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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. " That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. | |||
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"How is Brexit a "threat to democracy"?" Like northern ireland and scotland voted to remain and a final peoples vote on the brexit deal is rejected. | |||
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"Nah. Brexit is a form of democracy. A general election in 2015 and everyone can pick from a set of manifestos. The one that wins includes a referendum. A referendum is held and the majority outcome is implemented. Fast forward to the 2017 general election and a new set of manifestos. People had the choice to rerun the referendum, but at a UK level few people voted for that. In Scotland, one of the manifestos included a 2nd referendum, not on the UK leaving the EU but on Scotland leaving the UK. That won a majority in Scotland and that is what the ruling party now wants to implement. Leaving aside the wisdom of either idea, it seems to me both policies are legitimized by a democratic mandate. " | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy." You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out!  | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! "Yes I do know what it is  | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! "It's not often we agree but.. | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out!
It's not often we agree but.. "Indeed! | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is "Oh no you don't! Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. "Oh yes I do . | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. Oh yes I do ."You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!! | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. Oh yes I do .
You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!! "I do, it doesnt matter, we have to agree to disagree | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. Oh yes I do .
You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!! I do, it doesnt matter, we have to agree to disagree "William Wallace the brave heart guy said it best "They may take our democracy but they'll never take our freedom of speech " | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic.
Oh yes I do .
You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!! "You must be crazy.... Infact yes I agree indeed | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy." what garbage | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic.
Oh yes I do .
You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!!
You must be crazy....
Infact yes I agree indeed "See what I mean, the OP might want to try The Ladybird series of books they may have one on democracy which he may be able to understand! Lol | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! Yes I do know what it is
Oh no you don't!
Just because you don't agree with something it doesn't make it undemocratic. Oh yes I do .
You don't, even posters who never agree with me agree!! I do, it doesnt matter, we have to agree to disagree "We don't! | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim." Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship " The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship " We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it " That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? " Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol" Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. " If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you." Polls before an election mean jack when it comes down to the person in the booth that day voting anything can happen. One party cannot have the voice of a whole country they only have some grasping points that people are so naive to buy into. Without actually seeing the future of it. I have no shame on how I choose not shame on me at all. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right " Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. Polls before an election mean jack when it comes down to the person in the booth that day voting anything can happen. One party cannot have the voice of a whole country they only have some grasping points that people are so naive to buy into. Without actually seeing the future of it. I have no shame on how I choose not shame on me at all. " Your denial of democracy is shameful. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear" "No better alternative" includes the unionist parties, so you are just making the case for independence as the unionist parties are useless! | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear "No better alternative" includes the unionist parties, so you are just making the case for independence as the unionist parties are useless!" No I'm saying I wish a new unheard of party comes into play out of nowhere. Fresh | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence" No they are the only party that give the historical independence story all proud and stuff to be Scottish. Get independence and then what I ask you all? Have they told you how we would run as a country? What currency we would have? How it would effect our health services??? Anything at all? | |||
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"The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship " They voted no because England were dicks and forced how great being in a union is, threatening that if Scotland left, they would not be apart of the EU, etc, remember "better together" and "the EU is important"? England has spat in the face of the Scottish with Brexit, literally pulling the rug from under their feet, taking away everything they've promised to keep them from going independent. You don't think that's cause for trying again? Besides it's highlighted even more thanks to Brexit, why is it OK for England to dictate going alone when many EU countries have already said they'd fast track Scotland into the EU. | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! " | |||
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"The UK is not a proper, functioning democracy and never has been." That is right | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol" But haven't we got to get the Americans permission to use them? We only lease them we don't own them from what I understand? | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol But haven't we got to get the Americans permission to use them? We only lease them we don't own them from what I understand?" Yes we do need permission to use them ,in my opinion its billions worth of scrap metal that will never be used as soon as its moved out of my country the better | |||
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" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence" The majority of people vote for other parties. The SNP only got 1/3 of the vote share last time round. | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol But haven't we got to get the Americans permission to use them? We only lease them we don't own them from what I understand? Yes we do need permission to use them ,in my opinion its billions worth of scrap metal that will never be used as soon as its moved out of my country the better" Absolutely not true. The UK Trident system is totally in our control, does not need American codes or permission to be used and does not rely on American GPS systems to operate. The missles are maintained and stored in the USA when not on deployment. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you." | |||
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"How is Brexit a "threat to democracy"?Like northern ireland and scotland voted to remain and a final peoples vote on the brexit deal is rejected." I am a remain voted from Scotland. My voting form only mentioned the UK to stay or leave. The EU commissioners stated no seperate deals. The UK joined and the UK will leave. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you." If Scotland had voted for independence in 2014 it would have been out of the eu because it would have been a seccecionist state. My source....the Scottish white paper. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. If Scotland had voted for independence in 2014 it would have been out of the eu because it would have been a seccecionist state. My source....the Scottish white paper." They voted to remain in the eu in 2016 by 62% to 38% with a remain majority across all 32 voting areas. | |||
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" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence The majority of people vote for other parties. The SNP only got 1/3 of the vote share last time round." Id say 36.9% of the vote between 5 parties is a pretty good majority | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol But haven't we got to get the Americans permission to use them? We only lease them we don't own them from what I understand? Yes we do need permission to use them ,in my opinion its billions worth of scrap metal that will never be used as soon as its moved out of my country the better Absolutely not true. The UK Trident system is totally in our control, does not need American codes or permission to be used and does not rely on American GPS systems to operate. The missles are maintained and stored in the USA when not on deployment. " Im not too sure thats right but if im wrong il accept that | |||
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"49 % yes vote in newest Scottish poll. The Nats really need to be hitting 60 %. That will depend on whether Brexit gets any messier and the elevation of some English toff to Downing St." 49% before any campaigning has started is brilliant when you think before the 2014 snp were polling under 25% | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol But haven't we got to get the Americans permission to use them? We only lease them we don't own them from what I understand? Yes we do need permission to use them ,in my opinion its billions worth of scrap metal that will never be used as soon as its moved out of my country the better Absolutely not true. The UK Trident system is totally in our control, does not need American codes or permission to be used and does not rely on American GPS systems to operate. The missles are maintained and stored in the USA when not on deployment. Im not too sure thats right but if im wrong il accept that " If Faslane were to close, then our subs would operate from USA bases. Then again you could argue that if Jeremy Corbyn became PM, then he would cancel Trident. Lots of ifs and buts. | |||
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" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence The majority of people vote for other parties. The SNP only got 1/3 of the vote share last time round. Id say 36.9% of the vote between 5 parties is a pretty good majority " They may have got more votes than other parties but it's still not the majority of the vote share and nowhere near the majority of the electorate so when the SNP claim to be speaking for Scotland or the people of Scotland (as all national parties through history do), they are talking nonsense. They are speaking for a minority of the country. | |||
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" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence The majority of people vote for other parties. The SNP only got 1/3 of the vote share last time round. Id say 36.9% of the vote between 5 parties is a pretty good majority They may have got more votes than other parties but it's still not the majority of the vote share and nowhere near the majority of the electorate so when the SNP claim to be speaking for Scotland or the people of Scotland (as all national parties through history do), they are talking nonsense. They are speaking for a minority of the country." Well they got most votes and will continue to get most votes to keep them in power for many years to come as ppl trust them im more than happy with the job they are doing | |||
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" The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence The majority of people vote for other parties. The SNP only got 1/3 of the vote share last time round. Id say 36.9% of the vote between 5 parties is a pretty good majority " Didn't the SNP lose seats in the last Scottish election? In fact, didn't they lose their parliamentary majority? And didn't they also lose nearly 40% of their seats in the last UK General Election, going from 56 MPs down to 35? | |||
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"The electoral system for the Scottish Parliament was designed to prevent any single party gaining a majority. Every single administration has been a coalition of sorts, except one, when Salmond smashed the system and took an overall majority. That really was an astonishing result. Currently, it is an SNP administration with the support of the Greens. That is normal. Prior to the SNP, it was Labour with the Lib Dems. The SNP manifesto in both the last Scottish and UK elections promised a 2nd independence referendum. The SNP won both, so their electoral mandate is clear." Legally, its not theirs to promise. Only the UK Government has the power to allow a legally binding referendum. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. If Scotland had voted for independence in 2014 it would have been out of the eu because it would have been a seccecionist state. My source....the Scottish white paper.They voted to remain in the eu in 2016 by 62% to 38% with a remain majority across all 32 voting areas. " I am a remainder and your point does not get away from the snp would have had us outanyway in 2014 if independence had happened. So snp taking us out of the eu = good A UK wide vote to get taken out of the eu = bad. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. If Scotland had voted for independence in 2014 it would have been out of the eu because it would have been a seccecionist state. My source....the Scottish white paper.They voted to remain in the eu in 2016 by 62% to 38% with a remain majority across all 32 voting areas. I am a remainder and your point does not get away from the snp would have had us outanyway in 2014 if independence had happened. So snp taking us out of the eu = good A UK wide vote to get taken out of the eu = bad." | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol" Faslane is not under UK ultimate control: that remains with USA, ie, POTUS. It could be a perfectly acceptable deterrent in England, possibly down around the south coast where I think the deeper harbours are (could be wrong). | |||
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"A catastrophic Brexit, and/or an arrogant toff in No 10, is their best hope of reaching that." Both seem a very real possibility at the moment ..... | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol Faslane is not under UK ultimate control: that remains with USA, ie, POTUS. It could be a perfectly acceptable deterrent in England, possibly down around the south coast where I think the deeper harbours are (could be wrong)." The USA has absolutely no control over either Faslane or any of our submarines. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship We don't want them...Speaking for the people of Scotland, are you? Well seeing as the majority said no the first time..... kinda lol Polls suggested that Scotland would vote YES, which is why Brown was wheeled out (illegally, in contravention of electoral legislation) to deliver the notorious vow if we changed our mind. We were also promised, as part of the unionist campaign, that we would not be ripped out of the EU. Lies, broken promises, bad faith, total disrespect in parliament for Scotland's voice, huge changes in the political landscape.... and you would deny a democratic re-think? Shame on you. If Scotland had voted for independence in 2014 it would have been out of the eu because it would have been a seccecionist state. My source....the Scottish white paper.They voted to remain in the eu in 2016 by 62% to 38% with a remain majority across all 32 voting areas. I am a remainder and your point does not get away from the snp would have had us outanyway in 2014 if independence had happened. So snp taking us out of the eu = good A UK wide vote to get taken out of the eu = bad." But the snp want independence from the uk but still be in the eu. | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol Faslane is not under UK ultimate control: that remains with USA, ie, POTUS. It could be a perfectly acceptable deterrent in England, possibly down around the south coast where I think the deeper harbours are (could be wrong). The USA has absolutely no control over either Faslane or any of our submarines. " There aren't even any launch codes for trident.It can potentially be launched by the sub commanders without authorisation from the government . Although chain of command up to the PM would be the preferred way. | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol Faslane is not under UK ultimate control: that remains with USA, ie, POTUS. It could be a perfectly acceptable deterrent in England, possibly down around the south coast where I think the deeper harbours are (could be wrong). The USA has absolutely no control over either Faslane or any of our submarines. There aren't even any launch codes for trident.It can potentially be launched by the sub commanders without authorisation from the government . Although chain of command up to the PM would be the preferred way." Quite right- my mistake. The system relies on the discipline of the navy. | |||
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"On 23 junne 2016 the people of scotland voted decisively to remain within the eu, they dont got a backstop like northern ireland to safe guard them, how do you think it will play out for them? I hope they could remain in the eu ".Scotland took part in a national, UK wide vote . . Just because the vast majority in Scotland rejected leaving doesn't mean you can dismiss the overall national result of the referendum. . . Suck it up. . .Scotland took part, .Scotland should accept the outcome of the referendum. . . Then again, they couldn't even accept the Once In A Generation Indi vote !!!! | |||
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"On 23 junne 2016 the people of scotland voted decisively to remain within the eu, they dont got a backstop like northern ireland to safe guard them, how do you think it will play out for them? I hope they could remain in the eu
.Scotland took part in a national, UK wide vote . . Just because the vast majority in Scotland rejected leaving doesn't mean you can dismiss the overall national result of the referendum. . . Suck it up. . .Scotland took part, .Scotland should accept the outcome of the referendum. . . Then again, they couldn't even accept the Once In A Generation Indi vote !!!!"Fair point, but too many Brexiteers seem to be willing to sell NI down the river to get what they want, so they aren’t really interested in the Union. I am a Unionist for the UK and that means every part of the UK. Unless the Good Friday Agreement can be protected, then we should not be forcing Brexit down people’s throats. The Social & Economic consequences do not merit it. | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. " Sorry Sarah you are off the mark here. The first independence referendum sparked a very healthy debate. A lot more folk are involved with politics now, and are seeing why voting NO was indeed a huge mistake. Don't believe everything you hear or read in the MSM. Divisive and bitter are politician soundbites. As for the democracy issue. We have voted through a 2nd independence referendum through our parliament. What right does any PM have over us to say we aren't allowed to have it again? We have not voted in a Tory government for decades yet still have to suffer them. We did not vote for Brexit yet will suffer from it. Poll tax? Bedroom tax? R**e clause? The disabled and poor being culled by the Tories all over the UK. Where is the democracy in that? We have enough resources to go it alone. David fkin Cameron even admitted it himself. In fact can anyone make a positive case for the Union to exist? Other than oh its lasted over 300 years so why break it up now. | |||
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"One of the great things for me about the 2014 referendum was how lowering the voting age to 16 got a whole new generation young people engaged in politics. That was great to see. I'm Scottish, but I did not have a vote because I had moved to England in 2012. But I was back often enough and still have family there to understand how contentious it was. I really hope the next ballot delivers a clear, decisive result. There is nothing worse than a very narrow result either way, as Brexit illustrates. It resolves nothing. " Yes that was a great positive. And we gave the EU citizens the vote choice too. If it was down to Scots only if would have been a huge YES victory. The EU and other UK citizens swayed it in NOs favour. Yes it was contentious and still is but that is a very different phrase from divisive and bitter. After being told to vote NO to preserve our EU status a lot of people have been duped. Problem is this brexit farce is nowhere near conclusion (due to the UK government being so incompetent) so Sturgeon needs to wait before she pulls the trigger on another referendum. Personally I think it's only a matter of time before Scotland leaves the UK. Might even get a United Ireland and an Independent Wales too. Westminster doesn't work for any of the nations now. | |||
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" ... so when the SNP claim to be speaking for Scotland or the people of Scotland (as all national parties through history do), they are talking nonsense. They are speaking for a minority of the country." Just as true for the Tories, UK wide. They speak for the minority. The members of their party - fewer in number than those of the SNP - will appoint a new PM soon; with no mandate from the electorate, to govern. Independence for Scotland would, undoubtedly, have its difficulties; many of them significant. However, an independent Scotland would be an actual democracy, like Germany. Not an excuse for one, like the UK. | |||
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"What about faslane? SNP want to get rid of our only prevention. I have a first aid kit about I don't used it but least I know it's there incase of emergency. Ok I could go on and on. I don't care what others vote etc peace n love lol" That is a beauty right here. Comparing our nuclear defence to a first aid box. Scotland wants rid of it end of. There is nothing stopping it going down to England. Would the mps fancy having it stored 10 miles from them? I live close to it and believe me, it's not fun at all. If anything goes wrong with that you lose Glasgow. | |||
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"Your best bet is a public-schoolboy, hard-Brexit type in No. 10 - that will drive a real wedge into the Act of Union. " Yep i think we know one in particular that fits the bill. | |||
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"Your best bet is a public-schoolboy, hard-Brexit type in No. 10 - that will drive a real wedge into the Act of Union. Yep i think we know one in particular that fits the bill. " Assuming the UK actually does leave the UK, my best hope of regaining my rights as a European citizen will be the ascension of Scotland to the EU. But I don't under-estimate the strife and grief that will need to be gone through to reach that point. | |||
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"What about Faslane? Would the mps fancy having it stored 10 miles from them? I live close to it and believe me, it's not fun at all. If anything goes wrong with that you lose Glasgow. " Have you seen the bunkers all around Faslane andCoulport? The whole of Europe would be lost. At least. | |||
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"SNP have smashed the Euro elections. This is a clear message, it's time for indyref2 ."Exciting isn't it, Scotland will have a chance to get away  | |||
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"SNP have smashed the Euro elections. This is a clear message, it's time for indyref2 ."Yes it was good they won it and that is right this shows what they want | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy." How do you work that one out | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. How do you work that one out " I know it was too easy lol | |||
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"SNP have smashed the Euro elections. This is a clear message, it's time for indyref2 .Yes it was good they won it and that is right this shows what they want "SNP specifically campaigned on the point that a vote for them was a vote against Brexit, not a vote for independence. | |||
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" SNP specifically campaigned on the point that a vote for them was a vote against Brexit, not a vote for independence. " The shrewdest move the SNP ever made was to separate their policy of independence from a vote for the SNP. When I was growing up, it was assumed a mandate for independence would be the SNP winning a majority of seats in a Westminster election. At some point - maybe in the 1990s, I cannot remember - the SNP tacked a referendum to its independence policy. That allowed people to vote for the SNP safe in the knowledge they were not voting for independence - they would get a separate vote on that question. And it allows Ms Sturgeon to position a vote for the SNP as an anti-Brexit vote rather than a pro-independence vote. | |||
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"SNP have smashed the Euro elections. This is a clear message, it's time for indyref2 .Yes it was good they won it and that is right this shows what they want
SNP specifically campaigned on the point that a vote for them was a vote against Brexit, not a vote for independence. "And the Tories campaigned that voting against the SNP was voting against Independence. Its a clear message Scotland doesn't want brexit. Independence could be the only way to prevent it. | |||
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"SNP have smashed the Euro elections. This is a clear message, it's time for indyref2 .Yes it was good they won it and that is right this shows what they want
SNP specifically campaigned on the point that a vote for them was a vote against Brexit, not a vote for independence.
And the Tories campaigned that voting against the SNP was voting against Independence.
Its a clear message Scotland doesn't want brexit. Independence could be the only way to prevent it. "It is quite clear the Scotland doesn't want to leave the area of control that is influenced by a much larger confederation of states. Errr.....hold on  | |||
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" SNP specifically campaigned on the point that a vote for them was a vote against Brexit, not a vote for independence. The shrewdest move the SNP ever made was to separate their policy of independence from a vote for the SNP. When I was growing up, it was assumed a mandate for independence would be the SNP winning a majority of seats in a Westminster election. At some point - maybe in the 1990s, I cannot remember - the SNP tacked a referendum to its independence policy. That allowed people to vote for the SNP safe in the knowledge they were not voting for independence - they would get a separate vote on that question. And it allows Ms Sturgeon to position a vote for the SNP as an anti-Brexit vote rather than a pro-independence vote. " The problem is, they claim before elections that a vote isn't for independence but then immediately after the election they say otherwise. And it happened again yesterday, | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too "Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been dropping. | |||
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" Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been dropping. " By that logic less people voted for the Brexit party than they did for Brexit in 2016, clearly that means people don't want Brexit 
You can't spin this one way without doing the same for your own. It just makes you look like a hypocrite. | |||
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" Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been dropping. By that logic less people voted for the Brexit party than they did for Brexit in 2016, clearly that means people don't want Brexit
You can't spin this one way without doing the same for your own. It just makes you look like a hypocrite."Not sure what you're own about, what do I need to spin for my own? I voted Lib Dem, what do I need to spin there? I've just pointed out the facts, the SNP's vote share has been dropping in the last few elections. | |||
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" I've just pointed out the facts, the SNP's vote share has been dropping in the last few elections. " Scotland is a couple of years ahead of the UK, in the way the vote is evolving. It's no longer about left and right, and beginning to divide on Yes and No. Just as the rest of the UK is beginning to strain between Leave and Remain rather than left and right. | |||
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" I've just pointed out the facts, the SNP's vote share has been dropping in the last few elections. Scotland is a couple of years ahead of the UK, in the way the vote is evolving. It's no longer about left and right, and beginning to divide on Yes and No. Just as the rest of the UK is beginning to strain between Leave and Remain rather than left and right. " I agree but I wouldn't say it's starting to divide between Yes and No, the process of division was complete a few years ago and now we're in an almost permanent paralysis where the constitutional question overshadows everything. The Scottish parliament has been at a virtual stand still. | |||
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"I actually think that the Scots should have another bash.... But it will either result in the slow death of the SNP or the return of yet another Tory government in the remaining UK. I am not sure how damaging, independence would be to the Scots either. I do not think that it would be as damaging to the rest of the UK as people may claim. Nooooo no more votes we don't want them The amount of money that could be spent better else where in the country with all the cut backs would be more beneficial to the actual people of Scotland other than the god knows cost of running independence campaign again. The people of Scotland no said No to independence they need to except it. SNP are close to being a dictorship The scottish government have a mandate from the scottish parliament to hold an independence referendum if there was substantial change like scotland being taken out the eu because of brexit so they are using it That's because they are a party for themselves and not the people. They just want to go down in history by trying to get what they want. If they arent a party for the ppl why have they kept being voted into power for the last 12yrs ?must be doing something right Just lucky for them there is no better alternative to choose if there was anew party I do believe they would be out on their ear The majority of scottish ppl choose snp because they are the only party who stick up for scotland unlike labour tory or libdems who do what they are told by their Westminster based parties i cant wait for indyref2 and we will get our independence No they are the only party that give the historical independence story all proud and stuff to be Scottish. Get independence and then what I ask you all? Have they told you how we would run as a country? What currency we would have? How it would effect our health services??? Anything at all?" Funny Scotland did run as a country before the union and sure it could again. The mood has changed up here and change is near I feel | |||
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"I wouldn't compare a 300 year old political union of countries to Yugoslavia or the the Soviet Union. There's a world of difference between them (thankfully)." Countries are artificial. People are people. They are the same the world over. Given half a chance, plenty would knock six bells out of their neighbour for whatever petty grievance consumes them. | |||
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"Indyref2 is very bit as bitter and divisive in Scotland as Brexit is in other parts of the UK. The arguments are exactly the same - the emotional pull of taking back control and "being that nation again" versus economic reality. One thing Brexit has destroyed though is some of the bogus rhetoric from the likes of Milliband and May in 2014, who said a vote to leave would mean a hard border between Scotland and England. The nationalists need a more plausible plan for the currency issue. That is right, brexit is a threat against democracy. You haven't got the faintest idea what democracy is have you!? I suggest putting a dictionary on your Christmas list to help you find out! "Whilst I agree with every bit of the substance of what Sara says I also think BREXIT is a danger to our democracy. We have landed ourselves into the situation were people are calling our directly elected representatives undemocratic because they won't vote for something most of believe is going to very bad for their constituents and the country. If they succeed in stopping BREXIT those cries will no doubt get stronger and could totally undermine the very bases and trust that our Representative Democracy requires to work. However, on the other hand, if against their better judgment they back BREXIT and it turns out to as bad or worse than a lot of them believe it will be no excuse about 'the peoples will' will be accepted by the people and any MP who voted for it, and more so those that voted for it while actually believing that it would be a disaster, will to held accountable for failing to do their duty to vote for what they believe to be in the best interests of their constituents and the country, also ending up in undermining the bases of trust on which our representative democracy relies. So yes, BREXIT is a threat to our democracy which ever way it finally goes. | |||
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"Ffs just get on with it! I cannot wait for the day to arrive when Scotland is no longer represented in the UK Parliament. Let them take their pathetic leftist politicians to their own house and we can all point and laugh as they run their country to ruin. Fuck em..." Northern Ireland too? The Remain vote strengthened in the EU elections. Who wants a United Kingdom anyway huh? Far better a little England full of snarling, sweary, red necks. | |||
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"I wouldn't compare a 300 year old political union of countries to Yugoslavia or the the Soviet Union. There's a world of difference between them (thankfully). Countries are artificial. People are people. They are the same the world over. Given half a chance, plenty would knock six bells out of their neighbour for whatever petty grievance consumes them. " That's a lazy statement and a false one. Different countries have formed in different ways and that makes many of them different in character (for want of a better word). Some have very artificial constructs and others are more natural with a homogenous population. Some were formed with the threat of force or after being conquered, others weren't. Some were slowly formed over the centuries, others were quickly formed in more recent times. Etc etc. Lots of factors are at play and will impact on national identities and possible internal tensions. | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. " Evidence? | |||
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"Ffs just get on with it! I cannot wait for the day to arrive when Scotland is no longer represented in the UK Parliament. Let them take their pathetic leftist politicians to their own house and we can all point and laugh as they run their country to ruin. Fuck em..." Yep some Union. Its ok to waste 40 years of our oil though eh. | |||
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"Ffs just get on with it! I cannot wait for the day to arrive when Scotland is no longer represented in the UK Parliament. Let them take their pathetic leftist politicians to their own house and we can all point and laugh as they run their country to ruin. Fuck em..." Wow, not only are you racist but you hate the Scottish too, your well of hate goes deep. | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. Evidence? " evidence or is this more unionist scaremongering | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been dropping. "And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp "People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties. However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed. | |||
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"Ffs just get on with it! I cannot wait for the day to arrive when Scotland is no longer represented in the UK Parliament. Let them take their pathetic leftist politicians to their own house and we can all point and laugh as they run their country to ruin. Fuck em... Northern Ireland too? The Remain vote strengthened in the EU elections. Who wants a United Kingdom anyway huh? Far better a little England full of snarling, sweary, red necks." I’d give Northern Ireland a while longer yet, for the sake of the loyalist Ulstermen and women. For me it’s time to get the blue out of our national flag. | |||
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"Ffs just get on with it! I cannot wait for the day to arrive when Scotland is no longer represented in the UK Parliament. Let them take their pathetic leftist politicians to their own house and we can all point and laugh as they run their country to ruin. Fuck em... Wow, not only are you racist but you hate the Scottish too, your well of hate goes deep. "Stupid accusation. I have never said I hated anyone because of their race. As for Scotland, I have family from Aberdeen and have nothing personally against them. I just hate the way they continually drag the UK to the left. I do hope that I have clearly explained myself now. It’s all your going to get. Further accusations will be unanswered yet reported. | |||
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" For me it’s time to get the blue out of our national flag." What do you dislike about Scotland so much to want them out of the union? | |||
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" For me it’s time to get the blue out of our national flag. What do you dislike about Scotland so much to want them out of the union? " Too left wing, apparently- read his post. | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed."Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. Evidence? evidence or is this more unionist scaremongering"Will the BBC be considered as acceptable evidence to you? https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-47474290 | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. Evidence? evidence or is this more unionist scaremongering
Will the BBC be considered as acceptable evidence to you?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-47474290
"No | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. Evidence? evidence or is this more unionist scaremongering
Will the BBC be considered as acceptable evidence to you?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-47474290
No"ITV news perhaps? https://www.itv.com/news/2019-05-29/terror-police-appeal-to-postal-workers-over-parcel-bombs/ | |||
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"Recenty a bomb was sent to Glasgow University, it was not sent by Unionists but by nationalists! Our First Minister and Justice Minister were silent. Scotland is slowly becoming an Orwellian nightmare. Evidence? evidence or is this more unionist scaremongering
Will the BBC be considered as acceptable evidence to you?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-47474290
No
ITV news perhaps?
https://www.itv.com/news/2019-05-29/terror-police-appeal-to-postal-workers-over-parcel-bombs/"Dont read links give us your evidence | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland "You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with. Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this. NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website. Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous. Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%. This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? " So you rely on other sources for your evidence | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland
You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with.
Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this.
NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website.
Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous.
Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%.
This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc"Well it seems all the ppl who continually vote for them disagree with you if they were that bad they would be out,who do you think can do a better job ? | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland
You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with.
Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this.
NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website.
Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous.
Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%.
This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc
Well it seems all the ppl who continually vote for them disagree with you if they were that bad they would be out,who do you think can do a better job ?"People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone. Any of the other parties would do a better job, even Labour who are an utter shambles. Evidence of this? The fact that all the areas I spoke about above were better prior to the SNP coming to power. | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland
You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with.
Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this.
NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website.
Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous.
Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%.
This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc
Well it seems all the ppl who continually vote for them disagree with you if they were that bad they would be out,who do you think can do a better job ?
People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone. Any of the other parties would do a better job, even Labour who are an utter shambles. Evidence of this? The fact that all the areas I spoke about above were better prior to the SNP coming to power."Thats your opinion which you are entitled too im sure if they were not doing a good job they would be out snp have done more for scotland in 12yrs than labour did in 80 thats why they are an irrelevance in scottish politics now | |||
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" People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone.. " I voted SNP in 2006 and 2010, I think it was. It was not a vote for independence. I knew that was a separate vote. Labour in Scotland, Labour in the UK, had totally left me. The SNP turned up promising to be true Labour. I voted for them because of that. | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? So you rely on other sources for your evidence" Thank you for deliberately ignoring a simple question and responding with a ridiculous interpretation. I take it you are a separatist, its a known trait of theirs. | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? So you rely on other sources for your evidence Thank you for deliberately ignoring a simple question and responding with a ridiculous interpretation. I take it you are a separatist, its a known trait of theirs. " So you have no evidence of your own ? Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too | |||
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" Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too " Just curious, does an independent Scotland in your view mean joining the EU? | |||
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" Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too Just curious, does an independent Scotland in your view mean joining the EU?" Yes as we were European before we were part of the union | |||
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" Just curious, does an independent Scotland in your view mean joining the EU? Yes as we were European before we were part of the union" Not very independent then really. | |||
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" Just curious, does an independent Scotland in your view mean joining the EU? Yes as we were European before we were part of the union Not very independent then really. "Lots of independent countries in the eu | |||
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" Lots of independent countries in the eu" Haha, you're just swapping one Union for another. I'm not a Unionist by the way, I fully support the right for the people of Scotland to have a vote on independence. I hope its successful. | |||
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" Lots of independent countries in the eu Haha, you're just swapping one Union for another. I'm not a Unionist by the way, I fully support the right for the people of Scotland to have a vote on independence. I hope its successful. "The differnce is we would have a say about things in the eu wheras in this so called union we are totally ignored with no say in anything | |||
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"A say in what exactly? Adopting the Euro? The EU has already made clear that new member states have to adopt the Euro if they want to join the European Union. " A say in everything unlike the uk where we are continually snubbed as for the euro id take that no probs | |||
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"A say in what exactly? Adopting the Euro? The EU has already made clear that new member states have to adopt the Euro if they want to join the European Union. " does the uk use the euro? Bulgaria,denmark ,sweden,croatia,_omania,hungary poland dont use the euro so thats that myth put to rest | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? So you rely on other sources for your evidence Thank you for deliberately ignoring a simple question and responding with a ridiculous interpretation. I take it you are a separatist, its a known trait of theirs. So you have no evidence of your own ? Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too " A Scottish/Irish republican? | |||
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"A say in what exactly? Adopting the Euro? The EU has already made clear that new member states have to adopt the Euro if they want to join the European Union. does the uk use the euro? Bulgaria,denmark ,sweden,croatia,_omania,hungary poland dont use the euro so thats that myth put to rest" No myth. The EU is very clear about new nations adopting the Euro. Those countries apart from Denmark and the UK have to adopt the Euro in the future. No ifs or buts. Google is your friend. | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? So you rely on other sources for your evidence Thank you for deliberately ignoring a simple question and responding with a ridiculous interpretation. I take it you are a separatist, its a known trait of theirs. So you have no evidence of your own ? Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too " What’s the connection between postal bombs thought to have been sent by New IRA and Scotland’s independence? | |||
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"Two major broadcasters are not considered as evidence according to you. Is there any source that you would consider as evidence? So you rely on other sources for your evidence Thank you for deliberately ignoring a simple question and responding with a ridiculous interpretation. I take it you are a separatist, its a known trait of theirs. So you have no evidence of your own ? Im a scottish Republican cant wait to be independent and also get rid of the royals too A Scottish/Irish republican?" No just scottish | |||
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"A say in what exactly? Adopting the Euro? The EU has already made clear that new member states have to adopt the Euro if they want to join the European Union. does the uk use the euro? Bulgaria,denmark ,sweden,croatia,_omania,hungary poland dont use the euro so thats that myth put to rest" But any country joining the EU now (not entrants who joined before that rule was instituted in the EU constitution) has to adopt the EU and the governance of the European Central Bank | |||
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"All we have to do is Revoke Article 50 and we ‘take back control’! All our rights, privileges and benefits are restored and we have a place at the table again." In a more weakened position than we've ever been in. Great idea. What prevented Britain adopting the Euro and further integration? The threat of us leaving. Now if we were to go back with our tail between our legs they'll just call our bluff. "Please sir, can I have some more" It's startling how blinded you remainers are. You seem to totally disregard the fact that Britain has been the country which has always been against the further integration Germany and France want. | |||
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"All we have to do is Revoke Article 50 and we ‘take back control’! All our rights, privileges and benefits are restored and we have a place at the table again. In a more weakened position than we've ever been in. Great idea. What prevented Britain adopting the Euro and further integration? The threat of us leaving. Now if we were to go back with our tail between our legs they'll just call our bluff. "Please sir, can I have some more" It's startling how blinded you remainers are. You seem to totally disregard the fact that Britain has been the country which has always been against the further integration Germany and France want. "You claim incredible insight, but fail in your commentary. We wouldn’t be weaker, we’d be back where we were, same opportunities, same challenges so we wouldn’t be any weaker than we are now or if a No Deal happened. If Leavers genuinely wanted to be in the strongest negotiating position for either Leave or Stay, we’d Revoke Article 50. Where we currently stand, we have no cards left. This is not the EUs fault, it is sheer, utter, criminal incompetence from the Tory’s, especially ERG. | |||
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"All we have to do is Revoke Article 50 and we ‘take back control’! All our rights, privileges and benefits are restored and we have a place at the table again." | |||
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" People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone.. I voted SNP in 2006 and 2010, I think it was. It was not a vote for independence. I knew that was a separate vote. Labour in Scotland, Labour in the UK, had totally left me. The SNP turned up promising to be true Labour. I voted for them because of that. " Yes but that's not refuting my point in any way. In 2019 the SNP have been in power for 12 years, the past 8 years of which they've been a mjaority govt. We've also had the indepedence referendum in 2014 which changed a lot. We can now see how they perform is government. As I say, their record is shockingly bad but people will vote for them anyway as they know it's the only hope they have for indy. More and more online, and in real life conversations, outwith the true believers you hear people talking about voting SNP to get indy and then voting for another (almost always unspecified) party post independence. SNP are seen by many as a means to an end and for that reason they aren't being judged by their record in government. | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland
You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with.
Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this.
NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website.
Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous.
Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%.
This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc
Well it seems all the ppl who continually vote for them disagree with you if they were that bad they would be out,who do you think can do a better job ?
People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone. Any of the other parties would do a better job, even Labour who are an utter shambles. Evidence of this? The fact that all the areas I spoke about above were better prior to the SNP coming to power.
Thats your opinion which you are entitled too im sure if they were not doing a good job they would be out snp have done more for scotland in 12yrs than labour did in 80 thats why they are an irrelevance in scottish politics now "Ther performance information isn't my opnion, that is stated fact. Which parties would do better comes down to opinion and conjecture though. Your point about the SNP doing more for Scotland can be proven to be untrue by looking at the information I posted above and you can use the Scottish Govt's own stats to look at the details, all of those areas are worse under the SNP than they were when they came to power. | |||
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" If Leavers genuinely wanted to be in the strongest negotiating position for either Leave or Stay, we’d Revoke Article 50. Where we currently stand, we have no cards left. This is not the EUs fault, it is sheer, utter, criminal incompetence from the Tory’s, especially ERG. " It's pretty naive to believe that our steadfast desire against further integration wouldn't be tested time and time again until we eventually caved or were booted out. Also the strongest position possible for us after the referendum was to delay article 50 until we had fortified our economy and invested in our infrastructure before coming to the table. This would of put us in a much stronger position as we could of walked away without a deal with minimal disruption. Unfortunately we had a Remainer in charge which time and time again did her best to push through a deal nobody wanted. | |||
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" If Leavers genuinely wanted to be in the strongest negotiating position for either Leave or Stay, we’d Revoke Article 50. Where we currently stand, we have no cards left. This is not the EUs fault, it is sheer, utter, criminal incompetence from the Tory’s, especially ERG. It's pretty naive to believe that our steadfast desire against further integration wouldn't be tested time and time again until we eventually caved or were booted out. Also the strongest position possible for us after the referendum was to delay article 50 until we had fortified our economy and invested in our infrastructure before coming to the table. This would of put us in a much stronger position as we could of walked away without a deal with minimal disruption. Unfortunately we had a Remainer in charge which time and time again did her best to push through a deal nobody wanted. "So when a Brexiteer Revokes Article 50 to give us a stronger negotiating position you’ll support that? | |||
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"I have done a new thread we can continue on "Fab... We can discuss this till the day the sun don't shine | |||
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"Since 2014 snp has won the scottish elections 2 general elections the council elections and now euro elections id say thats pretty emphatic and now for indy2 where they will win that too
Since a peak vote in 2015 their share of the vote has been 9dropping.
And they are still getting more votes than labour and tories put together in every election,when indyref2 comes it will be a landslide for snp
People who want indy vote for the SNP whereas those who don't share the indy obsession spread their votes among other parties.
However your point was also incorrect anyway. In the 2017 general election the combined Labour and Conservative vote was far higher than the SNP. It's also difficult to see how you can claim it's emphatic for indyref2 when yet again the pro indy parties can't achieve 50% of the vote. Nothing has changed.
Awe i really can feel your pain you just hate that the snp are doing so well,just a wee thought do you and your family take free prescriptions? Help with childcare ? Pay to go over bridges, bus passes ect or are you just a unionist hypocrite who will mever give snp credit for the good they have done for scotland
You're falling for their spin I'm afraid and ignoring the biggest issues a governmetn should be dealing with.
Education (apparently Nicola's priority) has gone backwards to the extent that they have taken us out of the international survey so we now can't compare eductation performance with the past or other countries. The Scottish Parliament's own education committee have been pretty scathing about this.
NHS continues to go backwards with no sign of the failings slowing down nevermind being reversed. I can post more detail on this if required but all the info is on the Scottish Govt website.
Higher education sees poorer students penalised at the expense of richer ones. Basically the grants for poorer students have been cut to fund 'free education' so they are forced into taking out loans whereas richer students don't need to and leave debt free. Student debt has doubled under the SNP and students are now leaving with far more debt than they did under the old system. It's ridiculous.
Funding to Councils has been cut massively. Between 2013 - 2018 the Scottish Government's budget reduced by 1.8% but the money they paid to Councils reduced by 7.1%.
This is just the start of their many failings. Could go on about the fiasco with the railways, the fiasco with the ferries, the various big conference policy announcements that never actually came to anything etc etc
Well it seems all the ppl who continually vote for them disagree with you if they were that bad they would be out,who do you think can do a better job ?
People vote for them because they want independence. If they voted solely on their record they'd be long gone. Any of the other parties would do a better job, even Labour who are an utter shambles. Evidence of this? The fact that all the areas I spoke about above were better prior to the SNP coming to power.
Thats your opinion which you are entitled too im sure if they were not doing a good job they would be out snp have done more for scotland in 12yrs than labour did in 80 thats why they are an irrelevance in scottish politics now
Ther performance information isn't my opnion, that is stated fact. Which parties would do better comes down to opinion and conjecture though. Your point about the SNP doing more for Scotland can be proven to be untrue by looking at the information I posted above and you can use the Scottish Govt's own stats to look at the details, all of those areas are worse under the SNP than they were when they came to power."Impressed | |||
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