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"So part two started this morning and David Davis turned up with his team of unelected bureaucrats and promptly disappeared after an hour or so leaving it to the unelected to sort his shit out. One image above all summed up that meeting and respective approaches to the negotiations. It was the round table image with the three EU Negotiators along with Daviscand his protégés. The EU team had briefing notes at the ready and looked fully prepared. The UK team were smiling inanely. That picture annoyed the fuck out of me." Your just re spinning the spin from the papers !!!! | |||
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"So part two started this morning and David Davis turned up with his team of unelected bureaucrats and promptly disappeared after an hour or so leaving it to the unelected to sort his shit out. One image above all summed up that meeting and respective approaches to the negotiations. It was the round table image with the three EU Negotiators along with Daviscand his protégés. The EU team had briefing notes at the ready and looked fully prepared. The UK team were smiling inanely. That picture annoyed the fuck out of me. Your just re spinning the spin from the papers !!!!" Which papers? That photo was on the BBC news website this morning and it went straight onto my Facebook. It has naturally become a newsworthy image because of its content. It is a disgraceful representation of the UK Brexit teams approach to Brexit. David Davis is getting off incredibly lightly by the media. He is clueless. | |||
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"So part two started this morning and David Davis turned up with his team of unelected bureaucrats and promptly disappeared after an hour or so leaving it to the unelected to sort his shit out. One image above all summed up that meeting and respective approaches to the negotiations. It was the round table image with the three EU Negotiators along with Daviscand his protégés. The EU team had briefing notes at the ready and looked fully prepared. The UK team were smiling inanely. That picture annoyed the fuck out of me. Your just re spinning the spin from the papers !!!!" Hardly likely to be in the papers as the picture was only taken this morning. Very probably it will be in tomorrows papers and spun according to the political leanings on the individual papers. Very telling image, though. | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx" No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt" Are you not the same poster that just called the government 'incompetent' on the 'In the same week' thread? Or was the above just a rhetorical statement? | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt Are you not the same poster that just called the government 'incompetent' on the 'In the same week' thread? Or was the above just a rhetorical statement? " I think you are confusing me with ' _ex4unow' on this thread. Yes, I called our politicians incompetent on another thread. And here I am saying that putting our politicians down is not the same as putting our country down. -Matt | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt Are you not the same poster that just called the government 'incompetent' on the 'In the same week' thread? Or was the above just a rhetorical statement? I think you are confusing me with ' _ex4unow' on this thread. Yes, I called our politicians incompetent on another thread. And here I am saying that putting our politicians down is not the same as putting our country down. -Matt" No, I wasn't confusing you with anyone. I was just trying to point out that saying putting our politicians down is a National sport sounds a little like you disapprove of the practice whilst, on another thread, you did that very thing. Just a question of how you read you post, I suppose. I should add that I tend to agree with the vast majority of your posts, it's just that those two sounded a little contradictory in my opinion. | |||
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"So part two started this morning and David Davis turned up with his team of unelected bureaucrats and promptly disappeared after an hour or so leaving it to the unelected to sort his shit out. One image above all summed up that meeting and respective approaches to the negotiations. It was the round table image with the three EU Negotiators along with Daviscand his protégés. The EU team had briefing notes at the ready and looked fully prepared. The UK team were smiling inanely. That picture annoyed the fuck out of me." ...the Brits don't need any paperwork or in fact any form of digital media ...they must have it all in their heads  ...or efficiently condensed in that little black notebook in front of them ...
...we thought the photo was hilarious ...and we are not cynical at all
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt Are you not the same poster that just called the government 'incompetent' on the 'In the same week' thread? Or was the above just a rhetorical statement? I think you are confusing me with ' _ex4unow' on this thread. Yes, I called our politicians incompetent on another thread. And here I am saying that putting our politicians down is not the same as putting our country down. -Matt No, I wasn't confusing you with anyone. I was just trying to point out that saying putting our politicians down is a National sport sounds a little like you disapprove of the practice whilst, on another thread, you did that very thing. Just a question of how you read you post, I suppose. I should add that I tend to agree with the vast majority of your posts, it's just that those two sounded a little contradictory in my opinion." I'm a bit confused by your reading of it. I'm not sure how saying something is a national sport is disapproving of it. That said, you probably might (correctly) infer that I don't care much for football from what I wrote. To be clear, I think our current government is a complete shower of incompetent, vindictive, out of touch, tosspots. -Matt | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx No, we put our politicians down. It's pretty much our national sport (besides that one with millionaires chasing a ball about a field). -Matt Are you not the same poster that just called the government 'incompetent' on the 'In the same week' thread? Or was the above just a rhetorical statement? I think you are confusing me with ' _ex4unow' on this thread. Yes, I called our politicians incompetent on another thread. And here I am saying that putting our politicians down is not the same as putting our country down. -Matt No, I wasn't confusing you with anyone. I was just trying to point out that saying putting our politicians down is a National sport sounds a little like you disapprove of the practice whilst, on another thread, you did that very thing. Just a question of how you read you post, I suppose. I should add that I tend to agree with the vast majority of your posts, it's just that those two sounded a little contradictory in my opinion. I'm a bit confused by your reading of it. I'm not sure how saying something is a national sport is disapproving of it. That said, you probably might (correctly) infer that I don't care much for football from what I wrote. To be clear, I think our current government is a complete shower of incompetent, vindictive, out of touch, tosspots. -Matt" God hate to think what youd say about corbyn and his cronies | |||
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"Sorry you got my comments confused with someone else I actually believe all politicians are self serving but the majority of the public are also We should trust the negotiators to do their thing because moaning about them isn't going to help us Tim xx" Why should we blindly trust anyone that has never in their political life shown the qualities needed to spearhead these negotiations? If he had shown knowledge and understanding of the structure of the EU and Europe from the outset, we may have given him the benefit of doubt. As it is, he has a legacy of making statements that highlight his ignorance and not his knowledge. The guy is not up to the job, but he has a greT get out of jail card. He doesn't really have to try too hard because no deal really seems to be an option with these clowns. | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats..." You mean like the European Commission? | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx" The photo the OP was referring to was a photo opportunity for journalists before negotiations began behind closed doors. It's reported David Davis had his notes in his bag under the table ( very sensible considering the media have a habit of photographing any exposed notes and publishing them in the papers). David Davis had smile on his face in the photo I don't see why people are annoyed by that? He is a Brexiter it's good to see him and his colleagues happy in their jobs. 
David Davis left the negotiations early because for the most part now the negotiations on EU citizens rights are being worked on by UK working groups and it's exactly the same for the EU, Barnier isn't doing all this by himself for the EU he has a large team behind the scenes same as Davis has a large UK team behind him. As for people putting the country down you'd better get used to it on here, bitter and twisted remainers who can't accept that they lost the referendum look for any excuse to have a moan. | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx The photo the OP was referring to was a photo opportunity for journalists before negotiations began behind closed doors. It's reported David Davis had his notes in his bag under the table ( very sensible considering the media have a habit of photographing any exposed notes and publishing them in the papers). David Davis had smile on his face in the photo I don't see why people are annoyed by that? He is a Brexiter it's good to see him and his colleagues happy in their jobs.
David Davis left the negotiations early because for the most part now the negotiations on EU citizens rights are being worked on by UK working groups and it's exactly the same for the EU, Barnier isn't doing all this by himself for the EU he has a large team behind the scenes same as Davis has a large UK team behind him. As for people putting the country down you'd better get used to it on here, bitter and twisted remainers who can't accept that they lost the referendum look for any excuse to have a moan. "Haha he wasnt there long enough to have a bag  | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats... You mean like the European Commission?" Indeed it might be better if the EU Commissioners were directly elected by the population. At the moment our government hand picks who they put in as the UKs EU Commissioner, and we have no say. But then again, we have no say who the government put in any domestic ministerial post either. Not sure if we want to be micromanaging the government and voting on each position to be filled. Considering the UK public have quite clearly shown they don't know their arse from their elbow when voting on political outcomes. -Matt | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats... You mean like the European Commission? Indeed it might be better if the EU Commissioners were directly elected by the population. At the moment our government hand picks who they put in as the UKs EU Commissioner, and we have no say. But then again, we have no say who the government put in any domestic ministerial post either. Not sure if we want to be micromanaging the government and voting on each position to be filled. Considering the UK public have quite clearly shown they don't know their arse from their elbow when voting on political outcomes. -Matt" That's no way to talk about those who voted Remain! | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats... You mean like the European Commission? Indeed it might be better if the EU Commissioners were directly elected by the population. At the moment our government hand picks who they put in as the UKs EU Commissioner, and we have no say. -Matt" But why the government, and not the MEPs elected by us to represent us in the European Parliament? | |||
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" Not sure if we want to be micromanaging the government and voting on each position to be filled. Considering the UK public have quite clearly shown they don't know their arse from their elbow when voting on political outcomes. -Matt" Do you include yourself in that, or just the people who don't vote the way you do? | |||
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"Sounds like he is letting his fully briefed team do the leg work There are lots of issues to negotiate We as a country seem to put ourselves down Very sad Tim xx The photo the OP was referring to was a photo opportunity for journalists before negotiations began behind closed doors. It's reported David Davis had his notes in his bag under the table ( very sensible considering the media have a habit of photographing any exposed notes and publishing them in the papers). David Davis had smile on his face in the photo I don't see why people are annoyed by that? He is a Brexiter it's good to see him and his colleagues happy in their jobs.
David Davis left the negotiations early because for the most part now the negotiations on EU citizens rights are being worked on by UK working groups and it's exactly the same for the EU, Barnier isn't doing all this by himself for the EU he has a large team behind the scenes same as Davis has a large UK team behind him. As for people putting the country down you'd better get used to it on here, bitter and twisted remainers who can't accept that they lost the referendum look for any excuse to have a moan. "You are deluded absolutely fucking bonkers | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats... You mean like the European Commission? Indeed it might be better if the EU Commissioners were directly elected by the population. At the moment our government hand picks who they put in as the UKs EU Commissioner, and we have no say. -Matt But why the government, and not the MEPs elected by us to represent us in the European Parliament? " The European commission is no different to our cabinet. None of us got to vote on who was going to be Brexit minister. | |||
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"unelected bureaucrats... You mean like the European Commission? Indeed it might be better if the EU Commissioners were directly elected by the population. At the moment our government hand picks who they put in as the UKs EU Commissioner, and we have no say. -Matt But why the government, and not the MEPs elected by us to represent us in the European Parliament? " No idea. As I said, would be better perhaps to be more directly elected. I was just trying to make the point that it is our own government that select who we sit on the European Commission. The tone of the original point seemed to suggest it was something that our sovereign government was not in control of. -Matt | |||
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" Not sure if we want to be micromanaging the government and voting on each position to be filled. Considering the UK public have quite clearly shown they don't know their arse from their elbow when voting on political outcomes. -Matt Do you include yourself in that, or just the people who don't vote the way you do?" No, it is not about which way you voted at all. Everyone has a right to vote whichever way they want. They have the right to have whatever political opinion they want. But they should take the responsibility seriously and actually try and understand the concepts and the impact of what they are voting for. Also to do their due diligence and try and work out what might be truth and what might be lies. -Matt | |||
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"We are where we are and can only move onwards from this point I'm sure some people are wanting to reverse the result and some wonder why we are still part of the e u but besides becoming an m p all the arguing and undermining is a detriment to u k as a whole adding to a worse outcome Tim xx" See this is the root of the problem and the result of what is happening. You now believe that questioning what our government is doing is 'undermining' and a 'detriment' to the UK. This is not good. -Matt | |||
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"We are where we are and can only move onwards from this point I'm sure some people are wanting to reverse the result and some wonder why we are still part of the e u but besides becoming an m p all the arguing and undermining is a detriment to u k as a whole adding to a worse outcome Tim xx" Thats an idiotic approach to politics. People hold the power in a democracy and they can sway governments in between elections by excercising their right to have a view on issues and performance. If the governments going the wrong way they can be steered back on track by people voicing their opinion. Disagreeing on a bad plan and providing better alternatives is not going to make the result of Brexit worse than it is. The success of Brexit will be decided by numbers not emotions and feelings. Did trade, inflation,GDP growth, living standards and real wage growth rise, public and private debt or fall. And on all of those numbers Brexit has already made every one of them worse. And your idea is to mindlessly, obediantly continue the charge into a disaster that we can already see has started rather than plot a new amd better course of action? | |||
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" Not sure if we want to be micromanaging the government and voting on each position to be filled. Considering the UK public have quite clearly shown they don't know their arse from their elbow when voting on political outcomes. -Matt Do you include yourself in that, or just the people who don't vote the way you do? No, it is not about which way you voted at all. Everyone has a right to vote whichever way they want. They have the right to have whatever political opinion they want. But they should take the responsibility seriously and actually try and understand the concepts and the impact of what they are voting for. Also to do their due diligence and try and work out what might be truth and what might be lies. -Matt" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did! | |||
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" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did!" If 10 students take a test you think the ones who got the answers right studied and the ones who get them wrong didnt. Brexiters on this forum cant even keep up with what happened a week ago let alone put the effort into considering what might happen in something as complex as Brexit. Time and again discussion on here follows the same pattern: An opinion is made, 1 group critical of Brexit can post hard numbers, facts and back up their points with evidence while the Brexiters have the same stock answers: Brexit means Brexit, we won so get over it, just trust the negotiators, criticising the Tories undermines the country and its prospects,nobody knows whats going to happen so no point in discussing it, lets just get out and the whole thing done with. Ive yet to see a pro Brexit supporter, here or anywhere, outline why this will be a success. Do you know why? Its already a failure, you can see it in the rising inflation, declining financial barometers, the preparations for Brexodus, the overwhelming amount of unforeseen problems, the dizzying amount of u turns by the Tories and the huge amount of dissension in the cabinet. Not to mention the fact that Brexiters told us all loudly that the UK was so incredibly special and important that the EU had a weak negotiating position despite everyone who knew anything saying the opposite. Now Davis is being told how Brexit will unfold because reality has come crashing down on his head. The talks will proceed in the order that the EU decided. Britain will be allowed to discuss trade when the EU allow it. And now sources are saying that the Tories have accepted a divorce bill of up to 50bn already, big change from "go whistle" last week. | |||
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" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did! If 10 students take a test you think the ones who got the answers right studied and the ones who get them wrong didnt. Brexiters on this forum cant even keep up with what happened a week ago let alone put the effort into considering what might happen in something as complex as Brexit. Time and again discussion on here follows the same pattern: An opinion is made, 1 group critical of Brexit can post hard numbers, facts and back up their points with evidence while the Brexiters have the same stock answers: Brexit means Brexit, we won so get over it, just trust the negotiators, criticising the Tories undermines the country and its prospects,nobody knows whats going to happen so no point in discussing it, lets just get out and the whole thing done with. Ive yet to see a pro Brexit supporter, here or anywhere, outline why this will be a success. Do you know why? Its already a failure, you can see it in the rising inflation, declining financial barometers, the preparations for Brexodus, the overwhelming amount of unforeseen problems, the dizzying amount of u turns by the Tories and the huge amount of dissension in the cabinet. Not to mention the fact that Brexiters told us all loudly that the UK was so incredibly special and important that the EU had a weak negotiating position despite everyone who knew anything saying the opposite. Now Davis is being told how Brexit will unfold because reality has come crashing down on his head. The talks will proceed in the order that the EU decided. Britain will be allowed to discuss trade when the EU allow it. And now sources are saying that the Tories have accepted a divorce bill of up to 50bn already, big change from "go whistle" last week." Complete and utter nonsense but it's what we've all come to expect from you on any Brexit related topic on here. People who voted leave did do the research and look at the evidence available and a majority came to the conclusion leaving the EU is the better option for us. You say inflation keeps rising which is a blatant lie considering inflation fell this month to 2.6% compared to 2.9% last month. There is some hard fact , numbers and evidence for you while you just peddle lies. The success of brexit will come for Britain in the long term as we leave the EU and start to establish our own trade deals around the rest of the world. The USA wants a "very powerful trade deal" done with the UK "very, very quickly" after Brexit and Australia also want a free trade deal signed "speedily" with the UK after brexit. The UK also has a working group going with India on a trade deal which will be done after Brexit and international trade secretary Liam Fox has established a list of 27 countries worldwide who want a trade deal with the UK after brexit. This is hard fact. As for trade with the EU the Czech minister Ales Chmelar said on Monday as the 2nd round of talks began between Davis and Barnier that Britain could get a much deeper, much broader free trade deal than the recent Canada/EU trade deal. The EU is not getting everything It's own way on how the negotiations are developing (it's already been explained to you before that Britain tried to get the EU citizens rights issue settled before article 50 was triggered so it's no surprise to anyone that was given priority in the talks). On Monday the EU caved in on its own timetable and the talks are not proceeding in the order the EU wanted. On Monday talks moved onto future trade between the EU and the UK despite the EU insisting before that trade would not be discussed until a brexit bill was settled. Sources say The EU backed down on its previous insistence that talks on import quotas would not happen until the brexit bill was settled. | |||
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" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did! If 10 students take a test you think the ones who got the answers right studied and the ones who get them wrong didnt. Brexiters on this forum cant even keep up with what happened a week ago let alone put the effort into considering what might happen in something as complex as Brexit. Time and again discussion on here follows the same pattern: An opinion is made, 1 group critical of Brexit can post hard numbers, facts and back up their points with evidence while the Brexiters have the same stock answers: Brexit means Brexit, we won so get over it, just trust the negotiators, criticising the Tories undermines the country and its prospects,nobody knows whats going to happen so no point in discussing it, lets just get out and the whole thing done with. Ive yet to see a pro Brexit supporter, here or anywhere, outline why this will be a success. Do you know why? Its already a failure, you can see it in the rising inflation, declining financial barometers, the preparations for Brexodus, the overwhelming amount of unforeseen problems, the dizzying amount of u turns by the Tories and the huge amount of dissension in the cabinet. Not to mention the fact that Brexiters told us all loudly that the UK was so incredibly special and important that the EU had a weak negotiating position despite everyone who knew anything saying the opposite. Now Davis is being told how Brexit will unfold because reality has come crashing down on his head. The talks will proceed in the order that the EU decided. Britain will be allowed to discuss trade when the EU allow it. And now sources are saying that the Tories have accepted a divorce bill of up to 50bn already, big change from "go whistle" last week." And an equally big change from 100 Billion. | |||
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"I have an Audi with software cheat Americans have received £3000 or so in compensation because we are in e u I won't get anything Better in or out is only down to what is good for you People will never agree on this Tim xx " The UK could have passed legislation that would have got you compensation. The EU wasnt the issue here. Obama put in more stringent laws than any EU country. If you'd voted for MPs who cared more about the environment you'd have got compensation. | |||
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" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did! If 10 students take a test you think the ones who got the answers right studied and the ones who get them wrong didnt. Brexiters on this forum cant even keep up with what happened a week ago let alone put the effort into considering what might happen in something as complex as Brexit. Time and again discussion on here follows the same pattern: An opinion is made, 1 group critical of Brexit can post hard numbers, facts and back up their points with evidence while the Brexiters have the same stock answers: Brexit means Brexit, we won so get over it, just trust the negotiators, criticising the Tories undermines the country and its prospects,nobody knows whats going to happen so no point in discussing it, lets just get out and the whole thing done with. Ive yet to see a pro Brexit supporter, here or anywhere, outline why this will be a success. Do you know why? Its already a failure, you can see it in the rising inflation, declining financial barometers, the preparations for Brexodus, the overwhelming amount of unforeseen problems, the dizzying amount of u turns by the Tories and the huge amount of dissension in the cabinet. Not to mention the fact that Brexiters told us all loudly that the UK was so incredibly special and important that the EU had a weak negotiating position despite everyone who knew anything saying the opposite. Now Davis is being told how Brexit will unfold because reality has come crashing down on his head. The talks will proceed in the order that the EU decided. Britain will be allowed to discuss trade when the EU allow it. And now sources are saying that the Tories have accepted a divorce bill of up to 50bn already, big change from "go whistle" last week. Complete and utter nonsense but it's what we've all come to expect from you on any Brexit related topic on here. People who voted leave did do the research and look at the evidence available and a majority came to the conclusion leaving the EU is the better option for us. You say inflation keeps rising which is a blatant lie considering inflation fell this month to 2.6% compared to 2.9% last month. There is some hard fact , numbers and evidence for you while you just peddle lies. The success of brexit will come for Britain in the long term as we leave the EU and start to establish our own trade deals around the rest of the world. The USA wants a "very powerful trade deal" done with the UK "very, very quickly" after Brexit and Australia also want a free trade deal signed "speedily" with the UK after brexit. The UK also has a working group going with India on a trade deal which will be done after Brexit and international trade secretary Liam Fox has established a list of 27 countries worldwide who want a trade deal with the UK after brexit. This is hard fact. As for trade with the EU the Czech minister Ales Chmelar said on Monday as the 2nd round of talks began between Davis and Barnier that Britain could get a much deeper, much broader free trade deal than the recent Canada/EU trade deal. The EU is not getting everything It's own way on how the negotiations are developing (it's already been explained to you before that Britain tried to get the EU citizens rights issue settled before article 50 was triggered so it's no surprise to anyone that was given priority in the talks). On Monday the EU caved in on its own timetable and the talks are not proceeding in the order the EU wanted. On Monday talks moved onto future trade between the EU and the UK despite the EU insisting before that trade would not be discussed until a brexit bill was settled. Sources say The EU backed down on its previous insistence that talks on import quotas would not happen until the brexit bill was settled. " The new inflation figures just came out before or just after my post, and I hadnt seen it. It hardly compares with the outright lies you've told. And the inflation figures are still way above BoE targets and still outpacing wage growth significantly. The UK getting a better and deeper deal than Canada should be the bare minimum that the UK get. For a country thats in another continent thats nowhere near as reliant on the EU for trade to get a deeper deal would be a catastrophe. Congratulations on agreeing with the EU on citizen rights. You've proved to everyone that the Tories can get their priorities met...as long as they are also the EUs priorities. And the quotas is an area that matters to the EU as whether or not theres a deal that will have to be managed for the WTO. So again, congratulations when something matters to the EU and the UK the Tories can agree to discuss it and when something matters to the EU only it gets discussed, and when something matters to the UK only it gets put on the back burner. And we'll see those trade deals when and if they happen and under what terms. | |||
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 . Lol
You guys are great
Tim xx | |||
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"I have an Audi with software cheat Americans have received £3000 or so in compensation because we are in e u I won't get anything Better in or out is only down to what is good for you People will never agree on this Tim xx Germany is also in the EU and German consumers do get compensation. This is ruled by national legislation , nothing to do with EU. British government was just to lazy to develop appropriate national consumer protection . The UK could have passed legislation that would have got you compensation. The EU wasnt the issue here. Obama put in more stringent laws than any EU country. If you'd voted for MPs who cared more about the environment you'd have got compensation." | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. " No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. | |||
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"I wasn't looking for compensation Just pointing out people have views that are constructed by what is good for them There's nothing wrong with differences of opinion as long as you don't force your opinions onto others There is nothing anyone can do about brexit we are here and division will only help the opposition Tim xx" Yes and we were pointing to an example of people blaming the EU for something that was their national governments fault. Its not the EUs fault you didnt get compensation as you stated. Its your MPs fault. There is plenty that can be done about Brexit. No one knows what form it will take, the Tory cabinet cant even agree on what they want from negotiations. Theres a complete vacuum of leadership on this issue and thats what will make Brexit even worse. In the absence of political leadership and any concensus then the peoples opinions will be key to shaping Brexit. If there is a Brexit of course. | |||
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" division will only help the opposition Tim xx" Perhaps you should take that up with Government ministers. | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. " Fantastic.  | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. " UK/EU political holidays, followed by the German Election in September, means that little progress will be made. I understand that the EU finally supplied a detailed costing breakdown this week. That should make some good holiday reading in our civil service! | |||
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"I wasn't looking for compensation Just pointing out people have views that are constructed by what is good for them There's nothing wrong with differences of opinion as long as you don't force your opinions onto others There is nothing anyone can do about brexit we are here and division will only help the opposition Tim xx" 'help the opposition'? The bloody incumbents in cabinet are split, their opposites on the green benches similarly so and the EU know it full well.. the division point is a cop out, ditto when people traipse out other cliche's about the national interest and getting behind the brexit mantra.. Its a bit like the junior officers on a ship heading towards an iceberg disagreeing with the skipper and being told to stay united in the chosen course..? countries like North Korea don't have 'division' and debate, not a model that we will ever wish to aspire to so healthy discussion and different points of view especially on something so potentially big for our kids children is fine.. | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. UK/EU political holidays, followed by the German Election in September, means that little progress will be made. I understand that the EU finally supplied a detailed costing breakdown this week. That should make some good holiday reading in our civil service!" But we're just going to tell them to go whistle, right? We're not going to pay a penny, are we? | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. UK/EU political holidays, followed by the German Election in September, means that little progress will be made. I understand that the EU finally supplied a detailed costing breakdown this week. That should make some good holiday reading in our civil service! But we're just going to tell them to go whistle, right? We're not going to pay a penny, are we? " We will pay a correctly negotiated settlement fee. | |||
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" But you think everybody who voted to leave didn't do that, whereas everybody who voted to remain did! If 10 students take a test you think the ones who got the answers right studied and the ones who get them wrong didnt. Brexiters on this forum cant even keep up with what happened a week ago let alone put the effort into considering what might happen in something as complex as Brexit. Time and again discussion on here follows the same pattern: An opinion is made, 1 group critical of Brexit can post hard numbers, facts and back up their points with evidence while the Brexiters have the same stock answers: Brexit means Brexit, we won so get over it, just trust the negotiators, criticising the Tories undermines the country and its prospects,nobody knows whats going to happen so no point in discussing it, lets just get out and the whole thing done with. Ive yet to see a pro Brexit supporter, here or anywhere, outline why this will be a success. Do you know why? Its already a failure, you can see it in the rising inflation, declining financial barometers, the preparations for Brexodus, the overwhelming amount of unforeseen problems, the dizzying amount of u turns by the Tories and the huge amount of dissension in the cabinet. Not to mention the fact that Brexiters told us all loudly that the UK was so incredibly special and important that the EU had a weak negotiating position despite everyone who knew anything saying the opposite. Now Davis is being told how Brexit will unfold because reality has come crashing down on his head. The talks will proceed in the order that the EU decided. Britain will be allowed to discuss trade when the EU allow it. And now sources are saying that the Tories have accepted a divorce bill of up to 50bn already, big change from "go whistle" last week. And an equally big change from 100 Billion." That was the whole idea. Make £50 billion palatable by suggesting that it was going to be £100 billion. Remember when the so called "Brexit bill" was first mentioned it was around £50 billion but then somehow jumped up to £100 billion. Coincidence? | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. UK/EU political holidays, followed by the German Election in September, means that little progress will be made. I understand that the EU finally supplied a detailed costing breakdown this week. That should make some good holiday reading in our civil service! But we're just going to tell them to go whistle, right? We're not going to pay a penny, are we? We will pay a correctly negotiated settlement fee. " But BoJo just told them to go whistle. 
So if we pay them £50bn or £100bn, how long will it take until we get £350m a week for the NHS? | |||
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"I wasn't looking for compensation Just pointing out people have views that are constructed by what is good for them There's nothing wrong with differences of opinion as long as you don't force your opinions onto others There is nothing anyone can do about brexit we are here and division will only help the opposition Tim xx Yes and we were pointing to an example of people blaming the EU for something that was their national governments fault. Its not the EUs fault you didnt get compensation as you stated. Its your MPs fault. There is plenty that can be done about Brexit. No one knows what form it will take, the Tory cabinet cant even agree on what they want from negotiations. Theres a complete vacuum of leadership on this issue and thats what will make Brexit even worse. In the absence of political leadership and any concensus then the peoples opinions will be key to shaping Brexit. If there is a Brexit of course." Of course there will be a Brexit, the EU said themselves this week that article 50 once triggered is irreversible. The UK government responded by saying if this is an EU tactic to unsettle Britain then it has failed already because we have no intention of withdrawing our notification of Withdrawal from the EU. Also the broad outline of Brexit has been agreed upon in government, that is we are leaving the single market and the customs union. Even the Chancellor Philip Hammond who is perhaps the most hard line remainer in the cabinet accepts that is the UK position. | |||
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"So we have now concluded the 2nd month of negotiations. What have we got to show for it? We haven't agreed a deal for citizens. We haven't agreed NI arrangements. We haven't agreed a divorce settlement. We are no closer to even starting trade negotiation. No negotiations in August or September so next round will be in October. UK/EU political holidays, followed by the German Election in September, means that little progress will be made. I understand that the EU finally supplied a detailed costing breakdown this week. That should make some good holiday reading in our civil service! But we're just going to tell them to go whistle, right? We're not going to pay a penny, are we? We will pay a correctly negotiated settlement fee. But BoJo just told them to go whistle.
So if we pay them £50bn or £100bn, how long will it take until we get £350m a week for the NHS? "No one ever promised £350m to the NHS. | |||
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