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Would you change your vote ?

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon

As always appears in threads, there were positions taken by both sides that have not transpired and things which were held as facts have been shown to be not quite as they seem.

Now, if people voted based on these, then maybe that would be enough to change their vote. Or maybe it wouldn’t.

So would you change your vote ? And if not what would you need to happen ?

For me, I voted remain because I didn’t have enough of an idea of what leave looked like and saw too many (possible) bad scenarios. I’m still in that place (worryingly given we’re half way through the process) and would to know with more certainty what I’m voting for before considering switching.

Ps. Behave kids. This isnt saying anybody’s views are wrong. Or their red lines are in the wrong place.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

I voted leave, not because I am a brexiteer. But because I am 100% pro the EU and am a federalist who believes the UK needs to face the reality of being a small island nation that cant even build its own ships before it can fully embrace the EU.

Therefore my vote would remain the same.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

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By *verready32Man
over a year ago

omagh

As Im from NI and the border debate is going strong Im glad I voted remain, and im still sticking with it as being the right decision. But I do believe in the will of the people, so im happy to go with the outcome.

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By *oyce69Man
over a year ago

Driffield

I voted leave and wouldn't change my mind.

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon


" I voted leave and wouldn't change my mind."
never ? Can I ask why such an absolute position ?

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By *losguygl3Man
over a year ago

Gloucester

Voted remain and we still vote remain as I believe we should be leading front and centre within the EU. Driving reform and EU expansion along with Germany and France. Not dithering around half in half out as we were.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I voted remain but wanted to leave, however mine was kind of tactical, as I'm in Scotland, and in favour of independence, so if it all goes wrong when we do leave, am hoping for another referendum.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking.

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By *losguygl3Man
over a year ago

Gloucester


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again. "

I'm fine with a Federal Europe. And the EU Army thing has been on the cards for years. But I know many aren't ready yet. The old dogma of self interested nation states is still strong sadly.

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. "
like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We voted to remain - it could be said for selfish reasons - we live and work in the Euro zone. It was relatively easy to come here and set up our business - Well apart from loads of paperwork. The EU is not perfect and needs reform as does EVERY organization that was set up many years ago - e.g. U.N. & NH S for example. We understand some of the leave reasons, and some we agree with! But brexit has already hit us on the fx rate and will make things more complex and costly not to mention a 49% capital gains tax on our properties as a 3rd nation. Finally being risk adverse ( having learnt the lesson of being "gun ho" ) earlier in life brexit was just too much of a gamble! Once you have lost everything you learn the lesson. So no we wouldn't change our vote.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again. "

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make. "

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh "

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. "

Deluded

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. "
Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make. "

The Brexit ideology is exactly the same as any other ideology - it feeds off confirmation bias to become as embedded in the mind as a genuine fact of life. As humans, we prefer to believe what we want to believe and therefore feed ourselves mainly with things that we approve of rather than things that challenge our view of the world.

Of the people who I have met (caution... generalisation coming up...) committed Remain voters tend to be pragmatic and balanced and they tend to take their news from multiple different sources. They tend to be able to recognise the good and the bad in most things and are able to acknowledge positives and negatives on both sides of an argument but get frustrated when others do not appear to judge as fairly as they do.

Vocal Brexit voters who I know or with whom I have had social interactions with tend to be much more single minded in their opinions and they derive their news from sources that back up their existing beliefs. Generally, they are not able to (or are unwilling to) acknowledge anything positive that does not fit in their view of the world. Brexiters generally look for simple solutions and by necessity this involves the sidelining of issues that have the potential to derail the simple solution.

Let’s not forget though - the above are the extremes on each side and therefore the minority. The majority of people were/are floaters and these are the people who picked up on certain sound bytes or pledges and made a decision that was not necessarily deeply thought out. I would hazard a guess that not many floaters would have voted Brexit if they had been told that Brexit would make them poorer and would make their country less influential in the world.

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By *rench letterCouple
over a year ago

Chorley,

There us no way I would change our vote from remain. We want to keep our EU passport and have the free movement with no barriers. Don't want to step back in time. And we feel sorry for the younger generation who were the ones that voted remain, they have a lot more years ahead of us.

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By *rench letterCouple
over a year ago

Chorley,


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

The Brexit ideology is exactly the same as any other ideology - it feeds off confirmation bias to become as embedded in the mind as a genuine fact of life. As humans, we prefer to believe what we want to believe and therefore feed ourselves mainly with things that we approve of rather than things that challenge our view of the world.

Of the people who I have met (caution... generalisation coming up...) committed Remain voters tend to be pragmatic and balanced and they tend to take their news from multiple different sources. They tend to be able to recognise the good and the bad in most things and are able to acknowledge positives and negatives on both sides of an argument but get frustrated when others do not appear to judge as fairly as they do.

Vocal Brexit voters who I know or with whom I have had social interactions with tend to be much more single minded in their opinions and they derive their news from sources that back up their existing beliefs. Generally, they are not able to (or are unwilling to) acknowledge anything positive that does not fit in their view of the world. Brexiters generally look for simple solutions and by necessity this involves the sidelining of issues that have the potential to derail the simple solution.

Let’s not forget though - the above are the extremes on each side and therefore the minority. The majority of people were/are floaters and these are the people who picked up on certain sound bytes or pledges and made a decision that was not necessarily deeply thought out. I would hazard a guess that not many floaters would have voted Brexit if they had been told that Brexit would make them poorer and would make their country less influential in the world."
Very well said.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There us no way I would change our vote from remain. We want to keep our EU passport and have the free movement with no barriers. Don't want to step back in time. And we feel sorry for the younger generation who were the ones that voted remain, they have a lot more years ahead of us."

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things. "

How many examples do you want? We joined a simple trading arrangement called the common market in the 1970's with only a handful of countries. Now look in comparison to what the EU has become today and you can't see that there has been any centralisation of power in Brussels? Pull the other one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things.

How many examples do you want? We joined a simple trading arrangement called the common market in the 1970's with only a handful of countries. Now look in comparison to what the EU has become today and you can't see that there has been any centralisation of power in Brussels? Pull the other one.

"

So adding more countries makes it bad ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things.

How many examples do you want? We joined a simple trading arrangement called the common market in the 1970's with only a handful of countries. Now look in comparison to what the EU has become today and you can't see that there has been any centralisation of power in Brussels? Pull the other one.

"
..

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

The Brexit ideology is exactly the same as any other ideology - it feeds off confirmation bias to become as embedded in the mind as a genuine fact of life. As humans, we prefer to believe what we want to believe and therefore feed ourselves mainly with things that we approve of rather than things that challenge our view of the world.

Of the people who I have met (caution... generalisation coming up...) committed Remain voters tend to be pragmatic and balanced and they tend to take their news from multiple different sources. They tend to be able to recognise the good and the bad in most things and are able to acknowledge positives and negatives on both sides of an argument but get frustrated when others do not appear to judge as fairly as they do.

Vocal Brexit voters who I know or with whom I have had social interactions with tend to be much more single minded in their opinions and they derive their news from sources that back up their existing beliefs. Generally, they are not able to (or are unwilling to) acknowledge anything positive that does not fit in their view of the world. Brexiters generally look for simple solutions and by necessity this involves the sidelining of issues that have the potential to derail the simple solution.

Let’s not forget though - the above are the extremes on each side and therefore the minority. The majority of people were/are floaters and these are the people who picked up on certain sound bytes or pledges and made a decision that was not necessarily deeply thought out. I would hazard a guess that not many floaters would have voted Brexit if they had been told that Brexit would make them poorer and would make their country less influential in the world."

This is kinda where I am. But I’m hoping there are people who are less extreme which will help me see both sides. Unfortunately I tend to get hit by generalisations and ad hominem lite comments. (Note this is not at anyone in this thread per se. I’ve tried before.) and to be fair some have been really good at providing sources etc which have challenged my beliefs. (C 30% of new borns ARE to non-UK mums. Even if the leap to they are all immigrants and / or will over fill our schools isn’t a valid conclusion.)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"As always appears in threads, there were positions taken by both sides that have not transpired and things which were held as facts have been shown to be not quite as they seem.

Now, if people voted based on these, then maybe that would be enough to change their vote. Or maybe it wouldn’t.

So would you change your vote ? And if not what would you need to happen ?

For me, I voted remain because I didn’t have enough of an idea of what leave looked like and saw too many (possible) bad scenarios. I’m still in that place (worryingly given we’re half way through the process) and would to know with more certainty what I’m voting for before considering switching.

Ps. Behave kids. This isnt saying anybody’s views are wrong. Or their red lines are in the wrong place. "

Remain then, remain now.

(Above is an example of not rabbit holing a post)

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon

And what would need to change for you to change your mind ?

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By *utandbigMan
over a year ago

Bournemouth


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things.

How many examples do you want? We joined a simple trading arrangement called the common market in the 1970's with only a handful of countries. Now look in comparison to what the EU has become today and you can't see that there has been any centralisation of power in Brussels? Pull the other one.

"
keep taking the tablets

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By *utandbigMan
over a year ago

Bournemouth

Remain all day long I would never change my mind

If you think it’s bad now wait till we’re gone

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. "
so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush "

bush was so last decade .... get with the times dude ... all the brextremists are arse licking trump now instead

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain "

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

bush was so last decade .... get with the times dude ... all the brextremists are arse licking trump now instead"

Trump? He's a piece of shit

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave"

It's interesting that you think the Europeans are behaving vile towards us. Why would you think that? Surely some of our politicians and tabloids threw all sorts of insults at the EU - Boris whistle - Hammond "enemies " just in case you had forgotten? If you want a deal it doesn't help if you insult the other party. Divorce is usually nasty! I left the NE over 35yrs ago - no jobs no prospects and it's still the same today sadly. The north south divide hasn't changed which leads me to say the system is broken and that's not the EU fault.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave"

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave"

I’ve just come back from a trip to Paris and they were all thoroughly lovely over there.

But if you specifically mean the non-UK politicians in the EU, how have they been horrible and vile to us?

-Matt

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"As always appears in threads, there were positions taken by both sides that have not transpired and things which were held as facts have been shown to be not quite as they seem.

Now, if people voted based on these, then maybe that would be enough to change their vote. Or maybe it wouldn’t.

So would you change your vote ? And if not what would you need to happen ?

For me, I voted remain because I didn’t have enough of an idea of what leave looked like and saw too many (possible) bad scenarios. I’m still in that place (worryingly given we’re half way through the process) and would to know with more certainty what I’m voting for before considering switching.

Ps. Behave kids. This isnt saying anybody’s views are wrong. Or their red lines are in the wrong place. "

I voted to remain. And I’d vote to remain again. My reasons? On a personal level, I work in a high tech field that thrives on openness and collaboration. The fact I can work, live etc anywhere in the EU is great. The fact I can easily hire people from across the EU is great. The fact we have common standards and framework agreements is great.

On a wider scale I’ve never had a problem with the EU. Do they need to sort out some issues? Yes of course. But most of the problems we ascribe to the EU are actually our own problems and fixable by ourselves. If our politicians wanted to. If we wanted to train our own nationals to be skilled in certain areas, we could have. And we didn’t. If we wanted to evict EU nationals that were a drain on the state. We could have. We didn’t. Hell, if we wanted a blue passport. We could have. But we didn’t.

What would make me change my mind and vote leave? An actual argument that it would be better to do so. One that actually stood up to 5 seconds of scrutiny. Yet we’ve had none.

-Matt

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave"

they are simply doing what was predicted before the vote if it went the way it did..

is it because they are 'the EU' that they are not allowed or it is 'vile' in them standing up for their own interests..?

because we also are doing the same albeit in a totally haphazard chaotic not thought through sort of way..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much. "

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave"

How terribly mean of them to not simply acquiesce to the UK's every demand, the vile creatures.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

"

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush "

Blair was Bush's poodle. Obama wanted Cameron to support him with military action and the House of Commons voted against it so Cameron told Obama no.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much. "

The ex partner we are leaving in this divorce is a bully and has a proven track record of bulling others in the past (Greece anyone). When in a bullying relationship the only option is to leave and the EU have shown their true colours since we said we wanted a divorce.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would still have voted to leave tho , I thought leave meant just that !

Bye Bye See You !

As I believe many leave voters did !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm not sure how people who fancy the UK as a powerhouse who is the equal of anyone on the world stage reconcile that with their portrayal of the UK of the pitiable the victim of the EU and its bullying.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

The ex partner we are leaving in this divorce is a bully and has a proven track record of bulling others in the past (Greece anyone). When in a bullying relationship the only option is to leave and the EU have shown their true colours since we said we wanted a divorce. "

Deluded

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

Blair was Bush's poodle. Obama wanted Cameron to support him with military action and the House of Commons voted against it so Cameron told Obama no. "

and thank fuck that Parliamentary Sovereignty stopped the muppet from doing more damage..

without being held in check dullard Dave would have to try and be statesman like wagged his tail too..

Libya was a piss poor attempt to be a 'leader' by Cameron and look how that turned out..

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"I would still have voted to leave tho , I thought leave meant just that !

Bye Bye See You !

As I believe many leave voters did ! "

which was exactly what the liars in the leave campaign wanted..

no scrutiny and a totally unrealistic, naive outlook as to what it will mean for us to leave..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I would still have voted to leave tho , I thought leave meant just that !

Bye Bye See You !

As I believe many leave voters did !

which was exactly what the liars in the leave campaign wanted..

no scrutiny and a totally unrealistic, naive outlook as to what it will mean for us to leave.."

You missed off hoodwinking the gullible

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By *utandbigMan
over a year ago

Bournemouth


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

The ex partner we are leaving in this divorce is a bully and has a proven track record of bulling others in the past (Greece anyone). When in a bullying relationship the only option is to leave and the EU have shown their true colours since we said we wanted a divorce. "
as usual your wrong

The eu have done nothing wrong unfortunately is are useless government who have fucked up ad they failed to address the situations ins proper manner

But you don’t see that do you

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

The ex partner we are leaving in this divorce is a bully and has a proven track record of bulling others in the past (Greece anyone). When in a bullying relationship the only option is to leave and the EU have shown their true colours since we said we wanted a divorce. as usual your wrong

The eu have done nothing wrong unfortunately is are useless government who have fucked up ad they failed to address the situations ins proper manner

But you don’t see that do you "

some on here believe the present bunch of idiots are doing spiffingly well in the national interest..

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

The ex partner we are leaving in this divorce is a bully and has a proven track record of bulling others in the past (Greece anyone). When in a bullying relationship the only option is to leave and the EU have shown their true colours since we said we wanted a divorce. "

Greece is an example of profiteering german banks on the backs of a broken Greece

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted to remain...i wouldnt change it...in fact seeing what we are seeing now with May and her crew makes me more determined to remain

Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

How terribly mean of them to not simply acquiesce to the UK's every demand, the vile creatures."

Thats ok for you to say, your thousands of miles away in Canada!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt"

If were going with an interest in using the pool we'd negotiate just using that which is what we're doing.

Junker getting hiz knickers in a twist is his problem.

At a convention when he said english is no longer important then spoke french, fine, he cant speak english anyway, he's a ranting little twit

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

Blair was Bush's poodle. Obama wanted Cameron to support him with military action and the House of Commons voted against it so Cameron told Obama no. "

Cameron said that publicly but... British pilots were flying american planes

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

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By *ilent.Knight OP   Man
over a year ago

Swindon


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt

If were going with an interest in using the pool we'd negotiate just using that which is what we're doing.

Junker getting hiz knickers in a twist is his problem.

At a convention when he said english is no longer important then spoke french, fine, he cant speak english anyway, he's a ranting little twit "
we’re not deciding if you can use the pool, or how much it will cost, until you settle up your bill. There’s a good lad.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt

If were going with an interest in using the pool we'd negotiate just using that which is what we're doing.

Junker getting hiz knickers in a twist is his problem.

At a convention when he said english is no longer important then spoke french, fine, he cant speak english anyway, he's a ranting little twit we’re not deciding if you can use the pool, or how much it will cost, until you settle up your bill. There’s a good lad. "

Junker hasn't given an actual itemised bill though.

He's randomly making up figures.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed "

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that "

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with"

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?"

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

"

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

I voted leave and would do the same again.Reading this thread I am encouraged by the amount of people who have not changed there mind,well done to all of you.

We will show the bad losers how wrong they are,they are so misrable and negative it hurts me very much.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I voted leave and would do the same again.Reading this thread I am encouraged by the amount of people who have not changed there mind,well done to all of you.

We will show the bad losers how wrong they are,they are so misrable and negative it hurts me very much."

I think you will find that 95% of us will be losers...

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"I voted leave and would do the same again.Reading this thread I am encouraged by the amount of people who have not changed there mind,well done to all of you.

We will show the bad losers how wrong they are,they are so misrable and negative it hurts me very much."

Who is 'we'?

btw i am not miserable nor negative, strange world you live in when an opposing view is seen as such..

cheer up, don't be sad..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it "

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I say china but not all deals. Weve gone into a dodgy deal with tbe power stations due to complex designs. The one in Scandinavia being over budget, overdue and not finished yet

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral


"I voted leave and would do the same again.Reading this thread I am encouraged by the amount of people who have not changed there mind,well done to all of you.

We will show the bad losers how wrong they are,they are so misrable and negative it hurts me very much.

I think you will find that 95% of us will be losers..."
Have you heard of PMA try it do you good

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

"

Nothing to do with the tariffs they slapped on to protect there own businesses then

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"I think you will find that 95% of us will be losers..."

95% you are an optimist.

I would suggest the only ones who will come out of brexit on the winning side are the less than 1% that have been able to transfer the bulk of their wealth into foreign currencies in offshore tax-havens ready to buy up the UK at fire-sale prices when we drop off the cliff they have used their money to engineer. It is called disaster economic, remember that term, we will all be living it soon.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

Nothing to do with the tariffs they slapped on to protect there own businesses then "

Croney capitalism in action..

Boeing whinged to trump that the Canadian govt. Aided bombardier, something denied by the Canadians that jeapordised orders by american airline companies. The airline companies being pissed off as they said the bombardier planes are better than Boeing planes.

Another zeperate isdue im not keen on is neo liberalism in the uk.

Which can affect production

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

Nothing to do with the tariffs they slapped on to protect there own businesses then

Croney capitalism in action..

Boeing whinged to trump that the Canadian govt. Aided bombardier, something denied by the Canadians that jeapordised orders by american airline companies. The airline companies being pissed off as they said the bombardier planes are better than Boeing planes.

Another zeperate isdue im not keen on is neo liberalism in the uk.

Which can affect production

"

but this is what it was like before the EU

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

Blair was Bush's poodle. Obama wanted Cameron to support him with military action and the House of Commons voted against it so Cameron told Obama no.

and thank fuck that Parliamentary Sovereignty stopped the muppet from doing more damage..

without being held in check dullard Dave would have to try and be statesman like wagged his tail too..

Libya was a piss poor attempt to be a 'leader' by Cameron and look how that turned out.. "

If you are going to have a rant at least get your facts right, I'm no fan of Cameron but the decision to go into Libya was a joint decision with the Lib dems and deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg was all for it too, it was a coalition government with the Lib dems, not a Tory government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the fact is libiya was ca-morons fuck up ... some may want to pretend otherwise but the fact is he called the shots on that one, it was his shit fest

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

Nothing to do with the tariffs they slapped on to protect there own businesses then

Croney capitalism in action..

Boeing whinged to trump that the Canadian govt. Aided bombardier, something denied by the Canadians that jeapordised orders by american airline companies. The airline companies being pissed off as they said the bombardier planes are better than Boeing planes.

Another zeperate isdue im not keen on is neo liberalism in the uk.

Which can affect production

but this is what it was like before the EU "

Then they should learn from past mistakes.

Yheres no wrong or right anzwer. Perhaps you were right to vote remain and me wrong. Problem is its go8ng ahead and us swingers cant do anything about it now

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

were we fine before we went in...can you substantiate that

When we went in, we signed up to a customs tariff free zone, nothing more.

Over the years it's morphed into something else we didnt agree to.

We lost the ability to negotiate our own trade deals.

Now we have no control of what or who we can trade with

Ok so how was we better before than now ?

We could sell our own products.

Shipping, cars, aeroplanes and also did a reasonable job of it too. Aircraft did bloody well.

Not saying we can recapture the past.

But we do that now and have been doing since we joined...i refer you to America and Boeing the deal that scuppered 4000 jobs in Nth Ireland...not sure America is part of the EU that deal was done outside of it

The reason for that is cronyism.

Powerful compsnies lobbying politically. A particular problem in America. We shouldn't really deal so much with them ad we've never got a goodd deal from them, plus they're going backwards with an arsehole like trump.

We need to also diversify, and seek new partners, Japan, taiwan china with ai, and renewable energy markets,

Nothing to do with the tariffs they slapped on to protect there own businesses then

Croney capitalism in action..

Boeing whinged to trump that the Canadian govt. Aided bombardier, something denied by the Canadians that jeapordised orders by american airline companies. The airline companies being pissed off as they said the bombardier planes are better than Boeing planes.

Another zeperate isdue im not keen on is neo liberalism in the uk.

Which can affect production

but this is what it was like before the EU

Then they should learn from past mistakes.

Yheres no wrong or right anzwer. Perhaps you were right to vote remain and me wrong. Problem is its go8ng ahead and us swingers cant do anything about it now"

Maybe but all the pointers are saying im not...but tbh i hope i am

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Actually we should dump the usa and habe a trade deal with china and Russia. Possibly iran too

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Actually we should dump the usa and habe a trade deal with china and Russia. Possibly iran too

"

The EU is currently only 15% of the entire world's economy, that is forecast to fall to just 12% by the year 2030. The EU will go backwards while the future high growth areas will be in countries outside of the EU and that is where our priorities and future aspirations should be aimed at after Brexit. Successful billionaire businessesman James Dyson said as much in his interview on the BBC Andrew Marr show a few weeks ago.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Actually we should dump the usa and habe a trade deal with china and Russia. Possibly iran too

The EU is currently only 15% of the entire world's economy, that is forecast to fall to just 12% by the year 2030. The EU will go backwards while the future high growth areas will be in countries outside of the EU and that is where our priorities and future aspirations should be aimed at after Brexit. Successful billionaire businessesman James Dyson said as much in his interview on the BBC Andrew Marr show a few weeks ago. "

The one that was funded from the EU then fucked off to Thailand or somewhere else with his production a fine examlpe ....not

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Only 15%", as if that were insignificant.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Successful billionaire businessesman James Dyson said as much in his interview on the BBC Andrew Marr show a few weeks ago. "

he read mystic meg's dog's mind so it must be absolutely true

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Actually we should dump the usa and habe a trade deal with china and Russia. Possibly iran too

The EU is currently only 15% of the entire world's economy, that is forecast to fall to just 12% by the year 2030. The EU will go backwards while the future high growth areas will be in countries outside of the EU and that is where our priorities and future aspirations should be aimed at after Brexit. Successful billionaire businessesman James Dyson said as much in his interview on the BBC Andrew Marr show a few weeks ago. "

Yup, those growth areas will do even better when we outsource even more of our manufacturing to them, like Dyson! And doubly so when we do our trade deals with them so they can sell us even more stuff, undercutting our own domestic market even more.

-Matt

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By *inkyHnSCouple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

I voted remain as i wanna see Scotland stay in the EU and i wouldnt change it

Now i know England voted by a majority to leave the EU i respect that 100%

Shame some cannot respect Scotland's vote to remain.

Only only 3 year ago Scotland was told if we voted no to independence the EU would be safe in the UK now we know thats not true and the fact the Scottish majority voted to remain in the EU then yes Scotland's people should be albe to decide if we agree to brexit or not whats the harm

Plus i cant imagine how people living in N.Ireland are feeling right now with the UK government as its damn well clear they dont have an answer how to solve the border issue

N.Ireland voted to remain that also should be respected and if the UK government value N.Ireland as much as they say they do then fight for them to stay in the single market and customs union

Now if the 4th Dec comes and we see the UK government cave and allow N.Ireland to have a deal to stay in the single market and customs union then Scotland should get the same deal if not then no one can say the UK government were not well warned that the UK could face spliting up.

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex & Bridgend


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt

If were going with an interest in using the pool we'd negotiate just using that which is what we're doing.

Junker getting hiz knickers in a twist is his problem.

At a convention when he said english is no longer important then spoke french, fine, he cant speak english anyway, he's a ranting little twit "

What a load of uninformed tosh. How's your french/german/spanish etc? Im afraid your rant is just more of the dimwitted brexshit nonsense that the likes of BoJo, Gove, Fox, Redwood etc parrot every day. It's utterly shameful

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex & Bridgend


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed "

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Me likewise for the opposite reasons.

I voted out and sfter seeing how thoroughly horrible and vile the Europeans are behaving towards us i'd still vote leave

Now this attitude I really don't understand although i recognise that it is very common.

Brexit is very like an acrimonious divorce where only one partner wants the split but still wants to remain friends (fuck their soon to be ex whenever they feel the need). And like the partner who wants a divorce and to keep fucking rights we are the ones who have decided to leave and we are now getting upset because our soon to be ex partner is saying we have to pay maintenance and agree to fuck by their rules if we want to keep conjugal access.

I think we do protest too much.

All this "divorce" talk to me is my opinion, bollocks.

We were in a club, and after a number of years voted to leave it.

As an analogy, if you wanted to leave your gym/tennis club, you leave and pay off unpaid dues.. acrimoniously.

Not argue leaving terms and the club manager demanding thousands in fines because you want to leave.

Thousands in fines? wtf are you on about? Yes, it is very much like a gym club. And if you signed up with an annual contract, and wanted to leave before the year was up, you'd be contractually obliged to pay for the remaining term you agreed to in the contract when you signed up.

And when you leave, you leave. Correct. You don't then get pissed off that the club says you can't still use the swimming pool after you've left.

-Matt

If were going with an interest in using the pool we'd negotiate just using that which is what we're doing.

Junker getting hiz knickers in a twist is his problem.

At a convention when he said english is no longer important then spoke french, fine, he cant speak english anyway, he's a ranting little twit

What a load of uninformed tosh. How's your french/german/spanish etc? Im afraid your rant is just more of the dimwitted brexshit nonsense that the likes of BoJo, Gove, Fox, Redwood etc parrot every day. It's utterly shameful"

Pmsl

You forgot "flag waving little englander singing rule britania ebery nigjt" in your pathetic little rant

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed "

We weren't fine before we went it, we were a shambles, industry was hiding behind tariffs and barriers and producing goods that were unsellable

There also the small matter of there being no industrialised China, India South Korea etc.

If you want to drive around in a state of the art morris minor fine.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We weren't fine before we went it, we were a shambles, industry was hiding behind tariffs and barriers and producing goods that were unsellable

There also the small matter of there being no industrialised China, India South Korea etc.

If you want to drive around in a state of the art morris minor fine. "

Indeed. And there was no internet to speak of. Not much in the way of financial services industry.

Honda the other day told the commons select committee they have 350 trucks a day turn up at their plant in Swindon. And only keep an hour of stock on the production line. Just-in-time manufacturing didn’t exist back then.

It is a different world. Alas some people don’t seem to see that. Ironic given the fact they are likely reading this on a super computer the size of a packet of fags.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well "

So, no plan? Just ‘sit tight and trust us’? That is what you have to offer?

Not very reassuring, is it?

Do you have anything to offer besides that? Anything at all that might make those that voted remain see your viewpoint as something they could consider getting behind?

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well

So, no plan? Just ‘sit tight and trust us’? That is what you have to offer?

Not very reassuring, is it?

Do you have anything to offer besides that? Anything at all that might make those that voted remain see your viewpoint as something they could consider getting behind?

-Matt"

Matt; Matt; Matt,

your attitude is the typical attitude of every shop floor worker for decades when change is announced, whether it be in engineering or any industry, most like yourself are frightened of the unknown, but when you accept, brace it and join forces to put the plan in place you soon find out things after change are far better than before,

your attitude is the typical attitude of many when change is announced, some accept and move forward, others cannot accept and let the future pass them by whilst they sit and moan and express their negative thoughts.

.

You can always move to another E.U. country Matt, your attitude wont be missed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I voted remain.However leaving the EU might be the pain we need to create change.I can see brexit ruining the Tories and putting labour in power.Sometimes, you don't know what you got til it's gone.Brexit won't deliver anything anyone wants but it might deliver what we need.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well

So, no plan? Just ‘sit tight and trust us’? That is what you have to offer?

Not very reassuring, is it?

Do you have anything to offer besides that? Anything at all that might make those that voted remain see your viewpoint as something they could consider getting behind?

-Matt

Matt; Matt; Matt,

your attitude is the typical attitude of every shop floor worker for decades when change is announced, whether it be in engineering or any industry, most like yourself are frightened of the unknown, but when you accept, brace it and join forces to put the plan in place you soon find out things after change are far better than before,

your attitude is the typical attitude of many when change is announced, some accept and move forward, others cannot accept and let the future pass them by whilst they sit and moan and express their negative thoughts.

.

You can always move to another E.U. country Matt, your attitude wont be missed."

Hahahahahahah. You are hilarious!

I work in technology. My entire career is based upon embracing the unknown. However, you know what the key point is? I actually look at the unknown and make an educated guess. I do a risk assessment. What do I know about it, how does it compare to other things? How does it compare to past events, behaviours, systems? What other things are coming up? Who knows more about this than I do that I can talk to?

My last three years have been working with a programming language that didn't even exist a year or two before we started using it.

I fully embrace the future. But as with most decisions I have to make, I am very wary when told 'trust me' with nothing else to back it up. When every other analysis of the situation says 'don't do it'. Then I have to say, I generally take a skeptical view of it. Especially when I have others relying on me to provide for them. I'm brave. I am not reckless.

I could always move to another EU country. I'd love to. Unfortunately you are too stupid to realise that that is what you are taking away from me. The right to do exactly that.

I am actually in the process of researching moving my latest business out of the UK in order to diversify. Whilst I really want the UK to succeed (hence my passion on this topic, that you mistake for negativity), I also need to look after my own interests and that of my family. And having all my eggs in the UK right now is too risky with the current incompetents at the helm.

-Matt

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"I voted remain.However leaving the EU might be the pain we need to create change.I can see brexit ruining the Tories and putting labour in power.Sometimes, you don't know what you got til it's gone.Brexit won't deliver anything anyone wants but it might deliver what we need. "

As much as I wanted Labour to get in at the last election, In terms of Brexit, I'm actually glad they didn't. I want the Tories to own this shit. They created it, they can deal with it.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well

So, no plan? Just ‘sit tight and trust us’? That is what you have to offer?

Not very reassuring, is it?

Do you have anything to offer besides that? Anything at all that might make those that voted remain see your viewpoint as something they could consider getting behind?

-Matt

Matt; Matt; Matt,

your attitude is the typical attitude of every shop floor worker for decades when change is announced, whether it be in engineering or any industry, most like yourself are frightened of the unknown, but when you accept, brace it and join forces to put the plan in place you soon find out things after change are far better than before,

your attitude is the typical attitude of many when change is announced, some accept and move forward, others cannot accept and let the future pass them by whilst they sit and moan and express their negative thoughts.

.

You can always move to another E.U. country Matt, your attitude wont be missed.

Hahahahahahah. You are hilarious!

I work in technology. My entire career is based upon embracing the unknown. However, you know what the key point is? I actually look at the unknown and make an educated guess. I do a risk assessment. What do I know about it, how does it compare to other things? How does it compare to past events, behaviours, systems? What other things are coming up? Who knows more about this than I do that I can talk to?

My last three years have been working with a programming language that didn't even exist a year or two before we started using it.

I fully embrace the future. But as with most decisions I have to make, I am very wary when told 'trust me' with nothing else to back it up. When every other analysis of the situation says 'don't do it'. Then I have to say, I generally take a skeptical view of it. Especially when I have others relying on me to provide for them. I'm brave. I am not reckless.

I could always move to another EU country. I'd love to. Unfortunately you are too stupid to realise that that is what you are taking away from me. The right to do exactly that.

I am actually in the process of researching moving my latest business out of the UK in order to diversify. Whilst I really want the UK to succeed (hence my passion on this topic, that you mistake for negativity), I also need to look after my own interests and that of my family. And having all my eggs in the UK right now is too risky with the current incompetents at the helm.

-Matt"

Well you should be back at work then Matt; rather than be on here, im sure your Employer would not be happy with you being on here

.

If you work hard enough, one day you may be able to sit back in retirement, enjoy life, until then, I will let you run along and get back to work.

.

Life is good in retirement, work hard, invest well and one day you may also enjoy it

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"

Well you should be back at work then Matt; rather than be on here, im sure your Employer would not be happy with you being on here

.

If you work hard enough, one day you may be able to sit back in retirement, enjoy life, until then, I will let you run along and get back to work.

.

Life is good in retirement, work hard, invest well and one day you may also enjoy it"

I *am* my employer

And my investments are doing very well thanks.

-Matt

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By *tace 309TV/TS
over a year ago

durham

Change my mind

Not a hope in hell.

I waited a long time for the referendum to come .

I never wanted to be part of the pantomime in the first place .some of the ridiculous things they came up with belong there .And for those that only know being in Europe .how can you knock brexit if you never known anything else .

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again.

Yeah just let this government keep cutting back on our army we wont have one soon or the ability to respond...WE might have to rely on the EU for our security...lets hope that tory minister doesn't resign over it eh

I'd much rather we have full control over our armed forces than have them at the beck and call of clowns like Juncker and Tusk any day thanks. so it's better being at beck and call of Bush

Blair was Bush's poodle. Obama wanted Cameron to support him with military action and the House of Commons voted against it so Cameron told Obama no.

and thank fuck that Parliamentary Sovereignty stopped the muppet from doing more damage..

without being held in check dullard Dave would have to try and be statesman like wagged his tail too..

Libya was a piss poor attempt to be a 'leader' by Cameron and look how that turned out..

If you are going to have a rant at least get your facts right, I'm no fan of Cameron but the decision to go into Libya was a joint decision with the Lib dems and deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg was all for it too, it was a coalition government with the Lib dems, not a Tory government. "

Your suffering from the head in the sand issue again..

bit like your mate on here..

it was as Obama said a 'shit show'..

your now a conservative so stop running away from it..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I ready an article in the FT on this very subject.They did a survey in Usk in South Wales - the area voted 60-40% to leave. All sticking to their guns, but one UKIP Secretary, now lapsed membership is disappointed that the £ has fallen in value as they intend to sell up and retire in Spain!!!

No thought about how brexit will affect this dream. What new criteria that may have to fulfil - income, capital, health cover & pensions. Ok but here is the question - why should Spain provide all the infrastructure to a BRIT who is not paying Spanish Income Tax?

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Change my mind

Not a hope in hell.

I waited a long time for the referendum to come .

I never wanted to be part of the pantomime in the first place .some of the ridiculous things they came up with belong there .And for those that only know being in Europe .how can you knock brexit if you never known anything else ."

I just saw the results of a YouGov poll on this very topic. They stated, in short, that no-one is changing their mind on the impact of Brexit on the country:

"In October 2016, YouGov asked both Remain and Leave voters what impact they thought Brexit would have on a variety of things – such as the economy, food prices, their personal finances, etc. The research revealed that, in contrast to Remainers, only a small minority of Leave voters believed that Brexit would have a negative impact on any issue.

Now, one year on, YouGov finds that the proportion of Leave voters with negative expectations of Brexit is almost completely unchanged. On 11* of the potential areas of impact we asked about, negative opinion among Leave voters has shifted so little that in all but one instance any changes are all within the margin of error.

The only issue that has seen an increase in negative sentiment among Leavers is the likelihood of the price of their weekly shopping going up, which has risen from 25% to 30% over the past year. This is still, however, far behind the 52% who think the cost of their shopping will remain much the same."

But you your comment... my reply would be "How can you knock a dog-shit sandwich if you've never eaten one?"

-Matt

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


"I Voted leave and as time goes on I realise it was the only way to vote

.

further down the line when all is sweet and rosy, remainers will realise this as well

So, no plan? Just ‘sit tight and trust us’? That is what you have to offer?

Not very reassuring, is it?

Do you have anything to offer besides that? Anything at all that might make those that voted remain see your viewpoint as something they could consider getting behind?

-Matt

Matt; Matt; Matt,

your attitude is the typical attitude of every shop floor worker for decades when change is announced, whether it be in engineering or any industry, most like yourself are frightened of the unknown, but when you accept, brace it and join forces to put the plan in place you soon find out things after change are far better than before,

your attitude is the typical attitude of many when change is announced, some accept and move forward, others cannot accept and let the future pass them by whilst they sit and moan and express their negative thoughts.

.

You can always move to another E.U. country Matt, your attitude wont be missed."

Slight problem, there isn't a plan to embrace, there never has been a plan (perhaps Johnson has one, presumably that's the one labelled " how to become PM).

Oh and if you don't like people coming up with arguments you disagree with, I understand that it's OK for you to leave.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles"

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Anyway...

The question is "would i chage my vote" answer : yes IF the eu weren't so obstinate and controlling.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Change my mind

Not a hope in hell.

I waited a long time for the referendum to come .

I never wanted to be part of the pantomime in the first place .some of the ridiculous things they came up with belong there .And for those that only know being in Europe .how can you knock brexit if you never known anything else ."

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america. "

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading.

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France

I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again. "

You are so terrified of an "EU Army" because you don't understand it. There is no more an "EU Army" than there is a "NATO Army". All it is is national armies working together. They have been doing that for thousands of years.

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

I find this a hard question. I voted remain, though not with any enthusiasm. I don’t think I was mistaken and if transported back in a time machine I can’t say that any factors have changed enough for me to vote diffferenty. That said I’m influenced by emotions as well as reason ( as I think we pretty much all are), and my increasing irritation with the way the EU has managed negotiations, and indeed, some of the behaviour of fellow remainers in the UK, means that if there were a rerun now I would certainly vote to leave.

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

"

That’s an interesting perspective. The way our media works is always really to sound alarm and despondency. It makes for better news! We rarely hear how things look from the European side other than correspondents passing on the press releases!

My own guess is still, just, that a deal will be made at the last minute -which no one will be ecstatic over but each party will herald as a “ win”

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

all i ever wanted was a vote on an actual deal......

no blank cheques, no false threats or promises..... i want to be able to see how it would actually affect people!

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

That sounds reasonable Fabio and was the position I took on the Scottish referendum- that there should be two stages. But the difficulty with both is that where one party ( say the UK in the Scottish case or the EU in the other) doesn’t want a split at all then they have no logical reason to negotiate anything other than something totally unacceptable. Which is actually what I think some are trying to do as it is- and hoping we will cave in.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"I voted Leave and would do so again in another referendum. Jean Claude Juncker's federalist state of the union address speech a few months ago where he laid out the future direction of the EU only confirmed to me that the UK made the right decision to jump over the prison wall and get out. Juncker set out plans for more countries to join the EU and plans for an EU army (things which Remainers said wouldn't happen) so very happy that we are leaving and I would vote leave again. "

and you do know that the UK has an opt out on any future defence EU integration don't you....

same as denmark does.....

same as ireland does.....

and its this type of "false threats" i am on about....

blissfully lying and its not even ignorance of the subject....

thats why like i said... all i ever wanted was a vote on the final deal, because you then don't have to put up with shit like the above... and we can all make decisions based on our best knowledge of the effects....

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

There is nothing unreasonable about moving towards a European Army. Or any of the other initiatives towards an “ ever closer union” which is the perfectly proper dream of those at the heart of the EU project, and has been since the Treaty of Rome. Opt outs enable some countries to move at a slower pace and give time to persuade them. The direction , though not the rate of progress , is not negotiable. I don’t know really why those defending the EU position are not more positive about strengthening the Union.

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By *sensuousCouple
over a year ago

London

As if your vote counts! Pull the other one.

To be honest and I have said this from the start, we will not leave the Eu.

Politicians are just playing around, and creating the narrative not to leave.

Just an expensive sideshow, with "progress is being made" or "sorry no progress till this is sorted" depends what camp you listen to.

Denmark was forced to change its mind, then Ireland. Who thinks it's any different?

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

"

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I find this a hard question. I voted remain, though not with any enthusiasm. I don’t think I was mistaken and if transported back in a time machine I can’t say that any factors have changed enough for me to vote diffferenty. That said I’m influenced by emotions as well as reason ( as I think we pretty much all are), and my increasing irritation with the way the EU has managed negotiations, and indeed, some of the behaviour of fellow remainers in the UK, means that if there were a rerun now I would certainly vote to leave."

You remind me of the many trolls that are found on the Mail website proudly asserting that they voted Remain but now would vote to leave having seen just how - (take your pick) scheming, aggressive, nasty. unfair, greedy, pompous, annoying the EU have been for not giving the UK everything that the UK wanted.

The EU has not changed their position one millimetre from day 1 and during all of this team leading Brexiters have behaved atrociously. Undermining the United Kingdom as a country, undermining their own negotiating positions and leaking false, incorrect and completely inflammatory material for zero gain.

Do you not see that this is just a game that the UK is playing. There is NO NEGOTIATION. There is no negotiating when you choose to leave, you leave not on your terms but on the terms dictated by the surviving members.

That is it. All of this posturing by the UK is time wasting, immature and completely pointless. The EU, on the other hand, has maintained a dignified consistency throughout.

To say that the EU behavior has changed your mind is quite simply unbelievable - for no other reason than the EU has not done anything different since day 1.

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

Troll eh? Why is it that so many remainers seem incapable of polite discussion?

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort but it would be interesting to hear how you think any negotiation between two parties to any dispute could ever be resolved if each party maintained what you think is a “ dignified consistency” in not moving a jot on any issue from its opening position?

My criticism of the EU negotiators is mostly to do with the leaks and unofficial briefings aimed at influencing politics in the UK and which I expect you swallow wholesale.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

I was flexible before the vote upon my decision and I remain so today.

I need very strong evidence that the majority of the population is significantly better off in the short and long term, in or outside of the EU.

There was insufficient evidence and education prior to the vote imo. And the government has done itself no favours since, towards the same end.

Much information appears neo-fantasy, projections showing all will become rich enough to accumulate great wealth, gold bars aplenty, even for the homeless, by switching who we trade with, it's the magic money tree effect at work. All businesses will automatically accrue new customers in far flung exotic lands for their product range at no cost to them.

I'm skeptical of self-serving political parties and their donors putting the electorate first. I hope to see good news.

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France

[Removed by poster at 27/11/17 21:43:04]

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

That’s an interesting perspective. The way our media works is always really to sound alarm and despondency. It makes for better news! We rarely hear how things look from the European side other than correspondents passing on the press releases!

My own guess is still, just, that a deal will be made at the last minute -which no one will be ecstatic over but each party will herald as a “ win”"

You could well be right - My post above is just my opinion and nothing more

But I feel the complexities and differences are too many for an agreement to take place

If there were only two voices discussing the agreement, I'm sure it would reach a successful conclusion

But there are 27 with a voice and all with a potential veto, all looking to take advantage and several looking to take a pound of flesh

Already individually countries are over-playing their hand - Ireland for example prematurely suggesting a veto - Germany/France want more money because the short-fall will hit them the most.My own country will try to take further advantage over Gibraltar - France will stick a second knife in for historical reasons ... I could go on and on

I honestly think Theresa May is aware of this and is just going through the motions, to be seen as doing all she can to be fair and even-handed and compliant to a degree

A ploy to mollify the UK press and to reassure disgruntled remainers, that all was done that could have been done

But deep down she knows the complexities are too great and the compromises unacceptable to the UK public

The end result - and purely my opinion..... A no deal

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading. "

Typical rubbish from you again.

Look up the common market 1973 and it may stop you broadcasting utter shite

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside. "

And he lives in cloud cuckoo land like you do....what a right wing load of nonsense from you yet again...no links or fuck all just your assertions and assumptions on it...since the brexit vote we have gone from being no1 to the weakest....that firmly lies at the feet of you and your ilk

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By *un4allxMan
over a year ago

Arkley


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside. "

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"Troll eh? Why is it that so many remainers seem incapable of polite discussion?

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort but it would be interesting to hear how you think any negotiation between two parties to any dispute could ever be resolved if each party maintained what you think is a “ dignified consistency” in not moving a jot on any issue from its opening position?

My criticism of the EU negotiators is mostly to do with the leaks and unofficial briefings aimed at influencing politics in the UK and which I expect you swallow wholesale. "

Before you said "We rarely hear how things look from the European side", yet when you do hear from the European side from briefings or leaks then you complain about it!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading. "

I'll forgive your immature rant. Its clear you need to do some research yourself

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

On the contrary a sensible and balanced alternative viewpoint. Nothing seems to irritate shouty remainers more!

My reservation is that the readjustment in our trade will take time. It seems very likely to me that there will be some tricky years. In purely economic terms it’s whether you think that is a worthwhile risk.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament "

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester


"Troll eh? Why is it that so many remainers seem incapable of polite discussion?

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort but it would be interesting to hear how you think any negotiation between two parties to any dispute could ever be resolved if each party maintained what you think is a “ dignified consistency” in not moving a jot on any issue from its opening position?

My criticism of the EU negotiators is mostly to do with the leaks and unofficial briefings aimed at influencing politics in the UK and which I expect you swallow wholesale.

Before you said "We rarely hear how things look from the European side", yet when you do hear from the European side from briefings or leaks then you complain about it! "

No, you miss the point. What we never seem hear from the European viewpoint is a critical analysis of the EU position: what the arguments are from their point of view in favour of reaching an amicable deal with the UK. The propaganda line is heard regularly: and it is picked up faithfully by most correspondents who have never recovered from the shock of the referendum! My fault perhaps for listening primarily to the BBC which is still on most matters the source I trust most.

I don’t believe that on such a complex and huge issue there is the kind of complete unity you would expect in a totalitarian state. As we here continue to debate, I’m sure there is debate too throughout Europe. Indeed I know there is from my personal contacts. I just don’t see any of it reported in our media.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

"

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament "

Oh look, no links or fuck all, just your assertations and assumptions on it.....pot and kettle springs to mind....

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester

Hannan is one of the most interesting commentators from the Brexit side, and indeed interesting politicians at the moment. He is highly intelligent and persuasive on a range of matters, but not a team player. Had he been I suspect he would now be a leading, if not the leading cabinet member. He reminds me in some ways of Enoch Powell ( not regarding views on race) as a brilliant maverick who people will listen to when he speaks but will never wholly trust.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

3

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside. "

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

"

...and you accuse Brexiters of being xenophobic, your post is the most xenophobic on this entire thread.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside. "

Why don't you try and put a monetary figure on losing 2% of our trade? If you think that is "negligible" then you have no idea what you are talking about.

Also, if it is negligible, and nothing to worry about, why didn't the Leave campaign print it on their leaflets?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

...and you accuse Brexiters of being xenophobic, your post is the most xenophobic on this entire thread. "

Nah im questioning your reliable sources...i find it oddly amusing that someone like him and Farage have spouses from outside the UK yet are willing to deny others the same opportunity...in fact its bizarre...but i would like you to point out were ive been xenophobic

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!"

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"Hannan is one of the most interesting commentators from the Brexit side, and indeed interesting politicians at the moment. He is highly intelligent and persuasive on a range of matters, but not a team player. Had he been I suspect he would now be a leading, if not the leading cabinet member. He reminds me in some ways of Enoch Powell ( not regarding views on race) as a brilliant maverick who people will listen to when he speaks but will never wholly trust."

Don't you think he is one of the biggest liars out there? A whole leave campaign built around the fear of immigration, then the morning after the count, Hannan goes on national TV to say that immigration won't fall at all!

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

"

We don't have the capacity! We will need to sign 60 FTAs to get us to the point we are at the day before we leave. It's ridiculous to suggest that that is a good position to be in.

Do you know what's bad for business? Ripping up and starting again.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

...and you accuse Brexiters of being xenophobic, your post is the most xenophobic on this entire thread.

Nah im questioning your reliable sources...i find it oddly amusing that someone like him and Farage have spouses from outside the UK yet are willing to deny others the same opportunity...in fact its bizarre...but i would like you to point out were ive been xenophobic "

Well Farage sorted out his German passport just days after the referendum.

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

"

Do you think that at all likely? One of my main regrets about our leaving is that those in Europe who believe it needs reform and are unhappy with its direction have been weakened. It would be ironic indeed if reforms were agreed which, if addressed earlier would have undermined the case for Brexit.

I don’t by the way condemn at all those who press for greater European unity and progress towards an effective United States of Europe. In many ways it’s a fine vision. Just one I don’t share or want to be part of. To be honest I have no idea where the balance is across Europe now between the “ever closer Union” side and those who still want a union of sovereign states.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"Troll eh? Why is it that so many remainers seem incapable of polite discussion?

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort but it would be interesting to hear how you think any negotiation between two parties to any dispute could ever be resolved if each party maintained what you think is a “ dignified consistency” in not moving a jot on any issue from its opening position?

My criticism of the EU negotiators is mostly to do with the leaks and unofficial briefings aimed at influencing politics in the UK and which I expect you swallow wholesale. "

Yes Troll because your assertion that the EU has somehow made you change your mind is just not credible. The only people behaving like complete morons have been the U.K. Brexit team.

Let’s be clear again. There are NO NEGOTIATIONS at this stage and the U.K. has unilaterally chosen to leave an existing union. That union of 27 has told their negotiating team to achieve progress on certain matters before any negotiation can take place. Why do you think that the EU should change that position? The UK has known it from day 1 and seemingly the UK want to start trade negotiations so why not just sort out what the 27 want and crack on with the trade talks? It is very, very simple.

Of course the U.K. team have failed to plan, have no plan at this moment in time and are simply winging it. Hence the leaks and ridiculously inaccurate statements coming from all quarters in attempt to appear that they are making progress. It’s bullshit. They are not making progress and until they do the EU have said from Day 1 that things will not move forwards.

You have every right and would not be challenged for stating that the U.K. has behaved in an appallingly immature way during phase 1 of Brexit. Because they have and it is indisputable. To state that the EU should be vilified for standing by their stated position and by default inadvertently highlighting the lack of preparedness of the U.K. side is just wrong.

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester


"Hannan is one of the most interesting commentators from the Brexit side, and indeed interesting politicians at the moment. He is highly intelligent and persuasive on a range of matters, but not a team player. Had he been I suspect he would now be a leading, if not the leading cabinet member. He reminds me in some ways of Enoch Powell ( not regarding views on race) as a brilliant maverick who people will listen to when he speaks but will never wholly trust.

Don't you think he is one of the biggest liars out there? A whole leave campaign built around the fear of immigration, then the morning after the count, Hannan goes on national TV to say that immigration won't fall at all! "

No I don’t actually. And I don’t think you will find anything to support that. He took his own line on most issues, as he always has. He is,whether you agree with him or not, an independent thinker and worth listening to by anyone who tries to keep an open mind on issues. He’s also courteous in debate. I could instance issues where I disagree completely with him ( he was an advocate of rhe Norway model for example) but I would never dismiss his ideas without listening because I’ve decided he’s not worth listening to because he has a different opinion to mine.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Hannan is one of the most interesting commentators from the Brexit side, and indeed interesting politicians at the moment. He is highly intelligent and persuasive on a range of matters, but not a team player. Had he been I suspect he would now be a leading, if not the leading cabinet member. He reminds me in some ways of Enoch Powell ( not regarding views on race) as a brilliant maverick who people will listen to when he speaks but will never wholly trust.

Don't you think he is one of the biggest liars out there? A whole leave campaign built around the fear of immigration, then the morning after the count, Hannan goes on national TV to say that immigration won't fall at all!

No I don’t actually. And I don’t think you will find anything to support that. He took his own line on most issues, as he always has. He is,whether you agree with him or not, an independent thinker and worth listening to by anyone who tries to keep an open mind on issues. He’s also courteous in debate. I could instance issues where I disagree completely with him ( he was an advocate of rhe Norway model for example) but I would never dismiss his ideas without listening because I’ve decided he’s not worth listening to because he has a different opinion to mine. "

Hes far from independent

Daniel

HANNAN

European Conservatives and Reformists Group

Member

United Kingdom

Conservative Part

Just saying

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By *strokeC100Couple
over a year ago

chester


"Troll eh? Why is it that so many remainers seem incapable of polite discussion?

I’m not sure it’s worth the effort but it would be interesting to hear how you think any negotiation between two parties to any dispute could ever be resolved if each party maintained what you think is a “ dignified consistency” in not moving a jot on any issue from its opening position?

My criticism of the EU negotiators is mostly to do with the leaks and unofficial briefings aimed at influencing politics in the UK and which I expect you swallow wholesale.

Yes Troll because your assertion that the EU has somehow made you change your mind is just not credible. The only people behaving like complete morons have been the U.K. Brexit team.

Let’s be clear again. There are NO NEGOTIATIONS at this stage and the U.K. has unilaterally chosen to leave an existing union. That union of 27 has told their negotiating team to achieve progress on certain matters before any negotiation can take place. Why do you think that the EU should change that position? The UK has known it from day 1 and seemingly the UK want to start trade negotiations so why not just sort out what the 27 want and crack on with the trade talks? It is very, very simple.

Of course the U.K. team have failed to plan, have no plan at this moment in time and are simply winging it. Hence the leaks and ridiculously inaccurate statements coming from all quarters in attempt to appear that they are making progress. It’s bullshit. They are not making progress and until they do the EU have said from Day 1 that things will not move forwards.

You have every right and would not be challenged for stating that the U.K. has behaved in an appallingly immature way during phase 1 of Brexit. Because they have and it is indisputable. To state that the EU should be vilified for standing by their stated position and by default inadvertently highlighting the lack of preparedness of the U.K. side is just wrong."

Well we are not going to either agree nor acquire, it seems, any respect for each other’s integrity or intelligence. I’ve no interest really in shouty personal diatribes, though I am deeply interested in the issues themselves and find them both complex and challenging, with perfectly viable arguments to support different conclusions. I’ve little time really for those on either side who think them black and white and can only comprehend those taking a different view by regarding them as morons or gullible fools.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I'm an outsider looking in, so probably take a different view from most on here

I'm sad to see the UK leaving the EU but understand many of your reasons

For me the EU has had many benefits for Europe over the years but I have no doubt, it reached its peak some years ago and is now in decline

The UK's 12-14% contribution will be a huge loss - I also feel striking a departure deal with the UK will fail

The EU's direction is also a worry, especially the announcement of an EU army ........ Not only will Brussels demand more money after the UK departure but now wants our Sons and Daughters to serve in their Military

I have more trust in NATO and have no wish for an EU Army - However, I feel the announcement was made at this stage for a reason

Only France and the UK have a sizeable military force, so as part of the Brexit negotiations - you will be asked to contribute to the EU military programme after Brexit

Your military input is actually one of the most overlooked but biggest assets in the negotiations but .... as stated, I fully expect negotiations for a Brexit deal to fail

It seems the UK are preparing for a possible no-deal outcome but strangely the EU isn't

You may criticise your politicians and negotiators for lack of progress but your side seem to be better prepared and ready to face reality than ours - That's a big concern!

I think the Uk government learned it's lesson of not preparing for all outcomes in the EU referendum. Cameron and Osborne were arrogant enough to think it would be a walk in the park for Remain to win, and failed to plan for a leave victory. How wrong they were and these 2 incompetent buffoons were negligent in the extreme for failing to plan for both outcomes. Theresa May's government is not making the same mistake and the Chancellor Phillip Hammond announced an additional £3 billion to prepare for Brexit in the Budget last week, planning for a no deal scenario will take a big chunk from that allocated money.

Furthermore, the World Trade Organisation boss Roberto Azevedo said yesterday "It's not the end of the world if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules. Around half of the Uk's trade is on WTO terms, with the USA, China and emerging nations where the EU doesn't have trade agreements". Speaking from WTO HQ in Geneva, Switzerland, he made clear Britain could go it alone without a Brussels deal. He said "If you don't have a fully functioning free trade agreement with the EU, there could be rigidities and costs introduced to the relationship, but it's not like trade is going to stop. There will be an impact, but it is perfectly manageable". International trade secretary Liam Fox responded to WTO boss Roberto Azevedo's comments by saying "Far from the doomsday predictions given by some, if the UK trades with the EU under WTO rules, as Roberto Azevedo has said it will be perfectly workable. While we clearly want a free trade agreement with the EU, using WTO rules is entirely manageable. My department is a firm supporter of the WTO, and as Britain becomes an independent trading nation once again, we will be one of the world's strongest advocates for further trade liberalisation and modernisation".

The World Bank also released an independent and neutral report on the impact of Brexit a few weeks ago. It concluded that in the event of no deal with the EU, and trade reverting to WTO rules the lost trade to the UK will be minimal almost negligible (around 1.5% to 2% loss). Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan said in response to the World Bank report findings that the UK could easily make up the projected losses of trade with the EU with new trade deals with the high growth economies in the rest of the world outside.

Why don't you try and put a monetary figure on losing 2% of our trade? If you think that is "negligible" then you have no idea what you are talking about.

Also, if it is negligible, and nothing to worry about, why didn't the Leave campaign print it on their leaflets? "

Well remainers constantly dismiss the margin of victory for Leave in the EU referendum as insignificant, we hear all the time from remainers..."oh it was only 52%". Yet people like you never refer to the margin of victory in terms of voter number's, (for the record it was over a million votes). So I'll take no lectures from the likes of you on what 2% means. Seems you only want the figures rather than a percentage when it suits.

On your 2nd point, why didn't the leave campaign print it in their leaflets? Well because the World Bank report only came out a few weeks ago, if you can follow timeline of events you'll realise the referendum happened last year. How could the leave campaign have printed figures from a report which hadn't been released during the referendum? Lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

Do you think that at all likely? One of my main regrets about our leaving is that those in Europe who believe it needs reform and are unhappy with its direction have been weakened. It would be ironic indeed if reforms were agreed which, if addressed earlier would have undermined the case for Brexit.

I don’t by the way condemn at all those who press for greater European unity and progress towards an effective United States of Europe. In many ways it’s a fine vision. Just one I don’t share or want to be part of. To be honest I have no idea where the balance is across Europe now between the “ever closer Union” side and those who still want a union of sovereign states."

Those wanting to reform or constructively criticise the eu are just not being listened to. Its more of a "do as your told" rayber than negotiation. Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

I would've voted remain if they (eu leaders) were not so obstinate.

I felt bad about voting leave and spent months deciding which way to vote.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

...and you accuse Brexiters of being xenophobic, your post is the most xenophobic on this entire thread.

Nah im questioning your reliable sources...i find it oddly amusing that someone like him and Farage have spouses from outside the UK yet are willing to deny others the same opportunity...in fact its bizarre...but i would like you to point out were ive been xenophobic "

If you're not being xenophobic then why bring up his place of birth in the first place? What has his place of birth of the nationality of his wife got to do with anything?????

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"As of May 2017, Hannan ranks 743 out of 751 MEPs for his participation in roll call votes in the European Parliament.

And this head banger of a poster believes this guy....hes attended practically zero times at the EU parliament

and all of a sudden the 'experts', well those that speak the language of what he wants to hear are ok..

Haha best thing about this idiot he wasnt even born in the UK lol....how the fuck does that work

Born: 1 September 1971 (age 46), Lima, Peru

Spouse: Sara Hannan

Children: 3

Party: Conservative Party

Education: Marlborough College, Oriel College, Oxford

...and you accuse Brexiters of being xenophobic, your post is the most xenophobic on this entire thread.

Nah im questioning your reliable sources...i find it oddly amusing that someone like him and Farage have spouses from outside the UK yet are willing to deny others the same opportunity...in fact its bizarre...but i would like you to point out were ive been xenophobic

If you're not being xenophobic then why bring up his place of birth in the first place? What has his place of birth of the nationality of his wife got to do with anything?????"

Because the whole leave campaign was based on immigration....remember the bus thing with queues and queues of people trying to get into the country

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

Do you think that at all likely? One of my main regrets about our leaving is that those in Europe who believe it needs reform and are unhappy with its direction have been weakened. It would be ironic indeed if reforms were agreed which, if addressed earlier would have undermined the case for Brexit.

I don’t by the way condemn at all those who press for greater European unity and progress towards an effective United States of Europe. In many ways it’s a fine vision. Just one I don’t share or want to be part of. To be honest I have no idea where the balance is across Europe now between the “ever closer Union” side and those who still want a union of sovereign states."

Brexit could have been avoided if the EU had been more flexible towards the UK

After the dust has settled, it has to be considered a lesson learned

I don't believe reforms will come as a result of progressive and imaginative thinking - more a realisation that further demise must be halted

Unfortunately the EU appears to be similar to the Titanic - faced with a glaringly obvious Iceberg but unable to change direction

UK people - Consider yourselves lucky, you have grabbed the first available lifeboat!

The rest of us are still listening to the orchestra on the upper deck - hoping the water isn't as cold as it looks!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex & Bridgend


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america. "

We were the sick man of Europe prior to joining the EU. That, my friend, is a fact (And it's de Gaulle btw)

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex & Bridgend


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading.

Typical rubbish from you again.

Look up the common market 1973 and it may stop you broadcasting utter shite"

History and economics dont appear to be your strong suits. Britain was in decline. Why the hell else were we so enthusiastic about joining and why did a huge majority vote to join? Was it because they were already living in the land of milk and honey? Was it hell.

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By *heislanderMan
over a year ago

cheshunt

No, I voted to remain and I still think we’d be stronger remaining, however the country voted differently do I think we all need to accept that and stop fighting one another. I see so much rubbish from people blaming Theresa May for this, she voted remain

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It’s certainly quite a convincing scenario bobepo! And we have seeen before with the Canadian free trade deal how one tiny constituency can threaten to veto years of negotiations in pursuit of a little bit of self interest. My slightly more optimistic line is that a deal will probably be so much in virtually everyone’s interest at the final conclusion that, as it always does, the EU will find a way of “ persuading” the odd recalcitrant.

For Germany and France it’s probably money and trade. Spain may be tempted by Gib of course and internal politics may play a part but it has little to gain from alienating the UK in several fields, and so on.

If I’m right the country who may be least happy is indeed the UK! I’m fairly sure we will pay an absurd amount as the alleged “ bill” but really as a bribe to secure an arguably reasonable trade deal to give us time to re configure our economy. I think we will be rather worse off than we would have been otherwise for a few years, and at my age , that’s a fair chunk of what I have left!

I understand your concerns and respect your views - realistically it could go either way

On a more optimistic level - I don't think a no deal is the end of the world - in fact on the contrary

Both sides will be met with a situation of needing to change and a need to up their game ..... a case of 'ripping up and starting again'

If it's a no deal - We are likely to see the fastest trade deals in history take place

Hopefully followed by the EU making positive reforms and taking a reflective look into why the Union has become less attractive and faces decline

Do you think that at all likely? One of my main regrets about our leaving is that those in Europe who believe it needs reform and are unhappy with its direction have been weakened. It would be ironic indeed if reforms were agreed which, if addressed earlier would have undermined the case for Brexit.

I don’t by the way condemn at all those who press for greater European unity and progress towards an effective United States of Europe. In many ways it’s a fine vision. Just one I don’t share or want to be part of. To be honest I have no idea where the balance is across Europe now between the “ever closer Union” side and those who still want a union of sovereign states.

Brexit could have been avoided if the EU had been more flexible towards the UK

After the dust has settled, it has to be considered a lesson learned

I don't believe reforms will come as a result of progressive and imaginative thinking - more a realisation that further demise must be halted

Unfortunately the EU appears to be similar to the Titanic - faced with a glaringly obvious Iceberg but unable to change direction

UK people - Consider yourselves lucky, you have grabbed the first available lifeboat!

The rest of us are still listening to the orchestra on the upper deck - hoping the water isn't as cold as it looks!"

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading.

I'll forgive your immature rant. Its clear you need to do some research yourself"

Shock, Quitter reads something they don't like, declares it a rant to avoid having to try internalise the information.

Simple challenge, not that you'll do it, go and read up on the post war political situation in Europe, paying particular attention to the iron steel and mining industry.

Quitters get angry with being seen as stupid, I think many are far from stupid, but many are poorly informed or worse, wilfully ignorant.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading.

Typical rubbish from you again.

Look up the common market 1973 and it may stop you broadcasting utter shite

History and economics dont appear to be your strong suits. Britain was in decline. Why the hell else were we so enthusiastic about joining and why did a huge majority vote to join? Was it because they were already living in the land of milk and honey? Was it hell."

The North East is no stranger to hardship and has usually been sacrificed for the benefit of the south. It was no picknick up here, but the north voted to leave.

Your right, economics isnt my strong point, yours is getting things into perspective you drama queen!

Did the northeast vote leave because were all thickos that need guidance from you in the south?

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby

The north east vote was almost pure protest. It was the only way to lash out at politicians.

As I'm sure you are aware the labour party utterly controls north east political life ( bar a couple of seats).

It didn't matter who you voted for, you got labour.

The referendum was a one off where people could express their anger with, they were told, no negative impacts.

The reality is much different.

A huge chunk of funding for the North East comes from the EU. That's gone

Will this or any government replace that?

Labour won't, they don't need to, they win the seats anyway. Put it like this in Middlesbrough we had a labour mp who visited his constituency about once every 4 years. And did that for 20+ years.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

"

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other? "

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

"

Really, care to share the evidence for that statement?

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

"

How is it that people think it is ok to just make shit up and then post it as fact? No wonder we are on this political clusterfuck when there is no boundary between the truth and a lie.

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By *or Fox SakeCouple
over a year ago

Thornaby


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

How is it that people think it is ok to just make shit up and then post it as fact? No wonder we are on this political clusterfuck when there is no boundary between the truth and a lie.

"

Welcome to the post truth world, when we have idiots like Farage and Trump openly spewing lies.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What worries me more than anything is our government's inability to organise anything and get it right! The current encumbents don't inspire me one little bit. I worry that they will screw up the country and we will end up like Greece (no offence to Greece ). We have spent billions on an aircraft carrier - why? We have 5 border control boats and only 3 are opperational - why? Surely we could have spent the money on boarder patrol boats than an aircraft carrier - we are trying to secure the boarders after all! We are no longer a "world power" so let's concatenate on things that matter to the UK. This is not intended at any one political party as they are all just as bad as each other.

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By *oubepoMan
over a year ago

Spain Portugal France


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

Really, care to share the evidence for that statement? "

Early stages but the wheels are already in motion for this project - Did your country get an option to opt out? Mine certainly didn't

In that case your country, like the 27 other countries are already funding it - That's a compulsory contribution in my book

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


" Take thie eu army for example. What's its function when there's nato?

Many Leavers mention this "EU Army" that they don't understand, but I have never seen anyone mention the NATO VJTF, the Joint Expeditionary Force (UK, Sweden, Denmark, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Netherlands and Norway), or the Combined Joint Expeditionary Force (UK and France)

These 3 bodies have all been created within the last 10 years, yet get no mention what so ever on this forum. The "EU Army" which isn't operational gets mentioned countless times, why is that? Why are people terrified of one yet are completely ignorant of the other?

The answer is very simple - Membership to all the other organisations you mentioned is voluntary

The contribution to the EU army by all the remaining 27 EU countries will compulsory

How is it that people think it is ok to just make shit up and then post it as fact? No wonder we are on this political clusterfuck when there is no boundary between the truth and a lie.

Welcome to the post truth world, when we have idiots like Farage and Trump openly spewing lies."

Exactly, complete bollocks. Member states have the power of veto, and cannot be compelled to contribute military forces. Nothing about the EU is compulsory, as Brexit proves, sovereignty ultimately remains with the member state. If they dont like it they can leave. This is exactly the same as NATO, JCEF and CEF.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"What worries me more than anything is our government's inability to organise anything and get it right! The current encumbents don't inspire me one little bit. I worry that they will screw up the country and we will end up like Greece (no offence to Greece ). We have spent billions on an aircraft carrier - why? We have 5 border control boats and only 3 are opperational - why? Surely we could have spent the money on boarder patrol boats than an aircraft carrier - we are trying to secure the boarders after all! We are no longer a "world power" so let's concatenate on things that matter to the UK. This is not intended at any one political party as they are all just as bad as each other."

We have 5 additional boats being built on the Clyde for that role. One interesting thing though is fishing. For years, the MOD has published data on the number of interdictions they make with fishing vessels, including EU fishing vessels, fishing under the CFP. The MOD recently thought it was a good idea to stop publishing these figures. They put it out to public consultation. I personally submitted evidence saying that this information is important, and they should continue to publish it. My feeling was that they were trying to hide things under the rug when/if we leave the CFP.

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By *avidnsa69Man
over a year ago

Essex & Bridgend


"voted leave and would vote the same - the media hype is hysterical - we were fine before we went in - we'll be fine when we leave - perspective is what is needed

We werent fine before we went in.....we were an economic shambles

Nonsense.

When we entered into the eu in 1973 there was a recession wbich followed on after joining the common market. We had recessions before and nothing remarkable there.

The reason the common market was set up was to counter the emerging usa super power.

De Gual (big nosed french general from ww2) didn't want us joining as he thougjt we were too closely linked to america.

Simply put that's utter bolloxs.

The reason the EU was set up was to ensure that the German industrial capacity could not be turned to military purposes ( the other option was to turn Germany into a state based on agriculture)

The reason we had a recession in the 70s ( and went to the IMF for bail outs) was that British industry was a mess, an absolute basket case.

Industrial relations were a farce.

Please, do some reading.

Typical rubbish from you again.

Look up the common market 1973 and it may stop you broadcasting utter shite

History and economics dont appear to be your strong suits. Britain was in decline. Why the hell else were we so enthusiastic about joining and why did a huge majority vote to join? Was it because they were already living in the land of milk and honey? Was it hell.

The North East is no stranger to hardship and has usually been sacrificed for the benefit of the south. It was no picknick up here, but the north voted to leave.

Your right, economics isnt my strong point, yours is getting things into perspective you drama queen!

Did the northeast vote leave because were all thickos that need guidance from you in the south?

"

People voted to leave for a variety of reasons, many of them valid, most which wont be fixed by leaving the EU.

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby


"I voted leave and would vote the same again. The EU wants too much power over everything for my liking. like ? I’m trying to understand what created the high arching statements people tend to make.

Where have you been for the last 40 years? The general trend of the EU has been to centralise more and more power in Brussels and this has been happening incrementally since we joined in the 1970's. Be lovely to have some examples ta. I’ve only be politically aware for 20 and I’m not sure I can name too many straight off the bat. Let alone whether these are bad or good things. "

Isn't there a thing going through parliament at the moment? Something to do with the transfer of laws from the EU to the UK?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The north east vote was almost pure protest. It was the only way to lash out at politicians.

As I'm sure you are aware the labour party utterly controls north east political life ( bar a couple of seats).

It didn't matter who you voted for, you got labour.

The referendum was a one off where people could express their anger with, they were told, no negative impacts.

The reality is much different.

A huge chunk of funding for the North East comes from the EU. That's gone

Will this or any government replace that?

Labour won't, they don't need to, they win the seats anyway. Put it like this in Middlesbrough we had a labour mp who visited his constituency about once every 4 years. And did that for 20+ years. "

Just down the road from you the car plant Nissan plant was funded mostly by the EU people tend to forget that....and they will be going back to the government should any tariffs be imposed on imports or exports

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

[Removed by poster at 28/11/17 12:26:56]

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

You would think the uk paid the eu nothing by reading the posts on here lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You would think the EU took all our money reading some of the posts on here

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By * and BCouple
over a year ago

Durham

Leave yesterday, leave today and leave tomorrow. Lets make Britain Great again

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The north east vote was almost pure protest. It was the only way to lash out at politicians.

As I'm sure you are aware the labour party utterly controls north east political life ( bar a couple of seats).

It didn't matter who you voted for, you got labour.

The referendum was a one off where people could express their anger with, they were told, no negative impacts.

The reality is much different.

A huge chunk of funding for the North East comes from the EU. That's gone

Will this or any government replace that?

Labour won't, they don't need to, they win the seats anyway. Put it like this in Middlesbrough we had a labour mp who visited his constituency about once every 4 years. And did that for 20+ years.

Just down the road from you the car plant Nissan plant was funded mostly by the EU people tend to forget that....and they will be going back to the government should any tariffs be imposed on imports or exports "

Yet again a remainer tries to perpetuate the myth that the UK is funded by the EU. There is no such thing as 'EU money' it is UK taxpayers money handed over to the EU, recycled by a few pen pushing bureaucrats in Brussels and handed back to us. Then they call it 'EU money', it's the biggest con trick going! After Brexit the UK government can take direct control of that money instead of handing it over to the EU, we can cut out the EU middle man and Westminster can distribute that money themselves.

Another myth being perpetuated by remainers on this thread is that the UK has free trade with the EU. What a crock of shit that assumption is. The UK currently pays a tariff to trade with the EU, it's called the 'EU Membership fee'. The EU membership fee is a tariff by any other name and is another gigantic con trick pulled by the EU, clearly remainers on here have fallen for it hook, line and sinker. Leave voters on the other hand seem to be more aware as to what is really going on. After the rebate and other money coming back to us (which is originally UK taxpayers money anyway as the UK is a nett contributor to the EU) we are left with a bill of around £8.5 to £9 billion a year to trade with the EU. This is really a tariff by any other name, it's only the EU which calls it a 'membership fee'.

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