FabSwingers.com forum: Confusing help advice and meets

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Really got me annoyed I tried to offer advice to a newbie and it ended up into a meet I could not attend after a family issue I felt sorry for him them out of the blue I get a message with subject WTF and how he should of not pussey footed around me and was annoyed I never met him or gave him a chance ,clearly says on my profile I don't meet non veri and a meet was never really on the cards I won't be helping again that's for sure ended up having to block him

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"Really got me annoyed I tried to offer advice to a newbie and it ended up into a meet I could not attend after a family issue I felt sorry for him them out of the blue I get a message with subject WTF and how he should of not pussey footed around me and was annoyed I never met him or gave him a chance ,clearly says on my profile I don't meet non veri and a meet was never really on the cards I won't be helping again that's for sure ended up having to block him

So why arrange to meet him if you only meet verified and he wasn't? I'll help them with cam verifications but won't meet them, sounds like things went a bit too far, just stick to your guns next time and don't meet, after all it's your preference xxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My apologies if this comes across as a little harsh, but based on what you've made public here, communication is not your strong point. You state that you won't meet anyone that isn't verified yet you seem to imply you agreed to meet him: "and it ended up into a meet". A little confusing to the objective observer. Not sure what you're driving at here, was he abusive after you refused to meet?

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"My apologies if this comes across as a little harsh, but based on what you've made public here, communication is not your strong point. You state that you won't meet anyone that isn't verified yet you seem to imply you agreed to meet him: "and it ended up into a meet". A little confusing to the objective observer. Not sure what you're driving at here, was he abusive after you refused to meet?"

It would appear that OP had to cancel meet due to family issues, unclear as to the reason for blocking. I'm as confused as you are to be honest

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Sorry did the message at work so was a bit rushed I got annoyed after he messaged me at work ..... It started out him messaging me after I offered him advice we started chatting about his profile and how he could improve it and that ended up by me feeling sorry for him.

He was finding it so hard to get a meet with no verifications so he asked for a meet I didn't have the heart to turn him down people say I'm too nice for my own good and yes as someone said I had family issue and had to cancel.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

And yes it got heated with him trying to make me feel bad so I blocked him

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"Sorry did the message at work so was a bit rushed I got annoyed after he messaged me at work ..... It started out him messaging me after I offered him advice we started chatting about his profile and how he could improve it and that ended up by me feeling sorry for him.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x"

Not really as I would personally have directed him to the forums for advice that's what they're here for, if guys message me asking for advice this is the easiest and most helpful thing to do, I certainly wouldn't meet them out of pity, perhaps a cam veri with him would have helped him?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x

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By *dam_TinaCouple
over a year ago

Hampshire

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x"

Not really. Did you cancel or did you forget about it ?

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x"

So you did string him along then.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x

Not really. Did you cancel or did you forget about it ?"

Sounds like OP forgot to cancel the meet to me

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By *inkySlinkyCouple
over a year ago

Leeds

I'm not suprised he got annoyed that you "forgot about it".

Sally

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I had a couple promising to meet at a hotel I was in. They said they were on their way and never turned up. But were on fab later that evening. I messaged them and got no reply. It is difficult and upsetting, but like I always say - shit happens.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!"

She forgot to cancel

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel"

I would be annoyed.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel

I would be annoyed."

Same here

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By *he Queen of TartsWoman
Forum Mod
over a year ago

My Own Little World

So....

YOU went against your self imposed rule of not meeting the unverified.

YOU offered this guy a sympathy meet.

YOU forgot about him.

YOU were a timewaster.

And now YOU are annoyed that he had the balls to call you out about it in a message, so YOU started a thread highlighting your poor behaviour.

OK then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So....

YOU went against your self imposed rule of not meeting the unverified.

YOU offered this guy a sympathy meet.

YOU forgot about him.

YOU were a timewaster.

And now YOU are annoyed that he had the balls to call you out about it in a message, so YOU started a thread highlighting your poor behaviour.

OK then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People make mistakes, so give her a rest guys. OP if you can, just delete the thread.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

"People make mistakes, so give her a rest guys. OP if you can, just delete the thread."

I think only mods can do that?

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By *izzy.Woman
over a year ago

Stoke area

OP. I am with you on this. Ok you made a mistake and overlooked meeting him. I can see why he was annoyed, but you were trying to help him out. Well done for trying to help out a newbie.

I do the same from time to time and have been known to forget plans. I have had chance to apologise and rearrange it.

Shame he got nasty with you.

Maybe deleting the thread would be best and you can put this down to experience

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

No I never forgot I cancel the meet due to family issues nothing was said for a while after that no rearrangements so I forgot about the whole him wanting a meet as he never mentioned it till recently

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!"
my family will always come first my daughter is pregnant

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Oh and I also gave him plenty of warning you lot need to learn to read before jumping on a band wagon and my verifications show I'm not a time waster

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!! my family will always come first my daughter is pregnant "

Yes of course family comes first. But you can surely understand why he was annoyed ?

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By *lacksausageMan
over a year ago

Birmingham Airport

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel

I would be annoyed.

Same here"

Forgot to cancel but probably felt too powerful to say "sorry, I really want to meet you; how about next Halloween etc etc."

Annoyed, yes I would be. Hurl insults, I wouldn't. This is why I tell guys: do not invest your emotions into a meet. Do not give more than 50%; allow the other party to do some of the hard work. There is plenty to go round. Now see, there is this lovely attempt to portray you as the devil even though we can all read in between the lines.

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By *unandbuckCouple
over a year ago

Sheffield

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel

I would be annoyed.

Same here

Forgot to cancel but probably felt too powerful to say "sorry, I really want to meet you; how about next Halloween etc etc."

You need to read her reply earlier up. She says she did cancel, well before the meet. He was pissed off at no messages later to plan an alternative.

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By *lacksausageMan
over a year ago

Birmingham Airport

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel

I would be annoyed.

Same here

Forgot to cancel but probably felt too powerful to say "sorry, I really want to meet you; how about next Halloween etc etc."

You need to read her reply earlier up. She says she did cancel, well before the meet. He was pissed off at no messages later to plan an alternative."

It is neither here nor there.

If I try to meet and it got cancelled, I wouldn't be up in arms about it. You know why? I attend a meet thinking she might not even turn up etc etc. In that way if it happens, it's jus a bonus.

Oh and another thing... If your meets get cancelled or your attempts to arrange a meet get turned down WITHOUT an alternative suggestion eg " how about xday instead?" or " I'll let you know by the end of xday or vday, etc", why keep knocking? This how come you get so wound up about the whole thing and do your blood pressure no favours.

I say live and let live. Fuck and let fuck. If it happens, it happens, guys!

If all else fails, do not forget the magic button.

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By *unandbuckCouple
over a year ago

Sheffield

You need to read her reply earlier up. She says she did cancel, well before the meet. He was pissed off at no messages later to plan an alternative.

It is neither here nor there.

If I try to meet and it got cancelled, I wouldn't be up in arms about it. You know why? I attend a meet thinking she might not even turn up etc etc. In that way if it happens, it's jus a bonus.

I say live and let live. Fuck and let fuck. If it happens, it happens, guys!

If all else fails, do not forget the magic button. "

It's here or there to the OP as she is being called out in this thread as being a no-show, when she actually cancelled.

The guy shouldn't have kicked off, a meet got cancelled, that's it.

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By *lacksausageMan
over a year ago

Birmingham Airport

Somebody got a terrible memory, somebody got a terrible temper/ terrible manners so what.

Block the fucker, move on. See how easy that is???

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My take on this would be that he was in the wrong for getting stroppy about the lack of new plans, if you have family stuff that has caused you to cancel it seems logical that you're probably not going to be able to rearrange immediately. However I wouldn't be bothered about it, block, report if appropriate and don't veer from your rules next time. Try not to let the rudeness of (virtual) strangers bring you down.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So what have we learnt from this episode?

1) Never offer to meet or play with a Fab user out of pity.

2) Never lead someone on that you're going to meet them when you're probably not.

3) Never get ugly with someone with wtf messages if things don't work out as you'll only ever push them away by doing so.

This site can be ugly and upsetting. But, even though it's difficult to do, you need to stand firm in what you're willing and not willing to do, if you've been hurt try your best to swallow it, and try to keep a brave smiling welcoming polite face

A good way to do this is to continually remind yourself that the people you're talking to on here are real human beings with real lives. Try not to mess them around... and try not to lose your rag at them. If you can do these two things you'll shine through

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By *lacksausageMan
over a year ago

Birmingham Airport

Never a truer word spoken. A thousand kisses to you, my friend.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So what have we learnt from this episode?

1) Never offer to meet or play with a Fab user out of pity.

2) Never lead someone on that you're going to meet them when you're probably not.

3) Never get ugly with someone with wtf messages if things don't work out as you'll only ever push them away by doing so.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So you told him you would meet him, even thou he isnt verified, then you seem to have cancelled it. Then you wonder why hes annoyed !!!!

She forgot to cancel

I would be annoyed.

Same here

Forgot to cancel but probably felt too powerful to say "sorry, I really want to meet you; how about next Halloween etc etc."

You need to read her reply earlier up. She says she did cancel, well before the meet. He was pissed off at no messages later to plan an alternative."
Finally someone who can read ... I think he was annoyed because it never got around to being 're arranged I can only meet on a weekend clearly says on profile and I have family who will always come first before me I know men have feelings too but he never even asked again just sends that message a couple weeks later when I have forgotten all about the cancelled meet I have feelings too and don't appreciate being made to feel guilty about a cancelled meet I had no choice but to cancel and say it again he had plenty of notice xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Most of the members here do not meet unverified member or members who can’t accommodate but that how this site seem to work in the end..

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Most of the members here do not meet unverified member or members who can’t accommodate but that how this site seem to work in the end..

"
this is why I wanted to help but never again he's spoilt it for genuine mice guys wanting a verification meet

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By *lacksausageMan
over a year ago

Birmingham Airport

"Most of the members here do not meet unverified member or members who can’t accommodate but that how this site seem to work in the end..

this is why I wanted to help but never again he's spoilt it for genuine mice guys wanting a verification meet "

How about the rat guys?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Rat?

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By *unandbuckCouple
over a year ago

Sheffield

"Rat?"

A joke about your typo 'the mice guys' ...

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Lol oh stupid predictive text it's new phone just getting used to it xx

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x"

You were going to fuck someone because you felt sorry for them!? Has a pity fuck ever resulted in good quality sex for the woman?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you"

I tried. Where does it say the meet was strictly social?

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By *esparate danMan
over a year ago

glasgow

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you"

It sounds like you regretted agreeing to meet him. And the reason you cancelled is also one people can give as an excuse because no-one is going to call them out on whether it actually happened.

I think sausage is right. Nobody should be so invested in a meet actually happening .. if you dont got the time dont do the crime

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By *anky_PankyWoman
over a year ago

Filthy Fuckeryville

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you"

You verify after fun too - in fairness you don't state social.

Think if I were you I'd ignore this thread if I were you OP as it's obviously winding you up.

As you said you wrote it in a rush, maybe next time wait til you can word it better and you won't get the same backlash

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Most of the members here do not meet unverified member or members who can’t accommodate but that how this site seem to work in the end..

this is why I wanted to help but never again he's spoilt it for genuine mice guys wanting a verification meet "
as above VERIFICATION MEET same as social imo not once said I was going to have fun with him and clearly states on my profile a social meet in a public place comes first not guaranteed a play

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you

You verify after fun too - in fairness you don't state social.

Think if I were you I'd ignore this thread if I were you OP as it's obviously winding you up.

As you said you wrote it in a rush, maybe next time wait til you can word it better and you won't get the same backlash

"
don't bother me the trolls on forum lol they entitled to an opinion xx but thanks xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just stick to sexy guys you already know

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Just stick to sexy guys you already know

"
oh defiantly xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Most of the members here do not meet unverified member or members who can’t accommodate but that how this site seem to work in the end..

this is why I wanted to help but never again he's spoilt it for genuine mice guys wanting a verification meet as above VERIFICATION MEET same as social imo not once said I was going to have fun with him and clearly states on my profile a social meet in a public place comes first not guaranteed a play "

Ive read through the whole thread. I think the difficulty here OP is the first message ( written in anger - we've all done it

) was a bit garbled and confusing, and info relevant to the original post is sporadically given throughout the thread. Thus people have given information based on an incorrect situation.

So I think it best to just ignore whats said, but avoid the pity party meets in the future. Im sure some of us have done things we regret. I have lol Move on, block and delete hun xx

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Thread wasn't done in anger xx was rushed lol made a few mistakes and learning by them future meets are now in clubs not got time for drama men thanks for advice hun xx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Thread wasn't done in anger xx was rushed lol made a few mistakes and learning by them future meets are now in clubs not got time for drama men thanks for advice hun xx "

Im the same hun - only meeting in clubs ( well only Eureka ) and also a very casual ... " well I'll see you there" type thing as half of them just dont turn up ! At least then Im still at the club having fun and laughter anyway whilst he's probs at home playing with himself !! Ha ha

Chin up chick - u close to Kent ? Xx

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By *uckandbunnyCouple
over a year ago

In your bed

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x"

You've said a couple of times that people need to read. The problem is that the above can be read in two different ways. Read literally it say.

I had family issue and had to cancel.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Suggesting you had to cancel but forgot.

A few more words would have cleared this up.

I had family issue and had to cancel, which I did before the meeting went ahead.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about or previous contact and had not spoken since cancelling until he messaged me tonight.

The difference in emphasis makes it clearer for the reader. If people have to read between the lines it's not that they can't read, it's that your style is open to interpretation.

On the wider issue, we give lots of advice but we would not meet someone unless we wanted to have fun with them. Certainly not a pity meet.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x

You've said a couple of times that people need to read. The problem is that the above can be read in two different ways. Read literally it say.

I had family issue and had to cancel.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Suggesting you had to cancel but forgot.

A few more words would have cleared this up.

I had family issue and had to cancel, which I did before the meeting went ahead.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about or previous contact and had not spoken since cancelling until he messaged me tonight.

The difference in emphasis makes it clearer for the reader. If people have to read between the lines it's not that they can't read, it's that your style is open to interpretation.

On the wider issue, we give lots of advice but we would not meet someone unless we wanted to have fun with them. Certainly not a pity meet.

This

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Thread wasn't done in anger xx was rushed lol made a few mistakes and learning by them future meets are now in clubs not got time for drama men thanks for advice hun xx

Chin up chick - u close to Kent ? Xx

"
don't think I'm close to Kent but I do travel so never know when I'm on a week off work could visit xx and agree totally with clubs xx

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Hope that makes more sense x

You've said a couple of times that people need to read. The problem is that the above can be read in two different ways. Read literally it say.

I had family issue and had to cancel.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about it till he messaged me tonight.

Suggesting you had to cancel but forgot.

A few more words would have cleared this up.

I had family issue and had to cancel, which I did before the meeting went ahead.

My time is very limited and I have a terrible memory so forgot about or previous contact and had not spoken since cancelling until he messaged me tonight.

The difference in emphasis makes it clearer for the reader. If people have to read between the lines it's not that they can't read, it's that your style is open to interpretation.

On the wider issue, we give lots of advice but we would not meet someone unless we wanted to have fun with them. Certainly not a pity meet.

If his response was as you have stated then put it down to a close call and be thankful you did not pity verify a bloke who would not have the maturity for a proper meet. His lack of a verification from you will mean some other ladies will escape meeting him too. "
Totally agree with you sorry I never was good at getting my point across in writing xx and good advice I'm keeping on board xx

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By *uckandbunnyCouple
over a year ago

In your bed

It's fine, I was not meaning to have a go, just trying to explain why some may have read what you posted and come to a different conclusion. There are loads of errors in my posts, but most of mine are mundane rumblings of my brain. But when having a rant about someone it's good to make sure you set out the situation clearly.

I still maintain he was bang out of order to be abusive, but you probably need to be cautious about wanting to help people who could easily take advantage. What if you had met and that personality came out to pressure you into something else.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you

You verify after fun too - in fairness you don't state social.

Think if I were you I'd ignore this thread if I were you OP as it's obviously winding you up.

As you said you wrote it in a rush, maybe next time wait til you can word it better and you won't get the same backlash

don't bother me the trolls on forum lol they entitled to an opinion xx but thanks xx"

Im not a troll (although feel free to think i am) but i did respond to your comment.

Your first messege makes it sound as if you forgot to let the guy know you were cancelling the meet.

Then people critisised you and you added to what you first put and it appeared you were trying to make yourself look better. To be honest it looked in some ways as if you were now altering the truth to make you look better. Many people post stuff on here that they think is great and then get a shock when others critisise them.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"It's fine, I was not meaning to have a go, just trying to explain why some may have read what you posted and come to a different conclusion. There are loads of errors in my posts, but most of mine are mundane rumblings of my brain. But when having a rant about someone it's good to make sure you set out the situation clearly.

"
I understand now and thanks for all help constructive criticism is always good I was never offended it's good to get straight values whether we like it or not it's good to be honest I am too soft for my own good and in future going to stick to my principles and not fall for any more sob stories xx

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Omg noooo social meet and fun meet 2 totally different things as I posted was to verify him not shag him but guess you never really read it all did you

You verify after fun too - in fairness you don't state social.

Think if I were you I'd ignore this thread if I were you OP as it's obviously winding you up.

As you said you wrote it in a rush, maybe next time wait til you can word it better and you won't get the same backlash

don't bother me the trolls on forum lol they entitled to an opinion xx but thanks xx

Im not a troll (although feel free to think i am) but i did respond to your comment.

Your first messege makes it sound as if you forgot to let the guy know you were cancelling the meet.

spot on ty I will take time to get it right in future xx

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By *lighty1Woman
over a year ago

You Dont Need to Know, right now

Chin up, OP! You tried to do a good thing, and ended up with a man who doesn't know when he's on to a good thing.

I've done the same - met a man socially for coffee or a drink, just so I could get him started with his first verification. Most have gone well, and I've been able to verify "met socially, he turned up on time, smartly dressed and polite and smelled nice". One or two were pushy, trying to turn a social-meet into a play-meet, so no verifications for them!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can't believe someone would be so rude and ungreatful when you was trying to help them out. I wish a lady would have done the same thing for me.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Chin up, OP! You tried to do a good thing, and ended up with a man who doesn't know when he's on to a good thing.

some spoil it for others x

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By *entleman JayMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

As someone who has been bailed on countless times and actually stood up too I would be annoyed.

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By *entleman JayMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

"So what have we learnt from this episode?

1) Never offer to meet or play with a Fab user out of pity.

2) Never lead someone on that you're going to meet them when you're probably not.

3) Never get ugly with someone with wtf messages if things don't work out as you'll only ever push them away by doing so.

Here ends today's FAB sermon of the day. Well said.

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By *entleman JayMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

I've read a bit more and you did cancel so he should have taken it on the chin and moved on.

The thing is that guys get messed about a lot on here by couples and supposedly single women. I know all two well. My personal record for being bailed on in a single week is four times. It's not nice and if you are not careful can start to wind you up, annoy and even upset you. Maybe this guy thought "here I go again" another bailer and snapped.

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By *oodnitegirlWoman
over a year ago

Yorkshire

Op. I have met you and know youre the sweetest lady on earth... i am sorry that this happened to you. It sounds like he was disappointed/frustrated to be forgotten about. Its easily done with a single female profile. I do the same (forgot who ive agreed to arrange a meet with) half the time. Youll have to start writing them in your diary lol

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