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"2 years on and this alleged russia interfereing with elections debacle is still going on. If its true or not who knows but lets just say for arguments sake they did. What exactly did they do? Did they hack the system and increase the electoral collage votes digitally. Not that im aware off, at the end of the day people made their own votes on the information they had. Both campaigns tried to smere each others, hileray had her team looking for any kind of dirt they could on trump and his past, trump the same on Hilary. So apparently the russians got all this dirt on Hilary (not fabricated dirt, dirt that is true) which they then passed on to wikileaks (even though assange said the info didnt come from russia but from somome on the inside in the US), So wikileaks makes this information public which puts hilary in a bad light. I'm still failing to see why did has been going on for years now. Its not like any untruths was told about hilary, there was no digital altering of numbers in the votes. Hilary had her team digging up as much dirt on trump as possible and making it public. If russia felt they was going to have better relations with the US under a trump goverment than a Hilary one, they why not assist in digging for dirt and sharing their findings. Because believe it or not the outcome of that election wasnt just going to effect anericans but it would effect many other countrys mostly russia as hilary and current president at the time Obama the way they was talking about russia waa getting ready to bang on the war drums. " I think it’s interesting to see the outcomes. It certainly looks like they interfered based of the US intelligence findings. Russia would want Trump because he’s more unpredictablable, and has destabilised everything he goes near, America is now weaker on the global stage, and Russia is now stronger. Plus as we can see from these meetings, Putin considers Trump much more mailable. | |||
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" Russia would want Trump because he’s more unpredictablable, and has destabilised everything he goes near, America is now weaker on the global stage, and Russia is now stronger. " Indeed. Putin saw in Trump someone who would unite the world - unite the world against the United States. | |||
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"Trump is a corrupt businessman, Putin is a corrupt businessman. No need to say anything else." What businesses did Putin set up and run? | |||
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"Trump is a corrupt businessman, Putin is a corrupt businessman. No need to say anything else. What businesses did Putin set up and run?" Putin is one of the richest people on the planet. He skims the cream off all the big deals in Russia. | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style?" Yes. Of course. That must be it. -Matt | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style?" By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse  | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse "Do you understand Russia at all? And in particular Russia under Putin and the surprising manner in which they hosted the World Cup? | |||
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"Even Fox News has been outraged by the Trump backing of Putin and his calling the EU an enemy." And so what? How would you deal with Putin? | |||
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"I don't think that equates to being a businessman, in the mould of Donald Trump wheeling and dealing in the marketplace. No, it's more like a Marcos or a Suharto - someone using their power as a head of state for personal gain. It is a common trait of politicians the world over. They get into power and see opportunities to fill their boots. Our own politicians do it, they all do." Yep. Trump would LOVE to be in Putin's position - or Xi's. In charge of an entire country and answerable to no-one. I don't doubt that he would love to be rid of the pesky accountability that democracy and an independent judiciary bring. | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
Do you understand Russia at all? And in particular Russia under Putin and the surprising manner in which they hosted the World Cup?
".... by throwing your own security services under the bus you mean!!! With evidence they have been attempting to influence votes and elections in other countries as well ... but hey, sure why not! | |||
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"And so what? How would you deal with Putin?" Simply, I wouldn't. But if i were up to me we would be rebuilding our munitions industry, rearming and remanning our armed forces, especially the RAF and Navy. | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? " Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
Do you understand Russia at all? And in particular Russia under Putin and the surprising manner in which they hosted the World Cup?
"Is Russia being governed in a manner that other countries should aspire to? Why would it be a surprise that a dictatorship can focus its entire national resources to successfully host an event? What would we have expected to go wrong in a country where the leader can order hooligans to stop their activities because they are used as muscle? What is it that you understand about Russia and Putin that others do not? | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
Do you understand Russia at all? And in particular Russia under Putin and the surprising manner in which they hosted the World Cup?
Is Russia being governed in a manner that other countries should aspire to?
Why would it be a surprise that a dictatorship can focus its entire national resources to successfully host an event? What would we have expected to go wrong in a country where the leader can order hooligans to stop their activities because they are used as muscle?
What is it that you understand about Russia and Putin that others do not?"What do you think Russia is like as a country today? | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. " And the opposite of capitulation as you see it is what? | |||
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"Even Fox News has been outraged by the Trump backing of Putin and his calling the EU an enemy. And so what? How would you deal with Putin?" You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think. What you don't do is tell every one of your your allies that you consider them enemies and tell tour own security services that you do not believe them. You do not betray your friends. | |||
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"Even Fox News has been outraged by the Trump backing of Putin and his calling the EU an enemy. And so what? How would you deal with Putin? You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think. What you don't do is tell every one of your your allies that you consider them enemies and tell tour own security services that you do not believe them. You do not betray your friends." Because Putin works like that..... | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
Do you understand Russia at all? And in particular Russia under Putin and the surprising manner in which they hosted the World Cup?
Is Russia being governed in a manner that other countries should aspire to?
Why would it be a surprise that a dictatorship can focus its entire national resources to successfully host an event? What would we have expected to go wrong in a country where the leader can order hooligans to stop their activities because they are used as muscle?
What is it that you understand about Russia and Putin that others do not?
What do you think Russia is like as a country today?"I think that it operates very much like China. It is dominated by a small number of oligarchs and mega corporations operating through a corrupt system of kick-backs to the state. Russia is, however, far more heavily reliant on natural resources for its wealth creation than China though in large part due to their foreign adventures leading to heavy sanctions. Russia was marginalised by the West, but its reaction has led to economic difficulties for the majority of the population with wealth creation in the middle class stalled by corruption and criminality. The press is largely state controlled with little access to alternative Russian language views. Journalists are regularly intimidated and killed. Political opposition is suppressed. Homosexuality is met with violence and racism is common place towards non-ethnic Russians. What do you think it's like? Care to answer any of my other questions?  | |||
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"Even Fox News has been outraged by the Trump backing of Putin and his calling the EU an enemy. And so what? How would you deal with Putin? You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think. What you don't do is tell every one of your your allies that you consider them enemies and tell tour own security services that you do not believe them. You do not betray your friends. Because Putin works like that....." I have no idea what that reply means  | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. " Best reply I saw to that on Twitter earlier today was: "I guess there must be a poo tape too" lol -Matt | |||
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"You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think." Nope, you start rearming and make sure Vlad understands that next time he decides to use force he will be met with force. | |||
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"You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think. Nope, you start rearming and make sure Vlad understands that next time he decides to use force he will be met with force." America have got the arms already. | |||
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"America have got the arms already." but their president is a Russian agent. LoL | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. And the opposite of capitulation as you see it is what?" The summit shouldn't have happened in the first place. Russia is a hostile foreign power as far as the US ought to be concerned. You don't play footsie with a nation that's actively working to undermine your democracy. | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. And the opposite of capitulation as you see it is what? The summit shouldn't have happened in the first place. Russia is a hostile foreign power as far as the US ought to be concerned. You don't play footsie with a nation that's actively working to undermine your democracy." Of course it should have happened. Just like the North Korean one. | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. And the opposite of capitulation as you see it is what? The summit shouldn't have happened in the first place. Russia is a hostile foreign power as far as the US ought to be concerned. You don't play footsie with a nation that's actively working to undermine your democracy. Of course it should have happened. Just like the North Korean one. " It wasn't a summit meeting. They have a purpose other than as a publicity opportunity. I agree that a meeting at that level is usually helpful. Not in this case though. Having answered your question reasonably could you see your way clear to responding to my ones?  | |||
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"Do you trust the FBI? Look at how they absolutely affected Clinton's campaign. How would you deal with Russia? Well, step one would not be capitulating entirely to them, even as your own formidable intelligence community is telling you that they actively interfered in one election and will do so again. That seems like a solid opening move. I wonder why the very smart Trump didn't do that. And the opposite of capitulation as you see it is what? The summit shouldn't have happened in the first place. Russia is a hostile foreign power as far as the US ought to be concerned. You don't play footsie with a nation that's actively working to undermine your democracy. Of course it should have happened. Just like the North Korean one. " That shouldn't have happened either. But let's stick with the Helsinki summit. Why do you think it should have happened? | |||
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"Of course it should have happened. Just like the North Korean one. " So I take it you approve of Trump and see no problem with him reporting to his boss and collecting his new instructions? Remember this is not the first time he has met Putin with only a translator. | |||
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"Of course it should have happened. Just like the North Korean one. So I take it you approve of Trump and see no problem with him reporting to his boss and collecting his new instructions? Remember this is not the first time he has met Putin with only a translator." if i were a "baltic state"... i'd be worried that if putin tired to dip his toe in, that trump wouldn't honour article 5 of the nato treaty....... | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse "There is a huge stain on the history of the US intelligence services though (as well as our own). It's called weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. People will not forget it and if they can either tell lies or get it so spectacularly wrong in that case then question marks will now be put on whatever they say or come up with in future. | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
There is a huge stain on the history of the US intelligence services though (as well as our own). It's called weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. People will not forget it and if they can either tell lies or get it so spectacularly wrong in that case then question marks will now be put on whatever they say or come up with in future. "And therefore the correct option is to take at face value the word of a global rival when they say they didn't do it? Solid reasoning, there. | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
There is a huge stain on the history of the US intelligence services though (as well as our own). It's called weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. People will not forget it and if they can either tell lies or get it so spectacularly wrong in that case then question marks will now be put on whatever they say or come up with in future. "So you are saying that because of that, the US President *shouldn’t* question the attacks on the US election or apparent attacks on U.K. soil? Question Centy, what would Trump *have* to do before you would say ‘yeah, hat was bad’? -Matt | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
There is a huge stain on the history of the US intelligence services though (as well as our own). It's called weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. People will not forget it and if they can either tell lies or get it so spectacularly wrong in that case then question marks will now be put on whatever they say or come up with in future.
So you are saying that because of that, the US President *shouldn’t* question the attacks on the US election or apparent attacks on U.K. soil?
Question Centy, what would Trump *have* to do before you would say ‘yeah, hat was bad’?
-Matt"Regarding the apparent attacks on uk soil. Putin and russia have denied any involvement what so ever in this and when they asked our goverment if they can help in the investigation of finding out the origin of where the novachov came from and if we can send them a sample or have one of there experts come analyse it, our goverment refused any help involment from russia. Why would they do this? Sky news had a guy on after the trump putin press conference to analyse what happened. This guy (i forget his name) rolled of his toungue a list of crimes by putin himself from interfering in US elections and brexit and then continued with how putin attempted murder of the sherples and the actualy murder of the person that died last week. Where does the media get off on putting out these accusations as facts. Watched a speech from putin day after the world cup saying how it shows how people of all nations can come together and be friendly and show respect and love and this should be the aim of world goverments to. Putin and russia is not my enemy nor is he yours. | |||
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade?" Do you consider russia our enemy? | |||
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" if i were a "baltic state"... i'd be worried that if putin tired to dip his toe in, that trump wouldn't honour article 5 of the nato treaty......." Fair point - but Putin isn't stupid enough to risk an all out war with NATO. Were it to happen, Russia would lose. In any case, he doesn't need to. Right now, he's got Trump singing his praises, May doing bugger all about all the money laundering in London, better relations with China; and all it's cost him is a few, largely ineffective, sanctions. He's playing a blinder, considering the limitations he's under. | |||
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade? Do you consider russia our enemy?" Yes. | |||
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade? Do you consider russia our enemy? Yes." Thats a shame. Russia is a lovely place as are the people there. Ive got some friends over there that i am going to visit in September,maybe come along and see the place for yourself, after seeing st Petersburg and moscow i bet you would go back home with a different mind set. I promise you, you are not the enemy of russia or its people and you shouldnt see them as the enemy. | |||
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade? Do you consider russia our enemy? Yes. Thats a shame. Russia is a lovely place as are the people there. Ive got some friends over there that i am going to visit in September,maybe come along and see the place for yourself, after seeing st Petersburg and moscow i bet you would go back home with a different mind set. I promise you, you are not the enemy of russia or its people and you shouldnt see them as the enemy. " I am certain there might be some lovely Russian people, though given the support that anti-LGBT legislation enjoys makes me question that. But you're conflating a holiday being nice with the actions of the Russian state. So, I don't really give a shit what you promise, you're either not on the same page as everyone else, or deliberately trying to fudge things. | |||
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"Russia being our enemy has probably been the longest most successful brain washing campaign by the media in living memory." Russia is not our friend. And today's Russian establishment would destroy us in a heartbeat if it thought its losses would be acceptable. And to be clear it is probing our defences and resolve in order to ascertain how much it can take without provoking a military response resulting in deliberate direct conflict. There was a point in time in the late 80's early 80's when they could have been but the USA was only interested in exploiting them and making as much money as possible in the shortest of time out of them. As a result they turned Russia into a 20th century wild west, but with one difference. In Russia there were the highly trained KGB and their Spetsnaz spearhead that the US failed to respect (after all GI's and the USA are it, even if they get all their advanced training, weapons and technology from other countries), and now their arrogance is coming home too roost. | |||
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"Russia being our enemy has probably been the longest most successful brain washing campaign by the media in living memory. Russia is not our friend. And today's Russian establishment would destroy us in a heartbeat if it thought its losses would be acceptable." Ok, why though ? | |||
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"Or do they just no understand his negotiating style? By saying you believe putin and the FSB over the us security services! Cool.... he could have winked when he said it to let us all know it was a ruse
There is a huge stain on the history of the US intelligence services though (as well as our own). It's called weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. People will not forget it and if they can either tell lies or get it so spectacularly wrong in that case then question marks will now be put on whatever they say or come up with in future. "In that case it's a terrible shame that Trump "misspoke"and meant to say that Russia did interfere in the US elections. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-election-2016-russia-meddling-putin-mueller-investigation-latest-a8451936.html It's complicated giving unconditional support to a half-wit liar | |||
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade? Do you consider russia our enemy? Yes. Thats a shame. Russia is a lovely place as are the people there. Ive got some friends over there that i am going to visit in September,maybe come along and see the place for yourself, after seeing st Petersburg and moscow i bet you would go back home with a different mind set. I promise you, you are not the enemy of russia or its people and you shouldnt see them as the enemy. I am certain there might be some lovely Russian people, though given the support that anti-LGBT legislation enjoys makes me question that. But you're conflating a holiday being nice with the actions of the Russian state. So, I don't really give a shit what you promise, you're either not on the same page as everyone else, or deliberately trying to fudge things." You've just been brainwashed by western media on russia is the bad guy. Anything russia has done...WE the WEST have done 10 times worse from regime changes, invading countrys, interfering and medling. So if anyone is an enemy of peace it is us. We already got one guy on here talking about rebuilding ammuniations and the armed forces and basically talking about preparing for war. Its absolute nonsense. | |||
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"Russia being our enemy has probably been the longest most successful brain washing campaign by the media in living memory."  this guy knows the score | |||
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It's like a sketch from the Simpsons.
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"How is the weather in Moscow, comrade? Do you consider russia our enemy? Yes. Thats a shame. Russia is a lovely place as are the people there. Ive got some friends over there that i am going to visit in September,maybe come along and see the place for yourself, after seeing st Petersburg and moscow i bet you would go back home with a different mind set. I promise you, you are not the enemy of russia or its people and you shouldnt see them as the enemy. I am certain there might be some lovely Russian people, though given the support that anti-LGBT legislation enjoys makes me question that. But you're conflating a holiday being nice with the actions of the Russian state. So, I don't really give a shit what you promise, you're either not on the same page as everyone else, or deliberately trying to fudge things. You've just been brainwashed by western media on russia is the bad guy. Anything russia has done...WE the WEST have done 10 times worse from regime changes, invading countrys, interfering and medling. So if anyone is an enemy of peace it is us. We already got one guy on here talking about rebuilding ammuniations and the armed forces and basically talking about preparing for war. Its absolute nonsense. " Ohh, well if you're using the magic word "brainwashing" then who am I to disagree? Of course, you can always have the more nuanced view that no nation is perfect, but that doesn't take away from the fact that Russian interests run contrary to our own, so that does make them an enemy. | |||
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"You open a dialogue. You say hello and congratulate him on a splendid World Cup. You tell him that you understand that he feels that Russia (meaning Putin) feels like it has been excluded and treated badly. You tell him that you would be delighted to treat him far better but it requires a few changes in how he does things outside his home turf. Then you leave and book a date for another coffee and chat when everyone has had time think. Nope, you start rearming and make sure Vlad understands that next time he decides to use force he will be met with force." You can do that too, especially as the US is an unreliable ally. However our stick will never be as big as Russia because, quite correctly, we want to spend our scarce resources on other things. You always keep talking though. Jaw, jaw not war, war until there is absolutely no alternative. | |||
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"Trump is also saying he does believe in the intelligence community. " "I can see by your expressions that I was joking" | |||
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"His spin doctors gave him a script. He called in the media. "I meant to say no reason Russia wouldn't interfere, not would interfere." D'uh. Then he goes off script. "It might have been someone else, though."
It's like a sketch from the Simpsons.
"it did have a whiff of "some poor bloke reading a hostage note" about it last time he did that sort of "reading from a script" thing was just after charlottesville when we were waiting for the "for god sake at least condemn the actions of the kkk type people".... and we all know how that turned out! | |||
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"His spin doctors gave him a script. He called in the media. "I meant to say no reason Russia wouldn't interfere, not would interfere." D'uh. Then he goes off script. "It might have been someone else, though."
It's like a sketch from the Simpsons.
"I sometimes feel nervous for simultaneous translators in situations like this. They have to get the words exactly right. You have languages like German in which the negative comes right at the end of the sentence, so they have to mentally buffer the whole thing until the end when they know if there is a negative. But in this case it is just a doddery old twat who has been called out for saying what he said and now trying to weasel his way out of it. -Matt | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached." I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached. I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. " Just for curiosity what is his position on Russia interfering with the US election ? | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached. I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. " Which would be great news if his supporters numbered somewhat more than about 42% of the population. | |||
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". Just for curiosity what is his position on Russia interfering with the US election ?" He stood up on stage and asked for it to happen. He's just done and said so many awful, stupid things since then that it gets forgotten about. | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached. I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. Which would be great news if his supporters numbered somewhat more than about 42% of the population." He really doesn't need much more than that seeing as the President is elected on the Electoral College rules. | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached. I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. Which would be great news if his supporters numbered somewhat more than about 42% of the population. He really doesn't need much more than that seeing as the President is elected on the Electoral College rules. " Yes, of course, and it depends on where they are. It was only 107,000 votes in 3 states that effectively gave him the win. But as he only just scraped through last time, it won't take much for him to lose this time. Depending on who the alternatives are. -Matt | |||
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"Russia most definitely interfered in our election, thats a fact, not a witch hunt. Most of the people in charge of trumps campaign have been arrested, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Several of these people have connections with Russia and Putin, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. Russia funneled money through the National Rifle Association to trumps campaign, that's a fact, not a witch hunt. I could go on and on about known facts. Through social media, Russian propaganda reached more American citizens than actually voted in the election, well over a hundred million people were seeing false ads designed to sway their votes to the republican candidate, which unfortunately was trump. Putin didn't want Hillary Clinton elected president because he didn't have any control over her, but obviously, he has control over trump, somehow. Hopefully when the Mueller investigation is complete, we will know most of the story, but I'm sure some things will be held back from the public, it always is. It's truly terrible that this idiot of a man has the title of President of the United States, when he is clearly not capable of doing the job in any sense of the word. Luckily for the American people, and our long time allies around the world, he can't make the big decisions without the approval of congress, and trump really hates that lol. He's a spoiled brat that grew up with a golden spoon in his mouth, so he couldn't care less about the common people, here or abroad, and he's proven it time and time again. Thankfully, his time in office is limited, even if he doesn't get impeached. I think you're going to be in for a big disappointment because Trump will be elected President for a 2nd term. He's more popular than ever with his supporters and is delivering on his campaign promises. Which would be great news if his supporters numbered somewhat more than about 42% of the population. He really doesn't need much more than that seeing as the President is elected on the Electoral College rules. " Well, yes, Electoral College is broken, this is true. But as has been pointed out, he only scraped a win due to about 100,000 people. 100,000 mostly old people, most of whom won't be alive come 2020. Bonus: y'know what's really fucking unfavorable for the GOP? High voter turnout. It's why they're so fond of voter suppression. And do you wanna know what drives up voter turnouts? Having a cause. And getting rid of Trump is a hell of a cause. | |||
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"He really doesn't need much more than that seeing as the President is elected on the Electoral College rules. " Do you realise that in 7 of the last 8 presidential elections the democrats won the popular vote but in 3 of them a republican became president. Maybe it is time for the USA to overhaul the system and get rid of the Electoral college and allow the people to decide who will be their president. | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide " It is. But that's separate from the fact that electoral college is bullshit. | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide " True, but just because it is for the US to decide dos not make pointing out exactly how broken the system is inappropriate. Further it is worth noting that the whole point of the Electoral College was to stop the population of the USA from being able to pick their leaders and put in place a system that had the appearance of being democratic while actually giving unrestricted power to select the countries head of state to the political elite. | |||
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"Putin wanted Obama to get into the white house., are they going to investigate Obama?! " Did Russia influence the 2008 and/or 2012 election in Obama's favour? | |||
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"Well, the state point of the EC was to weight the votes of people in rural states so that they're not overruled by the people in urban areas. Which seems kinda reasonable - until you remember that in the US, rural areas are predominantly white, and urban areas are not so much. White supremacy - it's a feature, not a bug." With due respect, that was the propaganda put out to justify the EC. But the fact is originally the EC did not have to take any notice of the electorate and could select whoever they pleased as president. Further the electors in the electoral college were selected by state legislators, therefore the ordinary electorate were never supposed to pick their president. However the US political elite had to find a way that would give the population of the USA (who had just violently overthrown the British Throne) an appearance of now being in charge, while in reality replacing the British Crown's autocracy with a US home grown autocracy. | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide True, but just because it is for the US to decide dos not make pointing out exactly how broken the system is inappropriate. Further it is worth noting that the whole point of the Electoral College was to stop the population of the USA from being able to pick their leaders and put in place a system that had the appearance of being democratic while actually giving unrestricted power to select the countries head of state to the political elite." but why stop at America why not China Russia dozens of other country’s or we could keep our noses out other country’s affairs | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide True, but just because it is for the US to decide dos not make pointing out exactly how broken the system is inappropriate. Further it is worth noting that the whole point of the Electoral College was to stop the population of the USA from being able to pick their leaders and put in place a system that had the appearance of being democratic while actually giving unrestricted power to select the countries head of state to the political elite. but why stop at America why not China Russia dozens of other country’s or we could keep our noses out other country’s affairs " Because the USA is supposed to be our ally and back us up when people are attacked with nerve agents in our country. Because the USA is supposed to have a "special relationship" with us but has started a trade war. It's not unique to the USA. Throughout the world systems of government were put in place that assumed that those in power would behave with some grace and civility. That no longer seems to be the case. In the last Brexit vote the Chairman of the Conservative Party voted even though paired with an MP on maternity leave who would have voted the other way. It was, apparently, a "mistake". | |||
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"but why stop at America why not China Russia dozens of other country’s or we could keep our noses out other country’s affairs " I have criticised both china and Russia. In fact I have also criticised our own 'first past the post' system. Further I would point out that the USA claims to be the greatest and oldest democracy in the world and clearly this is not the case. Every voting system (I know of) has flaws, but the fact is the US system was set up as a confidence trick by a US elite who intended to replace the Crown with a timeshare pseudo-crown. that 242 years later their con-trick is still being successfully used to subvert the will of the people of the USA is a testament to its brilliance. | |||
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"Well, the state point of the EC was to weight the votes of people in rural states so that they're not overruled by the people in urban areas. Which seems kinda reasonable - until you remember that in the US, rural areas are predominantly white, and urban areas are not so much. White supremacy - it's a feature, not a bug. With due respect, that was the propaganda put out to justify the EC. But the fact is originally the EC did not have to take any notice of the electorate and could select whoever they pleased as president. Further the electors in the electoral college were selected by state legislators, therefore the ordinary electorate were never supposed to pick their president. However the US political elite had to find a way that would give the population of the USA (who had just violently overthrown the British Throne) an appearance of now being in charge, while in reality replacing the British Crown's autocracy with a US home grown autocracy." I'm not sure "hey, white supremacy, how about that" is the kind of propaganda you want to lead with, but OK. But on the subject of the electors, faithless electors are still a thing. But the whole "they can all just decide to select who they want" is true in the same way that the Queen could just dissolve Parliament if the mood took her. Technically true, but it's not something that's going to happen because the backlash wouldn't be worth it. | |||
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"I'm not sure "hey, white supremacy, how about that" is the kind of propaganda you want to lead with, but OK. But on the subject of the electors, faithless electors are still a thing. But the whole "they can all just decide to select who they want" is true in the same way that the Queen could just dissolve Parliament if the mood took her. Technically true, but it's not something that's going to happen because the backlash wouldn't be worth it." Two points. Firstly and most importantly I did not mention white supremacy, that was a different post by someone else (you in fact!). So please do not misrepresent me in such a dishonest and disrespectful manner. Secondly, I was totally correct in what I said about the original workings of the electoral college and its purpose. That it has been modernised and updated over the last 240 years I do not dispute, however it still preforms its original task which is to subvert the will of the US electorate without causing mass civil unrest and potentially another revolution. | |||
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"I'm not sure "hey, white supremacy, how about that" is the kind of propaganda you want to lead with, but OK. But on the subject of the electors, faithless electors are still a thing. But the whole "they can all just decide to select who they want" is true in the same way that the Queen could just dissolve Parliament if the mood took her. Technically true, but it's not something that's going to happen because the backlash wouldn't be worth it. Two points. Firstly and most importantly I did not mention white supremacy, that was a different post by someone else (you in fact!). So please do not misrepresent me in such a dishonest and disrespectful manner. Secondly, I was totally correct in what I said about the original workings of the electoral college and its purpose. That it has been modernised and updated over the last 240 years I do not dispute, however it still preforms its original task which is to subvert the will of the US electorate without causing mass civil unrest and potentially another revolution." 1) nobody is misrepresenting anyone, you took a post about the white supremacy and tried to "well actually" it, I pointed out how unlikely that was. If you can't keep up, don't participate. 2) is a very unique interpretation, and then projecting it forward into now is just daft. The EC is a bad system, with institutional racism at it's core, but it's allowed to be simply be just that without an added layer of shadowy machinations by those pesky elites. People don't need Machiavellian puppet masters to fool them into building awful things for a nefarious higher purpose, they're more than capable of doing it on their own for no grand reason. | |||
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"Putin wanted Obama to get into the white house., are they going to investigate Obama?! Did Russia influence the 2008 and/or 2012 election in Obama's favour? " Your guess is as good as mine., but why investigate trump and not obama. The so called evidence seems either very illusive or circumstantial | |||
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"Putin wanted Obama to get into the white house., are they going to investigate Obama?! Did Russia influence the 2008 and/or 2012 election in Obama's favour? Your guess is as good as mine., but why investigate trump and not obama. The so called evidence seems either very illusive or circumstantial " I didn't know you were on the Muller team, that's impressive. Though, that said, shouldn't you be not talking about this? | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide True, but just because it is for the US to decide dos not make pointing out exactly how broken the system is inappropriate. Further it is worth noting that the whole point of the Electoral College was to stop the population of the USA from being able to pick their leaders and put in place a system that had the appearance of being democratic while actually giving unrestricted power to select the countries head of state to the political elite. but why stop at America why not China Russia dozens of other country’s or we could keep our noses out other country’s affairs Because the USA is supposed to be our ally and back us up when people are attacked with nerve agents in our country. Because the USA is supposed to have a "special relationship" with us but has started a trade war. It's not unique to the USA. Throughout the world systems of government were put in place that assumed that those in power would behave with some grace and civility. That no longer seems to be the case. In the last Brexit vote the Chairman of the Conservative Party voted even though paired with an MP on maternity leave who would have voted the other way. It was, apparently, a "mistake"." America is our ally and did back us up when people were attacked with nerve agents here (although it's still not 100% clear Russia was responsible). America expelled a large amount of Russian diplomats in case you forgot. America does have a 'special relationship' with the UK and is not directly having a trade war with us per sey, they are having a trade war with the EU. We are in the process of leaving the EU so shall see if this trade war still affects us after Brexit. The Americans want a trade deal with the UK after Brexit. | |||
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"Well, the state point of the EC was to weight the votes of people in rural states so that they're not overruled by the people in urban areas. Which seems kinda reasonable - until you remember that in the US, rural areas are predominantly white, and urban areas are not so much. White supremacy - it's a feature, not a bug." And then a black man became President in the electoral college rules called Barack Obama. Not once but twice he was elected under this system. If the purpose of the electoral college is to have white supremacy it doesn't appear to work very well. Your theory is nonsense. Secondly it's funny how people like you never question the system when someone like Obama is elected under it, and now apparently it's not fit for purpose just because Trump was elected. Lol. | |||
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"Well, the state point of the EC was to weight the votes of people in rural states so that they're not overruled by the people in urban areas. Which seems kinda reasonable - until you remember that in the US, rural areas are predominantly white, and urban areas are not so much. White supremacy - it's a feature, not a bug. And then a black man became President in the electoral college rules called Barack Obama. Not once but twice he was elected under this system. If the purpose of the electoral college is to have white supremacy it doesn't appear to work very well. Your theory is nonsense. Secondly it's funny how people like you never question the system when someone like Obama is elected under it, and now apparently it's not fit for purpose just because Trump was elected. Lol. " Seeing as when Obama was president I wasn't posting on here what, exactly, do you think you know about how I felt about the EC then? Exactly, fucking nothing. And to your first point, someone can overcome systemic racism - case in point, Obama. This does not mean said systemic racism doesn't exist. Unless you're disputing that the EC gives the votes of people in Rural America a higher weighting than those of Urban Americans, and that the demographics in Rural America favour white people. In which case, good luck arguing against numbers and maths. | |||
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"Isn’t that for America to decide True, but just because it is for the US to decide dos not make pointing out exactly how broken the system is inappropriate. Further it is worth noting that the whole point of the Electoral College was to stop the population of the USA from being able to pick their leaders and put in place a system that had the appearance of being democratic while actually giving unrestricted power to select the countries head of state to the political elite. but why stop at America why not China Russia dozens of other country’s or we could keep our noses out other country’s affairs Because the USA is supposed to be our ally and back us up when people are attacked with nerve agents in our country. Because the USA is supposed to have a "special relationship" with us but has started a trade war. It's not unique to the USA. Throughout the world systems of government were put in place that assumed that those in power would behave with some grace and civility. That no longer seems to be the case. In the last Brexit vote the Chairman of the Conservative Party voted even though paired with an MP on maternity leave who would have voted the other way. It was, apparently, a "mistake". America is our ally and did back us up when people were attacked with nerve agents here (although it's still not 100% clear Russia was responsible). America expelled a large amount of Russian diplomats in case you forgot. America does have a 'special relationship' with the UK and is not directly having a trade war with us per sey, they are having a trade war with the EU. We are in the process of leaving the EU so shall see if this trade war still affects us after Brexit. The Americans want a trade deal with the UK after Brexit. " You are right. The The USA did expel "diplomats" but that may have actually blown the domestic tracking of Russia's assets in the US. It was probably done in good faith though. If it was a covert Russian operation then it's rather unlikely that there will be conclusive evidence. Of course, the Russian security services have never done anything like this before. Trump did not feel that the death of a UK national as a consequence of the incident was worth mentioning though. We have a trade surplus with the USA. For Trump that is "unfair". He would be "losing". We'd be getting the same treatment I or out of the EU. Choosing to believe a proven liar recorded lice about future UK trade deals is your decision. | |||
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"Trump is a corrupt businessman, Putin is a corrupt businessman. No need to say anything else. What businesses did Putin set up and run?" You can trust me that all pil related and heavy infrastructure sided businesses were divided by Putin amongst the current stakeholders. All businesses hes had a hand in | |||
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