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"Am I right in thinking this is the first time Davis has said this? Ive said for a while that the Ukraine model is the one that the UK team should be aiming for and it seems Davis has realised this as well as he mentioned this as an option. His major issue is the ECOJ but we could see a fudge where theres a new court with a new name doing the exact same job. Is this the Tories finally accepting a sensible way forward?" Given what the BBC are reporting about brexiteer tories saying any involvement in the customs union might lead them to withdraw support for TM, I think party politics will get in the way. | |||
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"Am I right in thinking this is the first time Davis has said this? Ive said for a while that the Ukraine model is the one that the UK team should be aiming for and it seems Davis has realised this as well as he mentioned this as an option. His major issue is the ECOJ but we could see a fudge where theres a new court with a new name doing the exact same job. Is this the Tories finally accepting a sensible way forward?" How nice for him to be considering this with 11 months to go. Plenty of time left for him to be doing that.  | |||
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"I can't for the life of me think why they don't just adopt the Norwegian model, it's tried and tested and allows for some immigration control which in reality is what this is all about "I think you need to research the Norway model a bit more! It is the worst of all worlds. It would not be Brexit at all. We voted for Brexit, which means no being controlled by the EU. No payments to the EU and no free movement of people. The Norwegian model is none of those things. It is worse than we have now. Norway are bound by the EU rules but cannot vote on them. We are bound by them at the moment, but at least we get a say. The Norwegian model is worse than being in the EU properly. Given that the UK voted to leave the EU, no sane politician would dare to suggest the terrible Norway model. | |||
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"I can't for the life of me think why they don't just adopt the Norwegian model, it's tried and tested and allows for some immigration control which in reality is what this is all about
I think you need to research the Norway model a bit more!
It is the worst of all worlds. It would not be Brexit at all.
We voted for Brexit, which means no being controlled by the EU. No payments to the EU and no free movement of people.
The Norwegian model is none of those things. It is worse than we have now. Norway are bound by the EU rules but cannot vote on them. We are bound by them at the moment, but at least we get a say.
The Norwegian model is worse than being in the EU properly. Given that the UK voted to leave the EU, no sane politician would dare to suggest the terrible Norway model.
". Again I'm not saying it's the ideal way forward I'm saying it's the best option we have at this time. Having a say sounds like a big deal but in reality it's not that big a hurdle, we'll do whatever the EU does anyhow, it's called trade and when your in a 28 member committee and 27 of them want to do something and you don't, you've got the choice of having your say and then going along with it anyhow | |||
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"It is THE WORST OPTION. We voted to: leave the EU; stop paying them money; stop free movement of people; stop them telling us what to do. Norway pays the EU, has to accept freedom on movement, has to accept being told what to do by the EU, but cannot vote on those decisions. Norway is worse than Remain. Norway will never happen here. " Let's just stay in then | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. " We can rescind our notice. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice." And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. " You can checkout any time you like, but you can never leave (unless you want to tank your own economy). Theres a reason the Tories cant make any headway in negotiations. The UK still needs the EU more than the EU needs it. Despite the disingenuous "we buy more from them" line which has been answered more times than Id care to count. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one!" - If - whatever the Conservative EU negotiated exit deal is worse for the UK than staying inside the EU, then anyone insisting on not renegotiating or just remaining inside the EU, would be fit to be sectioned. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one!" It's better than wrecking the economy  | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy "It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy
It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU."Do you have any idea how much it has cost us already? | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy
It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU.
Do you have any idea how much it has cost us already? "was brexit only about money like | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy
It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU.
Do you have any idea how much it has cost us already? "It will save us £ in the long run. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy
It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU.
Do you have any idea how much it has cost us already?
It will save us £ in the long run.
"No it wont. And as I said the EU doesnt need the UK but the UK does need the EU. 46% of UK exports go to the EU. Forty six. Compare that to 7% - 9% of EU exports going to the UK. If you were a business or a country, would you rather lose 46% or 9% of your business? I know, its quite a head scratcher that one. Now add in the fact that the UK has almost no unique products or services to offer. So all the UK exports can be replaced by EU27 businesses. Then add into the fact that some UK businesses, particularly financial services if theres no services deal, will be moving to the EU providing jobs, investment and tax revenue to EU countries. Then add in the costs to the UK to replace the government agencies that the EU used to provide. And the cost to UK businesses of not only losing out on tariff free trade to EU27 but also the benefits 120+ trade deals that the EU have with other countries. But wait, theres more! The UK will have a smaller market than EU27+UK so will be in a worse negotiating position when they try and do new trade deals. And countries like the US, Australia, Brazil and New Zealand are lobbying for both the EU and UK to take on more WTO responsibilities costing British business even more. Then youve got all the additional costs for business and the coubtry to trade with the EU, for example increased work and infrastructure at customs. | |||
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"We voted to leave. We told the EU that we are leaving. We are leaving. We can rescind our notice. And ignore the public's vote and choice? Good luck with that one! It's better than wrecking the economy
It will not wreck any economy. The EU sells far more to us than we sell to them. They need us far more than we need them and we will be saving the net payments to the EU."About 8 per cent of exports from the EU27 go to the UK. About 45 per cent of the UK exports go to the EU27. Now tell me again who has more to lose? | |||
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"Neither will happen, but if it did, then we will find it easier to trade with the rest of the world than the EU will. We will be free to do our own deals. Just ask Canada how difficult it was to reach a trade deal with the EU!" Yes, the bigger the trading bloc, the greater leverage it has and the more it will extract in return. As the UK is about to find out. Just as it will discover when we learn of the demands of the likes of China and India. India has already declared it wants unlimited visa access for its students. I'm sure that will play well with the Brexiteers. Trade agreements are not some diplomatic nicety sorted out over a cup of tea. They are brutal, where the strongest extract from the weakest. You seriously think that a country of 65m consumers will have more clout when it comes to trade agreements than a bloc of 500m consumers? Good luck with that notion. | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them." The net financial benefit to the EU of the UKs membership is about 4.5bn in a 15.2tn economy. Forget silly percentages? Do you need it explained how stupid that sounds? Let me put it this way: when a server breaks in google they dont bother trying to repair it and they dont wipe it and resell it they destroy it. If a small companies server breaks you can be damn sure they'll fix it. Or to put it another way do you think if Bill Gates loses £20 he even notices compared to most people? And have you not noticed that the EU is dictating the talks. Thats for a very simple reason. If the talks fail the EU will be ok, the UK wont. And everyone at the tabke knows it. | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them." But their economy is massively bigger than ours, as is their population, so percentages are more important than the value. | |||
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"Nonsense. That is how the EU want it to look. And their biggest problem is the money we paid in. Who is going to make that up? We have a trade surplus with the rest of the world. " We are not going to be taking out either. No more British farm subsidies to worry about, no more British civil servants to pay, no more money for British regions to pay, no more money for British culture to pay etc. | |||
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"So why was an EU Canadian trade deal being scuppered by the Belgians? To the astonishment of the Canadians. And I keep telling you. The EU, which really means Germany need to trade with the UK, because there is not much business in bankrupt Greece, or poor Eastern Europe or Portugal. " It wasn't, it's in place. If you can't make your arguement without lying, you arguement probably isn't too strong! | |||
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"It is THE WORST OPTION. We voted to: leave the EU; stop paying them money; stop free movement of people; stop them telling us what to do. Norway pays the EU, has to accept freedom on movement, has to accept being told what to do by the EU, but cannot vote on those decisions. Norway is worse than Remain. Norway will never happen here. " And destroy the economy while you're at it  | |||
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"Nonsense. That is how the EU want it to look. And their biggest problem is the money we paid in. Who is going to make that up? We have a trade surplus with the rest of the world. " We have a trade surplus with the rest of the world through our many trade deals as part of the EU. When our membership ends, those trade deals end. And trade will revert to WTO rules until a new one is thrashed out, which will take many years. And WTO tariffs are a lot different to the EU ones. The price of everything will change, mainly for the worse. For us. Not them. | |||
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Anger in this country is totally justified. Shame that it was hijacked by some politicians to push their own personal agendas and ideology and, in the process, divert focus from the *real* reasons behind the complete decline of everything from living standards to success and morale. Canny yes, helpful hell no! But that's politicians for you! | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them. The net financial benefit to the EU of the UKs membership is about 4.5bn in a 15.2tn economy. Forget silly percentages? Do you need it explained how stupid that sounds? Let me put it this way: when a server breaks in google they dont bother trying to repair it and they dont wipe it and resell it they destroy it. If a small companies server breaks you can be damn sure they'll fix it. Or to put it another way do you think if Bill Gates loses £20 he even notices compared to most people? And have you not noticed that the EU is dictating the talks. Thats for a very simple reason. If the talks fail the EU will be ok, the UK wont. And everyone at the tabke knows it." Unlikely to be the case . The EU already have countries concerned about who will make up for the loss of revenue from the UK. It is a substantial sum. No organisation regardless of size will be happy with losing 8 billion. The EU might like to think that they can dictate the talks but they will have to face reality eventually. Few organisations can afford to lose their second biggest customer . | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them. The net financial benefit to the EU of the UKs membership is about 4.5bn in a 15.2tn economy. Forget silly percentages? Do you need it explained how stupid that sounds? Let me put it this way: when a server breaks in google they dont bother trying to repair it and they dont wipe it and resell it they destroy it. If a small companies server breaks you can be damn sure they'll fix it. Or to put it another way do you think if Bill Gates loses £20 he even notices compared to most people? And have you not noticed that the EU is dictating the talks. Thats for a very simple reason. If the talks fail the EU will be ok, the UK wont. And everyone at the tabke knows it. Unlikely to be the case . The EU already have countries concerned about who will make up for the loss of revenue from the UK. It is a substantial sum. No organisation regardless of size will be happy with losing 8 billion. The EU might like to think that they can dictate the talks but they will have to face reality eventually. Few organisations can afford to lose their second biggest customer . " That works both ways.... You do know that.... Right ? | |||
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" And forget silly percentages" That's the one of the most .... uneducated nonsense remarks I've ever read on here.....and I've read quite a few..... Your employer, if you have one, tells you they are reducing your hourly rate by 79% .... you'd soon be interested in "silly percentages"... FFS...  | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them. The net financial benefit to the EU of the UKs membership is about 4.5bn in a 15.2tn economy. Forget silly percentages? Do you need it explained how stupid that sounds? Let me put it this way: when a server breaks in google they dont bother trying to repair it and they dont wipe it and resell it they destroy it. If a small companies server breaks you can be damn sure they'll fix it. Or to put it another way do you think if Bill Gates loses £20 he even notices compared to most people? And have you not noticed that the EU is dictating the talks. Thats for a very simple reason. If the talks fail the EU will be ok, the UK wont. And everyone at the tabke knows it. Unlikely to be the case . The EU already have countries concerned about who will make up for the loss of revenue from the UK. It is a substantial sum. No organisation regardless of size will be happy with losing 8 billion. The EU might like to think that they can dictate the talks but they will have to face reality eventually. Few organisations can afford to lose their second biggest customer . " I dont know,youve avoided facing reality for decades
The Uks net contribution is less than 5 billion in a 15 trillion economy. Its miniscule.
And the EU are putting a small tax on massive technology firms like Google, Facebook and Twitter which will raise over 5 billion. Thats the money lost all recovered in one simple long overdue tax on companies avoiding their tax responsibilities.
The EU is already dictating the talks and the Tories are going along with it because they have no choice. The EU has all the leverage.
And I have to laugh at your last line. No organisation would want to lose its 2nd biggest customer....as you advocate for the UK losing ots single biggest customer. The mind boggles. | |||
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"So why was an EU Canadian trade deal being scuppered by the Belgians? To the astonishment of the Canadians. And I keep telling you. The EU, which really means Germany need to trade with the UK, because there is not much business in bankrupt Greece, or poor Eastern Europe or Portugal. " Because each nation in the EU has it's own sovereignty! Despite what you were told we did have sovereignty! Also it was the UK which was blocking a trade deal with India - readon being the Indians wanted freedom of movement! You also fell for Mr Farage's rhetoric - "we buy more...." The fact is trade is not the No 1 on the list as it is in the UK. | |||
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"And the other 56% of UK exports are to non-EU. And ask the EU where the fastest growing market is? Non-EU. And forget silly percentages, given we are 1 country and the rest of the EU is nearly 30. Last year we exported £276 billion to them and the EU exported £347 billion to us. So they have more to lose than we do. And we will not be paying into the EU budget either, which is a massive headache to them. The net financial benefit to the EU of the UKs membership is about 4.5bn in a 15.2tn economy. Forget silly percentages? Do you need it explained how stupid that sounds? Let me put it this way: when a server breaks in google they dont bother trying to repair it and they dont wipe it and resell it they destroy it. If a small companies server breaks you can be damn sure they'll fix it. Or to put it another way do you think if Bill Gates loses £20 he even notices compared to most people? And have you not noticed that the EU is dictating the talks. Thats for a very simple reason. If the talks fail the EU will be ok, the UK wont. And everyone at the tabke knows it. Unlikely to be the case . The EU already have countries concerned about who will make up for the loss of revenue from the UK. It is a substantial sum. No organisation regardless of size will be happy with losing 8 billion. The EU might like to think that they can dictate the talks but they will have to face reality eventually. Few organisations can afford to lose their second biggest customer . I dont know,youve avoided facing reality for decades
The Uks net contribution is less than 5 billion in a 15 trillion economy. Its miniscule.
And the EU are putting a small tax on massive technology firms like Google, Facebook and Twitter which will raise over 5 billion. Thats the money lost all recovered in one simple long overdue tax on companies avoiding their tax responsibilities.
The EU is already dictating the talks and the Tories are going along with it because they have no choice. The EU has all the leverage.
And I have to laugh at your last line. No organisation would want to lose its 2nd biggest customer....as you advocate for the UK losing ots single biggest customer. The mind boggles."If only there was a thank post option. Facts vs hysteria. Thanks | |||
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