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Didn't vote in the Brexit referendum

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I'm reasonably politically aware and I understand (in theory) the importance of exercising my power to vote. I've voted in all National Elections.

However, when it came to voting on leaving the EU I couldn't decide. I knew it was an important decision and one that may effect my children more that it might effect me. With that in mind I took the decision quite seriously and listened to as many views as I could.

The more I learned, the harder the decision became, people kept talking about the Economy, which to be fair is something I usually avoid, Capitalism does my head in. So having to learn about all that crap all over again hurt my head.

Given my children's quality of life is more important to me than my own, I put a fair bit of pressure on myself to make a responsible decision.

My answer in the end? I don't know. I'm not qualified to make a decision on this. I'm too conflicted to choose either way and I don't trust ANY of the interested parties involved. My ideal choice isn't an option and I don't know which vote would take me a step closer to it.

So I chose not to make the decision and didn't vote.

It looks to me as if a second referendum may be a strong possibility. Now, after all that's happened, the extra time it's had to sink in, I've finally come to a decision.

Did any of you decide not to vote in the initial referendum? If so, would you vote if given a second chance? Are you, or have you been undecided about all of this? Have you flipped your views at any point? Care to give your reasoning?

For the record, I thought Brexit may have been an opportunity to change Our Country for the better. Make Our own decisions based on what's really better for all of Us. Only I don't trust ANY of Our British politicians to make those decisions. All the backstabbing, infighting, time wasting, name calling and general immaturity has proper pissed me off and reminded why I think British politicians are pond scum.

Can you guess which way I'm leaning?

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

I was similarly unsure up to the vote, in the end I looked at how i viewed the competency of not only the party in power but the opposition and I went with remain despite my misgivings with some elements of the membership..

I think had we been mature and as with the period of the 2nd world war had a cross party coalition to lead the country, put a plan in place etc then I would have voted leave..

I have seen nothing thus far that will make me change my initial vote..

I don't want another referendum as that's been done so despite my lack of faith in our political class at present they need to sort this and if that means taking the direction of travel out of the hands of the executive then so be it..

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I don't want another one either, I think politicians are starting to fear our frustration in this area and none really want to be totally responsible for the final decision incase they are lynched for it.

I tried to do same as you, judge all sides on both sides of Leave and Remain, here and in Europe.

Only I couldn't make up my mind.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Up until the night before the referendum I was slightly leaning towards leave but for me the main thing was the economy.

Every public service costs money and a lot of it too.

There's hardly any countries that are not in a decent sized trading bloc.

If you're not in a trading bloc then generally tradings more expensive.

More expensive trade then most probably less trade & more expensive products, higher prices.

Less trade or more expensive trade means a lower GDP, and a lower GDP means less money to pay for Education, NHS, Police, Armed Forces, Councils... basically less of everything meaning higher taxes all round to try and make up the shortfall.

We've also spent the last 40+ years developing as a nation interwoven with the EU, so trying to rip ourselves free over night in comparison is unrealistic.

To negotiate all new trade deals will probably take decades, who knows if the new deals would be on par, worse or better than we have now is just a guess so that in its self is a big gamble.

Sovereignty, I honestly don't see how that is something you can feel, how as we are you can feel it's effect on your daily life, how it's making anyone's life worse and how anyone's life could be enriched by leaving regarding sovereignty.

Leaving the EU only takes rights away from us as far as I can make out, I honestly can't see what I or the Country gains by removing some of our rights.

So I ended up with a massive list of negatives / uncertainties regarding voting leave so based my vote on that and decided I wouldn't want the risk when there basically wasn't any real positives I could come up with for leaving other than a load of maybe's, possibly, could be's

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Same as.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Up until the night before the referendum I was slightly leaning towards leave but for me the main thing was the economy.

Every public service costs money and a lot of it too.

There's hardly any countries that are not in a decent sized trading bloc.

If you're not in a trading bloc then generally tradings more expensive.

More expensive trade then most probably less trade & more expensive products, higher prices.

Less trade or more expensive trade means a lower GDP, and a lower GDP means less money to pay for Education, NHS, Police, Armed Forces, Councils... basically less of everything meaning higher taxes all round to try and make up the shortfall.

We've also spent the last 40+ years developing as a nation interwoven with the EU, so trying to rip ourselves free over night in comparison is unrealistic.

To negotiate all new trade deals will probably take decades, who knows if the new deals would be on par, worse or better than we have now is just a guess so that in its self is a big gamble.

Sovereignty, I honestly don't see how that is something you can feel, how as we are you can feel it's effect on your daily life, how it's making anyone's life worse and how anyone's life could be enriched by leaving regarding sovereignty.

Leaving the EU only takes rights away from us as far as I can make out, I honestly can't see what I or the Country gains by removing some of our rights.

So I ended up with a massive list of negatives / uncertainties regarding voting leave so based my vote on that and decided I wouldn't want the risk when there basically wasn't any real positives I could come up with for leaving other than a load of maybe's, possibly, could be's

"

Similar.

I think there are parts of the Eu where I think it’s not what I think is right. But these don’t seem a big enough benefit under a “good brexit” to offset the risk of a “bad brexit”.

Some may have a different cost/benefit/risk analysis.

Some may be prepared to risk gbp and it: fallout to reduce the risk of FoM being taken advantage of, a significant Eu rule being passed we disagree with, or to not be in a European army.

But in most cases it’s trading risks rather than definite outcomes.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

My experience was a little different.

I lived through the 2014 Scottish referendum, and the parallels are illuminating.

The Remain campaign, led by Cameron, and its key messages about economic harm of leaving the UK and EU, no sharing of the £. Just as he did two years later, Cameron instructed Whitehall departments not to make any plans for a Leave outcome.

The Leave went for the heart, with the “be that nation again” rhetoric. It tracked down people who did not normally vote and persuaded them they had nothing to lose voting Yes.

At least the Leave campaign had a plan - a White Paper setting out how they thought it could work.

The campaign was very divisive and bitter.

Fast forward two years and the parallels are similar. Only some of the issues, such as migration, were different.

Unlike Scotland, the UK electorate opted not to heed the economic messages.

Now I see the consequences of trying to disengage from a union after 50 years and I wonder how much worse it would have been to disengage from one after 300 years.

I did not vote in 2014. Billy Connolly summed it up as a morass. I voted to stay in 2016. It is also a morass.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

It's a strange one isn't it? Scottish leave referendum does have some interesting parallels. I'm mixed English/Scottish and again didn't know what the best answer was, don't think I'd have voted in that either, had I been allowed.

Yes, both sides of both referendums were bitter and hard fought. Left the Unions in a bit of a State.

Im very concerned about the Rise in Nationalism the world over, being a fan of history, it reminds me of pre-WW1, pre-WW2 times. I'd prefer not to have a fight about who is the best country. Imagine how good this planet could be if we all mobilised for Peace instead of War.

I think social media is responsible for all of this. Finally we're all being listened to, people are paying attention to our views and more of us are becoming politically aware. I think this rise in Nationalism shows us how uneducated we all are as a species. As a population we're largely unaware of cause and effect, scientific theory, sociology, quality of life, equality, sociology, biology, psychology, anthropology, history and how politics is influenced by all of it.

The political pendulum is in a swing to the Right at the moment, whether it's reached its apex or still building momentum, I've no idea. I just hope the effect results in a long enough swing to the left for us to realise some of the benefits of a kinder society.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

The parallels with the 1930s are fascinating.

A financial crash, austerity, protectionism and populists.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"The parallels with the 1930s are fascinating.

A financial crash, austerity, protectionism and populists.

"

Scary isn't it?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period."

I'm hoping the pendulum swing to the left will wake us up to that.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period."

Lol, you are funny Will.

Maybe you could ask your saviour Jeremy Corbyn about the 'things' he doesn't like about the EU. After all he's been against the EU pretty much his whole career in politics and has been talking about 'things' he dislikes about the EU for the last 4 decades. The 30 plus years of anti EU propaganda you so often like to complain about was started by the far left in the 1970's, by people like Jeremy Corbyn, Tony Benn, George Galloway and Michael Foot. Are these the self-serving politicians you were referring to? As for the media, editors and hacks you refer to does that also include the far left Morning Star newspaper that backed Leave during the referendum and still backs Brexit now.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Lol, you are funny Will.

Maybe you could ask your saviour Jeremy Corbyn about the 'things' he doesn't like about the EU. After all he's been against the EU pretty much his whole career in politics and has been talking about 'things' he dislikes about the EU for the last 4 decades. The 30 plus years of anti EU propaganda you so often like to complain about was started by the far left in the 1970's, by people like Jeremy Corbyn, Tony Benn, George Galloway and Michael Foot. Are these the self-serving politicians you were referring to? As for the media, editors and hacks you refer to does that also include the far left Morning Star newspaper that backed Leave during the referendum and still backs Brexit now. "

Firstly I do not read pro Soviet pro Russian imperialist propaganda, but am not surprised that it would back weakening the EU. But no, I was thinking more bendy bananas, straight cucumbers and all the other banner headline lies pumped out by the 'popular press'. You know the ones who hacked Millie's phone and bribed police.

Secondly I know there are many in the Labour movement who believe the EU is too capitalistic and pro big business. But I will point out that JC has always been open about his misgivings about the EU and its bureaucracy, but has also said that it is the best game in town and that we should be trying to reform it.

Thirdly, I notice that you attack me and name others to justify that attack because you can't find fault with what I have said. You Centy are very good at doing this. Its your default 'go to' position followed quickly by hitting the complain button when anyone gives you a bit of what you hand out back.

Now rather than trying to belittle me how about you try any refute my observation that it is alway 'things' wrong with the EU, never specifics, because when specifics are fact checked they are found to be made up, as in false and lies.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period."

i think the one thing the EU doesn't actually do well enough is "big itself up" when they help in projects....

thats why i think that because people in newcastle/gateshead can see what a difference the EU regeneration money did for central newcastle and gateshead that it was such an tangable thing people here decided to vote remain....

whereas if you point to some projects and say " did you know EU regen money went into this?" you get a look of surprise......

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Keep it clean boys. This is politics. It's automatically confrontational, if you can't keep in cool and non personal then get out of the thread

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period.

i think the one thing the EU doesn't actually do well enough is "big itself up" when they help in projects....

thats why i think that because people in newcastle/gateshead can see what a difference the EU regeneration money did for central newcastle and gateshead that it was such an tangable thing people here decided to vote remain....

whereas if you point to some projects and say " did you know EU regen money went into this?" you get a look of surprise......"

It's not EU money that regenerated the North in areas like Newcastle and Gateshead though Fabio, it's UK money. The UK is a net contributor to the EU and therefore any money coming back to us in the form you describe is money that we (the UK taxpayers) paid into the EU in the first place. The UK paid the EU money and all they've done in Brussels is handed it back to us and rebranded it 'EU money' or 'EU regeneration money'. It's the biggest con trick in history and you've fallen for it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period.

i think the one thing the EU doesn't actually do well enough is "big itself up" when they help in projects....

thats why i think that because people in newcastle/gateshead can see what a difference the EU regeneration money did for central newcastle and gateshead that it was such an tangable thing people here decided to vote remain....

whereas if you point to some projects and say " did you know EU regen money went into this?" you get a look of surprise......

It's not EU money that regenerated the North in areas like Newcastle and Gateshead though Fabio, it's UK money. The UK is a net contributor to the EU and therefore any money coming back to us in the form you describe is money that we (the UK taxpayers) paid into the EU in the first place. The UK paid the EU money and all they've done in Brussels is handed it back to us and rebranded it 'EU money' or 'EU regeneration money'. It's the biggest con trick in history and you've fallen for it. "

It’s not the UKs money. It’s London’s

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You can easily argue it's not our money though.

You could say our money is still in the EU bank or has been spent in Poland or Junkers drank it & we've received money from German contributions instead or from France

So it's impossible to say with certainty it's OUR Money

Would all these places that get EU money still get it when we leave, don't think they will

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"The thing that strikes me about the posts so far is how many sat 'there are things about the EU they don't like'. However I notice its always 'things' because whenever asked to name these things they turn out to be either fictions or UK government policy that when proven to be unpopular has been blamed on the EU.

Maybe someone will start naming these 'things' or just admit that after 30+ years of being told by the press that "You couldn't make this up!" in banner headlines about EU regulations that they had just made up that you had started to believe the propaganda and so your vote was subverted.

And yes, I voted leave. But I voted leave in the hope that in the next year or so the British people will wake up to exactly how they have been manipulated and, as a previous poster suggested, string up the self-serving politicians, media proprietors, editors and hacks that have been pumping out these lies for decades, and maybe move on to their corrupt merchant banker billionaire backers who have stolen so much of our countries wealth over the same period.

i think the one thing the EU doesn't actually do well enough is "big itself up" when they help in projects....

thats why i think that because people in newcastle/gateshead can see what a difference the EU regeneration money did for central newcastle and gateshead that it was such an tangable thing people here decided to vote remain....

whereas if you point to some projects and say " did you know EU regen money went into this?" you get a look of surprise......

It's not EU money that regenerated the North in areas like Newcastle and Gateshead though Fabio, it's UK money. The UK is a net contributor to the EU and therefore any money coming back to us in the form you describe is money that we (the UK taxpayers) paid into the EU in the first place. The UK paid the EU money and all they've done in Brussels is handed it back to us and rebranded it 'EU money' or 'EU regeneration money'. It's the biggest con trick in history and you've fallen for it. "

the north east is a net beneficary of EU money.... I'll happily take it!

nope.... you show me the government put the money in... and then i'll concede the point...

the UK government could have put the money in anytime they wanted... they never did!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would."

if you ditch the empire... what will you have to fall back on!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would.

if you ditch the empire... what will you have to fall back on!!!! "
.

I don't know to be honest, maybe having nothing to fall back on might benefit us in the long run.

What I do know is that power structures always corrupt, it's the nature of hierarchies, those at the bottom are always grateful for the scraps thrown by the elites ("the EU paid for Newcastle regeneration and if they want to give I'll take it")

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

I was uncertain because of the huge complexity of the situation and would not vote based on emotions, only from rational analysis.

The global recession of 2008 was still very recent and millions had had austerity measures imposed on them and UK public services were in dire shape, following massive cuts - these were factors that suggested it was an inappropriate time to inflict major risks and uncertainty on such a state. In any event, the future looked more positively healthy in the EU.

The biggest challenges now and for our future are from damage that humans have caused our world - and continue to inflict upon it. It is certain that the UK should be within the EU to have greater effect for positive influence against such catastrophic changes and the current UK position is poor. We need alliances and collaborative effort more than ever before and Brexit is not that.

Lastly, much of the driver for Brexit was insufficient investment in UK education, health, housing and vital services - Brexit would likely make this worse, with reduced potential to rectify under-investment.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm reasonably politically aware and I understand (in theory) the importance of exercising my power to vote. I've voted in all National Elections.

However, when it came to voting on leaving the EU I couldn't decide. I knew it was an important decision and one that may effect my children more that it might effect me. With that in mind I took the decision quite seriously and listened to as many views as I could.

The more I learned, the harder the decision became, people kept talking about the Economy, which to be fair is something I usually avoid, Capitalism does my head in. So having to learn about all that crap all over again hurt my head.

Given my children's quality of life is more important to me than my own, I put a fair bit of pressure on myself to make a responsible decision.

My answer in the end? I don't know. I'm not qualified to make a decision on this. I'm too conflicted to choose either way and I don't trust ANY of the interested parties involved. My ideal choice isn't an option and I don't know which vote would take me a step closer to it.

So I chose not to make the decision and didn't vote.

It looks to me as if a second referendum may be a strong possibility. Now, after all that's happened, the extra time it's had to sink in, I've finally come to a decision.

Did any of you decide not to vote in the initial referendum? If so, would you vote if given a second chance? Are you, or have you been undecided about all of this? Have you flipped your views at any point? Care to give your reasoning?

For the record, I thought Brexit may have been an opportunity to change Our Country for the better. Make Our own decisions based on what's really better for all of Us. Only I don't trust ANY of Our British politicians to make those decisions. All the backstabbing, infighting, time wasting, name calling and general immaturity has proper pissed me off and reminded why I think British politicians are pond scum.

Can you guess which way I'm leaning?

"

You could have spoiled your ballot paper. It would have counted as a no confidence in the referendum as a whole.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would."

Why stop at an England level parliament ... that’s a power structure too

What would your ultimate end position look like ?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I'm reasonably politically aware and I understand (in theory) the importance of exercising my power to vote. I've voted in all National Elections.

However, when it came to voting on leaving the EU I couldn't decide. I knew it was an important decision and one that may effect my children more that it might effect me. With that in mind I took the decision quite seriously and listened to as many views as I could.

The more I learned, the harder the decision became, people kept talking about the Economy, which to be fair is something I usually avoid, Capitalism does my head in. So having to learn about all that crap all over again hurt my head.

Given my children's quality of life is more important to me than my own, I put a fair bit of pressure on myself to make a responsible decision.

My answer in the end? I don't know. I'm not qualified to make a decision on this. I'm too conflicted to choose either way and I don't trust ANY of the interested parties involved. My ideal choice isn't an option and I don't know which vote would take me a step closer to it.

So I chose not to make the decision and didn't vote.

It looks to me as if a second referendum may be a strong possibility. Now, after all that's happened, the extra time it's had to sink in, I've finally come to a decision.

Did any of you decide not to vote in the initial referendum? If so, would you vote if given a second chance? Are you, or have you been undecided about all of this? Have you flipped your views at any point? Care to give your reasoning?

For the record, I thought Brexit may have been an opportunity to change Our Country for the better. Make Our own decisions based on what's really better for all of Us. Only I don't trust ANY of Our British politicians to make those decisions. All the backstabbing, infighting, time wasting, name calling and general immaturity has proper pissed me off and reminded why I think British politicians are pond scum.

Can you guess which way I'm leaning?

You could have spoiled your ballot paper. It would have counted as a no confidence in the referendum as a whole. "

I could have, didn't see the point.

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East


"

Why stop at an England level parliament ... that’s a power structure too

What would your ultimate end position look like ?"

Indeed. If only England and Wales had voted to leave the UK, instead of voting to remove the UK from the EU, life would be a lot simpler.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would.

Why stop at an England level parliament ... that’s a power structure too

What would your ultimate end position look like ?"
.

As small as possible hence stopping at English level.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would.

Why stop at an England level parliament ... that’s a power structure too

What would your ultimate end position look like ?.

As small as possible hence stopping at English level."

But why stop at English ? Let’s break up Cornwall and use the M25 to create the state of London.

After all a power structure is a power structure. Surely even an English HoC would be too big. Be easier to establish culture in smaller states. I mean, London is probably a bit too difficult to change.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow


"I voted leave because I don't like power structures.

If I could vote leave on the UK, NATO, the commonwealth, the UN and any other power structure I would.

if you ditch the empire... what will you have to fall back on!!!! .

I don't know to be honest, maybe having nothing to fall back on might benefit us in the long run.

What I do know is that power structures always corrupt, it's the nature of hierarchies, those at the bottom are always grateful for the scraps thrown by the elites ("the EU paid for Newcastle regeneration and if they want to give I'll take it")"

Do you believe hierarchical structures will no longer be influential when we leave the European Union?

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