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"Where did you read that - I read two of the perpetrators run a scaffolding business but couldn't find anything about them being in the Convervative party." Just Will's imagination he invents it as he goes along,but is happy to never criticise anti semetism in Labour,just feel sorry for him | |||
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"Where did you read that - I read two of the perpetrators run a scaffolding business but couldn't find anything about them being in the Convervative party.Just Will's imagination he invents it as he goes along,but is happy to never criticise anti semetism in Labour,just feel sorry for him" No need to feel sorry. Here you go sweetheart: https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/17210377.south-norwood-grenfell-effigy-burners-members-of-local-conservative-club/?ref=rss | |||
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"Where did you read that - I read two of the perpetrators run a scaffolding business but couldn't find anything about them being in the Convervative party.Just Will's imagination he invents it as he goes along,but is happy to never criticise anti semetism in Labour,just feel sorry for him No need to feel sorry. Here you go sweetheart: https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/17210377.south-norwood-grenfell-effigy-burners-members-of-local-conservative-club/?ref=rss" Not relevant to my remark,the point I was making is that he only ever looks at anti tory things never anti labour,the fact they are party members is of no relevance to anything. I do think what they did was discusting and proves what sad bastards they are putting it out there,they have made fools of themeselves | |||
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"Where did you read that - I read two of the perpetrators run a scaffolding business but couldn't find anything about them being in the Convervative party.Just Will's imagination he invents it as he goes along,but is happy to never criticise anti semetism in Labour,just feel sorry for him No need to feel sorry. Here you go sweetheart: https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/17210377.south-norwood-grenfell-effigy-burners-members-of-local-conservative-club/?ref=rssNot relevant to my remark,the point I was making is that he only ever looks at anti tory things never anti labour,the fact they are party members is of no relevance to anything. I do think what they did was discusting and proves what sad bastards they are putting it out there,they have made fools of themeselves" Since Corbyn is anti semitic because of the antics of some mebers of the Labour Party, does that make our PM complicit in this racism? | |||
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"Just Will's imagination he invents it as he goes along,but is happy to never criticise anti semetism in Labour,just feel sorry for him" Last time I checked out of the Labour party's near 1 million members we have had 8 expelled for anti-Semitism. The problem the Labour party has is that many of us refuse to accept that criticising the Israeli state for its systematic annexation of Palestinian land and its treatment of the Palestinian people is anti-Semitic. Israel is not the Jewish people and the Jewish people are not Israel. The fact that you would quote such a plainly false equivalence to deflect from the fact that the Tories (who I believe now number less than 200,000) clearly have a serious problem with bigotry based on wealth, a total lack of empathy, Christian moral values and belief in country before party (which they continually claim to be the custodians of) from top to bottom sums you and the party you support up. | |||
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 ) against one of the local Labour party's stalwart workers in there. | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" " Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming.. | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming.." I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming..I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for " True, and no doubt some Labour supporters were involved with the burning of Theresa May and Boris Johnson effigies on Bonfire night that was reported in the press, which was as equally despicable as the Grenfel effigy burning. | |||
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" True, and no doubt some Labour supporters were involved with the burning of Theresa May and Boris Johnson effigies on Bonfire night that was reported in the press, which was as equally despicable as the Grenfel effigy burning. " You forgot to mention the Conservative councillor who "black-faced" for the occasion. | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming..I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for True, and no doubt some Labour supporters were involved with the burning of Theresa May and Boris Johnson effigies on Bonfire night that was reported in the press, which was as equally despicable as the Grenfel effigy burning. " Sometimes you should pause and re-read before you post. | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming..I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for " If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis. | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming..I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis." This guy speaks the truth | |||
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"The father and son who held the party are members of the South Norwood Conservative Club, which is a social organisation for conservative supporters. Think golf trips and snooker tournaments. It is not affiliated to the Conservative Party. Both have had their membership immediately suspended. Neighbours have described the pair as "EDL Wannabees" Brexit has given the green light for some really disgusting views to come to the surface.Its emboldened the far right to air their views publicly.Theres real trouble coming..I don't see what brexit has to do with this post . so if my dog has a shit on your lawn its brexit fault is it ..get back on track .... the making and burning of this effigy is disgraceful . scum will always be scum no matter what party you vote for If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis." When Basil Brush and a bloke singing Kung Fu Fighting get investigated for a hate crime no wonder the numbers have gone up. Even the Home secretary's speech on immigration policy got reported as a hate crime. | |||
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" If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis." The tyrannical man is the son of the democratic man. I have not read Republic by Plato, but the snippets I see convince me he was onto something. The cycle that every society keeps going through. When democracy creates too much freedom for the many, not just the few, the resistance transforms into tyranny. I did get a shock in the 2016 referendum. Then I realised I was blind to what was happening, and has happened since. As a country, I do not think we are not any more bigoted, racist or prejudiced than we were before the referendum. The outcome simply empowered those whose views, until that point, had been held in check by the march of equality. The rise of equality basically deterred the tyrannical types from picking on those of whom they disapproved or considered inferior, even sub-human. Think of race, of ethnicity, of nationality, of gender, of sexuality. For decades now, society has pushed back against the idea it is OK to pick on someone who is gay, or black, and laugh or shrug. Society has sent out a message they are no different from anyone else. Those people who think they are, that they are inferior and a stain on the species, were pushed back into a corner, but they never disappeared. They sneered down their local pub at what they called "political correctness". Brexit lets them feel they can push back. That's why the overwhelming reaction of disgust towards the Grenfell effigy is so important. If the response had been apathetic, as it was in Germany in the early 1930s, it emboldens these people even more. The response was robust and force, which sends out a powerful message. The critical mass still believes in tolerance, and rounds on those who transgress. So long as that continues, we keep tyrannical man in check. | |||
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" If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis. The tyrannical man is the son of the democratic man. I have not read Republic by Plato, but the snippets I see convince me he was onto something. The cycle that every society keeps going through. When democracy creates too much freedom for the many, not just the few, the resistance transforms into tyranny. I did get a shock in the 2016 referendum. Then I realised I was blind to what was happening, and has happened since. As a country, I do not think we are not any more bigoted, racist or prejudiced than we were before the referendum. The outcome simply empowered those whose views, until that point, had been held in check by the march of equality. The rise of equality basically deterred the tyrannical types from picking on those of whom they disapproved or considered inferior, even sub-human. Think of race, of ethnicity, of nationality, of gender, of sexuality. For decades now, society has pushed back against the idea it is OK to pick on someone who is gay, or black, and laugh or shrug. Society has sent out a message they are no different from anyone else. Those people who think they are, that they are inferior and a stain on the species, were pushed back into a corner, but they never disappeared. They sneered down their local pub at what they called "political correctness". Brexit lets them feel they can push back. That's why the overwhelming reaction of disgust towards the Grenfell effigy is so important. If the response had been apathetic, as it was in Germany in the early 1930s, it emboldens these people even more. The response was robust and force, which sends out a powerful message. The critical mass still believes in tolerance, and rounds on those who transgress. So long as that continues, we keep tyrannical man in check. " The difference is that your tyrannical man now has an alternative society to turn to...his support network of like minded goons on the internet. | |||
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"Will you seem to be commiting the error of extrapolating the bad behaviour of some group members to the group. " . Ah the old circular Muslim argument and selective leftism?. Muslims good Tories evil, exchange as appropriate to your political persuasion.  | |||
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"Will you seem to be commiting the error of extrapolating the bad behaviour of some group members to the group. . Ah the old circular Muslim argument and selective leftism?. Muslims good Tories evil, exchange as appropriate to your political persuasion. "Basically....and you are all as wrong as each other | |||
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"Will you seem to be commiting the error of extrapolating the bad behaviour of some group members to the group. " No error on my part, we all get judged by the conduct of the worst not the best of ourselves, our piers and the groups and causes we associate ourselves with. | |||
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"Bollox....by that logic you should hate everyone because a subset of humanity are cunts. Just admit that you getting way too over-zealous with this tory obsession. " It is clear you have not been paying too much attention to my views on humanity, because I hold us in pretty low esteem. In fact I think you will find there have been multiple occasions when I have said that we could do with getting rid of a few billion of us. In fact I seem to remember you asked me once if I was going to be the first to volunteer to be put down (I also seem to remember you were unable to come up with a suitable retort to my answer.) | |||
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" If you choose to be wilfully ignorant in the rise of hate crime recorded by the police since brexit.Thats up to you .I see the view from your sphincter allows you dismiss the rise in hate crimes as liberal fake news.I understand you as a brexiter have no choice but to say there has been no rise in racism due to brexit and the empowerment of the far right neo nazis. The tyrannical man is the son of the democratic man. I have not read Republic by Plato, but the snippets I see convince me he was onto something. The cycle that every society keeps going through. When democracy creates too much freedom for the many, not just the few, the resistance transforms into tyranny. I did get a shock in the 2016 referendum. Then I realised I was blind to what was happening, and has happened since. As a country, I do not think we are not any more bigoted, racist or prejudiced than we were before the referendum. The outcome simply empowered those whose views, until that point, had been held in check by the march of equality. The rise of equality basically deterred the tyrannical types from picking on those of whom they disapproved or considered inferior, even sub-human. Think of race, of ethnicity, of nationality, of gender, of sexuality. For decades now, society has pushed back against the idea it is OK to pick on someone who is gay, or black, and laugh or shrug. Society has sent out a message they are no different from anyone else. Those people who think they are, that they are inferior and a stain on the species, were pushed back into a corner, but they never disappeared. They sneered down their local pub at what they called "political correctness". Brexit lets them feel they can push back. That's why the overwhelming reaction of disgust towards the Grenfell effigy is so important. If the response had been apathetic, as it was in Germany in the early 1930s, it emboldens these people even more. The response was robust and force, which sends out a powerful message. The critical mass still believes in tolerance, and rounds on those who transgress. So long as that continues, we keep tyrannical man in check. " Good post.However I fear the tide is turning in favour of the extremists.A prudent person should be prepared for their arrival and ascendency into power and following purge. | |||
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"I fear the tide is turning in favour of the extremists.A prudent person should be prepared for their arrival and ascendency into power and following purge." I think the extremists are already here and that the purges have already begun. After all the murdering of 6 million Jews did not begin with Operation Reinhard and the death camps of Belzec, Birkenau, Sobibor and Treblinka. It started with stripping German Jews of passports and citizenship (even the ones who had fought and been decorated in WW1). Anyone for a bit of Maybot Tory Windrush, Trumpster ICE or Italian 5 Star Gipsy expultions? | |||
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"Bollox....by that logic you should hate everyone because a subset of humanity are cunts. Just admit that you getting way too over-zealous with this tory obsession. It is clear you have not been paying too much attention to my views on humanity, because I hold us in pretty low esteem. In fact I think you will find there have been multiple occasions when I have said that we could do with getting rid of a few billion of us. In fact I seem to remember you asked me once if I was going to be the first to volunteer to be put down (I also seem to remember you were unable to come up with a suitable retort to my answer.) " I don't remember that all.... | |||
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"I think racist sentiment grows in proportion to the increase in numbers of foreign nationals in a country. We don't have brexit or as the case would be irexit yet we have more racism now than ever before due to the fact that in the past there were very little foreigner in our country. Over the last decade Britain has seen a big increase in foreign nationals as has Ireland and hence more targets for racists. Also years ago I Remeber the UK had the NF, combat 18 and the BNP. I'm not justifying racism btw just pointing out factors other than brexit" I'd offer an opposite theory....people naturally fear the unknown and exhibit tribal behaviour but this can be normalised through integration and making the presence of people who look different normal. Put kids playing together early enough and limit any top down racist messages from their elders and you'll dissolve racism in a generation. | |||
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"As a mixed race person I can say I'm sick of hearing about racism, my life experiences are obviously different to my brothers who thinks the world revolves around it or it could be that I'm paler skinned than him and see less of it?. I don't know to be honest but I am sick of hearing the constant hark to racism by I'm sorry to say, mainly white people, racism exists and none of this will make it go away, it's part of human nature,I just try my best to not let it define me as an individual."  | |||
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"I think racist sentiment grows in proportion to the increase in numbers of foreign nationals in a country. We don't have brexit or as the case would be irexit yet we have more racism now than ever before due to the fact that in the past there were very little foreigner in our country. Over the last decade Britain has seen a big increase in foreign nationals as has Ireland and hence more targets for racists. Also years ago I Remeber the UK had the NF, combat 18 and the BNP. I'm not justifying racism btw just pointing out factors other than brexit I'd offer an opposite theory....people naturally fear the unknown and exhibit tribal behaviour but this can be normalised through integration and making the presence of people who look different normal. Put kids playing together early enough and limit any top down racist messages from their elders and you'll dissolve racism in a generation. " Well not an opposite theory really, the more foreigners (the unknown) that come in the more people fear change and hence racism expands but as you rightly say integration and education are the key. | |||
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"As a mixed race person I can say I'm sick of hearing about racism, my life experiences are obviously different to my brothers who thinks the world revolves around it or it could be that I'm paler skinned than him and see less of it?. I don't know to be honest but I am sick of hearing the constant hark to racism by I'm sorry to say, mainly white people, racism exists and none of this will make it go away, it's part of human nature,I just try my best to not let it define me as an individual." If I remember rightly you previous incarnation here was '"bongo boy" from bongo land.Tell us more about that sock puppet  | |||
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"As a mixed race person I can say I'm sick of hearing about racism, my life experiences are obviously different to my brothers who thinks the world revolves around it or it could be that I'm paler skinned than him and see less of it?. I don't know to be honest but I am sick of hearing the constant hark to racism by I'm sorry to say, mainly white people, racism exists and none of this will make it go away, it's part of human nature,I just try my best to not let it define me as an individual. If I remember rightly you previous incarnation here was '"bongo boy" from bongo land.Tell us more about that sock puppet ". I've no idea what your talking about but I've already blocked you for this stuff so I don't know how your managing to post on my messages but I'll report it again. | |||
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" I've no idea what your talking about but I've already blocked you for this stuff so I don't know how your managing to post on my messages but I'll report it again." Me thinks you do protest too much. By the way this is not your post, it is a thread in an open forum that anyone regardless of your approval can post on. | |||
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" Me thinks you do protest too much. . " We all think you protest too much You have ignored my point on how the rich get their money for the second time now. | |||
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"As a mixed race person I can say I'm sick of hearing about racism, my life experiences are obviously different to my brothers who thinks the world revolves around it or it could be that I'm paler skinned than him and see less of it?. I don't know to be honest but I am sick of hearing the constant hark to racism by I'm sorry to say, mainly white people, racism exists and none of this will make it go away, it's part of human nature,I just try my best to not let it define me as an individual. If I remember rightly you previous incarnation here was '"bongo boy" from bongo land.Tell us more about that sock puppet "What evidence have you got making such claims against other forum poster's? I'd suggest it's a big fat Zero! | |||
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"https://www.fabswingers.com/content/forum-rules Here's a link to forum rules for anyone who might be unfamiliar with them" Lol at the “threads we remove section”. Otherwise these are good rules. | |||
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"We all think you protest too much You have ignored my point on how the rich get their money for the second time now. " Yep, and for good reason. I don't give a flying fuck how people get their money provided it is legal and they pay their taxes! But let me remind you that the vast majority here seem to believe that I am some sort of commie who would strip the wealth from everyone when in fact I am a believer in a progressive income based high taxation mixed economy. Now you were saying... | |||
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"We all think you protest too much You have ignored my point on how the rich get their money for the second time now. Yep, and for good reason. I don't give a flying fuck how people get their money provided it is legal and they pay their taxes! But let me remind you that the vast majority here seem to believe that I am some sort of commie who would strip the wealth from everyone when in fact I am a believer in a progressive income based high taxation mixed economy. Now you were saying..." Ha ha ha ha Are you joking me...refer back to any of your rants about the Tories....resplendent with references to poor houses and serfdom | |||
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" I'd offer an opposite theory....people naturally fear the unknown and exhibit tribal behaviour but this can be normalised through integration and making the presence of people who look different normal. Put kids playing together early enough and limit any top down racist messages from their elders and you'll dissolve racism in a generation. " That sounds so scary.. normalising behaviour... What is normal behaviour and who decides what it is? What do you suggest that we do with those who can't be normalised.. state reprogramming perhaps ? | |||
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" I'd offer an opposite theory....people naturally fear the unknown and exhibit tribal behaviour but this can be normalised through integration and making the presence of people who look different normal. Put kids playing together early enough and limit any top down racist messages from their elders and you'll dissolve racism in a generation. That sounds so scary.. normalising behaviour... What is normal behaviour and who decides what it is? What do you suggest that we do with those who can't be normalised.. state reprogramming perhaps ?" Not in any totalitarian sense Just common sense...idealistic sure but where achievable it works | |||
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