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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now "There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister. I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum. | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister.
I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum. "As long as it comes out of thier budget  | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister.
I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum.
As long as it comes out of thier budget "I don't think she actually said no. Like all politicians, she never gave a direct answer. | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister.
I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum. "True words the SNP might very well have been hoping that Teresa May would make this decision, it is absolutely perfect for the SNP this weekend as they hold their Conference in Aberdeen. The Vote will take place this Wednesday coming and it should easily be passed even with Labour & Lib Dems backing the Tories. Never thought Scotland would ever see a day when Labour & Tories walk hand in hand, great news for Scottish Tories and its the continued downfall of Scottish Labour. Teresa May has just walked into SNP honey trap which will make interesting weeks ahead, She has unknowingly built more support for Scottish Independence today | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now "You obviously do not know the minds of the SNP, this is exactly what they were hoping for | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister.
I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum.
As long as it comes out of thier budget " | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. " Keep up Mercury; what do you think the honey trap is, that we have all been talking about, the one she fell into at lunchtime. You are aware that your PM of the UK has raised more backing today for Scottish independence than could be wished for by SNP, May has worked wonders for them, perfect timing too for Aberdeen this weekend  | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. Keep up Mercury; what do you think the honey trap is, that we have all been talking about, the one she fell into at lunchtime. You are aware that your PM of the UK has raised more backing today for Scottish independence than could be wished for by SNP, May has worked wonders for them, perfect timing too for Aberdeen this weekend "And I'm pleased for you but you still won't get a referendum until 2021. No matter how much posturing and mischief making the SNP does, Scotland will be taken out of the,EU along with the rest of the UK. Sturgeon knows that once out of the EU, it could take a very long time to get back in again. Hence, this is a "all or nothing" gamble by her. | |||
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"why are you pleased?????? " If you want to play political games, then fine. I have nothing against the Scottish people, no finer people to have at your back in a fight, but they are part of the UK and have yet to put forward any credible reasons why they are more special than anyone else. I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable | |||
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"why are you pleased?????? If you want to play political games, then fine. I have nothing against the Scottish people, no finer people to have at your back in a fight, but they are part of the UK and have yet to put forward any credible reasons why they are more special than anyone else. I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable" I do believe the people of Scotland will force May's hand, and it will not be the date you think, It will be sooner. You should be telling David Davis that Politics are not a game . think about it  | |||
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"why are you pleased?????? If you want to play political games, then fine. I have nothing against the Scottish people, no finer people to have at your back in a fight, but they are part of the UK and have yet to put forward any credible reasons why they are more special than anyone else. I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable" if the head of the EU came out and said the UK cannot have a referendum last year and he's gona ignore it how do you think that would gone down with the British people? That's what may just done to the Scots instead of assuring them that independence is not the right thing she played dictator and like it or not Scotland is a country that decision is gona come back to bite her ...the more sturgeon push and fight and the more may push back will increase the devide and decrease confidence and the value of the pound in the uk | |||
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"............... I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable" And it is EXACTLY THAT kind of attitude that will guarantee that Scotland will be an independant nation - on their timetable and on their terms. Prime Minsiter May is en route to becoming a person who history will judge appallingly. What a Legacy... Exit from the EU without a plan Scotlands aggressive exit from the UK The loss of N Ireland from the Union And amongst all that - years and years of economic chaos because she refused to pick the best people to negotiate our Brexit and instead chose those who had the most hardened attitudes against the EU. | |||
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"............... I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable And it is EXACTLY THAT kind of attitude that will guarantee that Scotland will be an independant nation - on their timetable and on their terms. Prime Minsiter May is en route to becoming a person who history will judge appallingly. What a Legacy... Exit from the EU without a plan Scotlands aggressive exit from the UK The loss of N Ireland from the Union And amongst all that - years and years of economic chaos because she refused to pick the best people to negotiate our Brexit and instead chose those who had the most hardened attitudes against the EU. " One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world | |||
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"............... One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world" I live in the real world and I know a lot of Scots... All (bar one) resent immensely the way that they are viewed and treated by Westminster. Just think back a year ago as to how outraged Brexiters were at being told what they could and should be doing by world leaders, economists, heads of big business etc etc. Just why (in the real world) do you suppose Scots are going to take your kind of words any differently? Being in the real world and all that... | |||
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"I don't have any problem with Scotland having another referendum, quite the opposite and it's obvious that the SNP wanted may to say no. The problem is the SNP playing political games by wanting to scedual a vote at a time when it will cause the most conflict with what will be going on at that time. Let them have one now and get it out of the way "Well if you wen't going to listen to them when they tried playing nice... then maybe they finally got a reaction you they played nasty... may have gotten this situation with the scottish government wrong right from the point when she entered no.10.... she was more focused on looking after here tory people down south than she ever was looking after people up north... the couple of speeches she has made with regard to relooking atthe roles of devolved governments post brexit and not giving them any new power and keeping it all at westminster was the first shots that started all this... her legacy will be the break up of the union.... | |||
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"............... I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable And it is EXACTLY THAT kind of attitude that will guarantee that Scotland will be an independant nation - on their timetable and on their terms. Prime Minsiter May is en route to becoming a person who history will judge appallingly. What a Legacy... Exit from the EU without a plan Scotlands aggressive exit from the UK The loss of N Ireland from the Union And amongst all that - years and years of economic chaos because she refused to pick the best people to negotiate our Brexit and instead chose those who had the most hardened attitudes against the EU. One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world" Can I ask you what you thought of Obama coming to the UK and telling us if we left the EU the UK would be 'at the end of the queue'. I think a lot of people found that offensive. Same applies to May and Scotland. | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now " | |||
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"............... I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable And it is EXACTLY THAT kind of attitude that will guarantee that Scotland will be an independant nation - on their timetable and on their terms. Prime Minsiter May is en route to becoming a person who history will judge appallingly. What a Legacy... Exit from the EU without a plan Scotlands aggressive exit from the UK The loss of N Ireland from the Union And amongst all that - years and years of economic chaos because she refused to pick the best people to negotiate our Brexit and instead chose those who had the most hardened attitudes against the EU. One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world Can I ask you what you thought of Obama coming to the UK and telling us if we left the EU the UK would be 'at the end of the queue'. I think a lot of people found that offensive. Same applies to May and Scotland." As much as I liked and respected Obama I think he should have kept his mouth shut and his nose out of it, but instead he tried to dictate and tell us what is good for UK, which was 1 more reason to vote leave. And leave we will and hopefullly very quickly, whilst showing 2 fingers to all those who doubted that we could and would do it. The EU isn't some promised land most of it is broke or piss poor, we have as many if not more opertunities outside of the EU as we ever had inside it Be brace be strong be confident and we we will succeed | |||
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"............... I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable And it is EXACTLY THAT kind of attitude that will guarantee that Scotland will be an independant nation - on their timetable and on their terms. Prime Minsiter May is en route to becoming a person who history will judge appallingly. What a Legacy... Exit from the EU without a plan Scotlands aggressive exit from the UK The loss of N Ireland from the Union And amongst all that - years and years of economic chaos because she refused to pick the best people to negotiate our Brexit and instead chose those who had the most hardened attitudes against the EU. One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world Can I ask you what you thought of Obama coming to the UK and telling us if we left the EU the UK would be 'at the end of the queue'. I think a lot of people found that offensive. Same applies to May and Scotland." It's actually Spain who are now saying Scotland will be at the back of the queue to join the EU if Scotland votes for independence. | |||
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"Now is not the time, the people of Scotland have the right to see what is or is not on the table for offer. The timing put forward by the SNP is good. If Tories cannot cope with Brexit and ScotRef at same time, then, should they really be in power!!!!! . God forbids a war breaks out, what will they say, wait, you cant have a war just now, we are busy with brexit, lol . its all a big joke" luckily for corbyn and his supporters they only have to concentrate on breathing out, as there lungs are filled by atmospheric pressure at 1014mbar, other wise they would keel over having to do more than 1 task at once. I hope Scotland do vote to leave, they are a burden on England and bring very little to the party | |||
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"Fabio, May is also talking to the over 2 million Scots that voted to stay in the UK. Why is that vote not being respected? With a turnout of 85% Scotland said no, it was a decisive result. And we knew full well the likelihood of an upcoming EU vote prior to the independence referendum." ... | |||
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"............... One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world I live in the real world and I know a lot of Scots... All (bar one) resent immensely the way that they are viewed and treated by Westminster. Just think back a year ago as to how outraged Brexiters were at being told what they could and should be doing by world leaders, economists, heads of big business etc etc. Just why (in the real world) do you suppose Scots are going to take your kind of words any differently? Being in the real world and all that..." It was the Supreme court who ruled that Scotland wouldn't get a say on Brexit. The Supreme court judges ruled unanimously that the devolved Parliaments wouldn't get a say, and they said Westminster and Westminster Parliament alone must decide on Brexit. It seems that Nicola Sturgeon doesn't like the ruling of the Supreme court, which is the highest court in the land. Nicola Sturgeon should respect the law and respect the Supreme court ruling, if she wants an indy ref 2 then fine, but it can only come after Brexit is complete. The UK voted as a whole to leave the EU so that is what will happen. Once Brexit is complete then Sturgeon can have her referendum, and this is what Teresa May and the government seem to be indicating. Polls in Scotland also suggest a majority of Scots don't want another referendum at this time and Teresa May is also saying now is not the time for another referendum. | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. " No, we'll have the referendum when OUR parliament decides, not some English PM who has been elected to the job by precisely 0 voters. Well done tory strategists, you just don't understand Scotland one little bit.... which is about as much as you care about our best interests (though you love the plundered oil which was transferred to wastemonster coffers to fund growth in the south east). | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. No, we'll have the referendum when OUR parliament decides, not some English PM who has been elected to the job by precisely 0 voters. Well done tory strategists, you just don't understand Scotland one little bit.... which is about as much as you care about our best interests (though you love the plundered oil which was transferred to wastemonster coffers to fund growth in the south east)." I think you will find the growth in the south east was built in service industries like banking and insurance | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. No, we'll have the referendum when OUR parliament decides, not some English PM who has been elected to the job by precisely 0 voters. Well done tory strategists, you just don't understand Scotland one little bit.... which is about as much as you care about our best interests (though you love the plundered oil which was transferred to wastemonster coffers to fund growth in the south east)." We had a Scottish Prime minister, Gordon Brown, who was elected by precisely 0 voters. Were you complaining about this or is it only English Prime Ministers you have a problem with?  | |||
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"You sure about 0 votes? Maidenhead 2015 General Election result, Theresa May Con 35,453 65.8%. " As MP, but not as PM | |||
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"Teresa Mare is morphing into a Thatcher clone, with her leer, snarl and arrogance. And her speech upon entering Downing Street, promising to govern for all, with echoes of Thatcher's St Francis speech, was just pure bollocks. Her triumphalist PMQ snarl, "Remind you of anyone?" showed her true colours - evil witch." ....Evil..???....why is she evil. | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. No, we'll have the referendum when OUR parliament decides, not some English PM who has been elected to the job by precisely 0 voters. Well done tory strategists, you just don't understand Scotland one little bit.... which is about as much as you care about our best interests (though you love the plundered oil which was transferred to wastemonster coffers to fund growth in the south east). We had a Scottish Prime minister, Gordon Brown, who was elected by precisely 0 voters. Were you complaining about this or is it only English Prime Ministers you have a problem with? "As a leader, an economist and a human being, Gordon Brown is just dire - beyond the pale. Blair & Brown - psychopath and sociopath, both totally unfit to hold public office. | |||
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"why are you pleased?????? If you want to play political games, then fine. I have nothing against the Scottish people, no finer people to have at your back in a fight, but they are part of the UK and have yet to put forward any credible reasons why they are more special than anyone else. I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable I do believe the people of Scotland will force May's hand, and it will not be the date you think, It will be sooner. You should be telling David Davis that Politics are not a game . think about it "You obviously haven't heard about the petition, now approaching 200000 names, stating that they don't want another referendum. And the added FACT, that the strongest opposition is from 6 of the SNP's strongholds!!! | |||
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"why are you pleased?????? If you want to play political games, then fine. I have nothing against the Scottish people, no finer people to have at your back in a fight, but they are part of the UK and have yet to put forward any credible reasons why they are more special than anyone else. I know that they will get independence one day and good luck to them but they need to grasp that it's the UK goverment that dictates any timetable I do believe the people of Scotland will force May's hand, and it will not be the date you think, It will be sooner. You should be telling David Davis that Politics are not a game . think about it
You obviously haven't heard about the petition, now approaching 200000 names, stating that they don't want another referendum.
And the added FACT, that the strongest opposition is from 6 of the SNP's strongholds!!!"Stop making things up | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
There may be a number of Scots that dont care for a referendum just yet, but there are an awful lot of those that care even less for being bullied by a Conservative Prime Minister.
I'd say Theresa Mays words have probably hardened even more attitudes now. The SNP may not now be able to have a legally binding referendum but they can have an advisory one and seemingly Theresa May has no problem recognising the will of the people in an advisory referendum.
True words
the SNP might very well have been hoping that Teresa May would make this decision, it is absolutely perfect for the SNP this weekend as they hold their Conference in Aberdeen.
The Vote will take place this Wednesday coming and it should easily be passed even with Labour & Lib Dems backing the Tories.
Never thought Scotland would ever see a day when Labour & Tories walk hand in hand, great news for Scottish Tories and its the continued downfall of Scottish Labour.
Teresa May has just walked into SNP honey trap which will make interesting weeks ahead, She has unknowingly built more support for Scottish Independence today
"Or could it be her plan? Two ways of thinking here: 1) Scots can make an informed decision once Brexit negotiations are finished. This will also (possibly) include recognition that an independent Scotland will NOT be a member of the EU but will have to apply, meet the financial criteria, go through the (seven year?) process and join the Euro. All things which Nicola seems to be ignoring. Or 2) Theresa has played Nicola like a fish....and figures that UK would be stronger economically without being required to prop the Scottish economy up as has been the case since anyone can remember. Just a thought? | |||
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"No she didnt say NO to a referendum Even if she did block a independence referendum like i said its very unwise to do that as she is unelected and stands on no manifesto of her on so no mandate. Now if its blocked the Scottish government could go through the courts or the can hold a non-binding referendum just as the EU referendum was and if it shows support for independence there is yet another mandate. Also think about this the EU do not refuse referendum for any EU country yet the UK think they can rule out a Scottish referendum dangerous game to play and just shows you Scotland is not an equal partner and in a dictatorship What is so wrong about allowing the Scottish people to decide on Scotland future as this point the Tories are telling Scotland we have no say and will be dragged out of the EU which we want to stay in so an independence referendum before exiting the EU will let the Scottish people decide on if they like the brexit deal or would rather independence" Keep talking - the cleavage is mesmerising PS - Totally agree | |||
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"No she didnt say NO to a referendum Even if she did block a independence referendum like i said its very unwise to do that as she is unelected and stands on no manifesto of her on so no mandate. Now if its blocked the Scottish government could go through the courts or the can hold a non-binding referendum just as the EU referendum was and if it shows support for independence there is yet another mandate. Also think about this the EU do not refuse referendum for any EU country yet the UK think they can rule out a Scottish referendum dangerous game to play and just shows you Scotland is not an equal partner and in a dictatorship What is so wrong about allowing the Scottish people to decide on Scotland future as this point the Tories are telling Scotland we have no say and will be dragged out of the EU which we want to stay in so an independence referendum before exiting the EU will let the Scottish people decide on if they like the brexit deal or would rather independence" You're not allowed to jump ship.We all go down togeather.Mutineers will be displined.  | |||
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" Or could it be her plan? Two ways of thinking here: 1) Scots can make an informed decision once Brexit negotiations are finished. This will also (possibly) include recognition that an independent Scotland will NOT be a member of the EU but will have to apply, meet the financial criteria, go through the (seven year?) process and join the Euro. All things which Nicola seems to be ignoring. Or 2) Theresa has played Nicola like a fish....and figures that UK would be stronger economically without being required to prop the Scottish economy up as has been the case since anyone can remember. Just a thought?" IMVHO TM has run rings round NS all through, by going to court over the parliament issue she stopped the SNP going to court about the scottish parliament having any right to veto art 50,now as you say the scots will have a very stark choice stay in the UK post brexit or leave both the uk and the EU and maybe never get back in, NS knows she has been cornered and is having to resort to blaming the horrid English and stiring up hate to stand any hope to gain her ambition when the deal is done then that is the time for the scottish to make up their mind, NS knows whatever the deal is its going to be better than being out of the UK and EU,its her last desperate gamble | |||
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"“To look at the issue at this time would be unfair, because people wouldn’t have the necessary information to make such a crucial decision,” May said.' Unlike Brexit, which wasn't a crucial decision and all the information we needed was written on the side of a bus. " Did anyone here actually read the bus? It didn't actually say we would spend EU money on anything....it "asked" why not spend it in NHS. We WERE given all the info...in a £14million government sponsored leaflet. It clearly stated the facts such as unemployment rising massively the day after the vote. An immediate recession. Share prices crashing....in fact I think all it missed was a plague of frogs! So actually the vote was fully informed and eyes open. Nicola seems to think an independence vote would mean Scotland stays in the EU...... but nobody has checked with the EU....actually they have and the EU have categorically stated that this would NOT be possible. | |||
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"How decisive a vote was it for Remaining in the EU among the Scots? Just wondering, since this might have been a factor in the first Scottish Referendum vote." 62-38 in the favour of remain... see this is what i don't get.... everyone lauding over the conservatives when they keep there manifesto promise and give people a referendum on brexit..... and for example doing the U turn on putting up self employed ni conts.... the SNP want to keep on of their manifesto promises...giving the people the option of indyref 2 if there is a major change in circumstances... (and they actually put the example of scotland voting to remain, whilst the uk voted to leave in the actual 2016 manifesto... god bless them) so.... one rule for some.... one rule for everyone else.... | |||
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"You seem to forget that it's the PM of the UK that will agree to any section 30. You will get your referendum in 2021. No, we'll have the referendum when OUR parliament decides, not some English PM who has been elected to the job by precisely 0 voters. Well done tory strategists, you just don't understand Scotland one little bit.... which is about as much as you care about our best interests (though you love the plundered oil which was transferred to wastemonster coffers to fund growth in the south east). We had a Scottish Prime minister, Gordon Brown, who was elected by precisely 0 voters. Were you complaining about this or is it only English Prime Ministers you have a problem with? " | |||
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"............... One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world I live in the real world and I know a lot of Scots... All (bar one) resent immensely the way that they are viewed and treated by Westminster. Just think back a year ago as to how outraged Brexiters were at being told what they could and should be doing by world leaders, economists, heads of big business etc etc. Just why (in the real world) do you suppose Scots are going to take your kind of words any differently? Being in the real world and all that..." Maybe the sample of Scottish people that you know is a bit skewed . A significant number of Scottish people fully appreciate the subsidies which are received from the UK ( and also the people of Northern Ireland ). Without these subsidies we would have financial meltdown. | |||
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"............... One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world I live in the real world and I know a lot of Scots... All (bar one) resent immensely the way that they are viewed and treated by Westminster. Just think back a year ago as to how outraged Brexiters were at being told what they could and should be doing by world leaders, economists, heads of big business etc etc. Just why (in the real world) do you suppose Scots are going to take your kind of words any differently? Being in the real world and all that... Maybe the sample of Scottish people that you know is a bit skewed . A significant number of Scottish people fully appreciate the subsidies which are received from the UK ( and also the people of Northern Ireland ). Without these subsidies we would have financial meltdown. " Ah so Westminster subsides Scotland eh So we should be grateful for being leeches ? Though problem with that is the UK government cant subside a bedroom tax yet but seem hell bend on keeping Scotland | |||
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"Teresa Mare is morphing into a Thatcher clone, with her leer, snarl and arrogance. And her speech upon entering Downing Street, promising to govern for all, with echoes of Thatcher's St Francis speech, was just pure bollocks. Her triumphalist PMQ snarl, "Remind you of anyone?" showed her true colours - evil witch." I hated Thatcher. May isnt fit to tie her shoelaces in any way, shape or form | |||
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"“To look at the issue at this time would be unfair, because people wouldn’t have the necessary information to make such a crucial decision,” May said.' Unlike Brexit, which wasn't a crucial decision and all the information we needed was written on the side of a bus. Did anyone here actually read the bus? It didn't actually say we would spend EU money on anything....it "asked" why not spend it in NHS. We WERE given all the info...in a £14million government sponsored leaflet. It clearly stated the facts such as unemployment rising massively the day after the vote. An immediate recession. Share prices crashing....in fact I think all it missed was a plague of frogs! So actually the vote was fully informed and eyes open. Nicola seems to think an independence vote would mean Scotland stays in the EU...... but nobody has checked with the EU....actually they have and the EU have categorically stated that this would NOT be possible." The EU have said no such thing | |||
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"............... One of these days we might just get a post from you that has an idea, some positivity, some good thoughts instead of the usual slag everyone off. If you think my posts are arrogant, then fine. But then, my life is in the real world, one that exists rather than.in some perfect and idealistic world I live in the real world and I know a lot of Scots... All (bar one) resent immensely the way that they are viewed and treated by Westminster. Just think back a year ago as to how outraged Brexiters were at being told what they could and should be doing by world leaders, economists, heads of big business etc etc. Just why (in the real world) do you suppose Scots are going to take your kind of words any differently? Being in the real world and all that... Maybe the sample of Scottish people that you know is a bit skewed . A significant number of Scottish people fully appreciate the subsidies which are received from the UK ( and also the people of Northern Ireland ). Without these subsidies we would have financial meltdown. " Ive had this brilliant idea. Instead of us all pretending we know what the Scots want, why dont we let them vote on it? We could call it, um, IndyRef2...... | |||
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"It's the ups and downs of life,put your fucking toys back in your prams and get on with it, don't think for one moment us in the north east have it easy,do you think the southern elite give a shit about us, " Haha southern elite. Lived in gun central. As kids we in used to say let's meet at the gun shop. Elites are everywhere. | |||
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"It's the ups and downs of life,put your fucking toys back in your prams and get on with it, don't think for one moment us in the north east have it easy,do you think the southern elite give a shit about us, " Have you wandered around Hexham or Alnwick lately? Theyre busy not giving a shit about the paupers elsewhere in the NE. Youve got your own "elites" by the bucketload | |||
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"Interesting turn of phrase from Nicola Sturgeon yesterday in describing it as the day that the fate of the Union was decided. Much as I am a proud Brit and have many Scottish friends I really am on the side of the SNP this time around. The EU is a bit of a red herring but I understand that in or out the Scots would want a more productive relationship with the rest of Europe than the kind of relationship that Westminster is charging headlong into. Scotland has every right to choose its own destiny and I wish them well." Largely agree, May didn't even have the common sense to wait till after the SNP conference before her thou shalt not have even the same referendum which upon the basis of I am taking us all out.. | |||
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"Teresa Mare is morphing into a Thatcher clone, with her leer, snarl and arrogance. And her speech upon entering Downing Street, promising to govern for all, with echoes of Thatcher's St Francis speech, was just pure bollocks. Her triumphalist PMQ snarl, "Remind you of anyone?" showed her true colours - evil witch.....Evil..???....why is she evil." Any politician who tries to restrict our liberties and human rights counts as evil in my book. | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol." I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol. I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! "Yes me too, the quicker the better, it was on question time yesterday, also ireland voted to remain, wonder what will happen to them?. | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol. I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! Yes me too, the quicker the better, it was on question time yesterday, also ireland voted to remain, wonder what will happen to them?."Ireland is a bit more complicated as it's already a split country, I don't want to see any of them leave but wish the SNP would shut up for a change | |||
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"Am curious to know how many people think that Theresa May will cause the break up on the UK ? All the SNP are doing is making sure the Scottish people get a say as Scotland voted to remain and should be able to decide on if we agree on the brexit deal or if Scottish independence seems the better choice. There is no equal partnership in the UK The EU do not refuse any referendums in EU countries yet the UK government are going to tell Scotland we dont get to decide when to hold one That is a dictatorship and people are allowed to change their minds on independence just people are allowed to change their minds on voting for parties in elections. " Incase you missed it the scots had a vote 30 months these days there is five years between general elections. TM has not said you cant have a votebut wait till after we leave which is common sense all round,perhaps NS is worried we will get a better deal than she would for scotland, after all the finacial projections were dubious when oil was $110 a barrel let alone $50,do you want the euro thats of course even if you get allowed into the club which the spanish have said they will veto, and of course if we go to WTO rules any imports into the rest of the uk would cost scottish exporters dear, personally I dont give a monkeys whether you stay or go but at be honest you will keep demanding more votes until you get your way | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol." That's never been in doubt. Holyrood can ask under a section 30, but Holyrood can only rule on devolved matters. A referendum is a "reserved" issue and legality remains with Westminster. TM has never used the words "no", just "not now", and considering its only been just over two years since the last one, that's entirely reasonable. NS can use Brexit, even though article 50 hasn't even been invoked yet, as a excuse but the Scottish people voted in a UK wide referendum and along with the rest of the UK, can expect to be bound by that UK result. Legally, Westminster holds the powers. Morally, who knows but I remember both NS and AS using the phrase "once in a lifetime" several times during the last referendum. Convenient to use such a phrase to gain votes, not so convenient now I would imagine! | |||
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"Teresa Mare is morphing into a Thatcher clone, with her leer, snarl and arrogance. And her speech upon entering Downing Street, promising to govern for all, with echoes of Thatcher's St Francis speech, was just pure bollocks. Her triumphalist PMQ snarl, "Remind you of anyone?" showed her true colours - evil witch.....Evil..???....why is she evil. Any politician who tries to restrict our liberties and human rights counts as evil in my book." ...you must hate the Eu then. | |||
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"Am curious to know how many people think that Theresa May will cause the break up on the UK ? All the SNP are doing is making sure the Scottish people get a say as Scotland voted to remain and should be able to decide on if we agree on the brexit deal or if Scottish independence seems the better choice. There is no equal partnership in the UK The EU do not refuse any referendums in EU countries yet the UK government are going to tell Scotland we dont get to decide when to hold one That is a dictatorship and people are allowed to change their minds on independence just people are allowed to change their minds on voting for parties in elections. " This magnificent cleavage takls a lot of sense | |||
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" Any politician who tries to restrict our liberties and human rights counts as evil in my book.... you must hate the Eu then." You probably made the comment thinking it was "smaert" (like in the Donald Trump way). Yet even the most cursory and feeble bit of research would demonstrate that you are completely and totally wrong. If you think that you are even slightly correct - perhaps you could enlighten us all as to how the EU restricts your liberties and human rights? | |||
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"Am curious to know how many people think that Theresa May will cause the break up on the UK ? All the SNP are doing is making sure the Scottish people get a say as Scotland voted to remain and should be able to decide on if we agree on the brexit deal or if Scottish independence seems the better choice. There is no equal partnership in the UK The EU do not refuse any referendums in EU countries yet the UK government are going to tell Scotland we dont get to decide when to hold one That is a dictatorship and people are allowed to change their minds on independence just people are allowed to change their minds on voting for parties in elections. " . The UK parliament is divided equally to represent the amount of people living in each nation. Thats called a union, i cannot for the life of me think whats not fair about it? I dont think it's practical to hold more referendums than elections, lets say the Scots vote out, should you have another referendum in two years to see if people with to vote back in and then two years later another, people change their minds more than underwear it hardly seems practical to follow the whim of a constantly changing voter! | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol. I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! Yes me too, the quicker the better, it was on question time yesterday, also ireland voted to remain, wonder what will happen to them?.". I voted to remain what will happen to me, also my mate Steve did, what will happen to us?. Why did i have to put up with tony Blair and all his foreign interventions and secret taxs when i never voted for him?. Unfortunately we dont live in a system designed for the minority half for good reasons like some minorites tend to be whack jobs and half because they like it that way. All anybody can do is try to get along as best as possible | |||
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" You obviously haven't heard about the petition, now approaching 200000 names, stating that they don't want another referendum. And the added FACT, that the strongest opposition is from 6 of the SNP's strongholds!!!" Post Analysis: Stockholm syndrome | |||
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"I don't have any problem with Scotland having another referendum, quite the opposite and it's obvious that the SNP wanted may to say no. The problem is the SNP playing political games by wanting to scedual a vote at a time when it will cause the most conflict with what will be going on at that time. Let them have one now and get it out of the way
Well if you wen't going to listen to them when they tried playing nice... then maybe they finally got a reaction you they played nasty...
may have gotten this situation with the scottish government wrong right from the point when she entered no.10.... she was more focused on looking after here tory people down south than she ever was looking after people up north...
the couple of speeches she has made with regard to relooking atthe roles of devolved governments post brexit and not giving them any new power and keeping it all at westminster was the first shots that started all this...
her legacy will be the break up of the union.... " | |||
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"If Nigel farage is a flag waving nationalist popularist demagogue for ensuring that the UK population got a vote on wether to remain in the EU. Then how come sturgeon is the hero of the people for doing exactly the same?." .. | |||
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"Indyref2 or not I think you will find Scotland will have to leave the EU with the rest of the UK, the UK joined the EU as a 4 country union and must leave as a 4 country union known as the UK. I,m not 100% sure that is right but I seem to remember reading it some where so sorry if I,m wrong. " you don't have to be sorry, just try to keep up, its not indyref2, its ScotRef don't worry though, your not alone, so many cant keep up on here | |||
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"Indyref2 or not I think you will find Scotland will have to leave the EU with the rest of the UK, the UK joined the EU as a 4 country union and must leave as a 4 country union known as the UK. I,m not 100% sure that is right but I seem to remember reading it some where so sorry if I,m wrong. you don't have to be sorry, just try to keep up, its not indyref2, its ScotRef don't worry though, your not alone, so many cant keep up on here "Like I said before on another thread your off your head. | |||
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"Indyref2 or not I think you will find Scotland will have to leave the EU with the rest of the UK, the UK joined the EU as a 4 country union and must leave as a 4 country union known as the UK. I,m not 100% sure that is right but I seem to remember reading it some where so sorry if I,m wrong. you don't have to be sorry, just try to keep up, its not indyref2, its ScotRef don't worry though, your not alone, so many cant keep up on here
Like I said before on another thread your off your head. "you sound like a little housewife always wanting last word, nobody is interested, now run along please | |||
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"If Nigel farage is a flag waving nationalist popularist demagogue for ensuring that the UK population got a vote on wether to remain in the EU. Then how come sturgeon is the hero of the people for doing exactly the same?... ". Thanks for the thumb but it was a genuine question that Im honestly struggling to answer. Ps nice arse | |||
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"Fabio, May is also talking to the over 2 million Scots that voted to stay in the UK. Why is that vote not being respected? With a turnout of 85% Scotland said no, it was a decisive result. And we knew full well the likelihood of an upcoming EU vote prior to the independence referendum." I think you'll find the turnout was 62% not your quoted 85% | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol. I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! Yes me too, the quicker the better, it was on question time yesterday, also ireland voted to remain, wonder what will happen to them?.
Ireland is a bit more complicated as it's already a split country, I don't want to see any of them leave but wish the SNP would shut up for a change "Yes, they was like when germany was divided too with east and west. | |||
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"It turns out scotland still can seek independence, well done for may to split up uk, soon it will be just england lol. I just wish they would get on with it SNP are just trying to get the timeing to cause the most trouble!! Yes me too, the quicker the better, it was on question time yesterday, also ireland voted to remain, wonder what will happen to them?..
I voted to remain what will happen to me, also my mate Steve did, what will happen to us?.
Why did i have to put up with tony Blair and all his foreign interventions and secret taxs when i never voted for him?.
Unfortunately we dont live in a system designed for the minority half for good reasons like some minorites tend to be whack jobs and half because they like it that way.
All anybody can do is try to get along as best as possible"Yeah, the remainers have to hope for the best or somehow as juan said that britain can rejoin the eu as the brexitors will soon realise that the gran bretana dream with waving with flag was 300 years ago. | |||
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"Fabio, May is also talking to the over 2 million Scots that voted to stay in the UK. Why is that vote not being respected? With a turnout of 85% Scotland said no, it was a decisive result. And we knew full well the likelihood of an upcoming EU vote prior to the independence referendum. I think you'll find the turnout was 62% not your quoted 85%" . Not according to Wikipedia they say 84.9% | |||
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"Indyref2 or not I think you will find Scotland will have to leave the EU with the rest of the UK, the UK joined the EU as a 4 country union and must leave as a 4 country union known as the UK. I,m not 100% sure that is right but I seem to remember reading it some where so sorry if I,m wrong. you don't have to be sorry, just try to keep up, its not indyref2, its ScotRef don't worry though, your not alone, so many cant keep up on here
Like I said before on another thread your off your head.
you sound like a little housewife always wanting last word, nobody is interested, now run along please "Yes you could be right but at least I don't talk like a spoilt (war)child. | |||
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"If Nigel farage is a flag waving nationalist popularist demagogue for ensuring that the UK population got a vote on wether to remain in the EU. Then how come sturgeon is the hero of the people for doing exactly the same?... .
Thanks for the thumb but it was a genuine question that Im honestly struggling to answer.
Ps nice arse "You are correct.Flag waving nationalism north and south of this island and across the pond in the USA and within the EU is the game being played at present.They are all the same.Blind pride and nationalism will be the down fall of us all. | |||
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"EU Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier: Article 50 triggered end of March agreement reached by Oct 2018 people will know what Brexit means Therefore Theresa May and her comments to try and delay a Scottish referendum because we wont know what the brexit deal means looks rather foolish. As it seems to me the Scottish people will know in Oct 2018 what brexit means and should be able to choose if we agree on brexit or prefer Scottish independence. People need to wake up the Tories are useless pricks out to keep their pals rich and screw the poor. " And if Scotland leaves the UK at that point in time are they guaranteed to have continued membership of the EU ? | |||
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"EU Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier: Article 50 triggered end of March agreement reached by Oct 2018 people will know what Brexit means Therefore Theresa May and her comments to try and delay a Scottish referendum because we wont know what the brexit deal means looks rather foolish. As it seems to me the Scottish people will know in Oct 2018 what brexit means and should be able to choose if we agree on brexit or prefer Scottish independence. People need to wake up the Tories are useless pricks out to keep their pals rich and screw the poor. And if Scotland leaves the UK at that point in time are they guaranteed to have continued membership of the EU ?" Well if you follow what the EU are saying then yes as they seem quite happy to fast track an independent Scotland being accepted in the EU Scotland meets the criteria to be in the EU as we are already in yes not member state but we are in the EU right now as part of the UK. The main point Theresa May is looking very foolish yet again 18 months from now if she is to trigger Article 50 end of March is Oct 2018 which is in the timescale for when the SNP plan on having a 2nd independence referendum and the Scottish people will know the final brexit deal and can choose what sounds better. To deny a Scottish referendum proves Scotland is living under Westminster dictatorship and people are allowed to change their minds on independence if they feel the UK no longer suits them. | |||
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"EU Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier: Article 50 triggered end of March agreement reached by Oct 2018 people will know what Brexit means Therefore Theresa May and her comments to try and delay a Scottish referendum because we wont know what the brexit deal means looks rather foolish. As it seems to me the Scottish people will know in Oct 2018 what brexit means and should be able to choose if we agree on brexit or prefer Scottish independence. People need to wake up the Tories are useless pricks out to keep their pals rich and screw the poor. " The EU have never ever managed to do anything on time and all 27 have to approve the deal, whats the rush to leave the uk anyway a couple of years extra isnt going to make much difference or are you scared staying will be more popular after we leave and the eu says you cant join | |||
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"EU Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier: Article 50 triggered end of March agreement reached by Oct 2018 people will know what Brexit means Therefore Theresa May and her comments to try and delay a Scottish referendum because we wont know what the brexit deal means looks rather foolish. As it seems to me the Scottish people will know in Oct 2018 what brexit means and should be able to choose if we agree on brexit or prefer Scottish independence. People need to wake up the Tories are useless pricks out to keep their pals rich and screw the poor. And if Scotland leaves the UK at that point in time are they guaranteed to have continued membership of the EU ? Well if you follow what the EU are saying then yes as they seem quite happy to fast track an independent Scotland being accepted in the EU Scotland meets the criteria to be in the EU as we are already in yes not member state but we are in the EU right now as part of the UK. The main point Theresa May is looking very foolish yet again 18 months from now if she is to trigger Article 50 end of March is Oct 2018 which is in the timescale for when the SNP plan on having a 2nd independence referendum and the Scottish people will know the final brexit deal and can choose what sounds better. To deny a Scottish referendum proves Scotland is living under Westminster dictatorship and people are allowed to change their minds on independence if they feel the UK no longer suits them. " | |||
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"It would seem that Scotland has become a very unhealthy place to live as Nicola Sturgeon and her cronies would have us belive that life expectancy there is only 4 to 4.5 years - as the Independence referendum of 2014 was billef as a 'once in a generation' event" when does one lifetime end and another begin? its nothing about a once in a lifetime but you already know that | |||
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"Yes we are living under a small minded bigoted anti-english regime .One which a lot of Scots revel in, but then some have little to lose...They cry and wail. but actual policies to change this "Austerity" we are under ..em NO...fuck the poor , We will not raise more revenue, we will not attract major businesses , more jobs too ? Nope we will have "Freedom".from what , We have the means to change things now but do nothing ...Whining, and bitching is what St Nicola does, a deeply divisive and increasingly slightly unhinged figure...She has that gleam that other Nationalists in history had..... "As the PM said in the last PMQs, a leader of a Minority Goverment. | |||
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"Yes we are living under a small minded bigoted anti-english regime .One which a lot of Scots revel in, but then some have little to lose...They cry and wail. but actual policies to change this "Austerity" we are under ..em NO...fuck the poor , We will not raise more revenue, we will not attract major businesses , more jobs too ? Nope we will have "Freedom".from what , We have the means to change things now but do nothing ...Whining, and bitching is what St Nicola does, a deeply divisive and increasingly slightly unhinged figure...She has that gleam that other Nationalists in history had.....
As the PM said in the last PMQs, a leader of a Minority Goverment."But able to muster a majority when it comes to voting for holding a referendum. I dont recall Cameron feeling too hampered by having to have a formal coalition to be in Number 10 or May being embarrassed at being Home secretary in said government | |||
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"Yes we are living under a small minded bigoted anti-english regime .One which a lot of Scots revel in, but then some have little to lose...They cry and wail. but actual policies to change this "Austerity" we are under ..em NO...fuck the poor , We will not raise more revenue, we will not attract major businesses , more jobs too ? Nope we will have "Freedom".from what , We have the means to change things now but do nothing ...Whining, and bitching is what St Nicola does, a deeply divisive and increasingly slightly unhinged figure...She has that gleam that other Nationalists in history had.....
As the PM said in the last PMQs, a leader of a Minority Goverment.
But able to muster a majority when it comes to voting for holding a referendum. I dont recall Cameron feeling too hampered by having to have a formal coalition to be in Number 10 or May being embarrassed at being Home secretary in said government"I was just stating a fact, not an.opinion | |||
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"Why dont the SNP government raise income tax 1p and remove the food banks at a stroke ?.....why underspend the NHS budget when we cry our for shorter queues and more GPs....Unless they want to stoke grievance and discontent ? or am i being to cynical......Maybe they are just incompetent ?.....Or as i believe they are both of the above "I believe that you are right, and have stated several times, that it's independence or bust for the SNP right now. Get independence first and worry about everything else afterwards moment for them. Bet NS loves Gordon Brown right now! | |||
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"Why dont the SNP government raise income tax 1p and remove the food banks at a stroke ?.....why underspend the NHS budget when we cry our for shorter queues and more GPs....Unless they want to stoke grievance and discontent ? or am i being to cynical......Maybe they are just incompetent ?.....Or as i believe they are both of the above "£40 a week on top of the 40% we already pay, bollox to that | |||
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"Why dont the SNP government raise income tax 1p and remove the food banks at a stroke ?.....why underspend the NHS budget when we cry our for shorter queues and more GPs....Unless they want to stoke grievance and discontent ? or am i being to cynical......Maybe they are just incompetent ?.....Or as i believe they are both of the above
I believe that you are right, and have stated several times, that it's independence or bust for the SNP right now. Get independence first and worry about everything else afterwards moment for them.
Bet NS loves Gordon Brown right now! "It was the same for brexit. Get brexit and worry afterwards.No plans and no idea.Its a sad reflection of todays politics. Keep waving the flag and beat the nationalist drum until fever pitch . | |||
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"How patriotic of you......How much tax will you pay in a "Free" Scotland...Now that will be scary "not at all, in a free Scotland I would happily pay my dues but then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome | |||
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"How patriotic of you......How much tax will you pay in a "Free" Scotland...Now that will be scary
not at all, in a free Scotland I would happily pay my dues
but then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome "Including the one that insists on private messaging on Scottish Independence after the topic is closed. Take the hint Milli  | |||
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"But then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome " "Civic Nationalism" call dissenters, people seeking answers to difficult questions - cowards, quislings, traitors to scotland etc. What an interesting way to change people's minds and bring them over the independence cause. | |||
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"But then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome "Civic Nationalism" call dissenters, people seeking answers to difficult questions - cowards, quislings, traitors to scotland etc. What an interesting way to change people's minds and bring them over the independence cause. " Jane I don't really give two fucks about them, gave up speaking to them after 2014, I just consider them pathetic cowards who deserve to be ruled by Westminster, They will go to their graves knowing they are pathetic cowards who do not stand for an independent Scotland, nations fight wars for independence and these pathetic cowards are too frightened to tick a box scum. | |||
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"But then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome "Civic Nationalism" call dissenters, people seeking answers to difficult questions - cowards, quislings, traitors to scotland etc. What an interesting way to change people's minds and bring them over the independence cause. Jane I don't really give two fucks about them, gave up speaking to them after 2014, I just consider them pathetic cowards who deserve to be ruled by Westminster, They will go to their graves knowing they are pathetic cowards who do not stand for an independent Scotland, nations fight wars for independence and these pathetic cowards are too frightened to tick a box scum." How sad you feel like that, from your comments I infer that you are the sort that believes "Independence trancends all" no matter the pain that you inflict on your fellow scot. I do suppose it would be the easiest way to make a fairer more equal country. Beggar everyone. Hate is such a horrible thing to have in your heart. | |||
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"But then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome "Civic Nationalism" call dissenters, people seeking answers to difficult questions - cowards, quislings, traitors to scotland etc. What an interesting way to change people's minds and bring them over the independence cause. Jane I don't really give two fucks about them, gave up speaking to them after 2014, I just consider them pathetic cowards who deserve to be ruled by Westminster, They will go to their graves knowing they are pathetic cowards who do not stand for an independent Scotland, nations fight wars for independence and these pathetic cowards are too frightened to tick a box scum." Is that the official SNP line on democracy? | |||
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"But then Scotland will never be free as there are far to many cowards suffering from Stockholm syndrome "Civic Nationalism" call dissenters, people seeking answers to difficult questions - cowards, quislings, traitors to scotland etc. What an interesting way to change people's minds and bring them over the independence cause. Jane I don't really give two fucks about them, gave up speaking to them after 2014, I just consider them pathetic cowards who deserve to be ruled by Westminster, They will go to their graves knowing they are pathetic cowards who do not stand for an independent Scotland, nations fight wars for independence and these pathetic cowards are too frightened to tick a box scum." . They dont just fight wars for independence unfortunately!. They also have bitter civil conflict over ideological differences and end up split in half for long long times like Ireland. Think on | |||
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Begs the question why would you want to live amongst them | |||
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"“To look at the issue at this time would be unfair, because people wouldn’t have the necessary information to make such a crucial decision,” May said.' Unlike Brexit, which wasn't a crucial decision and all the information we needed was written on the side of a bus. Did anyone here actually read the bus? It didn't actually say we would spend EU money on anything....it "asked" why not spend it in NHS. We WERE given all the info...in a £14million government sponsored leaflet. It clearly stated the facts such as unemployment rising massively the day after the vote. An immediate recession. Share prices crashing....in fact I think all it missed was a plague of frogs! So actually the vote was fully informed and eyes open. Nicola seems to think an independence vote would mean Scotland stays in the EU...... but nobody has checked with the EU....actually they have and the EU have categorically stated that this would NOT be possible. The EU have said no such thing" Have you had your ears sealed up? Everyone else has heard it repeated on several occasions. | |||
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"“To look at the issue at this time would be unfair, because people wouldn’t have the necessary information to make such a crucial decision,” May said.' Unlike Brexit, which wasn't a crucial decision and all the information we needed was written on the side of a bus. Did anyone here actually read the bus? It didn't actually say we would spend EU money on anything....it "asked" why not spend it in NHS. We WERE given all the info...in a £14million government sponsored leaflet. It clearly stated the facts such as unemployment rising massively the day after the vote. An immediate recession. Share prices crashing....in fact I think all it missed was a plague of frogs! So actually the vote was fully informed and eyes open. Nicola seems to think an independence vote would mean Scotland stays in the EU...... but nobody has checked with the EU....actually they have and the EU have categorically stated that this would NOT be possible. The EU have said no such thing Have you had your ears sealed up? Everyone else has heard it repeated on several occasions." Pls tell us a cpl names who have said scotland wont get to join the eu | |||
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"Viviane Reding Vice President of the European Commission Justice, Fundamental Rights and Citizenship in a letter to Christina McKelvie Convener European and External Relations Committee of the Scottish Parliament said "The commission,s position on this issue that you raise has been stated on a number of occasions since 2004. The treaties apply to the Member States. When part of the territory of a Member State ceases to be part of that State, e.g. because that territory becomes an independent state, the treaties will no longer apply to that territory. In other words, a new independent region would, by the fact of its independence, becomes a third country with respect to the Union and the Treaties would, from the day of its independence, not apply anymore on its territory." In full here, https://www.parliament.scot/S4_EuropeanandExternalRelationsCommittee/Inquiries/Letter_from_Viviane_Reding_Vice_President_of_the_European_Commission_dated_20_March_2014__pdf.pdf" Thanks ,was that before the 2014 referendum ? Il give you elmar bok and julienne minor who have both said in the last 2 months that scotland is a special case and would be fasttracked into the eu ,i suppose it all depends who you beleive | |||
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"Who are they? And what did they say? One a mere MEP like Nigel Farage, and has no power or authority to back up whatever claims he makes. The other, Is that the spokesperson you refer to? " Check them both out on youtube il have look see if its right spelling of names | |||
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"Yes it was before 2014, thus making the white paper a tissue of lies in regard to an independent Scotland EU status. Nothing between then and now alters the fact that treaties have not been changed, what the letter stated still stands. " i think if your honest a lot has changed but we are never going to agree | |||
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"Maragritis Schinas, Chief Spokesperson of the European Commission, told reporters at a briefing that Brussels would apply the “Barroso doctrine” to Scotland’s case, an argument which states that regions opting for independence automatically lose their EU membership by opting to become a new country. In 2012 the then Commission president Jose Manuel Barroso slapped down claims by Alex Salmond that Scots could vote to leave Britain and still keep their membership of the bloc, saying it was incompatible with both EU and international law. He said: "I am not going to speculate now about possible secessions, it is not my job. But I can tell you that to join the European Union, yes, we have a procedure. It is a procedure of international law. "A new state, if it wants to join the European Union, has to apply to become a member like any state." "A state has to be a democracy first of all, and that state has to apply to become a member of the European Union and all the other member states have to give their consent."" Thats old news ,i prefer to listen to ppl who have spoken in the last few months when they became aware that scotland didnt want to leave the eu ,we will just have to wait 2 yrs when we are independent and see who is right | |||
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"Procedure are in place for states to join, Scotland would need to apply like any other country. Unless you know differently? Do you? The EU has rules for applicant states and its they that must be adhered to. Its the EU Commission that has the power, and what they say goes. NOT MEP,s. Check out elmar blok chairman of eu foreign affairs committee om youtube , scotland in eu not much to negotiate " | |||
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"I just checked out ELMAR BROK, and he did say "for sure they must apply" right at the start of his reply. He confirms that there will be no continuance of EU membership. Thanks for that. "Yes all countries have to apply he also said scotland would be fastracked but hey you put your spin on it all you want ,as i said ealier we will be independent in 2yrs time then see who is right | |||
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"I just checked out ELMAR BROK, and he did say "for sure they must apply" right at the start of his reply. He confirms that there will be no continuance of EU membership. Thanks for that. "Maybe you should listen to him again as he said it would be easy negotiations as scotland fulfilled all that is required ,not one did he say there will be no continuance of eu membership | |||
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"Fastracked? What does that really mean? We need to comply with the 35 chapters of the acquis like any other country wishing to join. We do indeed comply with many of them but not ALL of them, we must comply with ALL of them before joining. Chapter 17 is the biggest single obstacle to Scotland joining. We have no central bank and no currency so there is monetary union failure to comply. We then look at the Growth and Stabilty pact which demands that member states cant have debt exceeding 60% of GDP. Also member states must have a deficit no larger than 3% of GDP, Scotlands is nearly 10%. It then goes on to say we should commit to joining the Euro. Good luck selling that to the Scottish people." Look at a dictionary that will tell you what fastracked means, we will have a bank and our own currency when independent and once we have contol of all our resources like whisky which the uk gets all the tax for also all the big supermarkets some banks most major big company's who have their company addresses in london so Westminster gets all the tax once we get that sorted our economy will be just fine ,there are nine countries in the eu who dont use the euro including uk though once brexit kicks in and the pound collapses maybe the euro be a good thing ,oh and on the elmar blok video why did you make up he said no continuance in eu when he cleary didnt your coming across asa scaremongerer making things up | |||
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"Its laughable the amount of small Englanders on here who voice their opinion, love to put Scotland down, yet have no vote what so ever on the matter, same as they will never venture up or set foot in Scotland " No matter where you are from, informed and factually accurate debate should always be encouraged. It's always ok to have an opinion, a view but when it is clouded by rabid nationalism, then it becomes rather foolish. | |||
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"“To look at the issue at this time would be unfair, because people wouldn’t have the necessary information to make such a crucial decision,” May said.' Unlike Brexit, which wasn't a crucial decision and all the information we needed was written on the side of a bus. Did anyone here actually read the bus? It didn't actually say we would spend EU money on anything....it "asked" why not spend it in NHS. We WERE given all the info...in a £14million government sponsored leaflet. It clearly stated the facts such as unemployment rising massively the day after the vote. An immediate recession. Share prices crashing....in fact I think all it missed was a plague of frogs! So actually the vote was fully informed and eyes open. Nicola seems to think an independence vote would mean Scotland stays in the EU...... but nobody has checked with the EU....actually they have and the EU have categorically stated that this would NOT be possible. The EU have said no such thing Have you had your ears sealed up? Everyone else has heard it repeated on several occasions." I repeat, the EU have said no such thing. There has been no pronouncement from the EU parliament or the commission. Don't let facts get in the way of your argument | |||
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"Yes it was before 2014, thus making the white paper a tissue of lies in regard to an independent Scotland EU status. Nothing between then and now alters the fact that treaties have not been changed, what the letter stated still stands. i think if your honest a lot has changed but we are never going to agree " A lot has changed here in the U.K. But what is relevant is that NOTHING has changed within the dogmatic EU rules..... Cameron asked for changes prior to the EU referendum. He got nothing. The EU rules would mean a process has to be gone through. (1) Scotland has to become fully independent, with its own central bank and currency etc. (2) Independent Scotland applies for membership. (3) An approximately seven year process starts [maybe it could be "specially" speeded up?] (4)Scotland has to meet the economic criteria....miles off at the moment! (5) They have to change their new currency to the Euro prior to joining (Sturgeon has said many times that would never happen). So basically Sturgeon is peddling an impossible dream. (Or you may like to call it a lie?) The Brexit vote is just her latest excuse to put another Indy referendum back on the agenda. If it wasn't for Brexit she would have just found another excuse. | |||
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"Its laughable the amount of small Englanders on here who voice their opinion, love to put Scotland down, yet have no vote what so ever on the matter, same as they will never venture up or set foot in Scotland " Ah the irony, little englanders are bad little scotlanders good .
I have no problem if scotland wants to be independant but at least one might hope after all the criticism of the brexit campaign and post truth, fake news those supporting it would try and be honest about the fact that scotland will ahve to reapply to join the EU,even if its fast tracked because many things are in place, the two biggies that arent are the financail test and the compulsion to join the euro which NS and AS said they wouldnt do last time but would keep the pound  | |||
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"If T.M. had used these words; "I know that Nicola Sturgeon is passionate about an Independent Scotland as are many Scots. But I am passionate about keeping the Union together, as are many Scots. For the next two years all my efforts will be focused on Brexit negoitations therefore I cannot give as much effort to countering Nicola's position as I must do. Therefore in the interests of fairness the Independence Referendum will have to be after Brexit negoitations are finished and I can give the Independence referendum my full attention as Nicola will". Then it would have sounded better than "Now is not the time", but it means the same thing." yes perhaps that would be a better approach tell me? what would happen if a war breaks out between now and the 2 years, will she also say "now is not the time" please attack us later If the Tories cannot handle 2 actions at one time perhaps they should not be running the country (or should I say try to run the country) | |||
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"Yes only a fool follows the Leader over the cliff just because she holds a Saltire......It will end in tears for all but the rich and those who can transfer there employment to another location...For the rest it is cuts, more cuts and eventually the light will lift and they will see they were sold a crock of shit...." I am sure thousands followed the Union Jack out of the trenches in WW1, | |||
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"How decisive a vote was it for Remaining in the EU among the Scots? Just wondering, since this might have been a factor in the first Scottish Referendum vote. 62-38 in the favour of remain... see this is what i don't get.... everyone lauding over the conservatives when they keep there manifesto promise and give people a referendum on brexit..... and for example doing the U turn on putting up self employed ni conts.... the SNP want to keep on of their manifesto promises...giving the people the option of indyref 2 if there is a major change in circumstances... (and they actually put the example of scotland voting to remain, whilst the uk voted to leave in the actual 2016 manifesto... god bless them) so.... one rule for some.... one rule for everyone else.... "No one ever mentions the Scottish Green Party what's wrong with us greens wanting Independence | |||
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"How decisive a vote was it for Remaining in the EU among the Scots? Just wondering, since this might have been a factor in the first Scottish Referendum vote. 62-38 in the favour of remain... see this is what i don't get.... everyone lauding over the conservatives when they keep there manifesto promise and give people a referendum on brexit..... and for example doing the U turn on putting up self employed ni conts.... the SNP want to keep on of their manifesto promises...giving the people the option of indyref 2 if there is a major change in circumstances... (and they actually put the example of scotland voting to remain, whilst the uk voted to leave in the actual 2016 manifesto... god bless them) so.... one rule for some.... one rule for everyone else....
No one ever mentions the Scottish Green Party
what's wrong with us greens wanting Independence"The Green Party (who hold the all important 6 seats in the SP) will only back a referendum if it's "the will of the Scottish people and not for a party to gain a political advantage" So the proposed vote on a section 30 next week will be very interesting indeed, as all the polls clearly show there is no overwhelming support for such a referendum. | |||
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"The greens are on the rise.As a green voter the future needs more greens in power here and in the EU." Looks like the Scottish Greens have sold themselves out and have abandoned their manifesto pledge on independence. | |||
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"Independence; why its being asked today. Nicola Sturgeon’s speech at Bute House last Monday in effect challenged Theresa May to give Scotland, which voted in favour of remaining in the EU by 62% to 38%, special access to the single market and substantial new powers or face a second Scottish independence referendum. Why is the first minister doing this? Sturgeon argued that last year’s Scottish National party election manifesto gives her a mandate to press for a new independence vote if “a significant or material change” in Scotland’s constitutional position occurred, such as the rest of the UK voting to leave the EU while Scotland voted to stay. Nicola Sturgeon expected to set out plan for Scottish independence vote She spoke at the first minister’s official residence in Edinburgh rather than at last weekend’s SNP spring conference in Aberdeen because she needs to appeal to pro-EU Labour, Liberal Democrat and Conservative voters, who could prefer independence in Europe to Brexit, to ensure she can win a referendum. Sturgeon believes the imminent decision by May’s government in London to invoke article 50 gives her a strong opportunity to set the political agenda in Scotland. What do the polls show? The latest opinion polls have mixed messages for Sturgeon. They show a recent rise in support for independence from 45% up to 49%, excluding don’t knows. In statistical terms, no and yes are effectively neck and neck The polls also show about a third of SNP voters backed leave in the EU referendum. Sturgeon needs to persuade a large majority of them to back independence in Europe but also attract non-nationalist voters to back it to be sure of winning. The polls also show a majority of Scottish voters object to a referendum before the UK leaves the EU, because they need to know what they are voting for and against. Sturgeon therefore has to justify any decision to stage one before Brexit What is the constitutional position? Sturgeon acknowledged the Scottish parliament does not have the legal authority to stage a poll under the UK’s referendum legislation. She plans to ask for Holyrood’s backing TODAY to seek that approval under a section 30 order of the Scotland Act. She expects to command a narrow majority if all six Scottish Green MSPs vote alongside the 63 SNP members. The UK and Scottish governments will then need to sign a second “Edinburgh agreement” which in 2012 set up the 2014 independence referendum, before asking the Electoral Commission to adjudicate on the question to be set. Sturgeon said on Monday she favoured retaining the single “yes” or “no” question from September 2014: “Should Scotland be an independent country?” But there will be strong pressure to adopt the method used in the 2016 EU referendum, to present two “leave” or “remain” options such as should Scotland leave the UK or remain in the UK? These talks will trigger a major battle over the vote’s timing, on whether the referendum should happen before or after Brexit, or indeed whether a third option, such as Labour and Lib Dem demands for a federal UK, could be added. What will the EU say and do? The bigger question of when and how an independent Scotland could join the EU or retain its membership is extremely uncertain: there is no precedent for part of a member state retaining membership when the member state leaves. The EU may insist it cannot start considering a Scottish bid until after Brexit, so it knows what terms Scotland is joining under because questions about cross-border trade, tariffs and access to UK waters will be key issues for other EU member states. There will be disagreements in the EU. Many MEPs, including the European parliament’s Brexit chief Guy Verhofstadt and senior figures in key EU member states, have been openly sympathetic to Scotland’s pro-European stance. Despite Sturgeon’s belief that winning a pre-Brexit referendum will smooth an independent Scotland’s transition to rejoining the single market in some form, the European commission is sticking to its stance in 2014 that an application can only be made once Scotland has fully left the UK – a process that could take several years. What about the economics? Scotland’s financial position is worse than it was in 2014. The collapse in oil prices increased the public spending deficit last year to £15bn, or more than 20% of annual government spending; Scotland’s economy is growing more slowly than the UK’s and its exports to the rest of the EU are not growing as fast as to the rest of the UK. Sturgeon has to answer critical questions on which currency Scotland would use and whether it will need to accept the euro in future; on setting up a new central bank; on tackling its massive deficit; on repaying Scotland’s share of the UK’s £1.7tn debt; and on how it can have free trade on equal terms simultaneously with the UK and the EU. Much will rest on the shape of the UK’s Brexit deal with the EU. Sturgeon pointed out last Monday at the favourable open border deal on the cards for the Republic of Ireland, which has been underpinned by a common travel area deal for decades. “There’s absolutely no reason that would or should change if Scotland became an independent country,”. Sturgeon added that if May is confident the UK will have free trade deals with all its trading partners post-Brexit, Scotland would also expect one too. So Today, Wednesday is the Day that the Scottish Government votes. Theminority SNP government is asking the Scottish Parliament to back its plans to ask Westminster for a section 30 order, which is needed to make a referendum legally binding. The government is expected todays vote with the support of the Scottish Greens - despite opposition from the Conservatives, Labour and Liberal Democrats. I hope this is a non-biased description and would be interested in your views of what the future may or may not hold " A good summary. If everything was milk and honey in Scotland, then I can see a case for Independence but if NS gets this section 30, then every other party in Scotland is going to expose every weakness, every bad decision made by NS. Do you think that the time is right, or is NS just riding the uncertain Brexit wave here? | |||
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"I honestly don't know, there are good and bad aspects of both obviously the greens back independence, and both the tories & lib dems are fairly hated in Scotland, leaves Labour which are also losing votes due to poor leadership both in Westminster and Scotland. I guess its now or never for independence, I just hate all the lies, spin and shit from all, including BBC coverage" What's your estimated black hole in public finances? I did see a figure of £42 billion quoted sometime back? Your share of the national debt is estimated at £50 billion. Has NS mentioned the estimated £24 billion needed to decommision the North Sea oilfields yet? With the best will in the world, Sean Connery isn't going to put his hand in his pocket to make those sort of some up, so a huge tax hike looks inevitable. Independence will come at a price, it's just how high a price | |||
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"Decommissioning of platforms should be done by the oil companies owning them, the specific example of this is Shell with the Brents. But Shell are getting very crafty and selling off older platforms to small companies, these companies I suspect will find it very difficult to decommission, I do not think they have the knowledge required either. Same with BP getting rid of the forties a decade back. removal of the Brent legs will be the biggest problem as they are huge concrete columbs, I believe there are 16 cells at the bottom of the legs too, each cell used to store crude in a ballast system, they are still filled with sludge, seawater and LSA (radioactive). I worked on the brent delta for 9 years its a huge platform. Shell are now asking to leave the legs and cells in situe. It would be good for Scotland to receive the taxation revenues from North Sea though, a small fortune even although they have re-invested this year" Yes, but they will offset those costs against tax. This is many years down the line, which is I suppose, not been mentioned yet. | |||
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"Decommissioning of platforms should be done by the oil companies owning them, the specific example of this is Shell with the Brents. But Shell are getting very crafty and selling off older platforms to small companies, these companies I suspect will find it very difficult to decommission, I do not think they have the knowledge required either. Same with BP getting rid of the forties a decade back. removal of the Brent legs will be the biggest problem as they are huge concrete columbs, I believe there are 16 cells at the bottom of the legs too, each cell used to store crude in a ballast system, they are still filled with sludge, seawater and LSA (radioactive). I worked on the brent delta for 9 years its a huge platform. Shell are now asking to leave the legs and cells in situe. It would be good for Scotland to receive the taxation revenues from North Sea though, a small fortune even although they have re-invested this year Yes, but they will offset those costs against tax. This is many years down the line, which is I suppose, not been mentioned yet." not at all, there are many aging platforms, some being decommissioned, others such as the Beatrice take on new beginnings such as wind generation, the platform being the main hub. Personally I would change them into Prisons but that's another story. At the same time there are huge developments coming onstream right now, huge finds both North Sea and West of Shetland, not to mention all capped off reservoirs of the West coast which cannot be developed due to our nuclear subs | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now "Yes indeed, we will see how much she stamps tonight at 5:30pm
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perhaps the greens will stamp their feet too | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
Yes indeed, we will see how much she stamps tonight at 5:30pm
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perhaps the greens will stamp their feet too"I hope they do with great big boots!! And get thier referendum then maybe we can finally put the issue to bed once and for all one way or the other | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
Yes indeed, we will see how much she stamps tonight at 5:30pm
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perhaps the greens will stamp their feet too"NS will get her section 30 passed. The Greens will turn a blind eye to their manifesto, having been promised things behind closed doors, and help NS get the required majority. The PM will say No now, tomorrow, next year, and for as long as she sees prudent. SNP MPs will cause mischief at Westminster. Scotland will get more divisive. That's how it's going to play out. | |||
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"Well it seems that May has told sturgeon NO!! I bet she's stamping her little feet in a tantrum now
Yes indeed, we will see how much she stamps tonight at 5:30pm
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perhaps the greens will stamp their feet too
NS will get her section 30 passed. The Greens will turn a blind eye to their manifesto, having been promised things behind closed doors, and help NS get the required majority.
The PM will say No now, tomorrow, next year, and for as long as she sees prudent.
SNP MPs will cause mischief at Westminster.
Scotland will get more divisive.
That's how it's going to play out."no need to buy a ticket then, will may comment tonight or 10am tomorrow | |||
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