FabSwingers.com forum: London - higher murder rate than New York

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Further two shootings last night, 47 murders so far this year which gives London a higher murder rating than New York.

16 & 17 year old kids with guns and knives, disgraceful.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Perhaps it's time London took note of the UN report in 2005 that showed that Scotland was the most violent country in the western world, and Scots were 3 times more likely to be assaulted than Americans, and 30 times morel likely than Japanese. Scottish police have tackled Scotland's problems quite successfully, time the MET followed suit.

Ginger

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I blame the Scots inability to handle their drink for being such a violent bunch.I wouldn't sell them buck fast they can't handle it.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

London is simply not a nice place to live, not nice people

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-43624392

London murder rate overtakes New York's

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-43610936

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I blame the Scots inability to handle their drink for being such a violent bunch.I wouldn't sell them buck fast they can't handle it.

you need to come up and visit me Bob, I will introduce you to many nice Scots

they are well mannered and they even keep their "rooms tidy"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I blame the Scots inability to handle their drink for being such a violent bunch.I wouldn't sell them buck fast they can't handle it.

"
.

ooh you are awful bob

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Two shootings in London in the space of an hour - including a drive-by attack - have left a 17-year-old girl dead and a boy, 16, critically ill.

Friends said the girl, named locally as Tanesha, was killed "for no reason" in Tottenham on Monday night.

The Met has confirmed she died when "shots were fired" from a vehicle as it drove past a group of young people.

Two miles away, in Walthamstow, the boy was found with gunshot wounds, with another boy, 15, who had stab injuries.

Both attacks come amid concerns over rising violent crime in London. Police say the shootings are not linked

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By *eedsandyMan
over a year ago

Leeds

And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?"

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community.

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By *rMrsWestMidsCouple
over a year ago

Dudley

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?"
You could but you would be classed as racist unfortunately!!

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By *eedsandyMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community."

Yes. It matters massively which ethnic group is carrying it out and the ethnic group that they are killing.

To tackle it, you have to tackle those groups specifically.

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By *inkyHnSCouple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?"

What the fuck ?

A murder is a muder no matter who does it why ask about which ethnic groups carried out the murders ?

News flash all kinds of nutters murder people its not pin pointed to one group

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community.

Yes. It matters massively which ethnic group is carrying it out and the ethnic group that they are killing.

To tackle it, you have to tackle those groups specifically.

guess you will have more experience of this than me, you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border

So Andy, what you going to do about it?

nothing? not your problem?

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent

"...you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border"

You've obviously never watched Taggart then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"...you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border

You've obviously never watched Taggart then "

that's the problem, too many get tv mixed up with what is going on around them, cant determine fiction from fact

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave

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By *eedsandyMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community.

Yes. It matters massively which ethnic group is carrying it out and the ethnic group that they are killing.

To tackle it, you have to tackle those groups specifically.

guess you will have more experience of this than me, you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border

So Andy, what you going to do about it?

nothing? not your problem?

This was gang related violence. A turf or postcode war. Probably over drug dealing turf. Probably young, male, non-white groups.

So these groups have to be tacked.

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By *rMrsWestMidsCouple
over a year ago

Dudley

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community.

Yes. It matters massively which ethnic group is carrying it out and the ethnic group that they are killing.

To tackle it, you have to tackle those groups specifically.

guess you will have more experience of this than me, you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border

So Andy, what you going to do about it?

nothing? not your problem?

This was gang related violence. A turf or postcode war. Probably over drug dealing turf. Probably young, male, non-white groups.

So these groups have to be tacked."

The full force of the law needs to be brought down on these gangs but we all know it won't be, the law is weak that's why they have no respect for it!

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

The increase in the number of deaths and injuries caused by stabbings has increased proportionately to the decrease in stop and search incidents conducted by the Met. Everyone's favourite Prime Minister - Theresa May - is directly responsible for the decrease in the numbers of stop searches conducted on young black men in London. She changed the justification from "suspicion of may be involved in crime" to "suspicion that they will or have been involved in crime." As a result the number of searches decreased and the niumber of actual stabbings has increased.

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By *eedsandyMan
over a year ago

Leeds

Totally correct.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The increase in the number of deaths and injuries caused by stabbings has increased proportionately to the decrease in stop and search incidents conducted by the Met. Everyone's favourite Prime Minister - Theresa May - is directly responsible for the decrease in the numbers of stop searches conducted on young black men in London. She changed the justification from "suspicion of may be involved in crime" to "suspicion that they will or have been involved in crime." As a result the number of searches decreased and the number of actual stabbings has increased."
The police can still stop and search if they have reasonable suspicion.They can't however dragnet the black community of all young black males without repercussions.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The increase in the number of deaths and injuries caused by stabbings has increased proportionately to the decrease in stop and search incidents conducted by the Met. Everyone's favourite Prime Minister - Theresa May - is directly responsible for the decrease in the numbers of stop searches conducted on young black men in London. She changed the justification from "suspicion of may be involved in crime" to "suspicion that they will or have been involved in crime." As a result the number of searches decreased and the number of actual stabbings has increased. The police can still stop and search if they have reasonable suspicion.They can't however dragnet the black community of all young black males without repercussions."

why not?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave"
.

Well yes, just put a wall round the place, it's the arse end of Britain

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And are we allowed to ask which ethnic group are carrying out these murders? And can we ask which ethnic group they are murdering?

Does it really matter who the fuck are carrying out these attacks and if they are ethnic groups,

the concern is London is a massive tourism city, families visit to see the city, to appreciate the surroundings and not to be caught up in murders, shootings, knifings or aggravated assault.

Its about time everyone wrote to their MP's demanding action against these crimes, as well as doing their own bit within the community.

Yes. It matters massively which ethnic group is carrying it out and the ethnic group that they are killing.

To tackle it, you have to tackle those groups specifically.

guess you will have more experience of this than me, you don't have these type of problems and here North of the border

So Andy, what you going to do about it?

nothing? not your problem?

This was gang related violence. A turf or postcode war. Probably over drug dealing turf. Probably young, male, non-white groups.

So these groups have to be tacked."

Agree need to tackle gang related violence. But is it race related? Or are they more driven by poverty?

I'm Latino but never got involved in a latino gang. I had British friend involve in gangs because they were poor not because they were white.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Friends

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We need to be preventive and solve the problems at its core. Deterants like stop and search could lower it, but not stop it. I remember the knife amnesty in 2006 with the knife bins. Did that work? I wonder about it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave.

Well yes, just put a wall round the place, it's the arse end of Britain"

The wall is meant to keep the northerners out. From what I gathered from GoT

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

Shit hole place ...full of shit people ...most good people moved out years ago ....next time your in London listen to the people ...hardly any English spoken on some areas ....when will we learn ...oh yr toooooo late

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shit hole place ...full of shit people ...most good people moved out years ago ....next time your in London listen to the people ...hardly any English spoken on some areas ....when will we learn ...oh yr toooooo late"

Brixton, Clapham, Balham? All were shot holes back in the day. But now gentrified. But I wonder where the original residents move to? They cannot afford houses in that area. They move to poorer areas. It's not just the people it's the environment.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

They all speak English in Eastenders, isn't that what everyone is like down there

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Turns out that the statistics used were for a certain part of 2018. New York is still more violent than London.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Turns out that the statistics used were for a certain part of 2018. New York is still more violent than London."

BBC just reported on it.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

Police need more man power men on the ground more vehicles etc and not just London for all this they need money

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave.

Well yes, just put a wall round the place, it's the arse end of Britain

The wall is meant to keep the northerners out. From what I gathered from GoT"
.

I've got news for you, I don't know a single "northerner" who would even like to visit London let alone live there, it's truly an awful place, I left there in 2006 ish and the writing was on the wall even then.

Don't get me wrong, most capitals are pretty rank but London excels in it.

If we put a wall round it we might at least stand a chance of keeping the rats in it when the ship finally sinks into the abyss

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If London didn't have to subsidise the rest of the UK it would be a better resourced place with more police officers.London should keep its tax revenue and spend it on

Londoners.Make London a city state and it will thrive.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If London didn't have to subsidise the rest of the UK it would be a better resourced place with more police officers.London should keep its tax revenue and spend it on

Londoners.Make London a city state and it will thrive.

Now that’s true totalitarian thinking

London is nothing without the rest of the country

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To be fair I remember my first visit to Paris over 20 years ago and thinking, woow I could seriously live here.

I don't think anybody in their right mind would think that now.

European capitals are just following the route of new York in the 80s and descending into shitholest that will require zero tolerance policing to even make them livable.

The fall of the West is inevitable, we've gotta look eastwards now

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It was reported the deaths were within the black community.

I think a huge part of the problem is initial complacency within the majority- "we feel safe as we'll not be targeted, we don't understand or want 'them' here so if that's a few less, well,....".

There then starts a whole cycle of distrust and judgement en mass from both sides. Now, it's critical to tackle this head-on and be SEEN to be doing it in an inclusive way. I've no doubt there are processes underway but this starts so young it has to be treated multifactorially.

Showing the episode of a crime drama involving black gangs last night which made huge judgements of guilt before trial was probably not helpful.....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 04/04/18 10:07:59]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It might be better to wait for the facts before making too many assumptions about the drive-by shooting of the girl sad though it is.

If indeed it was a drive-by towards that house and and it’s occupants and she got hit, maybe needs asking why she was hanging out there in the first place ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If London didn't have to subsidise the rest of the UK it would be a better resourced place with more police officers.London should keep its tax revenue and spend it on

Londoners.Make London a city state and it will thrive.

Now that’s true totalitarian thinking

London is nothing without the rest of the country "
It makes sense many outside London can't stand the melting pot of multicultural diversity that London is.That won't change.Let London have all the foreigners the rest of the UK seems to hates.

London would be really wealthy if it left the UK.London doesn't need the rest of little England with its backward looking world view.Its a dynamic hub of business and innovation.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I suspect you'd find the cost of living absolutely rockets- land-locked barring the river, which could be controlled further downstream, getting water from outwith its boundaries, not to mention commuters, food, services.......don't think you've really thought this through, have you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If London didn't have to subsidise the rest of the UK it would be a better resourced place with more police officers.London should keep its tax revenue and spend it on

Londoners.Make London a city state and it will thrive.

Now that’s true totalitarian thinking

London is nothing without the rest of the country It makes sense many outside London can't stand the melting pot of multicultural diversity that London is.That won't change.Let London have all the foreigners the rest of the UK seems to hates.

London would be really wealthy if it left the UK.London doesn't need the rest of little England with its backward looking world view.Its a dynamic hub of business and innovation.

"
.

Lolololol ... No it's not.

It makes alot of money from money laundering and financial corruption for sure but if you take that morally bankrupt industry out of London it's actually in deficit.

Mind you I guess if you have morally bankrupt industries like finance, politics, football clubs and television as your main industries you'll produce morally bankrupt citizens.

Multiculturalism is lovely, everybody loves a Thai Street festival or a Hindu wedding, not quite as keen on acid attacks though.

The fact is this country is in moral decline, these problems are caused by dysfunctional families living in a get rich or die trying culture, left alone by the state, the inevitable consequences are born out on a daily basis

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If London didn't have to subsidise the rest of the UK it would be a better resourced place with more police officers.London should keep its tax revenue and spend it on

Londoners.Make London a city state and it will thrive.

Now that’s true totalitarian thinking

London would be really wealthy if it left the UK.London doesn't need the rest of little England with its backward looking world view.Its a dynamic hub of business and innovation.

Lolololol ... No it's not.

It makes alot of money from money laundering and financial corruption for sure but if you take that morally bankrupt industry out of London it's actually in deficit.

Mind you I guess if you have morally bankrupt industries like finance, politics, football clubs and television as your main industries you'll produce morally bankrupt citizens.

Multiculturalism is lovely, everybody loves a Thai Street festival or a Hindu wedding, not quite as keen on acid attacks though.

Morality isn't an issue in business.China isn't hung up on morality and neither should London if it wants to compete.Lets be honest it's all just a competition.Winners and losers

.Without the financial services London would be poor it's not a manufacturing power house.Leave the manufacturing for what it's worth to the Midlands and the North.Make London and independent economic city state and keep the foreigners in one place and everyone will be happy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

East Asian family culture is far different than the West, the Japanese business leaders still commit suicide when the business fails from a sense of honour!.

The West is morally bankrupt and we've all imported that culture from the great Satan of the USA. When I was child I used to sit and laugh with my family while watching the Rockford files, I mean a PI (never heard of one) who lived in a caravan (who lives in caravans expect gypsies) investigating murders (never really heard of any) while getting information of homeless people (nerve saw one until I was 15) ... But boy didn't Jim Rockford live a dynamic wealthy multicultural life, we all used to have a really good chuckle at starsky and hutch and there suing coffee shops for hot coffee, I used to watch hill Street blues with great enthusiasm of the nastiness of new York crime and NEVER for a million years did I think we'd import that culture here.

I know I was so naive back then

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"East Asian family culture is far different than the West, the Japanese business leaders still commit suicide when the business fails from a sense of honour!.

I know I was so naive back then

"
Civilisation marches onwards in a direction of its own choosing.Embrace coffee shop culture and baseball caps and burgers and multiculturalism .Crime has always been gritty.Long before hill Street blues and Hannibal the cannibal we had jack the ripper and more recently Fred west wasn't imported he was homegrown.We are where we choose to be and we have to work with what we've got.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I suspect you'd find the cost of living absolutely rockets- land-locked barring the river, which could be controlled further downstream, getting water from outwith its boundaries, not to mention commuters, food, services.......don't think you've really thought this through, have you?"

I'm sure Nestlé would be more than happy to supply their bottled water instead of that nasty stuff that Thames Water produce!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Two 38 year old scum bags break into a pioneers house to loot it, Pensioner calls police, but the police take so long to get there that a fight breaks out, one of the thieves force the pensioner into the kitchen where continued fighting takes place. The pensioner defends himself and is now charged with murder.

you cannot make this up, unbelievable.

A 78-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of murder after a suspected burglar was stabbed to death.

The homeowner discovered two intruders in Further Green Road, Hither Green, south-east London, at about 00:45 BST.

One suspect, armed with a screwdriver, forced the man into his kitchen where a struggle ensued and he was stabbed, Scotland Yard said.

The 38-year-old was taken to hospital by paramedics but was pronounced dead at 03:40.

The pensioner, who suffered bruising to his arms, has been arrested on suspicion of murder.

He remains in custody at a south London police station

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm sure Nestlé would be more than happy to supply their bottled water instead of that nasty stuff that Thames Water produce!"

I'm very sure they would. Nothing huge corporate loves more than a captive market

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"East Asian family culture is far different than the West, the Japanese business leaders still commit suicide when the business fails from a sense of honour!.

I know I was so naive back then

Civilisation marches onwards in a direction of its own choosing.Embrace coffee shop culture and baseball caps and burgers and multiculturalism .Crime has always been gritty.Long before hill Street blues and Hannibal the cannibal we had jack the ripper and more recently Fred west wasn't imported he was homegrown.We are where we choose to be and we have to work with what we've got.

"
.

Funnily enough I actually think alot of it is to do with the decline in church and religions, there's nothing left for people to hold onto a a sense of purpose, we sell sex and partying as the new sermons, there's no community left since they outlawed pub culture and closed down all the youth clubs and even if there was commerce tells us it's a dog eat dog world.

For all human technological advancements we remain a very real primitive ape, controlled for 2000 years by having religion and nationalism, my fear is as this is removed we won't really know what to do but enjoy the excesses that technology has brought but... Do monkeys really crave Xboxs, fast cars and satellite TV?.

Maybe your right, all empires fail eventually and our course is unavoidable

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Churches are in terminal decline for the native population not so for the immigrant population.

Pub culture was finished with the smoking ban and high taxes on drink.Now everything unfortunately is a weather spoons or clone if it.

Social cultural activities have migrated to the internet to an extent.We are still a social species .We always adapt and survive the collapse of Civilisation.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

"To be fair I remember my first visit to Paris over 20 years ago and thinking, woow I could seriously live here.

I don't think anybody in their right mind would think that now.

European capitals are just following the route of new York in the 80s and descending into shitholest that will require zero tolerance policing to even make them livable.

The fall of the West is inevitable, we've gotta look eastwards now"

Except that New York was fixed. These shootings and stabbings in London are a societal failure and they can be fixed by education, youth and adult community services and Policing - just as they were in New York.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"To be fair I remember my first visit to Paris over 20 years ago and thinking, woow I could seriously live here.

I don't think anybody in their right mind would think that now.

European capitals are just following the route of new York in the 80s and descending into shitholest that will require zero tolerance policing to even make them livable.

The fall of the West is inevitable, we've gotta look eastwards now

London is keyed in to lose a further 500 police officers this year

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave.

Well yes, just put a wall round the place, it's the arse end of Britain

The wall is meant to keep the northerners out. From what I gathered from GoT.

Don't get me wrong, most capitals are pretty rank but London excels in it.

If we put a wall round it we might at least stand a chance of keeping the rats in it when the ship finally sinks into the abyss"

It was a joke. I'm a Londoner and left in 97. Never going back. I love the north. Yorkshire and Cheshire are my favourite places after Amsterdam.

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By *inkyHnSCouple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Another two to add that have been killed in London

Wtf is going on stop the madness

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By *ungmagic10Man
over a year ago

Northampton

I don't think those statistics are accurate.

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By *enshermanMan
over a year ago

Durham

"It's always been a shit hole, if I were Trumper I'd put it on the list of places not to allow anyone from

take it your talking about London dave.

Well yes, just put a wall round the place, it's the arse end of Britain

The wall is meant to keep the northerners out. From what I gathered from GoT.

Don't get me wrong, most capitals are pretty rank but London excels in it.

If we put a wall round it we might at least stand a chance of keeping the rats in it when the ship finally sinks into the abyss

It was a joke. I'm a Londoner and left in 97. Never going back. I love the north. Yorkshire and Cheshire are my favourite places after Amsterdam."

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Another two to add that have been killed in London

Wtf is going on stop the madness"

yes, its now 50+ and still tonight to go

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Tottenham MP, David Lanny, has come out and made some bold comments tonight, blaming a drugs war between Eastern European gangs being fought on the streets of London.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Should say David Lammy, not Lanny

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By *inkyHnSCouple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Hearing 4 more stabbed in London tonight

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

Everything in this thread.

Resentment of London. Underlying racism. Religion. Finance and corruption. Big business.

Like almost everywhere, most people in most parts of London, most of the time will not have to encounter violence or crime.

Your experience of crime will be directly related to your socio-economic circumstances. You arrest likely to be poor if you are black and from a West Indian background. You are not going to be a poor criminal because you are pre-disposed to it due to it.

The solution is education and nutrition. The solution to most things is. "Dealing" with certain communities is not.

Indiscriminate stop and search causes resentment. How many of those advocating it have ever been stopped by the police whilst minding their own business. I'm sure you'd say you wouldn't mind. Wait until it happens again or until it happens to your son or father or friends again and again.

Some "experts" did a study at the College of Policing:

"The report explores the relationship stop and search had with crime at a borough level in the

Metropolitan Police over a 10-year period. Overall, it suggests that higher rates of stop and

search (under any power) were associated with very slightly lower than expected rates of

crime in the following week or month. Other relationships were occasionally found between

the use of specific search powers and particular categories of crime. The inconsistent nature

and weakness of these associations, however, provide only limited evidence of stop and

search having acted as a deterrent at a borough level. It is possible that stop and search may

be more strongly associated with crime at a more local level, assuming it is targeted

appropriately in crime hot spots."

Religion uses fear as a tool to control the ignorant. When you understand the consequences of your actions and you have enough to eat and a roof over your head that becomes redundant.

I would agree that there can be a sense of community missing although this was always more prevalent in poorer communities before there was a social security safety-net. What level of poverty or ignorance do we deem acceptable to encourage community?

There is always a tendency to harken back to some golden past when things were better.

The closest it got for murder was the 1950s when quite frankly people had there fill of killing. The rest of life was miserable enough living in the rubble of victory.

If you really want to make things better then share the wealth. Pay more tax, however frustrating that is. Educate the poor and reduce envy from economic disparity.

If you want to reduce the likelihood of global conflict do that on a global scale. Build up the poor countries on who's backs we got wealthy.

Will we share more? Unlikely. Blame and punishment are easier narratives.

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By *inkyguy81Man
over a year ago

Oxford

Did anybody happen to notice that one of those murdered was a member of Fab?

That’s the second murder in the fab community in the past year.

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

There has always been gang activity in London (and other cities) which we now 'celebrate' and look back on all nostalgic like. Except these gangs were white and spoke with cockney accents. These are good gangsters!

We teach (and I say we because we are all responsible) that to be successful in life you need to be rich. To be rich you don't really need any skills, experience or expertise you just have to release an EP on YouTube or apply to appear on Love Island. A big proportion of our young people will never be rich - but dealing drugs/ running etc, they are gonna make more than on UC or some minimum wage job.

We will further compound this by ensuring that our poorest young people living in some of our poorest neighbourhoods don't have the same access to opportunities, to a decent education, to other people who may have different, more positive aspirations, to support them as they grow and mature.

We don't even want the majority of these young people to live in this country (although most of born here). It says so in the newspapers and on the TV.

We have decimated communities that once would of supported and helped to raise our young people.

We have closed down youth centres and decimated youth services across the country. We have drastically reduced the funding available for meaningful interventions that work.

This is how we treat a huge proportion of our young people up and down the country. This is what we teach them.

I could go on and on...

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"There has always been gang activity in London (and other cities) which we now 'celebrate' and look back on all nostalgic like. Except these gangs were white and spoke with cockney accents. These are good gangsters!

We don't even want the majority of these young people to live in this country (although most of born here). It says so in the newspapers and on the TV.

We have decimated communities that once would of supported and helped to raise our young people.

We have closed down youth centres and decimated youth services across the country. We have drastically reduced the funding available for meaningful interventions that work.

This is how we treat a huge proportion of our young people up and down the country. This is what we teach them.

I could go on and on... "

I agree.

You've not being paying attention though. Clearly what is important to many posters is to be able to say that crime is being created by black people and we should be able to target them directly.

Obvious, right?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Teenagers being stabbed to death at alarming rates is nothing new people, go back to bed, your left wing ideologues are in full control of this situation, nothing to see here, go back to bed!.. Whatever you do, don't mention black people stabbing each other for reasons like they went better footwear

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

We don't even want the majority of these young people to live in this country (although most of born here). It says so in the newspapers and on the TV.

We have decimated communities that once would of supported and helped to raise our young people.

We have closed down youth centres and decimated youth services across the country. We have drastically reduced the funding available for meaningful interventions that work.

This is how we treat a huge proportion of our young people up and down the country. This is what we teach them.

I could go on and on...

I agree.

You've not being paying attention though. Clearly what is important to many posters is to be able to say that crime is being created by black people and we should be able to target them directly.

Obvious, right?

Absolutely. Please forgive my mistake.

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Teenagers being stabbed to death at alarming rates is nothing new people, go back to bed, your left wing ideologues are in full control of this situation, nothing to see here, go back to bed!.. Whatever you do, don't mention black people stabbing each other for reasons like they went better footwear"

If you had a rash that kept appearing what would you do? You'd probably treat it as a one off the first couple of times but maybe after the fourth or fifth time you'd want to investigate the cause.

Better footwear isn't the cause of why gangs form, why young people stab each other. I think investigating the root causes and implementing more effective interventions (and changes in national policies ) is the way forward.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

Get a grip.

Do white people commit crime? Did white British gangs dominate in previous generations?

Read the Mail. Who cares?

If you think that this problem is inherently due to the fact that these crimes are being carried out by people of different or mixed ethnicities due to the tiny differentiation in their genetics despite being third or fourth generation then it is the definition of racism.

If you do not think that education or poverty are the biggest driver of crime then please share your theory and your solution.

If you do not believe that consumerism and a media landscape that emphasises instant success is not a problem please indicate what's good about it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The solution is always money.The cause is always poverty.

Unfortunately an irrational fear of young black men holds those on the right and center from seeing the causes of knife crime..They just want to dragnet the black community and tar them all with the same brush.If youre young black and male then you are a legitimate target for a stop and search or worse.

Ignore those who blame the left or liberals for a soft approach in the black community,that's just a smoke screen for calling for abuse of human rights and targeting people based on skin colour to achieve a nefarious agenda.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Would a better deterrent be more effective? For example anyone carrying a knife in public gets an automatic 10 yrs? It's sad what's happening in London and maybe social media is not helping - not an easy fix.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

Get a grip.

Do white people commit crime? Did white British gangs dominate in previous generations?

Read the Mail. Who cares?

If you do not think that education or poverty are the biggest driver of crime then please share your theory and your solution.

If you do not believe that consumerism and a media landscape that emphasises instant success is not a problem please indicate what's good about it."
.

I'll share that dysfunctional families create dysfunctional children.

No farther, different fathers, step blokes in and out, no routines, poor education, no discipline, and most importantly no fear of the police or law.

There's a complete breakdown in social values like marriage, work and making something of your life!.

This is a long term problem coming to fruition and part of the cause is this idea that if you give everybody free money and free benefits and free housing they'll turn into lovely people and we won't have to involve ourselves in there lives.

It seems to me were past the solution of community centers and youth leaders, US style crime rates need US style tackling which means zero tolerance, increased stop and search, rafts of new prisons and much harsher sentences

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

Get a grip.

Do white people commit crime? Did white British gangs dominate in previous generations?

Read the Mail. Who cares?

If you do not think that education or poverty are the biggest driver of crime then please share your theory and your solution.

If you do not believe that consumerism and a media landscape that emphasises instant success is not a problem please indicate what's good about it..

I'll share that dysfunctional families create dysfunctional children.

No farther, different fathers, step blokes in and out, no routines, poor education, no discipline, and most importantly no fear of the police or law.

There's a complete breakdown in social values like marriage, work and making something of your life!.

Nobody said anything about giving free money to people. You made an assumption. You read what you expected to.

Shall we step through this?

1. Is the problem of criminality limited to non-white people?

2. Will spending money on educating and feeding children help?

3. Will an educated, nourished person be more likely to become gainfully employed and live a better life? Perhaps even find their talent?

4. How much does imprisoning someone cost compared to 2?

5. Does the USA have the highest per capita rate of imprisonment?

6. Is the crime rate in the USA rising despite their strategy?

7. Does locking more people up for longer without useful rehabilitation make it more or less likely that children will grow up without a positive male role model?

8. Does the Daily Mail take a balanced, well thought out position on most matters?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

More Police armed with big sticks may help, along with more stop & search, stricter capital punishment, even the birch

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"More Police armed with big sticks may help, along with more stop & search, stricter capital punishment, even the birch"

So it is down to money regardless except that you don't think that spending it on preventing crime would be better?

Where has your preferred approach worked long-term?

Where will the money come from? Why is there not enough now?

Should we do several things to solve a complicated problem? Educate, police, rehabilitate maybe?

Is it only a problem in London?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

What have Black Lives Matter had to say on these stabbings and shootings?

Have they made a statement?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What have Black Lives Matter had to say on these stabbings and shootings?

Have they made a statement?"
Would anyone listen to them.I very much doubt it.I listened to a Scot this morning on the news talking about how they respond to Glasgow being the Murder capital of Europe a Fe years back.They choose a holistic approach and it worked.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What have Black Lives Matter had to say on these stabbings and shootings?

Have they made a statement?"

Maybe because a lot of it is rival black gangs winding each other up with territory invasions and taunts on social media.

I’m not saying it’s always black gangs but it is a lot of the time.

And before someone jumps up and down crying racist I have friends and acquaintances of lots of different races and we all get on fine

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

Get a grip.

Do white people commit crime? Did white British gangs dominate in previous generations?

Read the Mail. Who cares?

If you do not think that education or poverty are the biggest driver of crime then please share your theory and your solution.

If you do not believe that consumerism and a media landscape that emphasises instant success is not a problem please indicate what's good about it..

I'll share that dysfunctional families create dysfunctional children.

No farther, different fathers, step blokes in and out, no routines, poor education, no discipline, and most importantly no fear of the police or law.

There's a complete breakdown in social values like marriage, work and making something of your life!.

Nobody said anything about giving free money to people. You made an assumption. You read what you expected to.

Shall we step through this?

1. Is the problem of criminality limited to non-white people?

2. Will spending money on educating and feeding children help?

3. Will an educated, nourished person be more likely to become gainfully employed and live a better life? Perhaps even find their talent?

4. How much does imprisoning someone cost compared to 2?

5. Does the USA have the highest per capita rate of imprisonment?

6. Is the crime rate in the USA rising despite their strategy?

7. Does locking more people up for longer without useful rehabilitation make it more or less likely that children will grow up without a positive male role model?

8. Does the Daily Mail take a balanced, well thought out position on most matters?"
.

Your such a neo liberal race baiter I can't be arsed to reply to be honest... You make sweeping grand statements like would feeding children, what a shit stick of utter crap designed wholly to make any right wing view seem like the child catcher from chitty chitty bang bang.

I mean yea, like the state goes round force feeding children of bad parents. Get the fuck outta here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What you actually meant to say is let's give money to the fuck up parents of fucked up kids and maybe just maybe they'll use it to feed mcchuncky take away shite down there already fat mouths and if we make them really fat they won't be able to break in through the little window we left open while we nipped out to the corner shop

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"What have Black Lives Matter had to say on these stabbings and shootings?

Have they made a statement?

Maybe because a lot of it is rival black gangs winding each other up with territory invasions and taunts on social media.

I’m not saying it’s always black gangs but it is a lot of the time.

And before someone jumps up and down crying racist I have friends and acquaintances of lots of different races and we all get on fine "

We don't have any black families in Kinross, but then we have no crime either

I did see a black family in Perth a week back, not sure if they were on holiday or staying, but they looked nice enough, seemed friendly

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You'll find the same individuals that get involved in knife crimes and violent crime had previously been flagged up by social services and by schools and educational services and mental health services and also the police.So from what I've read early intervention creates better outcomes and is much much cheaper in the long run than custodial sentences later on.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"When faced with a problem just repeat that the problem has always been there but you just didn't know it because.

A it was white

B you read the mail

C your a racist.

File under left wing crazed logic!.

Get a grip.

Do white people commit crime? Did white British gangs dominate in previous generations?

Read the Mail. Who cares?

If you do not think that education or poverty are the biggest driver of crime then please share your theory and your solution.

If you do not believe that consumerism and a media landscape that emphasises instant success is not a problem please indicate what's good about it..

I'll share that dysfunctional families create dysfunctional children.

No farther, different fathers, step blokes in and out, no routines, poor education, no discipline, and most importantly no fear of the police or law.

There's a complete breakdown in social values like marriage, work and making something of your life!.

Nobody said anything about giving free money to people. You made an assumption. You read what you expected to.

Shall we step through this?

1. Is the problem of criminality limited to non-white people?

2. Will spending money on educating and feeding children help?

3. Will an educated, nourished person be more likely to become gainfully employed and live a better life? Perhaps even find their talent?

4. How much does imprisoning someone cost compared to 2?

5. Does the USA have the highest per capita rate of imprisonment?

6. Is the crime rate in the USA rising despite their strategy?

7. Does locking more people up for longer without useful rehabilitation make it more or less likely that children will grow up without a positive male role model?

8. Does the Daily Mail take a balanced, well thought out position on most matters?.

I mean yea, like the state goes round force feeding children of bad parents. Get the fuck outta here

How does calling me names help?

I do not know or care what a "neo-liberal" is.

Actually, I posted specific questions to address. That is the exact opposite of making a sweeping generalisation.

I am not trying to bait you or make you "seem" any way. Just respond directly and your position will be clear as will how much you've considered the statements that you have made. I assume you believe them not to be generalisations.

Alternatively don't, in which case you have neither contributed anything nor contemplated your own views.

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By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"What you actually meant to say is let's give money to the fuck up parents of fucked up kids and maybe just maybe they'll use it to feed mcchuncky take away shite down there already fat mouths and if we make them really fat they won't be able to break in through the little window we left open while we nipped out to the corner shop"

So having denounced a "breakdown in social values" you write this?

Compassion. Solidarity.

Have you met any small children? Primary school kids all want to please adults and be loved. They live to learn and they don't want to feel hungry.

Their parents may well be utter failures, but why should their children suffer?

Perhaps the kids from the worst families could be fed at school three times a day? Perhaps they could be read with and taught how to be kind and helpful? Stuff like that...

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