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Government statistics... Can they be trusted?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Employers a d other element claiming that lwa ing the eu would leave them sbort of labour, while the goverment claims lowest unemployment figures since the 70s. Slight anomalies here?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They all manipulate them to fit their own narrative.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Employment doesn't necessarily mean full time either. Call me fickle but when I see graduates with 2:1 degrees in good subjects stuck on part time and zero hours for two years I question what kind of job growth we have.

They should list the proportion of those in full time, part time, self employed and on zero hours all together. Oh and internships and apprenticeships as they throw them in to bulk it up.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"Employers a d other element claiming that lwa ing the eu would leave them sbort of labour, while the goverment claims lowest unemployment figures since the 70s. Slight anomalies here? "

No OP, it makes perfect sense. If you have lots and lots of unemployed people, you don't have a labour shortage. You have lots of people available to work.

On the other hand, when you have low unemployment, you dont have many people available to hire. There just aren't that many people around who are looking for work.

Labour shortage and low employment are the same phenomenon just by a different name.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

The unemployment figures are bogus, there is no labour shortage (yet). The reason I can say this is because if the government's assertions were true then wages would be skyrocketing, because labour in an unregulated market is governed by the laws of supply and demand like all finite commodities if there is a shortage the cost rises. Labour costs are not rising (yet).

Therefore what we have is a rigged statistical system designed to hide economic inactivity.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its a well known fact that the unemployment figures are doctored by the zero hours contracts

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

They are doctored but that has nothing to do with zer hours contracts which are not relevant in this statistic.There is an old saying there are statistics,stastictics and damn lies

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They are doctored but that has nothing to do with zer hours contracts which are not relevant in this statistic.There is an old saying there are statistics,stastictics and damn lies"

I think you will find they do...and yes i do agree with the there are statistics,stastictics and damn lies quote lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Two words, both heavily and closely linked to lies and trickery...and you're SERIOUSLY asking if they can be trusted...?!!!?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of course they can.

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

Tim Harford's programme More Or Less on Radio 4 regularly debunks government statistical claims.

No, of course we can't trust the government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Of course they can."

Only because you love the gender pay crap

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Of course they can.

Only because you love the gender pay crap "

Gap.

Gender pay gap.

And I'm not fond of it, to be quite honest.

And the idea that these stats are false doesn't really make any sense.

You can take issue with the conclusions drawn, sure, but even the people that "debunk" the conclusions use the same data set.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman
over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

In a word, NO

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By *ilent.KnightMan
over a year ago

Swindon


"Employers a d other element claiming that lwa ing the eu would leave them sbort of labour, while the goverment claims lowest unemployment figures since the 70s. Slight anomalies here?

No OP, it makes perfect sense. If you have lots and lots of unemployed people, you don't have a labour shortage. You have lots of people available to work.

On the other hand, when you have low unemployment, you dont have many people available to hire. There just aren't that many people around who are looking for work.

Labour shortage and low employment are the same phenomenon just by a different name."

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"There's lies, damn lies and statistics"

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

OP do you get that they are the same thing yet?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What I think employers mean is 'leave us short of skilled workers who will settle for rubbish pay and work really hard'.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"What I think employers mean is 'leave us short of skilled workers who will settle for rubbish pay and work really hard'."

My thoughts exactly. I'm currently in a badly paid, insecure, dirty, unsocial hours job and now with an unwritten threat of losing my job if i dont volunteer to do overtime.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Not much fun when i can feel the sliding doors at the jobcentre biting at my arse

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I was a nurse and worked in a&e many moons ago. But after people expiring despite best efforts i soldiered on despite getting upset. but my courage ran out and thought 'fuck it!' i just couldn't hack it anymore. Cowards way out possibly but there you are, just got too upset instead of taking an objective viewpoint.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 16/09/17 22:05:42]

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws "

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms"

But the thing is the Tories dont work that way...they want all cheap labour and zero hours contracts....looks good on the dole figures

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms"

So you prefer market forces rather than legislation?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms

So you prefer market forces rather than legislation? "

I'm in favour on any system tbat reduces the inequalities.

Legislation is open to ideological influence e.g Corporate greed and those who treat it and exploitation as a virtue (them f*ing tories)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms

So you prefer market forces rather than legislation?

I'm in favour on any system tbat reduces the inequalities.

Legislation is open to ideological influence e.g Corporate greed and those who treat it and exploitation as a virtue (them f*ing tories)"

Well then you and the majority of the country wants to hope the Great Repeal Bill doesn't go through

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"And this is before brexit...wait till the government are able to repeal all the EU's employment laws

Thing is though, if you cut off the supply of cheap labour, the effect would be better conditions if employees can choose employers on better terms

So you prefer market forces rather than legislation?

I'm in favour on any system tbat reduces the inequalities.

Legislation is open to ideological influence e.g Corporate greed and those who treat it and exploitation as a virtue (them f*ing tories)

Well then you and the majority of the country wants to hope the Great Repeal Bill doesn't go through"

Legislation by proclamation issue is the part i don't like at all. Especially with the tories at the helem.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Who do you trust more? Boris or the head of the UK statistics authority?

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By *nleashedCrakenMan
over a year ago

Widnes

I think you can probably trust the raw statistical data, if you can actually find it, but you have to take any interpretation and use of them with a large pinch of salt, taking account of the bias of the person making the argument.

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