FabSwingers.com forum: Farage or Boris

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

As a remain voter I am confused with the current rift between Boris and Farage as I thought they were both on the same side and that Brexit means Brexit and we should leave ASAP ?? Can any leave voters explain why they are not in agreement and who they agree with?

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By *ammskiMan
over a year ago

lytham st.annes

Why does it upset you?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?"

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Quite simple really. They are politicians. A democratic vote was taken 3 years ago or so and then Politicians got involved and it became all about politics and less and less about democracy. Pretty obvious really.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Quite simple really. They are politicians. A democratic vote was taken 3 years ago or so and then Politicians got involved and it became all about politics and less and less about democracy. Pretty obvious really."

Is it? So tell me? Who do you agree with? Boris or Farage?

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

leave means leave to boris means leaving with some sort of deal as boris is only backing leave as it finally got him into number 10 he knew it would.leave means leave to farrage is walk away with no deal and pay no divorce settlement.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"leave means leave to boris means leaving with some sort of deal as boris is only backing leave as it finally got him into number 10 he knew it would.leave means leave to farrage is walk away with no deal and pay no divorce settlement."

Who do the leave voters agree with?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? "
.

Sometimes leaving means not leaving, imagine leaving your wife but not actually doing anything any different except she changes back to her maiden name, you go in the pub and tell everybody you've finally had enough and left the old bag.

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

Who do the leave voters agree with? "

not having voted i cant say what leavers or remainers actuall agree with but id guess leavers would go with farrage it wasnt just torie votes he was hoovering up plenty in northern labour areas were liking what he was saying.he was a pain in the arse for both main parties.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??"
.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is it? So tell me? Who do you agree with? Boris or Farage? "

I personally do not agree with anything that is going on now tbh. But if I have to make a choice then leave with a deal.

I personally think there should be a second preference referendum but the politicians do not seem to think the electorate is intelligent enough for that so the battle will continue Ad infinitum.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ?

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"As a remain voter I am confused with the current rift between Boris and Farage as I thought they were both on the same side and that Brexit means Brexit and we should leave ASAP ?? Can any leave voters explain why they are not in agreement and who they agree with? "

For the same reason that all the 'remain' parties, or parties at least supporting a second referendum, cannot agree with each other.

If they could, we would have had a GE by now.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Is it? So tell me? Who do you agree with? Boris or Farage?

I personally do not agree with anything that is going on now tbh. But if I have to make a choice then leave with a deal.

I personally think there should be a second preference referendum but the politicians do not seem to think the electorate is intelligent enough for that so the battle will continue Ad infinitum. "

I agree. The fact that the two most influential leave campaigners can’t agree on Brexit does suggest that the 17.4 million who voted leave might also have different reasons for voting to leave ?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

For the same reason that all the 'remain' parties, or parties at least supporting a second referendum, cannot agree with each other.

If they could, we would have had a GE by now."

We aren’t taking about remain. We are talking about Boris and Farage? Did you vote to leave ? If so , who do you agree with?

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

It matters not who is PM in this country. Parliament is sovereign, not the PM.

So whether Farage or Johnson is PM, it is Parliament they must persuade of their great unmatched wisdom.

Johnson has failed spectacularly to do so - his reputation for dishonesty preceded him - and I suspect the Farage effect would be even more abrasive.

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ? "

thats easy boris is the better deal for you as if farrage was p.m with a majority it would be leave without a deal

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ?

thats easy boris is the better deal for you as if farrage was p.m with a majority it would be leave without a deal"

Luckily Farage will never be the PM, however a large percentage of the people who voted leave agree with him?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh yes.........

To put flesh on the bones if there was a second preference referendum my vote would be to vote for this crappy deal and try and make something of it because I'm not keen on where EU is heading and would honour the result of the first referendum, 2nd preference would be to remain because going out without some sort of deal is economic suicide and will require an economic reboot which at my age would seem to be a bit silly. There you go. A perfectly reasoned argument.

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ?

thats easy boris is the better deal for you as if farrage was p.m with a majority it would be leave without a deal

Luckily Farage will never be the PM, however a large percentage of the people who voted leave agree with

him? "

yep a large percentage do agree with him so i wouldnt be surprised if they take some seats grom the torys and labour.out of all this i thinnk labour will suffer more than the torys.can see labour losing to the lib dems as well the torys not so much

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ?

thats easy boris is the better deal for you as if farrage was p.m with a majority it would be leave without a deal

Luckily Farage will never be the PM, however a large percentage of the people who voted leave agree with

him?

True. But if we leave the EU before a GE then the Brexit Party and Farage are finished??

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

if we leave before a GE Thats not looking likley though is it.only thing that is certain is one half of the country is gonna be pissed off.who that will be who knows

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"if we leave before a GE Thats not looking likley though is it.only thing that is certain is one half of the country is gonna be pissed off.who that will be who knows"

At this rate it will be more like 70% of the country will be pissed off

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

If i was a leaver I'd agree with Farage, otherwise we'd be the divorced man whose ex wife won't let him date anyone.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

Spot on.

I don't how understand how Johnson claims to speak for the people against the "nasty remainer parliament", claims to want a deal and to avoid no deal.

But his deal would pass if he attached a conformational public vote to it. I wonder why we wont, its almost as if he knows public opinion has changed...

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

But couldn't a similar accusation be pointed at Corbyn? - after 2 years of calling for a GE, he refused as it would not benefit Labour.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

But couldn't a similar accusation be pointed at Corbyn? - after 2 years of calling for a GE, he refused as it would not benefit Labour."

This is about Farage and Boris not Corbyn. Who do you agree with

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

But couldn't a similar accusation be pointed at Corbyn? - after 2 years of calling for a GE, he refused as it would not benefit Labour."

Very true. They're all in it for themselves.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

But couldn't a similar accusation be pointed at Corbyn? - after 2 years of calling for a GE, he refused as it would not benefit Labour."

Most rational people could see through what Johnson was trying to do.

Most rational people concluded that getting No Deal off the table was more important than kissing some babies for a few weeks.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused "

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This post reminds me how radioactively partisan this whole issue is.

We can probably all agree the Withdrawal Agreement is the biggest constitutional change in the UK for generations.

Last month, we had a PM who thought little of closing down Parliament for 5 weeks.

This week, he wants to rush through the legislation in the space of 3 days.

Three days for legislators to scrutinise the laws required to enact the biggest constitutional change for generations.

Why?

Because if the Conservative Party has to go to the polls after trying and failing to leave the EU on 3 separate dates, Johnson knows it will be eaten alive by Farage and co.

So never mind doing what is right for the country and getting the law right, do what's right for keeping the Conservative Party in power.

Mind-blowing.

"
.

95% of the 500 pages are exactly the same as maybots deal which has been open to scrutiny for over 12 months, that leaves 25 pages that need scrutiny over 3 days.

This argument is of course a load of bollocks as we all know this is about overturning a Democratic decision.

Just say what the liberals are saying, at least we know there honest.

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal. "

Nope we don't. We had a no deal-remain referendum and no deal won that didn't they. What we actually need is a 3 way 2nd preference vote with remain, best UE-government backed deal and no deal. Why can't people see that. I just makes me weep that people cannot see this as only way to heal the country. So until someone with any intelligence suggest this we are all totally fucked for ever more.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

Four way surely?.

I mean what type of remain are you talking about!.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Are we talking remain remain, remain and integrate more or remain and integrate less?.

That's a five way referendum vote

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

The 2016 vote was respected by the years of negotiation. Because of how different the realty is from what was promised before the 2016 vote. Whatever the result of that negotiation (thd deal or no deal) should be put up against remain as a confirmationary vote. This time an actual legal vote not an advisory one, with the protections that gives to ensure there is no foul play.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal. "
.

It makes perfect sense if your objective is to overturn a perfectly legal democratic vote.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal. "

So why did the leaders of the 2 leave campaigns and the ERG all vote against Theresa Mays deal, which would have seen us leave the EU?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal.

So why did the leaders of the 2 leave campaigns and the ERG all vote against Theresa Mays deal, which would have seen us leave the EU?"
.

Probably for the same reason Corbyn and the whole of the labour bar about 6 did, it was shit.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

95% of the 500 pages are exactly the same as maybots deal which has been open to scrutiny for over 12 months, that leaves 25 pages that need scrutiny over 3 days.

This argument is of course a load of bollocks as we all know this is about overturning a Democratic decision.

Just say what the liberals are saying, at least we know there honest."

Okay.

The details are spilling out now.

We know already that UK business faces a bill of between £8 bn (Con estimate) and £15bn (Lab estimate) for UK/EU border trade after the exit date.

MPs are now asking about the bill faced by businesses that do GB/Northern Ireland transactions.

Businesses in NI that sell to the UK will need to fill out a new set of forms with HMRC, and vice versa.

How much will this cost business?

No-one has worked it out yet.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You either leave or you remain.

Everything else is just a load of bollocks, orderly transitions to leave do not require you to stay forever in various EU institutions.

It's exactly the same as to remain you don't have to, leave bits to remain, you just remain

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

95% of the 500 pages are exactly the same as maybots deal which has been open to scrutiny for over 12 months, that leaves 25 pages that need scrutiny over 3 days.

This argument is of course a load of bollocks as we all know this is about overturning a Democratic decision.

Just say what the liberals are saying, at least we know there honest.

Okay.

The details are spilling out now.

We know already that UK business faces a bill of between £8 bn (Con estimate) and £15bn (Lab estimate) for UK/EU border trade after the exit date.

MPs are now asking about the bill faced by businesses that do GB/Northern Ireland transactions.

Businesses in NI that sell to the UK will need to fill out a new set of forms with HMRC, and vice versa.

How much will this cost business?

No-one has worked it out yet.

"
.

Shit your kidding, well fair dos just call it all off

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal.

So why did the leaders of the 2 leave campaigns and the ERG all vote against Theresa Mays deal, which would have seen us leave the EU?.

Probably for the same reason Corbyn and the whole of the labour bar about 6 did, it was shit."

So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Are we talking remain remain, remain and integrate more or remain and integrate less?.

That's a five way referendum vote"

This is politics and not democracy. A cross party thing like Brexit was always going to be exploited by the politicians. They know it and feed off it like a voracious animal.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

"
.

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

There is no middle ground, if the deal was were leaving but it will take ten years to do it, that's reasonable and honest, saying we need to stay in various bits forever is not leaving and being dishonest.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? "

It's really quite simple:

As the rhetoric of the brexit camp and their claims that the warnings of the remain camp were 'project fear' become history and the cost of no longer being in the EU become the everyday reality of life the architects and engineers of brexit are scrambling to abrogate their responsibility and find scapegoats blame.

After all, if only we had believed and parliament had just nodded everything through, and the people had given Mrs May a landslide victory in 17 and the 65% of the country that didn't vote for brexit had all fully respected the 35% that made up the 52% of the votes cast for brexit then there would be no need for Farage to be looking to distance himself from the brexit reality because we would be living in the 'green uplands of a post EU nirvana.

Yea right!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever"

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote"

That's because it was a Binary vote and as such flawed. Again politicians exploited the outcome. The only ones benefiting from this shit fest are the 650 so called representatives of this nation. Our politicians are exploiting our weakness to the full. They are making a good living out of it and are happy for it to continue as long as they possible can. They have at least until 2022 to keep their noses in the trough.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

Four way surely?.

I mean what type of remain are you talking about!."

There is only one type of remain.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Brexit will be an issue for a generation.It will influence the way people vote for decades.The politicians will make good use of this .This is just the beginning.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever"

Again, my sandwich analogy:

“Would you like a tasty sandwich?”

“Yes please”

“Here is a dog shit and pickle sandwich”

“But you promised it would be tasty!?”

“Here it is. You wanted it you have to eat it now”

“On balance I’d prefer to go hungry, thanks”

“EAT IT! WILL OF THE PEOPLE. BLUE PASSPORTS!”

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Hot potato! Hot potato!

Pass it on! Pass it on!

don't forget May was nicknamed the submarine for a very good reason. Bet she is sitting on the back benches pissing herself with laughter while watching Boris's good ship Johnson getting hammered by the heaviest of Westminster storms and waiting for the perfect moment to sink de Pfeffel.

Ah the joy of watching the Tories drown in the sea shit they have produced over the last 9 years.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point "

No they haven't got to have an election. They can keep this going for another 3 years if they want. It's stalemate and they all know it. We just have to sit and watch the 650 pigs gobble at the trough and get as many truffles down their neck as they can and Hey Northern Ireland politicians don't even have to go to their trough, they just boycott it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

I'm sorry but I missed it again.

How are they benefiting?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Boris and Farage were at one point both in the same position where they could shout from the sidelines bitching about decisions being made by people in power while having no power or any need for accountability for themselves.

Now Boris has become one of those people in power with accountability and he's quickly learning that he now has to back up what he says and conform to the Law and he now knows if he was to engineer a no deal Brexit then all consequences afterwards rests on his shoulders, unlike that weasel Farage.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Boris and Farage were at one point both in the same position where they could shout from the sidelines bitching about decisions being made by people in power while having no power or any need for accountability for themselves.

Yes, brexit falls apart as soon as you say what you think it is.

Which is why we had two years of "brexit means brexit" from Theresa May, and why Boris is doing everything he can to get MPs to vote quickly before he has to give full details.

Sadly this fiction of "define your own brexit" obviously appeared to be more attractive at the polls in 2016, people expecting this to be delivered are going to be disappointed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There's supposed to be a majority of leavers in the UK.

Yet not one of them can actually say WHY leaving is a good thing.

I've heard then say, 52 is more than 48, will of the people and all those sound bites.

But if it's a good thing surely it's easy to say why?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes, brexit falls apart as soon as you say what you think it is.

Which is why we had two years of "brexit means brexit" from Theresa May, and why Boris is doing everything he can to get MPs to vote quickly before he has to give full details.

Sadly this fiction of "define your own brexit" obviously appeared to be more attractive at the polls in 2016, people expecting this to be delivered are going to be disappointed."

The problem is the 2016 referendum was backed up from both sides of the campaign by lots and lots of rhetoric like any vote or election is.

The official Leave campaign was saying we'd have a close trading relationship with the EU, was promising we'd get a better deal than we have as being a member, that we held all the cards, the German automotive industry would instruct Merkel to give us everything we wanted etc so that rhetoric has to be taken into account as to why people voted for Brexit.

Now leavers have come to realise all that they were promised was bullshit, just as remainers had been saying since before the referendum, Brexit now doesn't mean any of that what they voted for and now they say they voted for no deal which wasn't promised or even probably talked about.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

I'm sorry but I missed it again.

How are they benefiting?"

They get paid lots of money with perks . I can't see what your point is tbh either.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"There's supposed to be a majority of leavers in the UK.

Yet not one of them can actually say WHY leaving is a good thing.

I've heard then say, 52 is more than 48, will of the people and all those sound bites.

But if it's a good thing surely it's easy to say why? "

Stop repeating the giant brexit narrative lie!

In a country with a population of 65.38 million (2016 number) 17,410,742 is NOT 52%, in fact it is about half that! Even removing those ineligible to vote from the top line figures barely a third of the population voted to leave and none of them knew what sort of brexit they were voting for. and anyone who says different is a barefaced liar!

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

A genius move by whom??

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

A genius move by whom?? "

By ‘them’. You know. ‘Them’. The ones that want to do ‘it’. You know what ‘it’ is, right?

-Matt

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

6% isn't really that much, we can easily handle that is the 'on message' message of the government and BoE. One little thing missing from the above: 6% is not some absolute, its the ANNUAL loss, so the real message is 6% per annum. So how do you feel about a 6% annually compounded loss of growth for the next 50 years?

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight."

Sorry not sorry, but seeing you capitalists getting all panicy over money, never fails to bring a smile to my lefty lips! Don't worry, your Tory friends won't abandon you, I'm sure it's all part of the plan.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight."
May I remimd you that the EU economy is stagnant,Germany is about to go onto recession and by comparison we are booming

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight.

Your anti capitalist.?.Well I never comrade and you hate Corbyn??

I’d vote green if i was you they’re left of Labour..

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

"May I remimd you that the EU economy is stagnant,Germany is about to go onto recession and by comparison we are booming"

The UK economy contracted last quarter.

Next set of figures out beginning of November.

Another contraction and the UK is in recession.

The only glimmer of light may be stockpiling for Brexit.

I'd be wary about gloating at the neighbours.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight.

Your anti capitalist.?.Well I never comrade and you hate Corbyn??

I’d vote green if i was you they’re left of Labour..

Id vote for Corbyn again to be fair.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id vote for Corbyn again to be fair. "

I'd vote for Corbyn, on Strictly, if I watched it, if he was on it

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"Brexit chaos! Causing fear! To push us into ever closer ties with Europe.... A genius move.

LoL!

Give me a break, and stop with all this bullshit!

We are getting exactly the opposite!

Let me give you a little example:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

We are being fed the modern equivalent of 'Keep Calm and Carry On' and being told its 'project fear'.

Time to remove your heads from the sand folks and wake up to the bits of the messages that are hiding in plain sight."

6% is not the annual loss. It's the total loss compared to the total relevant calculated gain between 2016 and 2030 were we to remain in the EU. (Source - "The economic impact of Brexit, by the LSE, which refers to reports and forecasts by the BoE, OECD, IMF and Treasury).

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

To put into context for you, a 6% fall in expected GDP per annum to 2030 would mean that we will be in permanent recession for the next 11 years, having been in recession since 2016, with the loss of about 1.5 to 2 Million jobs per year. So by 2030 our GDP will be about 20% of existing levels, with about 8 to 12 Million people in employment to support a population of 70 Million.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"6% is not the annual loss. It's the total loss compared to the total relevant calculated gain between 2016 and 2030 were we to remain in the EU. (Source - "The economic impact of Brexit, by the LSE, which refers to reports and forecasts by the BoE, OECD, IMF and Treasury).

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

Ah, thank you for correcting my statement that:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

and pointing out that:

There we have it then, nothing to worry about the BoE have said we will loose 6% of our growth relative to what we would have had over 14 years. As soon as it is 2030 the economy no longer falls any further behind due to market access restriction and we can all ignore the fact that JRM and the Tories are publicly admitting it will 50 years to get back to where we were pre the referendum.

Looks to me on examination of the above that you are saying I'm wrong and then sighting a time limited study that says exactly what I said, while ignoring the fact that there is nothing to suggest that come 2030 things will change, therefore supporting my original proposition.

You must be one of these secret remainers planted to make brexiteers look like a bunch of knuckle dragging imbeciles who cant tell the difference between their arses and elbows.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

Ah, thank you for correcting my statement that:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

and pointing out that:

You must be one of these secret remainers planted to make brexiteers look like a bunch of knuckle dragging imbeciles who cant tell the difference between their arses and elbows.

You voted leave...

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By *ky19Man
over a year ago

Plymouth

Out of the two, I want to vote leave so would vote Brexit every time over Boris, especially since the only other choices are UKIP or... bnp, and I'm not voting for the bnp this time*.

*that was a joke.

If you wanted to remain, imo the best choice would be to vote Boris and the Conservatives so they can get a majority and get the result overturned.

I would have voted for Corbyn before this brexit thing but now he's a waste of a remain vote imo. An ardent leaver who's been assimilated into a remainer too easily, like flotsam on a wave. Is he really someone who will stand strong?

As for Jo, well maybe her husband's company funding can be investigated to see how much is from the EU. If so, I don't think she declared it as an interest. But as we know, the news is picked and chosen for us so that's not focused on.

Most leave voters are probably fooled by the blustering Boris portrayal and will be taking it at face value. If things go to plan (and they don't always, check out the referendum result!) he will hoover up the 'leave' vote, thus depriving actual leaving parties.

He's being sold as the "*splutter* people's person being foiled by those dastardly remainers" and I won't lie, he's not that bad an actor.

I will say to leave voters to consider all is not as it appears, lest you all be on here furious in 12-18 months.

If Boris gets a majority leaving is oooooover.

Vote Boris to undo brexit and remain instead.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"You voted leave..."

I did, and as I keep saying I voted leave in order to destroy the Tories.

Seems to be working.

Maybe I am one of the few who will actually get the brexit I voted for. But then I did not believe a single word any of the swivel eyed nationalists said and was voting to destroy the hard right neo-liberal bullshit that was spawned by the unregulated economic model that is the Thatcher-ism and the Reaganomic trickle-down lie.

Now what did you vote leave for?

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

Ah, thank you for correcting my statement that:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

and pointing out that:

You must be one of these secret remainers planted to make brexiteers look like a bunch of knuckle dragging imbeciles who cant tell the difference between their arses and elbows.

To further clarify for you, this equates to about a 0.4% loss in GDP per annum against what was previously forecast.

So, 15 times less than you at first said.

But still forecasting a rise in GDP of about 2% per annum... Or about £600 per capita per annum.

Not one Brexit forecast said that GDP will shrink compared to where we were at the time of the referendum.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"You voted leave...

I did, and as I keep saying I voted leave in order to destroy the Tories.

Seems to be working.

Now what did you vote leave for?"

I voted remain, keep up.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"I voted remain, keep up. "

Sorry, so used to brexiteers using that line on me I naturally assume anyone who does after I have explained my reasoning so may times is a brexiteer with a selective memory. I will not make that mistake again.

Further I will thank you for giving me an opportunity to remind everyone that so far I seem to be the only person here who voted out and is not having to pretend that I knew that I was voting for this rabid right Tory brexit de Pfeffel, JRM and co are attempting to force on the country.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

Ah, thank you for correcting my statement that:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

and pointing out that:

You must be one of these secret remainers planted to make brexiteers look like a bunch of knuckle dragging imbeciles who cant tell the difference between their arses and elbows.

To further clarify for you, this equates to about a 0.4% loss in GDP per annum against what was previously forecast.

So, 15 times less than you at first said.

But still forecasting a rise in GDP of about 2% per annum... Or about £600 per capita per annum.

Not one Brexit forecast said that GDP will shrink compared to where we were at the time of the referendum.

Your like a dog with a bone with your new "fact" of the day

The economic modelling is relative to a baseline.

Every model (apart from the one where we reduce all tariffs to zero and screw every industry) indicates a drop in GDP.

We will be poorer than we would be. Inflation also rises due to the devaluation of the pound and tariff rises so we are doubly poorer.

If the baseline GDP growth is zero or negative as it will be in the the next, now overdue, recession we will be shrinking at a bigger rate than it would have done, especially as our domestic market will have shrunk from the EU to just the UK.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

"I voted remain, keep up.

You are the only person i have heard give a coherently valid reason for voting leave. I feel the level of collateral damage may be excessive, but i can sympathise with the aim of fucking over the Tories.

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"It is important to stress that this means lower GDP than would otherwise be the case, not

an actual fall in prosperity: if, for example, the UK maintained its trend growth rate up to

2030, the economy would be some 30% larger, and the ‘losses’ envisaged are relative to

that projection. A loss of 6% would, therefore, mean 24% growth instead of 30%"

Ah, thank you for correcting my statement that:

The economy will grow by approximately 6% less than if we stay in the EU...

and pointing out that:

You must be one of these secret remainers planted to make brexiteers look like a bunch of knuckle dragging imbeciles who cant tell the difference between their arses and elbows.

To further clarify for you, this equates to about a 0.4% loss in GDP per annum against what was previously forecast.

So, 15 times less than you at first said.

But still forecasting a rise in GDP of about 2% per annum... Or about £600 per capita per annum.

Not one Brexit forecast said that GDP will shrink compared to where we were at the time of the referendum.

Your like a dog with a bone with your new "fact" of the day

The economic modelling is relative to a baseline.

Every model (apart from the one where we reduce all tariffs to zero and screw every industry) indicates a drop in GDP.

We will be poorer than we would be. Inflation also rises due to the devaluation of the pound and tariff rises so we are doubly poorer.

Please quote the sources and forecasts that say our GDP will be less in 2030 than it is now.

They actually say that GDP will be 24% higher than at the time of the referendum.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Neither is honest and working for the people. They are both self-interested parasites with Brexit as their core area to be able to sustain their futures. Very similar and competitive

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Neither is honest and working for the people. They are both self-interested parasites with Brexit as their core area to be able to sustain their futures. Very similar and competitive "

Yes but the OP is asking which one you prefer LOL. Sorry couldn't resist it.

It's a Trap "Admiral Ackbar"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The only thing Farage wants to do is stick it to the EU and does not care about what happens after it’s a personal vendetta for him.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Neither is honest and working for the people. They are both self-interested parasites with Brexit as their core area to be able to sustain their futures. Very similar and competitive "

I don't believe Boris really believes in Brexit at all. He believes in feathering his own nest anyway he can.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Neither is honest and working for the people. They are both self-interested parasites with Brexit as their core area to be able to sustain their futures. Very similar and competitive

I don't believe Boris really believes in Brexit at all. He believes in feathering his own nest anyway he can. "

I agree. He has used Brexit to get the PM job and people have fallen for his bullshit every time . Now he has to make difficult and accountable decisions he will be found out

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ken Clarke saying it how it is .

“Will my right honourable friend get over his disappointment and accept that 31 October [the current deadlie for Brexit] is now Halloween.”

"It is devoid of any symbolic or political content and will fade away into historical memory very rapidly."

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

But didn't it used to mean to Fararge leave like Norway because they're rich, happy and successful? Does Fararge not want us all to rich, happy and successful like Norway any more?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Why does it upset you?

It doesn’t, it is just confusing? I thought Brexit means Brexit, leave means leave? I just don’t know who to believe ? Are you capable of answering the question for me ? .

That's how some leavers plus most remainers wanna do it.

Then there's some who want to actually leave and endure hardship on the HOPE life will be better.

That's the leavers leave.

Then there's a bunch of cucks who like taking it up the arse by the old bag, there called liberals

I see. Nobody has been able help me though. What version of Brexit is better? Farage or Boris??.

Dunno, depends if you want to live in hope or happy with the same old shit and taking it up the arse.

I would like the best deal for Britain and the best deal for my children ? Can any leave voter tell me which is the better deal? Boris or Farage ?

thats easy boris is the better deal for you as if farrage was p.m with a majority it would be leave without a deal

Luckily Farage will never be the PM, however a large percentage of the people who voted leave agree with him? "

That also means that unless more than 95% of those that voted Leave agree on one type of Leave then any specific type of Leave has less than 48% support amongst those that voted; leaving Remain having the highest vote share between Leave with 'no deal', Leave with a deal or Remain.

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"The point is "brexit" doesn't mean anything.

Boris Johnson's version of Brexit will become increasingly unpopular the more details he is forced to reveal.

Nigel can just keep shouting "brexit means brexit" from the sidelines and brexiteers lap it up, taking it yo mean whatever they think it does.

Thereasa May was popular with brexiteers when she was saying "brexit means brexit", until she had to write her deal down then everyone turned against her.

Surely this proves there is no majority for any definition of Brexit

Spot on. If the 2 most influential leave campaigners support 2 very different versions of Brexit then the 17.4 million who voted to leave must be very confused

Absolutely. This is why we need another vote. Deal or no deal.

That doesn't make sense. You can't split the leave vote. Leave was the result. You can only now ask how we should leave. Deal or no deal. "

So what you're saying is that, despite Remain having 48% of the vote the choice should be between the other two options (Leave with 'no deal' and Leave with a deal) even though, unless one of those options has more than 95% amongst Leave voters, both options have less than 48% support. How is that democratic?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

I'm sorry but I missed it again.

How are they benefiting?

They get paid lots of money with perks . I can't see what your point is tbh either."

But they get paid the same amount of money whether they agree to BREXIT, agree to Remain, or continue to disagree. So I to would like to know how you think they are all benefiting from this?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

I'm sorry but I missed it again.

How are they benefiting?

They get paid lots of money with perks . I can't see what your point is tbh either.

But they get paid the same amount of money whether they agree to BREXIT, agree to Remain, or continue to disagree. So I to would like to know how you think they are all benefiting from this?

They love the drama and attention their getting. They love standing up like preening peacocks and making grandstand speeches that they hope everyone is listening too with baited breath. Most of the time everyone just ignores them LOL.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You voted leave...

I did, and as I keep saying I voted leave in order to destroy the Tories.

Seems to be working.

Now what did you vote leave for?"
.

So your sacrificing GDP for a desired outcome in the future, I think your no different than everybody else to be honest

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"So your sacrificing GDP for a desired outcome in the future, I think your no different than everybody else to be honest

I disagree (but then I would).

I would characterise the situation as being more akin to throwing crabs into boiling water or slowly increasing the heat of the water so they are unaware of being cooked alive. Both methods produce the same end, cooked crab, but with method 1 some crabs escape if the cook is not quick with the pot lid.

We are the crabs and the Tories the cook.

You like the comfort of being slow cooked, I prefer the shock of boiling water, the chance of escape and the outside chance of tipping the boiling water over the cook.

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"So you agree there are versions of Brexit which "are shit", your words.

Do you still include the votes in 2016 for versions of Brexit that you disagree with? Even though they all mean "leaving the EU". Do you take them off the 17.4 million.

How can you still include votes in 2016 making up the 17.4 million for the versions of Brexit you see as shit?

Can you see how you wouldn't have a majority over remain for any one option?

No because your obsessed with versions.

There's one option to leave and one option to remain.

Why not just be honest and say we can NEVER LEAVE these bits of the EU.

There permanent and forever

Can you name the brexiteer who advised the voters before the referendum that we would end up in the situation we are now?

All I remember was being told, "all positives no negatives", "We will hold all the cards", "legally the EU have yo do a deal with us", "£350 a week to save the NHS" etc, etc, etc.

I'm just looking for the name/names from the various leave sides who have been proven correct from what they said before the vote

Since the brexit vote in 2016 the Mps have already faced an election once, and look so to do again in the next few months.

They have to vote themselves to do this under the fixed term parliament act.

How exactly are they benefiting, I don't follow your point

I'm sorry but I missed it again.

How are they benefiting?

They get paid lots of money with perks . I can't see what your point is tbh either.

But they get paid the same amount of money whether they agree to BREXIT, agree to Remain, or continue to disagree. So I to would like to know how you think they are all benefiting from this?

I'm not sure that all 650 do actually love the drama or the attention they're getting, maybe some but not all. And if that is the so called benefit they're hoping to get from all this then I have to say it's been a terrible failure for most. I mean if most people could name 50 out of the 650 MPs in the House of Commons I'd be pretty surprised. So if that is they're reason then about 600 of them aren't doing it very well, are they?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"So your sacrificing GDP for a desired outcome in the future, I think your no different than everybody else to be honest

I disagree (but then I would).

We are the crabs and the Tories the cook.

You like the comfort of being slow cooked, I prefer the shock of boiling water, the chance of escape and the outside chance of tipping the boiling water over the cook."

Well you already know what I think about your version of disaster socialism. The prize just isn't worth the price. But even if this whole BREXIT fiasco does cause the demise of the Conservative Party, and I can't see how eventually, especially if we get a 'no deal' BREXIT it won't, that doesn't really solve your problem with right of centre liberal economic policies. It will just change the party that supports it. It may end up being the LibDems, a reformed, slightly righter Liberal Party, or a National Party like in New Zealand, or even after BREXIT a regrouping of the current BREXIT Party and the Conservatives. You're not going to kill off the idea of liberal economics just by killing the Conservative Party. Ideas simply don't die that easily and especially so when some of the most successful economies in the world over the last 100 years will still be there as an example for everyone to see.

In my opinion things never work out well when people vote for something they don't really want because they think it will damage something they don't really like. Far better to vote for what you do actually want.

All that being said, you are the only person on here who has been able to say exactly why they voted BREXIT, what they hoped to achieve by voting BREXIT and, quite possibly, one of the only people who may actually get the end result you hoped for. I just wondered if when all the dust has settled you will still think the prize was worth the price.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Well you already know what I think about your version of disaster socialism. The prize just isn't worth the price. But even if this whole BREXIT fiasco does cause the demise of the Conservative Party, and I can't see how eventually, especially if we get a 'no deal' BREXIT it won't, that doesn't really solve your problem with right of centre liberal economic policies. It will just change the party that supports it. It may end up being the LibDems, a reformed, slightly righter Liberal Party, or a National Party like in New Zealand, or even after BREXIT a regrouping of the current BREXIT Party and the Conservatives. You're not going to kill off the idea of liberal economics just by killing the Conservative Party. Ideas simply don't die that easily and especially so when some of the most successful economies in the world over the last 100 years will still be there as an example for everyone to see.

I fully understand and to a certain extent sympathise with your position. In fact although I profoundly disagree with you I will fight to my last breath for your right to hold and express your views.

But I am constantly reminded that you and many here are the epitome of an attitude I despise with a vengeance. You are Tommy Tory, you are the embodiment of Middle English conservatism (small C)...

You get up in the morning take a deep breath of clean air, wash with soaps you know are safe, go to the kitchen and read, watch or listen to the morning news tutting at the disruption to your daily commute that those leftee tree huggers of Extinction Rebellion will cause while you you drink your tea and eat your eggs and bacon that are only safe because of the regulations that leftee tree huggers campaigned for.

You drive to work in a safe car and spend your day working in a safe environment while moaning about meddling regulations disrupting your ability to make more money, when your car and working environment are the result of years of struggle by 'meddling do gooders'!

You believe that commie unions are a scourge, have done nothing but harm and should be banned. As you enjoy your 8 hour day, 5 day week, paid holidays and safe work place, paid for in blood by the membership of commie unions.

You were educated in a state school, your children are educated in a state school. When you're ill you use the NHS when you're you expect to retire and be able to live on your pension. But you are a self-reliant, self made conservative who'll have no truck with any of this lefty commie crap!

You are Tory through and through. You want small government, you get nothing from big government but taxes. The sooner all these lefties are made stand on their own feet just as you do the better!

...

Yea right

...

You may very well be right about me and my lefty politics, and I may not be fully right about you. But I bet I'm not too far of the mark for many here.

At least know which political side of the political spectrum has my best interests at heart, and it is not the right, and certainly not the Tories who have fight against all social progress!

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By *avagliamMan
over a year ago

London

The question can be rephrased as: Do you prefer being stabbed in your lower or upper back?... I obviously prefer none.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

I fully understand and to a certain extent sympathise with your position. In fact although I profoundly disagree with you I will fight to my last breath for your right to hold and express your views.

But I am constantly reminded that you and many here are the epitome of an attitude I despise with a vengeance. You are Tommy Tory, you are the embodiment of Middle English conservatism (small C)...

You are Tory through and through. You want small government, you get nothing from big government but taxes. The sooner all these lefties are made stand on their own feet just as you do the better!

...

Yea right

...

You may very well be right about me and my lefty politics, and I may not be fully right about you. But I bet I'm not too far of the mark for many here.

At least know which political side of the political spectrum has my best interests at heart, and it is not the right, and certainly not the Tories who have fight against all social progress!"

We've forgotten. In fact, those of us around now never knew.

Some people have found a first world problem of being annoyed about having to make some compromises to be a member of one of the world's most comfortable groupings to "die in a ditch over".

However, the same group of people scorn climate change as "debatable".

Nuts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If i was a leaver I'd agree with Farage, otherwise we'd be the divorced man whose ex wife won't let him date anyone. "

Not when she doesn’t want the kids to be around anyone he’s going to be with

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