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Where the fcuk are labour?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Corbin sacks his NI shadow secretary for suggesting a second brexit referendum in a newspaper article.

His deputy refuses to “rule it out” on Andrew Marr. He the supports Diane Abbot for doing the same in a letter and accepts that Kier Starmer said basically the same in a different newspaper.

Kier Starmer seemed to support the idea of it on Peston although was a little more careful with his language.

It’s bad enough that the government don’t know where they are going......but the opposition should, surely, have a clear position....or are they trying to fool all of the people and fooling nobody?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

*Corbyn....I know. Need to teach my auto correct to shut the fcuk up!

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...


"Corbin sacks his NI shadow secretary for suggesting a second brexit referendum in a newspaper article.

His deputy refuses to “rule it out” on Andrew Marr. He the supports Diane Abbot for doing the same in a letter and accepts that Kier Starmer said basically the same in a different newspaper.

Kier Starmer seemed to support the idea of it on Peston although was a little more careful with his language.

It’s bad enough that the government don’t know where they are going......but the opposition should, surely, have a clear position....or are they trying to fool all of the people and fooling nobody?"

The Tories are pretty bad at the moment but Labour are all over the place.

They seem to think that they can be all things to everyone. Keep remain voters on side but not upset Brexiters in their northern heartlands.

This could well and truly blow up in their face.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Labour just can't make any headway on the polls. They should be streets ahead of the Conservatives by now.

At the end of the day, it's not your die-hard socialists and Momentum supporters that they need to convince, it's the centrist voters that they need to get on side.

Up here, two Labour councillors on Ashfield (near Mansfield) council have defected to the Conservatives. And who would have thought that!

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Corbyn is anti EU, because the Labour party are pro EU (and he is anti what ever anyone else is for), the party is Pro-EU, but a sizeable chunk of Labour voters are anti-EU.

This is the kind of time when you need propper leadership, and thats not what the Labour party has in JC.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham


"Corbyn is anti EU, because the Labour party are pro EU (and he is anti what ever anyone else is for), the party is Pro-EU, but a sizeable chunk of Labour voters are anti-EU.

This is the kind of time when you need propper leadership, and thats not what the Labour party has in JC. "

Do you think that JC has peaked and support for him is on the wane?

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

On the topic i said over a year ago that with Corbyn as leader despite a resurgence in members that Labour are not electable as others have said the centre ground voters will not come over..

i say that despite many i believe agreeing with some of Labours policies on rail, utilities and the essential services..

they should be in a much better position given the weak leader the tories have and the infighting within that party on Europe..

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"Corbyn is anti EU, because the Labour party are pro EU (and he is anti what ever anyone else is for), the party is Pro-EU, but a sizeable chunk of Labour voters are anti-EU.

This is the kind of time when you need propper leadership, and thats not what the Labour party has in JC.

Do you think that JC has peaked and support for him is on the wane?

"

He is a divisive figure, his supporters love him, his detractors loathe him. Labour did relatively well in the last GE, however I would say that was more of a case of the Tories doing badly, rather than Labour doing well.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Time for a new political party?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's time for Diane Abbott to be sacked

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

It's funny though, how left wing parties across Europe who have stuck to a "third way", centre left approach have lost masses of the vote share. Had a centrist, pro-remain party been what the elctorate had wanted, the Lib-Dems would have made massive gains in the last election (and indeed they very arrogantly asserted that they would), but they didn't.

I think the electorate generally are fed up with that approach - many people (whether you like it or not) feel New Labour sold the working classes down the river.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"It's funny though, how left wing parties across Europe who have stuck to a "third way", centre left approach have lost masses of the vote share. Had a centrist, pro-remain party been what the elctorate had wanted, the Lib-Dems would have made massive gains in the last election (and indeed they very arrogantly asserted that they would), but they didn't.

I think the electorate generally are fed up with that approach - many people (whether you like it or not) feel New Labour sold the working classes down the river. "

they did yes, totally but the one thing they knew was where the votes were that are needed to get into number 10..

and the position of being in that house will not be given to Corbyn, i just don't see the middle ground that Blair won over going with Corbyn despite my wanting to see some of the policies on the statute..

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"It's funny though, how left wing parties across Europe who have stuck to a "third way", centre left approach have lost masses of the vote share. Had a centrist, pro-remain party been what the elctorate had wanted, the Lib-Dems would have made massive gains in the last election (and indeed they very arrogantly asserted that they would), but they didn't.

I think the electorate generally are fed up with that approach - many people (whether you like it or not) feel New Labour sold the working classes down the river.

they did yes, totally but the one thing they knew was where the votes were that are needed to get into number 10..

and the position of being in that house will not be given to Corbyn, i just don't see the middle ground that Blair won over going with Corbyn despite my wanting to see some of the policies on the statute.. "

I think it's yesterdays idea, to chase the middle ground swing voters.

Corbyn is doing what I have been amazed that nobody (especially from the left) has done so far, is that he, instead of writing off the under 30s as non-voters, is actively mobilising them, and they are responding.

If I am not mistaken, the Labour Party has the biggest membership of any political party in Europe.

Will Corbyn see number 10? I doubt it, if the current govt' lasts their full term. What I think he is doing is drawing a lot of flak/smears whilst he is changing the party back to a social democratic one, and, if he has any tactical sense, will step aside for a younger, unsmeared leader immediately in the run up to the next GE.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"It's funny though, how left wing parties across Europe who have stuck to a "third way", centre left approach have lost masses of the vote share. Had a centrist, pro-remain party been what the elctorate had wanted, the Lib-Dems would have made massive gains in the last election (and indeed they very arrogantly asserted that they would), but they didn't.

I think the electorate generally are fed up with that approach - many people (whether you like it or not) feel New Labour sold the working classes down the river.

they did yes, totally but the one thing they knew was where the votes were that are needed to get into number 10..

and the position of being in that house will not be given to Corbyn, i just don't see the middle ground that Blair won over going with Corbyn despite my wanting to see some of the policies on the statute..

I think it's yesterdays idea, to chase the middle ground swing voters.

Corbyn is doing what I have been amazed that nobody (especially from the left) has done so far, is that he, instead of writing off the under 30s as non-voters, is actively mobilising them, and they are responding.

If I am not mistaken, the Labour Party has the biggest membership of any political party in Europe.

Will Corbyn see number 10? I doubt it, if the current govt' lasts their full term. What I think he is doing is drawing a lot of flak/smears whilst he is changing the party back to a social democratic one, and, if he has any tactical sense, will step aside for a younger, unsmeared leader immediately in the run up to the next GE. "

would go with that yes, good synopsis..

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

"

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Corbyn is anti EU, because the Labour party are pro EU (and he is anti what ever anyone else is for), the party is Pro-EU, but a sizeable chunk of Labour voters are anti-EU.

This is the kind of time when you need propper leadership, and thats not what the Labour party has in JC. "

Labour voters need to be more careful who they vote for

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

"

You are right. We are living in very strange times. We are being Governed by a Conservative Govt who are probably the most incompetent bunch of politicians in living memory and who are in place quite simply because there really is no credible alternative.

Brexit seems to be defining everyone and everything in politics and it is astonishing that Labour seems to be incapable of sinking the Tories right now.

I wonder how history will judge this period of time when a sitting Government was actively pursuing a policy to make the country poorer and less influential and the opposition was unable to hold them to account.

What a situation...

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By *elly39devonCouple
over a year ago

tavistock

under 30's voting labour because they promise the moon, my nephew voted abour because of university fees will never happen

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

You are right. We are living in very strange times. We are being Governed by a Conservative Govt who are probably the most incompetent bunch of politicians in living memory and who are in place quite simply because there really is no credible alternative.

Brexit seems to be defining everyone and everything in politics and it is astonishing that Labour seems to be incapable of sinking the Tories right now.

I wonder how history will judge this period of time when a sitting Government was actively pursuing a policy to make the country poorer and less influential and the opposition was unable to hold them to account.

What a situation... "

for the last few years Labour have been a joke in Scotland, seems they have continued that Joke down South

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"under 30's voting labour because they promise the moon, my nephew voted abour because of university fees will never happen"
Free tuition fees isn't just a vote winner for students.Its s vote winner for parents who want their kids to go to uni in the next decade and that's a large demographic.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"under 30's voting labour because they promise the moon, my nephew voted abour because of university fees will never happen"

I really struggle to understand the viewpoint that a proper, mixed economy is somehow promising "the moon" look at what Labour achieved post WW2 when the country had virtually nothing.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

"

But labour official policy is PRO BREXIT too. That’s why the guy got sacked....go back to my OP.

But they have clearly fooled you into thinking the opposite....my very point...they are trying to be all things to all men....I thought fooling nobody...but clearly they have fooled some of you! For now....their falling support may be due to people becoming unfooled?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

But labour official policy is PRO BREXIT too. That’s why the guy got sacked....go back to my OP.

But they have clearly fooled you into thinking the opposite....my very point...they are trying to be all things to all men....I thought fooling nobody...but clearly they have fooled some of you! For now....their falling support may be due to people becoming unfooled?"

I think you're missing my point. Labour's biggest electoral problem is Jeremy Corbyn. Get rid of Jeremy and they can also get rid of their schizophrenic BREXIT policy. Personally I think Labour will actually get rid of Corbyn sooner rather than later but even if not one day in the not too distant future Corbyn will be gone. The Conservative's biggest electoral problem is BREXIT and, regardless what happens in March 2019 or December 2020 that's not going to go away any time soon.

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success."

A lot of remainers voted Labour in order to stop a Conservative getting a working majority to push forward with BREXIT. Quite a few remainers on the right of centre voted Conservative because they were more scared of a Jeremy than BREXIT and, as you pointed out, the official Labour policy was BREXIT also. The LibDems suffered from what they have always suffered from, the reality that, in most areas their chances of winning are quite remote and their chances of forming a government in their own right are non existent.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success.

A lot of remainers voted Labour in order to stop a Conservative getting a working majority to push forward with BREXIT. Quite a few remainers on the right of centre voted Conservative because they were more scared of a Jeremy than BREXIT and, as you pointed out, the official Labour policy was BREXIT also. The LibDems suffered from what they have always suffered from, the reality that, in most areas their chances of winning are quite remote and their chances of forming a government in their own right are non existent.

"

But they were the only openly anti-Brexit party. They should have massively increased their vote share (as Vince Cable arrogantly predicted they would), they are also undeniably Centrists.

And yet, not only did they not even manage to increase their numbers of MPs, they got absolutely anihilated.

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success.

A lot of remainers voted Labour in order to stop a Conservative getting a working majority to push forward with BREXIT. Quite a few remainers on the right of centre voted Conservative because they were more scared of a Jeremy than BREXIT and, as you pointed out, the official Labour policy was BREXIT also. The LibDems suffered from what they have always suffered from, the reality that, in most areas their chances of winning are quite remote and their chances of forming a government in their own right are non existent.

But they were the only openly anti-Brexit party. They should have massively increased their vote share (as Vince Cable arrogantly predicted they would), they are also undeniably Centrists.

And yet, not only did they not even manage to increase their numbers of MPs, they got absolutely anihilated.

"

Because people were voting either against Corbyn or against BREXIT. The best way to stop Corbyn was to vote Conservative. Tne best way to frustrate BREXIT was to vote Labour. I'm looking at this from the point of view of someone who is both anti Corbyn and anti BREXIT, such as myself. If I lived in a marginal constituency I would have still voted Conservative if I thought Corbyn could have won. However I felt at this election that the bigger danger was the Conservative march to a hard BREXIT and might of voted Labour to stop that. As it was I actually live in a constituency that is solid Labour so voted for the party that represented my personal views which was, this time, the LibDems.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success.

A lot of remainers voted Labour in order to stop a Conservative getting a working majority to push forward with BREXIT. Quite a few remainers on the right of centre voted Conservative because they were more scared of a Jeremy than BREXIT and, as you pointed out, the official Labour policy was BREXIT also. The LibDems suffered from what they have always suffered from, the reality that, in most areas their chances of winning are quite remote and their chances of forming a government in their own right are non existent.

But they were the only openly anti-Brexit party. They should have massively increased their vote share (as Vince Cable arrogantly predicted they would), they are also undeniably Centrists.

And yet, not only did they not even manage to increase their numbers of MPs, they got absolutely anihilated.

Because people were voting either against Corbyn or against BREXIT. The best way to stop Corbyn was to vote Conservative. Tne best way to frustrate BREXIT was to vote Labour. I'm looking at this from the point of view of someone who is both anti Corbyn and anti BREXIT, such as myself. If I lived in a marginal constituency I would have still voted Conservative if I thought Corbyn could have won. However I felt at this election that the bigger danger was the Conservative march to a hard BREXIT and might of voted Labour to stop that. As it was I actually live in a constituency that is solid Labour so voted for the party that represented my personal views which was, this time, the LibDems."

So, people were voting against BREXIT by voting for the pro-BREXIT Labour Party?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes


"I think we're in a very strange place in British politics currently.

Because of Conservative support for BREXIT Labour should be well ahead in the polld but it's not because it's lead by Jeremy Corbyn. Because of Labour being lead by Jeremy Corbyn the Conservatives should be well ahead in the polls but they're not because of their support for BREXIT.

I guess the winner of the next election depends on whether Labour ditch Jeremy before the Conservatives ditch BREXIT. My money (but definitely not my support) is on Labour ditching Corbyn.

Explain then, why the vocally pro-remain lib dems were whitewashed at the GE?

I know most people on this forum don't accept it, but BREXIT isn't the biggest factor in a parties electoral success.

A lot of remainers voted Labour in order to stop a Conservative getting a working majority to push forward with BREXIT. Quite a few remainers on the right of centre voted Conservative because they were more scared of a Jeremy than BREXIT and, as you pointed out, the official Labour policy was BREXIT also. The LibDems suffered from what they have always suffered from, the reality that, in most areas their chances of winning are quite remote and their chances of forming a government in their own right are non existent.

But they were the only openly anti-Brexit party. They should have massively increased their vote share (as Vince Cable arrogantly predicted they would), they are also undeniably Centrists.

And yet, not only did they not even manage to increase their numbers of MPs, they got absolutely anihilated.

Because people were voting either against Corbyn or against BREXIT. The best way to stop Corbyn was to vote Conservative. Tne best way to frustrate BREXIT was to vote Labour. I'm looking at this from the point of view of someone who is both anti Corbyn and anti BREXIT, such as myself. If I lived in a marginal constituency I would have still voted Conservative if I thought Corbyn could have won. However I felt at this election that the bigger danger was the Conservative march to a hard BREXIT and might of voted Labour to stop that. As it was I actually live in a constituency that is solid Labour so voted for the party that represented my personal views which was, this time, the LibDems.

So, people were voting against BREXIT by voting for the pro-BREXIT Labour Party?

"

In a word 'yes'.

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