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"The bloodbath is yet to come. The backbenchers will be mobilising their troops and inciting their front bench allies. " Inclined to agree with you. Theresa May has started the great betrayal of Brexit with this move, she may have managed to get the cabinet on board but getting the rest of the party on board is a different matter entirely. | |||
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"The bloodbath is yet to come. The backbenchers will be mobilising their troops and inciting their front bench allies. Inclined to agree with you. Theresa May has started the great betrayal of Brexit with this move, she may have managed to get the cabinet on board but getting the rest of the party on board is a different matter entirely. " i think you'll find the amount of people who want the type of brexit you want is actually not as many as you want... rees-mogg and his "ERG" group of 60mps... and thats about it | |||
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"Hooooolllllly crap. Wow. Seriously. Wow. May has managed to achieve more than I ever thought she would. She has managed to completely piss off the hardline brexiteers, and come out with a 12-point plan that *STILL* has no detail in it. I hope the whitepaper has a bit more detail in it, but I'm really not holding my breath. -Matt" the hardliners in the cabinet won't resign until the eu give their answer (which will be go swivel!!!) because they won't resign on principle.... if there was any chance of the eu accepting this there would have been a coup by now | |||
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"So what do people make of the outcome of the meeting?(...)" Pretty much as I predicted on the "white paper thread". If only I could guess the lottery numbers as easily! Two things in reply to the OP: 1. This is yet to be accepted by the EU *but*, with some tweaks here and there, it probably will be. 2. Once that happens, as I mentioned on the other thread, the background process will go into overdrive, from our side, to lay down the groundwork for us to be able to operate/trade independently and work out ways to solve current issues (e.g. N.I. border, develop technology fot customs, etc) without the deadline pressure. I think that's the way she probably sold it to her brexiteers. "Better do it a bit slower but make sure we ready ourselves so that we can then withdraw fully, while in the meantime we keep businesses "happy" and encourage investment through the illusion of finality and, thus, end uncertainty (for now! muahaha)". Her hope is that the EU won't suspect the background plan but, I heard that, the EU are in fact sceptical, precisely because they suspect that this is the ultimate goal. If they buy it, she won by masquerading a delayed full withdrawal as a fudge. If they don't, God help us. | |||
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"I bet the Sunday papers and the TV political shows have people queueing up to get on and put their point of view across. It's all meaningless of course, as the EU are going to reject it. They know that the political uncertainty in the UK will be to their advantage and they will be quite happy to play on that. " They're not going to reject it simply to sow discord, they're going to reject it because May is under the impression that FoM is something that the EU is going to be flexible on. Spoiler: They are not. | |||
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"I bet the Sunday papers and the TV political shows have people queueing up to get on and put their point of view across. It's all meaningless of course, as the EU are going to reject it. They know that the political uncertainty in the UK will be to their advantage and they will be quite happy to play on that. They're not going to reject it simply to sow discord, they're going to reject it because May is under the impression that FoM is something that the EU is going to be flexible on. Spoiler: They are not." But why are you only telling us this now?!  | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ?" I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are | |||
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"As expecte quite pleased but will the tories stay united? While I am a brexiter I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU. These hardliners have got zero common sense. We leave then over the next so many years we use gradual stealth to get out as the EU collapses,why cannot others see this." "I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU" What you meant to write was: "I have always realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we actually use a lot of the EU services, and to leave would require us to actually replicate them or work out alternatives and we don't have anybody in government with the skills or patience to actually do that because they are too busy trying to appease their own political party infighting and the tabloid readers and their 'will of the people'" -Matt | |||
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"Brexit in name only , " I know. And this, after two years, is the best BREXIT they, or anyone else, can manage to come up with. A BREXIT were we have to follow all the rules but have no say in making them. The BREXITers didn't put that on the side of their big, red bus. It does beg the question that, if the best BREXIT possible leaves us with less control over the rules we'll have to follow anyhow, why are we doing it at all? . | |||
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"Brexit in name only , I know. And this, after two years, is the best BREXIT they, or anyone else, can manage to come up with. A BREXIT were we have to follow all the rules but have no say in making them. The BREXITers didn't put that on the side of their big, red bus. It does beg the question that, if the best BREXIT possible leaves us with less control over the rules we'll have to follow anyhow, why are we doing it at all? ." because RULE BRITANNIA AND STOP ASKING HARD QUESTIONS! | |||
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"Brexit in name only , I know. And this, after two years, is the best BREXIT they, or anyone else, can manage to come up with. A BREXIT were we have to follow all the rules but have no say in making them. The BREXITers didn't put that on the side of their big, red bus. It does beg the question that, if the best BREXIT possible leaves us with less control over the rules we'll have to follow anyhow, why are we doing it at all? ." So we can change the colour of our passports? | |||
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"I said during the referendum campaign that the only thing a vote to leave would achieve would be the loss of our seat at the rule making table. I said many times on here after December that, no matter what any politician told them, or what they called, or how they spun it, we would be remaining in the customs union and some sort of free trading single market. All this was agreed back in December when we agreed to regularty allinmemt. This whole BREXIT fiasco was never going to be anything other than ceding our say over the rules we'll still have follow from Britain to the EU. WHEN are BREXITers going to wake to the reality of what BREXIT actually means and start working for the good of the whole nation rather than on their own petulant beliefs, crazy stories and mad EU conspiracy theories. Centura-RU. Wrong, again. " Because unfortunately Theresa May just doesn't have a spine or enough backbone to see Brexit through properly. This deal if approved by the EU will not settle the issue, all it will do is continue the divisions in the country with remainers arguing to go back in for a seat at the table (as you are already doing now), and Brexiters will continue to argue that we haven't fully left. This deal achieves absolutely nothing. | |||
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"Well everybody that thought wed seen the last of ukip and farage, sorry " Indeed, Farage said last week on his LBC radio show that if Theresa May sells out the 17.4 million Brexit voters and we end up with Brexit in name only he'll be forced to return to the front line of national politics in the UK. A poll has already shown the tories will lose massive amounts of support from leave voters over this half baked idea version of Brexit Theresa May has come up with. Even Tory remainers don't like it because they say we're a rule taker with no say over the rules at the table. There will be a backlash against the government by voters the likes of which has never been seen before. Bring on ukip Mk II. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are "So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters? 
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds. | |||
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"As expecte quite pleased but will the tories stay united? While I am a brexiter I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU. These hardliners have got zero common sense. We leave then over the next so many years we use gradual stealth to get out as the EU collapses,why cannot others see this." I really hope that you are right and this deal could just be a stepping stone to fully leaving over the coming years as the technology for maximum facilitation on the Irish border comes into full effect. I'm not sure the EU will accept this deal from Theresa May though as it looks like yet more cherry picking which they have already ruled out. If the EU expects more concessions i don't think Brexiters will stand for it. The Brexiters at Chequers may have backed Theresa May with a guarantee that she would not make any more concessions. If the EU can't accept the deal as it is we will have to fully leave with no deal in March 2019 and trade with the EU on WTO rules. | |||
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"I said during the referendum campaign that the only thing a vote to leave would achieve would be the loss of our seat at the rule making table. I said many times on here after December that, no matter what any politician told them, or what they called, or how they spun it, we would be remaining in the customs union and some sort of free trading single market. All this was agreed back in December when we agreed to regularty allinmemt. This whole BREXIT fiasco was never going to be anything other than ceding our say over the rules we'll still have follow from Britain to the EU. WHEN are BREXITers going to wake to the reality of what BREXIT actually means and start working for the good of the whole nation rather than on their own petulant beliefs, crazy stories and mad EU conspiracy theories. Centura-RU. Wrong, again. Because unfortunately Theresa May just doesn't have a spine or enough backbone to see Brexit through properly. This deal if approved by the EU will not settle the issue, all it will do is continue the divisions in the country with remainers arguing to go back in for a seat at the table (as you are already doing now), and Brexiters will continue to argue that we haven't fully left. This deal achieves absolutely nothing. " So why were you so adamant that people like JRM or Giesela Stuart shouldn't have a say in parliament, and that it should be left to the PM? Do you know think you were wrong on a meaningful vote for parliament? | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds. "I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years. Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better? | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?"really .the most stupid idea was to join the circus in the very beginning anyway . brexit is not a shit idea . the remoaners do need to wake up or grow up .we had a vote if you can't accept the result by now there is no hope for you . just how big a spoon do you actually want . the EU is disintegrating slow but sure anyway .it was always a bad idea .as Churchill once said " if its a choice between Europe and the open sea Britain should always choose the open sea " .its time the remain camp put their dummies back in .I won't be responding to any negative or juvenile response as no doubt the remoaners will soon be back on their little box .PS.if the result had gone the other way I would have accepted it .why can't you | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?"Brexit isn't a shit idea if it's fully implemented and we fully leave properly. You can only get the full benefits of Brexit by fully leaving properly. It's Theresa May's Brexit plan that is a shit idea, I won't be voting Tory again on the back of this deal and former Tory leader Ian Duncan Smith has already said the tories will lose support from leave voters over this fudge of a deal. Boris Johnson is reported to have told Theresa May at the Chequers meeting that Theresa May was asking the cabinet to polish a turd by backing this deal so Bojo thinks it's shit. I think Brexiters in cabinet are relying on backbenchers like Jacob Rees Mogg's European Research Group (ERG) to trash the deal and vote against it or the EU will reject it anyway. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?really .the most stupid idea was to join the circus in the very beginning anyway . brexit is not a shit idea . the remoaners do need to wake up or grow up .we had a vote if you can't accept the result by now there is no hope for you . just how big a spoon do you actually want . the EU is disintegrating slow but sure anyway .it was always a bad idea .as Churchill once said " if its a choice between Europe and the open sea Britain should always choose the open sea " .its time the remain camp put their dummies back in .I won't be responding to any negative or juvenile response as no doubt the remoaners will soon be back on their little box .PS.if the result had gone the other way I would have accepted it .why can't you "Churchill was also the first to come up with the idea of a "united states of europe" so he couldn't have been all that keen on the open sea really. As for brexit and winning the vote and put up or shut up and all the rest of the playground language, maybe we would shut up if brexiteers supported their no deal/cliff edge preference by coming up with actual plans on how the *transition* between the *now* and the *immediate after* would work in practice, rather than *moaning* "we don't want this, we don't like that, we'll bring you down if you don't deliver this, we'll humiliate you if you don't do that, etc". They want brexit but don't have a clue on how to implement it. You'd think that if someone wanted to jump off a cliff, he'd have an idea on how to achieve it without getting killed (unless that's his aim!). Maybe wear a parachute or put some kind of inflatable at the bottom to catch his fall or use paragliding equipment. But no. All he does is shoot down the suggestions of those who didn't wanna jump on the first place but are now dragged there against their will. I'm sorry if I don't wanna jump and expect that two unicorns will magically appear and save me from fatal injuries. It's fine if *you* wanna jump (because you already have provisions for yourself - like JRM's personal parachute in the form of his millions) but don't expect millions of others to jump too knowing that they'll face certain death because of the lack of any proposal on how to avoid it. And no, you don't have to respond to my "negative and juvenille" argument because making "negative and juvenille" arguments is a privilege only reserved for you. And to hell with everyone else. Kinda like brexit. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?
Brexit isn't a shit idea if it's fully implemented and we fully leave properly. You can only get the full benefits of Brexit by fully leaving properly. It's Theresa May's Brexit plan that is a shit idea, I won't be voting Tory again on the back of this deal and former Tory leader Ian Duncan Smith has already said the tories will lose support from leave voters over this fudge of a deal. Boris Johnson is reported to have told Theresa May at the Chequers meeting that Theresa May was asking the cabinet to polish a turd by backing this deal so Bojo thinks it's shit. I think Brexiters in cabinet are relying on backbenchers like Jacob Rees Mogg's European Research Group (ERG) to trash the deal and vote against it or the EU will reject it anyway. "This is true if you believe the proposal was solely to compromise with the remainers. I’m not convinced it is. I think it’s a compromise between theory and reality, and cake and eat it. Given the lack of fine detail in the leave campaign, and the subsequent failure of those involved to persuade others there is an easy and acceptable route I suspect it’s as much this as compromise. If it is compromise between brexit and leavers are we saying there is enough party power in the remain campaign to unsettle May so ? Or risk the power of the brexit MPs ? From the outside there seem to be more vocal brexit supporters than leavers. Or at least their names are more accessible in my mind.... | |||
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"I said during the referendum campaign that the only thing a vote to leave would achieve would be the loss of our seat at the rule making table. I said many times on here after December that, no matter what any politician told them, or what they called, or how they spun it, we would be remaining in the customs union and some sort of free trading single market. All this was agreed back in December when we agreed to regularty allinmemt. This whole BREXIT fiasco was never going to be anything other than ceding our say over the rules we'll still have follow from Britain to the EU. WHEN are BREXITers going to wake to the reality of what BREXIT actually means and start working for the good of the whole nation rather than on their own petulant beliefs, crazy stories and mad EU conspiracy theories. Centura-RU. Wrong, again. Because unfortunately Theresa May just doesn't have a spine or enough backbone to see Brexit through properly. This deal if approved by the EU will not settle the issue, all it will do is continue the divisions in the country with remainers arguing to go back in for a seat at the table (as you are already doing now), and Brexiters will continue to argue that we haven't fully left. This deal achieves absolutely nothing. " Well it does achieve something; it leaves us with less control over the rules we'll still have to follow than we had before. But then that was always the only result possible from any form of BREXIT. | |||
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"Well everybody that thought wed seen the last of ukip and farage, sorry Indeed, Farage said last week on his LBC radio show that if Theresa May sells out the 17.4 million Brexit voters and we end up with Brexit in name only he'll be forced to return to the front line of national politics in the UK. A poll has already shown the tories will lose massive amounts of support from leave voters over this half baked idea version of Brexit Theresa May has come up with. Even Tory remainers don't like it because they say we're a rule taker with no say over the rules at the table. There will be a backlash against the government by voters the likes of which has never been seen before. Bring on ukip Mk II. "The future electoral success of the Conservative party was sealed on the 23rd June 2016 when they gave up any ability to claim they were the party of economic pragmatism. The only reason why they're not dead already is Jeremy Corbyn, but he won't be around forever. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds. "I agree, it's a pretty shit deal. However it's also the best possible BREXIT that either party can come up with after over two years of trying. Problem is you just can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. | |||
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"As expecte quite pleased but will the tories stay united? While I am a brexiter I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU. These hardliners have got zero common sense. We leave then over the next so many years we use gradual stealth to get out as the EU collapses,why cannot others see this. I really hope that you are right and this deal could just be a stepping stone to fully leaving over the coming years as the technology for maximum facilitation on the Irish border comes into full effect. I'm not sure the EU will accept this deal from Theresa May though as it looks like yet more cherry picking which they have already ruled out. If the EU expects more concessions i don't think Brexiters will stand for it. The Brexiters at Chequers may have backed Theresa May with a guarantee that she would not make any more concessions. If the EU can't accept the deal as it is we will have to fully leave with no deal in March 2019 and trade with the EU on WTO rules. " You really need to wake up and smell the coffee. That's just not going to happen. The choice is this BREXIT deal or softer, or remain. 'No deal' was never a realistic option and even less so now. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?really .the most stupid idea was to join the circus in the very beginning anyway . brexit is not a shit idea . the remoaners do need to wake up or grow up .we had a vote if you can't accept the result by now there is no hope for you . just how big a spoon do you actually want . the EU is disintegrating slow but sure anyway .it was always a bad idea .as Churchill once said " if its a choice between Europe and the open sea Britain should always choose the open sea " .its time the remain camp put their dummies back in .I won't be responding to any negative or juvenile response as no doubt the remoaners will soon be back on their little box .PS.if the result had gone the other way I would have accepted it .why can't you "Because we don't like the idea of being made less prosperous whilst not gaining any benefits at all. | |||
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"I feel ok it’s better than a no deal how do u feel _lcc ? I'm thrilled at how outraged so many Brexiters are
So you don't really care about the country all you care about in annoying Brexiters?
Glad we established what your real motivations are on here.
For the record many remainers are also annoyed by this fudge of a deal, Chukka Ammuna just one example was spitting feathers that we'll be taking rules from the EU with no seat at the table. David Cameron is reported to have met with Boris Johnson the night before the Chequers meeting and told Bojo Theresa May's Brexit plan would be the worst of both worlds.
I do care about the country, that's why I voted to remain. I am happy that brexiters have finally realised that Brexit is a load of Bullshit after living in a fantasy for 3+ years and crowing about the referendum result for the last 2 years.
Of course Remainers are still pissed off, that's because Brexit is a SHIT idea, we have been pissed off for 2 years, but now if Brexiters are also pissed off, it makes it more likely that it will be cancelled. Failing that, we will be tied to an EU without any say at all, which will hopefully make brexiters realise how stupid it was to vote for Brexit. No UK judges, no UK MEPs, no UK commissioners, no UK veto. How is that better?
Brexit isn't a shit idea if it's fully implemented and we fully leave properly. You can only get the full benefits of Brexit by fully leaving properly. It's Theresa May's Brexit plan that is a shit idea, I won't be voting Tory again on the back of this deal and former Tory leader Ian Duncan Smith has already said the tories will lose support from leave voters over this fudge of a deal. Boris Johnson is reported to have told Theresa May at the Chequers meeting that Theresa May was asking the cabinet to polish a turd by backing this deal so Bojo thinks it's shit. I think Brexiters in cabinet are relying on backbenchers like Jacob Rees Mogg's European Research Group (ERG) to trash the deal and vote against it or the EU will reject it anyway. "But it's still the best BREXIT possible. | |||
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"Maybe we should stay in the EU and make it work from the inside? The way the world is now, I’d rather we stayed with our friends "Friends really? | |||
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"Maybe we should stay in the EU and make it work from the inside? The way the world is now, I’d rather we stayed with our friends
Friends really?"I think so, they have been for many years. All the mess we see now is of our own making - after all we let people like Farage represent us, real quality... | |||
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This referendum has been a disaster beyond what anyone imagined. Cameron had to resign, BoJos lost his chance to be PM, its done in Mays reign, its weakened the UK within Europe, divided the nation and could leave the Tories out of power for who knows how long. The only winners will be Labour but they'll inherit a diminshed economy and have to deal with the fall out from that. | |||
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"(Corbyn by his silence) " Really? Did you never learn never to interrupt an enemy or enemies while they were destroying themselves? | |||
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"(Corbyn by his silence) Really? Did you never learn never to interrupt an enemy or enemies while they were destroying themselves?" I’m not interested interested in party politics on this one - his silence is deafening on the future of this country...  | |||
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"(Corbyn by his silence) Really? Did you never learn never to interrupt an enemy or enemies while they were destroying themselves?" normally I would agree with this but this is a cross party issue and will be remembered as such. At least we won’t have too much of blaming the previous government as and when they get power. I also fear there will be judgement at the lack of opposition in the face of this one off issue. It’s not like they can ride in and reverse the decision easily. As much as no future government can have their hands bound, this is pretty darn close .... | |||
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"It’s not like they can ride in and reverse the decision easily. As much as no future government can have their hands bound, this is pretty darn close ...." Well I think the answer there is yes and no. We will never be able to go back to being the 'special' member of the EU with all our 'special' opt outs, and I for one think that is definitely for the best. But I expect that reentering the EU as a normal member with no opt outs would not take long at all (and that is what I hope will be the outcome in 5 years time). Oh and the death of trickle down and sell off public services to the private sector Thatcherism/Reaganomics. In my view it is time e returned to a mixed economy where services held in trust for the nation are run by central and local government for the benefit of the nation rather than private enterprise for the benefit of shareholders and foreign countries taxpayers. | |||
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"It’s not like they can ride in and reverse the decision easily. As much as no future government can have their hands bound, this is pretty darn close .... Well I think the answer there is yes and no. We will never be able to go back to being the 'special' member of the EU with all our 'special' opt outs, and I for one think that is definitely for the best. But I expect that reentering the EU as a normal member with no opt outs would not take long at all (and that is what I hope will be the outcome in 5 years time). Oh and the death of trickle down and sell off public services to the private sector Thatcherism/Reaganomics. In my view it is time e returned to a mixed economy where services held in trust for the nation are run by central and local government for the benefit of the nation rather than private enterprise for the benefit of shareholders and foreign countries taxpayers." Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. | |||
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" Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. " Sadly we never had full membership. That would have given us a much stronger voice if we were. At least we can rejoin as full members and the country will be fine with that as it will be a benefit to us. The sooner leavers accept this the better. | |||
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" Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. Sadly we never had full membership. That would have given us a much stronger voice if we were. At least we can rejoin as full members and the country will be fine with that as it will be a benefit to us. The sooner leavers accept this the better." Completely deluded! | |||
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" Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. Sadly we never had full membership. That would have given us a much stronger voice if we were. At least we can rejoin as full members and the country will be fine with that as it will be a benefit to us. The sooner leavers accept this the better. Completely deluded!" Sorry. I was just joining in with the unprovable sweeping statements based on personal preference. I have absolutely no evidence for my statement but then neither did Centy. How come you didn't accuse him of being deluded? | |||
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"Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. " So now you think that the referendum means we can never rejoin the EU regardless of how brexit turns out. I keep asking you what if your bright new beginning and the light at the end of the tunnel proves to be the light of an approaching express, and you continually fail to answer but reverse the question on me and I say I will be happy if I am wrong, why do you refuse to admit you could be wrong and tell us what other options will be open to us other than starve or rejoin the EU without any of our 'special' opt outs? | |||
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"As expecte quite pleased but will the tories stay united? While I am a brexiter I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU. These hardliners have got zero common sense. We leave then over the next so many years we use gradual stealth to get out as the EU collapses,why cannot others see this. "I have allways realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we are so tied into the bloody EU" What you meant to write was: "I have always realised that a hard brexit is impossible because we actually use a lot of the EU services, and to leave would require us to actually replicate them or work out alternatives and we don't have anybody in government with the skills or patience to actually do that because they are too busy trying to appease their own political party infighting and the tabloid readers and their 'will of the people'" -Matt" Yes well said  | |||
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"Well I've been accused of needing to 'wake up and smell the coffee' over this deal, but I think this really applies to you will. If this referendum has established anything it is that the UK can never again be a full member of the EU, the country simply won't stand for it. The sooner remainers accept this the better. So now you think that the referendum means we can never rejoin the EU regardless of how brexit turns out. I keep asking you what if your bright new beginning and the light at the end of the tunnel proves to be the light of an approaching express, and you continually fail to answer but reverse the question on me and I say I will be happy if I am wrong, why do you refuse to admit you could be wrong and tell us what other options will be open to us other than starve or rejoin the EU without any of our 'special' opt outs?" There is no way back the EU would not want it get real,stop living in a world of fantasy for your own good | |||
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"There is no way back the EU would not want it get real,stop living in a world of fantasy for your own good" Why you would ever think that defies all logic. | |||
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"I think you'd find the EU would welcome the UK back with open arms if we we're to actually leave to start with but not on the special terms we currently have." Maybe rejoining isn't such a bad idea. After all according to a number of Remainers and one Leaver on here the UK economy is going to nose dive and we will become a third world economy after we do leave so when we rejoin we become a net beneficiary. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? " Well David Davis has gone! | |||
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"I think you'd find the EU would welcome the UK back with open arms if we we're to actually leave to start with but not on the special terms we currently have. Maybe rejoining isn't such a bad idea. After all according to a number of Remainers and one Leaver on here the UK economy is going to nose dive and we will become a third world economy after we do leave so when we rejoin we become a net beneficiary." | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! " At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished. "Like.... Brexit | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished. "Shame that all those who have been itching to replace her are even more useless, in that they have *no plan at all* and instead only criticisms. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished.
Like.... Brexit "HAHAHA! You really believe that. HAHAHA! Article 50 has been triggered one way or the other we leave the EU in March 2019. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished.
Shame that all those who have been itching to replace her are even more useless, in that they have *no plan at all* and instead only criticisms."Simply not true. Brexiters in cabinet wanted the Maximum Facilitation Brexit plan but Theresa May would not allow it. She was hell bent on having her preferred customs partnership plan. She made the wrong choice and she will now pay the price for it with her Job as Prime minister. Also she has not put enough preparation into a No Deal scenario. She is guilty of extreme negligence in this regard same as Cameron never planned for a leave vote in the referendum. The first thing a Brexit prime minister would do is prepare properly for 'No deal'. 2nd on the list is to sack the remain chancellor Philip Hammond and put a Brexiter in charge of the Treasury. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished.
Shame that all those who have been itching to replace her are even more useless, in that they have *no plan at all* and instead only criticisms.
Simply not true. Brexiters in cabinet wanted the Maximum Facilitation Brexit plan but Theresa May would not allow it. She was hell bent on having her preferred customs partnership plan. She made the wrong choice and she will now pay the price for it with her Job as Prime minister.
Also she has not put enough preparation into a No Deal scenario. She is guilty of extreme negligence in this regard same as Cameron never planned for a leave vote in the referendum. The first thing a Brexit prime minister would do is prepare properly for 'No deal'. 2nd on the list is to sack the remain chancellor Philip Hammond and put a Brexiter in charge of the Treasury. "A. Bullshit B. As for max fac, I have two (other) words for you: Universal credit. And for that, they had time to plan, develop, implement, test, etc. Yet, we hear almost daily what a shambles it is. You expect the *same* government who introduced that disaster (and are now lying to Parliament about how "brilliantly" it's going) to actually *invent* the max fac technology, develop it, plan it, test it, use it, iron out bugs/issues, etc and all in the next 2 years?! Do you really expect the EU, based on our record with a domestic issue like UC, to trust us to develop such a system and for it to be working perfectly (as required) in the time agreed?! Are you serious?! Not to mention that the max fac deals with only *one* aspect of the whole brexit thing. What about *all* the rest? Where's the plan for the rest? C. Yes, let's upgrade the utter clusterfuck with a total clusterfuck. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished.
Shame that all those who have been itching to replace her are even more useless, in that they have *no plan at all* and instead only criticisms.
Simply not true. Brexiters in cabinet wanted the Maximum Facilitation Brexit plan but Theresa May would not allow it. She was hell bent on having her preferred customs partnership plan. She made the wrong choice and she will now pay the price for it with her Job as Prime minister.
Also she has not put enough preparation into a No Deal scenario. She is guilty of extreme negligence in this regard same as Cameron never planned for a leave vote in the referendum. The first thing a Brexit prime minister would do is prepare properly for 'No deal'. 2nd on the list is to sack the remain chancellor Philip Hammond and put a Brexiter in charge of the Treasury. "Another brexit paradox. True brexit is easy even when it comes to the details. And our brexit MPs should be the one leading negotiations. Yet a weak Teressa mat is calling all the shots when it comes to the internal tory politics. | |||
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"(Corbyn by his silence) Really? Did you never learn never to interrupt an enemy or enemies while they were destroying themselves?" And that's the problem. Right now it's not The Tories or Labour who are the real enemies of this country, it's BREXIT. But then you voted for it because you believed it would be bad for the country but thought it's worth it because we can blame The Tories and keep them out of power for years. Well you may be right on that but this is such a complete disaster that even if Labour do get to power the economy will be in such a mess they won't be able to any of the things they want to do any how. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished.
Shame that all those who have been itching to replace her are even more useless, in that they have *no plan at all* and instead only criticisms.
Simply not true. Brexiters in cabinet wanted the Maximum Facilitation Brexit plan but Theresa May would not allow it. She was hell bent on having her preferred customs partnership plan. She made the wrong choice and she will now pay the price for it with her Job as Prime minister.
Also she has not put enough preparation into a No Deal scenario. She is guilty of extreme negligence in this regard same as Cameron never planned for a leave vote in the referendum. The first thing a Brexit prime minister would do is prepare properly for 'No deal'. 2nd on the list is to sack the remain chancellor Philip Hammond and put a Brexiter in charge of the Treasury. "The Remainers have been saying that the government hasn't been planning for a no deal for months, yet we haven't heard a peep out of Brexiters like you Centaur. Instead you have said any such talk is project fear. I'm glad to see you are finally coming out of your delusional fantasy and seeing the reality. | |||
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"So what do people make of the outcome of the meeting? I'm interested to hear especially from Brexiters." Chimps fuckin tea party. If you remember i did mention my doubts about the quality of politician. They just aren't up to the challenge | |||
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"Do we think the cabinet will still be the same come Monday morning? Well David Davis has gone! At last someone in the cabinet (a Brexiter) has shown some backbone and stood up to Theresa May's bonkers brexit plan. Just had a look at the Telegraph online and apparently Brexit minister Steve Baker has resigned as well. Other Brexiters could now follow. Theresa May has signed her own death warrant (politically) with this plan. She is finished. "So you are saying fuck business and fuck the UK. We have 3 months of negotiation time left on the clock. Hardly the time to be plotting to push the career dreams of Johnson. Leadership is making a decision and that happened at the weekend like it or loath it. | |||
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