FabSwingers.com forum: Brexit meaningful vote.

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

She has to win it today or her already shredded credibility will be turned to dust. I previously said that even though the new “deal” will not be removal of the backstop as demanded by the ERG and DUP, both may well claim a victory and pass May’s deal because the consequences otherwise may well be an extension to A50 and a conditional agreement by Labour to support it third time around if she agrees to either a 2nd referendum or an election.

It is often said that that working class people voting for Brexit were turkeys voting for Christmas. If the DUP and ERG vote against this deal today they will have effectively enabled an even worse outcome for themselves.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

It is more than likely she will present a brexit delay scenario.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"It is more than likely she will present a brexit delay scenario."

Not her style, she will either find a way of conning everyone or kick it on another couple of weeks...

She is not one to change her mind regardless of the consequences.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"It is more than likely she will present a brexit delay scenario.

Not her style, she will either find a way of conning everyone or kick it on another couple of weeks...

She is not one to change her mind regardless of the consequences."
I reckon a delay have been her plan all along.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

She'll be in the upper house by the autumn, able to say I did it..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Another twist and turn in this whole scenario

Leave means leave ffs!!!

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By *j48Man
over a year ago

Wigan

Hopefully defeated again

It's proving that non of then can do as instructed

A farse from day one. No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Too late now - they've seen all our cards

We'll stay in on the guise we're still talking about leaving

Farsical

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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago

on the hill NordWest of

"Another twist and turn in this whole scenario

Leave means leave ffs!!! "

The irony of this simplistic leave means leave slogan is hilarious.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

"No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Why would you want to tell your biggest trade partner to "fuck off"?

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

"Another twist and turn in this whole scenario

Leave means leave ffs!!! "

I bet three years later you still can’t actually articulate what that actually means to anyone.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hopefully defeated again

It's proving that non of then can do as instructed

A farse from day one. No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Too late now - they've seen all our cards

We'll stay in on the guise we're still talking about leaving

Farsical "

What cards? They knew we had none from the start.

Why are people surprised about what’s going on? Especially those who voted for this bullshit. There was never any other way for this to go down. From the day after the referendum we were stuck with a choice between a shit deal, (much worse than we have as a member of the EU). Or no deal and the economic ruin that will bring for the 99.99% of us.

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By *j48Man
over a year ago

Wigan

"No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Why would you want to tell your biggest trade partner to "fuck off"?

Because its a fucking dictatorship

Traders trade - weeks and weeks sorting out specific words relating to the backstop

We are being told what to do by unelectected dictators

When it all collapses the survival of the fittest will kick in

Look at France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, all in serious trouble.

There's a big world out there

So we're being told that after the end of the month we can trade but the terms are yet unknown..

Leave and take a year out. Ignore them and let's see who comes talking to us first

That's how you negotiate - not jetting off at an instants notice with cap in hand and have to pay 50 billion quid for the privalige of leaving

Are we all stupid?

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By *j48Man
over a year ago

Wigan

[Removed by poster at 12/03/19 11:29:48]

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Why would you want to tell your biggest trade partner to "fuck off"?

Because its a fucking dictatorship

Traders trade - weeks and weeks sorting out specific words relating to the backstop

We are being told what to do by unelectected dictators

When it all collapses the survival of the fittest will kick in

Look at France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, all in serious trouble.

There's a big world out there

So we're being told that after the end of the month we can trade but the terms are yet unknown..

Leave and take a year out. Ignore them and let's see who comes talking to us first

That's how you negotiate - not jetting off at an instants notice with cap in hand and have to pay 50 billion quid for the privalige of leaving

Are we all stupid?

Go and have a look at this Economics and International trade thread:

https://m.fabswingers.com/forum/politics/858775

All major nations trade predominantly with their nearest neighbours and tend to have their deepest trade deals with them.

This isn't a gap year wear we can take a year out to "find ourselves". Capital and business do not wait. We've already failed to decide what we want after two years and that's just the Conservative party shouting at itself.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc"

She wouldn't have been so foolish as to kick this off.

Whatever your opinion of her, she understood economic realities.

In the 80s she went for a strategy that ultimately led to a richer country but did did nothing to mitigate the devestatuin that it wrought on the way.

Brwxif brings the downside with no understanding of what the upsides might be except in the vaguest terms.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

The Attorney General has already stated that the latest iteration of the deal will not satisfy the DUP or ERG position.

How could you have a conract where one side can just walk away?

So a second vote with the same question. This is democratic but a second referendum is not?

This vote wouldn't even be happening if the "traitors" in UK Supreme Court hadn't "defied" the will of the people who wanted them to take control back, because the hated Gewna Miller wanted to give the UK Parliament sovereignty

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc"

So you think she was a good PM ?

Especially with hindsight she is the one who fucked the country good and proper!

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

The Attorney General has already stated that the latest iteration of the deal will not satisfy the DUP or ERG position.

How could you have a conract where one side can just walk away?

So a second vote with the same question. This is democratic but a second referendum is not?

Lots of contracts have a clause where either party can just 'walk away' as you put it.

For example;

Employment Contracts

Engineering Contracts

Hire Purchase Agreements once you've paid half.

And contracts usually have a 'breach of contract' clause, allowing the damaged party to immediately cessate.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

The Attorney General has already stated that the latest iteration of the deal will not satisfy the DUP or ERG position.

How could you have a conract where one side can just walk away?

So a second vote with the same question. This is democratic but a second referendum is not?

Lots of contracts have a clause where either party can just 'walk away' as you put it.

For example;

Employment Contracts

Engineering Contracts

Hire Purchase Agreements once you've paid half.

And contracts usually have a 'breach of contract' clause, allowing the damaged party to immediately cessate."

You are correct. Although there are usually massive penalty clauses for for failing to deliver on an engineering contract.

I was over-simplifying.

However, they all exist for a specific purpose.

What international trade agreements allow that?

What would be the purpose of one?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

She'll lose but not quite do substantially I imagine. The magic money tree has bern shaken so some MPs will be swayed by the promised of funding for their constituency bit the Attorney General won't give it his backing and neither will most MPs.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

i think she loses by 100-120 tonight.... then all hell breaks loose........

for the first time in this process i really don't know what happens next... but you can't point the fingers at the EU....

point the finger at May

point the finger at the ERG

point the finger at the DUP.....

the hardline are still looking for their unicorn and are willing to gamble everything on it!

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

General Election Time.

Let’s have another go at it all.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

"i think she loses by 100-120 tonight.... then all hell breaks loose........

for the first time in this process i really don't know what happens next... but you can't point the fingers at the EU....

point the finger at May

point the finger at the ERG

point the finger at the DUP.....

the hardline are still looking for their unicorn and are willing to gamble everything on it!"

That's when backbenchers like Cooper/Boles will try and seize the initiative by tabling amendments that they already know have support.

May's deal is dead, we are just going through the motions now. Legally it's the right thing to do but the can is nearly at the end of the road now.

Should Parliament not be able to agree anything beyond "no deal" and asking for a "technical extension", then there are only two options available.

A referendum with Remain on the ballot, or the Government stopping the Brexit process by consensus.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Another twist and turn in this whole scenario

Leave means leave ffs!!!

I bet three years later you still can’t actually articulate what that actually means to anyone.

-Matt"

Correct... Many of us don't deep down but there are still many who voted leave and leave without any deal

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By *usty and LustyCouple
over a year ago

Fleet

Not a hope that TM deal will get through a vote tonight, next vote will be a no to a No Deal withdrawal,it's like Royston Casey, you'll never leave.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not a hope that TM deal will get through a vote tonight, next vote will be a no to a No Deal withdrawal,it's like Royston Casey, you'll never leave."

Or the song Hotel California by the Eagles

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc

So you think she was a good PM ?

Especially with hindsight she is the one who fucked the country good and proper!"

The one who hollowed out northern industrial towns to create wastelands she did not understand nor care about, sowing the seeds of anti-establishment resentment that yielded Brexit.

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By *igblackdomTV/TS
over a year ago

West Midlands

"Hopefully defeated again

It's proving that non of then can do as instructed

A farse from day one. No one has the balls to tell the EU to fuck off

Too late now - they've seen all our cards

We'll stay in on the guise we're still talking about leaving

Farsical

What cards? They knew we had none from the start.

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By *igblackdomTV/TS
over a year ago

West Midlands

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc"

Thatcher voted for the EEC in 73 and signed the European agreement in 86, part of her later downfall was due to her subsequent Euroscepticism.

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By *igblackdomTV/TS
over a year ago

West Midlands

point the finger at May

point the finger at the ERG

point the finger at the DUP.....

..and the dimwits who voted for this idiocy in the first place.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Should Parliament not be able to agree anything beyond "no deal" and asking for a "technical extension", then there are only two options available.

A referendum with Remain on the ballot, or the Government stopping the Brexit process by consensus."

If that happens then we don't need another referendum, MP's won't accept Brexit as it is anyway.

Either a General Election where the public get the chance to vote out remain MP's so Brexit has a better chance or Brexit should be scrapped for now until a Brexit party manages to take Government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It will be voted down again. The attorney generals legal interpretation / advice (whatever you ant to call it) is that essentially nothing has changed.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's a beautiful thing to behold. Brexit is dead in the water.The inevitable second referendum looms large...

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Not a hope that TM deal will get through a vote tonight, next vote will be a no to a No Deal withdrawal,it's like Royston Casey, you'll never leave.

Or the song Hotel California by the Eagles"

Or groundhog day...

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Any other time, it would be similar to last, still lost, with more than 200. I would otherwise assume that it would be in excess of 150 lost but the conservatives are also aware that there's a potential general election in the foreseeable future where voters may take revenge on politicians who didn't vote closer to their desires and then oust them. So I'll play safe and estimate that it will be lost at 140.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell"

Unusually, I would agree with you, if Brexit had continued, especially with a no deal and departure at the end of March 2019.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell"

Evil. Really?

She was asked to do something impossible and gave it a go.

Sbe could have made some effort to engage the whole country or at least other political parties and or at least reach consensus in her own party about what the strategy was.

Incompetent maybe. Evil? I don't think so.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"General Election Time.

Let’s have another go at it all. "

The Tiggers are shitting themselves at the prospect of a general election. Then we can really see what their constituents think of them as none of them had the balls or the decency to call by elections.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

point the finger at May

point the finger at the ERG

point the finger at the DUP.....

..and the dimwits who voted for this idiocy in the first place."

That would be the vast majority of MP's in Parliament then as it was Parliament who voted to have the referendum in the first place.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell"

hey... its the DUP and the ERG you should be pointing the finger at.... the only group may have tried to appease is them...

as been pointed out all along... if may had gone for the cross party approach since day 1 we would not be now where we are!

she put the interest of her party before the interest of her country....

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

Another vote ....same result then what xxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell"

What crime has she committed? ??

Shes been trying to polish a turd for years and unfortunately it still stinks.

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

hey... its the DUP and the ERG you should be pointing the finger at.... the only group may have tried to appease is them...

as been pointed out all along... if may had gone for the cross party approach since day 1 we would not be now where we are!

she put the interest of her party before the interest of her country.... "
your bang on there Fabio party before country just like jc now talking about a second vote fucking scum the lot of them

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Another vote ....same result then what xxx"

Exactly, same shit, different day, there's no point having another fucking referendum.

New government yes, another referendum no.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"Another vote ....same result then what xxx

Exactly, same shit, different day, there's no point having another fucking referendum.

New government yes, another referendum no. "

A quick revocation of Article 50 would be ideal, with a new government.

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By *eavenNhellCouple
over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

just a thought they are getting to vote for a second time

the public on the otherhand ............

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

may loses by 149..... big

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By *rench letterCouple
over a year ago

Chorley,

Brexit is not looking like it might not happen. Excellent.

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Second referendum soon come.

Democracy manifest.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As far as we can see the eu has told them no extension so 3 choices...no deal..accept deal or withdraw article 50 and no brexit....

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

the only thing may has done right today is to allow a free vote for her side on the "no deal" debate tomorrow....

if she had made them pick a side you would have seen the huge split... this way we just get to see the "tory civil war" played out big time in public tomorrow...

notice that the PM didn't say which side she would vote tomorrow....

p.s... losing by 149 is still the 4th biggest government defeat even to put it in context

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

They lost, just what I thought they would do, this time they lost with with 149, not as much as last time, but still the majority

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"may loses by 149..... big"

Any idea what happens now, Fabio?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They vote on whether to take no deal off the table tomorrow and Wednesday is a vote on whether to extend Article 50

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"may loses by 149..... big

Any idea what happens now, Fabio? "

well be get a debate when we find out who the true WTO lunatics are.......

seriously though, we find out tomorrow just what "no deal" would look like.... as well as the no deal vote, the govt are also going to release papers as to what is going to happen on day 1 with inbound tariffs....

"if" it was the paper i saw this morning..... then uk farming and manufacutring are going to be "Woah!!!!"

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex

"Another twist and turn in this whole scenario

Leave means leave ffs!!! "

That means absolutely nothing

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc"

I rather think not...she was the main architect of the single market

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell"

Hardly.....i can think of dozens worse than her

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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago

yumsville

Anybody noticed Corbyn's language softening. No botched brexit, no disaster deal, cliff edge or ransoming in reply to her statement. Given the defeat, I wonder if he's trying a new tack to get MP's on side.

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex

"the only thing may has done right today is to allow a free vote for her side on the "no deal" debate tomorrow....

if she had made them pick a side you would have seen the huge split... this way we just get to see the "tory civil war" played out big time in public tomorrow...

notice that the PM didn't say which side she would vote tomorrow....

p.s... losing by 149 is still the 4th biggest government defeat even to put it in context"

Meanwhile that halfwit BoJo is still spouting lies in the Commons by saying we can have a No Deal and a transition period which has already been rejected by the EU. Do liars like him forget the lies theyve already told?

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"They vote on whether to take no deal off the table tomorrow and Wednesday is a vote on whether to extend Article 50"

On extending article 50, just watched an interview with influential German MEP Elmar Brok on Sky news. He said its unlikely the EU will allow any extension beyond May this year as the EU don't want the UK participating in the European MEP elections (the last thing they want is the British people electing a shed load of anti EU MEP's). For an article 50 extension to happen all 27 EU member states must agree and he said that not all will agree to an extension. Remainers wanting a long extension to article 50 may be in for a huge disappointment.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They vote on whether to take no deal off the table tomorrow and Wednesday is a vote on whether to extend Article 50

I think in that case then faced with no deal which has no majority at all in Parliament or rescind A50 I think binning A50 will be the only way May will go.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

Take back control, eh?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They vote on whether to take no deal off the table tomorrow and Wednesday is a vote on whether to extend Article 50"

Thanks

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"may loses by 149..... big

Any idea what happens now, Fabio?

well be get a debate when we find out who the true WTO lunatics are.......

"if" it was the paper i saw this morning..... then uk farming and manufacutring are going to be "Woah!!!!""

Thanks. I get all the brexit news from here

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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago

yumsville

Here's the breakdown of how they voted

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2019/mar/12/how-did-your-mp-vote-in-the-march-brexit-votes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't even need to look to know how my MP voted

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that"

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

The Attorney General has already stated that the latest iteration of the deal will not satisfy the DUP or ERG position.

How could you have a conract where one side can just walk away?

So a second vote with the same question. This is democratic but a second referendum is not?

Lots of contracts have a clause where either party can just 'walk away' as you put it.

For example;

Employment Contracts

Engineering Contracts

Hire Purchase Agreements once you've paid half.

And contracts usually have a 'breach of contract' clause, allowing the damaged party to immediately cessate.

You are correct. Although there are usually massive penalty clauses for for failing to deliver on an engineering contract.

I was over-simplifying.

However, they all exist for a specific purpose.

What international trade agreements allow that?

What would be the purpose of one?"

You're right, you were over simplifying it.....and incorrectly.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......"

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Today there will be another vote, last time it went down to history with the most defeats, how will it go today?

The Attorney General has already stated that the latest iteration of the deal will not satisfy the DUP or ERG position.

How could you have a conract where one side can just walk away?

So a second vote with the same question. This is democratic but a second referendum is not?

Lots of contracts have a clause where either party can just 'walk away' as you put it.

For example;

Employment Contracts

Engineering Contracts

Hire Purchase Agreements once you've paid half.

And contracts usually have a 'breach of contract' clause, allowing the damaged party to immediately cessate.

You are correct. Although there are usually massive penalty clauses for for failing to deliver on an engineering contract.

I was over-simplifying.

However, they all exist for a specific purpose.

What international trade agreements allow that?

What would be the purpose of one?

You're right, you were over simplifying it.....and incorrectly. "

Oooh. Good "win"

What international trade agreements allow that?

What would be the purpose of one?

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By *eavenNhellCouple
over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Take back control, eh?

"
and blue passports

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate "

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?"

Because those who dont want us to leave are in charge, beware though that if brexit gets stopped then Farage will be back with a new party and may well wipe the floor with both the tories and labour at the next election. I know quite a few who voted remain but are disgusted with the way its been handled and would now vote leave

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

...and once again the conspiracy. Blaming other people.

They should vote leave then. It will be yet another clarification. Of what Brexit means. Satisfying people who want to remain but want punish the Illuminati for what they didn't want not happening

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By *iverpool LoverMan
over a year ago

liverpool

What happens next?

Well an extension will happen followed by a second referendum in which remain will get the majority as the public wont trust any of these politician's with anything like this ever again.

Lets just try again in a decade or so when hopfully somthing in politics has changed and these pompus out of touch with the people are no longer anywhere to be seen or heard.

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By *iverpool LoverMan
over a year ago

liverpool

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Im the opposite to your friends, i was happy to exit the eu 2 years ago.

Now id be voting remain.

Not that i like the people in charge of this EU farce cant stand any of them but i just dont trust this goverment or any of the other partys with brexit.

So i am willing to just keep things as they are for now and if there is a 2nd vote ill be voting remain this time around.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

Most people never really gave a crap.

Most people still don't.

It is now apparent that it's harder than it looks and tgat there's no obvious benefit.

Remain probably more likely to get the vote out the second time around.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

There is no sensible plan, brexit is cancelled lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

That’s some leap you’re proposing there. Sensible people (remainers ) suddenly swinging so far to the right, en-masse, and voting to flush the uk down the toilet. Can’t imagine that will be many of them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Another bollocks from brexiters.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Who said anything about remainers? The poster you quoted was referring to Leave voters, the 17.4 million 52% majority. If the EU referendum was done on a first past the post constituency basis it would have been a landslide victory for Leave.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

What does this mean to you?

"I know quite a few who voted remain but are disgusted with the way its been handled and would now vote leave"

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

Makes me ashamed to be British the way parliament has dealt with the Brexit process , we are a laughing stock on the world stage ! God help us all !!!

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Well done captain miss-the-point.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Makes me ashamed to be British the way parliament has dealt with the Brexit process , we are a laughing stock on the world stage ! God help us all !!! "

The embarrassment came as soon as the referendum result came in. That’s when we became a laughingstock. Putting ourselves in a no-win situation, and the ease with which the powerful few who stand to benefit from this fooled enough people to vote against their own interests. That’s why the world is laughing at us.

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

Lets just rescind Article 50, call a general election and attempt to move on. We have all wasted so much energy on this for too long. It has not helped in any way - unless you are very wealthy and now living in tax exile...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

I am guessing that the ERG and DUP must have a very cunning plan. Either that or the “backstop” was merely the red herring that disguised the absolute shitness of the other aspects of the “deal.”

Can’t really see how they are going to now benefit other than hope that the crazy “no deal” option actually happens in a couple of weeks.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

Can’t really see how they are going to now benefit other than hope that the crazy “no deal” option actually happens in a couple of weeks."

As cunning as a fox who's just been appointed Professor of Cunning at Oxford University?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Well done captain miss-the-point."

Hahaha,

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Well done captain miss-the-point."

You're the one who missed the point Dave. Jumping (wrongly) to the conclusion the poster was talking about remainers, when no reference to remainers was made.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

Not sure which planet you're living on Bob, but here in the real world the EU have said tonight they think a no deal Brexit is getting more likely.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

Not sure which planet you're living on Bob, but here in the real world the EU have said tonight they think a no deal Brexit is getting more likely. "

And on what planet do you and others brexiters live? Certainly much further than Mars.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc"

And 35 years later how do you think that has worked out for the country?

Before you answer take a look at the state of our roads, the number of homeless living on the streets, in tents and surfing sofas around the country. And before you tell me we have record employment figures go on the the government website and check out the definition of being employed (its anyone who works 1 hour a week and includes those on government schemes and those working for free looking after sick or disabled relatives).

Now tell me how great the milk snatcher was and how we need more of the same...

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

"Makes me ashamed to be British the way parliament has dealt with the Brexit process , we are a laughing stock on the world stage ! God help us all !!! "

It's the conservative party which has done this, just to clarify the issue. But conservatives have a track record in working against most citizens interests

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Makes me ashamed to be British the way parliament has dealt with the Brexit process , we are a laughing stock on the world stage ! God help us all !!!

It's the conservative party which has done this, just to clarify the issue. But conservatives have a track record in working against most citizens interests "

"Pride goes before falling"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For me as a semi new politics watcher the who system needs to change its hundreds of years old I belive?

I now have a new light why in the first place do 600 odd people decide fate all on at least £80,000 a year private gates and no idea of what street life is like.

I don't know if you know this but not so long ago it was business owners that decided the out come it got abolish years ago. For ordanaey people things will improve even if the country on a whole takes a hit. now I'm sorry if I offend anyone let me say I recognise that mixed race is what has made the human race thrive. But the influx of labour in this country cheap labour modern day slavery you guys may not see or belive it its true I see On a regular basis one boss talks English that's is not just eu may I add Indian men I see a lot in the building trade being modern day slaves.

Back to the small point eu laws dong let our young learn found enough what I mean Is you have to be 18 to enter. Building site? It's backward earlier the better no do you ride s bike once your old enough to be insured?

We need to teach our Young! Young when there programming there brains.

off the eu on to knife crime I know but I'm worried for the future I was a whild child but my era was just the beginning of the epidemic adha now multiple versions of autism.

People say good preservatives,

I say generation after generation of us being soft on our kids we have evolved.

We show no respect to one another we have let serious crimes become fodder and its modern day

Medevil times were controlled just enough to get by holiday if your lucky once a year, new car, and a mortgage that's us luck ones.

And the whole time they parliament smirk diss each other and devide them selves into a board game who's gonna win

Where the fuck are we

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"For me as a semi new politics watcher the who system needs to change its hundreds of years old I belive?

I now have a new light why in the first place do 600 odd people decide fate all on at least £80,000 a year private gates and no idea of what street life is like.

We need to teach our Young! Young when there programming there brains.

off the eu on to knife crime I know but I'm worried for the future I was a whild child but my era was just the beginning of the epidemic adha now multiple versions of autism.

People say good preservatives,

I say generation after generation of us being soft on our kids we have evolved.

We show no respect to one another we have let serious crimes become fodder and its modern day

Medevil times were controlled just enough to get by holiday if your lucky once a year, new car, and a mortgage that's us luck ones.

And the whole time they parliament smirk diss each other and devide them selves into a board game who's gonna win

Where the fuck are we

"
up the shit creek without a paddle !

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that"

Article 24 has been debunked already....it's tosh and doesnt apply to the circumstances that we are in

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Well done captain miss-the-point.

You're the one who missed the point Dave. Jumping (wrongly) to the conclusion the poster was talking about remainers, when no reference to remainers was made. "

Once again, what do these words mean?

"I know quite a few who voted remain but are disgusted with the way its been handled and would now vote leave"

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

Should Churchill have resigned?

Should Farage have resigned?

Just putting it out there that you are in a slightly unhinged tailspin

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

Should Churchill have resigned?

Should Farage have resigned?

Just putting it out there that you are in a slightly unhinged tailspin

At the time of Churchill the mechanism for resigning a commons seat was not the same as today and involved taking one of the 'Chiltern Hundreds' and leaving a seat unrepresented for 1 or 2 years (can't remember off hand the exact rules and not going to google it) so that comparison is bogus. However in the case of Farage or anyone else (in th modern era) who is elected on a political party ticket with with party funding then definitely YES!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He is probably referring to article 24 of the gatt which allows exactly that

nope.... he was referring to the "malthouse concession" (version b), of which some tory mps were trying to push.... and barnier flat out said "not happening!"......

Did he say he was referring to that by name. Tariffs are in no ones interest,certainly not european companies or employees, but hey the eu dont care about people only their dream of a superstate

But you voted to take back control. Why haven’t you?

Well done captain miss-the-point.

You're the one who missed the point Dave. Jumping (wrongly) to the conclusion the poster was talking about remainers, when no reference to remainers was made. "

They used the sentence “I know quite a few who voted remain but are disgusted with the way its been handled and would now vote leave”. Which to me, say they’re talking about remainers.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

Not sure which planet you're living on Bob, but here in the real world the EU have said tonight they think a no deal Brexit is getting more likely. "

Like a desperate man you now cling on to the words from those that you have spent over 3 years calling out all they say as project fear..

From people you have described as corrupt, d*unks and incompetent..

Though that could be your hero Farage too..

Has the reality not kicked in yet or will it even do so when no deal is binned by Parliament..

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

"Tonight brexiters all over this land will go to bed with the knowledge that brexit might not happen at all.

Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.

Not sure which planet you're living on Bob, but here in the real world the EU have said tonight they think a no deal Brexit is getting more likely. "

You had a pathway out of the EU in your own hands and you tossed it away, in the hope the EU will now do you a favour and refuse a request to stay longer.

One wonders if your chums have any backbone whatsoever. Spineless.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out in the real world people are off to work to keep the wheels of the UK turning .

No deal simply means that we trade with Europe on different terms but open up lots of different opportunities elsewhere.

Hardly a disaster and a great opportunity for the future of the UK..

It is employers and business that keep the UK moving.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

If you think “no deal” only impacts on trade, then you do not understand the role of EU legal frameworks in other aspects of everyday life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Out in the real world people are off to work to keep the wheels of the UK turning .

No deal simply means that we trade with Europe on different terms but open up lots of different opportunities elsewhere.

Hardly a disaster and a great opportunity for the future of the UK..

It is employers and business that keep the UK moving. "

Good post, another great example of the lack of understanding around the widespread impacts and implications of Brexit. I keep saying it, but there should never have been a referendum on this in the first place.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

maybe they were following your hero nigel farage's lead when he quit the EU parliament when he left UKIP...... oh wait.... he didn't!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

Unusually, I would agree with you, if Brexit had continued, especially with a no deal and departure at the end of March 2019."

Interesting that you put it that way, as that is now the position we find ourselves in.

Our departure on 29th March is written into UK law. Even if 'No-deal' gets voted down today and MP's vote to extend article 50 (neither of which are binding on the government), a change to this law would be required, which is a massive ask given that there will be just 15 days left in which to do it.

Actually, 11 days as parliament doesn't sit on weekends.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"It's a beautiful thing to behold. Brexit is dead in the water.The inevitable second referendum looms large...

"
No deal also looms!!!

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"Out in the real world people are off to work to keep the wheels of the UK turning .

No deal simply means that we trade with Europe on different terms but open up lots of different opportunities elsewhere.

Hardly a disaster and a great opportunity for the future of the UK..

It is employers and business that keep the UK moving. "

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc

And 35 years later how do you think that has worked out for the country?

Now tell me how great the milk snatcher was and how we need more of the same..."
It worked `100%you are totally blind ,I lost my business because of Maggie but still know she is the greatest PM of my lifetime.Yes I suffered for a time but all I have now is due to Maggie.A bit like Brexit might be,one step back and three steps forward.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Out in the real world people are off to work to keep the wheels of the UK turning .

No deal simply means that we trade with Europe on different terms but open up lots of different opportunities elsewhere.

Hardly a disaster and a great opportunity for the future of the UK..

It is employers and business that keep the UK moving. "
I see you didnt mention northern ireland there and with their hard border they could get.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

Should Churchill have resigned?

Should Farage have resigned?

Just putting it out there that you are in a slightly unhinged tailspin

Not only is EasyUK's Churchill comparison bogus as you point out but the Farage comparison is also bogus as Farage is not an MP. Farage is an MEP and the voting system for MEP's is completely different to that of MP's.

A like for like comparison in the modern era would be to that of former MP's like Douglas Carswell and Mark Reckless who left the conservative party and joined ukip. They both immediately did the honorable and decent thing and called by elections to allow their constituents to decide. The Tiggers simply don't have the honour, decency or backbone to do the same.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

Unusually, I would agree with you, if Brexit had continued, especially with a no deal and departure at the end of March 2019.

Interesting that you put it that way, as that is now the position we find ourselves in.

Actually, 11 days as parliament doesn't sit on weekends."

As you can see from the comments earlier remainers just don't seem to get this or they're just too blinkered to admit it. As pointed out the EU now think a no deal Brexit is more likely and said last night they are stepping up their own no deal preparations. It was also discussed on BBC Newsnight last night that the UK could still leave on no deal on March 29th even if MP's vote against it today.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Not only is EasyUK's Churchill comparison bogus as you point out but the Farage comparison is also bogus as Farage is not an MP. Farage is an MEP and the voting system for MEP's is completely different to that of MP's.

Thank you for agreeing with me regarding Churchill Centy, but it makes no difference what body you are elected to, or the electoral system, if you abandon those who paid to have you elected and that the electorate voted for you representing, you should automatically be made to re-stand for election.

This has nothing to do with party affiliation or party politics, it has to do with representing constituents.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

Should Churchill have resigned?

Should Farage have resigned?

Just putting it out there that you are in a slightly unhinged tailspin

You may be correct but I'm not convinced that this is true.

The rules about resigning from a seat still stand to this day from 1624. You disqualify yourself by being a paid servant of the Crown.

A seat does not have to be left vacant as a consequence.

That is not and was not the same as calling a by-election.

Churchill made a choice and Garage made a choice.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

Unusually, I would agree with you, if Brexit had continued, especially with a no deal and departure at the end of March 2019.

Interesting that you put it that way, as that is now the position we find ourselves in.

Actually, 11 days as parliament doesn't sit on weekends.

They also think e second referendum and remaining is more likely because the chance of a negotiated departure have reduced.

Talk about blinkers

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"i do find it ironic that 40 tories changed their minds and voted the other way today..... but they don't want to allow the general public the chance to do the same thing.....

just putting it out there......

And the 11 Tiggers who changed their party allegiance, who want a 2nd referendum but don't want to allow the general public a 2nd vote on their seats in parliament through by elections.....

Just putting it out there.....

Should Churchill have resigned?

Should Farage have resigned?

Just putting it out there that you are in a slightly unhinged tailspin

You don't even know what Will is talking about but you've chosen to accept it because it seems to suit you

See my reply then go and do some of your own thinking.

The voting system for MPs and MEPs is not the question.

The question that you raised is that if you leave a party should you resign your seat or call a by-election.

Farage did neither but you choose not to question his moral position

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

"Yes May should end up in prison for this,the most evil Britain since Cromwell

Unusually, I would agree with you, if Brexit had continued, especially with a no deal and departure at the end of March 2019.

Interesting that you put it that way, as that is now the position we find ourselves in.

Actually, 11 days as parliament doesn't sit on weekends.

The point is, no deal Brexit is the *default*. That is what will happen come March 29th in the absence of anything else being agreed or approved.

There is all this bogus rhetoric about "removing no deal from the table". That is like saying "Removing no dinner from my dinner table".. You can't remove nothing, you can only replace it with something. I can argue until I'm blue in the face that I want "No dinner removed from my table"... but unless I or someone else actually agree to cook some dinner, then 'no dinner' is what there is.

And so not only does the UK parliament need to agree to implement *something* (which seems a tall order given they can't agree on anything). But whatever it agreed of a deal (including an extension) needs to be also approved by the EU. And the EU have (rightly so) said that negotiations are now over. We've had our two years and May has squandered it.

The only other option is to revoke A50, which we may be able to unilaterally do. But I really can't see May doing that, as it just admits she was entirely wrong for triggering it in the first place. I could imagine it might also put the UK in some legal bother too.

-Matt

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"Makes me ashamed to be British the way parliament has dealt with the Brexit process , we are a laughing stock on the world stage ! God help us all !!!

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too."

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too."

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too."
The world has many views you are so blinkered it is crazy

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

"Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too.The world has many views you are so blinkered it is crazy"

I think it is perhaps you who is blinkered.

The world has borne witness to the most inept and shambolic political performance not seen in a civilised country for generations.

Brexit has blinded rationale, blown perspective into smithereens and reduced our once great Parliament to a pointless debating chamber, full of pointless people clinging on to pointless ideologies at the expense of all of us.

We have seen our politicians, outmaneuvered, politically sidelined and made to look like the second rate negotiators that they actually are.

The Brexit negotiations have shone a very bright light on to the sheer incompetence of the politicians allegedly representing our interests. It really is no surprise that we have so many failings in this country and after this shit show, it is all the more remarkable that people cannot see that the culprits lie not in Brussels, but in the Westminster den of ineptitude and amatuerism.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

Indeed. The populists promised the impossible and left it to the politicians to deliver.

Instead of calling out their bullshit and resetting public expectations, they regurgitated the rhetoric.

It’s how populism works. It leads to dysfunctional government and chaos, be it here or in the US.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"Take back control, said the populists.

So people said: “Go on, then.”

They don’t know how to.

They don’t know what to do with it.

They made promises they never thought they would have to deliver.

Those who stuck around are drowning in their own incompetence.

Exposed as charlatans and frauds.

It’s how populism works.

It’s a shambles, and the rest of the world can see it, too.The world has many views you are so blinkered it is crazy

I think it is perhaps you who is blinkered.

The world has borne witness to the most inept and shambolic political performance not seen in a civilised country for generations.

We have seen our politicians, outmaneuvered, politically sidelined and made to look like the second rate negotiators that they actually are.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

if you are watching this debate on the "free vote"..... its not the free vote that it seems....

two amendments were brought up... so where would have been 3 votes in all....

Spelmans.... which meant "no deal" would have been taken off the table for good rather than just on march 29th

Greens.... which is basically malthouse compromise b, no deal with a transistion (which has already been turned down by the EU and Barnier) with the addition that leave date is moved from march 29th to may 22nd

and the the overall government vote... which is that no deal is only taken off the table in relation to the march 29th date....

now the government are apparently going to allow a free vote on greens amendment and their vote...... but are NOT going to on spelmans... and are imposing the whip to make their side vote against it.....

so when you see what happens later.... just so you are aware they are appeasing the ERG yet again

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"if you are watching this debate on the "free vote"..... its not the free vote that it seems....

two amendments were brought up... so where would have been 3 votes in all....

Spelmans.... which meant "no deal" would have been taken off the table for good rather than just on march 29th

and the the overall government vote... which is that no deal is only taken off the table in relation to the march 29th date....

so when you see what happens later.... just so you are aware they are appeasing the ERG yet again"

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

In the last week of this month, after the council of ministers is unable to approve unanimously the UK request to delay the exit, Mrs May will be back in the Commons for the last throw of the dice - approve her deal or leave at the end of the week without one.

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

"In the last week of this month, after the council of ministers is unable to approve unanimously the UK request to delay the exit, Mrs May will be back in the Commons for the last throw of the dice - approve her deal or leave at the end of the week without one."
i wonder if she believes in 3rd time lucky lol

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

Well, if you listened to Mrs May and her Ministers in the Commons today, it is clear they have not given up on getting approved. They have no Plan B.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament. "

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"May is so weak ...if Maggie had the chance she would of battered them from start to finish ....like the miners/unions etc

And 35 years later how do you think that has worked out for the country?

Now tell me how great the milk snatcher was and how we need more of the same...It worked `100%you are totally blind ,I lost my business because of Maggie but still know she is the greatest PM of my lifetime.Yes I suffered for a time but all I have now is due to Maggie.A bit like Brexit might be,one step back and three steps forward."

Or one step over a cliff, regretting what we did - would be a more accurate analogy

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!"

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't).

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't). "

actually there ARE other tories on the sheet.....

the reason it was called the Spelman-Dromey amendment in the first place was that they were cross party mps in neighbouring seats

it just may be that yvette cooper or someone else may push it....

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't).

actually there ARE other tories on the sheet.....

the reason it was called the Spelman-Dromey amendment in the first place was that they were cross party mps in neighbouring seats

it just may be that yvette cooper or someone else may push it.... "

Well not long to find out, we shall see what happens later tonight.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't).

actually there ARE other tories on the sheet.....

the reason it was called the Spelman-Dromey amendment in the first place was that they were cross party mps in neighbouring seats

it just may be that yvette cooper or someone else may push it....

Well not long to find out, we shall see what happens later tonight. "

cooper has moved the spelman amendment... game on......

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't).

actually there ARE other tories on the sheet.....

the reason it was called the Spelman-Dromey amendment in the first place was that they were cross party mps in neighbouring seats

it just may be that yvette cooper or someone else may push it....

Well not long to find out, we shall see what happens later tonight.

cooper has moved the spelman amendment... game on......"

Spelman not backing It and the government whipped to vote against it. So any cabinet ministers who vote for Coopers ammendment will be sacked.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It was reported over an hour ago that Spellman had pulled her ammendment. Her ammendment now won't be voted on in Parliament.

because spelman was the main proposer... but not the only one, it means someone else "could" in theory move the amendment.... and yvette cooper in her speech has just said she may still do that!

Unlikely to pass though without Spellman's backing. Other tories only likely to back It if it had Spellman's name attached to it (which it now won't).

actually there ARE other tories on the sheet.....

the reason it was called the Spelman-Dromey amendment in the first place was that they were cross party mps in neighbouring seats

it just may be that yvette cooper or someone else may push it....

Well not long to find out, we shall see what happens later tonight.

cooper has moved the spelman amendment... game on......

Spelman not backing It and the government whipped to vote against it. So any cabinet ministers who vote for Coopers ammendment will be sacked. "

Hopefully everyone votes for it including T May

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

and cooper wins by 4...... wow!!!

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

Bye bye brexit and good riddens to bad rubbish !

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By *ross-eyed MaryMan
over a year ago

Salisbury

What do they mean by non binding vote?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"What do they mean by non binding vote?"

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight.....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What do they mean by non binding vote?"

Not legally binding

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

government are now apparently trying to whip against their own motion now......

so the "free vote" isn't a free vote after all and are trying to sink their own motion....

this is all madness........

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"What do they mean by non binding vote?"

It's not legally binding so is basically meaningless. The default legal position is we still leave with no deal on March 29th in the absence of anything else. That is UK law in the EU withdrawal act.

It will also be interesting to see if any cabinet ministers voted for Coopers ammendment because if they did they will now have to resign their cabinet post.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

It's not legally binding so is basically meaningless. The default legal position is we still leave with no deal on March 29th in the absence of anything else. That is UK law in the EU withdrawal act.

It will also be interesting to see if any cabinet ministers voted for Coopers ammendment because if they did they will now have to resign their cabinet post. "

I think now though it gives May a mandate that she can rescind A50 in the event of No extension knowing MP's will back her.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight....."

You say the government is not going to go against the will of the house, but the house has gone against the will of the people to Leave the EU as expressed in the referendum.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight.....

You say the government is not going to go against the will of the house, but the house has gone against the will of the people to Leave the EU as expressed in the referendum. "

But the government needs the house to enable them to do anything.

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester

Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight.....

You say the government is not going to go against the will of the house, but the house has gone against the will of the people to Leave the EU as expressed in the referendum. "

Leave was a lie, so MPs voting against stupidity and lies is not a bad thing for a change. Maybe we are seeing the dawning of some common sense

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

govt lose/win their own motion by 43.........

this is chaos.... we will see resignations coming!

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

Given that possibility and the current impasse should we withdraw article 50?

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"govt lose/win their own motion by 43.........

this is chaos.... we will see resignations coming!"

Not sure even they know what the fuck is going on..

No wonder the Eu are spitting feathers

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

Funny you should say that as Nigel Farage has just been speaking on the BBC news channel. In light of events in Parliament over the last 2 days he's now looking to persuade his anti EU friends and allies in Europe such as Salvini of Italy and Orban of Hungary to veto any extension to article 50. All 27 EU member states have to agree to an extension so it would only take 1 veto to torpedo it. Let's see if Nigel Farage can pull a Brexit rabbit out of the hat.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

my god you are like the bloke playing the violin whilst the titanic is going down......

clutching many straws tonight are we.....

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By *rotic-TouchTV/TS
over a year ago

doncaster

Its like a big game in The Commons but it's playing with people's lives

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

anyway.... govt A50 extension motion is out for tomorrow....

government are going to propose that they ask for an extension till june 30th

..... lets see how this is spun

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

So you are celebrating a man conspiring with foreign governments against the sovereignty of Parliament and the British government?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

One second you’re saying we need to respect democracy at all costs. And that we need sovereignty, that was one of your main reasons for Brexit.

Now you’re saying Farage should use the above tactics to circumvent democracy and to trump British sovereignty.

You’re becoming more entertaining by the day.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Any A50 extension request has to be vetoed, shot down, sunk, destroyed, shattered, killed.

This madness has to end one way or another and it's probably going to have to be an EU 27 member state that needs to facilitate holding a gun to May's head and say, you have 16 days, fucking choose.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight.....

You say the government is not going to go against the will of the house, but the house has gone against the will of the people to Leave the EU as expressed in the referendum.

Leave was a lie, so MPs voting against stupidity and lies is not a bad thing for a change. Maybe we are seeing the dawning of some common sense

It was joining the common market in the first place in the 1970's that was a lie. The House of Commons didn't display any sense back then and it seems nothing has changed.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

my god you are like the bloke playing the violin whilst the titanic is going down......

clutching many straws tonight are we....."

Where is the straw clutching? It will only take 1 veto to stop an extension to article 50, that's not straw clutching, that's just a fact.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"anyway.... govt A50 extension motion is out for tomorrow....

government are going to propose that they ask for an extension till june 30th

..... lets see how this is spun"

EU unlikely to agree as that goes beyond the European MEP elections in May.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"What do they mean by non binding vote?

basically you are now going to see a fight between what is "morally binding" and what is "legally binding"......

legally it isn't enforceable... but the government isn't going to go against the will of the house.... basically no deal in essence took an almost ko blow tonight.....

You say the government is not going to go against the will of the house, but the house has gone against the will of the people to Leave the EU as expressed in the referendum.

Leave was a lie, so MPs voting against stupidity and lies is not a bad thing for a change. Maybe we are seeing the dawning of some common sense

It was joining the common market in the first place in the 1970's that was a lie. The House of Commons didn't display any sense back then and it seems nothing has changed. "

Articles 2 and 3of the Treaty of Rome. What we signed up to.

Where's the lie?

"ARTICLE 2

The Community shall have as its task, by establishing a common market and

progressively approximating the economic policies of Member States, to promote

throughout the Community a harmonious development of economic activities, a

continuous and balanced expansion, an increase in stability, an accelerated raising of the

standard of living and closer relations between the States belonging to it.

ARTICLE 3

For the purposes set out in Article 2, the activities of the Community shall include, as

provided in this Treaty and in accordance with the timetable set out therein

(a) the elimination, as between Member States, of customs duties and of quantitative

restrictions on the import and export of goods, and of all other measures having

equivalent effect;

(b) the establishment of a common customs tariff and of a common commercial

policy towards third countries;

persons, services and capital;

(d) the adoption of a common policy in the sphere of agriculture;

(e) the adoption of a common policy in the sphere of transport;

(f) the institution of a system ensuring that competition in the common market is not

distorted;

(g) the application of procedures by which the economic policies of Member States

can he co-ordinated and disequilibria in their balances of payments remedied;

(h) the approximation of the laws of Member States to the extent required for the

proper functioning of the common market;

(i) the creation of a European Social Fund in order to improve employment

opportunities for workers and to contribute to the raising of their standard of

living;

(j) the establishment of a European Investment Bank to facilitate the economic

expansion of the Community by opening up fresh resources;

(k) the association of the overseas countries and territories in order to increase trade

and to promote jointly economic and social development."

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Fucking MPS are clueless !

We voted out , end of .

So I hope the EU tell us to fuck off anyway and we leave with no deal .

Unfortunately they need us so that won’t happen and we will no doubt end up staying in and having the rest of Europe stuffing us even more than ever .

What a joke

So you are celebrating a man conspiring with foreign governments against the sovereignty of Parliament and the British government?"

Why not. The likes of Blair, Mandelson and Campbell have been conspiring with the EU for months against the will of the British people to Leave.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

May deal coming back to Commons again. If it is not approved, UK to ask for long extension. If it is approvec, UK to ask for short extension.

The so-called free vote turned out to be three-line whip that MPs and Ministers ignored.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I have done a new thread we can continue on

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