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"I will happily admit I am very surprised at the scale of the defeat suffered by Mrs May. I had expected a much closer vote. But the 'No Confidence' vote will be strictly on party lines and its result will be down to the DUP, does anyone think they will vote May down? I very much doubt it, but if May decides to withdraw Article 50 then all bets are off in my estimation. What do others think? Please don't make this another leaver/remainer argument, lets discus how how brexit will inform what is about to become a purely party political conflict that could force a GE. After all both sides of the brexit (and maybe party) divide/debate will be equally divided on this issue" The dup leader was on tv just now hes voting for the gov. | |||
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"She won't withdraw Article. I doubt if the EU will roll over either. Labour's only option after losing the no-confidence vote is to go for a 2nd referendum. There are enough Tory MPs who will support that and bind the Government. The EU is willing to suspend Article 50 for a democratic vote. But I suspect that will hinge on the question that is asked in any referendum. Chapter 27 in the pantomime that is British politics." But how many labour mps will vote for a second referendum im not sure if it came to a vote it would be a done deal. | |||
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"military coup. hail el presidente" Not funny! An outlandish option that grows less ridicules every day... If only there were the troops in the Army...  | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. " The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff.  | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff. "It's not my baby, it's the Brexiteers baby that they voted for  | |||
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".But how many labour mps will vote for a second referendum im not sure if it came to a vote it would be a done deal." The alternative is the hard exit. | |||
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"military coup. hail el presidente Not funny! An outlandish option that grows less ridicules every day... If only there were the troops in the Army... "Why do you think they have run our forces down to dangerously low levels ... | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff. "I wouldnt gloat if we leave on a hard brexit irelands economy will be far harder hit than the uk | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff.
I wouldnt gloat if we leave on a hard brexit irelands economy will be far harder hit than the uk"This.. Same as when some on here want the EU to fail, such things are contagious when it's next door.. | |||
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"I will happily admit I am very surprised at the scale of the defeat suffered by Mrs May. I had expected a much closer vote. But the 'No Confidence' vote will be strictly on party lines and its result will be down to the DUP, does anyone think they will vote May down? I very much doubt it, but if May decides to withdraw Article 50 then all bets are off in my estimation. What do others think? Please don't make this another leaver/remainer argument, lets discus how how brexit will inform what is about to become a purely party political conflict that could force a GE. After all both sides of the brexit (and maybe party) divide/debate will be equally divided on this issueThe dup leader was on tv just now hes voting for the gov." The DUP have said they will back the Conservative party in the no Confidence vote tomorrow. The ERG will not vote against their own party in a no confidence vote tomorrow. Corbyn will lose the no confidence vote tomorrow. | |||
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I think we are looking at an a50 suspension for another vote....
june 2019.... vote 2.... this time its really really personal!!! | |||
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"mays deal is dead... no amount of tinkering is going to reverse a 230 vote defeat in a way the hard "no deal" also died tonight.....the tory "taliban" won't have enough votes to push that thru either........ JC aint winning the no confidence vote, so thats the general election off the table they could revoke a50, but that would split the tory party in two... well get ready for the peoples vote!!!!!
I think we are looking at an a50 suspension for another vote....
june 2019.... vote 2.... this time its really really personal!!! "The 'tory taliban' as you referred to them don't have to push a no deal vote through, its already the default position! | |||
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"military coup. hail el presidente Not funny! An outlandish option that grows less ridicules every day... If only there were the troops in the Army... "Sinking the French fisherman an option? | |||
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"Why do you think they have run our forces down to dangerously low levels ... " Because they are greedy self-indulgent fucks, not because they are Machiavellian geniuses who have been planning this for the last 30 plus years. Remember they first started running the forces down under Thatcher when they were calling it the payoff for winning the cold war after the collapse of the Warsaw Pact and the USSR. Problem is when you spend your life grabbing every penny today you loose the pounds tomorrow. | |||
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"Why do you think they have run our forces down to dangerously low levels ... Because they are greedy self-indulgent fucks, not because they are Machiavellian geniuses who have been planning this for the last 30 plus years. Remember they first started running the forces down under Thatcher when they were calling it the payoff for winning the cold war after the collapse of the Warsaw Pact and the USSR. Problem is when you spend your life grabbing every penny today you loose the pounds tomorrow." Very interesting that | |||
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"Sinking the French fisherman an option? "You think starting a war with France is an option... They would hand us our collective arse in a sling. | |||
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"Sinking the French fisherman an option?
You think starting a war with France is an option...
They would hand us our collective arse in a sling."They have more tanks & troops | |||
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"She won't withdraw Article. I doubt if the EU will roll over either. Labour's only option after losing the no-confidence vote is to go for a 2nd referendum. There are enough Tory MPs who will support that and bind the Government. The EU is willing to suspend Article 50 for a democratic vote. But I suspect that will hinge on the question that is asked in any referendum. Chapter 27 in the pantomime that is British politics.But how many labour mps will vote for a second referendum im not sure if it came to a vote it would be a done deal." It’s the only way out for those MPs that are unwilling to risk a no deal exit which will otherwise happen by defult on March 29th. | |||
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"She won't withdraw Article. I doubt if the EU will roll over either. Labour's only option after losing the no-confidence vote is to go for a 2nd referendum. There are enough Tory MPs who will support that and bind the Government. The EU is willing to suspend Article 50 for a democratic vote. But I suspect that will hinge on the question that is asked in any referendum. Chapter 27 in the pantomime that is British politics.But how many labour mps will vote for a second referendum im not sure if it came to a vote it would be a done deal. It’s the only way out for those MPs that are unwilling to risk a no deal exit which will otherwise happen by defult on March 29th." Even though its pretty clear that the majority of the public dont want one? | |||
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" Even though its pretty clear that the majority of the public dont want one " A significant majority clearly don’t want a no deal Brexit either... | |||
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"If we did have a people’s vote, can you imagine the political bunfight over the questions on the ballot paper? I know we’ve discussed it in here before, but given the current divide in government I can’t see them even being able to set the ballot questions without fucking it up. -Matt" Got to agree with you there.  | |||
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"The public voted out. Democracy must win. There cannot be another vote. Its absurd to say we didnt know what we were voting for. We never know exactly what we will get anyway. They should act like professionals and do their job." So regardless of the result, or the lies told by any party to get elected or election promises broken the next general election should be the last. After all by your logic we all will know what we are voting for and that vote must be honoured... So PM for life Corbyn is fine by you... It's not by me and I expect the same goes for you, so where is your disconnect between electing a government and choosing to remain in or leave the EU? Could it be that because of all the conflicting promises offered by the leave side and peoples tendency to lock on to what they want to hear, you and your side won a victory when you expected a spanking, and now that the public are waking up to the reality of they are not all going to get unicorn they were offered you think you may lose if the vote is rerun? I suspect if not you many on the leave side share this fear, and that is why leave are so fiercely opposed to a second legally binding (which the fist ballot was not) vote on the issue. | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff.
I wouldnt gloat if we leave on a hard brexit irelands economy will be far harder hit than the uk"Undoubtedly and unfortunately it will hit the Irish economy too. To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are. | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff.
I wouldnt gloat if we leave on a hard brexit irelands economy will be far harder hit than the uk
Undoubtedly and unfortunately it will hit the Irish economy too.
To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are."No deal brexit means companies stop buying British products to avoid tarriffs. Ireland provides many of those same products and replaces UK customers with EU. Plus we get some of the tax benefit from UK companies moving to the EU, as well as more jobs which decreases social spending. And the EU will be sending money to help stabilise things after Brexit. Overall I think we'll have an adjustment and things will be largely ok. The UK on the other hand has no benefits from a hard brexit. | |||
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"The confidence vote will fail, it's Jeremy Corbyns only option but he's such a limp cock flapping in the wind his motion will fail. May should now tell Junker the backstop is being scrapped and then take that back to Parliament. If Junker refuses about the backstop removal then we make it crystal clear it's no deal WTO route. The EU won't scrap the backstop. Enjoy the trip over the cliff.
I wouldnt gloat if we leave on a hard brexit irelands economy will be far harder hit than the uk
Undoubtedly and unfortunately it will hit the Irish economy too.
To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are.
No deal brexit means companies stop buying British products to avoid tarriffs. Ireland provides many of those same products and replaces UK customers with EU.
Plus we get some of the tax benefit from UK companies moving to the EU, as well as more jobs which decreases social spending.
And the EU will be sending money to help stabilise things after Brexit.
Overall I think we'll have an adjustment and things will be largely ok.
The UK on the other hand has no benefits from a hard brexit.". Yes I would expect you to do quite well from the UK leaving the EU , (financially) , would fully expect the EU to support you to avoid any initial problems , you may even get the English opening offices in your good country , ,,,, people like ,,,,, errrrr,,,,,, Jacob Rees Mogg | |||
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" To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are." Indeed. It's the "they need us more than we need them" mantra. It allows people to ignore the reality, the numbers. As the Spanish PM said last night, the consequences will be negative for the EU and catastrophic for the UK. Ireland will be impacted, for sure. And I'm sure the EU has contingency measures in place to help the Irish Government mitigate the impact. | |||
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" To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are. Indeed. It's the "they need us more than we need them" mantra. It allows people to ignore the reality, the numbers. As the Spanish PM said last night, the consequences will be negative for the EU and catastrophic for the UK. Ireland will be impacted, for sure. And I'm sure the EU has contingency measures in place to help the Irish Government mitigate the impact. " 5% of irish gdp is exports to the uk we export around 12% to the whole EU, of course the big difference is a very large percentage of Irish exports to the uk are food products where tariffs are far bigger than other areas | |||
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"The EU has said this morning under any deal or any government the back stop will remain part of the deal.Its not negotiable. So the only option is the inevitable people's vote and second referendum . " What deal ? The deal is dead its a straight choice now WTO with individual arrangements and on going trade talks or remain. Even if we have another vote who will campaign for May's deal even good old JC cant do that as he voted against it. | |||
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"It's binary now no brexit or no deal.The PM has said as much if her deal failed. Mays deal can't be on the 2nd referendum it's been defeated .The EU won't budge on the back stop parliament will never allow a no deal crash out only the public will be allowed that option aswell as the option of staying in. "So what is the eu going to do over the irish border when we leave on wto terms? They are the ones who will be building the border posts their side of the border, we can do want we want with the border they cant they will have to have customs posts | |||
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"It's binary now no brexit or no deal.The PM has said as much if her deal failed. Mays deal can't be on the 2nd referendum it's been defeated .The EU won't budge on the back stop parliament will never allow a no deal crash out only the public will be allowed that option aswell as the option of staying in.
So what is the eu going to do over the irish border when we leave on wto terms? They are the ones who will be building the border posts their side of the border, we can do want we want with the border they cant they will have to have customs posts"You must have customs and immigration on an external border .Brexiters won't allow an open border with EU .Neither will the EU want an open border. | |||
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" To believe that the impact on the uk's will be lesser shows how deluded no deal Brexiteers are. Indeed. It's the "they need us more than we need them" mantra. It allows people to ignore the reality, the numbers. As the Spanish PM said last night, the consequences will be negative for the EU and catastrophic for the UK. Ireland will be impacted, for sure. And I'm sure the EU has contingency measures in place to help the Irish Government mitigate the impact. 5% of irish gdp is exports to the uk we export around 12% to the whole EU, of course the big difference is a very large percentage of Irish exports to the uk are food products where tariffs are far bigger than other areas" 40+ per cent of all exports from the UK go to EU27 countries. 8 per cent of theirs go the UK. No deal does not stop that, it just puts barriers in the way that increase the cost to business and consumers. | |||
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"It's binary now no brexit or no deal.The PM has said as much if her deal failed. Mays deal can't be on the 2nd referendum it's been defeated .The EU won't budge on the back stop parliament will never allow a no deal crash out only the public will be allowed that option aswell as the option of staying in.
So what is the eu going to do over the irish border when we leave on wto terms? They are the ones who will be building the border posts their side of the border, we can do want we want with the border they cant they will have to have customs posts"Why do you think the rules are different on the UK side than the Irish side? | |||
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"I seriously don’t want a second referendum, but if this government defeat leads us to it, I believe Leave will win again. People will be incensed that the first referendums result could be disrespected in this way, and most will be aware that this is what the government have been aiming for all along..." ...or most people didn't really care that much and don't want to go through this crap again for no reason and will not vote or will vote to remain. Why do you think that this is a conspiracy? It's almost always incompetence that leads to situations like this, not cunning plans. The demand for all the benefits with none of the responsibilities is also impossible to deliver so, unsurprisingly, it's not been delivered. Any mention of "no deal" was always avoided throughout the leave campaign. Instead any option that anybody might want was available. This time around we have the real option which is crash out. That is far less palatable when it is becoming real that jobs will go. You can believe JLR or not, but they have said it out loud and jobs are going. That focusses minds, especially as we head into a global recession. | |||
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"Slightly off thread but nobody ever mentions Turkey. What sort of deal do they have? Not in EU but plenty of Turkish people and goods in Europe. Lots of talk about the Norway deal but never Turkey. Am I missing something obvious?" Not enough time left to negotiate anything- tick tock 72 days | |||
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"Slightly off thread but nobody ever mentions Turkey. What sort of deal do they have? Not in EU but plenty of Turkish people and goods in Europe. Lots of talk about the Norway deal but never Turkey. Am I missing something obvious?" Turkeys trade with the EU is minuscule compared to the UK | |||
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"Slightly off thread but nobody ever mentions Turkey. What sort of deal do they have? Not in EU but plenty of Turkish people and goods in Europe. Lots of talk about the Norway deal but never Turkey. Am I missing something obvious? Not enough time left to negotiate anything- tick tock 72 days" This seems to be Mrs May’s strategy. Run down the clock, allow others to huff and puff about this and that, until MPs find themselves up against a wall and forced to choose between her plan and no plan. It’s an extraordinary thing to be doing. | |||
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"I'll start. I think, even though this will even more divide and fracture British politics and the country, May will fight the No Confidence vote and win. Then even though she and her party will be damaged beyond repair she will refuse to back down and attempt to enforce her will on a parliament and country that clearly is split right down the middle on this issue. " I think that this is the beginning of the end of the tory party as we know it.I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad | |||
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"Slightly off thread but nobody ever mentions Turkey. What sort of deal do they have? Not in EU but plenty of Turkish people and goods in Europe. Lots of talk about the Norway deal but never Turkey. Am I missing something obvious? Not enough time left to negotiate anything- tick tock 72 days This seems to be Mrs May’s strategy. Run down the clock, allow others to huff and puff about this and that, until MPs find themselves up against a wall and forced to choose between her plan and no plan. It’s an extraordinary thing to be doing." You could be right on this one but she is clueless it will not work as donkeys are less stubborn than most MP's | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad" Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. | |||
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"I'll start. I think, even though this will even more divide and fracture British politics and the country, May will fight the No Confidence vote and win. Then even though she and her party will be damaged beyond repair she will refuse to back down and attempt to enforce her will on a parliament and country that clearly is split right down the middle on this issue. I think that this is the beginning of the end of the tory party as we know it.I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad" There could be splits in both Tory and Labour but what are you on about with the military taking over? | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. " If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits?  | |||
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"Slightly off thread but nobody ever mentions Turkey. What sort of deal do they have? Not in EU but plenty of Turkish people and goods in Europe. Lots of talk about the Norway deal but never Turkey. Am I missing something obvious?" No significant agreement on services (70% of our economy). This sort of regulatory agreement is very complicated. Just trade in goods and they take EU regulations without being able to influence them. | |||
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" If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits? "As you keep pointing out, the exit happens on March 29 with or without an agreement, so I really do not understand the point you are trying to make. | |||
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"I'll start. I think, even though this will even more divide and fracture British politics and the country, May will fight the No Confidence vote and win. Then even though she and her party will be damaged beyond repair she will refuse to back down and attempt to enforce her will on a parliament and country that clearly is split right down the middle on this issue. I think that this is the beginning of the end of the tory party as we know it.I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad" Possibly the most hilarious post I've seen on the politics forum for some time.... | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits? "Given a poll you quoted had people choosing remain above no deal (and by a margin) maybe the choice of the people is now to remain. Yet leavers dont want to check, because The choice of the people only matters when it agrees with them ... | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. " And the people will never elect that stupid commie cunt. No chance | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits?
Given a poll you quoted had people choosing remain above no deal (and by a margin) maybe the choice of the people is now to remain. Yet leavers dont want to check, because The choice of the people only matters when it agrees with them ...
"Which poll was that then? If you're referring to the poll of Conservative party members then only 15% opted for remain, 85% want brexit in one form or another. Over 60% preferred no deal compared to May's deal. | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits?
Given a poll you quoted had people choosing remain above no deal (and by a margin) maybe the choice of the people is now to remain. Yet leavers dont want to check, because The choice of the people only matters when it agrees with them ...
Which poll was that then? If you're referring to the poll of Conservative party members then only 15% opted for remain, 85% want brexit in one form or another.
Over 60% preferred no deal compared to May's deal. "You don't believe in polls! | |||
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"I think we are very close to the military having to take over the country as Corbyn cannot be allowed to rule Britain all very sad Thankfully, it is not in your power, nor that of the military, to decide who can and cannot lead the country. That choice lies with the people. If the choice lies with the people as you say we'll still be leaving the EU then, as the people voted Leave in the referendum. Or does 'the choice of the people' only happen when it suits?
Given a poll you quoted had people choosing remain above no deal (and by a margin) maybe the choice of the people is now to remain. Yet leavers dont want to check, because The choice of the people only matters when it agrees with them ...
Which poll was that then? If you're referring to the poll of Conservative party members then only 15% opted for remain, 85% want brexit in one form or another.
Over 60% preferred no deal compared to May's deal. "Same company. Same brexit analysis. But looking at the electorate. Was something like 40+% remain to 30% no deal given the two options. And Mays deal is dead. So it is the two options. | |||
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