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"His lack of leadership has left a dirty stain on the party. Whether some of it is exaggerated or not is irrelevant - it's the perception that counts in politics. The only way to remove the stain is to do something radical - e.g. a zero-tolerance approach backed up by something independent and something that gets the endorsement of Jewish groups. I do not believe he is anti-semitic himself - just foolish in allowing his pro-Palestinian sympathy to blind him to anti-Jewish sentiment in his midst. " Either way his lack of leadership or foolishness makes him not fit to run a country in my book. | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. " All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. " This.. We are in a parlous state at this time with our politics being influenced by a minority.. | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. This.. We are in a parlous state at this time with our politics being influenced by a minority.. " A minority what minority is that? | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. This.. We are in a parlous state at this time with our politics being influenced by a minority.. A minority what minority is that?" The Erg essentially and the likes of farage.. | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. This.. We are in a parlous state at this time with our politics being influenced by a minority.. A minority what minority is that? The Erg essentially and the likes of farage.. " Rubbish leave won the referendum did you miss this? | |||
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"I agree with you. I look around at the moment, across all parties, and see precious little talent emerging anywhere. All the people of any talent on both sides are being sidelined at the moment in favour of those committed to the right ideology or dogma. This.. We are in a parlous state at this time with our politics being influenced by a minority.. A minority what minority is that? The Erg essentially and the likes of farage.. Rubbish leave won the referendum did you miss this?" You need to read again what you think your responding to.. Do try harder eh..  | |||
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"He also said "the scale of the problem within labour has been over exaggerated by the media" not sure thats the words of a guy who truly believes there is a big problem." Why not though? I don't see the logic there. It can be both, can't it? Yes antisemitism is there (like Islamophobia too - which is also present in Labour, not just the Conservatives), but it does also depend unfortunately also on some different interpretations of the term - hopefully cleared up now by these new guidelines. And please bear in mind that 2 of the people accused of antisemitism in that darkly-made Panorama expose (some would say 'hatchet-job' as they guy who produced it had already expressed contempt for Corbyn over the subject elsewhere) were actually Jewish anti-Zionsists themselves, and 2 of the younger victims have aggressively worked for a Zionist Israeli body - which only shows (or could have shown if the programme was made properly) that it is HUGELY complicated for Labour to sort out the genuine Jew hatred, from the upsettingly insensitive, from the purely political in this area. It's just been really, really hard for them. And they've spend a fortune trying. It's been particularly hard as Zionism is almost always present, yet the common view is that to associate that with Jewishness is an act of antisemitism itself. And believe me that just makes it harder to untangle. But how would it be easy? Online trolling and obvious stereotyping is easier to deal with, but the middle east on the whole (such as platform sharing over Palestine etc - and parliament itself is platform sharing) is a nightmare subject in this age. Yes, it's taken a long time for Labour people to get these new guidelines out on how to talk about Israel essentially, but I'm afraid that the whole subject HAS been exaggerated too (it was spun as a crisis immediately by those who wanted Corbyn out), and it has been incredibly hard for them to untangle. It's just been really hard. So it's been there, it's been exaggerated (which is not the same as the over-apologetic thing of course) and its been hard. The question for me is this - is Jeremy Corbyn really anti Jewish? To me, he intends to be almost hopelessly fair towards everyone. And that is a notoriously hard thing to be. But it's crazy - he's still there. For me, he's as strong as an Ox that guy. | |||
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" Furthermore is this more a response to demonstrate that labour can deal with its problems, considering the conservative party havent dealt with its islamaphobia problems? " You could be forgiven for thinking Corbyn had written a column mocking the appearance of Jewish people. | |||
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" Furthermore is this more a response to demonstrate that labour can deal with its problems, considering the conservative party havent dealt with its islamaphobia problems? You could be forgiven for thinking Corbyn had written a column mocking the appearance of Jewish people. "I'm sure Boris will unite the Islamic elements of society within the wider communities of post Brexit Britain  | |||
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"Mind you, the worst the media can smear Corbyn with is his tolerance of anti-semitism. Whereas with boris johnson, a cocaine-using, racist, homophobic, lying, cheating, bigoted incompetent . . . except they don't. " Some might say you missed out kiddie fiddler  | |||
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" Furthermore is this more a response to demonstrate that labour can deal with its problems, considering the conservative party havent dealt with its islamaphobia problems? You could be forgiven for thinking Corbyn had written a column mocking the appearance of Jewish people.
I'm sure Boris will unite the Islamic elements of society within the wider communities of post Brexit Britain "I doubt it, the conservative Muslim chair has already promised to quit once boris takes office.. It's ok though because more than half of conservative members polled would not accept a Muslim as PM.They will however accept a racist as PM.  | |||
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As for Corbyn, read my post properly. | |||
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" Furthermore is this more a response to demonstrate that labour can deal with its problems, considering the conservative party havent dealt with its islamaphobia problems? You could be forgiven for thinking Corbyn had written a column mocking the appearance of Jewish people.
I'm sure Boris will unite the Islamic elements of society within the wider communities of post Brexit Britain
I doubt it, the conservative Muslim chair has already promised to quit once boris takes office..
It's ok though because more than half of conservative members polled would not accept a Muslim as PM.They will however accept a racist as PM. "Indeed, it was a piss take  | |||
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"He also said "the scale of the problem within labour has been over exaggerated by the media" not sure thats the words of a guy who truly believes there is a big problem. Why not though? I don't see the logic there. It can be both, can't it? Yes antisemitism is there (like Islamophobia too - which is also present in Labour, not just the Conservatives), but it does also depend unfortunately also on some different interpretations of the term - hopefully cleared up now by these new guidelines. And please bear in mind that 2 of the people accused of antisemitism in that darkly-made Panorama expose (some would say 'hatchet-job' as they guy who produced it had already expressed contempt for Corbyn over the subject elsewhere) were actually Jewish anti-Zionsists themselves, and 2 of the younger victims have aggressively worked for a Zionist Israeli body - which only shows (or could have shown if the programme was made properly) that it is HUGELY complicated for Labour to sort out the genuine Jew hatred, from the upsettingly insensitive, from the purely political in this area. It's just been really, really hard for them. And they've spend a fortune trying. It's been particularly hard as Zionism is almost always present, yet the common view is that to associate that with Jewishness is an act of antisemitism itself. And believe me that just makes it harder to untangle. But how would it be easy? Online trolling and obvious stereotyping is easier to deal with, but the middle east on the whole (such as platform sharing over Palestine etc - and parliament itself is platform sharing) is a nightmare subject in this age. Yes, it's taken a long time for Labour people to get these new guidelines out on how to talk about Israel essentially, but I'm afraid that the whole subject HAS been exaggerated too (it was spun as a crisis immediately by those who wanted Corbyn out), and it has been incredibly hard for them to untangle. It's just been really hard. So it's been there, it's been exaggerated (which is not the same as the over-apologetic thing of course) and its been hard. The question for me is this - is Jeremy Corbyn really anti Jewish? To me, he intends to be almost hopelessly fair towards everyone. And that is a notoriously hard thing to be. But it's crazy - he's still there. For me, he's as strong as an Ox that guy." Bollocks Corbyn is strong, the mans a weak leader, gets cussed in PMQ’s every week, cannot ask hard hitting question, but shitty ones, he has never ever taken the government of the day to task on its failings, if he was a footballer, he’d miss an open goal, even if the goal keeper was blind with no arms and legs, and sitting on the corner. He is just as complicit in this bullshit on brexit also, being a life long euro sceptic. Exaggerated? You cannot casually disregard anti semitism like this. Thats just as bad as the islamaphobic twonks in the conservative party. It wasn’t a hatchet job, if you were a jewish person or a muslim person are asked to represent the entire views of an entire religion or country you are not part of, wouldnt that be considered racist and ignorant. Both islamaphobia and anti semitism are equally evil, and none of the main parties have done sweet FA on it. We need better leader and better government, than the current clowns in parliament and I am not advocating that twat farage either. | |||
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"He also said "the scale of the problem within labour has been over exaggerated by the media" not sure thats the words of a guy who truly believes there is a big problem. Why not though? I don't see the logic there. It can be both, can't it? Yes antisemitism is there (like Islamophobia too - which is also present in Labour, not just the Conservatives), but it does also depend unfortunately also on some different interpretations of the term - hopefully cleared up now by these new guidelines. And please bear in mind that 2 of the people accused of antisemitism in that darkly-made Panorama expose (some would say 'hatchet-job' as they guy who produced it had already expressed contempt for Corbyn over the subject elsewhere) were actually Jewish anti-Zionsists themselves, and 2 of the younger victims have aggressively worked for a Zionist Israeli body - which only shows (or could have shown if the programme was made properly) that it is HUGELY complicated for Labour to sort out the genuine Jew hatred, from the upsettingly insensitive, from the purely political in this area. It's just been really, really hard for them. And they've spend a fortune trying. It's been particularly hard as Zionism is almost always present, yet the common view is that to associate that with Jewishness is an act of antisemitism itself. And believe me that just makes it harder to untangle. But how would it be easy? Online trolling and obvious stereotyping is easier to deal with, but the middle east on the whole (such as platform sharing over Palestine etc - and parliament itself is platform sharing) is a nightmare subject in this age. Yes, it's taken a long time for Labour people to get these new guidelines out on how to talk about Israel essentially, but I'm afraid that the whole subject HAS been exaggerated too (it was spun as a crisis immediately by those who wanted Corbyn out), and it has been incredibly hard for them to untangle. It's just been really hard. So it's been there, it's been exaggerated (which is not the same as the over-apologetic thing of course) and its been hard. The question for me is this - is Jeremy Corbyn really anti Jewish? To me, he intends to be almost hopelessly fair towards everyone. And that is a notoriously hard thing to be. But it's crazy - he's still there. For me, he's as strong as an Ox that guy. Bollocks Corbyn is strong, the mans a weak leader, gets cussed in PMQ’s every week, cannot ask hard hitting question, but shitty ones, he has never ever taken the government of the day to task on its failings, if he was a footballer, he’d miss an open goal, even if the goal keeper was blind with no arms and legs, and sitting on the corner. He is just as complicit in this bullshit on brexit also, being a life long euro sceptic. Exaggerated? You cannot casually disregard anti semitism like this. Thats just as bad as the islamaphobic twonks in the conservative party. It wasn’t a hatchet job, if you were a jewish person or a muslim person are asked to represent the entire views of an entire religion or country you are not part of, wouldnt that be considered racist and ignorant. Both islamaphobia and anti semitism are equally evil, and none of the main parties have done sweet FA on it. We need better leader and better government, than the current clowns in parliament and I am not advocating that twat farage either. " I am hardly casually disregarding anything! I spend time on that - why not show someone, or something some respect! Judging by your continually foul language and rhetoric in general, you are not best placed to judge any form of exaggeration in my opinion. That Panorama programme, presented as a hammer house of horror film, will eventually get an apology from the BBC. That was predicted before it was actually aired too. I wondered at one point if the BBC was going to do it, but to its shame it did. It made no attempt to explain anything, did nothing but mislead, and all even though it had the data to be objective and present it all properly (even darkly if it wanted to). It was the biggest hatchet job in anyone's memory. | |||
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"He also said "the scale of the problem within labour has been over exaggerated by the media" not sure thats the words of a guy who truly believes there is a big problem. Why not though? I don't see the logic there. It can be both, can't it? Yes antisemitism is there (like Islamophobia too - which is also present in Labour, not just the Conservatives), but it does also depend unfortunately also on some different interpretations of the term - hopefully cleared up now by these new guidelines. And please bear in mind that 2 of the people accused of antisemitism in that darkly-made Panorama expose (some would say 'hatchet-job' as they guy who produced it had already expressed contempt for Corbyn over the subject elsewhere) were actually Jewish anti-Zionsists themselves, and 2 of the younger victims have aggressively worked for a Zionist Israeli body - which only shows (or could have shown if the programme was made properly) that it is HUGELY complicated for Labour to sort out the genuine Jew hatred, from the upsettingly insensitive, from the purely political in this area. It's just been really, really hard for them. And they've spend a fortune trying. It's been particularly hard as Zionism is almost always present, yet the common view is that to associate that with Jewishness is an act of antisemitism itself. And believe me that just makes it harder to untangle. But how would it be easy? Online trolling and obvious stereotyping is easier to deal with, but the middle east on the whole (such as platform sharing over Palestine etc - and parliament itself is platform sharing) is a nightmare subject in this age. Yes, it's taken a long time for Labour people to get these new guidelines out on how to talk about Israel essentially, but I'm afraid that the whole subject HAS been exaggerated too (it was spun as a crisis immediately by those who wanted Corbyn out), and it has been incredibly hard for them to untangle. It's just been really hard. So it's been there, it's been exaggerated (which is not the same as the over-apologetic thing of course) and its been hard. The question for me is this - is Jeremy Corbyn really anti Jewish? To me, he intends to be almost hopelessly fair towards everyone. And that is a notoriously hard thing to be. But it's crazy - he's still there. For me, he's as strong as an Ox that guy. Bollocks Corbyn is strong, the mans a weak leader, gets cussed in PMQ’s every week, cannot ask hard hitting question, but shitty ones, he has never ever taken the government of the day to task on its failings, if he was a footballer, he’d miss an open goal, even if the goal keeper was blind with no arms and legs, and sitting on the corner. He is just as complicit in this bullshit on brexit also, being a life long euro sceptic. Exaggerated? You cannot casually disregard anti semitism like this. Thats just as bad as the islamaphobic twonks in the conservative party. It wasn’t a hatchet job, if you were a jewish person or a muslim person are asked to represent the entire views of an entire religion or country you are not part of, wouldnt that be considered racist and ignorant. Both islamaphobia and anti semitism are equally evil, and none of the main parties have done sweet FA on it. We need better leader and better government, than the current clowns in parliament and I am not advocating that twat farage either. I am hardly casually disregarding anything! I spend time on that - why not show someone, or something some respect! Judging by your continually foul language and rhetoric in general, you are not best placed to judge any form of exaggeration in my opinion. That Panorama programme, presented as a hammer house of horror film, will eventually get an apology from the BBC. That was predicted before it was actually aired too. I wondered at one point if the BBC was going to do it, but to its shame it did. It made no attempt to explain anything, did nothing but mislead, and all even though it had the data to be objective and present it all properly (even darkly if it wanted to). It was the biggest hatchet job in anyone's memory." Don’t be so supercilious, the extreme right and the extreme left are just as ignorant as each other, it surprises me that they are easy disregard all their faults, yet are so quick to point out others faults and blame the world is against them. Also momentum are a cult just like the brexit party, indoctrination like being nice to people is a common technique to obtain believers, then push you to see their twisted view of society. Problem is many people in these parties are terrified of criticising when something is wrong, being railroaded by the strong arm tactics of other activists or policy co-ordinators trying drown out the conversation, it sickens me to see how dissent is stamped out. You know why BJ is prime minister and the tories are going to stay in power? Because corbyn lacks the strength to mount an effective challenge against anything, his lack of vision, his crap appointments like mr barry bullshit gardiner, a man couldn’t who couldn’t give a straight answer if his life depended on it. Yeah I maybe crass, rude and uncouth recently, but just as much as the tories need a verbal kick in the balls on a regular basis, its does not preclude labour from getting the same verbal kicking either or any other party when they do wrong. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , " You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum." . Actually I think you will find that he is still the leader because when a challenge was made he stood and won again ,,, | |||
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"Rubbish leave won the referendum did you miss this?" The leave vote is split in at least 3 ways The ERG only represent the "never compromise never negotiate fuck everyone who doesn't do as we say" contingent they're what, 10% of people who voted to leave if they're lucky? The Brexit Party are trading on being deliberately vague on their exact position - I suspect it's about the same as the ERG - but I'd be delighted to be wrong. The remaining (pardon the pun) majority of leavers aren't completely bonkers so they don't represent that minority. So yeah - the Leave conversation is being dictated by a minority who do not represent the majority of leave voters. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum.. Actually I think you will find that he is still the leader because when a challenge was made he stood and won again ,,, " Yeah and changing party rules, and providing a welcoming environment for anti-semites to spread hate. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum." Are you suggesting the Jewish founder of momentum used KGB tactics ?? What tactics did he use and is he responsible for the rise in anti Semitism politics?? | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum. Are you suggesting the Jewish founder of momentum used KGB tactics ?? What tactics did he use and is he responsible for the rise in anti Semitism politics??" Just remember....the person who taught Hitler to speak in public and the officer who recommended him for his Iron Cross were both Jewish.....so it's always possible that a Jewish guy could sew the seeds of antisemitism. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum. Are you suggesting the Jewish founder of momentum used KGB tactics ?? What tactics did he use and is he responsible for the rise in anti Semitism politics?? Just remember....the person who taught Hitler to speak in public and the officer who recommended him for his Iron Cross were both Jewish.....so it's always possible that a Jewish guy could sew the seeds of antisemitism." Wow so we're saying the momentum founder could be anti Semitic and Jewish. A quick google tells me he's accused Jewish voice for labour as being part of the anti Semitic problem.Hes basically called them plastic Jews. So we have prominent Jews in labour accusing each other of anti Semitism.. This is very weird. I'm going to guess some of this division is not anti Semitism but about the state of Israel and which Jews in the labour support Israel and its actions and those who don't support the Jewish state.. | |||
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"Yeah I maybe crass, rude and uncouth recently, but just as much as the tories need a verbal kick in the balls on a regular basis, its does not preclude labour from getting the same verbal kicking either or any other party when they do wrong." You know I couldn't care less if you were just crass, rude and uncouth. Who cares about that, we all get passionate. It's the commitment you have to not listening that bothers me. It's entrenched self-righteousness in an area that demands self-analysis and objectivity. In my view it's extreme politics at it's worst: entirely invisible to the person it has taken hold of. | |||
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"Yeah I maybe crass, rude and uncouth recently, but just as much as the tories need a verbal kick in the balls on a regular basis, its does not preclude labour from getting the same verbal kicking either or any other party when they do wrong. You know I couldn't care less if you were just crass, rude and uncouth. Who cares about that, we all get passionate. It's the commitment you have to not listening that bothers me. It's entrenched self-righteousness in an area that demands self-analysis and objectivity. In my view it's extreme politics at it's worst: entirely invisible to the person it has taken hold of." I’ve read what you have said, I cannot hear what you said, and you have your opinion and I have mine, I think Corbyn is a twat, you think he’s the second coming. End communication. | |||
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"Jeremy Corbyn became leader of The Labour Party on 12 September 2015 , ( and it was said " he wouldn't last long " ) since that date the Conservative party have now had 3 leaders , the Brexit party 2 leaders , The LibDems 3 leaders , UKIP 7 leaders and The Greens 3 leaders , You know why he’s still in? The KGB tactics of momentum. Are you suggesting the Jewish founder of momentum used KGB tactics ?? What tactics did he use and is he responsible for the rise in anti Semitism politics?? Just remember....the person who taught Hitler to speak in public and the officer who recommended him for his Iron Cross were both Jewish.....so it's always possible that a Jewish guy could sew the seeds of antisemitism. Wow so we're saying the momentum founder could be anti Semitic and Jewish. A quick google tells me he's accused Jewish voice for labour as being part of the anti Semitic problem.Hes basically called them plastic Jews. So we have prominent Jews in labour accusing each other of anti Semitism.. This is very weird. I'm going to guess some of this division is not anti Semitism but about the state of Israel and which Jews in the labour support Israel and its actions and those who don't support the Jewish state.. " Isn't the point more like....you may not fully understand the evil that you encourage and nurture | |||
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