Transgender people are those who are transitioning to be a different gender to the one they were diagnosed with at birth.

Lol trannies is the word most used by ts to describe other ts in my experience

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Thats a very open minded viewpoint and extremely helpful...

Welcome to my blocklist."

Don't really much care about your or anyone else's blocklist

My viewpoint is neither open-minded nor close-minded; it is just a fact

I have yet to come across any person whose family registration document (birth certificate, in this country) has ever stated anything other than male or female

But if yours states TV/TS, then place your profile under TV/TS

It is just the same as I have never seen a birth document which states bisexual, heterosexual, bi-curious, lesbian or gay. These people, whatever their sexual orientation or preferences are, remain male or female

On FabS, one can select one of those preferences under gender. Maybe, that is where TV/TS sits too, since it is not a gender

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Thats a very open minded viewpoint and extremely helpful...

Welcome to my blocklist.

Don't really much care about your or anyone else's blocklist

My viewpoint is neither open-minded nor close-minded; it is just a fact

I have yet to come across any person whose family registration document (birth certificate, in this country) has ever stated anything other than male or female

But if yours states TV/TS, then place your profile under TV/TS

On FabS, one can select one of those preferences under gender. Maybe, that is where TV/TS sits too, since it is not a gender"

Yawn...

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Thats a very open minded viewpoint and extremely helpful...

Welcome to my blocklist.

Don't really much care about your or anyone else's blocklist

My viewpoint is neither open-minded nor close-minded; it is just a fact

I have yet to come across any person whose family registration document (birth certificate, in this country) has ever stated anything other than male or female

But if yours states TV/TS, then place your profile under TV/TS

On FabS, one can select one of those preferences under gender. Maybe, that is where TV/TS sits too, since it is not a gender"

The difficulty comes with changing your legal documents.

You can have full top and bottom surgery and be indistinguishable from a woman (if you have transitioned as a man) and still not have a changed birth certificate.

So should someone who lives full time as a woman, who has breasts, who has a nipped in waist, who has had facial surgery, voice training, and a vagina that is no different to yours - should she write her gender down on here as 'male' just because her birth certificate says that?

Also - which birth certificate? I have five, for various reasons.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Thats a very open minded viewpoint and extremely helpful...

Welcome to my blocklist.

Don't really much care about your or anyone else's blocklist

My viewpoint is neither open-minded nor close-minded; it is just a fact

I have yet to come across any person whose family registration document (birth certificate, in this country) has ever stated anything other than male or female

But if yours states TV/TS, then place your profile under TV/TS

On FabS, one can select one of those preferences under gender. Maybe, that is where TV/TS sits too, since it is not a gender

The difficulty comes with changing your legal documents.

You can have full top and bottom surgery and be indistinguishable from a woman (if you have transitioned as a man) and still not have a changed birth certificate.

Also - which birth certificate? I have five, for various reasons.

Well, if she has had all of that, which must have taken considerable time and cost a lot, then would she not also have a birth certificate stating that she is female? And if so, then she is legally and otherwise female and then would, presumably, put her profile under female

Question: What gender would the above person use on her job application form? Surely not TV/TS

How does one have five current birth certificates? Does each state a different gender? And what do these state other than male or female? I am seriously curious about this

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

No its not... im not transexual as i dont want to change sex. But i dont dress for sexual purposes so im not really a crossdresser either.

Im definately not TS (they should defibately have their own category)

My category i would identify as is more or less covered by TV even though its not quite right... but i dont get upset by it.

I do however dislike being referred to as a tranny as its usually a term used in a derogatory manner

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?"

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three."

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal."

Or the person who posted just above?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'."

But they said they dont dress for sexual purposes, try reading the post by Joanne

I know others too who dress part time not for sexual purposes but are happy being a man.

Problem with making up all these lables for people and then being condescending about how simple you've made is the people you're labeling rarely agree with you.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

But they said they dont dress for sexual purposes, try reading the post by Joanne

I know others too who dress part time not for sexual purposes but are happy being a man.

Problem with making up all these lables for people and then being condescending about how simple you've made is the people you're labeling rarely agree with you."

Blokes wearing skirts? Normal. Doesn't need a name. Just like women wearing trousers doesn't need a name.

Dressing for sex meets and advertising on a sex site that's what you're interested in? That makes you a crossdresser.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

But they said they dont dress for sexual purposes, try reading the post by Joanne

I know others too who dress part time not for sexual purposes but are happy being a man.

Problem with making up all these lables for people and then being condescending about how simple you've made is the people you're labeling rarely agree with you.

Blokes wearing skirts? Normal. Doesn't need a name. Just like women wearing trousers doesn't need a name.

Dressing for sex meets and advertising on a sex site that's what you're interested in? That makes you a crossdresser."

Why does crossdressing imply sex is involved? It sinply means you wear the other sexs clothes

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'."

What if you dress for a night out, go out with friends, have a great night and theres absolutely no sexual contact with any person at all?....

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?"

No two things is one thing too many for me . Forget multi tasking . Uni tasking is a struggle

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

But they said they dont dress for sexual purposes, try reading the post by Joanne

I know others too who dress part time not for sexual purposes but are happy being a man.

Problem with making up all these lables for people and then being condescending about how simple you've made is the people you're labeling rarely agree with you.

Blokes wearing skirts? Normal. Doesn't need a name. Just like women wearing trousers doesn't need a name.

Dressing for sex meets and advertising on a sex site that's what you're interested in? That makes you a crossdresser."

Seems pretty normal to me; I wear trousers; nobody blinks an eye; guys wear kilts; nobody blinks an eye

But I've yet to have sex wearing trousers; they have to come off at some point just before sex

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

But they said they dont dress for sexual purposes, try reading the post by Joanne

I know others too who dress part time not for sexual purposes but are happy being a man.

Problem with making up all these lables for people and then being condescending about how simple you've made is the people you're labeling rarely agree with you.

Blokes wearing skirts? Normal. Doesn't need a name. Just like women wearing trousers doesn't need a name.

Dressing for sex meets and advertising on a sex site that's what you're interested in? That makes you a crossdresser.

Why does crossdressing imply sex is involved? It sinply means you wear the other sexs clothes "

Exactly. It means you're normal. Average. Everyday. Just like most other people.

If you just enjoy wearing clothes (even if they are stereotypically from a different gender) then you're just normal.

You wouldn't call a butch woman who enjoys wearing men's clothes a crossdresser. So why do we call men who like wearing women's clothes crossdressers?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are more types of trannies etc than you can shake a stick at

It's confusing already by adding to it the different types would make it way too confusing

Most if not all trannies post tons of pictures and write loads so just look at the profiles and read the stuff

Well no, there aren't.

There are people who like wearing other genders clothes for sexual purposes - crossdressers.

And there are those who live in a different gender to the one they were assigned at birth - transgender people.

Just two types for you to manage. Can you do that?

What about those who wear the other genders clothes for non sexual purposes but who do live as the gender they were born as?

We're now up to three.

For performance purposes - drag queens or kings.

For everyday wear - normal.

Or the person who posted just above?

If you dress for sex meets then you're a crossdresser. That's everything from wearing a pair of knickers to full women's 'regalia'.

What if you dress for a night out, go out with friends, have a great night and theres absolutely no sexual contact with any person at all?...."

As I said - normal.

Just like if my female friends dress butch for the night, cut their hair into boys hair cuts, and wear men's clothes, they're not crossdressers. They're just butch women who like wearing clothes more usually associated with men.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I meant the title as a bit of a joke.

Having never had a threat go further than like 10 replies I didn't see it as a problem.... Haha

It's really been quite misleading as to what I wanted to talk about,

but still good fun to watch the debate

*munches popcorn*

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Thread*

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oanne_MacTV/TS
over a year ago

Perth

"I meant the title as a bit of a joke.

Having never had a threat go further than like 10 replies I didn't see it as a problem.... Haha

It's really been quite misleading as to what I wanted to talk about,

but still good fun to watch the debate

*munches popcorn*"

Your original point of the thread was very valid. The categories are dated

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well at the risk of repeating myself, I am at the point in my life where other people's perception or understanding of my gender issues are no longer much of a concern to me.

On here, fab, I'm labelled with a tv/ts which doesn't help the people I may meet or the people who simply chat to me, understand me.

My profile blurb, I hope, will help people know all they need to know about me. Fab isn't my life so it doesn't really matter to me if it's labelling system doesn't match up. Let's face it; even if it had a full set of labels they'd get misused and misunderstood anyway.

In my little chunk of the real world you may pass me in the street dressed as Rich, you may pass me as Rachael. As long as you don't feel the need to pick an arguement with me we'll not have an issue.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *icky_tvLondonTV/TS
over a year ago

london

Lol, silly-billies conflating transgendered with transexual. They are not equivalents.

Deary me, one step forward, one step back, duh lol.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

You've taken the shower I suggested?

hahaha

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

Some intersex people are born with both male and female genitals. They are often considered transgender because they are medically changed to have one gender characteristic as more pronounced.

FYI:

Trannies is a rather offensive word to many.

Transvestite and transexuals are very old fashioned words and again, can be quite offensive.

Crossdressers enjoy dressing in a manner that is non-traditional for their self-identified gender.

Transgender people are those who are transitioning to be a different gender to the one they were diagnosed with at birth.

Yeah, I am with you on that one. There are so many who get offended with one term or another

My niece has started calling me a lazy lard-arse just because I put on a couple of Kgs over Christmas; kids, eh

And the term she has for the fatties is really hilarious; I can PM you if you like

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple"

Would that it were that simple...

Male and female actually relate to a person's sex, not their gender. The fact that the two can be different is where the problems start. So on here a person's gender is more relevant than how a mid-wife saw them at all the point of their birth.

And then we throw in sexuality...

In truth all people want to know is "if I see you naked, will I get a surprise". Most TVs/TSs are sensible enough to ensure they don't find themselves in that position.

Mr ddc

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm even more fabulous than I was 3 hours ago

You've taken the shower I suggested?

hahaha

Mwaaah. Love you Mikki xx

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Would that it were that simple...

And then we throw in sexuality...

In truth all people want to know is "if I see you naked, will I get a surprise". Most TVs/TSs are sensible enough to ensure they don't find themselves in that position.

Mr ddc

OK; I mixed up gender and sex; what I meant was the sex on a birth certificate; male or female and only, male or female; not both; not in-between

I am fine with whatever gender people feel that they are and I will refer to them with the pronouns they would prefer

The point I was making was that there is no sex or gender called TV/TS, bisexual, heterosexual, gay, lesbian, bi-curious, bi-furious, etc. These are all meant to define a sexuality or an orientation

So why not put the TV/TS category under the sex (male or female) along-with where the rest of the orientations are

Agree with you about the 'surprise element' once the trousers, skirts, kilts, etc come off

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Would that it were that simple...

And then we throw in sexuality...

In truth all people want to know is "if I see you naked, will I get a surprise". Most TVs/TSs are sensible enough to ensure they don't find themselves in that position.

Mr ddc

OK; I mixed up gender and sex; what I meant was the sex on a birth certificate; male or female and only, male or female; not both; not in-between

I am fine with whatever gender people feel that they are and I will refer to them with the pronouns they would prefer

The point I was making was that there is no sex or gender called TV/TS, bisexual, heterosexual, gay, lesbian, bi-curious, bi-furious, etc. These are all meant to define a sexuality or an orientation

So why not put the TV/TS category under the sex (male or female) along-with where the rest of the orientations are

Agree with you about the 'surprise element' once the trousers, skirts, kilts, etc come off

Tv/ts is NOT the same as sexual orientation. It's not about who you're sexually attracted to, it's directly related to your sex/gender.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The problem is, everyone sees it differently. Different terms. Different labels.

There aren't enough 'labels' that will fit everyone. Some will still disagree. As long as each person is happy in themselves that's all that matters to me.

I treat each person individually anyway. They tell me how they wish to be. I'm happy with that. I just don't have the time or the energy to worry if I'm saying or doing something wrong anymore.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"There are two genders; female, male

However, if your birth certificate states that you are TV/TS then list your profile under that 'gender'

It is all quite simple

Would that it were that simple...

And then we throw in sexuality...

In truth all people want to know is "if I see you naked, will I get a surprise". Most TVs/TSs are sensible enough to ensure they don't find themselves in that position.

Mr ddc

OK; I mixed up gender and sex; what I meant was the sex on a birth certificate; male or female and only, male or female; not both; not in-between

I am fine with whatever gender people feel that they are and I will refer to them with the pronouns they would prefer

The point I was making was that there is no sex or gender called TV/TS, bisexual, heterosexual, gay, lesbian, bi-curious, bi-furious, etc. These are all meant to define a sexuality or an orientation

So why not put the TV/TS category under the sex (male or female) along-with where the rest of the orientations are

Agree with you about the 'surprise element' once the trousers, skirts, kilts, etc come off

Tv/ts is NOT the same as sexual orientation. It's not about who you're sexually attracted to, it's directly related to your sex/gender. "

But there is no sex or gender which is transvestite, now is there?

I haven't come across it on a job application or a passport application or bank account application. It is what a man or a woman does; wear clothes of the opposite sex

Me strutting around in trousers and boots and a cigar drooping from my lips (forget the cigar; I don't smoke) doesn't make me male, no matter how much I may feel at times

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

"So why not put the TV/TS category under the sex (male or female) along-with where the rest of the orientations are

But aren't they separate?

Don't you first choose to join as a man, woman, couple or TV/TS, and then choose to describe your orientation as straight, gay or bi?

I've always assumed the reason TV/TS's are lumped together is simply to flag up the fact that they might seem different whether dressed or naked, rather than any deliberate slight.