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"The hubris of David Cameron. He gambled the union of the UK and won, and thought he could do the same with the union with Europe. He lost, he had no plan and had given no thought what to do next, so he fled the scene. Whatever the faults of Mrs May, history will judge her more kindly than the recklessness of Cameron. His failings go way beyond ineptitude. It was negligence in a monumental scale." I think Sara J would make an excellent PM | |||
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"The hubris of David Cameron. He gambled the union of the UK and won, and thought he could do the same with the union with Europe. He lost, he had no plan and had given no thought what to do next, so he fled the scene. Whatever the faults of Mrs May, history will judge her more kindly than the recklessness of Cameron. His failings go way beyond ineptitude. It was negligence in a monumental scale. I think Sara J would make an excellent PM"  Sara, always informed, intelligent, pragmatic and a joy  | |||
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"The hubris of David Cameron. He gambled the union of the UK and won, and thought he could do the same with the union with Europe. He lost, he had no plan and had given no thought what to do next, so he fled the scene. Whatever the faults of Mrs May, history will judge her more kindly than the recklessness of Cameron. His failings go way beyond ineptitude. It was negligence in a monumental scale. I think Sara J would make an excellent PM Sara, always informed, intelligent, pragmatic and a joy "You gals certainly brighten up most days! | |||
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"The hubris of David Cameron. He gambled the union of the UK and won, and thought he could do the same with the union with Europe. He lost, he had no plan and had given no thought what to do next, so he fled the scene. Whatever the faults of Mrs May, history will judge her more kindly than the recklessness of Cameron. His failings go way beyond ineptitude. It was negligence in a monumental scale. I think Sara J would make an excellent PM"
Agreed, and if one were not on message then she could run a 3 line whip on me.. | |||
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" I think Sara J would make an excellent PM" I think I'd rather be whipped on the back benches by black rod  | |||
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"All triggered by conservative party behaviour. The conservative party had MPs that might have lost seats to UKIP, so David Cameron promised a referendum. The conservative information/advisory referendum then produced the leave option by a small majority. Cameron resigned. A desperate May wanted the PM job. The conservative PM May then, perhaps due to knowing that her party had extremists within it, did not seek to get the conservative party to agree what its agreed position nor plans were for leaving the EU, went ahead and triggered Article 50. Much of the 2 year Article 50 period was then wasted, whilst the conservatives argued amongst themselves, disrupting the completion of any deal with the EU. December 2018 saw conservative PM delay the parliamentary vote on the EU deal for a month, reducing the few days left until EU departure. January 2019, the conservative PM still loses vote, with even fewer days to March, which could mean a catstrophic departure. The conservatives have foisted this obscene mess on to the country. A desperate attempt to retain power by the party and individuals in it, including Cameron, May, former ministers and back-benchers. By triggering Article 50 before the conservatives had any agreement on what they wanted, this wasted almost 2 years of Article 50 time: and they still have no agreement amongst themselves. If this happened at junior level in any organisation, such individuals would have their employment curtailed. It's definitely extraordinary, it's not something that the majority of citizens would experience in normal life, as it's incompetence of the highest order, with massive implications for everyone. To the conservatives, it's obviously fairly reasonable, to submit the population to such perrilous endeavours - and at huge cost (the £billions wasted fruitlessly). Much of the media is complicit in this and the lack of attention to this being a 100% conservative induced and managed catastrophe isn't highlighted." The behaviour of all MP's on all sides of the house or are you to blind and to stuck in childish party dogma to see that.Anyway it is clear that May does not represent the Tory party or is that beyond you to | |||
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" I think Sara J would make an excellent PM I think I'd rather be whipped on the back benches by black rod "that's because your kinky | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country." The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. " You don't half talk some crap. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. " What other Countries 'roar' centy? I hear the chest beating pride from all leaders. Then when reality knocks it's all hushed whispers in ears and carful language in conference meeting and negotiations. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. You don't half talk some crap. " Maybe he if we stick dry teabags in his mouth he'll calm down. | |||
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"Is this what brexit has become. Let’s stop talking about issues, but argue the toss over shit metaphors. "The language people use is a tell, regarding what rhetory works on them. | |||
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"Is this what brexit has become. Let’s stop talking about issues, but argue the toss over shit metaphors. "Or whether people should put teabags in their ears.  | |||
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"All triggered by conservative party behaviour. The conservative party had MPs that might have lost seats to UKIP, so David Cameron promised a referendum. The conservative information/advisory referendum then produced the leave option by a small majority. Cameron resigned. A desperate May wanted the PM job. The conservative PM May then, perhaps due to knowing that her party had extremists within it, did not seek to get the conservative party to agree what its agreed position nor plans were for leaving the EU, went ahead and triggered Article 50. Much of the 2 year Article 50 period was then wasted, whilst the conservatives argued amongst themselves, disrupting the completion of any deal with the EU. December 2018 saw conservative PM delay the parliamentary vote on the EU deal for a month, reducing the few days left until EU departure. January 2019, the conservative PM still loses vote, with even fewer days to March, which could mean a catstrophic departure. The conservatives have foisted this obscene mess on to the country. A desperate attempt to retain power by the party and individuals in it, including Cameron, May, former ministers and back-benchers. By triggering Article 50 before the conservatives had any agreement on what they wanted, this wasted almost 2 years of Article 50 time: and they still have no agreement amongst themselves. If this happened at junior level in any organisation, such individuals would have their employment curtailed. It's definitely extraordinary, it's not something that the majority of citizens would experience in normal life, as it's incompetence of the highest order, with massive implications for everyone. To the conservatives, it's obviously fairly reasonable, to submit the population to such perrilous endeavours - and at huge cost (the £billions wasted fruitlessly). Much of the media is complicit in this and the lack of attention to this being a 100% conservative induced and managed catastrophe isn't highlighted." Regardless of who triggered Brexit, it’s what the country voted for. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. " Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit..." Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit..." Most of that is false, that's not bs it's plain old facts.. | |||
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"From a positive angle: the predicted snowball effect of more countries wanting to leave the EU won't happen. Sure nobody wants to follow that one...." They've all seen the brexit car crash .. and collectively said fuck that!!! | |||
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"From a positive angle: the predicted snowball effect of more countries wanting to leave the EU won't happen. Sure nobody wants to follow that one.... They've all seen the brexit car crash .. and collectively said fuck that!!! "Tbh, the car crash has been created not by invoking article 50 per se, but from having the good Friday agreement (and the risks of breaking it). An Italian (day) could look at us and say they could make a success where we can’t. I think the real wake up call will come when it comes to the speed we sign other trade agreements and the additional friction of trade. If we get great deals signed quickly and there’s little friction, they may fancy it. If we struggle to get to the table, or then get bent over it, smaller economies may be a lot more reluctant to leave the power in numbers of the EU. Or they may ignore all the money side and vote on other emotional issues. Like we did. And possibly still would ... | |||
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"From a positive angle: the predicted snowball effect of more countries wanting to leave the EU won't happen. Sure nobody wants to follow that one.... They've all seen the brexit car crash .. and collectively said fuck that!!!
Tbh, the car crash has been created not by invoking article 50 per se, but from having the good Friday agreement (and the risks of breaking it).
An Italian (day) could look at us and say they could make a success where we can’t.
I think the real wake up call will come when it comes to the speed we sign other trade agreements and the additional friction of trade.
If we get great deals signed quickly and there’s little friction, they may fancy it.
If we struggle to get to the table, or then get bent over it, smaller economies may be a lot more reluctant to leave the power in numbers of the EU.
Or they may ignore all the money side and vote on other emotional issues. Like we did. And possibly still would ..." | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit..." Again, can you answer my question I asked weeks ago - the one where you said Germany is acting or is,like it was in the second world war? | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. " Nonsense. We managed to prosecute several wars (for better or worse) and have leveraged our power at the EU top table to our benefit with international trade agreements and coordinated sanctions as a foreign policy tool. Interesting parallel between Brexit and the partition of India in The New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/17/opinion/sunday/brexit-ireland-empire.html | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit..." How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over." do you think Germany holds the same power in the eu as the other 26 | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over." Because we pumped millions into germany after ww2 after ww1 we imposed fines on germany as the victors after ww2 they realized it was a mistake to punish a country and instead of making them pay we executed their leaders.In the 1950,s we wrote of the debt germany owed us from ww1 while we were still paying the usa up until the early 2000,s.Thats how they became a powerhouse.There are other reasons too to do with deregulation but i will leave that to you to read up on. | |||
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" do you think Germany holds the same power in the eu as the other 26 " Each country in the Council of Ministers has a vote. Where a proposal requires a qualified majority vote for approval, the rules under the Treaty of Lisbon require a majority of countries and a majority of population (65%). Germany is the largest member by population, so it carries slightly more weight than France and the UK on the 2nd threshold. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit..." Interesting rant..... but doesn’t actually explain how you think the EU is un-democratic. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over.Because we pumped millions into germany after ww2 after ww1 we imposed fines on germany as the victors after ww2 they realized it was a mistake to punish a country and instead of making them pay we executed their leaders.In the 1950,s we wrote of the debt germany owed us from ww1 while we were still paying the usa up until the early 2000,s.Thats how they became a powerhouse.There are other reasons too to do with deregulation but i will leave that to you to read up on. " So in a membership of friendly nations, we the mighty and all conquering Brits were unable to craft the EU to our advantage and instead we allowed Germany to rule Supreme? Is that how it is? Looks like the politics of international relations is a bit out of reach if we fucked up like that. Perhaps we learned our lesson though??? Thinks back over last three years..... Nah, we still appear to be shit at international relations. As one dingbat loves to say... “Nothing’s changed!” | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over.Because we pumped millions into germany after ww2 after ww1 we imposed fines on germany as the victors after ww2 they realized it was a mistake to punish a country and instead of making them pay we executed their leaders.In the 1950,s we wrote of the debt germany owed us from ww1 while we were still paying the usa up until the early 2000,s.Thats how they became a powerhouse.There are other reasons too to do with deregulation but i will leave that to you to read up on. " I always thought the US debts were what made them “great”. Reading up in the germany debt it seems (based on a quick read) it was *only* half the debt and may have been done to help allay fears of them becoming communist. It would be interesting to see if this created a more “level” playing field given the Great War reparations weee crippling. Or gave them a head start. More reading to be done. | |||
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"Germany had a major advantage over the rest of Europe in that they were then, and still are to this day, manufacturing and engineering giants. I read an FT report a couple of years ago that placed German businesses in 16 of the top 20 European manufacturing companies. " So they are just better than us at making stuff and selling it? Incredible to think that instead of learning from that, stage 1 of Thatcherism decimated it and stage 2 post-Brexit (according to Minford, Rees-Mogg etc) it gets completely finished off. Maybe the Germans have a point. Building good shit and selling it brings in dosh and keeps the economy healthy. Why didn’t we think of that? | |||
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"Germany had a major advantage over the rest of Europe in that they were then, and still are to this day, manufacturing and engineering giants. I read an FT report a couple of years ago that placed German businesses in 16 of the top 20 European manufacturing companies. So they are just better than us at making stuff and selling it? Incredible to think that instead of learning from that, stage 1 of Thatcherism decimated it and stage 2 post-Brexit (according to Minford, Rees-Mogg etc) it gets completely finished off. Maybe the Germans have a point. Building good shit and selling it brings in dosh and keeps the economy healthy. Why didn’t we think of that?" Haven't you said repeatedly on here you were a staunch supporter of Thatcher and Thatcherism in the 1980's? | |||
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"Germany had a major advantage over the rest of Europe in that they were then, and still are to this day, manufacturing and engineering giants. I read an FT report a couple of years ago that placed German businesses in 16 of the top 20 European manufacturing companies. So they are just better than us at making stuff and selling it? Incredible to think that instead of learning from that, stage 1 of Thatcherism decimated it and stage 2 post-Brexit (according to Minford, Rees-Mogg etc) it gets completely finished off. Maybe the Germans have a point. Building good shit and selling it brings in dosh and keeps the economy healthy. Why didn’t we think of that? Haven't you said repeatedly on here you were a staunch supporter of Thatcher and Thatcherism in the 1980's?" Meaning what? I am a normal human being and I have evolved like a normal human being. My thoughts and feelings have evolved in line with my experiences in life and of course I think differently now than I did when I was in my twenties. I have seen more, experienced more and I have different values now. That is only to be expected. Time and experience changes a lot of things in life. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s." This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. " no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all." Your in denial son.You needed stop mentioning the war then basil! If I had a pound for every time a brexiter said in this forum "Germany lost the war but won Europe" id have few hundred quid. Did you miss the endless memes online saying good old tommy would hang his head in shame if anyone was voting for remain betraying our boys buried out there. Know thyself and your fellow brexiters.. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all. Your in denial son.You needed stop mentioning the war then basil! If I had a pound for every time a brexiter said in this forum "Germany lost the war but won Europe" id have few hundred quid. Did you miss the endless memes online saying good old tommy would hang his head in shame if anyone was voting for remain betraying our boys buried out there. Know thyself and your fellow brexiters.. "I am not your son you condescending twat read what i wrote . | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all. Your in denial son.You needed stop mentioning the war then basil! If I had a pound for every time a brexiter said in this forum "Germany lost the war but won Europe" id have few hundred quid. Did you miss the endless memes online saying good old tommy would hang his head in shame if anyone was voting for remain betraying our boys buried out there. Know thyself and your fellow brexiters.. I am not your son you condescending twat read what i wrote ."Language.! Untwist you panties basil Its on the record.. Brexiters used WWII imagery and accused remainers of being traitors for voting remain and your still mentioning the war!
Don't worry you can get back to blaming corbyn for not getting your far right brexit later once your bored of blaming the krauts and of course you will be able to blame us remainers til the day you die..Because your mob will never Except responsibility for anything.. | |||
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"From a positive angle: the predicted snowball effect of more countries wanting to leave the EU won't happen. Sure nobody wants to follow that one.... They've all seen the brexit car crash .. and collectively said fuck that!!!
Tbh, the car crash has been created not by invoking article 50 per se, but from having the good Friday agreement (and the risks of breaking it).
An Italian (day) could look at us and say they could make a success where we can’t.
I think the real wake up call will come when it comes to the speed we sign other trade agreements and the additional friction of trade.
If we get great deals signed quickly and there’s little friction, they may fancy it.
If we struggle to get to the table, or then get bent over it, smaller economies may be a lot more reluctant to leave the power in numbers of the EU.
Or they may ignore all the money side and vote on other emotional issues. Like we did. And possibly still would ..."Don't you think it's a cheap excuse and rather appalling to blame the crash on the Irish border issue respectively gfa? The whole fuck up called Brexit is a multifaceted one with many players and factors, mainly driven by narrowminded self-interest, greed and arrogance. | |||
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"There were no winners from WW2. All countries suffered devestating losses. After the war, Germany got help in rebuilding from two different sources. The Soviets took care of their part, and the Western half was helped by the USA, under the Marshall plan. Whilst this was seen as an aid and recovery programme, it's true purpose was to stop the spread of communism any further westwards. The biggest recipient of aid from the Marshall Plan was actually the UK." Indeed. What is often overlooked is that the allies in the west were already engaged in a new war before the one with Germany was over. The ideological war of capitalism versus communism. Some of the hawks even wanted to attack the USSR straight away with the technological advantage that nuclear weaponry gave the Americans. West Germany became a front-line in that new war. In the propaganda battle, West Germany needed to be rebuilt on capitalist lines and shown to prosper more than the rebuilding of East Germany on communist lines. The European Convention of Human Rights - written by the British - was part of that rebuilding exercise. So, too, was the first incarnation of the EU - the steel and coal community arising from the Treaty of Rome. All these issues need to be considered in the geopolitical context of the time. | |||
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" Don't you think it's a cheap excuse and rather appalling to blame the crash on the Irish border issue respectively gfa? The whole fuck up called Brexit is a multifaceted one with many players and factors, mainly driven by narrowminded self-interest, greed and arrogance. " The car crash, as you call it, can be traced a lot further back - to the British partition of Ireland. The same idiotic, imperial mindset that imposed partition on Ireland is the same idiotic, imperial mindset still at work today in the meltdown of what remains of the United Kingdom. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all." And your version of “history” is that they were given an unfair advantage over everyone else and that is the only reason that, in your opinion, they now “control the EU” and were able to exert more influence in the EU than any other single country AND the combined will of all 27 others? That is somewhat fantastical don’t you think? The very issue with Brexitology and the Brexshit mindset is that it tries to paint an alternative factual reality in order to fit an opinion. | |||
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"From a positive angle: the predicted snowball effect of more countries wanting to leave the EU won't happen. Sure nobody wants to follow that one.... They've all seen the brexit car crash .. and collectively said fuck that!!!
Tbh, the car crash has been created not by invoking article 50 per se, but from having the good Friday agreement (and the risks of breaking it).
An Italian (day) could look at us and say they could make a success where we can’t.
I think the real wake up call will come when it comes to the speed we sign other trade agreements and the additional friction of trade.
If we get great deals signed quickly and there’s little friction, they may fancy it.
If we struggle to get to the table, or then get bent over it, smaller economies may be a lot more reluctant to leave the power in numbers of the EU.
Or they may ignore all the money side and vote on other emotional issues. Like we did. And possibly still would ...
Don't you think it's a cheap excuse and rather appalling to blame the crash on the Irish border issue respectively gfa?
The whole fuck up called Brexit is a multifaceted one with many players and factors, mainly driven by narrowminded self-interest, greed and arrogance.
"I think the border, and the nature of the GFA, has created a circle that can’t be squared. If it didn’t exist then I’m not saying it wouldn’t have still been a pigs ear. As you say, too many players. However I think the GFA made the last two years of issues almost inevitable. It ties us closer to the EU than possibly even being in the euro. | |||
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"Germany had a major advantage over the rest of Europe in that they were then, and still are to this day, manufacturing and engineering giants. I read an FT report a couple of years ago that placed German businesses in 16 of the top 20 European manufacturing companies. So they are just better than us at making stuff and selling it? Incredible to think that instead of learning from that, stage 1 of Thatcherism decimated it and stage 2 post-Brexit (according to Minford, Rees-Mogg etc) it gets completely finished off. Maybe the Germans have a point. Building good shit and selling it brings in dosh and keeps the economy healthy. Why didn’t we think of that?" We've been behind the Germans in making and selling decent products since the late 1920's....almost a hundred years lagging behind them in manufacturing and engineering, which but for WW2 the gap would have been even bigger. | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all. And your version of “history” is that they were given an unfair advantage over everyone else and that is the only reason that, in your opinion, they now “control the EU” and were able to exert more influence in the EU than any other single country AND the combined will of all 27 others? That is somewhat fantastical don’t you think? The very issue with Brexitology and the Brexshit mindset is that it tries to paint an alternative factual reality in order to fit an opinion." I never said no such thing i was telling it how it was nothing about an unfair advantage or them controlling the eu please copy and paste where i have said that.I was making a point of why they developed much quicker than us.If you actually read what i wrote instead of just seeing germany ww2 and assuming i am an anglophile because i voted leave you will see part of what i wrote was were held back by our own governments ministry's not wanting to go back to little regulation because they now had the power.So no not fanatical at all. | |||
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"Germany had a major advantage over the rest of Europe in that they were then, and still are to this day, manufacturing and engineering giants. I read an FT report a couple of years ago that placed German businesses in 16 of the top 20 European manufacturing companies. So they are just better than us at making stuff and selling it? Incredible to think that instead of learning from that, stage 1 of Thatcherism decimated it and stage 2 post-Brexit (according to Minford, Rees-Mogg etc) it gets completely finished off. Maybe the Germans have a point. Building good shit and selling it brings in dosh and keeps the economy healthy. Why didn’t we think of that? Haven't you said repeatedly on here you were a staunch supporter of Thatcher and Thatcherism in the 1980's? Meaning what? I am a normal human being and I have evolved like a normal human being. My thoughts and feelings have evolved in line with my experiences in life and of course I think differently now than I did when I was in my twenties. I have seen more, experienced more and I have different values now. That is only to be expected. Time and experience changes a lot of things in life." This is one of these fault lines in people's approach to the world. 1. Once you make a decision you stick to it and never change your mind regardless of data and consequences. Determined, stalwart, stubborn and inflexible. Vocabulary depends on which side of the argument you're on. 2. Changing your opinion depending on the situation. Pragmatic, realistic, flip-flop and disloyal all used to cover this approach depending on perspective. In reality it's best to have a mix of both but there is always a bias one way or the other. | |||
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"Having done a quick bit of google scholaring it seems Germany was seen as the sick man of Europe in 1990s/2000s. If so, can we really look back as far as the 60s and ww2? It seems their success aha come recently and twenty years ago we’d not be having this conversation .... Is that fair ?" Sick man of europe ? thats why all the old boys i drink with in spain had to leave there wives and kids to go and work there because there was plenty of jobs in spain?.I think they went through a period when the wall came down because they then had millions of more people to sort out. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit... How did We glorious, powerful and all conquering Brits allow the Germans to seize control of the entire EU and all it’s Members? I suggest one of two things: Maybe we are notbthat powerful if we can’t even get control of an economic union of friends and - or more likely..., The fantasy that the EU is under the German jackboot is just another silly little bogeyman under the bed for Brexiters to get their knickers in a twist over.Because we pumped millions into germany after ww2 after ww1 we imposed fines on germany as the victors after ww2 they realized it was a mistake to punish a country and instead of making them pay we executed their leaders.In the 1950,s we wrote of the debt germany owed us from ww1 while we were still paying the usa up until the early 2000,s.Thats how they became a powerhouse.There are other reasons too to do with deregulation but i will leave that to you to read up on. " That's one of the criticisms of the EU isn't it? Pumping money into economies to develop them? It's also one of the arguments against international development. Investing in less developed countries. If it was just money then everyone would be Germany. So there must be something in how it's done. Investing the money wisely. Not just charity but nation building. Seizing the opportunity and having the right attitude? | |||
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"All triggered by conservative party behaviour. The conservative party had MPs that might have lost seats to UKIP, so David Cameron promised a referendum. The conservative information/advisory referendum then produced the leave option by a small majority. Cameron resigned. A desperate May wanted the PM job. The conservative PM May then, perhaps due to knowing that her party had extremists within it, did not seek to get the conservative party to agree what its agreed position nor plans were for leaving the EU, went ahead and triggered Article 50. Much of the 2 year Article 50 period was then wasted, whilst the conservatives argued amongst themselves, disrupting the completion of any deal with the EU. December 2018 saw conservative PM delay the parliamentary vote on the EU deal for a month, reducing the few days left until EU departure. January 2019, the conservative PM still loses vote, with even fewer days to March, which could mean a catstrophic departure. The conservatives have foisted this obscene mess on to the country. A desperate attempt to retain power by the party and individuals in it, including Cameron, May, former ministers and back-benchers. By triggering Article 50 before the conservatives had any agreement on what they wanted, this wasted almost 2 years of Article 50 time: and they still have no agreement amongst themselves. If this happened at junior level in any organisation, such individuals would have their employment curtailed. It's definitely extraordinary, it's not something that the majority of citizens would experience in normal life, as it's incompetence of the highest order, with massive implications for everyone. To the conservatives, it's obviously fairly reasonable, to submit the population to such perrilous endeavours - and at huge cost (the £billions wasted fruitlessly). Much of the media is complicit in this and the lack of attention to this being a 100% conservative induced and managed catastrophe isn't highlighted.The behaviour of all MP's on all sides of the house or are you to blind and to stuck in childish party dogma to see that.Anyway it is clear that May does not represent the Tory party or is that beyond you to" | |||
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"Its so tragically true.. a complete and utter shambles, had it been written as an episode of Yes Minister the silence after the Editor said 'what planet do you think we are on suggesting running with this' to the author would have been uncomfortable.. " Too true. The Author would have been sent to the naughty corner. | |||
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" I think the GFA made the last two years of issues almost inevitable. It ties us closer to the EU than possibly even being in the euro. " Call the ambulance . . . the Brexit loons will be having cardiac arrest reading that! | |||
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"All triggered by conservative party behaviour. The conservative party had MPs that might have lost seats to UKIP, so David Cameron promised a referendum. The conservative information/advisory referendum then produced the leave option by a small majority. Cameron resigned. A desperate May wanted the PM job. The conservative PM May then, perhaps due to knowing that her party had extremists within it, did not seek to get the conservative party to agree what its agreed position nor plans were for leaving the EU, went ahead and triggered Article 50. Much of the 2 year Article 50 period was then wasted, whilst the conservatives argued amongst themselves, disrupting the completion of any deal with the EU. December 2018 saw conservative PM delay the parliamentary vote on the EU deal for a month, reducing the few days left until EU departure. January 2019, the conservative PM still loses vote, with even fewer days to March, which could mean a catstrophic departure. The conservatives have foisted this obscene mess on to the country. A desperate attempt to retain power by the party and individuals in it, including Cameron, May, former ministers and back-benchers. By triggering Article 50 before the conservatives had any agreement on what they wanted, this wasted almost 2 years of Article 50 time: and they still have no agreement amongst themselves. If this happened at junior level in any organisation, such individuals would have their employment curtailed. It's definitely extraordinary, it's not something that the majority of citizens would experience in normal life, as it's incompetence of the highest order, with massive implications for everyone. To the conservatives, it's obviously fairly reasonable, to submit the population to such perrilous endeavours - and at huge cost (the £billions wasted fruitlessly). Much of the media is complicit in this and the lack of attention to this being a 100% conservative induced and managed catastrophe isn't highlighted.The behaviour of all MP's on all sides of the house or are you to blind and to stuck in childish party dogma to see that.Anyway it is clear that May does not represent the Tory party or is that beyond you to" Apparently she does because her MPs backed her in the leadership vote #justsaying | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. " The problem is that there's noone out there who gives a toss what we think or say. | |||
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"The mighty British lion mewing like a kitten on the international stage. It doesn't matter what the outcome is, a thousand years building a reputation and we are the world's clown. We will never fully recover from this as a country. The British lions roar turned into a kittens mew the day Ted Heath took the UK (by deception) into the common market (now the EU) in 1973. For the last 40 years our voice on the world stage has been turned into a barely audible whisper drowned out by 27 other member states of the EU. The only way to get our voice back is to Leave the anti democratic, corrupt, protection racket in Brussels. Explain exactly how the EU is anti-democratic and corrupt. Last time someone said this ill informed tabloid rubbish it was shown the UK had the democratic deficit... Don’t tell him Pike! It ain’t “ill informed tabloid rubbish” though, is it? The EU have been swallowing up entire nations and spitting them out as fuel for the German economy. We have paid through the nose for this bullshit for years, and the time has come for us to leave, end of. We don’t want them taking our money. We don’t want them interfering with our legal system. We don’t want them forcing extra immigrants on us. We don’t want to be in an army commanded by German generals. We don’t want their poxy single currency. We don’t want to have our hands tied when a nation from outside their little block wants to do business with us. I could go on but I would be late for work. So I’ll leave it so that the lying liberals can “debunk” every issue I have mentioned with ever more pc orientated bullshit..." What an absolute load of old tosh. Most of that is absolute fantasy and lies | |||
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"The advantage germany had was that it was totally destroyed and started from scratch while we were make do and mend,also the chancellor deregulated everything so the cream rose to the top and the weak went under where as we were more regulated than before the war as the government had taken over everything with a minister for this a minister for that.After the war they didnt want to give the power up and we became a nanny state.Thats the short version of why germany prospered and we didnt.Also we had crippling debts while writing off half of their debt in the 50,s. This is the problem with brexiters ..It's still 1945 in their heads.They blame everything on the end of the war and the way we treated our defeated enemy.. I've lived and worked in Germany they have been always and will be leaders in engineering and industry.Its what they do well .Just look at the way they run apprenticeships compared to us.They invest in trainings all their citizens .We don't . Blaming their economic prowess on the war and the costs to us shows brexiters for who they are.. no body is blaming anyone why do you always have to turn it into "brexiters mentality" someone ask a question how germany became an economic powerhouse its history mate thats all. Your in denial son.You needed stop mentioning the war then basil! If I had a pound for every time a brexiter said in this forum "Germany lost the war but won Europe" id have few hundred quid. Did you miss the endless memes online saying good old tommy would hang his head in shame if anyone was voting for remain betraying our boys buried out there. Know thyself and your fellow brexiters.. I am not your son you condescending twat read what i wrote .
Language.!
Untwist you panties basil Its on the record..
Brexiters used WWII imagery and accused remainers of being traitors for voting remain and your still mentioning the war!
Don't worry you can get back to blaming corbyn for not getting your far right brexit later once your bored of blaming the krauts and of course you will be able to blame us remainers til the day you die..Because your mob will never Except responsibility for anything.. "There was a powerful letter in The Times yesterday, mentioning WW2 and Brexit. | |||
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