FabSwingers.com forum: SNP manifesto

By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Independence for scotland

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

So for the SNP to get that triple lock mandate to reinforce that democratic mandate on having a 2nd independence referendum all the SNP need is 30 or more seats and that is a majority out of 59 Scottish seats.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Just need to make sure that the school kids are able to read it now,!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Just need to make sure that the school kids are able to read it now,!

Would you agree with me if the SNP win a majority of 30 or more seats that is a mandate for their triple lock on the mandate to have a 2nd independence referendum ?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

"Just need to make sure that the school kids are able to read it now,!

Would you agree with me if the SNP win a majority of 30 or more seats that is a mandate for their triple lock on the mandate to have a 2nd independence referendum ? "

It doesn't make sense what you have put.

The triple lock refers to future pension increases, and has no bearing on any independence

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Just need to make sure that the school kids are able to read it now,!

Would you agree with me if the SNP win a majority of 30 or more seats that is a mandate for their triple lock on the mandate to have a 2nd independence referendum ?

It doesn't make sense what you have put.

The triple lock refers to future pension increases, and has no bearing on any independence"

Lmao am not on about the triple lock on pensions

Again in the SNP 2017 manifesto it clearly says this

'' Last year's Holyrood election delivered the democratic mandate for a independence referendum. The recent vote of Scotland's national parliament has underlined that mandate. If the SNP win a majority of Scottish seats in this election that would compete a triple lock further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists.

So like i said its clear for anyone to understand that if the SNP win 30 or more seats that is a majority and will give them that triple lock mandate on an independence referendum to be held

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Apologies, the SNP manifesto does mention "triple lock" in regard to Independence.

Down here, it's taken as the pensions increase mechanism.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Apologies, the SNP manifesto does mention "triple lock" in regard to Independence.

Down here, it's taken as the pensions increase mechanism."

Cool , cool so do you agree with me that if the SNP win 30 or more seats in this UK election they will have a triple lock mandate on having a 2nd independence referendum?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

"Apologies, the SNP manifesto does mention "triple lock" in regard to Independence.

Down here, it's taken as the pensions increase mechanism.

Cool , cool so do you agree with me that if the SNP win 30 or more seats in this UK election they will have a triple lock mandate on having a 2nd independence referendum?

Yes, if they achieve that, then ask away

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

This question has been asked and answered.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"This question has been asked and answered. "

Am guessing you mean the 2014 independence referendum ? Yes your right the question was asked and answered

But are you really saying people should be denied a right to change their minds on independence ?

Do you agree that if the SNP win a majority of 30 or more seats in this UK election then they will have a triple lock mandate on the mandate that already exists from the 2016 Holyrood vote that passed 69-59 in favor to hold another independence referendum ?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

No.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"No. "

No to what ?

1. Is it no you think people should be denied a right to change their minds on independence ?

2. Is it no you think if the SNP win a majority of seats in this election will not give them a triple lock mandate on the mandate that already exists ?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

"No.

No to what ?

1. Is it no you think people should be denied a right to change their minds on independence ?

2. Is it no you think if the SNP win a majority of seats in this election will not give them a triple lock mandate on the mandate that already exists ?

Would the majority of seats equal more than half the electorate in Scotland?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

We had a vote, and over 2m voted to stay in the UK, the bar has been set.

When you get anything like that amount of support then you may have a case.

Until then it's just pointless tub thumping.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"We had a vote, and over 2m voted to stay in the UK, the bar has been set.

When you get anything like that amount of support then you may have a case.

Until then it's just pointless tub thumping. "

So your happy to say you would deny people the right to change their minds on independence?

Would you respect it if the SNP get a majority vote in this UK election that is a triple lock mandate on their mandate in Holyrood ?

Say Scottish Tories or Scottish Labour win this election in Scotland on their anti indpendence ticket to stop a referendum happening would that give them a mandate to rule out a independence referendum ?

Also

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"No.

No to what ?

1. Is it no you think people should be denied a right to change their minds on independence ?

2. Is it no you think if the SNP win a majority of seats in this election will not give them a triple lock mandate on the mandate that already exists ?

Would the majority of seats equal more than half the electorate in Scotland?"

To me thats just moving the goalposts yet again

The UK election is based on first past the post correct ? So with that means if the SNP win a majority the win the election in Scotland if people dont agree with that get on to whoever your mp will be and get them told you dont want this first past the post crap anymore

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

[Removed by poster at 30/05/17 15:35:37]

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

I would be very surprised if the snp got a majority in this UK election.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"I would be very surprised if the snp got a majority in this UK election. "

Right 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs . So you think SNP wont get 30 seats or more ? That would be a majority correct ?

Am interested to see the views of the pro union side if the Scottish Tories or Scottish Labour win on their anti indpendence ticket to stop a referendum would they have a mandate to block one ?

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

If Scotland gained independence from the rest of the UK, what is the plan for the future economy? Am I to understand no more money from Westminster and not in the EU, how does the wee dwarf plan to keep Scotland running ?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

[Removed by poster at 30/05/17 15:53:55]

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"If Scotland gained independence from the rest of the UK, what is the plan for the future economy? Am I to understand no more money from Westminster and not in the EU, how does the wee dwarf plan to keep Scotland running ? "

No more money from Westminster ? Lol

Simple answer any money raised in Scotland will stay in Scotland and not go down to Westminster for the UK government to send Scotland part of the money in an independent Scotland it will have full control over money and like said any money raised in Scotland stays in Scotland.

If Scotland is subside junkies as some people think then why oh why would the Tories want to keep Scotland in the UK so badly ?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

It would not be a majority in terms of the UK. This is a UK election and I,m not prepared to go down this myopic route of seeing it only through the narrow prism of nationalism.

Lets face it, if the union supporting parties get a majority of the votes available, not seats. What chance do you have of winning a referendum, which is a binary question?

We have seen peak nat, and its declining, every poll suggests this.

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

What industry in Scotland can sustain the people on a long term basis ? I am only asking and not criticising, I have a few friends from Scotland and they have no idea how it will work

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"It would not be a majority in terms of the UK. This is a UK election and I,m not prepared to go down this myopic route of seeing it only through the narrow prism of nationalism.

Lets face it, if the union supporting parties get a majority of the votes available, not seats. What chance do you have of winning a referendum, which is a binary question?

We have seen peak nat, and its declining, every poll suggests this."

Moving the goalposts lol

Again there is 59 Scottish seats up for grabs if the SNP win 30 or more seats that is a majority victory for the SNP in a UK election that is based on First past the post.

So seen as the SNP have put it in their 2017 manifesto that if the SNP win a majority of seats then that will give them a triple lock mandate on the existing mandate from the Holyrood vote which was a democratic vote

If the Tories , Labour get rejected in Scotland in this UK election on their anti independence ticket then they wont have a mandate to stop one.

Peak nat ? Did you not witness the council elections the SNP won the election and in lot of councils they were the largest party and strange thing the party that is so against the Tories thats Labour btw were caught out doing dirty deals with the Tories in councils just to keep the SNP out strange eh

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

"If Scotland is subside junkies as some people think then why oh why would the Tories want to keep Scotland in the UK so badly ?"

The people of Scotland made that choice, not "the Tories".

But to be fair, it was "the Tories" that gave us that choice.

Do you forget that vote we had in 2014?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"What industry in Scotland can sustain the people on a long term basis ? I am only asking and not criticising, I have a few friends from Scotland and they have no idea how it will work "

Food , drink Tourism , Oil yes oil Scotland will take back full control over oil

Yes i know and its good to know what the media wont ever tell you

Back in 2014 up here in Scotland for the Scottish referendum the pro union side said ship yards and steel works would be safe in the UK turns out that was aload of shite and it was a broken promise they were not safe in the UK.

Now the SNP had to step in and find buyers for the ship yards and steel works there is other industries , fishing another one exporting things made in Scotland and exiting Scotland ports instead of going down south to English ports and being exported as a UK product dont believe me have a look at Bell's whisky made here in Scotland yet goes down to England and exported as a UK product and slaps a union jack on the label

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

I think the uk is stronger together , the fish lady does not care about the best interests of the Scottish people she cares about her own agenda and her disliking for England , in my humble opinion

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

Your in a dream world; your oil will be depleted in about 30 years , Japan is now the major exporter of whiskey in the world

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

""If Scotland is subside junkies as some people think then why oh why would the Tories want to keep Scotland in the UK so badly ?"

The people of Scotland made that choice, not "the Tories".

But to be fair, it was "the Tories" that gave us that choice.

Do you forget that vote we had in 2014?"

Yes the Scottish people did decide in 2014 but you seem to be ok with denying those same people a right to change their minds on independence thats what i dont get that is being very undemocratic.

No i respect that vote in 2014 but it doesnt say anywhere that their wont ever be another independence referendum and just so happens a party won an election and the people of Scotland gave them a mandate to go for another referendum on independence

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"I think the uk is stronger together , the fish lady does not care about the best interests of the Scottish people she cares about her own agenda and her disliking for England , in my humble opinion "

You do know there is English born people members of the SNP and English born people believe in Scotland being independent ?

There goes that theory of SNP being anti English when they have English born members in their party.

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

And how many referendums do we have ? Carry on and carry on until you get the answer you want , who will pay for this ?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

[Removed by poster at 30/05/17 16:24:11]

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

Tourism is seasonal and relatively low paid and only in specific places, not many fat Yanks with money to spend visiting the likes of Kilmarnock or Airdrie is there.

And the whisky industry, the majority of which is owned by non Scottish companies, the likes of Pernod Ricard and Diageo head offices are not domicile in Scotland, say bye bye to the corporation tax from the likes of them.

THE salmon farming industry is another one, almost entirely owned by the Norwegians. Same applies.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"And how many referendums do we have ? Carry on and carry on until you get the answer you want , who will pay for this ? "

Right if a party puts in a manifesto to hold a referendum and the people vote for that party and that party wins the election that party will have a mandate to deliver on their polices in that manifesto

To rule out a independence referendum then its more than simple to understand one of the unionist parties have to win an election in Scotland to rule one out.

That is democracy right there

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Tourism is seasonal and relatively low paid and only in specific places, not many fat Yanks with money to spend visiting the likes of Kilmarnock or Airdrie is there.

THE salmon farming industry is another one, almost entirely owned by the Norwegians. Same applies. "

Ah so now tourism is seasonal lol So people only visit seasonal now and no one comes to Scotland out of season lol and its only people in the USA that visit Scotland now lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Lets face it, if the union supporting parties get a majority of the votes available, not seats. What chance do you have of winning a referendum, which is a binary question?

Lets face it, if the parties opposing the Tories get a majority of the votes available, not seats, what chance do they have of forming a government?

Is that a binary question too?

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By *exywoman77Couple
over a year ago

Barnsley

The point is you have no long term strategy to take care of the Scottish economy, you will have to raise taxes massively just to meet your promises,what about university fees or prescription charges ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The point is you have no long term strategy to take care of the Scottish economy, you will have to raise taxes massively just to meet your promises,what about university fees or prescription charges ? "

That's the shock that will hit home when it's too late.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

I believe that Independence is actually point 10 in the manifesto.

I think that the SNP have wised up and are fighting this GE on austerity rather than independence.

If so, it would appear that Ruth Davidson is having a bigger impact than some would have us believe. The SNP will dispute this of course but for a party founded to deliver Scottish Independence, it does seem that indy2 has been shunted sideways somewhat.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

And staying in the UK is working wonders for the economy that lets not forget money is not devolved to the Scottish government thats reversed to Westminster governments that has racked up a national debt in the trillions thats something great eh ?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"I believe that Independence is actually point 10 in the manifesto.

I think that the SNP have wised up and are fighting this GE on austerity rather than independence.

Nope its 11th

On that the reason why its so low down again their was a vote in Holyrood it passed 69-59 that is a democratic vote so the mandate is there and that wont change

This is a UK election on polices may i add Ruth Davidson single policy is to stop a independence referendum nothing else on those leaflets that are going through people's doors.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I believe that Independence is actually point 10 in the manifesto.

I think that the SNP have wised up and are fighting this GE on austerity rather than independence.

You DO realise this is a General Election?

The SNP manifesto recognises this and reflects the aims of the party on the basis of working in the UK parliament.

If you care to reflect on the manifesto for the Scottish elections (to Holyrood) you will see that the emphasis is on independence.

To put it in simple terms for you, the topic of Scottish independence is a matter for the Scottish people to decide upon. It's not a matter of issue in terms of the UK government.

From my own point of view and although I'm an SNP supporter, I have no clear idea which way I'd vote if and when there is another indyref but I cannot see the harm in giving the Scottish people another choice given the way that Scots voted in the Brexit referendum. Scotland voted by a large majority to stay in the EU and given that was what was promised at the time of indyref1, I don't see an argument against another one.

When we know the full ramifications of Brexit and should another indyref be held and the people of Scotland vote to remain as part of the UK, there can be no further argument against the Union and I doubt the SNP would pursue it.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

"Tourism is seasonal and relatively low paid and only in specific places

Ah so now tourism is seasonal lol So people only visit seasonal now and no one comes to Scotland out of season lol and its only people in the USA that visit Scotland now lol

When do you go your holidays?

As usual, your interpretations of peoples posts are remarkable. My point still stands, tourism is seasonal and the towns I mentioned and many others are not tourist hotspots and derive no benefit from tourism whatsoever.

Thanks for ignoring the foreign owned industries that you were earlier relying on.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

[Removed by poster at 30/05/17 18:01:53]

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Tourism is seasonal and relatively low paid and only in specific places

Ah so now tourism is seasonal lol So people only visit seasonal now and no one comes to Scotland out of season lol and its only people in the USA that visit Scotland now lol

When do you go your holidays?

Thanks for ignoring the foreign owned industries that you were earlier relying on."

When do i go my holidays ? Whenever i book somewhere. Just like most people they can go on holiday any time they wish in the 12 months

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

And yet again you ignore the part of my post that highlights the fact that tourism does not help industrial towns and that the industries that you relied on earlier are "foreign" owned.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"And yet again you ignore the part of my post that highlights the fact that tourism does not help industrial towns and that the industries that you relied on earlier are "foreign" owned."

I think you will see am answering your questions.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Back to the main point here that has been lost

The SNP manifesto has today clearly shown if the SNP win a majority of seats which would be 30 seats out of 59 then that would be a triple lock mandate on the mandate that already exists from the Holyrood vote that passed 69-59

Now its interesting that the Scottish Tories are once again fighting this election on an anti independence ticket of stopping a independence referendum. So if the Tories wish to establish that there is indeed no support for another independence referendum then they need to win 30 Westminster seats and overtake the SNP in terms of vote share ie the Tories will have fuck all mandate to block another referendum

And to think if they would ok another referendum those that are so keen to keep the UK union together can guess what ? ... still vote no but what its doing is denying people that have changed their minds on independence. Not very democratic but then again we all know the UK is a dictatorship and never has or never will be an equal partnership or a family of nations its all bullshit

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of course its all bullshit.Only a dribbling fool would trust Westminster.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

https://www.thinkscotland.org/files/ThinkScotland%20%E2%80%93%20SNP's%20broken%20promises%20revealed.pdf

Shows all the policies and pledges laid out in the last 2 SNP manifestos for Holyrood elections. And shows clearly what happened with each policy and pledge once they were in power. The phrases "abandoned" and "failed to deliver" feature. A lot! So its not important to them that they deliver promises made in their manifestos. Except for the one giving them their 'mandate' for another independence referendum of course....

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"https://www.thinkscotland.org/files/ThinkScotland%20%E2%80%93%20SNP's%20broken%20promises%20revealed.pdf

Does it say anything about scrapping the council tax ? Remember when in 2007 the SNP put it in their manifesto to scrap the council tax and the SNP became a minority government in 2007 and when the actually vote took place Labour and the Tories voted against scrapping the council tax and that is why the SNP failed to deliver on that does it mention that eh ?

Or how about the football act ? There was a vote and yes the Scottish government did lose that vote but can anyone tell me of those parties that voted to scrap the football act would replace it with ? Or is it just scrap it and do fuck all about singing nasty songs ?

How about fracking yes again the Scottish government lost that vote but thing is there is a moratorium in Scotland which guess what means NO fracking. Those that voted to ban fracking outright in Scotland knew fine well it could have been challenged in court but they didnt care.

And i saved the very best for last did you read who wrote that ? The one and only Murdo Fraser thats the same Murdo fraser that have never and i mean never been elected in his life by the Scottish people failed MSP that has to get in with the list vote very sad.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

I think you are not, how does tourism help industrial towns, and does the fact that two of the industries you relied on earlier (whisky and salmon) are foreign owned, and that we would not see any corporation tax from these companies if independent?

What is the basic fundamentals in the economy in an independent Scotland?

We were told that "oil is just a bonus" in the white paper, yet the first minister now says the reason for the failing Scottish economy is the decline in the oil sector.

Which is it, a bonus or the foundation?

Are we now reliant on oil, and as we know billions will be needed for decommissioning, who will foot that bill? The 5m Scots or 60m people of the UK?

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By *ighland gentlemanMan
over a year ago

Ardgay

It has suited the SC&U very well to push the polarisation of Scottish Politics.

And wee Ruth is a master at it.

She has used the fear of IndyRef2 to bolster her party's fortunes.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

Likewise the fear of the tories has been well used and manipulated by the snp, its a dirty game. Some see through it and some turn a blind eye to it, when it suits.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"https://www.thinkscotland.org/files/ThinkScotland%20%E2%80%93%20SNP's%20broken%20promises%20revealed.pdf

Murdo Fraser did not write this review, he wrote a foreword to it that's all. The review was written by think Scotland, an independent think tank with no allegiance to any one political party. You have mentioned 3 policies, this review covers all of them, it does not cherry-pick the ones they want to make a point with. As you have just done. It's there in black and white what the SNP said they would do, and what they have done. Give it a read before you blindly shoot it down.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"https://www.thinkscotland.org/files/ThinkScotland%20%E2%80%93%20SNP's%20broken%20promises%20revealed.pdf

Nah thanks anything that the queen's eleven man Murdo unelected Fraser wants to put up i will pass.

Like i said i will point out how fucked up that misleading things can be

When like i said the SNP had in their 2007 manifesto scrapping the council tax and they formed a minority government and when the vote took place guess what the Tories and Labour voted against scrapping the council tax and thats why the SNP couldnt deliver on that promise.

Now is it not strange not one of the unionist parties in Scotland can be honest enough about that vote on scrapping the council tax ? They blame the SNP for not delivering on that but will they fuck admit they were ones that voted against scrapping the council tax. Why the fuck would people believe liars ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Strange how you want to harp on about one policy and ignore all the others. Strange how you are too scared to read a document that discusses it all further. You are clearly one of the sheep. That believes everyone lies except your sainted SNP. Despite all the documented evidence on the contrary. But that is up to you. I can only hope others will at least consider the evidence before they make their minds up.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Strange how you want to harp on about one policy and ignore all the others. Strange how you are too scared to read a document that discusses it all further. You are clearly one of the sheep. That believes everyone lies except your sainted SNP. Despite all the documented evidence on the contrary. But that is up to you. I can only hope others will at least consider the evidence before they make their minds up. "

Ah the point am making is no doubt the scrapping the council tax is on that list am i correct ?

am interested to know your views do you blame the SNP for failing to scrap the council tax in 2007 ?

Anyone can look up that vote and they will 100% see that Labour and the Tories voted against scrapping the council tax and seen as the SNP were a minority government then they couldnt deliver on that promise to scrap the council tax.

But as i said strange eh that both Labour and the Tories in Scotland blame the SNP for not being able to scrap the council tax when infact both Labour and Tories were to blame for that promise not being delivered.

Also its some fucking cheek that Scottish Labour wanted to scrap the council tax when they were the ones that voted against it.

You see how misleading the unionist parties can be in Scotland what else are they lying about ?

Yes i agree lets hope people can see through the lies of the unionist parties in Scotland.

Remember 2014 - NHS , Ship yards , Steel works HMRC jobs the EU were ALL suppose to be safe in the UK that turned out to be a whole heap of utter bullshit.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This question has been asked and answered. "

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Independence for scotland

(m) replying - James I (for Scotland VI) united England and Scotland out 1 simple reason - Scotland was "bust"..no money no nothing as the gentry and the rest of the country had speculated in building in the colonies.

So please all the independent thinking Scots tell this simple British born person, who lived years abroad (speaking several languages) thus can not be made out to be a radical, explain who Scotland would survive without money "pouring in from England and Wales?

Brussels has already said clearly that all others come first before the "Republic of Scotland". Nato has declared a "no thank you". WTO and UNO the same...So will then the Republic of Scotland join Russia or sell itself out to China?

My family is roots back to the Clan without land, and I respect all who search for new ideas but re inventing something that did not work before is just stupid... But then again history is not for all and SNP has sadly forgotten what schools are here for

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Independence for scotland

Ok can i first point out if Scotland were to become independent we wont stop being British as its the British isles all that will happen is the United Kingdom will come to an end.

Again simple answer any money raised in Scotland will stay in Scotland instead of going down south for the Westminster government mismanaging the money which again i will point out is not devolved to Scotland its reversed to Westminster who are borrowing more and more and adding to the UK debt not a good look.

The EU said there would be no problem with an independent Scotland being in the EU and they did state very clear Spain do not have a veto on Scottish independence.

I suppose independence is good for all other countries but just not for Scotland.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

I doubt its going to be less than 45% some of my family and friends and even some of my wife family were all no voters and now changed their minds to saying yes to independence

This is the biggest reason why there needs to be another independence referendum as you cant deny people's right to change their minds on independence

I fully accept that yes there could be people that voted yes that would vote no but there is no voters that would now vote yes and not one them should ever be denied their right to change their minds.

To block a independence referendum when it was voted for in Holyrood is wrong and people know it. Anyone that is pro union will still be able to vote no i dont see the problem with not allowing one unless the unionist parties are afraid Scotland will vote for independence.

And on the time scale that the SNP are asking for an independence referendum to take place is not that bad either as it allows the Scottish voters to have their say on if we agree on brexit or prefer independence considering Scotland majority voted remain in the EU and then to be told Scotland will not be able to be involved in brexit talks only shows you living in the UK is a dictorship

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

Im confident it will be well over 50% we will just have to wait until we all have the opportunity to have that vote

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

I doubt its going to be less than 45% some of my family and friends and even some of my wife family were all no voters and now changed their minds to saying yes to independence

This is the biggest reason why there needs to be another independence referendum as you cant deny people's right to change their minds on independence

By the same token I know many yes voters that are now disillusioned with the SNP and say they would vote no in a new referendum. I still believe it will be a no. So lets bring it on, get it over with. Then I would not expect to see another referendum in my lifetime.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

A majority in what? They are only standing in 59 out of over 600 seats...it's a UK election! There are no elections for Scottish parliament this year where they already don't have a majority without green support.

Of course the SNP manifesto has policies (they all do). I'm English....I support Scottish independence. But it would bugger up the SNP spending plans as they would, presumably loose the billions in subsidies from the rest of the UK.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

Right 59 seats are up for grabs in Scotland if the SNP win 30 or more seats then that is classed as a majority of Scottish seats that the SNP would have won

So Scotland people are subside junkies problem with that is why the hell would Westminster then be hell bend to keep Scotland ?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

I feel utter sick watching Ruth Davidson this is why the Tories are utter scumbags

Ruth Davidson made a fucking cheap shot on why the SNP postponed the manifesto launch until today as anyone with respect would know the SNP manifesto launch was suppose to be last week but because of sad events that happened in Manchester the SNP out of respect cancelled their manifesto launch but Ruth Davidson take a cheap sad ass shot. It makes me sick that the Tories dont give a flying fuck

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

I doubt its going to be less than 45% some of my family and friends and even some of my wife family were all no voters and now changed their minds to saying yes to independence

This is the biggest reason why there needs to be another independence referendum as you cant deny people's right to change their minds on independence

Why not? You are offered the chance to change the government every five years?

You clearly do not want future electorates to have the chance to debate this critical issue, do you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This question has been asked and answered.

And it will be asked again ,it was in the last manifesto that if scotland was taken out of the euro there would be cause to ask for another referendum maybe you dont like that but it will happen

And when it is asked again and answered again with even less than 45% for independence... well here's hoping they get the message that time

I doubt its going to be less than 45% some of my family and friends and even some of my wife family were all no voters and now changed their minds to saying yes to independence

This is the biggest reason why there needs to be another independence referendum as you cant deny people's right to change their minds on independence

Why not? You are offered the chance to change the government every five years?

You clearly do not want future electorates to have the chance to debate this critical issue, do you?"

Alex Salmond himself said this would be a once-in-a-generation decision. The uncertainty, division and cost make it an exercise that just cannot be carried out over and over again without detriment to Scotland. Give the next generation their choice yes. But we have already had our turn. Brexit is an unusual situation that means we might have another turn. If that is a no then that should be it for a very long time. However sore the losers feel.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Interesting how some parties seem to fail to understand that manifesto commitments only apply if that party secures a majority and forms the government. The SNP are not capaple of securing a majority in this election as they are only contesting 59 of the 650 availablr seats.

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Interesting how some parties seem to fail to understand that manifesto commitments only apply if that party secures a majority and forms the government. The SNP are not capaple of securing a majority in this election as they are only contesting 59 of the 650 availablr seats.

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

The SNP do seem to have an over-inflated view of their importance in the UK. Demanding seats at the Brexit negotiations and all that. I have grown up in an area that is staunch snp, all my life there has been an anti-English feeling in my town. (only topped recently by the degree of anti- Eastern European feeling, seems ironic as the SNP wants to stay in the EU!). We have been left with hateful division between yes and no indy voters. And what I am seeing now with all the SNP posturing and demands is anti-Scottish feeling growing in England. Something I never thought I would see. It is all a very sad state of affairs

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

An unequal union?? Scotland has MP's representing us in Westminster. Plus MSP's in our own devolved parliament. Seems fair enough to me. Of course England has more MP's in Westmister. It's a much bigger country. I cannot think of a simpler concept to understand

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

What was it back in 2014 '' Dont leave the UK we want Scotland to lead the UK ''

Why shouldnt Scotland's government not be at the brexit talks ? Remember its suppose to be a equal partnership and family of nations but just when it suits Westminster it would appear.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

[Removed by poster at 31/05/17 01:00:56]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

What was it back in 2014 '' Dont leave the UK we want Scotland to lead the UK ''

Why shouldnt Scotland's government not be at the brexit talks ? Remember its suppose to be a equal partnership and family of nations but just when it suits Westminster it would appear.

Because Scotland is represented by MP's in Westminster. And it is for the leader of Westminster (i.e. Theresa May) to make the negotiations on behalf of her country (i.e the UK). Didn't you learn domestic politics in school?? You seem to have little clue how any of it works. If Scotland had voted to leave the UK then Scotland would be having their own talks and negotiations. Perhaps for Brexit terms, perhaps for joining the EU as an independent nation. But guess what? Scotland did NOT vote to be an Independent nation. Deal wih it

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

So you think Scotland gets treated well off Westminster in the UK union ?

Remind me again how many of the amendments to the Scotland Bill did the Tories agree with ? Scotland was promised Home Rule where is this Home Rule ? Did English mp's and unelected lords decide what powers Scotland will get in that Scotland bill ? Yet the thought English votes for English laws since good to ban Scottish mps voting on English matters yet English mps and unelected lords have power over Scottish matters yeah i see unequal union

So because of population thats ok to overrule Scottish MP's

Anyways its been good debating with you but am off to bed hope you have a lovely rest of the night and happy swinging . ps nice profile photo hehe

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

So you think Scotland gets treated well off Westminster in the UK union ?

So because of population thats ok to overrule Scottish MP's

Anyways its been good debating with you but am off to bed hope you have a lovely rest of the night and happy swinging . ps nice profile photo hehe

Scotland has many devolved powers, the SNP are failing in every one of them. I am kind of thankful there are still reserved areas that they can't mess up! But I guess that is a whole other debate...

Good night. Try not to have dreams of Alex Salmond. Even for a staunch SNP supporter that would surely be scary haha x

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

What was it back in 2014 '' Dont leave the UK we want Scotland to lead the UK ''

Why shouldnt Scotland's government not be at the brexit talks ? Remember its suppose to be a equal partnership and family of nations but just when it suits Westminster it would appear.

The UK is not a country i learned that in school there is 4 countries in the UK and two of those countries voted to remain in the EU so why shouldnt the 3 other devolved countries parliaments be involved in brexit talks ?

What that court case in Jan proved when they said the UK government doesnt need to involve the Scottish government proved the Scotland act is a piece of crap that you could wipe your arse on

Do you know if the Tories get a big majority they could use a power grab and every devolved issue in Scotland as well as Holyrood could be gone how may people in Scotland would be happy to see the Tories in full control of Scottish matters and dont say that will never happen just remember 2015 David Cameron saying on live tv that there will be no child tax credits and then they win and thats what they were planning to do is cut child tax credits never ever trust a Tory

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

So you think Scotland gets treated well off Westminster in the UK union ?

So because of population thats ok to overrule Scottish MP's

Anyways its been good debating with you but am off to bed hope you have a lovely rest of the night and happy swinging . ps nice profile photo hehe

Scotland has many devolved powers, the SNP are failing in every one of them. I am kind of thankful there are still reserved areas that they can't mess up! But I guess that is a whole other debate...

Good night. Try not to have dreams of Alex Salmond. Even for a staunch SNP supporter that would surely be scary haha x"

What devolved powers do you think SNP are failing in ?

Would you like the NHS to be reversed to Westminster or how about education ? Think the Tories would do better ? I didnt see the red cross in Scottish NHS thank fuck our NHS is devolved shame eh that money is not devolved seen as the pro union supporters keep saying the SNP should spent more but money is not devolved

Ah but wait what about the underspend money ah right is that the money that got spent on mitigating the bedroom tax that no one in Scotland has to pay for thank fuck for that underspend money to clean up Tory mess how much do people want the SNP to spent to keep cleaning up Tory mess before enough is enough ?

Oh yes What is wrong what that sexy fucker Alex Salmond ?

Would rather him that the pig fucker David Cameron or any of those toff dickheads

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Think they are somewhat confused. This is a UK wide election and not Scitland only.

Really so 59 Scottish seats are up for grabs in Scotland in this UK election if the SNP win 30 or more Scottish seats that is winning a majority of Scottish seats how hard is that shit too work out ?

What you are saying just goes to prove the UK is pretty much an unequal union so because England has 600 English seats that means Scotland elected mp's shouldnt be heard ?

So you think Scotland gets treated well off Westminster in the UK union ?

So because of population thats ok to overrule Scottish MP's

Anyways its been good debating with you but am off to bed hope you have a lovely rest of the night and happy swinging . ps nice profile photo hehe

Scotland has many devolved powers, the SNP are failing in every one of them. I am kind of thankful there are still reserved areas that they can't mess up! But I guess that is a whole other debate...

Good night. Try not to have dreams of Alex Salmond. Even for a staunch SNP supporter that would surely be scary haha x

What devolved powers do you think SNP are failing in ?

Oh yes What is wrong what that sexy fucker Alex Salmond ?

Would rather him that the pig fucker David Cameron or any of those toff dickheads"

Oh Christ. I give up. Really. This is not worth the rise in my blood pressure. Enjoy your fantasy world. I will just go along and vote, like everyone else, and hope for a decent result. Again, goodnight

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Goodnight everyone

Am away to have fun with the wife and dream of that sexy fucker Alex Salmond lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As Nicola Sturgeon is so keen to remind us of percentages (rather than actual numbers) I would remind you that in the EU referendum last year just 7.8% of all the votes cast across the UK came from Scotland.

Just thought I'd throw that in there since you're so fond of proportional represtentation north of the border

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"As Nicola Sturgeon is so keen to remind us of percentages (rather than actual numbers) I would remind you that in the EU referendum last year just 7.8% of all the votes cast across the UK came from Scotland.

Just thought I'd throw that in there since you're so fond of proportional represtentation north of the border"

So 1.6 million remain voters in Scotland dont matter ?

Yes i know about the 1 million leave voters in Scotland too but the majority was 62% 1.6million remain and i know how many pro union supporters love their majority talk

I know leave votes in Scotland will claim what is Nicola doing to respect those leave voters

but thing is what the hell has the pro union parties done to respect those 45% that voted to leave the UK ? Nothing not a damn thing was told to shut up and eat your cereal

One thing is for sure all of this is proving one big sign their is no equal partnership in the UK and its time it ended and every country in the UK becomes an independent country

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

Scotland is, as far as I know is not a member state of the EU.

And please remember, the question that was asked, should the UK (not Scotland) stay or remain a member of the EU?

We would have been out in the event event of a yes vote in 2014, it never bothered you then so why the faux concern now?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"Scotland is, as far as I know is not a member state of the EU.

And please remember, the question that was asked, should the UK (not Scotland) stay or remain a member of the EU?

We would have been out in the event event of a yes vote in 2014, it never bothered you then so why the faux concern now? "

Yes you are correct Scotland is not member state but you cant ever hide the fact Scotland rejected brexit its there for all to see Scotland voters voted 62% majority voted remain

Also you will find the Scottish government was willing to compromise with the UK government on staying in the UK and for Scotland to keep single market.

Really ? Can you find anywhere that a yes vote in 2014 would have meant Scotland being out of the EU ? Or could it be that a yes vote would mean 2 years of talks with the UK and EU are you really saying you know how those talks would have went now ? Thats like saying you know how these 18 months- 2 year brexit talks in going to go.

You will also find the EU seem to be ok and saying an independent Scotland would have no problem joining the EU that must sting same with the Spain veto myth on Scottish independence when infact their is no Spain veto on Scottish independence.

I did try and tell people the Spain veto was aload of shite as it would be foolish for Spain to veto a country that democratically votes to be indpendent

Remember the 2014 Better Together crap a no vote would mean Scotland's place in the EU would be safe in the UK what utter bullshit that was but yet some pro union supporters seem not to care about that lie

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

I showed you before, I, m surprised you have forgot.

The letter from Vivane Reding, Vice-President of the European Commission Justice, Fundamental Rights and Citizenship to Christina McKelvie, Convener European and External Relations Committee of the Scottish government where it said,

"The Commission's position on the issue that you raise has been stated on a number of occasions since 2004.

The Treaties apply to the Member States.

When part of the territory of a Member State ceases to be a part of that State, e.g. because that territory becomes an independent state, the treaties will no longer apply to that territory. In other words, a new independent region would, by the fact of its independence, become a third country with respect to the Union and the Treaties would, from the day of its independence, not apply anymore on its territory."

Now I know your interpretation of things are, to put it mildly, interesting, but there it is in black and white.

A new country by definition is not a member state and treaties to that new member state do NOT apply, despite it previously being part of a member state.

An independent Scotland would NOT automatically be a member of the EU, it would need to reapply.

And that would lead to even more uncomfortable questions that would need to be answered.

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By *ighland gentlemanMan
over a year ago

Ardgay

Scotland and the EU membership is all hypothetical as it never happened in 2014 so we will never know how it could have turned out.

We might have been completely out, we might have been kept in or some sort of interim arrangement could have been in place whilst we had the various discussions on entry.

It's a moot point because of the vote.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

It isn't moot in regards to the threat of an independent referendum on the back of leaving the EU now is it?

This is just grievance politics of the worst kind.

As I said earlier, a yes vote in 2014 would have seen us out of the EU in March last year if the white papers schedule for independence was to be believed, thankfully it was not.

It never bothered them then, so why the faux outrage now?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why shouldnt Scotland's government not be at the brexit talks ? Remember its suppose to be a equal partnership and family of nations but just when it suits Westminster it would appear.

Because it's very simple. The UK is a member of the EU. Scotland is NOT a member of the EU. The EU have said that there should not be separate representation. We only have ONE membership (UK) therefore we have ONE voice. That's the EU rules...not something Scotland is being denied by any English plot.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And no-one has ever suggested Spain has a veto on Scottish independence (but it suits some to put this argument so they can appear to counter it).

What Spain would have (though no-one knows if they would use it) is a veto on an independent Scotland joining the EU when they applied. And they would have to apply from scratch as an independent country....as pointed out by a previous poster above. It's in the EU rules and pointed out in the communication quoted above.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All the SNP sheep are undemocratic ! You lost the referendum for independence. So respect the majority, respect democracy and move on. Focus on running Scotland and restoring or educational standards to pre SNP rule! Do this for the sake of our children and country.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Why shouldnt Scotland's government not be at the brexit talks ? Remember its suppose to be a equal partnership and family of nations but just when it suits Westminster it would appear.

Yes again i will agree the UK is member state. But there is fuck all stopping the UK government bring in the devolved parliaments into the talks.

Why should the Tories do the talking for other countries in the UK when those countries reject the Tories at the ballot box ?

Like i said the Scottish government was willing to compromise with the UK government on brexit and asked the UK government to fight for Scotland's case to remain in the single market was that considered was it fuck

Remember Theresa May said no triggering article 50 until there was a UK wide agreement but she went ahead with it anyway without a mandate to trigger it. Dont believe me why she calling this election to strengthen her hand and to give her a mandate on the brexit talks funny that she already got brexit passed through on the Tory majority they have right now

If people cant see what the fuck she is doing by calling an election she said she wouldnt call is all because she knows she doesnt have a mandate and some of her own party wont pass through things like grammer schools its not hard to work out what the Tories are upto but seems some want to give them a free to do what the fuck they want.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"And no-one has ever suggested Spain has a veto on Scottish independence (but it suits some to put this argument so they can appear to counter it).

Now thats not true the media seemed and as well and pro union supporters seemed to think Spain had this so called veto on an independent Scotland joining the EU when infact its not Scotland but Gibraltar i had some laugh with that because i did try and tell people Spain would not veto an independent Scotland because if Scotland were to become independent with a democratic vote then it would be fucking silly for Spain to veto a democratic vote.

They even said Scotland and Catalonia are very different

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I want the Indy ref 2 as soon as possible !!!

If it was good for Scotland in 2014 it will be good in 2017.

There is no need to wait for brexit or anything else.

The reason I want another Indy ref is simple.

The result will be the same Scotland will vote to remain in the UK and then we can look forward to another devisive Indy ref 3 two years later.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"All the SNP sheep are undemocratic ! You lost the referendum for independence. So respect the majority, respect democracy and move on. Focus on running Scotland and restoring or educational standards to pre SNP rule! Do this for the sake of our children and country."

You do know not everyone that believe's in independence are not all SNP supporters this is the great myth the media love trying to spin that if you believe in independence that must mean you support the SNP not true.

Now the 2014 result was respect it was a no vote no one is arguing against that hell if the SNP didnt respect the vote in 2014 they would have just declared independence anyway correct so it has been respected but there is no where in the Edinburgh agreement that says there will never ever be an independence referendum again.

The SNP put it in a manifesto and the people of Scotland voted SNP and gave them a mandate to deliver on that policy then Holyrood took a democratic vote and it passed 69 -59 how is that being undemocratic ?

Force on running Scotland ? So if the SNP are not doing a good job as some might that fair enough but who would you want to see in government in Scotland then ? So far the Tories and Labour are fighting campaigning on an anti independence ticket to stop a referendum but fuck all policy on what they would do to help Scotland i cant believe people would really vote for parties that have fuck all policy but one thing to stop an independence referendum they swear down dead that the SNP keep going on about yet its the unionist parties that keep on mentioning independence the SNP are fighting to help running Scotland

The leaders tv debate with Nicola then the BBC Andy Neil interview with Nicola was on devolved issues they have nothing to do with a UK election

I dont you about you but me i wanna hear what SNP mp's would do down in Westminster in this UK election not focus on devolved issues that were voted on in the Scottish elections in 2016 that the SNP won.

Pre SNP rule on education ? Labour left schools in good nic eh the great PFI's that the tax pay will be paying off for years to come.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sadly labours PFI debacle left schools and NHS in the sh1t all over the UK. If the NHS weren't paying tens of billions in debt interest or locked into "maintenance contracts" where it costs over £300.00 to change a light bulb...then there may be enough money to treat patients and to pay staff properly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Name calling says a lot about you ,and as for another referendum there will be one and theres not alot you can do about it ,and itseems your in the minority as snp are doing just fine thats why the majority of scots keep voting for them

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

If you watched and listened to his opening line, which Sturgeon agreed on.

That's why it was on devolved issues, after all she isn't even standing in this general election, so she can promise the moon but would never be in a position to deliver it.

How did you find the V Reding letter, did it clear some things up for you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

God how boring are the SNP .....All this talk is just that talk. They are failing on the economy, health, education, transport......Oh that is enough to totally mess up and still proclaim your "Stronger for Scotland" takes self-delusion to new heights...Oh and if there is an Indy 2 i suspect it will be a No vote by at least 20 points this final time. Then all the SNP will have is there hated of the English to sustain them

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"God how boring are the SNP .....All this talk is just that talk. They are failing on the economy, health, education, transport......Oh that is enough to totally mess up and still proclaim your "Stronger for Scotland" takes self-delusion to new heights...Oh and if there is an Indy 2 i suspect it will be a No vote by at least 20 points this final time. Then all the SNP will have is there hated of the English to sustain them

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

Channel 4 fact-checker has just destroyed the SNP manifesto point out it's many flaws (The IFS have done the same)

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/the-snp-manifesto

Also points out that Healthcare spending has gone up 9.2% in England under the Tories but only 3.7% in Scotland under the SNP. Shocking

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

A great quote from the article that shows up some of the SNP's duplicity:

'It has responsibility over key areas such as tax, health, and education and social services. But the party’s actions have not always tallied with the rhetoric.

During the last General Election the IFS claimed the SNP’s plans would mean a longer period of austerity than any other party was proposing.

In government, the SNP have failed to protect services from what their manifesto calls “damaging Tory cuts”.

In some cases, they have gone along with the austerity or even gone further than the Conservatives.'

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Fair enough that people think the SNP are failing that your opinion but .....

The thing is the Scottish voters clearly say something different and trust the SNP

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

i really hate this shite about the SNP being anti English

I fully support the SNP and i have English family so are people really gonna say i hate my English family i love them to bits.

Also there is alot of English members in the SNP so this SNP are anti English is aload of fucking shite.

Pro independence supporters are anti Westminster rule and want to see Scotland government self govern and that meand have full control.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

You may not be but there are plenty in the indy movement that are anti English, a look at social media would tell you that.

They may be a minority but they are very vocal, you can't deny it doesn't exist.

The introduction of the sectarian divide in Scotland and applying it to politics is another disturbing turn that has taken place recently.

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By *ighland gentlemanMan
over a year ago

Ardgay

2 election leaflets yesterday. LibDems and SC&U. Both proclaiming in big letters that only they can defeat the SNP and that only they can stop IndyRef2.

In actual fact the SC&U one hardly mentions the party but does say that the candidate is Ruth's candidate. Her name is in the biggest boldest font!

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

Funny that the snp manifesto mentions the tories over 50 times and even manages to give the late Margaret Thatcher a name check, even though she left No.10 over 27 years ago.

Laughable nonsense.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You may not be but there are plenty in the indy movement that are anti English, a look at social media would tell you that.

They may be a minority but they are very vocal, you can't deny it doesn't exist.

The introduction of the sectarian divide in Scotland and applying it to politics is another disturbing turn that has taken place recently. "

And the same applies in the other direction.

You only have to read some of the posts on this and other forums to see how much anti-Scottish feelings exist in England.

Like other posters, I'm an SNP supporter and have family in England and, additionally, a son in the armed forces. I have no grudge against England or the English. I do, however,have a problem with the way the Tories govern the country and see the SNP as the only credible opposition in Scotland.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

The the Scottish people see themselves as better than the English?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The the Scottish people see themselves as better than the English?"

There are probably a number of traits in which both nations differ. Not necessarily better, but different.

Scots are certainly better fighters.

I'm sure the English have some benefits too. I'm just struggling to come up with any at the moment

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

When another NO vote comes out of another independence refrendum, what next, will the SNP give up on independence and concentrate on running our country?

I hope the referendum happens soon so as wee Jimmy Cranky has to resign just like her predecessor.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"When another NO vote comes out of another independence refrendum, what next, will the SNP give up on independence and concentrate on running our country?

I hope the referendum happens soon so as wee Jimmy Cranky has to resign just like her predecessor."

Some people must not know how it works

If a party any party doesnt always have to be the SNP put a referendum in a manifesto and the people vote that party into government that gives that party a mandate to deliver on there policies if the pro unionist put no referendum in there manifesto then they have a mandate not to hold a referendum thats how democracy works

Now the SNP 2017 manifesto has very much made it clear if the SNP win a majority of 30 or more seats out of 59 Scottish seats in this UK election then without any doubt the SNP will have a triple lock mandate on the existing mandate on the Holyrood vote that passed 69-59 to allow another independence referendum to happen when the Scottish people know the final deal on brexit and before the UK leaves thats democracy

Out of interest for everyone claiming the SNP are failing Scotland who do tou think would do better ? Any time i ask that its always the answer "anyone" but they cant name a party it says alot when you cant think of any party that would do better than SNP

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The Conservatives would do a lot better. Lower taxes to encourage wealth creators who provide high paid employment and in turn create additional tax revenue to spend on our hospitals and schools.The SNP have now made Scotland the highest taxed part of the UK. A stupid and very short sighted move! If the SNP had their way thousands of highly skilled and highly paid defence jobs would be moved to England.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"When another NO vote comes out of another independence refrendum, what next, will the SNP give up on independence and concentrate on running our country?

I hope the referendum happens soon so as wee Jimmy Cranky has to resign just like her predecessor."

See if you cant post without being derogatory about someone you really should shut your idiotic mouth you just come across as a bit of a clown ,see what i did there lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes I do see what you have done. Jimmy Cranky did do a lot of clowning around as does her/his reflection Nicola Sturgeon.

Who is being derogatory now!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"The Conservatives would do a lot better. Lower taxes to encourage wealth creators who provide high paid employment and in turn create additional tax revenue to spend on our hospitals and schools.The SNP have now made Scotland the highest taxed part of the UK. A stupid and very short sighted move! If the SNP had their way thousands of highly skilled and highly paid defence jobs would be moved to England."

So you think the Tories would do better running Scotland wonder how mamy people would agree with you that thinking a party willing to cut welfare and punish the poor is something to be proud of

I wonder how many think the tories cutting £30 off Esa /pip thats people that are unfit to work its fucking sick

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yes I do see what you have done. Jimmy Cranky did do a lot of clowning around as does her/his reflection Nicola Sturgeon.

Who is being derogatory now!"

Says it all about you ,i wont reply again to anything you say as your not worth it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So you think the Tories would do better running Scotland wonder how mamy people would agree with you that thinking a party willing to cut welfare and punish the poor is something to be proud of

I wonder how many think the tories cutting £30 off Esa /pip thats people that are unfit to work its fucking sick"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You may not be but there are plenty in the indy movement that are anti English, a look at social media would tell you that.

They may be a minority but they are very vocal, you can't deny it doesn't exist.

The introduction of the sectarian divide in Scotland and applying it to politics is another disturbing turn that has taken place recently. "

There has always been secterian divide in scotland it was getting better over the years ,but ruth davidson and her unionist party have just brought it all back personally i think she is scotland shame she comes across as a very bitter bigot

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We can disagree on politics but I can assure you that I am worth it. Are you brave enough to try?

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

",but ruth davidson and her unionist party"

I,d love to see evidence of that.

I,ve seen conversations on twitter/facebook that descend into "what team do you support" within a few posts. We all know the implications. This division is ugly, unnecessary and has no place in politics.

Even here, we haven't seen anyone condemn it, but the "they all do it" defence comes in to play.

If you don't confront it, it will get worse, fester, and poison the already toxic atmosphere is Scotlands political debate.

Wrap everything in a flag and it blinds you to reality, and excuses the inexcusable.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"",but ruth davidson and her unionist party"

I,d love to see evidence of that.

Even here, we haven't seen anyone condemn it, but the "they all do it" defence comes in to play.

If you don't confront it, it will get worse, fester, and poison the already toxic atmosphere is Scotlands political debate.

Wrap everything in a flag and it blinds you to reality, and excuses the inexcusable.

The evidence is that 2 tory councillors have recently been suspended for anti catholic hatred on their twitter and fb accounts ,and also her encouraging bigoted orange order ppl to stand as councillors ,that says everything about her and her scottish unionist party in my opinion

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"",but ruth davidson and her unionist party"

I,d love to see evidence of that.

Even here, we haven't seen anyone condemn it, but the "they all do it" defence comes in to play.

If you don't confront it, it will get worse, fester, and poison the already toxic atmosphere is Scotlands political debate.

Wrap everything in a flag and it blinds you to reality, and excuses the inexcusable.

Alister majury ,robert davis both suspended for bigoted tweets

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By *bi_scotlandTV/TS
over a year ago

Glasgow

SNP govt being slated for trying to hide facts from the public. An open letter has been sent to them by a number of journalists from newspapers, tv channels the national union of journalists and also, tellingly, some pro-indy writers from the Commonspace website.

Basically it accuses them of delaying and hiding information that should be available to Freedom of Information Requests (and various other failures)

It should also be noted the outgoing Scottish Information Commissioner describes the performance of ministers on freedom of information as “totally unacceptable” and “rude”. They are denying citizens their legal rights and damaging public trust in government, she warns. She has threatened them with the 'full force of the law'

---------------------------------

What we're seeing here now is a party whos arrogance in power is leading to complete disdain for the public. It's hiding facts it doesn't want us to know and believes it can get away with it. Hopefully the incoming Information Commissioner will continue with the plan to use the full force of the law. So much for transparency in govt.

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By *icklybitMan
over a year ago

Ayrshire

"The evidence is that 2 tory councillors have recently been suspended for anti catholic hatred on their twitter and fb accounts ,and also her encouraging bigoted orange order ppl to stand as councillors ,that says everything about her and her scottish unionist party in my opinion

Alister majury ,robert davis both suspended for bigoted tweets"

And it should be noted that they have been suspended, not encouraged as you say.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Alister majury ,robert davis both suspended for bigoted tweets"

And it should be noted that they have been suspended, not encouraged as you say.

In my opinion she is a bigot and does encourage it

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By *wiftieeMan
over a year ago

near Glasgow

I haven't read the bulk of your thread because I find that it's the same old stuff!

BUT, if the SNP were to only get 30 seats at the forthcoming election, then surely it would be a disaster for them, seeing as they presently have 50 odd!!!

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

"I haven't read the bulk of your thread because I find that it's the same old stuff!

BUT, if the SNP were to only get 30 seats at the forthcoming election, then surely it would be a disaster for them, seeing as they presently have 50 odd!!!

UK election coming up and its a first past the post system so if SNP get 30 seats or more they win the election in Scotland with a majority of Scottish therefore have a mandate from the people living in Scotland to deliver on their policies i really cant see how hard that is to understand.

I know the spin the Tories will use if they gain seats in Scotland they will claim they won but the the SNP will just hsve the majority of seats.

And seen as the Snp 2017 manifesto clearly says if the get a majority of Scottish seats which would be 30 seats out of 59 they will have a triple lock mandate on having a new independence referendum and also will mean the Tories policy on stopping a referendum would have been rejected by the people that would be democracy anyone that doesnt agree i would say sounds very undemocratic

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What if as many suspect the SNP wins 40plus seats.........But with maybe only 40% of the electorate voting for them........Do they charge ahead calling for Indy 2 ,when they know defeat is almost inevitable or as i suspect does Nicola delay and shout her banalities as she knows her career and possibly her party are done if she goes ahead.

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"What if as many suspect the SNP wins 40plus seats.........But with maybe only 40% of the electorate voting for them........Do they charge ahead calling for Indy 2 ,when they know defeat is almost inevitable or as i suspect does Nicola delay and shout her banalities as she knows her career and possibly her party are done if she goes ahead."

The SNP know their vote share will be down and they will get less than 50% of the vote, that's why they've come out with this triple lock nonsense (which is pretty meaningless). It's to deflect from the fact that they know they will have under 50% (and possibly a good bit under it). If they were confident at all they would say, with some justification, that having over 50% of the vote shows the country is in favour in another referendum and it's only right that they get one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So i ask again, having noted your very good points...Will she push ahead Knowing that she risks becoming like the UKIP party a relic. With the exception she has not fulfilled her protest parties only real goal... Interesting times ahead...she must have hated her bluff being called by this early election....As has Mrs May who looks very fragile as Labour looks to have taken a leap forward, despite leadership issues...

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

"So i ask again, having noted your very good points...Will she push ahead Knowing that she risks becoming like the UKIP party a relic. With the exception she has not fulfilled her protest parties only real goal... Interesting times ahead...she must have hated her bluff being called by this early election....As has Mrs May who looks very fragile as Labour looks to have taken a leap forward, despite leadership issues...

She will push ahead as it's all she cares about. It's why almost everything else they've done has been such a disaster.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

Again this UK election is based on a first past the post system where the largest party wins.

Also again there was a Holyrood vote on to have another independence referendum that was a democratic vote that passed are people honestly about to say that vote should not count ? Because that would be very very undemocratic and botherline dictatorship.

So that is a mandate and if SNP get a majority victory in this election there is a triple lock mandate that the pro union side will have to accept or again that is being very undemocratic.

things have big time changed since 2014 and people have the right to change their minds on independence denying people that right is again a dictatorship

Where is this family of nations i keep hearing about ? All i see is a UK dictatorship of a party Scotland time after time reject the fuck out of but because we are in this so called equal partnership in the UK union Scotland has to suffer Tory cuts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Can you honestly say this with a straight face? What about the first independence referendum, are people honestly about to say that vote should not count? Oh yes, you are... and yes that is very very undemocratic and borderline dictatorship. You are all so deluded and self-righteous you fail to see the irony in your own rhetoric. And I know there's no point arguing with you. So I guess I will leave it there.

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By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

It's definitely going to change the meaning of,

"Once in a lifetime"

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

So would you say a party who ignores the outcome of a vote in the Scottish parliament are very undemocratic and borderline dictatorship?

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

The 2014 independence referendum counted it was a no vote i accept that but for people to say the SNP have not respected is bullshit if the SNP didnt respect the vote they would have declared independence already but they haven't people need to see things have big time changed since 2014 and a democratic vote took place you may not like it or agree with it but that is democracy

Let me ask you this do you think the Holyrood vote that passed 69-59 on to have another independence referendum should not count ? That was a democratic vote are people honestly going to say that shouldnt count what does that say on how you feel about your own countries parliament that you wont accept a democratic vote.

Are pro union supporters really going to say they would deny people right to change their minds on independence surely not ?

Since 2014 the Better Together bullshit has been exposed as lies those that voted no on those lies have a right to change their minds no one has any right to deny them that right.

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By *inkyHnS OP Couple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

So would you say a party who ignores the outcome of a vote in the Scottish parliament are very undemocratic and borderline dictatorship?

I k now where your going with this would it be by any chance the votes on the football act and fracking ?

1. the vote on the Football act in Holyrood the Scottish government lost that vote the problem is the parties that voted against it did so and still have not brought forward a bill on what the fuck they would do so is that there game vote against it but have fuck all to replace it with yeah great idea that is lol .

2. The vote on frack again the Scottish government lost the vote but here is the think the parties that voted to ban fracking outright clearly do not have a scooby doo on that the fuck a moratorium means as it means NO FRACKING to ban it outright when its not devolved to the Scottish government would mean they would be open to a court case and prob would have saw them lose and fracking would end up happening in Scotland.

So in all no plans on a bill and acting fucking stupid to ban something thats not devolved yeah and people really want these tubes to run Scotland lmao

There is a reason whey SNP have been in government for 10 years because they have the trust of the Scottish people

If people really thing the SNP are failing then who the hell to people think will do better ? A party with nasty bastards willing to punish the poor or how about a party that abstains to allow said party to bring in cuts and have the fucking cheek to blame SNP for the cuts when we all witnessed 184 Labour mps sit on their arses and allow those Tory welfare cuts to happen aw but its all the big bad SNP fault even though the SNP mps opposed those cuts and voted against them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

It's definitely going to change the meaning of,

"Once in a lifetime"

Times and ppls attiudes change thats why we will have another vote

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

hahaha oh Christ harping on about the same old stuff, fracking and football. Because you have nothing sensible to say about any other doomed and abandoned snp promise. And as for your protestation that the snp respected the inependence referendum outcome or else "they would have made Scotland independent by now" well BULLSHIT!! No way they could, if they had tried they would be stopped in their tracks because it simply would not be legal. And that, thank fuck, is democracy in action. So instead they take the snide path, trying to massage statistics and exploit anything they think might be a loophole to get what they want. Then wonder why affronted Scottish citizens get angry at the refusal to accept the outcome of the referendum the SNP fought to hold

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

It's definitely going to change the meaning of,

"Once in a lifetime"

Times and ppls attiudes change thats why we will have another vote "

yeah. Should be "once in a generation" as we were told...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

It's definitely going to change the meaning of,

"Once in a lifetime"

Times and ppls attiudes change thats why we will have another vote

yeah. Should be "once in a generation" as we were told... "

what the SNP really mean is "until we get what we want"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shocker eh the SNP manifesto does have actually polices.

Also this is in the SNP manifesto ... If the SNP win a majority of seats in this election that would compete a triple lock , further reinforcing the democratic mandate that already exists

That democratic mandate was voted in Holyrood and passed 69-59 that democracy right there.

So there goes the pish from the pro union side that any lose in seats for the SNP would kill off independence all they need is a majority and that will give them a triple lock mandate

For anyone to argue against that would be undemocratic its like people are saying people are not allowed to change their minds on independence.

It's definitely going to change the meaning of,

"Once in a lifetime"

Times and ppls attiudes change thats why we will have another vote

yeah. Should be "once in a generation" as we were told...

what the SNP really mean is "until we get what we want""

Pls tell us what and how any other party would make a better job of running scotland ? Oh im dying to hear this lol

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

So would you say a party who ignores the outcome of a vote in the Scottish parliament are very undemocratic and borderline dictatorship?

I k now where your going with this would it be by any chance the votes on the football act and fracking ?

So in all no plans on a bill and acting fucking stupid to ban something thats not devolved yeah and people really want these tubes to run Scotland lmao

There is a reason whey SNP have been in government for 10 years because they have the trust of the Scottish people

The SNP have lost more votes than that. So basically you're saying it's undemocratic when the SNP win a vote and it's ignored but it's not undemocratic when the SNP lose a vote and then ignore it. Good to know it's double standards.

Also, I know you don't do any fact checking and stick to pro indy sites for inforamtion but the Institute for Financial Studies and Channel 4 have both looked at SNP plans and slated them. They aren't an anti-austerity party, they're the opposite. As the Channel 4 fact checker explains:

'During the last General Election the IFS claimed the SNP’s plans would mean a longer period of austerity than any other party was proposing.

In government, the SNP have failed to protect services from what their manifesto calls “damaging Tory cuts”.

In some cases, they have gone along with the austerity or even gone further than the Conservatives.'

That's pretty damning.

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

The Scottish people trust the SNP? Surely you don't fall for that rhetoric? All it means is 40-50% of the people voted for them. If they get 40% of the vote the corrolarly is that the majority of the people don't trust them. The SNP continually talk about speaking for Scotland, they don't, they speak for the % of Scotland that voted for them, no one else.

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By *bi_scotlandTV/TS
over a year ago

Glasgow

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

Yep, the 55% won. It's great

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

Seems your in the minority and yes the majority of scots do trust snp thats why they keep voting for them,maybe you dont like that but it seems thats the way its going to stay but hey you keep voting for who you think would do a better job

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

Yep, the 55% won. It's great

Yes they did win dont think they will win next time though

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By *andACouple
over a year ago

glasgow

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

This may come as a bit of a shock to you (not sure why because it's blatantly obvious) the majority of Scots don't vote for the Snp. Less than half the electorate vote for the SNP and their share of the vote is falling. I know the SNP are killing the education system in the country but basic arithmetic still holds true.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Be honest the SNP are really only good at whinge and propaganda. But i feel the tide is turning on there myopic bullshit Thay will win this election.

But i am also sure it will be there last They will lose Indy 2 heavily and...Well the party is over....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 06/06/17 13:38:59]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id say 40 or 50% is a pretty good result as will show that the scottish ppl trust the snp ,maybe it doesnt fit with the unionists but hey thats democracy the one with most votes wins

Not sure where you learned to add up but snp have majority of votes thats whey they are in goverment ,and im not sure where you get their vote is falling from prob a dodgy unionist poll ,i know you may not like it but the snp are only going to get stronger esp if tories get back in tomorow

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Be honest the SNP are really only good at whinge and propaganda. But i feel the tide is turning on there myopic bullshit Thay will win this election.

But i am also sure it will be there last They will lose Indy 2 heavily and...Well the party is over....

Do you really think that ?or just wish it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Be honest the SNP are really only good at whinge and propaganda. But i feel the tide is turning on there myopic bullshit Thay will win this election.

But i am also sure it will be there last They will lose Indy 2 heavily and...Well the party is over....

Do you really think that ?or just wish it "

I certainly believe it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh i believe it and i suspect Nicola Sturgeon does as well......She is a formidable politician but has been relatively poor in her recent interviews. She knows she has been railroaded into making Indy2 a core of her manifesto...Her party does not have the patience..or maybe the belief that they really can win. There lack of policies and good governance is going to be there undoing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Oh i believe it and i suspect Nicola Sturgeon does as well......She is a formidable politician but has been relatively poor in her recent interviews. She knows she has been railroaded into making Indy2 a core of her manifesto...Her party does not have the patience..or maybe the belief that they really can win. There lack of policies and good governance is going to be there undoing

Got to disagree i and many like me are more than happy with snp policies and the way they are governing yes not perfect but have done more in 10yrs than labour done in a 100 ,also think snp will only get stronger with more ppl voting for them esp if tories win tomorow and it will only be a matter of time before we become independent

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Done more in 10yrs than Labour in 100yrs "

Wow really ?......your that deluded, The NHS ? Minimum wage? The creation of the welfare state, Equal pay...Oh god it is too easy .Wait the SNP have given us such life changing acts as......whinge moan and worst of all the brain washing of no doubt very nice people x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Done more in 10yrs than Labour in 100yrs "

Yes really labour in scotland took the voters for granted and are now paying the price ,oh and not deluded or brainwashed just realised a few yrs ago snp are the ones who will fight hardest for scotland unlike labour or tories who do what there Westminster masters tell them to do

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By *bi_scotlandTV/TS
over a year ago

Glasgow

Dodgy unionist poll, lol. It turns out their vote dropped even further than these 'dodgy unionist polls' predicted

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