FabSwingers.com forum: Scotland could be £12billion a year worse off

By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Scottish government analysis concludes Scotland's economy could be £12.7bn a year worse off under a so-called hard Brexit

Now how many would be willing to accept this to keep your wee UK union together?

Now can you see why Scotland's people must be allowed to make their own minds up with having a new independence referendum as Scotland's majority voted to remain in the EU and single market

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit. "

CLCC are you willing to see Scotland be £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit ?

What is it you want Scotland to do just sit and wait to be hit with being £12 billion worse off ?

Thank you so much for caring about Scotland

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Btw the Yoon nutter media up here is Scotland claim the want the SNP to stop talking about independence and get on with the day job

Well the Herald has this as a headline

''Nicola Sturgeon refuses to discuss referendum after criticism''

Also by yoon logic they want Nicola to talk about a new independence referendum they really should make up their minds

Well Nicola was clear as hell yesterday once the final deal on brexit is known then she will decide on if to hand in the section 30 order to downing st

Whyis it unionists never listen as Nicola has said this time and time again but for now she is seeking to find the best possible deal for the whole of the UK and that is to stay in the single market how clear do you want Nicola to make it before it registers in your heed ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Kinky as CLCC has said best scenario is to cancel Brexit

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Kinky as CLCC has said best scenario is to cancel Brexit "

And if that doesnt happen are people willing to accept Scotland being £12 billion worse off in a UK brexit ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I for one am not

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Has there been an analysis of the cost of Scotland leaving the UK? A hard indy and a soft indy?

There is no way Scotland could leave the UK before the UK leaves the EU, so Scotland would be doubly fucked if out of the UK and out of the EU.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

CLCC if brexit is not cancelled are you willing to accept Scotland being £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit ? Yes or No ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What is a hard brexit

Is not the hole of the uk going to be worse off when this brexit comes

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"CLCC if brexit is not cancelled are you willing to accept Scotland being £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit ? Yes or No ?

"
i think the sooner you leave the uk the better for you then lol

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"CLCC if brexit is not cancelled are you willing to accept Scotland being £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit ? Yes or No ?

Yes. Of course, they would be even poorer outisde of the UK and out of the EU. Are you willing to make Scotland even poorer by leaving both the UK and the EU?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Has there been an analysis of the cost of Scotland leaving the UK? A hard indy and a soft indy?

There is no way Scotland could leave the UK before the UK leaves the EU, so Scotland would be doubly fucked if out of the UK and out of the EU. "

That would be interesting as the last time they did that they based all their economic figures based on oil being 120 dollars a barrel...

You will never get kinky to admit it but the dodged a hell of a bullet economically last time

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Has there been an analysis of the cost of Scotland leaving the UK? A hard indy and a soft indy?

There is no way Scotland could leave the UK before the UK leaves the EU, so Scotland would be doubly fucked if out of the UK and out of the EU.

That would be interesting as the last time they did that they based all their economic figures based on oil being 120 dollars a barrel...

You will never get kinky to admit it but the dodged a hell of a bullet economically last time "

I think Brexit also shows how complicated a split would be, and it would be much more complicated than leaving the UK, especially with a lot more national security complications on both sides.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh"

Yet you "strategically" didn't reply and quote so you would see me saying that's because leaving the UK and the EU would make Scotland even poorer. You didn't answer my question though. Would you still want an independent Scotland know that it will cost even more than £12bn per year?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Ok lets play your game

show much how much its going to cost Scotland being out of the UK and the EU ? You said it back it up then

much it total is it going to leave Scotland worse off out of the UK and EU ?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Ok lets play your game

show much how much its going to cost Scotland being out of the UK and the EU ? You said it back it up then

much it total is it going to leave Scotland worse off out of the UK and EU ? "

Are you saying you don't know???!!!!

Come on kinky, I have a lot more respect for you than that. I can't believe that you would advocate leaving the UK and EU simultaneously without knowing how much it will cost your countrymen.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Question for you all

Should it be down to the people living in Scotland to either agree or not agree to the final brexit deal ?

You all know Scotland voted in a majority to remain in the EU and single market now if the UK are hell bend on taking the UK out how many of you would deny Scotland its right to decide its own future ? i get it your all afraid to lose Scotland but doesnt give you the right to dictate our future am afraid

If Scotland if gonna be worse off then yes Scotland's people have a right to decide our future

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Ok lets play your game

show much how much its going to cost Scotland being out of the UK and the EU ? You said it back it up then

much it total is it going to leave Scotland worse off out of the UK and EU ?

Are you saying you don't know???!!!!

Come on kinky, I have a lot more respect for you than that. I can't believe that you would advocate leaving the UK and EU simultaneously without knowing how much it will cost your countrymen. "

No no you said you back it up

Now come on CLCC how much in total will it leave Scotland worse off being out of the UK and the EU ?

As you can see i am not saying that you are now please back it up or i call bullshit and you cant answer which then i say your making it and are clueless lol

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Figures from Glasgow University say that Scotland would lose £7bn a year from the ending of the Barnett Forumla, and it had previously estimated an income of £4bn a year from North Sea oil and gas. Now seeing how North Sea oil and gas was a net drain on the treasury last year, we will conservatively reduce that down to an income of £0. So £7bn plus £4bn makes £11bn a year loss to Scotland if they were to become independent, add that to the £12bn announced as a cost of leaving the EU, that would make Scotland at least £23bn a year worse off.

I would also posit that the effect of leaving both would compound, however I am unable to quantify by how much so we will have to leave that, and simply call the £23bn a very conservative estimate.

The population of Scotland is 5.3m, so independence would cost the people of Scotland, every man, woman and child, £4,339.62, each and every year. Do you think that everyone in Scotland can afford that Kinky? Or would want to pay that?

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Question for you all

Should it be down to the people living in Scotland to either agree or not agree to the final brexit deal ?

If Scotland if gonna be worse off then yes Scotland's people have a right to decide our future "
I'd be happy for you to have another vote it's upto the Scots which ever way a vote went

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By *an_WoodMan
over a year ago

Stafford

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?"

Fact check alert ! It was Alex Salmons claim in 2013 on oil revenue being the basis of a £57 billion boom

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Norway a country of 5 million + people have as much oil as the UK do

Norway's wealth fund hits £1 Trillion

Norway is in the single market

Now lets look at Scotland

Scotland has 5 million + people and if Scotland were to become independent then yes Scotland has alot of Scottish waters

And at present our Scottish government are fighting to make sure the UK and if not the UK then Scotland remains in the single market

So how come people think Norway a country of 5 million people can be independent and really successful then how in the hell can Scotland not do the same ?

Oh wait i forgot Scotland is far too poor and stupid to be ever independent we need help from England to fund us and help us out lol

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

Fact check alert ! It was Alex Salmons claim in 2013 on oil revenue being the basis of a £57 billion boom

Funny how i never mentioned Salmond but you by passed what David Cameron told Scottish people that there will be a big £200billion oil boom

So where is the £200billion oil boom that was promised ?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Figures from Glasgow University say that Scotland would lose £7bn a year from the ending of the Barnett Forumla, and it had previously estimated an income of £4bn a year from North Sea oil and gas. Now seeing how North Sea oil and gas was a net drain on the treasury last year, we will conservatively reduce that down to an income of £0. So £7bn plus £4bn makes £11bn a year loss to Scotland if they were to become independent, add that to the £12bn announced as a cost of leaving the EU, that would make Scotland at least £23bn a year worse off.

I would also posit that the effect of leaving both would compound, however I am unable to quantify by how much so we will have to leave that, and simply call the £23bn a very conservative estimate.

Come on kinky, answer the question would you make every man woman and child in Scotland pay more than £4,300 per year for independence?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Remember now today's Scottish government brexit impact papers it was carried out by Scottish Government economists, not the SNP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now is anyone on here willing to call these economists liars ? That Scotland face being £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

I notice that the people that claim that Scotland will be even more worse off out of the UK and the EU cannot come up with a figure in total of how much worse off Scotland will be out of both ? Come back to me when you to eh or i call bullshit lol

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Norway a country of 5 million + people have as much oil as the UK do

Norway's wealth fund hits £1 Trillion

Norway is in the single market

Now lets look at Scotland

Scotland has 5 million + people and if Scotland were to become independent then yes Scotland has alot of Scottish waters

And at present our Scottish government are fighting to make sure the UK and if not the UK then Scotland remains in the single market

So how come people think Norway a country of 5 million people can be independent and really successful then how in the hell can Scotland not do the same ?

Oh wait i forgot Scotland is far too poor and stupid to be ever independent we need help from England to fund us and help us out lol

And for all there wealth they are one of the MOST taxed population on the planet

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Many of the journalists going through the Scottish Government Brexit report with a fine tooth comb have spent the last 18 months pointedly ignoring the fact Westminster is forcing us out of the EU without any research plan or basic competence

The SNP campaign against Brexit, saying it would be an unmitigated disaster. Scottish voters votes against Brexit by massive margin. Scottish Tories branch conclusion? "The SNP should focus on making a success of Brexit''

Lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember now today's Scottish government brexit impact papers it was carried out by Scottish Government economists, not the SNP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now is anyone on here willing to call these economists liars ? That Scotland face being £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

You call the economists liars when they produce the GERS figures and they are always remodeling to make them as accurate as they can using international standards.

The RUK is still Scotland's biggest market !!!!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Remember now today's Scottish government brexit impact papers it was carried out by Scottish Government economists, not the SNP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now is anyone on here willing to call these economists liars ? That Scotland face being £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

You call the economists liars when they produce the GERS figures and they are always remodeling to make them as accurate as they can using international standards.

The RUK is still Scotland's biggest market !!!!"

The GERS figures are for Scotland in the UK not really a good argument to make i would shhhhhh on that if i were you lol

GERS does not show what an independent Scotland would look like but it does show you what ill effects that Scotland has with being in the UK you know where the UK government control the money and where the present Uk government are adding to the debt and borrowing more and cant meet a single target and Scotland has no borrowing powers as thats not devolved lol

In your opinion

let me think what about 60 million in rUK if you take out Scotland

EU - 511.8 million

which is bigger 60 or 511 million ? lol

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Btw the Yoon nutter media up here is Scotland claim the want the SNP to stop talking about independence and get on with the day job

Well the Herald has this as a headline

''Nicola Sturgeon refuses to discuss referendum after criticism''

Also by yoon logic they want Nicola to talk about a new independence referendum they really should make up their minds

Well Nicola was clear as hell yesterday once the final deal on brexit is known then she will decide on if to hand in the section 30 order to downing st

I don't think many or anyone, North or South of the border, doesn't understand. What makes you think some don't?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Cant wait to hear a unionist sit there and say there pissed off that the Scottish government are doing brexit impact papers

While the UK governmennt tell us they did do brexit impact papers then said oh wait no no we didnt do any brexit impact papers

So which government do you trust more eh ?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit.

CLCC are you willing to see Scotland be £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit ?

What is it you want Scotland to do just sit and wait to be hit with being £12 billion worse off ?

Thank you so much for caring about Scotland "

Neither CCLC, myself or many other who are in favour of the UK Union want to see Scotland leave the EU's single market. We don't want to see any part of the UK leave. If you also don't want Scotland to leave the EU's single market then, rather than using it as an excuse for your independence argument, why don't you work more with others around the UK, as Nicola actually is, to try and prevent it. Maybe you actually are willing to see the whole UK £120+ billion a year worse of if it makes Scott's independence more likely?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit.

CLCC are you willing to see Scotland be £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit ?

What is it you want Scotland to do just sit and wait to be hit with being £12 billion worse off ?

Thank you so much for caring about Scotland

Erm clue i dont want Scotland to be in the UK its not an equal partnership or family of nations it never was

Sorry but yes i want Scotland to stay in the EU single market and i respect England vote t leave the EU and your being told from your PM that the UK wont be in the single market.

Now i do hope England do decide to stay in the single market but sorry i aint hanging about waiting because as it stands it dont look like its gonna happen.

So in all Scotland people have to do what is best for our country and can only hope England follow but by god if there is a way out for Scotland to escape the brexit mess then by god we will take it

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?"

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember now today's Scottish government brexit impact papers it was carried out by Scottish Government economists, not the SNP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now is anyone on here willing to call these economists liars ? That Scotland face being £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

What did the impact papers of leaving the UK say ???

or have they not been done ???

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

I'm already convinced that the UK leaving the EU is going to cost us all billions, why would I argue against the Scottish impact papers when they say pretty much exactly what I'd expect?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember now today's Scottish government brexit impact papers it was carried out by Scottish Government economists, not the SNP!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now is anyone on here willing to call these economists liars ? That Scotland face being £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

You call the economists liars when they produce the GERS figures and they are always remodeling to make them as accurate as they can using international standards.

The RUK is still Scotland's biggest market !!!!

The GERS figures are for Scotland in the UK not really a good argument to make i would shhhhhh on that if i were you lol

In your opinion

let me think what about 60 million in rUK if you take out Scotland

EU - 511.8 million

which is bigger 60 or 511 million ? lol

The GERS figures are the best we have and are used as a starting point.

Have you noticed Saint Nicola does not criticize them nor swinny or salmond.

The GERS figures were held up as going to prove how solvent Scotland is by all there of the aforementioned.

So swinny salmond and sturgeon all wrong but you are right ??

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit.

CLCC are you willing to see Scotland be £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit ?

What is it you want Scotland to do just sit and wait to be hit with being £12 billion worse off ?

Thank you so much for caring about Scotland

Erm clue i dont want Scotland to be in the UK its not an equal partnership or family of nations it never was

Sorry but yes i want Scotland to stay in the EU single market and i respect England vote t leave the EU and your being told from your PM that the UK wont be in the single market.

Now i do hope England do decide to stay in the single market but sorry i aint hanging about waiting because as it stands it dont look like its gonna happen.

So in all Scotland people have to do what is best for our country and can only hope England follow but by god if there is a way out for Scotland to escape the brexit mess then by god we will take it

So, basically you don't care about the whole of the UK being £120+ billions worse of after BREXIT or the likely £24+ billion worse of Scotland could be after a split with the rest of the UK.

You're really no different from the BREXITers are you? To hell with the damage to any people!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

I'm already convinced that the UK leaving the EU is going to cost us all billions, why would I argue against the Scottish impact papers when they say pretty much exactly what I'd expect?"

Right so say it is a hard brexit for the UK and it will make Scotland £12billion a year worse off staying in the UK would you accept this or would you be saying Scotland should get the hell away while they have the chance ?

Now there is impact papers telling you what Scotland would face by being out of the UK and EU so people are making up numbers

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Scotland's share of trade with the EU has shrunk over the past few years but that is not what the OP wants to hear.

You can only state they are potential customers of Scotland.

We already have a solid customer base with the RUK.

Scotland would need to reapply to the EU and satisfy the other nations before entry.

Small matters like deficit and currency would need to be over come and remember we would not have T hatchers rebate when we start contributing! !!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Scotland in the UK and the EU is best financially for Scotland, for the UK and for the EU. We can get richer together, or get poorer apart. Just cancel Brexit.

CLCC are you willing to see Scotland be £12 billion a year worse off with a hard brexit ?

What is it you want Scotland to do just sit and wait to be hit with being £12 billion worse off ?

Thank you so much for caring about Scotland

Erm clue i dont want Scotland to be in the UK its not an equal partnership or family of nations it never was

Sorry but yes i want Scotland to stay in the EU single market and i respect England vote t leave the EU and your being told from your PM that the UK wont be in the single market.

Now i do hope England do decide to stay in the single market but sorry i aint hanging about waiting because as it stands it dont look like its gonna happen.

So in all Scotland people have to do what is best for our country and can only hope England follow but by god if there is a way out for Scotland to escape the brexit mess then by god we will take it

So, basically you don't care about the whole of the UK being £120+ billions worse of after BREXIT or the likely £24+ billion worse of Scotland could be after a split with the rest of the UK.

You're really no different from the BREXITers are you? To hell with the damage to any people!"

I could twist that and say seems alot of people outside of Scotland do not care that Scotland could be £12billion a year worse off by staying in the UK and outside of the EU and single market

Now like i said i hope to god England changes it minds and stays in the single market but i aint hanging about living in hope that England chooses to stay in the EU or single market that may never happen and Scotland has to do what is in its best interests and that is staying in the single market

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year? "

Come on OP. What's your answer?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer? "

You want me to answer that

ok before i answer can you go find me the impact papers that show the figure that Scotland would be even worse off being out of the UK and the EU ? Find them then i shall answer

until then your figures are made up bullshit

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh"

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer?

You want me to answer that

ok before i answer can you go find me the impact papers that show the figure that Scotland would be even worse off being out of the UK and the EU ? Find them then i shall answer

until then your figures are made up bullshit

So research from Glasgow University is bullshit? All of their research?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

No and am getting sick fed up with this anti English crap

So because i believe the country i was born and live in should be independent that then means i somehow become anti English yeah ok!!!!

To make it clear i want England as neighbors

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer?

You want me to answer that

ok before i answer can you go find me the impact papers that show the figure that Scotland would be even worse off being out of the UK and the EU ? Find them then i shall answer

until then your figures are made up bullshit

So research from Glasgow University is bullshit? All of their research? "

Have you not found the impact papers to tell us the figures of Scotland leaving the UK and EU yet ?

Find them and i shall answer ok

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

I'm already convinced that the UK leaving the EU is going to cost us all billions, why would I argue against the Scottish impact papers when they say pretty much exactly what I'd expect?

Now there is impact papers telling you what Scotland would face by being out of the UK and EU so people are making up numbers "

I've said it before and I'll say it again. I believe that both Scotland and England would be worse off separated whether either or both are inside the EU or not. I also believe that both would be even more worse of if they are not in the same customs union and single market. So, while I don't want Scotland to be £12 billion worse of and the UK as a whole even mote so, by leaving the EU I even less want Scotland, England and the UK as a whole to be a lot more worse off by breaking up the UK's single market and customs union. Scotland's independence from the UK would do nothing to mitigate the effects of BREXIT and can only add to and compound the detrimental effects to both Scotland, England and the rest of the UK. Solutions are meant to mark things better, not worse.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

No and am getting sick fed up with this anti English crap

So because i believe the country i was born and live in should be independent that then means i somehow become anti English yeah ok!!!!

To make it clear i want England as neighbors "

Listen it's how you come across..

Because many on here disagree with your poor us we are so not being treated the way we want or point out to you the facts of just how and what can be achieved at this point in time under the laws of Parliament and devolved authority, you try and turn it into a they all hate us when it's not the case..

You have no choice in the neighbours element

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

I'm already convinced that the UK leaving the EU is going to cost us all billions, why would I argue against the Scottish impact papers when they say pretty much exactly what I'd expect?

Now there is impact papers telling you what Scotland would face by being out of the UK and EU so people are making up numbers

say it is a hard brexit for the UK and it will make Scotland £12billion a year worse off staying in the UK would you accept this or would you be saying Scotland should get the hell away while they have the chance ?

I will be honest it comes across that way

So do you have the impact papers and figures there to show if Scotland will be worse off out of the UK and EU ?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

No and am getting sick fed up with this anti English crap

So because i believe the country i was born and live in should be independent that then means i somehow become anti English yeah ok!!!!

To make it clear i want England as neighbors "
you will always av England as neighbors it's a bloody island so what the hell does that realy mean lmao

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Right this is to make things very clear

Scotland voted by a majority to remain in the EU and single market

England voted by a majority and so did Wales to leave the EU but didnt vote to leave the single market which is good as England and Wales still have a change to save themselves on that

You keep on telling me and other pro indy supporters we should respect the 2014 result to remain part of the UK i have done this and i also respect the wishes of England to leave the EU i hope England and Wales fight to remain part of the single market but like i said Scotland aint hanging about and living in hope to see if England changes its mind and stays in the single market or cancels brexit

Scotland has to prepare for a hard brexit and what we can do to stop this from happening here in Scotland now before Scotland is hit will being £12billion a year worse off by staying in the UK and out of the EU and single market

none of you can give a real true figure your making up numbers as there is no impact papers to say if Scotland will be even more worse off out of the UK and EU stop making shit up and produce figures real figures coming from experts

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

No and am getting sick fed up with this anti English crap

So because i believe the country i was born and live in should be independent that then means i somehow become anti English yeah ok!!!!

To make it clear i want England as neighbors you will always av England as neighbors it's a bloody island so what the hell does that realy mean lmao "

Wow just wow

yes i know Britain is an Island might wanna tell others that as some see it as a country lol

What i mean is Scotland does not have full control over non devolved matters

So why should English MP's for example tell Scottish people want we should get in a set budget and what powers we should get thats not neighbors thats dictating terms thats no family of nations

Anyone wanna challenge that ? Then i simply have to put the Scotland bill that was Westminster and unelected Lords telling us Scots what we can have in powers

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer? "
is that like the £4500 Osborn said every person will be worse of if we voted brexit in England then

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer? "

I told you go find me the impact papers and figures that tell you Scotland will be even worse off out of the UK and the EU then i will be more than happy to answer that question ok

i know you cant and your stalling i can see through you a mile

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer?

I told you go find me the impact papers and figures that tell you Scotland will be even worse off out of the UK and the EU then i will be more than happy to answer that question ok

i know you cant and your stalling i can see through you a mile "

You do know that this £12 billion is all assumption don't you, there is not one iota of practical evidence that makes that figure.

It's all based on assumption no one knows what is going to happen when Brexit comes around hard or soft.

Just reported on 5 live that these figures are guess work, but hey it's the bbc so you wont accept that will you.

Scotland is staying put matey and all your whinging and flag flying and going on about how hard done by Scotland is you aint going anywhere.

Your mostly just a lone voice that will not accept the true facts that are put in front of you.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Who thinks Kinky should answer the question if they still support an independent Scotland that will cost every man woman and child more than £4,300 per year?

Come on OP. What's your answer?

I told you go find me the impact papers and figures that tell you Scotland will be even worse off out of the UK and the EU then i will be more than happy to answer that question ok

i know you cant and your stalling i can see through you a mile

You do know that this £12 billion is all assumption don't you, there is not one iota of practical evidence that makes that figure.

It's all based on assumption no one knows what is going to happen when Brexit comes around hard or soft.

Just reported on 5 live that these figures are guess work, but hey it's the bbc so you wont accept that will you.

Scotland is staying put matey and all your whinging and flag flying and going on about how hard done by Scotland is you aint going anywhere.

Your mostly just a lone voice that will not accept the true facts that are put in front of you."

So the economists that are experts are lying then ? Funny how unionists love trusting experts on anything anti independence but when it clearly shows Scotland will be worse off in a hard brexit UK no no the experts all of a sudden have not to be trusted lol

BBC 5 live ? Lol yeah ok trust the BBC they never lie to people lmao

Sadly for you that is not upto you to decide if Scotland were to become independent as you dont live in Scotland lol

lone voice ? yeah ok so i am the only one that supports Scottish independence now lol

You seen the youtube videos titled ''Journey to yes''

i would if i were you as that is no voters that now back independence

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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

The two referenda - Scotland in the UK, and the UK in the EU - make interesting comparisons.

In both - and I'm being very simplistic to make a point - the arguments came down to:

- stay, you'll be poorer if you leave

- leave, and you can be a nation again

Scotland heeded the warnings and voted with the head; the UK (or more accurately England & Wales) ignored the "experts" and voted with the heart.

For better or worse, Scotland renewed its marriage vows with England.

We're all in this together, as someone who is best forgotten once said. And I suspect we are ALL going to be poorer for a while as a result.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"Is this £12 be ON TOP of the £24bn they would be worse off from leaving the UK?

That’s a real shitter if it is!

Better pray for a soft brexit and staying in the union then?

Where you getting that figure from ?

Where is the so called leaving the UK and Eu impact papers eh ? Oh wait you have none made up bullshit to scare people off

One thing is for sure though unionists do not seem to be trying to say Scotland being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit is a lie ? VERY TELLING!!!!

I'm already convinced that the UK leaving the EU is going to cost us all billions, why would I argue against the Scottish impact papers when they say pretty much exactly what I'd expect?

Now there is impact papers telling you what Scotland would face by being out of the UK and EU so people are making up numbers

I will be honest it comes across that way

So do you have the impact papers and figures there to show if Scotland will be worse off out of the UK and EU ?

I've already answered you. I think Scotland would be a lot more than £12 billion worse of if it breaks away from the UK. Independence will not mitigate the impact of BREXIT it will compound it, and here's the impact study to show it.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/236579/scotland_analysis_macroeconomic_and_fiscal_performance.pdf

It concludes that Scottish trade with the rest of the UK could fall by 80% and average annual incomes in Scotland by 25% as a direct result of independence. Just to be absolutely clear:- The report says that Scotland's exports to the UK could drop by £40 billion a year leading to a decrease in average incomes in Scotland of £6,000 per year as a direct result of independence.

Don't try and tell me you actually give a shit about Scotland being £12 billion worse of per year when your solution is forecast to actually make Scotland £40 billion a year worse off.

Like i said, solutions are meant to make things better, not worse.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

Stand by for the I love England and have English friends speech

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wow did you all catch that

CLCC said yes he is willing to see Scotland £12 billion a year worse off in a UK brexit

So much for caring about Scotland eh

Faux tears won't wash..

You come across as someone who hates England and yet get all outraged when people show indifference or just go yeah HnS whatever..

No and am getting sick fed up with this anti English crap

So because i believe the country i was born and live in should be independent that then means i somehow become anti English yeah ok!!!!

To make it clear i want England as neighbors "

You don't have any choice

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Right this is to make things very clear

Scotland voted by a majority to remain in the EU and single market

England voted by a majority and so did Wales to leave the EU but didnt vote to leave the single market which is good as England and Wales still have a change to save themselves on that

Just so all readers know

A third of Scottish voters did not cast a vote !!!

They did not care one way or another if Scotland / RUK were in the EU or not.

So not really Scotland being dragged out is it.

Just for info the snp campaigned not to join the EU when The UK polled to join or not.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

I wasnt the one that said yes to accepting Scotland being £12billion a year worse off if it meant keeping Scotland in the UK

Who says that ? lol That is madness

There is no impact papers to say what Scotland would face being out of the UK and the EU so please stop with that shite

Your being told by expects Scotland face being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

not even a care in the world that the Scottish government ACTUALLY researched and put out impact papers of the effects a hard brexit will do to Scotland

Did your UK government do brexit impact papers ? No they did not!!

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Right this is to make things very clear

Scotland voted by a majority to remain in the EU and single market

England voted by a majority and so did Wales to leave the EU but didnt vote to leave the single market which is good as England and Wales still have a change to save themselves on that

Just so all readers know

A third of Scottish voters did not cast a vote !!!

They did not care one way or another if Scotland / RUK were in the EU or not.

So not really Scotland being dragged out is it.

Just for info the snp campaigned not to join the EU when The UK polled to join or not.

Wow listen to yourself

So let me get this right

your telling people that not everyone voted in Scotland on the EU referendum

fact not everyone voted in the Scottish independence referendum and guess what no voters keep saying the will of the majority of Scotland's no vote should be respected

Then by that logic Scotland's majority remain vote should also be respected

and the people that didnt vote well tough shit their vote dont count

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?"

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

Wow so you trying to say David Cameron never said that if Scotland vote no to independence there would be a £200billion oil boom ?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

Wow so you trying to say David Cameron never said that if Scotland vote no to independence there would be a £200billion oil boom ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I know you're not good with figures etc so there's a big bright picture in that headline to help capture your attention.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

England voted by a majority and so did Wales to leave the EU but didnt vote to leave the single market which is good as England and Wales still have a change to save themselves on that

The UK as a whole voted to leave the EU and the single market. All the leading figures of both the Remain campaign and the Leave campaign said a vote to Leave the EU meant leaving the single market. The Prime minister at the time David Cameron made this point numerous times on several occasions during the EU referendum campaign.

Scotland has never joined the EU as an independent nation. Scotland only has membership of the EU as part of the UK. That's why the EU referendum was a UK wide vote. It's also why the UK Supreme court ruled in the Gina Miller case that Scotland has no say in Brexit, because the UK Parliament took us into the EU in the 1970's and only the UK Parliament in Westminster can take us out now. It's about time you started to respect the democratic decision that the UK as a whole made to Leave the EU and the single market and also respect UK law as administered by the UK Supreme court that ruled Scotland has no say in the Brexit process because it is not a devolved issue.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I know you're not good with figures etc so there's a big bright picture in that headline to help capture your attention.

PLease answer my question

Oh look and its all unionist newspapers too i suppose there all lying now lol

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/10656869/David-Cameron-to-boost-North-Sea-revenues-by-200bn-to-persuade-Scots-to-vote-no-to-independence.html

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-independence-oil-politics-centre-stage-1-3317316

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/24/david-cameron-north-sea-oil-scottish-independence

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scotland-should-not-need-endless-black-stuff-to-stay-out-of-the-red-kh8ppf6j6

So LandA did David Cameron tell Scotland if it votes no to independence then there would be a £200 billion oil boom yes or no ?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I know you're not good with figures etc so there's a big bright picture in that headline to help capture your attention.

PLease answer my question

Oh look and its all unionist newspapers too i suppose there all lying now lol

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/10656869/David-Cameron-to-boost-North-Sea-revenues-by-200bn-to-persuade-Scots-to-vote-no-to-independence.html

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-independence-oil-politics-centre-stage-1-3317316

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/24/david-cameron-north-sea-oil-scottish-independence

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scotland-should-not-need-endless-black-stuff-to-stay-out-of-the-red-kh8ppf6j6

So LandA did David Cameron tell Scotland if it votes no to independence then there would be a £200 billion oil boom yes or no ? "

There's not a single quote in any of those articles with Cameron mentioning £200bn. Can you quote here exactly what he said?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I know you're not good with figures etc so there's a big bright picture in that headline to help capture your attention.

PLease answer my question

Oh look and its all unionist newspapers too i suppose there all lying now lol

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/10656869/David-Cameron-to-boost-North-Sea-revenues-by-200bn-to-persuade-Scots-to-vote-no-to-independence.html

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-independence-oil-politics-centre-stage-1-3317316

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/24/david-cameron-north-sea-oil-scottish-independence

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scotland-should-not-need-endless-black-stuff-to-stay-out-of-the-red-kh8ppf6j6

So LandA did David Cameron tell Scotland if it votes no to independence then there would be a £200 billion oil boom yes or no ?

There's not a single quote in any of those articles with Cameron mentioning £200bn. Can you quote here exactly what he said?

Wow so are you saying those unionist newspaper are all lying now ?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"Fabio we are still waiting for our £200bn oil boom that was promised of we voted No

Gonna deny that was not a promise made by Cameron and co ?

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I think you'll find the person who predicted an oil boom just before the arse fell out of it is the SNP's current education secretaty

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHxlLw7WAAAnXiK.jpg

I know you're not good with figures etc so there's a big bright picture in that headline to help capture your attention.

PLease answer my question

Oh look and its all unionist newspapers too i suppose there all lying now lol

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/10656869/David-Cameron-to-boost-North-Sea-revenues-by-200bn-to-persuade-Scots-to-vote-no-to-independence.html

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-independence-oil-politics-centre-stage-1-3317316

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/feb/24/david-cameron-north-sea-oil-scottish-independence

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scotland-should-not-need-endless-black-stuff-to-stay-out-of-the-red-kh8ppf6j6

So LandA did David Cameron tell Scotland if it votes no to independence then there would be a £200 billion oil boom yes or no ?

There's not a single quote in any of those articles with Cameron mentioning £200bn. Can you quote here exactly what he said?

Wow so are you saying those unionist newspaper are all lying now ? "

There's no such thing as a Unionist newspaper.

So where is the quote with Cameron mentioning £200bn? Should be easy to find surely?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

"I wasnt the one that said yes to accepting Scotland being £12billion a year worse off if it meant keeping Scotland in the UK

Who says that ? lol That is madness

There is no impact papers to say what Scotland would face being out of the UK and the EU so please stop with that shite

Your being told by expects Scotland face being £12billion a year worse off with a hard brexit

not even a care in the world that the Scottish government ACTUALLY researched and put out impact papers of the effects a hard brexit will do to Scotland

Did your UK government do brexit impact papers ? No they did not!!

But you are the person saying that to avoid £12 billion per year from BREXIT you want independence which would lose £40+ billion a year.