FabSwingers.com forum: Vote Labour ?

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Is thier any thing that could happen that could make you want to vote for the Labour Party ?

Personally for me I can't think of Anything , not even a bribe of a Million £

Well maybe that would do the trick on second thoughts

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A full frontal lobotomy? That might work?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is a Hobsons choice for me..........not one party represents my views on even half of what i believe in.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness."
......Gisela Stuart impresses me...a politition that talks alot of sense.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I wonder are you all labour before?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

Jc needs to show who's boss and get a team behind him who will support him.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I wonder are you all labour before?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"I wonder are you all labour before?"

Not new Labour.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness.......Gisela Stuart impresses me...a politition that talks alot of sense."

Gisela Stuart and other sensible Labour MP's like Kate Hoey, John Mann and Frank Field who supported Leave in the EU referendum should be running the party. Maybe then they could offer some serious opposition to the tories. Labour under Corbyn's leadership are a joke.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would rather stick red hot needles down my naps eye than vote for labour at any time

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness.......Gisela Stuart impresses me...a politition that talks alot of sense."

So apart from Brexit, what other policies of hers do you like?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Is thier any thing that could happen that could make you want to vote for the Labour Party ?

Personally for me I can't think of Anything , not even a bribe of a Million £

Well maybe that would do the trick on second thoughts

I thought you were a fan of devolution Mr Suit?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness.......Gisela Stuart impresses me...a politition that talks alot of sense.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Is thier any thing that could happen that could make you want to vote for the Labour Party ?

Personally for me I can't think of Anything , not even a bribe of a Million £

Well maybe that would do the trick on second thoughts

I thought you were a fan of devolution Mr Suit?"
not the labour style I'm not !

I'm in favour of 4 seperate Country's with close and friendly ties

woods maybe 5

, Sorry Bob

, let's not forget Cornwall

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Meant woods not woods

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nothing I can think of would make me vote labour.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"New leader Kier Starmer, front bench of Meg Hillier, Margaret Hodge Iain Wright and Frank Field and you may stand a chance.

Otherwise, Labour are going to pull themselves apart and spend decades in the wilderness.......Gisela Stuart impresses me...a politition that talks alot of sense.

always said Gisela Stuart be leader, even Corbyn must realise they aint going to win under his leadership.

In saying that, you do have it lucky compared to Scotland,

I mean Kezia Dugdale, does anyone take her serious, we in Scotland thought Jim Murphy was a disaster but then to replace him with Kezia Dugdale is beyond believe

Please tell me if anyone seriously believes in her as I have yet to hear of anyone thinking she is a good leader.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

So would you guys be happier without the NHS?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So would you guys be happier without the NHS? "
Nobody would !!!

And if won't happen whoever is in charge !

Tho I Soilfix be wojrtied for it if it was Cofbyn as he might half the budget and send it to Cuba !!!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Yes sorry ! Bad spelling and grammar

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So would you guys be happier without the NHS? "

I've go private. But what party has declared their intention and made it part of their manifesto to close it down?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So would you guys be happier without the NHS? "

Absolutely not, the NHS is vital for everyone in UK

I have private healthcare which I will now fund myself when I take early retirement.

Continuing on with this health care will cost me £56 a month and I do not grudge one penny.

it provides immediate consultation, CT & MRI scanning as well as surgery as and when required and in turn will should reduce NHS waiting list.

As I have said previously, I prefer to have this cover rather than sky tv, or latest mobile phone

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

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By *eliz NelsonMan
over a year ago

The Tantric Tea Shop

The privatisation of the NHS has already started!...It began with Care in the Community then progressed to GP's commissioning services, yet most GP's have no involvement in the process...

The 'privateers' will cherry pick parts of the NHS and leave the rest for the state (i.e. taxpayers) to pick up

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By *eliz NelsonMan
over a year ago

The Tantric Tea Shop

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country? "

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

The intersting thing, I find is that when asked, lots of people support Corbyn's policies, until they find out that they are his policies.

I'm guessing that this is because his critics repeatedly "play the man, not the ball".

I find it mildly amusing when people who have never actually watched him speak in parliament decide that he is somehow ineffective at what he does. It's really very easy to flip to the parliament channel if you so choose.

I think his legacy will possibly be getting the Blairite rot out of the Labour Party and rebuilding a coherent, Social Democratic party.

In response to the OP - I wouldn't vote labour as I have never forgiven them for 1997, but if they carry on the way they are going, I just might.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country? "

Unlike you I am not on it so doesn't bother me

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

Unlike you I am not on it so doesn't bother me

So you're alright then, Jack?

I'm not on it either, but it in no way precludes me from supportring the idea of one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country? "

But you forget that the largest privatisation in NHS history occurred under labour with the PFI initiative. It's why most health trusts are massively over budget..... crippled with interest costs to PFI companies...mostly Tony's Cronies.

Corbin has, of course, nothing to do with this....nor has he anything to do with setting the NHS up....

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

Corbin has, of course, nothing to do with this....nor has he anything to do with setting the NHS up...."

Of course, but his politics are much more Nye Bevan than Tony Blair.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country? "

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

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By *eliz NelsonMan
over a year ago

The Tantric Tea Shop

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

Corbin has, of course, nothing to do with this....nor has he anything to do with setting the NHS up...."

Yourselves and Jimiuk both talk sense, even Thatcher said that one of her proudest achievements was Tony Blair...At times Corbyn irritates me esp at PM's question time....Labour made mistakes in the past but is still a relatively new party compared to the Tories and Liberals and will always struggle c/o a biased and at times, corporate controlled media

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd vote Labour if I didn't give a shit about my country and it's future anymore.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

What I find strange is that when people are asked if they support policies without knowing whose policies they are, the vast majority reject Tory policies and support Labour policies. As soon as they are told which party policies they have picked and rejected they change their minds...

Guess that is the power of the media telling everyone that labour mixed market socialism is bad and tory unrestricted capitalism is good.

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Jc needs to show who's boss and get a team behind him who will support him. "

Jeremy Corbyn needs to fuck off and give the party a chance to recover, before it's too late.

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"What I find strange is that when people are asked if they support policies without knowing whose policies they are, the vast majority reject Tory policies and support Labour policies. As soon as they are told which party policies they have picked and rejected they change their minds...

Guess that is the power of the media telling everyone that labour mixed market socialism is bad and tory unrestricted capitalism is good."

Or it could be the power of sane right thinking individuals who know that labour are incapable of running a piss up in a brewery, even less so whilst it is lead by the nutter named Corbyn and his Trotsky side kicks

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"I'd vote Labour if I didn't give a shit about my country and it's future anymore."

so very well said

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage. "

don't tell the Corbyn supporting nutters that it's the conservatives who actually care for the working man. They forget how labour imported votes from Pakistan and Eastern Europe, which denys our home grown needy social housing, Drs appointments, drives up NHS waiting lists, and causes those living in the poorer suburbs to have schools dominated by pupils who speak little if any English so causing even greater pressure on schools and there ability to deliver

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country? "

I like how they created PFI, which has nearly bankrupted the NHS, I like how they took us to war in Iraq and how that twat Tony Blair continues to try and lecture us. I like how they sold our gold bullion of cheap. I like how more pits were actually closed under labour than the under one of our greatest ever leaders Maggie Thatcher. I like how labour for all of its rhetoric on rights in the workplace and equality has never had a female leader. I could go on but it would be fruitless as most labour followers are actually blind to any kind of reality

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence? "

As you love the EU so much. Which political party took Britain into the EU? You must vote for them.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"I like how they created PFI, "

No they did not, that was a Tory creation.

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?"

I don't need or neither would I join the BNP, I don't need the minimum wage. I don't use the schools, I know teachers who praise the schools that they work in as being diverse and culturally enhanced. Then they do all that they can to send their own kids to my local school which has superb results, is lacking in cultural diversity, is in an upper middle class area because they want their kids to thrive and succeed, and not be held back by socially engineered experiments driven by the elitist left who never actually take part in the experiment, but who lecture the rest of us on its merits and perceived succes

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"I like how they created PFI,

No they did not, that was a Tory creation."

You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

Why not?

The more you post, ther more you seem to have in common with them - your politics are incredibly similar. Embrace it, you already think like a BNP member.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

"I like how they created PFI,

No they did not, that was a Tory creation."

John Major created it to fund infrastructure projects, the Skye Bridge was one of the first.

Tony Blair and his cabinet then saw it as a way of delivering hospital projects without the need to increase the already massive borrowing bill, a real smoke and mirrors trick. It was like financing the NHS using Wonga.

Labour seemed to forget that they sold more housing stock and replaced it slower and less than any other goverment.

Apparently the Labour Executive meeting last week descended into a right slanging and shouting match. I know the far left adore Corbyn but how much longer can they leave him in charge?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya"

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

Are you refusing to answer by diversion?

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

Why not?

The more you post, ther more you seem to have in common with them - your politics are incredibly similar. Embrace it, you already think like a BNP member. "

Thank you for your comments, they have been processed and placed in the round brown recycling receptacle

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

Why not?

The more you post, ther more you seem to have in common with them - your politics are incredibly similar. Embrace it, you already think like a BNP member.

Thank you for your comments, they have been processed and placed in the round brown recycling receptacle "

Awwww, you do protest too much.

I'm serious - why don't you embrace the party who represents your views? It would be the most sensible thing to do, surely?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"I'm all for inviting trump here,"

And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA who had help from the Russian State to get elected?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"...

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"..."

To dream the impossible dream....

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"..."

There wasn't actually a question in there to answer was there?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"...

There wasn't actually a question in there to answer was there? "

Ah, so you mean he can't say that for all of New Labour's evil they still can't be criticised.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"...

There wasn't actually a question in there to answer was there?

Ah, so you mean he can't say that for all of New Labour's evil they still can't be criticised."

No, I'm saying that you cant answer a question if no question has been asked.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"...

There wasn't actually a question in there to answer was there?

Ah, so you mean that for all of New Labour's evil, they still can't be criticised."

Or that!

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

Why not?

The more you post, ther more you seem to have in common with them - your politics are incredibly similar. Embrace it, you already think like a BNP member.

Thank you for your comments, they have been processed and placed in the round brown recycling receptacle

Awwww, you do protest too much.

I'm serious - why don't you embrace the party who represents your views? It would be the most sensible thing to do, surely?"

Thank you for your concerns as to my political leanings, luckily I'm a lifelong conservative supporter who has seen and lived through the nightmares caused by every labour government we have had since the 70's. Unfortunately on this occasion I won't be needing your constructive advise, and thank you for your concern

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

I'll give him another chance to answer you before he gets carried away in "what ifs"...

There wasn't actually a question in there to answer was there?

Ah, so you mean he can't say that for all of New Labour's evil they still can't be criticised.

No, I'm saying that you cant answer a question if no question has been asked. "

Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points.

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"I'm all for inviting trump here,

And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA who had help from the Russian State to get elected? "

We would have been so much safer under the corrupt lying Hillary Clinton, and her I didn't have sex hubby Bill, after all we all know that having a lady giving you a dam good gobble can not be construed as having sex can it!

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm all for inviting trump here,

And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA who had help from the Russian State to get elected?

You do know that kjust because somebody isn't a fan of Trump, it doesn't mean that they like Hilary by default don't you?

How about you actually answer a question for once?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends "

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

And while we are at it, tell me how you feel about Thatcher inviting the same men into Downing Street and holding secret talks to get them not to attack Tories while telling the country that she would never be intimidated by violence and that she would never talk to the gunmen?

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

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By *inkyHnSCouple
over a year ago

The Council of Elrond

It would be hard to vote Scottish Labour as they dont exist if anyone were to look up electoral commission in Scotland for official parties you wont find Scottish Labour registered anywhere.

Try going on to sign up to be a member of Scottish Labour and it will take you to the UK Labour party.

It proves Scottish Labour are a branch office and an accounting unit of the UK Labour party they have hoodwinked the Scottish people for far too long and now here in Scotland Labour are as bad as the Tories.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century."

Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points. "

See above and add your condemnation too.

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century."

I take my hat off to her, she had more courage and determination than most men to succeed and deliver for the UK. Also best PM of the 20th century must surely go winston Churchill, who ensured that as a nation we survived and fought on during the 2nd WW

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"I'm all for inviting trump here,

And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA who had help from the Russian State to get elected?

You do know that kjust because somebody isn't a fan of Trump, it doesn't mean that they like Hilary by default don't you?

How about you actually answer a question for once?"

Surely "And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA" is a rhetorical question?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?"

You can read the released cabinet papers that record the meetings, or you can the biographies of those members of Thatcher's government involved in the talks and making the requests through back channels to open talks made the day after the Brighton bombing of Thatchers hotel.

It is now a matter of documented history.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm all for inviting trump here,

And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA who had help from the Russian State to get elected?

You do know that kjust because somebody isn't a fan of Trump, it doesn't mean that they like Hilary by default don't you?

How about you actually answer a question for once?

Surely "And who will you blame if (as is looking more likely) it turns out he is a traitor to the USA" is a rhetorical question? "

Possibly...although I can't read this post and then look at the one directly above it without chuckling slightly...

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points.

See above and add your condemnation too."

I am proud to have never voted for New Labour. Can you say the same?

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points.

See above and add your condemnation too.

I am proud to have never voted for New Labour. Can you say the same? "

I can.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"I take my hat off to her, she had more courage and determination than most men to succeed and deliver for the UK. "

Of course you do...

JC talks to people openly and you see that as bad.

Thatcher lies to the nation and talks to the same people in secret and you see that as good.

Typical right winger attitude of don't do as I do do as I say!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Dont know to much about labour in england,but in scotland labour are dead they have stood with the tories every time ,shame on them

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?

It is now a matter of documented history.

So what amuses you so much about it?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points.

See above and add your condemnation too.

I am proud to have never voted for New Labour. Can you say the same? "

I can.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Ah. But if he's so quick to point out that the fucking tories invented PFI then it's only fair to address the other points.

See above and add your condemnation too.

I am proud to have never voted for New Labour. Can you say the same? "

Clem, aren't you bi? Dont you think that these have been fairly useful?

In government Labour:

achieved an equal age of consent;

ended the ban on LGBT people serving in our armed forces;

ended discrimination against Lesbian & Gay partners for immigration purposes;

given LGBT individuals and couples the right to adopt children;

scrapped the homophobic Section 28 (Clause 2a in Scotland);

become a signatory of the Treaty of Amsterdam, which gave the EU powers to end discrimination on the grounds of sexual orientation;

banned discrimination in the workplace and in vocational training with the introduction of the Employment Equality (Sexual Orientation) Regulations;

created the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) which gives LGBT people statutory body protection;

included homophobia in the definition of hate crimes;

increased sentencing for homophobic hate crimes;

removed outdated offences such as gross indecency and buggery;

produced and implemented the Gender Recognition Act, allowing Trans people to have their true gender recognised in law;

created the Civil Partnerships, allowing LGB people to have their loving relationships recognised by law and have the same benefits as married couples;

outlawed discrimination in good and services (with no exceptions);

launched a campaign in the UN for the Decriminalisation of Homosexuality focusing on the nine countries where it is still punishable by death;

awarded statutory rights for fertility treatment for Lesbians on the NHS.

introduced the Equality Act

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?

It is now a matter of documented history.

So what amuses you so much about it?"

The amusement is at the fact that lots of evidence exists, Clem.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"So what amuses you so much about it?"

That you are so ill informed or so blindly loyal to the Tories that you either don't know or wont admit that the day after the Brighton bombing Thatcher was making overtures to and opening secret talks with the people she was telling the country she would never have any dealings with.

to be honest I find that hilarious!

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest. "

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"So what amuses you so much about it?

to be honest I find that hilarious!

Lol I'm no Tory. But I'm no new labour fool either.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?"

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively.

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

I'm normally dismissive of conspiracy theories, but the unwitnessed death of steady-as-ye-she-goes leader John Smith (a man of principles, albeit tainted by the usual loyalty to party over people)on a remote Scottish hill was terribly convenient, as it ushered in the biggest right-wing switch ever seen in the labour party: captured by big business, entranced by and supplicant to a neocon US administration and corrupted by the donations of its wealthy, favour-seeking financial backers.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Not that the tories are any better; and Corbyn, for all his efforts to resist the miserable effects of global capital running rampant over our society, just doesn't have what it takes to lead a party to electoral victory.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?

It is now a matter of documented history.

So what amuses you so much about it?

The amusement is at the fact that lots of evidence exists, Clem. "

Oh i didn't know that. But it's funny to laugh at people like me isn't it? Gives you a hard-on I bet? I see why you loved Blair so much, he hated the working class to. Sorry "hates". The cunt is still alive after all.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land."

Good post!

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Could we see some evidence for the "secret talks" please?

It is now a matter of documented history.

So what amuses you so much about it?

The amusement is at the fact that lots of evidence exists, Clem.

No. Read the post again (not mine). Grasp the correct end of the stick this time.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively. "

Chamberlain would have given Britain to Hitler. Without the Britain to launch an offensive on Europe from it wouldn't have happened.

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan
over a year ago

salisbury

"So what amuses you so much about it?

to be honest I find that hilarious!

You see how much hate is in this fool's post? Scoffing like this will never get the real left back into power only keep the workers voting tory. Sickening.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively.

Chamberlain would have given Britain to Hitler. Without the Britain to launch an offensive on Europe from it wouldn't have happened. "

Not sure he would have, Clem - although its a false dichitomy really. I'm saying that besides letting the yanks park their planes here, in terms of the actual war effort, we'd have been fucked if it wasn't for the USSR and USA, Churchill or no Churchill.

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

Being a typical leftie, I read the OP and haven't read the rest of the thread. I always vote labour and nothing would stop me doing so, apart from deciding not to vote at all. Bit of a wasted vote, but hey ho, its the principle involved for me

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"No. Read the post again (not mine). Grasp the correct end of the stick this time. "

He already answered me...

Seems he just can't leave go of the shitty end of the stick I was using to beat the Tory who claimed that Labour thought up PFI and JC did something wrong talking to the republican leadership...

Of course that particular Tory has not been posting since they worked out how shitty the stick was, but Clem, well there is always one...

Sorry Clem but you really should step away from the keyboard for a while.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Being a typical leftie, I read the OP and haven't read the rest of the thread. I always vote labour and nothing would stop me doing so, apart from deciding not to vote at all. Bit of a wasted vote, but hey ho, its the principle involved for me"

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour. "

I was out of the country at that point, but, as I said, more of a matter of principle to vote labour

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour. "

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had. "

Sorry, just popping in for a quick glance at the forums. Can't be bothered these days to get into the debates here, they get too personal .....

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

" I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively. "

Not really - it was a joint effort, with each making vital contributions.

If Britain and its allies had folded in 1940, Hitler would have been able to give his undivided attention to Operation Barbarossa. Without the assistance of the arctic convoys, Russia would not have had the chance to consolidate and rebuild for the counter attack. Stalin was as much a disaster as Hitler when it came to military leadership and, even though the Russian winter and German supply problems were crucial to halting and turning back the Germans at Stalingrad, there can be little doubt that fighting Britain in several theatres denuded Hitler of the chance to throw the full weight of German arms against a depleted enemy.

As regards USA, if Britain had capitulated, the German missile and nuclear programmes would have developed unhindered and Germany would have been able to obliterate US cities at will.

There are so many facts and even single incidents which can be claimed as pivotal - such as one heavily bombed supply ship limping into Malta and sustaining that crucial outpost's ongoing resistance - that "what if" claims on WW2 are probably best avoided.

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

New Labour was far from perfect, with a lot of legitimate problems.

But the way a lot of the left is now desperate to treat New Labour as if it were equivalent to the most vile of Tory regimes is just playing into the hands of the right.

The left should be standing up for the achievements of New Labour (and there were plenty), not rushing to drag the party to an unelectable far left, holier-than-thou position.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"New Labour was far from perfect, with a lot of legitimate problems.

But the way a lot of the left is now desperate to treat New Labour as if it were equivalent to the most vile of Tory regimes is just playing into the hands of the right.

The left should be standing up for the achievements of New Labour (and there were plenty), not rushing to drag the party to an unelectable far left, holier-than-thou position."

Exactly.

Also New Labour connected with the electorate and won big at the ballot box, in a way that I don't see wide spread support for Corbyn, and think that Labour will be obliterated at the ballot box if he is still at the helm at the next general election.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"New Labour was far from perfect, with a lot of legitimate problems.

But the way a lot of the left is now desperate to treat New Labour as if it were equivalent to the most vile of Tory regimes is just playing into the hands of the right.

The left should be standing up for the achievements of New Labour (and there were plenty), not rushing to drag the party to an unelectable far left, holier-than-thou position."

Not really. New Labour were not left, they were an infiltration of the Labour Party by the right.

The Labour party has never been far left - they are social democrats. Possibly perception could be skewed by the shift of mainstream politics in general to the right.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had. "

Tony Blair was not a Labour leader, he was the leader of New Labour.

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

"New Labour was far from perfect, with a lot of legitimate problems.

But the way a lot of the left is now desperate to treat New Labour as if it were equivalent to the most vile of Tory regimes is just playing into the hands of the right.

The left should be standing up for the achievements of New Labour (and there were plenty), not rushing to drag the party to an unelectable far left, holier-than-thou position.

Not really. New Labour were not left, they were an infiltration of the Labour Party by the right.

The Labour party has never been far left - they are social democrats. Possibly perception could be skewed by the shift of mainstream politics in general to the right. "

Thank goodness the socialist workers were still selling their papers in Brixton today ... and there was one love at the Wailers gig last night. Restores my faith in human nature ...

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"New Labour was far from perfect, with a lot of legitimate problems.

But the way a lot of the left is now desperate to treat New Labour as if it were equivalent to the most vile of Tory regimes is just playing into the hands of the right.

The left should be standing up for the achievements of New Labour (and there were plenty), not rushing to drag the party to an unelectable far left, holier-than-thou position.

Not really. New Labour were not left, they were an infiltration of the Labour Party by the right.

The Labour party has never been far left - they are social democrats. Possibly perception could be skewed by the shift of mainstream politics in general to the right.

Thank goodness the socialist workers were still selling their papers in Brixton today ... and there was one love at the Wailers gig last night. Restores my faith in human nature ..."

You could quite accurately describe the SWP as the far left, bless 'em.

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By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow

"The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land."

Didn't we decide our own future,

in a democratic vote,two and a half years ago.

Wasn't that democracy.

If it was all about our values,and democracy.

You would already have accepted the will of the majority.

You say according to our VALUES,

And it's all about DEMOCRACY,

Even though your post clearly shows,

you have no regard,

nor respect,for either.

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

"The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land.

Didn't we decide our own future,

in a democratic vote,two and a half years ago.

Wasn't that democracy.

If it was all about our values,and democracy.

You would already have accepted the will of the majority.

You say according to our VALUES,

And it's all about DEMOCRACY,

Even though your post clearly shows,

you have no regard,

nor respect,for either.

Your logic must be severely askew if you can contort yourself to come to that bonkers conclusion.

Are you suggesting that we should only be allowed a vote on our own future every 300 years?

It must be a happy place, trapped within the psychological embrace of Stockholm syndrome.

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By *leasure domMan
over a year ago

Edinburgh

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had. "

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?"

If that's how you chose to view it that's fine, I look at other things, like tax credits, pension credit, the LGBT measures mentioned above, new schools, limits to class sizes, massive investment in the NHS, cuts to waiting times, peace in northern Ireland, devolutions, house of Lords reform, minimum wage, independence of the MPC, etc etc.

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land.

Didn't we decide our own future,

in a democratic vote,two and a half years ago.

Wasn't that democracy.

If it was all about our values,and democracy.

You would already have accepted the will of the majority.

You say according to our VALUES,

And it's all about DEMOCRACY,

Even though your post clearly shows,

you have no regard,

nor respect,for either.

Which system is the most democratic? How would you rate the UK against it?

My vote in the UK counts if more people in my area votes for them. But that is one seat. In the Netherlands it's proportional representative. I know if a certain percentage votes like me, they get a seat. My vote counts more in the second system.

In a two party system you know if you don't vote for the two main parties your vote could be lost. So would you vote for a minority party even if it probably won't count?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things? "

Are the poorest voting for labour? We should ask ourselves why not. If they vote Tories they're voting for a dream. Their policies are pro business. So if you have money you will not be affected much.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Who agrees that to keep the rich rich you have to oppress the poor?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Most of the posts on here point to one thing.

Labour and their supporters are full of in fighting, blame, finger pointing and it's going to take a long time for them to appeal to middle England again.

Should Mrs May get a half decent Brexit deal and Corbyn is still leader at the next GE, Labour could well be so seriously diminished that they will cease to effectively exist for years to come.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively. "

With out a shadow of doubt, the Americans certainly helped, that's why we were still paying for lend lease 50+ yrs later

But let's not forget, we stood alone for a very long time, and it was Churchills Drive and leadership that helped us through it.

The Yanks only joined the party because the Japanese desecrated the Pacific fleet at pearl harbour

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things? "

Whilst your at it look at all of the major social housing estates, built under a conservative government, housing poorer individuals, the right to buy done under the conservatives which allowed those who had rented their home and looked after it, the right to buy it

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Ok, so you wouldn't vote Labour, but you like the things that they create?

How about something more recent, like the minimum wage. Would you prefer we didn't have that in this country?

It was the Tories who increased the minimum wage upto the current living wage.

Why not just join the BNP and be done with it?

Why not?

The more you post, ther more you seem to have in common with them - your politics are incredibly similar. Embrace it, you already think like a BNP member.

Thank you for your comments, they have been processed and placed in the round brown recycling receptacle

Awwww, you do protest too much.

I'm serious - why don't you embrace the party who represents your views? It would be the most sensible thing to do, surely?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively.

With out a shadow of doubt, the Americans certainly helped, that's why we were still paying for lend lease 50+ yrs later

Ncentrated on Japan !But let's not forget, we stood alone for a very long time, and it was Churchills Drive and leadership that helped us through it.

The Yanks only joined the party because the Japanese desecrated the Pacific fleet at pearl harbour "
And even then only because Hitler officially declared War on them !

If he hadn't the Yanks most probably would just have co

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"You seem to have skipped over my other points, but hey that a lefty for ya

Yep and your a typical Tory blame the left for the shit you think up and then when claim that anyone who picks you up on your lie is not addressing the issues you raise.

Bet you support May inviting Donald the Fart here too...

I'm all for inviting trump here, just like a Corbyn invited and lauded over his murderous IRA friends

Well as you want to carry on...

Of course you are nearly correct about JC inviting IRA to Parliament. Except that they were not IRA, they were PIRA, but as usual with a Tory accuracy is not a strong suit.

You now have a chance to show how even handed you are, lets hear how disgusted you are at being lied to by the greatest Tory leader and PM of the 20th Century.

Churchill was pretty good, that winning the war thing work out pretty good for us.

I'm not sure that you can give Churchill any credit for winning WW2, to be honest.

What makes you say that? Do you think we'd have done better with Chamberlain?

No, Clem.

I'm surprised at you, you are normally able to think more widely than that.

I think most of the credit for us having won WW2 can go to Uncles Sam and Joe, respectively.

With out a shadow of doubt, the Americans certainly helped, that's why we were still paying for lend lease 50+ yrs later

Ncentrated on Japan !But let's not forget, we stood alone for a very long time, and it was Churchills Drive and leadership that helped us through it.

The Yanks only joined the party because the Japanese desecrated the Pacific fleet at pearl harbour And even then only because Hitler officially declared War on them !

If he hadn't the Yanks most probably would just have co"
meant to say the Yanks would have just concentrated on Japan

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you? "
Some do ! The same as some in Labour don't !

You can't tar a whole group with the same brush , theirs good and bad eggs in all groups ! Surely ?

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you? "

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?"
carefull ? Yul upset the lefties

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner? carefull ? Yul upset the lefties

Honestly? Most lefties ignore the politics forum .....

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow

"The new labour conspiracy was the most cynical and corrupt power grab in modern political history.

Tony Blair 666 is the classic snake oil salesman and those who voted for the psycopath should be asking themselves some serious questions.

Which is why we in Scotland want to decide our own future, according to OUR values. It's not about nationalism - it's all about democracy.

Anyone who thinks that Westminster is representative of a proper, functioning democracy is living in cloud cuckoo land.

Didn't we decide our own future,

in a democratic vote,two and a half years ago.

Wasn't that democracy.

If it was all about our values,and democracy.

You would already have accepted the will of the majority.

You say according to our VALUES,

And it's all about DEMOCRACY,

Even though your post clearly shows,

you have no regard,

nor respect,for either.

Your logic must be severely askew if you can contort yourself to come to that bonkers conclusion.

Are you suggesting that we should only be allowed a vote on our own future every 300 years?

It must be a happy place, trapped within the psychological embrace of Stockholm syndrome."

Unsurprisingly you reply,

with a typical nationalist rant.

I know it's all you've got,

But in the big,real,grown-up world,

It's seldom considered a credible response.

At no point did I make any suggestions,

on Any kind of timescale.

Although I'm almost certain Alex,and Nicola,did mention a timescale.

Both saying,The Scottish referendum,

would be a once in a lifetime event.

Showing them both to be completely untrustworthy,

And dishonest.

Let's face it,

It would take a complete cretin,

To believe anything they now say.

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence? "

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"I like how they created PFI,

No they did not, that was a Tory creation."

One of the self acclaimed greatest accomplishments of Labour between 1997 and 2008 is all the new hospitals they built.

In a report by Allison Pollock in 2005, "NHS Plc: The Privatisation of Our Health Care", she recalls a meeting with the then Chancellor of the Exchequer Gordon Brown who could not provide a rationale for PFI other than to "declare repeatedly that the public sector is bad at management, and that only the private sector is efficient and can manage services well." So even Gordon Brown and Labour back then were promoting Privatisation of the NHS.

Over 100 of those new hospitals were built under PFI agreements instigated by and signed by Labour. Agreements that are now financially strangling the NHS.

For example, Barts in London has to pay out £2,000,000 a week in PFI interest payments before even one patient is seen. Their hospital was built at a cost of £1 Billion, yet they will pay £7 Billion for it.

PFI agreements signed by Labour added about £60 Billion of assets to the UK..... At a cost to the taxpayer of well in excess of £300 Billion over 35 years.

And look at how many of those PFI holdings are based in offshore tax havens.

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?"

National living wage is better for the workers.

Cuts to benefits including disability benefits and in work benefits hits the poorest in society, don't forget that these cuts were so savage even in the minister in charge could no longer handle it and resigned in protest.

Raises in VAT disproportionately affect the poor as it's not related to the ability to pay.

Cuts to services again disproportionately affect the poorest in society because they are most likely to rely upon them.

Surely this isn't new information to you, you must have known this all the time that you have supported the Tories?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

NATO has protected its members from external agression and the EU has ensured peace and co-operation between members.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

NATO has protected its members from external agression and the EU has ensured peace and co-operation between members. "

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?

National living wage is better for the workers.

Raises in VAT disproportionately affect the poor as it's not related to the ability to pay.

Cuts to services again disproportionately affect the poorest in society because they are most likely to rely upon them.

Surely this isn't new information to you, you must have known this all the time that you have supported the Tories? "

So you are happy advocating Labour's "Viv Nicholson" attitude to running the country?

One that inevitably means the country running up a huge deficit and then taking years to pay back?

I was brought up to respect that "things have to be paid for".

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *ammskiMan
over a year ago

lytham st.annes

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

NATO has protected its members from external agression and the EU has ensured peace and co-operation between members. "
You never say anything different though,EU this and EU that every day you spout the same shit,we are leaving the EU,so they can't help us,not that they ever did

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?

National living wage is better for the workers.

Raises in VAT disproportionately affect the poor as it's not related to the ability to pay.

Cuts to services again disproportionately affect the poorest in society because they are most likely to rely upon them.

Surely this isn't new information to you, you must have known this all the time that you have supported the Tories?

So you are happy advocating Labour's "Viv Nicholson" attitude to running the country?

One that inevitably means the country running up a huge deficit and then taking years to pay back?

I was brought up to respect that "things have to be paid for"."

I too was brought up to respect that things have to paid for. I wasn't brought up however to believe that you need to give the poorest and most vulnerable in society a good kicking every day.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?"

Careful, you are asking the leftards to think rationally

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

I'm not sure you can call yourself "left" of anything if you voted for New Labour.

Labour is not going to get anywhere if people keep trashing the most popular and successful leader they have ever had.

New labour - Thatcher's greatest legacy.

It's quite an endorsement, eh?

Do you think that the poorest in society would be better off today without those things?

You are not really suggesting that the Tories care about the poor are you?

So when the National Living Wage increases, who does that benefit? The wage earner or the nasty capitalist business owner?

National living wage is better for the workers.

Raises in VAT disproportionately affect the poor as it's not related to the ability to pay.

Cuts to services again disproportionately affect the poorest in society because they are most likely to rely upon them.

Surely this isn't new information to you, you must have known this all the time that you have supported the Tories?

So you are happy advocating Labour's "Viv Nicholson" attitude to running the country?

One that inevitably means the country running up a huge deficit and then taking years to pay back?

I was brought up to respect that "things have to be paid for".

I too was brought up to respect that things have to paid for. I wasn't brought up however to believe that you need to give the poorest and most vulnerable in society a good kicking every day. "

I've not seen or heard of anybody who goes out and kicks the poor on a daily basis

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"I've not seen or heard of anybody who goes out and kicks the poor on a daily basis"

Really???

So you don't think that cutting benefits to sick and disabled to fund tax cuts of the for the wealthiest is kicking the poor? And of course the homeless in Stoke are not attacked and kicked by d*unken yobs on a regular basis because Stoke is such a paradise it does not have any homeless. I guess that only happens in very other city and town where there are homeless visible on the streets.

Or could it be that you refuse to see what is right in front of you?

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"I've not seen or heard of anybody who goes out and kicks the poor on a daily basis

Really???

Or could it be that you refuse to see what is right in front of you?"

The way the quote was delivered was in a manner that suggests normal right thinking honest individuals go out and kick the homeless and needy for pleasure

I'm OK Jack I have multiple properties I vote conservative, but I still have no wish to beat those who need help

I still have no wish to take money away from genuine claimants, but I do sincerely think that many claiming benefits do so because its the easy option

And yeah Iknow that Stoke like lots of city's has an undesireable section of the community, it also has terrorists drug dealers murderers pimps rapists and all of the other types of criminals. But I like many stop to talk and engage with elderly and homeless.

Being a thoughtless uncaring individual I chose to take a guy who lives on the streets in to restaurant for meal on Friday whilst my mates nipped in to the next bar on our Friday afternoon out

I choose to help vulnerable people from lots of the sectors of society as so many right wing conservative voting peeps do. But you obviously think that if a person votes to leave the EU, doesn't support labour and wants to see benefits correctly focused and delivered, is uncaring and xenophobic, unfortunately your wrong on so many fronts, but I'm sure you will disagree

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By *awandOrderCouple
over a year ago

SW London

"I've not seen or heard of anybody who goes out and kicks the poor on a daily basis

Really???

Or could it be that you refuse to see what is right in front of you?

The way the quote was delivered was in a manner that suggests normal right thinking honest individuals go out and kick the homeless and needy for pleasure

I'm OK Jack I have multiple properties I vote conservative, but I still have no wish to beat those who need help

I still have no wish to take money away from genuine claimants, but I do sincerely think that many claiming benefits do so because its the easy option

Being a thoughtless uncaring individual I chose to take a guy who lives on the streets in to restaurant for meal on Friday whilst my mates nipped in to the next bar on our Friday afternoon out

Buying a homeless person a meal perpetuates the problematical. It is a Dickensian way if dealing with poverty ... pat the little hugger on the head, and keep things status quo. Its a great way of kicking someone when they. are down and keeping them down.

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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

NATO has protected its members from external agression and the EU has ensured peace and co-operation between members. "

I really must have been imagining things when I thought you sauce EU had protected us from war in Europe and Russian aggression for 70 years.... And continues protect us from Russian aggression.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"So people seem to like the NHS, and the minimum wage, how about NATO. Labour signed us up to NATO, has thay been good for our defence?

I'm certain you've said before that its the EU, not NATO, that has been responsible for peace for the last 70 years!

And being so anti-Tory, which party was it that took the UK into the EU?

NATO has protected its members from external agression and the EU has ensured peace and co-operation between members.

I really must have been imagining things when I thought you sauce EU had protected us from war in Europe and Russian aggression for 70 years.... And continues protect us from Russian aggression."

You will struggle to find a quote where I have said that.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By *oorland2Couple
over a year ago

Stoke

"I've not seen or heard of anybody who goes out and kicks the poor on a daily basis

Really???

Or could it be that you refuse to see what is right in front of you?

The way the quote was delivered was in a manner that suggests normal right thinking honest individuals go out and kick the homeless and needy for pleasure

I'm OK Jack I have multiple properties I vote conservative, but I still have no wish to beat those who need help

I still have no wish to take money away from genuine claimants, but I do sincerely think that many claiming benefits do so because its the easy option

Being a thoughtless uncaring individual I chose to take a guy who lives on the streets in to restaurant for meal on Friday whilst my mates nipped in to the next bar on our Friday afternoon out

Next time I will walk on by, not stop to share a meal ,not stop and engage in some conversation, as by doing so I am ensuring that the guy remains on the street

I won't continue to donate to the NSPCC as they perpetuates child cruelty

I won't help SOGB as they does not help people who are intellectually and mentally challenged as that does not address there issues, and helping them to have meaningful fulfilling days out is a selfish act

I won't help out at soup kitchens as that is not helping the homeless to get a warm meal on a freezing night and only perpetuates the housing crisis and mental health issues that the nation faces

I won't collect toys clothes and household goods and arrange for 10 vans to deliver the collected items to those affected by the floods as that does not address climate change

Or may be I will continue to help and assist where and when I can as that is a more caring and thoughtful thing to do than to walk on by and do nothing