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"Agree with Craken.. the plate juggling, being all things to all approach will fail.. then again no surprises given we have the system we have whereby the vast majority of Politicians can't or wont be open and honest with the electorate not only on this but in general.. " | |||
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"Anyone followed Stefan de Rynck’s speech earlier today? Just how systematic, controlled and consistent is the EU message compared to the U.K. and its bungling attempt to bridge the needs of dealing with EU and the Brextremist ideologists. This is not going to end well. Big takeaway for me was the comment that only the Brexit transition framework could be agreed by March and finalised in September. By my reading, that could put U.K. aviation operators in limbo from March to September as they have schedule one year in advance. EASA membership cannot yet be replaced without a massive overhaul and expansion at the CAA which in even the best estimates will take 5 years." Almost like such things were ignored by those who campaigned to leave so strongly.. | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? "What was it the lady said. "What? Another one?" There is no point in having another referendum just as there was no point in having the first. Whether it's called being in the EU, Single Market or customs union or something else, at the end of it all in reality, if not in name, we will be in all three. You may as well call a referendum on whether rain should be banned on Sundays. BREXITers are just going to have to learn and accept that you can't always get what you want in life. | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss?
What was it the lady said. "What? Another one?"
There is no point in having another referendum just as there was no point in having the first. Whether it's called being in the EU, Single Market or customs union or something else, at the end of it all in reality, if not in name, we will be in all three. You may as well call a referendum on whether rain should be banned on Sundays.
BREXITers are just going to have to learn and accept that you can't always get what you want in life. "True ,voting never changed anything .I genuinely feel sorry for brexiters who believe that they've changed anything.Theyve been had over proper. | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss?
What was it the lady said. "What? Another one?"
There is no point in having another referendum just as there was no point in having the first. Whether it's called being in the EU, Single Market or customs union or something else, at the end of it all in reality, if not in name, we will be in all three. You may as well call a referendum on whether rain should be banned on Sundays.
BREXITers are just going to have to learn and accept that you can't always get what you want in life. "Good luck with that, Herr Farage will fight on until the last British worker has been made unemployed | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time "The UK had a veto over the Euro. Neither Labour or the conservatives have ever made a manifesto commitment to join the Euro, so the chances of that ever happening, slim to fucking none! This, like many of anti-EU issues is just fear whipped up by people who don't like the EU and have to lie about it to get other people to piss their pants about a subject that they don't understand. An EU Army is another perfect example of this. | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time "I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too. I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro. | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me... " No. | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
The UK had a veto over the Euro. Neither Labour or the conservatives have ever made a manifesto commitment to join the Euro, so the chances of that ever happening, slim to fucking none!
This, like many of anti-EU issues is just fear whipped up by people who don't like the EU and have to lie about it to get other people to piss their pants about a subject that they don't understand. An EU Army is another perfect example of this. "And manifestos are always stuck to, aren't they..... | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro."Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that? | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
The UK had a veto over the Euro. Neither Labour or the conservatives have ever made a manifesto commitment to join the Euro, so the chances of that ever happening, slim to fucking none!
This, like many of anti-EU issues is just fear whipped up by people who don't like the EU and have to lie about it to get other people to piss their pants about a subject that they don't understand. An EU Army is another perfect example of this.
And manifestos are always stuck to, aren't they....."If it's not a manifesto commitment then it can be blocked in the Lords. Do you honestly believe that a government of any colour would do something as massive as changing to the Euro without it being a manifesto commitment? Like I said, just another coward pissing their pants. | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? "its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there | |||
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"its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there " I already do live in the EU and am extremely happy with that state of affairs. Leaving the EU will be detrimental to me and my families way of life. The world has moved on from the 1950's ideals the brexiters seem to want to drag us back to. The UK is too small to stand alone and doesn't have the influence to deal with the rest of the world on our terms. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave." Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there "You talk some garbage | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there "Or how about the UK stays in the EU, and if you don't like it, you leave? | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave." But we need the EU more than the EU need us. There is no point in them accommodating what you call a 'sensible' deal from their point of view. They will be after the best deal for themselves. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx" . At a rough guess I'd say err where the border is? | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there "Why? for such a momentous change, surely more than 37% of the voting population should have been needed to bring about change? | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there
Why? for such a momentous change, surely more than 37% of the voting population should have been needed to bring about change? ". We didn't need any vote to start the momentum, we didn't need any vote for all the treaties, Constitutional changes were wafted through without any public engagement whatsoever the same applies to WTO rules and every trade agreement we've ever made, there just always in the "public good" | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?"Actually no they did | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there
Why? for such a momentous change, surely more than 37% of the voting population should have been needed to bring about change? "We've already had 2 votes on Brexit. First the referendum which Leave won with 52% and a majority of over a million votes more than remain. Then the public had a chance to vote on it again at the general election earlier this year. If the public really wanted to stop Brexit they could have voted Lib dem but the Lib dems only got around 8% of the overall vote, this was a clear rejection of remain. Parties with Brexit manifestos and a clear commitment to Leave the EU in their manifestos (Conservative, Labour and Ukip) got a combined 85% of the vote in the general election. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx" It's actually the EU that insists on having a border on the edge of its customs union. The UK has not proposed having a border in Northern Ireland. | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?"Actually no they didn't. There was some mutterings at the time that, if there was fundamental treaty change, there should be a referendum but never a promise back then to actually have. Also the (Labour) government at the time argued that Lisbon didn't represent fundamental treaty change but was simply a tiding up of previously agreed EU policies. I personally believe, like Margaret Thatcher and Clement Attlee, that referendum are the tool of demagogues and dictators and are incapable of ever representing the will of the people accurately. Consequently I'm always opposed to them in principle and never consider their results either democratic, valid or binding. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx It's actually the EU that insists on having a border on the edge of its customs union. The UK has not proposed having a border in Northern Ireland." Total BREXIT bullshit. There is know way you can not have a hard border in Ireland if we are not in a customs union with the Republic. If we take action to break our current customs union with the republic then, following WTO rules, both the Irish Republic and the UK have a duty to police the consequential customs border. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx It's actually the EU that insists on having a border on the edge of its customs union. The UK has not proposed having a border in Northern Ireland." Total BREXIT bullshit. There is no way you can not have a hard border in Ireland if we are not in a customs union with the Republic. If we take action to break our current customs union with the republic then, following WTO rules, both the Irish Republic and the UK have a duty to police the consequential customs border and, as it's the UK that is breaking the customs union, it is the UK that will be responsible for the creation of customs border, contra to are commitments made in the Good Friday Agreements. | |||
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"This is all going to end badly. I bet those voting to leave never knew of the costs of this. Take a look at those politicians leading the Brexit campaign, they are not the brightest sparks in the land!..I get the feeling that those who voted out are not either. Our kids/Grandchildren are really going to thank us for this folly in years to come. But who cares, so long as we are alright! we have already left them with no affordable low cost housing thanks to everyone buying council houses.. If Nigel Farage hates the EU so much why the fuck did he take the £72000 a year pension from them. Its not as if he was broke. The NHS will get no more money..We will not be better off...the sentence i am looking for is ....THE BLIND LEADING THE BLIND !!!!!!" I'm not so sure it's a case of the blind leading the blind. There's a lot of personal financial vested interest possibly involved, especially if you have off shore investments, in seeing a steadily devaluing UK economy. Makes you wonder whether some BREXITers might actually have any medium to large investments in cash, assets or property out side the UK which have already gone in GBP value by 15% to 20% and are set to go up by even more when we leave. When something really odd and clearly non beneficial for most happens it's always a good idea to see who's actually making money out it. They are not blind. A better analogy would be the well connected leading the clueless and gullible. | |||
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"On the news one said it is the beginning and end for the uk, he is right." There is a high probability that the UK will be forced into a position where it will have to brake legally binding international treaties while begging the world in general to enter into legally binding trade treaties. This cannot be a good position to be in. Especially when we consider that as we leave the EU not only do we loose unfettered access to the single market but we also loose our WTO status as at present our WTO status is derived from our membership of the EU. Therefore there is a certain amount of backing for the position you refer to. | |||
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"Why don’t we just have another vote, no way will the majority be Brexit. The FT published a report today saying our economic growth has declined due to the vote leading to rougly £350m a week loss to Britain. We get to vote in General Elections and are allowed to change our minds, given that the Brexit vote is far more momentous in its impact to the UK, we should have another chance to turn this round... discuss? its time to put a cork in that idea .there was a result the first time round .its time you dealt with it or if you love the EU that much go live there
Why? for such a momentous change, surely more than 37% of the voting population should have been needed to bring about change?
We've already had 2 votes on Brexit. First the referendum which Leave won with 52% and a majority of over a million votes more than remain. Then the public had a chance to vote on it again at the general election earlier this year. If the public really wanted to stop Brexit they could have voted Lib dem but the Lib dems only got around 8% of the overall vote, this was a clear rejection of remain. Parties with Brexit manifestos and a clear commitment to Leave the EU in their manifestos (Conservative, Labour and Ukip) got a combined 85% of the vote in the general election. "As you well know the ‘second vote on Brexit’ you mention is bollox. On that basis we have had many votes since joining in the 70s to stay in, which is equally bollox. Given the economy is already growing less quickly, resulting in £350m per week less inthe economy - which if you follow Brexit logic could have been used in the NHS, then Austerity will start to look like a golden age soon.  | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx It's actually the EU that insists on having a border on the edge of its customs union. The UK has not proposed having a border in Northern Ireland." Utter crap from the kipper again. And again and again | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?
Actually no they did"What was it then? | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?
Actually no they didn't. There was some mutterings at the time that, if there was fundamental treaty change, there should be a referendum but never a promise back then to actually have. Also the (Labour) government at the time argued that Lisbon didn't represent fundamental treaty change but was simply a tiding up of previously agreed EU policies. I personally believe, like Margaret Thatcher and Clement Attlee, that referendum are the tool of demagogues and dictators and are incapable of ever representing the will of the people accurately. Consequently I'm always opposed to them in principle and never consider their results either democratic, valid or binding."2005 Labour Manifesto. | |||
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"Dealing with the EU is like dealing with the Krays.They would approach a business and tell the owners it would be trashed unless they paid the Krays to "protect" it.Should have worked out the trade deal first and then the price. The EU attitude is another reason why we should never have joined in the first place.We should walk away and tell the EU to contact us when they wanted to have a sensible conversation about a free trade deal juat as we have now.Otherwise just leave. Very good you can tell Ireland where the border will go xxx It's actually the EU that insists on having a border on the edge of its customs union. The UK has not proposed having a border in Northern Ireland." Do you not listen at all that is utter bullshit and lies yet again from the kipper | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?
Actually no they didn't. There was some mutterings at the time that, if there was fundamental treaty change, there should be a referendum but never a promise back then to actually have. Also the (Labour) government at the time argued that Lisbon didn't represent fundamental treaty change but was simply a tiding up of previously agreed EU policies. I personally believe, like Margaret Thatcher and Clement Attlee, that referendum are the tool of demagogues and dictators and are incapable of ever representing the will of the people accurately. Consequently I'm always opposed to them in principle and never consider their results either democratic, valid or binding.
2005 Labour Manifesto."I'm guessing you are referring to this paragraph in the Labour Manifesto of 2005 The EU now has 25 members and will continue to expand. The new Constitutional Treaty ensures the new Europe can work effectively, and that Britain keeps control of key national interests like foreign policy, taxation, social security and defence. The Treaty sets out what the EU can do and what it cannot. It strengthens the voice of national parliaments and governments in EU affairs. It is a good treaty for Britain and for the new Europe. We will put it to the British people in a referendum and campaign whole-heartedly for a ‘Yes’ vote to keep Britain a leading nation in Europe. But, as it clearly states, that was for the EU Constitutional Treaty. That Treaty was signed on 29 October 2004 by representatives of the then 25 member states of the European Union. It was later ratified by 18 member states, which included referendums endorsing it in Spain and Luxembourg. However the rejection of the document by French and Dutch voters in May and June 2005 brought the ratification process to an end so the treaty never came into effect so no longer required a referendum to held here in the UK to ratify it. The Treaty of Lisbon (a completely different amending treaty didn't require ratification as it was successfully argued that no fundamental changes were being made) was never mentioned in the Labour Manifesto of 2005 for the simple reason that it didn't exist at that time. | |||
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"I know a few people who work for the eu and believe me a vote to stay in was a vote to change to the euro and roll over and agree to everything they come up with. Before you shoot the messenger it’s just what they said. Whether we will ever leave or what deal we get will be what we have to live with maybe the debate needs to be held in 5 years time
I won't shoot the messenger but I will shoot the message. The Conservative Policy on the Euro was a definite no, never ever, ever. The Labour policy (and I think the LibDems to) was we would only join if it was in Britain's national interests to join and then came up with a series of tests had to be fulfilled to show it was in our interests. But the tests were designed to be all but impossible to achieve and so they too had effectively a never in the Euro policy too.
I don't know who this friend of yours is but he sounds pretty out-of-touch with the realities of Britain and the Euro.
Didn't the Labour party have a policy for a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty? What happened to that?
Actually no they didn't. There was some mutterings at the time that, if there was fundamental treaty change, there should be a referendum but never a promise back then to actually have. Also the (Labour) government at the time argued that Lisbon didn't represent fundamental treaty change but was simply a tiding up of previously agreed EU policies. I personally believe, like Margaret Thatcher and Clement Attlee, that referendum are the tool of demagogues and dictators and are incapable of ever representing the will of the people accurately. Consequently I'm always opposed to them in principle and never consider their results either democratic, valid or binding.
2005 Labour Manifesto.
I'm guessing you are referring to this paragraph in the Labour Manifesto of 2005
The EU now has 25 members and will continue to expand. The new
Constitutional Treaty ensures the new Europe can work effectively,
and that Britain keeps control of key national interests like foreign policy,
taxation, social security and defence. The Treaty sets out what the EU can do and what it cannot. It strengthens the voice of national parliaments
and governments in EU affairs. It is a good treaty for Britain
and for the new Europe. We will put it to the British people in a referendum
and campaign whole-heartedly for a ‘Yes’ vote to keep Britain
a leading nation in Europe.
But, as it clearly states, that was for the EU Constitutional Treaty. That Treaty was signed on 29 October 2004 by representatives of the then 25 member states of the European Union. It was later ratified by 18 member states, which included referendums endorsing it in Spain and Luxembourg. However the rejection of the document by French and Dutch voters in May and June 2005 brought the ratification process to an end so the treaty never came into effect so no longer required a referendum to held here in the UK to ratify it.
The Treaty of Lisbon (a completely different amending treaty didn't require ratification as it was successfully argued that no fundamental changes were being made) was never mentioned in the Labour Manifesto of 2005 for the simple reason that it didn't exist at that time.
"And also there was no reasons for the UK to have a referendum on a treaty that had already been torpedoed and sunk by other countries. Whatever the outcome of the referendum, it couldn't have made a difference. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" What was your role in WWII? | |||
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"none in ww2 ..just Ireland,falklands and Iraq first time around ...that's all " Spitfires over the White Cliffs of Dover draped in the union jack singing along with Vera Lynn  | |||
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"none in ww2 ..just Ireland,falklands and Iraq first time around ...that's all " So you should be proud of that Service instead of trying to claim valour for someone else's Service. | |||
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"very proud to be british are u " You can be proud to be British without putting the livelihood and prosperity of your country in danger you know! | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" This is Trump level misuse of ellipses. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" Fact: Youre economy has been massively damaged and no one else is looking to leave. Fact: Brexit and its effects have seen a rise in pro EU sentiment across Europe even in the UK. Fact: All 27 pay in and 9 are net contributors with another 7 just below net contributions. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" you do know that we had many other troop's from nations both within Europe and outside who fought with us in those dark days? | |||
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"none in ww2 ..just Ireland,falklands and Iraq first time around ...that's all " how old are you? | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x Fact: Youre economy has been massively damaged and no one else is looking to leave. Fact: Brexit and its effects have seen a rise in pro EU sentiment across Europe even in the UK. Fact: All 27 pay in and 9 are net contributors with another 7 just below net contributions." Well said, sir. And could you send a big bag of Irish passports please? We need 'em! | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" You really don’t understand the EU do you.... These kind of one dimensional thought processes are going to destroy this country. All humans have been fearful of the future but Brexiters seem to have taken it to another level and to such a degree they are wanting to turn the clock back and hold it there. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x You really don’t understand the EU do you.... These kind of one dimensional thought processes are going to destroy this country. All humans have been fearful of the future but Brexiters seem to have taken it to another level and to such a degree they are wanting to turn the clock back and hold it there. " wouldn't brexitiers want to stay in the eu if they were fearful of the future it's normally the unknown which scares ppl | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x You really don’t understand the EU do you.... These kind of one dimensional thought processes are going to destroy this country. All humans have been fearful of the future but Brexiters seem to have taken it to another level and to such a degree they are wanting to turn the clock back and hold it there. wouldn't brexitiers want to stay in the eu if they were fearful of the future it's normally the unknown which scares ppl " Every generation thinks things were better in their youth. Its just the way we work. A large amount of the over 60s voted for Brexit because they want things to be like it was. | |||
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"The other side of that coin is young ppl think there era is the best and want it to remain he same and a lot of young ppl Voted remain for the same reason " Actually if you just think through human nature rather than take sides. Young people are generally more adventurous and actively seek out new horizons and are more open minded. It is a fact of human life that as we get older we become more intolerant and more fearful of change. It is only ever older people who refer to the country going to the dogs and how things were much better “back then.” It is just a fact that life is better now than it was 10 years ago and life was better 10 years ago than it was ten years before that. Advances in science and medicines are transforming our lives and so the older generation are generally wrong about things being worse now. The question then is how much did the EU have to do with the U.K. being a better place now and theoretically - what might the U.K. look like now had we never been in the EU. No one can answer that but young people being more optimistic and less fearful of change are the ones who would have ( should have) ensured thT we stayed in the EU. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x You really don’t understand the EU do you.... These kind of one dimensional thought processes are going to destroy this country. All humans have been fearful of the future but Brexiters seem to have taken it to another level and to such a degree they are wanting to turn the clock back and hold it there. wouldn't brexitiers want to stay in the eu if they were fearful of the future it's normally the unknown which scares ppl Every generation thinks things were better in their youth. Its just the way we work. A large amount of the over 60s voted for Brexit because they want things to be like it was." Well I turned 40 just a few weeks ago. All I've ever known is being in the EU since the day I was born and I want out of it now. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. " So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? " We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). | |||
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"what has the eu done for us " Given people like you a convenient scapegoat for all the failings of the world? | |||
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"what has the eu done for us " Saved us from bankruptcy in 1973... Given us a market from 1973 that we used to rebuild our economy... Improved our diet... gave us easy access to buying property across the union.... | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" Can I suggest you buy a dictionary and look up the word fact as you clearly havent got a clue what it means. Oh, and harking back to WW2 just makes you look a f@cking tool | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). " Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” Winston Churchill realised and accepted early on that the war and the subsequent peace was going to be all about close co-operation with other international allies. He knew that the U.K. could not do it on their own. | |||
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"Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. " To be absolutely honest even this is not true. The reason Germany lost WW2 was Hitler. He like Trump surrounded himself with chaos and was only interested in grandiose plans and vanity projects. Had he not continually played one part of his military machine against another and had invested in submarines rather than surface raiders where the Kriegsmarine were concerned he would have destroyed the UK's ability to fight in 1940. And if he had learned Napoleons winter 1812 lesson and given his army winter clothing, oil and fuel with antifreeze as demanded by his commanders he would have been pushing the red army into Pacific by the summer of 42. Further if he had no ordered the 6th Army to cross the Don and attack Stalingrad or had orderd them to cross the Volga fully enveloping Stalingrad he would have won. Of course the Germans were helped in no small way General Heinz Guderian (credited with creating blitzkrieg armoured warfare) was helped in no small point by the British General staff who invited him to observe them slapping down an upstart tank regiment Major in a fixed exercise on Salisbury Plain who said he had a new way of using tanks and vehicle mounted to make static and slow moving warfare totally obsolete. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” " This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. " Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' | |||
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" This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. " The Battle of Britain was a defensive action and not an offensive action. Its aim was to prevent an invasion of the UK, not to defeat Hitler or the Luftwaffe and neither of those things happened. However, thanks to the participation of Pilots from the Commonwealth as well as Poland and France the Luftwaffe were not able to achieve air superiority over England and therefore the invasion was postponed. Denying the Luftwaffe air superiority was not defeating it. This is basic stuff. Defeating Nazism and ridding it from Europe was something altogether different than the defensive actions of the Battle of Britain (as it was known) | |||
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" This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The Battle of Britain was a defensive action and not an offensive action. Its aim was to prevent an invasion of the UK, not to defeat Hitler or the Luftwaffe and neither of those things happened. However, thanks to the participation of Pilots from the Commonwealth as well as Poland and France the Luftwaffe were not able to achieve air superiority over England and therefore the invasion was postponed. Denying the Luftwaffe air superiority was not defeating it. This is basic stuff. Defeating Nazism and ridding it from Europe was something altogether different than the defensive actions of the Battle of Britain (as it was known)" Dunkirk was a 'defensive action' yet just a few posts ago you said it was the only time Britain stood "alone". Again I reiterate that statement you made was false and in the same post you accuse others of having a loose grasp on history, just laughable. Defensive action or not Britain stood "alone" during the Battle of Britain, so Dunkirk wasn't the only time Britain stood alone like you said. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. " You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. " What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. " No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. " I suggest you go and read a history book about it, or better still watch a documentary about it, moving pictures with narration maybe easier for you to understand. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. I suggest you go and read a history book about it, or better still watch a documentary about it, moving pictures with narration maybe easier for you to understand. " I don't need to.. I know that during the battle of Britain the Raf was made up of people of many nations as Willwill correctly states above.. Known it since I was about 15.. | |||
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"Both my grandfathers were at Dunkirk and then Normandy.They gutted the far right where they found them.Neither would have tolerated the far right we see here in the UK today.One entire branch of my family were executed in France by the Nazis. So many of the men in my family died in this war that only me and my son carry the family name.Anyone who sides or doesn't condemned the Alt right or neo Nazis are the enemy. Fuck em." (Stands and applauds) Well said Sir | |||
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"Both my grandfathers were at Dunkirk and then Normandy.They gutted the far right where they found them.Neither would have tolerated the far right we see here in the UK today.One entire branch of my family were executed in France by the Nazis. So many of the men in my family died in this war that only me and my son carry the family name.Anyone who sides or doesn't condemned the Alt right or neo Nazis are the enemy. Fuck em." Well said.. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. I suggest you go and read a history book about it, or better still watch a documentary about it, moving pictures with narration maybe easier for you to understand. " God your such a fool...you open your mouth and any bullshite comes out....your just wrong on just about everything....and you call yourself educated | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. I suggest you go and read a history book about it, or better still watch a documentary about it, moving pictures with narration maybe easier for you to understand. I don't need to.. I know that during the battle of Britain the Raf was made up of people of many nations as Willwill correctly states above.. Known it since I was about 15.." Dunkirk also involved people from many nations but Too Hot said it was the only time Britain acted alone, On that basis then his statement was false. Too Hot also seems to think the battle of Britain doesn't count because it was a 'defensive action' seeing as Dunkirk was also a 'defensive action' his statement was also false on that basis using his own reasoning. | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x ours? Read a book - you probably have Stalin and Roosavelt to thankk. So much for being a patriot, what about Churchill? We'd have been fucked, Churchill or not if Hitler hadn't committed himself to war on two fronts (Stalin) and the US hadn't joined the war (Roosavelt). Absolutely. People have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. The war was won because The Nazi’s committed to two fronts and the Americans joined the war in Europe. The disaster that was portrayed as a victory when the remnants of the British Army were evacuated from Dunkirk is the only thing that we Brits did “alone.” This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. You really are a disgrace, not only do you show no respect to those who fought the Nazis you are grossly ignorant about our history.. What I said is correct, it's Too Hot who appears to be ignorant about our history when he makes false statements about Dunkirk being the only time Britain stood 'alone'. No you are wrong and a man of your age should be able to do a simple search and find the facts you are ignorant of.. I suggest you go and read a history book about it, or better still watch a documentary about it, moving pictures with narration maybe easier for you to understand. I don't need to.. I know that during the battle of Britain the Raf was made up of people of many nations as Willwill correctly states above.. Known it since I was about 15.. Dunkirk also involved people from many nations but Too Hot said it was the only time Britain acted alone, On that basis then his statement was false. Too Hot also seems to think the battle of Britain doesn't count because it was a 'defensive action' seeing as Dunkirk was also a 'defensive action' his statement was also false on that basis using his own reasoning. " Listen up Quisling we as in you and I are talking about the battle of Britain, refresh yourself by looking at what you said in relation to that above.. Spinning and deflection won't work.. | |||
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"the far right brextremists failing in their attempt to revise history yet again .... no news there then" Failing big style lol...but they always do | |||
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"It's fascinating that a thread about Brexit becomes about The War (or wars) at the Behest of The Brexiteers. The Past is their country, not this Isle. "Thats the whole point about brexit....its the little Englander stuff...Spitfires and Vera Lynn all that bollocks....nothing to actually do with the EU parliament its a fucking excuse from them...there just so inward looking | |||
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"It's fascinating that a thread about Brexit becomes about The War (or wars) at the Behest of The Brexiteers. The Past is their country, not this Isle.
Thats the whole point about brexit....its the little Englander stuff...Spitfires and Vera Lynn all that bollocks....nothing to actually do with the EU parliament its a fucking excuse from them...there just so inward looking "You are completely wrong, ...yet again. Brexit is all about getting out there and engaging more with the wider world outside of the EU. It's people like you who are narrow minded and inward looking, you can't see beyond the borders of the EU. You are a little EU'er. | |||
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"It's fascinating that a thread about Brexit becomes about The War (or wars) at the Behest of The Brexiteers. The Past is their country, not this Isle.
Thats the whole point about brexit....its the little Englander stuff...Spitfires and Vera Lynn all that bollocks....nothing to actually do with the EU parliament its a fucking excuse from them...there just so inward looking
You are completely wrong, ...yet again. Brexit is all about getting out there and engaging more with the wider world outside of the EU. It's people like you who are narrow minded and inward looking, you can't see beyond the borders of the EU. You are a little EU'er. "Borders...your lot want to close them off....you fail every single time you open your mouth | |||
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"Dunkirk also involved people from many nations but Too Hot said it was the only time Britain acted alone, On that basis then his statement was false. Too Hot also seems to think the battle of Britain doesn't count because it was a 'defensive action' seeing as Dunkirk was also a 'defensive action' his statement was also false on that basis using his own reasoning. " Again you are wrong centy. British and French troops were picked off the beaches and harbour. But the rescue was a 100% British only operation. Therefore it was the one time we truly stood alone. It is like when there is a fire and the fire brigade rescue trapped occupiers, the occupiers were not part of the rescue effort they are the one rescued by the effort. It is not that hard to under stand. | |||
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"the brexit campaign that his best friends in the BNP launched, was called "the battle for britain" .... they used a picture of spitfire for the campaign ... but being far right extremist fuck-wits, it was a picture of the spitfire flown by a Polish Squadron pmsl fucking idiots!! "Haha my sides are splitting....fucking halfwits knuckle draggers lol | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x" | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x "I do hope once we leave you will be coming home and doing your bit for good old blighty...and not be sunning it up in ther EU  | |||
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"the brexit campaign that his best friends in the BNP launched, was called "the battle for britain" .... they used a picture of spitfire for the campaign ... but being far right extremist fuck-wits, it was a picture of the spitfire flown by a Polish Squadron pmsl fucking idiots!! " | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' " Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. " What a load of bollocks again....these people CAME to the UK to help....some ie the french were rescued at Dunkirk...but we left more there than we rescued...every single time you open your mouth you fail...history isnt your strongest point really is it | |||
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"fact ..once we go ..others will follow ...the eu will never be the same or work ....different values and different cultures will be the downfall....at present 5 of 27 pay in .....how long would u support scroungers for ....uk will be great on its own as we always have ....if not for our backbone....in ww2 we would all be german now .....back great Britain x
I do hope once we leave you will be coming home and doing your bit for good old blighty...and not be sunning it up in ther EU "Remember - British people living abroad aren't something as crass as immigrants, they're "ex-pats" | |||
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"Dunkirk also involved people from many nations but Too Hot said it was the only time Britain acted alone, On that basis then his statement was false. Too Hot also seems to think the battle of Britain doesn't count because it was a 'defensive action' seeing as Dunkirk was also a 'defensive action' his statement was also false on that basis using his own reasoning. Again you are wrong centy. British and French troops were picked off the beaches and harbour. But the rescue was a 100% British only operation. Therefore it was the one time we truly stood alone. It is like when there is a fire and the fire brigade rescue trapped occupiers, the occupiers were not part of the rescue effort they are the one rescued by the effort. It is not that hard to under stand. " No you are wrong there Will, volunteers from other nations set sail from British shores in boats to pick up troops from Dunkirk. Not every single boat that set sail from the UK was staffed with 100% British nationals. Therefore other nationalities helped in the rescue effort at Dunkirk. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. What a load of bollocks again....these people CAME to the UK to help....some ie the french were rescued at Dunkirk...but we left more there than we rescued...every single time you open your mouth you fail...history isnt your strongest point really is it "The only reason they were here is because they had no where else to go. France and Poland had already been conquered by Germany. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. What a load of bollocks again....these people CAME to the UK to help....some ie the french were rescued at Dunkirk...but we left more there than we rescued...every single time you open your mouth you fail...history isnt your strongest point really is it
The only reason they were here is because they had no where else to go. France and Poland had already been conquered by Germany. "Omfg you get worst and worst....lots were smuggled out to come work for the British government...like i said history isnt your strongest subject | |||
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"France and Poland had already been conquered by Germany. " that's fiction not fact | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. " Self contradiction to disprove your initial claim.. Nice one.. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. What a load of bollocks again....these people CAME to the UK to help....some ie the french were rescued at Dunkirk...but we left more there than we rescued...every single time you open your mouth you fail...history isnt your strongest point really is it
The only reason they were here is because they had no where else to go. France and Poland had already been conquered by Germany. "What utter and complete nonsense. What's the phrase " you can't educate stupid?" | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Self contradiction to disprove your initial claim.. Nice one.. "No self contradiction here, just your basic lack of understanding which seems to be apparent on the majority of your posts. If French and Polish fighter pilots had taken off from bases in Poland and France in their own French and Polish supplied planes you may have had a point, but they didn't. They took off from British bases on British soil in British supplied planes so Britain stood alone during the battle of Britain. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Self contradiction to disprove your initial claim.. Nice one..
No self contradiction here, just your basic lack of understanding which seems to be apparent on the majority of your posts. If French and Polish fighter pilots had taken off from bases in Poland and France in their own French and Polish supplied planes you may have had a point, but they didn't. They took off from British bases on British soil in British supplied planes so Britain stood alone during the battle of Britain. "Your stupiness knows no bounds...like an earlier poster said cant fix stupid | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Self contradiction to disprove your initial claim.. Nice one..
No self contradiction here, just your basic lack of understanding which seems to be apparent on the majority of your posts. If French and Polish fighter pilots had taken off from bases in Poland and France in their own French and Polish supplied planes you may have had a point, but they didn't. They took off from British bases on British soil in British supplied planes so Britain stood alone during the battle of Britain. "The planes did not fly themselves, we had no shortage of aircraft.. It was pilots we needed and not all the plots were born here which you acknowledged.. At the end of the war some of those that could do went 'home'.. Some stayed.. Your attempt to spin is getting more irrational, lacks fact and foundation though.. ?? | |||
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"You can garantee that the eu is going to keep on pushing for free movement of people and that will always be the stumbling block. If the government agreed to it there would be a bad reaction from the leave side" so what's the difference between EU migrants and rest of the world? A migrant is a migrant surely? What about the NHS recruiting INDIAN doctors - a nation which has similar problems with Doctors as we have and we are luring them away? Enoch was against them in the past - will we greet them with open arms? Or do we just dislike Europeans? | |||
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"Why on earth would anyone want disregard the sacrifice foreign nationals gave for this country.Some I guess want to win and spin an argument no matter how it makes them look.If wasn't for brave polish and Czech and Canadian pilots I might be typing in german today." Trying to rewrite history, perverse ignorance.. | |||
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"Whether we actually stood alone or with others, whether we would have won or lost if Russia or The US had not entered the war, or whether if Hitler had done something different at Dunkirk or in Russia the outcome may have been different is pretty irrelevant. What is relevant is what we stood and fought for, and what we stood and fought against. What ever those things are I'm pretty sure it wasn't for a Europe of division and disunity or for the UK to become an Vassal state of Europe, having to accept rules that it has no say in the making of. Unfortunately, so far, it looks like those are exactly the result our so called BREXIT is going to deliver. It's all very well BREXITers crying 'British Bulldogs' and 'Dunkirk Spirit' but it means nothing if what your actually doing is selling Britain out to the US, Russia and in reality the EU to. There is more to being a true patriot than a few jingoistic slogans and a wave of the Union Jack." iv got to say I haven't seen any saying the words British bulldog or the Dunkirk spirit on here | |||
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"Whether we actually stood alone or with others, whether we would have won or lost if Russia or The US had not entered the war, or whether if Hitler had done something different at Dunkirk or in Russia the outcome may have been different is pretty irrelevant. What is relevant is what we stood and fought for, and what we stood and fought against. What ever those things are I'm pretty sure it wasn't for a Europe of division and disunity or for the UK to become an Vassal state of Europe, having to accept rules that it has no say in the making of. Unfortunately, so far, it looks like those are exactly the result our so called BREXIT is going to deliver. It's all very well BREXITers crying 'British Bulldogs' and 'Dunkirk Spirit' but it means nothing if what your actually doing is selling Britain out to the US, Russia and in reality the EU to. There is more to being a true patriot than a few jingoistic slogans and a wave of the Union Jack. iv got to say I haven't seen any saying the words British bulldog or the Dunkirk spirit on here " It's metaphorical. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. " Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history" So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? " He probably thinks he's look good in a uniform | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? " It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? He probably thinks he's look good in a uniform "No I'm a blue collar working class guy, much prefer jeans and a T-shirt actually. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? He probably thinks he's look good in a uniform
No I'm a blue collar working class guy, much prefer jeans and a T-shirt actually. "So, when you were getting an education, those history classes, did you just think " nah, not for me?" | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. " Again, this is not a freedom of speech issue. Stop lying and saying it is. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. " This isnt freedom of speech though is it? It's pointing out that your grasp of history leaves something to be desired. Why should you have right to spout lies without people being able to show that you're factually incorrect? Freedom of speech isnt and never has been freedom to make sh^t up and parade it as facts in case you were struggling with that concept | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. This isnt freedom of speech though is it? It's pointing out that your grasp of history leaves something to be desired. Why should you have right to spout lies without people being able to show that you're factually incorrect? Freedom of speech isnt and never has been freedom to make sh^t up and parade it as facts in case you were struggling with that concept" Is it OK to parade them as Alternative Facts? | |||
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"No you are wrong there Will, volunteers from other nations set sail from British shores in boats to pick up troops from Dunkirk. Not every single boat that set sail from the UK was staffed with 100% British nationals. Therefore other nationalities helped in the rescue effort at Dunkirk. " And again, you are wrong. Every man who crossed the Channel in either one of the 'little boats' or the RN flotilla was a member of the RN or RNR (Royal Naval Reserve (also known as the wavy navy)) even if it were only a temporary enlistment for Operation Dynamo. All were required to swear the 'Oath of Allegiance' and therefore all became subjects of the King and British Citizens. Further all had their enlistment and discharge at the end of the operation properly documented so the records are there if you do not believe me. This was not the case for the foreign and Commonwealth squadrons formed in 1940, they like the Free French crewed RN ships although a part of the 'British Order Of Battle' were officially 'foreign combatant units' under RAF or RN orders who enforced their own discipline and used their own military laws as well as British Military Law. | |||
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"All gets a bit boring, just face the facts we are leaving the EU, get behind it, support it fully instead of whinging like school children" Read the OP. Exactly what is being suggested. | |||
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"No you are wrong there Will, volunteers from other nations set sail from British shores in boats to pick up troops from Dunkirk. Not every single boat that set sail from the UK was staffed with 100% British nationals. Therefore other nationalities helped in the rescue effort at Dunkirk. And again, you are wrong. Every man who crossed the Channel in either one of the 'little boats' or the RN flotilla was a member of the RN or RNR (Royal Naval Reserve (also known as the wavy navy)) even if it were only a temporary enlistment for Operation Dynamo. All were required to swear the 'Oath of Allegiance' and therefore all became subjects of the King and British Citizens. Further all had their enlistment and discharge at the end of the operation properly documented so the records are there if you do not believe me. This was not the case for the foreign and Commonwealth squadrons formed in 1940, they like the Free French crewed RN ships although a part of the 'British Order Of Battle' were officially 'foreign combatant units' under RAF or RN orders who enforced their own discipline and used their own military laws as well as British Military Law." But in the post Brexit world we can make history whatever we want it to be. Who cares about the truth as long as we can win an argument. | |||
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"All gets a bit boring, just face the facts we are leaving the EU, get behind it, support it fully instead of whinging like school children" No, what's being done is a fudge to pacify the majority of those who voted leave in a pique of lashing out to blame someone for whatever their own gripes were and they are a myriad of reasons and where ever we end up it still won't change their gripes and whining.. The hard-core xenophobic types will keep on ranting as on here that they have been sold out when the full details are clearer, some like centaur will spin it rather than have to look at it in an objective way.. Nothing from what we've seen thus far indicates that it won't be a fudge to fuck the whole thing off and for who ever in power when it's done to get on and try and sort the many issues we have without this unnecessary distraction.. | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. This isnt freedom of speech though is it? It's pointing out that your grasp of history leaves something to be desired. Why should you have right to spout lies without people being able to show that you're factually incorrect? Freedom of speech isnt and never has been freedom to make sh^t up and parade it as facts in case you were struggling with that concept" The censorship of the press, freedom of speech and freedom of expression was actually making reference to another thread. It has nothing to do with the history being talked about on this thread. | |||
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"For years we have been lied to about the EU and the way it operates I can't wait till we leave behind the money pit it has become " | |||
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"No you are wrong there Will, volunteers from other nations set sail from British shores in boats to pick up troops from Dunkirk. Not every single boat that set sail from the UK was staffed with 100% British nationals. Therefore other nationalities helped in the rescue effort at Dunkirk. And again, you are wrong. Every man who crossed the Channel in either one of the 'little boats' or the RN flotilla was a member of the RN or RNR (Royal Naval Reserve (also known as the wavy navy)) even if it were only a temporary enlistment for Operation Dynamo. All were required to swear the 'Oath of Allegiance' and therefore all became subjects of the King and British Citizens. Further all had their enlistment and discharge at the end of the operation properly documented so the records are there if you do not believe me. This was not the case for the foreign and Commonwealth squadrons formed in 1940, they like the Free French crewed RN ships although a part of the 'British Order Of Battle' were officially 'foreign combatant units' under RAF or RN orders who enforced their own discipline and used their own military laws as well as British Military Law." There may have been 'temporary' enlistment but some of those crew on rescue ships for all intents and purposes were volunteers, some went over the channel in canal barges, small lightweight commercial fishing boats and other commercial or leisure time boats, many of the boats were not what you could call military boats by any description. Many were volunteers just as you said many who fought in the battle of Britain were volunteers. | |||
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"Well when we leave the eu great Britain as I still call it will stand alone .trade with the world without out hands tied....we will again have our own fate in our own hands ....the eu will still buy our goods ..we will buy there's and we will still be able to go to Spain.. ..once others see how we do others will follow very quickly xx "Dead right I don’t understand why people can’t see it It staring us in the face talk about people deluded | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. This isnt freedom of speech though is it? It's pointing out that your grasp of history leaves something to be desired. Why should you have right to spout lies without people being able to show that you're factually incorrect? Freedom of speech isnt and never has been freedom to make sh^t up and parade it as facts in case you were struggling with that concept The censorship of the press, freedom of speech and freedom of expression was actually making reference to another thread. It has nothing to do with the history being talked about on this thread. "So try keeping on topic then.... | |||
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"This is false. Britain stood "alone" against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain when the RAF beat the Luftwaffe. This was before USA joined the war and we had no help from the Russians in it. It seems you yourself have such a loose grasp of history it is frightening. Yep the RAF stood alone in the Battle of Briton... Along with the Poles, Canadians, Australians, New Zealanders, South Africians, Indians, Free French, Norwegians and all the other Empire pilots along with the US and Irish volunteers. but as you and Churchill said 'We stood alone' Tell us all then where did these French and Polish fighter pilots take off from? Did they take off from bases in France or Poland to come to our aid? Oh no, because France and Poland had already been conquered by Nazi Germany these French and Polish fighter pilots took off from bases on British soil in fighter planes supplied by the British RAF! As for the commonwealth they were duty bound to help anyway. Argue the toss all you like Britain stood alone against Nazi Germany during the battle of Britain, that is just a fact of history. Don't forget the Czech pilots too in your rewrite of history So it seems like there were quite a few anti facists then. Apart from Centaur, who were pro facist? It's people like you who want to censor the press, silence free speech and stop freedom of expression who are the real fascists. By advocating the censorship of the press, the silencing of free speech and stopping freedom of expression you are becoming the very thing you say you oppose. This isnt freedom of speech though is it? It's pointing out that your grasp of history leaves something to be desired. Why should you have right to spout lies without people being able to show that you're factually incorrect? Freedom of speech isnt and never has been freedom to make sh^t up and parade it as facts in case you were struggling with that concept The censorship of the press, freedom of speech and freedom of expression was actually making reference to another thread. It has nothing to do with the history being talked about on this thread.
So try keeping on topic then...."Good fucking luck keeping any far right goose stepping neo Nazi brexiters on topic. | |||
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"Well when we leave the eu great Britain as I still call it will stand alone .trade with the world without out hands tied....we will again have our own fate in our own hands ....the eu will still buy our goods ..we will buy there's and we will still be able to go to Spain.. ..once others see how we do others will follow very quickly xx "Psst! Regularly Alignment | |||
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"There may have been 'temporary' enlistment but some of those crew on rescue ships for all intents and purposes were volunteers, some went over the channel in canal barges, small lightweight commercial fishing boats and other commercial or leisure time boats, many of the boats were not what you could call military boats by any description. Many were volunteers just as you said many who fought in the battle of Britain were volunteers. " Temporary or not, every man and boy (boy being anyone under the age of 17 and a half) that crossed the channel was a serving member of the British military and leisure boat, Thames Barge, fishing smack, or the Royal Iris for that matter that went across was a 'pressed ship' and therefore added to the RN 'Order of Battle'. You would do much better if you just accepted that my knowledge of military history, conflict escalation and general 'war studies' far exceeds anything you could ever hope to learn, and rather than trying to twist and spin your way out of yet another hole you have dug for yourself just admitted that you really do not know what you are talking about. You may even think about asking a question like 'Will, if what you say is true, why was that done?', that way you may actually learn something. Further, I think if you did that just once in a while many of us may even begin to respect you. As it is, we take it in turns to point out exactly how ill-educated you are. | |||
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"......once others see how we do others will follow very quickly xx "This is a common theme in your version of Brexitology - you seem to need others to follow the UK down the path of broken bottles, nails and dogshit towards a destination unspecified. Why? Why do you so need others to follow? Just so you know - they won't. Hungary and Poland may get kicked out but I doubt that any right-thinking country would leave. | |||
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"There may have been 'temporary' enlistment but some of those crew on rescue ships for all intents and purposes were volunteers, some went over the channel in canal barges, small lightweight commercial fishing boats and other commercial or leisure time boats, many of the boats were not what you could call military boats by any description. Many were volunteers just as you said many who fought in the battle of Britain were volunteers. Temporary or not, every man and boy (boy being anyone under the age of 17 and a half) that crossed the channel was a serving member of the British military and leisure boat, Thames Barge, fishing smack, or the Royal Iris for that matter that went across was a 'pressed ship' and therefore added to the RN 'Order of Battle'. You would do much better if you just accepted that my knowledge of military history, conflict escalation and general 'war studies' far exceeds anything you could ever hope to learn, and rather than trying to twist and spin your way out of yet another hole you have dug for yourself just admitted that you really do not know what you are talking about. You may even think about asking a question like 'Will, if what you say is true, why was that done?', that way you may actually learn something. Further, I think if you did that just once in a while many of us may even begin to respect you. As it is, we take it in turns to point out exactly how ill-educated you are. " Do you realise how childish you sound, 'my knowledge is better than your knowledge' Lmao.
I suppose your dad is bigger than my dad too, Lololol. | |||
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"There may have been 'temporary' enlistment but some of those crew on rescue ships for all intents and purposes were volunteers, some went over the channel in canal barges, small lightweight commercial fishing boats and other commercial or leisure time boats, many of the boats were not what you could call military boats by any description. Many were volunteers just as you said many who fought in the battle of Britain were volunteers. Temporary or not, every man and boy (boy being anyone under the age of 17 and a half) that crossed the channel was a serving member of the British military and leisure boat, Thames Barge, fishing smack, or the Royal Iris for that matter that went across was a 'pressed ship' and therefore added to the RN 'Order of Battle'. You would do much better if you just accepted that my knowledge of military history, conflict escalation and general 'war studies' far exceeds anything you could ever hope to learn, and rather than trying to twist and spin your way out of yet another hole you have dug for yourself just admitted that you really do not know what you are talking about. You may even think about asking a question like 'Will, if what you say is true, why was that done?', that way you may actually learn something. Further, I think if you did that just once in a while many of us may even begin to respect you. As it is, we take it in turns to point out exactly how ill-educated you are. Do you realise how childish you sound, 'my knowledge is better than your knowledge' Lmao.
I suppose your dad is bigger than my dad too, Lololol. "Didnt you say to me once that you had more veries than me...hypocrite | |||
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"......once others see how we do others will follow very quickly xx
This is a common theme in your version of Brexitology - you seem to need others to follow the UK down the path of broken bottles, nails and dogshit towards a destination unspecified. Why? Why do you so need others to follow?
Just so you know - they won't. Hungary and Poland may get kicked out but I doubt that any right-thinking country would leave. "Reported in today's papers Donald Tusk fears Poland will plunge the EU into crisis by holding a referendum on its membership. Brexit will cut the EU's budget by £9 billion a year, forcing member states to pay more. Warsaw is the biggest recipient of EU cash, but strong growth is set to push up Poland's contributions. Mr Tusk blasted Poland's ruling PiS party over its eurosceptic policies, saying "I can easily imagine a situation when Poland is among the net payers (maybe because EU plans to add some of the poor balkan states to the EU by 2025 have been leaked) then the government would feel it is time to ask Poles if they want to continue being in the EU. | |||
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"......once others see how we do others will follow very quickly xx
This is a common theme in your version of Brexitology - you seem to need others to follow the UK down the path of broken bottles, nails and dogshit towards a destination unspecified. Why? Why do you so need others to follow?
Just so you know - they won't. Hungary and Poland may get kicked out but I doubt that any right-thinking country would leave.
Reported in today's papers Donald Tusk fears Poland will plunge the EU into crisis by holding a referendum on its membership. Brexit will cut the EU's budget by £9 billion a year, forcing member states to pay more. Warsaw is the biggest recipient of EU cash, but strong growth is set to push up Poland's contributions. Mr Tusk blasted Poland's ruling PiS party over its eurosceptic policies, saying "I can easily imagine a situation when Poland is among the net payers (maybe because EU plans to add some of the poor balkan states to the EU by 2025 have been leaked) then the government would feel it is time to ask Poles if they want to continue being in the EU. "
So you believe the papers then most of it is editors filling the pages with rubbish | |||
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"There may have been 'temporary' enlistment but some of those crew on rescue ships for all intents and purposes were volunteers, some went over the channel in canal barges, small lightweight commercial fishing boats and other commercial or leisure time boats, many of the boats were not what you could call military boats by any description. Many were volunteers just as you said many who fought in the battle of Britain were volunteers. Temporary or not, every man and boy (boy being anyone under the age of 17 and a half) that crossed the channel was a serving member of the British military and leisure boat, Thames Barge, fishing smack, or the Royal Iris for that matter that went across was a 'pressed ship' and therefore added to the RN 'Order of Battle'. You would do much better if you just accepted that my knowledge of military history, conflict escalation and general 'war studies' far exceeds anything you could ever hope to learn, and rather than trying to twist and spin your way out of yet another hole you have dug for yourself just admitted that you really do not know what you are talking about. You may even think about asking a question like 'Will, if what you say is true, why was that done?', that way you may actually learn something. Further, I think if you did that just once in a while many of us may even begin to respect you. As it is, we take it in turns to point out exactly how ill-educated you are. Do you realise how childish you sound, 'my knowledge is better than your knowledge' Lmao.
I suppose your dad is bigger than my dad too, Lololol. "Unlike your Dad I suspect his Dad also knows you are wrong on this, who knows maybe your Dad also knows you are wrong too.. | |||
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"For years we have been lied to about the EU and the way it operates I can't wait till we leave behind the money pit it has become "You seem to have confused personal willful ignorance with "being lied to". | |||
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"For years we have been lied to about the EU and the way it operates I can't wait till we leave behind the money pit it has become
You seem to have confused personal willful ignorance with "being lied to"." | |||
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"You have to remember it's the CONservatives that are running this. Conservative =lies. Bug red bus anyone? " . Wey the big red bus again wondered when someone would shout out that new it wouldn't be long it's only a yr and a half old lol don't forget the falling of a cliff sorry ment big bloody phone lol | |||
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"You have to remember it's the CONservatives that are running this. Conservative =lies. Bug red bus anyone? . Wey the big red bus again wondered when someone would shout out that new it wouldn't be long it's only a yr and a half old lol don't forget the falling of a cliff sorry ment big bloody phone lol" Ironically the reason brexiters used a "Big Red Bus " was so the mental image would stick in people's heads. | |||
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"You have to remember it's the CONservatives that are running this. Conservative =lies. Bug red bus anyone? . Wey the big red bus again wondered when someone would shout out that new it wouldn't be long it's only a yr and a half old lol don't forget the falling of a cliff sorry ment big bloody phone lol Ironically the reason brexiters used a "Big Red Bus " was so the mental image would stick in people's heads." The reason Vote Leave chose red and white as their campaign colours was to appeal more to Labour voters. Founding member of Vote Leave former Labour MP Gisela Stuart knew that the Ukip vote would be in the bag so no point in picking Purple or Yellow, the tories were more naturally eurosceptic than Labour so the main vote they needed to attract was the Labour vote. The red and white colours of Vote Leave was a ploy to get more Labour voters onside. Let's face it in many parts of the country Labour voters will vote for anything in a red rosette. | |||
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"You have to remember it's the CONservatives that are running this. Conservative =lies. Bug red bus anyone? . Wey the big red bus again wondered when someone would shout out that new it wouldn't be long it's only a yr and a half old lol don't forget the falling of a cliff sorry ment big bloody phone lol Ironically the reason brexiters used a "Big Red Bus " was so the mental image would stick in people's heads." well why wouldn't they they played to there strengths like all sides do don't they | |||
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"Omg the scare mongering never ends " i wouldent say it’s scarmongering it’s bloody true That’s what I don’t get with you brexiteers it’s allways in your minds to say scaremongeing Yes ile bring it up again as you can’t abide it What was the big red bus then | |||
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