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Trump: 'We will build Mexico border wall'

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

This Morning

Donald Trump has said a "big day" is planned on national security, including an announcement to build a wall on the border between the US and Mexico

.

so the build process begins

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

The whole idea is ridiculous. But I am sure that property tycoon The Donald has loads of mates who will supply the concrete and construction workers (most Hispanic) to build it.

However a wall needs guarding and patrolling. It was not the Berlin Wall or the fence that kept people from fleeing Eastern Europe in the Soviet days, all they did was slow them down. It was the soldiers with rifles who shot dead anyone caught climbing the wall or fence that kept people in, and it is easier to keep people in than out (it takes longer to climb up a wall than it does to drop down from the top of a wall).

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France

It's mostly trump bullshit;

700 miles of it already exist under the secure fence act 2006; the rest is monitored by surveillance devices.

They stopped building it when it was realised that the budget to build it would exceed the total budget for the border force for the next 20 years; and that they couldn't really patrol or monitor it, or maintain it effectively.

I suspect it is a bit of showmanship; he signs, says he is going to build a wall, in a few months or weeks he will show pictures of the already existing wall/ fence and tell everyone what a success " his" wall has been.

More alternative facts;

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"It's mostly trump bullshit;

700 miles of it already exist under the secure fence act 2006; the rest is monitored by surveillance devices.

They stopped building it when it was realised that the budget to build it would exceed the total budget for the border force for the next 20 years; and that they couldn't really patrol or monitor it, or maintain it effectively.

I suspect it is a bit of showmanship; he signs, says he is going to build a wall, in a few months or weeks he will show pictures of the already existing wall/ fence and tell everyone what a success " his" wall has been.

More alternative facts;

"

Geeee

You should apply for a job as "Advisor" to Trump, I am sure he would benefit from all your "wisdom"

thanks for sharing

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"It's mostly trump bullshit;

700 miles of it already exist under the secure fence act 2006; the rest is monitored by surveillance devices.

They stopped building it when it was realised that the budget to build it would exceed the total budget for the border force for the next 20 years; and that they couldn't really patrol or monitor it, or maintain it effectively.

I suspect it is a bit of showmanship; he signs, says he is going to build a wall, in a few months or weeks he will show pictures of the already existing wall/ fence and tell everyone what a success " his" wall has been.

More alternative facts;

Geeee

You should apply for a job as "Advisor" to Trump, I am sure he would benefit from all your "wisdom"

thanks for sharing "

You're welcome

But no I wouldn't apply for a job with Trump;

For moral reasons;

And because I only act as an advisor to people who listen and understand the advice they are given.

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

"

I suspect that he is implying that the " punitive import taxes" that he threatens Mexico with, will pay for it.

Which is more nonsense, since if he stops all trade with Mexico, then there won't be any import taxes

You couldn't make this stuff up

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Did he not say that building would begin on his first day in office? I suppose he got sidetracked with more important issues. BTW, how many was actually at his coronation /inauguration?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Did he not say that building would begin on his first day in office? I suppose he got sidetracked with more important issues. BTW, how many was actually at his coronation /inauguration? "

more than the press reported

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Did he not say that building would begin on his first day in office? I suppose he got sidetracked with more important issues. BTW, how many was actually at his coronation /inauguration?

more than the press reported"

..but not as many as trump/Spicer said

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do. "

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order."

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

His long had he been in power ? Be realistic people all things take time you just cannot wave a wand and hey presto things take off right away.

Give it six months and then see what has been accomplished

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. "

....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

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By *eavenscentitCouple
over a year ago

barnstaple

Ohh god

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"the rest is monitored by surveillance devices.

They stopped building it when it was realised that the budget to build it would exceed the total budget for the border force for the next 20 years; and that they couldn't really patrol or monitor it, or maintain it effectively."

This is exactly it. Anyone who knows anything about border patrol on the Mexican-American border knows that surveillance drones are the future of domestic border patrol. Its cheaper and more feasible. Not to mention that more illegal Mexicans are leaving American than entering.

But the fact of the matter is that unlike Democrat presidents, Trump is doing everything he said he would. He is fulfilling his promises one executive order at a time. And his voters probably love him for it.

Whether his actions are constitutional or indeed whether they actually fix the problems his suporters take issue with is quite another matter.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

"

There is/was a policy document on his campaign website. It was a two page thing on un-headed paper as a PDF which said something along the lines of they were going to alter the financial regulations to include Western Union and the likes such that any transfer via them (e.g. Mexicans sending money home) would be subject to a levy under the Know You Customer anti-funding-terrorism laws.

My gut feeling is that would have fallen well short of the funds he needed.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is good. I have seen one part of the border, there is a lake and no border guards, so everyone can enter, there is no reason why illegal aliens would enter, every country have its own right to defend itself, look at how good hungary have done, they have fenced up itself from the immigration crisis

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

"

Trade embargo

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

Trade embargo"

But there has to be some kind of precedent in International law that enables one country to choose to construct a physical border and get the bordering country to pay for it.

If there is no precedent, then Trump is being a fool to himself saying that it will happen because Mexico will easily be able to roll back all of Trumps speeches to point out the illegality of what he attempts do via punitive taxation (or similar).

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"His long had he been in power ? Be realistic people all things take time you just cannot wave a wand and hey presto things take off right away.

Give it six months and then see what has been accomplished "

It's not us holding him to unrealistic expectations. TRUMP said he would start it on day 1. He didn't.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

Trade embargo

But there has to be some kind of precedent in International law that enables one country to choose to construct a physical border and get the bordering country to pay for it.

If there is no precedent, then Trump is being a fool to himself saying that it will happen because Mexico will easily be able to roll back all of Trumps speeches to point out the illegality of what he attempts do via punitive taxation (or similar)."

What he has confirmed in his latest interview is that the US taxpayer will pay for the wall and they will get payment back from Mexico. He said it may be via a 'complicated way' but they will get payment back. I guess that leaves him enough wiggle room to build the thing then come up with some convoluted plan that includes factoring in some kind of unprovable payment in kind. .eg. "They paid for the wall by NOT building that huge factory here [that they were never going to build]"... that sort of thing. The same way he has claimed he has created jobs by virtue of companies (e.g. Ford) NOT investing as much elsewhere.

-Matt

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados

Alternatively he'll just claim Mexico have paid. Despite them never having paid, or any evidence suggesting they have.

-Matt

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

Trade embargo

But there has to be some kind of precedent in International law that enables one country to choose to construct a physical border and get the bordering country to pay for it.

If there is no precedent, then Trump is being a fool to himself saying that it will happen because Mexico will easily be able to roll back all of Trumps speeches to point out the illegality of what he attempts do via punitive taxation (or similar)."

Cuba was a precedent

All he has to do is to place a trade embargo on Mexico. Their economy will start to suffer and perhaps they won't be able to pay for the entire wall but will be forced to pay for some of it

And no, he does not require international agreement for a US trade embargo

What will the world do? Place a trade embargo on the US? Unlikely

Whether it is right or wrong does not matter. He is keeping the promise he made to the people who voted for him

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"His long had he been in power ? Be realistic people all things take time you just cannot wave a wand and hey presto things take off right away.

Give it six months and then see what has been accomplished

It's not us holding him to unrealistic expectations. TRUMP said he would start it on day 1. He didn't."

Correct;

He started preparation's before he even took up presidency.

.

And now Planning has started, this is expected to take a couple of months

.

then construction begins

.

you don't go out building on day one unless you are a little piggy building with wood or straw.

.

President Trump will do it right, good planning and solid building

.

Mexico will pay for the wall, estimated cost $8bn (£6.4bn).

.

negotiations will start with Mexico relatively soon. And we will be - in a ""form"" - reimbursed by Mexico,

.

so again, you are correct, Trump didn't start on day one, he pre planned prior, then continued talks on day one and signed Wednesday.

.

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

.

Another promise held

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China. "

He also signed an action to strip funds from US cities that are sanctuaries for undocumented immigrants

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China.

He also signed an action to strip funds from US cities that are sanctuaries for undocumented immigrants"

And keep Guantamo open and reinstate torture.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

"

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China.

He also signed an action to strip funds from US cities that are sanctuaries for undocumented immigrants

And keep Guantamo open and reinstate torture.

"

The Guantanamo that Obama promised he would close but didn't.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China. "

Right, but the US already has a fence. Trump wants to build a solid wall 40' high.

-Matt

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt "

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China.

Right, but the US already has a fence. Trump wants to build a solid wall 40' high.

-Matt"

I am sure he was quoted saying "part of the wall was already there", he would just complete what was started

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall. "

Walls are a very basic technology. More drones would be more effective and cheaper. A wall does a have psychological effect it protects and limits.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall. "

Indeed. And that technology costs even more.

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall. Walls are a very basic technology. More drones would be more effective and cheaper. A wall does a have psychological effect it protects and limits."

I am sure there will be much more than a wall, more security, manning, drones, & strick penalties for any smugglers, any one sheltering and anyone caught entering illegally

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"At its most basic, a wall, border or even a basic picket fence psychologically makes people feel safer—whether or not it does in fact.The Great Wall of China did little to halt Genghis Khan and his Mongolian army from conquering 13th century China.

Right, but the US already has a fence. Trump wants to build a solid wall 40' high.

-Matt

I am sure he was quoted saying "part of the wall was already there", he would just complete what was started"

No. They have a fence there. Trump promised a wall. A big solid wall.

-Matt

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall. Walls are a very basic technology. More drones would be more effective and cheaper. A wall does a have psychological effect it protects and limits."

Someone commented on the amount of time it took to build the wall of China. They didn't have JCBs/diggers and heavy plant machinery or power tools then, nor did they have the supply chains for building materials that exist today. As for the use of drones that can be used in tandem with the wall to make it an even more effective new modern border.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt

Technology has moved on a fair bit since the Chinese built their wall. Walls are a very basic technology. More drones would be more effective and cheaper. A wall does a have psychological effect it protects and limits.

Someone commented on the amount of time it took to build the wall of China. They didn't have JCBs/diggers and heavy plant machinery or power tools then, nor did they have the supply chains for building materials that exist today. As for the use of drones that can be used in tandem with the wall to make it an even more effective new modern border. "

No, you are right they didn't have that machinery... but then they were not building as high and could rely on forced labour.

So the wall is estimated to need about 3 times the volume of concrete of the Hoover dam. Now, it might not be as challenging a construction as that... but that still took about 10 years planning and 5 years construction.

But hey... it would create jobs

And then as I overheard someone say a while back "A wall?! We've got a fucking moat and that doesn't keep the buggers out".

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They could always grow a hedge

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"They could always grow a hedge"

nope, have to import water

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool. "

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Jon snow approves of this thread

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"His long had he been in power ? Be realistic people all things take time you just cannot wave a wand and hey presto things take off right away.

Give it six months and then see what has been accomplished

It's not us holding him to unrealistic expectations. TRUMP said he would start it on day 1. He didn't.

Correct;

He started preparation's before he even took up presidency.

.

And now Planning has started, this is expected to take a couple of months

.

then construction begins

.

you don't go out building on day one unless you are a little piggy building with wood or straw.

.

President Trump will do it right, good planning and solid building

.

Mexico will pay for the wall, estimated cost $8bn (£6.4bn).

.

negotiations will start with Mexico relatively soon. And we will be - in a ""form"" - reimbursed by Mexico,

.

so again, you are correct, Trump didn't start on day one, he pre planned prior, then continued talks on day one and signed Wednesday.

.

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

.

Another promise held "

....a big beautiful wall,Mexico will pay for it,they just don't know it yet...l never heard such a load of codswallop in my life. Oh wait I did. He's going to investigate voting fraud, even though his own party know nothing about it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw. "

I love how easy Trump supporters make this sound. If he is determined to build it, then he can go right ahead. But we shouldn't lie to ourselves about how difficult it is going to be. The landscape is very tricky and some estimates say it will cost 2-3 times Trump's estimate.

Not to mention that much of the border activity these days goes via tunnels under the ground. I'd be interested in how far down they are going to build this wall.....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw.

I love how easy Trump supporters make this sound. If he is determined to build it, then he can go right ahead. But we shouldn't lie to ourselves about how difficult it is going to be. The landscape is very tricky and some estimates say it will cost 2-3 times Trump's estimate.

Not to mention that much of the border activity these days goes via tunnels under the ground. I'd be interested in how far down they are going to build this wall....."

....to paraphrase,trust me its gonna be great,

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Let's all be honest.....it's a bit of a silly idea isn't it

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By *imited 3EditionCouple
over a year ago

Live in Scotland Play in England


"It's mostly trump bullshit;

700 miles of it already exist under the secure fence act 2006; the rest is monitored by surveillance devices.

They stopped building it when it was realised that the budget to build it would exceed the total budget for the border force for the next 20 years; and that they couldn't really patrol or monitor it, or maintain it effectively.

I suspect it is a bit of showmanship; he signs, says he is going to build a wall, in a few months or weeks he will show pictures of the already existing wall/ fence and tell everyone what a success " his" wall has been.

More alternative facts;

"

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By *ensualtouch15Man
over a year ago

ashby de la zouch


"Let's all be honest.....it's a bit of a silly idea isn't it "

The concept is pathetic

Stupid and racist

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw. "

China are pretty good at making big concrete things.... he could order them from there

He could get them pre-cast with his face in them... like a 2000 mile long Mount Rushmore!

-Matt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Let's all be honest.....it's a bit of a silly idea isn't it

The concept is pathetic

Stupid and racist

"

....much like the idiot who's pushing it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"He could get them pre-cast with his face in them... like a 2000 mile long Mount Rushmore!

-Matt"

Don't give him any ideas, please! I can see it now - 2,000 fucking miles of trump's face cast into concrete and painted gold.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth


"Let's all be honest.....it's a bit of a silly idea isn't it

The concept is pathetic

Stupid and racist

....much like the idiot who's pushing it "

Would that be the idiot who took on the US political machine in both parties plus large sections of the media and still won ? Not saying I am a fan but he is a winner like him or not

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw.

China are pretty good at making big concrete things.... he could order them from there

He could get them pre-cast with his face in them... like a 2000 mile long Mount Rushmore!

-Matt"

Bizarrely; logistics dictate that the only companies who could build it are probably Mexican.

Shares in the largest Mexican concrete company have just gone stratospheric

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By *omaMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

"

Watch this space, This very very shrewd business man,Trump, will even find a way to have Mexico pay for it.

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"Thing is, I am not sure what gets his disciples most excited - just building the wall or building it and getting someone else to pay for it.

As a matter of interest, by exactly what legal mechanism can you elect to build something and require someone else to pay for it? I never really understood that.

Watch this space, This very very shrewd business man,Trump, will even find a way to have Mexico pay for it.

"

Like the way he has gotten Russia to ball out his businesses and finance his campaign? I'm not sure that is shrewd, I think they just have a lot of leverage over him financially.

-Matt

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral


"The whole idea is ridiculous. But I am sure that property tycoon The Donald has loads of mates who will supply the concrete and construction workers (most Hispanic) to build it.

However a wall needs guarding and patrolling. It was not the Berlin Wall or the fence that kept people from fleeing Eastern Europe in the Soviet days, all they did was slow them down. It was the soldiers with rifles who shot dead anyone caught climbing the wall or fence that kept people in, and it is easier to keep people in than out (it takes longer to climb up a wall than it does to drop down from the top of a wall)."

Maybe his real reason for building it is to keep Americans in,they might want to get away from him

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By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago

Barbados


"For me the wall is a symbolic statement.Style over substance.A fence and drones and more man power would be cheaper and more effective.Bricks and concrete is old skool.

I doubt many bricks will be used. Trump could just order pre-made, pre-fabricated reinforced concrete slabs and have them shipped to the site. Then cranes just lift the slabs and fit them together like a jigsaw.

China are pretty good at making big concrete things.... he could order them from there

He could get them pre-cast with his face in them... like a 2000 mile long Mount Rushmore!

-Matt

Bizarrely; logistics dictate that the only companies who could build it are probably Mexican.

Shares in the largest Mexican concrete company have just gone stratospheric

"

Whoa yeah, Cemex? They are about triple the price they were this time last year. They have been steadily rising all year though, so not sure if all Trump's doing. So i wonder which one of Trump hundreds of interlinked companies hold shares in Cemex?

-Matt

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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge


"

Its not as if its the wall of china, its only 2000 miles long

No indeed. It is only half the length of the Great Wall of China. And their wall only took them in the most about 300 years to complete it (they did some minimal building work for the 2000 year beforehand). And Trump's wall is going to be twice as high.

So yeah, easy peasy.

-Matt "

Did Mexico pay for that one too?

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By *risky_MareWoman
over a year ago

...Up on the Downs

Mexico's President has said 'No way Jose are we paying for a wall' so I can't imagine why Trump ever thought they would.

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By *iamondjoeMan
over a year ago

Glastonbury

*as Jose, toiling Mexican worker*

"How high you want theese wall, senior Trump?"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Mexico's President has said 'No way Jose are we paying for a wall' so I can't imagine why Trump ever thought they would. "

There's more than one way to skin a cat. Add to the debt the Mexico owns or wipe out any debt that America owes them. Things aren't always like paying with cash.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ford have decided to spend 1.6Bn dollars on a new plant in Michigan instead of in Mexico so kudos to him for creating jobs for American citizens though. My personal beliefs is that huge businesses should keep as much money as possible circulating within its own economy

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By *onnyJohnMan
over a year ago

Doncaster


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went. "

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will.

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"Ford have decided to spend 1.6Bn dollars on a new plant in Michigan instead of in Mexico so kudos to him for creating jobs for American citizens though."

Not quite...

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN14N1T0

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"Mexico's President has said 'No way Jose are we paying for a wall' so I can't imagine why Trump ever thought they would.

There's more than one way to skin a cat. Add to the debt the Mexico owns or wipe out any debt that America owes them. Things aren't always like paying with cash."

US aid to Mexico is currently worth around 400m USD per year. So if the wall costs 8bn it should only take 20 years for Mexico to "pay" in "form" for the wall.

If Trump uses import tariffs to "pay" for the wall, then he'll be charging US consumers for the wall.

If Trump uses export tariffs he will widen their trade deficit with Mexico and he'll look silly even by Trumpian standards, most likely Mexico will pay for the imaginary wall in an imaginary form.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will."

..the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They will just tunnel under the wall !!!!!

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Roger Waters will have a "New Wall" to sing about

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Roger Waters will have a "New Wall" to sing about "
....slight change of lyrics though.

All and all

Its just another prick with a wall

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will...the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies."

India is an Asian country whose indigenous people are Indians!

First Nations is the correct term for these people.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will...the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies.

India is an Asian country whose indigenous people are Indians!

First Nations is the correct term for these people. "

....oh dear I've made a pc boo boo. The "first nations " refer to themselves as American Indians or native Indians. But do feel free to correct my terminology at any time,while trump and his buddies continue on a daily basis to assault and disenfranchise them.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will...the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies.

India is an Asian country whose indigenous people are Indians!

First Nations is the correct term for these people. "

Tell me?

were Asian's not first to populate America

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"Trump his keeping his promise to the people who elected him. He promised to build a wall on his campaign trail and now he is carrying out that promise. So what is the problem then? People are sick and tired of politicians breaking their promises, saying one thing during election campaigns and then doing something else once they are elected. As least Trump is doing what he said he was gonna do.

Really?

He promised to get America working again, he has stopped all Federal recruitment. Any vacant post on the 22/1/2017 is not to be filled by presidential order.

This thread is about the wall on Mexico's border, he is keeping that promise, end of.

If you want to take the thread of on a tangent about jobs then fine, he just signed an executive order yesterday to begin construction on the new oil pipelines. That will create 28,000 new construction jobs. ....yes he's gonna build pipelines through land he doesn't own,the owner of dpl is a large contributor and a close personal friend of his. The last time a yellowhair fucked with the Indians, well we all know how that went.

Building through land he doesn't own.... HS2 ? Or indeed any major infrastructure project in the last 50 years... they want to build it then they will...the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies.

India is an Asian country whose indigenous people are Indians!

First Nations is the correct term for these people.

Tell me?

were Asian's not first to populate America"

In reality , probably, given DNA and carbon dating; the most probable theory is that they were central Asians, ( Paleo-Indians) who migrated up to the Bering Straits area ( when it was still a land bridge, and then migrated across Nirth America and down the coast to South America .

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


".the Dakota pipeline isn't a public infrastructure project. It's a private oI'll company running roughshod over an Indian reservation. And will go straight through their drinking water supply,and traditional burial grounds. It could be rerouted, but would cut into the profits of trump''s buddies."
.

I don't think that's quite true.

It was going to run through Indian reservation land but they refused the money so they moved it to army land I belive, there argument now is any leaks will still cause pollution to they're water which they see as sacred.

The truth is Indians land rights have been fucked over by the US government for decades... Trump is a dick but Hillary and Obama were also more than happy to crack skulls open in Dakota, they even oversaw locking up journalists from democracy now for reporting from there.

Like I said ALL that matters is trade and trade needs energy and even good people like Obama ain't gonna stop that!

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Would be funny if the USA stop the funding Mexican drug interdiction to fund building the wall and the Mexicans reply in kind by stopping all anti drug smuggling operations and effectively telling the cartels that if they leave the Mexican people alone the Mexican authorities will not interfere with their cross border operations...

I think that could make the Donald fart so great that he may well follow through!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Would be funny if the USA stop the funding Mexican drug interdiction to fund building the wall and the Mexicans reply in kind by stopping all anti drug smuggling operations and effectively telling the cartels that if they leave the Mexican people alone the Mexican authorities will not interfere with their cross border operations...

I think that could make the Donald fart so great that he may well follow through! "

...you think flooding a country with illegal drugs would be funny.?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"you think flooding a country with illegal drugs would be funny.?"

I think that if Donald The Fart chooses to divert funding given to Mexico to help stop drugs entering the USA and use it to build a wall then it is perfectly reasonable for Mexcio to redeploy all the resources it has been using to protect the USA to protecting its own people and let the USA get on with protecting its people by building its wall.

Maybe you have a different view. If so maybe you would like to explain it to me. I may change my opinion.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"you think flooding a country with illegal drugs would be funny.?

I think that if Donald The Fart chooses to divert funding given to Mexico to help stop drugs entering the USA and use it to build a wall then it is perfectly reasonable for Mexcio to redeploy all the resources it has been using to protect the USA to protecting its own people and let the USA get on with protecting its people by building its wall.

Maybe you have a different view. If so maybe you would like to explain it to me. I may change my opinion."

...I know what your saying...but would never find it funny.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"you think flooding a country with illegal drugs would be funny.?

I think that if Donald The Fart chooses to divert funding given to Mexico to help stop drugs entering the USA and use it to build a wall then it is perfectly reasonable for Mexcio to redeploy all the resources it has been using to protect the USA to protecting its own people and let the USA get on with protecting its people by building its wall.

Maybe you have a different view. If so maybe you would like to explain it to me. I may change my opinion....I know what your saying...but would never find it funny."

Unless you were under the influence of the smuggled product

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"I know what your saying...but would never find it funny."

The USA have put a conman and criminal in the Whitehouse. The sooner and the more starkly that the American people are forced to confront the consequences of their actions the better. Maybe the Mexican President will do us all that favour, I doubt it.

Unfortunately I believe that May and others like her will now do everything they can to reduce effects of his actions and in that way curry favour with the Donald. Of course we all know there is no honour amongst thieves and we are the ones who will eventually pay the price of donny the fart.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"you think flooding a country with illegal drugs would be funny.?

I think that if Donald The Fart chooses to divert funding given to Mexico to help stop drugs entering the USA and use it to build a wall then it is perfectly reasonable for Mexcio to redeploy all the resources it has been using to protect the USA to protecting its own people and let the USA get on with protecting its people by building its wall.

Maybe you have a different view. If so maybe you would like to explain it to me. I may change my opinion....I know what your saying...but would never find it funny.

Unless you were under the influence of the smuggled product "

...after losing a dear brother to the scourge of illegal drugs... I very much doubt it.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Unless you were under the influence of the smuggled product "

I wish!

Haven't tasted space cake or had a hash cookie for decades. OK since my student days in the mid 70's.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"after losing a dear brother to the scourge of illegal drugs... I very much doubt it. "

Sorry for my flippant reply earlier, you have my sympathy.

On a slightly different note, I think the remark about being under the influence was aimed at me, and to be honest I found it quite amusing. Again sorry if I have moved this thread in a direction that has caused you distress, it was not my intention.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"after losing a dear brother to the scourge of illegal drugs... I very much doubt it.

Sorry for my flippant reply earlier, you have my sympathy.

On a slightly different note, I think the remark about being under the influence was aimed at me, and to be honest I found it quite amusing. Again sorry if I have moved this thread in a direction that has caused you distress, it was not my intention."

..thank-you.. No need to apologise though..always happy to debate with you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The war on drugs is over and drugs won!

The world's most extensive study of the drug trade has just been published in the medical journal BMJ Open, providing the first "global snapshot" of four decades of the war on drugs. You can already guess the result. The war on drugs could not have been a bigger failure. To sum up their most important findings, the average purity of heroin and cocaine have increased, respectively, 60 percent and 11 percent between 1990 and 2007. Cannabis purity is up a whopping 161 percent over that same time. Not only are drugs way purer than ever, they're also way, way cheaper. Coke is on an 80 percent discount from 1990, heroin 81 percent, cannabis 86 percent. After a trillion dollars spent on the drug war, now is the greatest time in history to get high.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"The war on drugs is over and drugs won!

The world's most extensive study of the drug trade has just been published in the medical journal BMJ Open, providing the first "global snapshot" of four decades of the war on drugs. You can already guess the result. The war on drugs could not have been a bigger failure. To sum up their most important findings, the average purity of heroin and cocaine have increased, respectively, 60 percent and 11 percent between 1990 and 2007. Cannabis purity is up a whopping 161 percent over that same time. Not only are drugs way purer than ever, they're also way, way cheaper. Coke is on an 80 percent discount from 1990, heroin 81 percent, cannabis 86 percent. After a trillion dollars spent on the drug war, now is the greatest time in history to get high. "

Yep...

It is sad, everyone knows that the use of prohibition does not work. All it does is provide an environment where organised crime can flourish and grow. But the bible/quran (insert any other religious text) thumping conservatives who demand that everyone live in the way they decree continually rush to ban anything they do not approve of and for the most part we the sheeple follow meekly behind as they lead the way into another shitheap...

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth


"The war on drugs is over and drugs won!

The world's most extensive study of the drug trade has just been published in the medical journal BMJ Open, providing the first "global snapshot" of four decades of the war on drugs. You can already guess the result. The war on drugs could not have been a bigger failure. To sum up their most important findings, the average purity of heroin and cocaine have increased, respectively, 60 percent and 11 percent between 1990 and 2007. Cannabis purity is up a whopping 161 percent over that same time. Not only are drugs way purer than ever, they're also way, way cheaper. Coke is on an 80 percent discount from 1990, heroin 81 percent, cannabis 86 percent. After a trillion dollars spent on the drug war, now is the greatest time in history to get high.

Yep...

It is sad, everyone knows that the use of prohibition does not work. All it does is provide an environment where organised crime can flourish and grow. But the bible/quran (insert any other religious text) thumping conservatives who demand that everyone live in the way they decree continually rush to ban anything they do not approve of and for the most part we the sheeple follow meekly behind as they lead the way into another shitheap..."

So you are saying that drugs should be freely available, perhaps you need to see some of the results from people getting hooked on them, you have already apologised for upsetting one poster who had a family member die from taking drugs, anyone who thinks using highly addictive drugs is anything but destructive to the person themselves their family and society in general is totally deluded

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The war on drugs is over and drugs won!

The world's most extensive study of the drug trade has just been published in the medical journal BMJ Open, providing the first "global snapshot" of four decades of the war on drugs. You can already guess the result. The war on drugs could not have been a bigger failure. To sum up their most important findings, the average purity of heroin and cocaine have increased, respectively, 60 percent and 11 percent between 1990 and 2007. Cannabis purity is up a whopping 161 percent over that same time. Not only are drugs way purer than ever, they're also way, way cheaper. Coke is on an 80 percent discount from 1990, heroin 81 percent, cannabis 86 percent. After a trillion dollars spent on the drug war, now is the greatest time in history to get high.

Yep...

It is sad, everyone knows that the use of prohibition does not work. All it does is provide an environment where organised crime can flourish and grow. But the bible/quran (insert any other religious text) thumping conservatives who demand that everyone live in the way they decree continually rush to ban anything they do not approve of and for the most part we the sheeple follow meekly behind as they lead the way into another shitheap...

So you are saying that drugs should be freely available, perhaps you need to see some of the results from people getting hooked on them, you have already apologised for upsetting one poster who had a family member die from taking drugs, anyone who thinks using highly addictive drugs is anything but destructive to the person themselves their family and society in general is totally deluded"

Portugal decriminalised the possession of all drugs for personal use in 2001.The reality is that Portugal’s drug situation has improved significantly in several key areas. Most notably, HIV infections and drug-related deaths have decreased, while the dramatic rise in use feared by some has failed to materialise.

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By *iamondjoeMan
over a year ago

Glastonbury


"The war on drugs is over and drugs won!

The world's most extensive study of the drug trade has just been published in the medical journal BMJ Open, providing the first "global snapshot" of four decades of the war on drugs. You can already guess the result. The war on drugs could not have been a bigger failure. To sum up their most important findings, the average purity of heroin and cocaine have increased, respectively, 60 percent and 11 percent between 1990 and 2007. Cannabis purity is up a whopping 161 percent over that same time. Not only are drugs way purer than ever, they're also way, way cheaper. Coke is on an 80 percent discount from 1990, heroin 81 percent, cannabis 86 percent. After a trillion dollars spent on the drug war, now is the greatest time in history to get high.

Yep...

It is sad, everyone knows that the use of prohibition does not work. All it does is provide an environment where organised crime can flourish and grow. But the bible/quran (insert any other religious text) thumping conservatives who demand that everyone live in the way they decree continually rush to ban anything they do not approve of and for the most part we the sheeple follow meekly behind as they lead the way into another shitheap...

So you are saying that drugs should be freely available, perhaps you need to see some of the results from people getting hooked on them, you have already apologised for upsetting one poster who had a family member die from taking drugs, anyone who thinks using highly addictive drugs is anything but destructive to the person themselves their family and society in general is totally deluded"

]

I was a drugs/alcohol/mental health worker for a charity, in London for 10 years. I've seen it at the sharp end.

I understand your upset but as stated prohibition hasn't and doesn't work.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"So you are saying that drugs should be freely available, perhaps you need to see some of the results from people getting hooked on them, you have already apologised for upsetting one poster who had a family member die from taking drugs, anyone who thinks using highly addictive drugs is anything but destructive to the person themselves their family and society in general is totally deluded"

I know that in the 19th century Laudanum was available in any pharmacist and widely used and there were opium dens in most towns and cities but the problem was in the open and easily managed. I know there will always be some who become addicted to alkaloidal stimulants and depressants and also psychotropic substances. I know that drug use has spiralled out of control since the introduction of Controlled Substances Act 1970 and the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971. I know that every time the authorities increase the punishments for trafficking the drugs cartels increase the potency of the drugs being supplied. I know that 40 years ago if you wanted cannabis you had to seriously go hunting for it because it was not available. I know that where ever I go now I can almost guarantee walking past someone openly smoking a joint.

Personally, I know that if I am in a hole I do not bet out by digging! I do not know we as a society do we all stop digging and that is more disturbing than anything.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border."

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting"

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

well in the last couple of minutes we have found out how the trump administration plans on paying for it....

a 20% tax on all imports coming in from mexico

that is against NAFTA rules... NAFTA is now basically dead...

that would also be against WTO rules as well...

can someone now say "trade war".... or it will have to be one hell of a climb down

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Throwback to 2011 on the roast of Donald trump.

It's pronounced I'm fucking delusional. Not I'm running for president

Well worth watching

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest. "

I actually think this is exactly the type of thing he does lose sleep over - he'll see it as a personal insult

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"well in the last couple of minutes we have found out how the trump administration plans on paying for it....

a 20% tax on all imports coming in from mexico

that is against NAFTA rules... NAFTA is now basically dead...

that would also be against WTO rules as well...

can someone now say "trade war".... or it will have to be one hell of a climb down"

And by that Trump has shot himself in the foot because all those men in the street all those that voted for more jobs when they find out the Mexican things they have bought for years will be going up 20% they will be up in arms.

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest.

I actually think this is exactly the type of thing he does lose sleep over - he'll see it as a personal insult "

Yes; he is fucking furious;

His body language gave it away this afternoon; ( but already he is spinning it that he told the Mexicans not to visit).

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest.

I actually think this is exactly the type of thing he does lose sleep over - he'll see it as a personal insult "

The Mexican President will be losing sleep if he loses all his trade to America that's for sure.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"well in the last couple of minutes we have found out how the trump administration plans on paying for it....

a 20% tax on all imports coming in from mexico

that is against NAFTA rules... NAFTA is now basically dead...

that would also be against WTO rules as well...

can someone now say "trade war".... or it will have to be one hell of a climb down

And by that Trump has shot himself in the foot because all those men in the street all those that voted for more jobs when they find out the Mexican things they have bought for years will be going up 20% they will be up in arms."

Maybe they will instead purchase American goods which will become cheaper in comparison. It is not as if Mexico produces anything that the Americans do not produce or could not produce

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest.

I actually think this is exactly the type of thing he does lose sleep over - he'll see it as a personal insult

The Mexican President will be losing sleep if he loses all his trade to America that's for sure. "

Ok. I still think trump is more bothered by this than you seem to think he is.

The president of Mexico is being publicly laughed at by trump - he has to stand up for himself or be trump's bitch - and he made his choice. Let's see what trump does now.

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By *anes HubbyCouple
over a year ago

Babbacombe Torquay

[Removed by poster at 26/01/17 22:14:50]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"His aggressive stance against Mexico has just ratcheted up another notch.

He is now suggesting next weeks meeting be cancelled "if Mexico doesn't want to pay for the badly needed wall."

Where is he going with this? He can get as aggressive as he wants but he MUST now that it would be NO BENEFIT at all to the United States to have an economic basket case on their southern border.

looks like mexico called trumps bluff.... they have cancelled the meeting

Don't think Trump is going to lose any sleep over it to be honest.

I actually think this is exactly the type of thing he does lose sleep over - he'll see it as a personal insult

The Mexican President will be losing sleep if he loses all his trade to America that's for sure.

Ok. I still think trump is more bothered by this than you seem to think he is.

The president of Mexico is being publicly laughed at by trump - he has to stand up for himself or be trump's bitch - and he made his choice. Let's see what trump does now."

...I was just looking at the trade figures for Mexico /USA. Really big numbers. Trump is playing a high stakes game. His balls are definitely bigger than his brain

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By *anes HubbyCouple
over a year ago

Babbacombe Torquay

Trump needs to get backing from Congress regarding the wall yet, construction costs estimates range from between Eight and Ten Billion US Dollars......he today eluded to implimenting a 20% tax on goods imported from Mexico to finance the wall, Congress would not be certain to back that.....early indications are that many Republicans are not in favour.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 26/01/17 22:16:11]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth!

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By *iamondjoeMan
over a year ago

Glastonbury


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth! "

Fuck yeah! It's car-crash-TV-reality-politics-international-situation-comedy.

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By *iamondjoeMan
over a year ago

Glastonbury


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth!

Fuck yeah! It's car-crash-TV-reality-politics-international-situation-comedy.

"

But Brexit is the bigger danger.

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By *ixson-BallsMan
over a year ago

Blackpool

according tohttps://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/mexico....

20% tariff of the 58 billion trade deficit will pay for the wall (estimated at 12-15 billion dollars)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"according tohttps://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/mexico....

20% tariff of the 58 billion trade deficit will pay for the wall (estimated at 12-15 billion dollars) "

...I think that would be illegal. .but I'm open to correction

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"well in the last couple of minutes we have found out how the trump administration plans on paying for it....

a 20% tax on all imports coming in from mexico

that is against NAFTA rules... NAFTA is now basically dead...

that would also be against WTO rules as well...

can someone now say "trade war".... or it will have to be one hell of a climb down

And by that Trump has shot himself in the foot because all those men in the street all those that voted for more jobs when they find out the Mexican things they have bought for years will be going up 20% they will be up in arms.

Maybe they will instead purchase American goods which will become cheaper in comparison. It is not as if Mexico produces anything that the Americans do not produce or could not produce"

Won't happen if America could produce goods cheaper than Mexico there would be no goods imported from Mexico because nobody would buy them.

It all comes down to price to the man in the street, yes many people will say we should all buy home made goods support the country but the reality is people don't.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"well in the last couple of minutes we have found out how the trump administration plans on paying for it....

a 20% tax on all imports coming in from mexico

that is against NAFTA rules... NAFTA is now basically dead...

that would also be against WTO rules as well...

can someone now say "trade war".... or it will have to be one hell of a climb down

And by that Trump has shot himself in the foot because all those men in the street all those that voted for more jobs when they find out the Mexican things they have bought for years will be going up 20% they will be up in arms.

Maybe they will instead purchase American goods which will become cheaper in comparison. It is not as if Mexico produces anything that the Americans do not produce or could not produce

Won't happen if America could produce goods cheaper than Mexico there would be no goods imported from Mexico because nobody would buy them.

It all comes down to price to the man in the street, yes many people will say we should all buy home made goods support the country but the reality is people don't. "

The 20% tariff on Mexican imports will automatically make the American goods cheaper

You are correct; wages in the US are higher than in Mexico so it will otherwise be very difficult to compete

Also, manufacturing costs are higher in the developed world compared to the third world as there is a lot more regulation here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth! "

At least it makes our politicians look relatively normal for once.

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By *ndigo40Woman
over a year ago

secret town

I like Trump

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth!

At least it makes our politicians look relatively normal for once. "

...bring back Michael foot I say !!!!

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth!

At least it makes our politicians look relatively normal for once. "

Even Theresa Maybe

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 26/01/17 23:46:47]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just watching the news- facepalm again- every time he opens his mouth!

At least it makes our politicians look relatively normal for once. ...bring back Michael foot I say !!!! "

Come on that's getting silly now.

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"

Maybe they will instead purchase American goods which will become cheaper in comparison. It is not as if Mexico produces anything that the Americans do not produce or could not produce"

That margarita's just gone up in price

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"

Ok. I still think trump is more bothered by this than you seem to think he is.

The president of Mexico is being publicly laughed at by trump - he has to stand up for himself or be trump's bitch - and he made his choice. Let's see what trump does now."

There's definitely a touch of the narcissist about him, whether it's the 'more at my inauguration' or the 'voter fraud cost me the popular vote' sidetracks he seems to obsess about. Up until now he could browbeat bluff or buy the type of attention he obviously craves but now the circumstances are alien to him.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Ok. I still think trump is more bothered by this than you seem to think he is.

The president of Mexico is being publicly laughed at by trump - he has to stand up for himself or be trump's bitch - and he made his choice. Let's see what trump does now.

There's definitely a touch of the narcissist about him, whether it's the 'more at my inauguration' or the 'voter fraud cost me the popular vote' sidetracks he seems to obsess about. Up until now he could browbeat bluff or buy the type of attention he obviously craves but now the circumstances are alien to him."

So true Sir i made the exact observation ages ago putting aside if you agree or disagree everytime someone said something about him he didn't like he did not reply with facts provong them wrong he would give a reply a petulant child would give and thought what's he going to say when he goes to any country and they don't do exactly what he want's pick the ball up and say i'm not playing.I'm not a fan of Theresa May like a lot of people but i know i would prefer someone with a bit of diplomacy than bo ho i'm not playing with you anymore your not my friend anymore.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well to be honest since i will admit i never was Cambridge, Oxford or Presidential material i haven't got a clue though i have said many times over the years and proved it i'm not a physiologist but can read false people like a book people that say the right thing then do only what benefits themselves, there actions do not match there words probably why i dislike Nigel Farage so much.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer"

I've told you my answer.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer

I've told you my answer. "

It's obvious. He managed to win because he was considered a better option than the alternative. The funny thing is that the ones who slate him/dislike him most are the ones who created him.

A similar thing happened in the UK in the 70s. The Unions created Thatcher

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Donald trump!! For fuck sake she couldn't even fucking beat Donald fucking tiny hands trump..... What the fuck where the DNC playing at?.

The guy should have been a walk over, he's erratic, in cohesive, talks jibberish... It's the equivalent of being beaten by Kim Jung il in a free election.

.

Slag off and show these people for what they are by all means but save your venom for who's to blame for them getting there?..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The democrats!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer

I've told you my answer.

It's obvious. He managed to win because he was considered a better option than the alternative. The funny thing is that the ones who slate him/dislike him most are the ones who created him.

A similar thing happened in the UK in the 70s. The Unions created Thatcher"

That is ridiculous. The people who slate him didn't stop him, but they didn't "help create him." The people who voted for him and supported him created him. I can see the blame shifting for all of his ridiculous policies already.

I was in the US for a while before the election - I told everyone that I thought trump was going to win. And it had everything to do with the underlying topic of this very thread. The one people in the UK get angry for mentioning. Many of his supporters in the US have no problem with admitting why they voted for him.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The democrats!"

No. The American people are to blame for getting him there. Saying it's the democrats is a cop-out. People supported him - they weren't just voting against the dems. Eventually we're all going to have to accept that people actually like trump. This wasn't one big example of a protest vote.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"You are correct; wages in the US are higher than in Mexico so it will otherwise be very difficult to compete

Also, manufacturing costs are higher in the developed world compared to the third world as there is a lot more regulation here"

Are you aware that one of his first presidential decrees was to reduce federal manufacturing regulations?

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"You are correct; wages in the US are higher than in Mexico so it will otherwise be very difficult to compete

Also, manufacturing costs are higher in the developed world compared to the third world as there is a lot more regulation here

Are you aware that one of his first presidential decrees was to reduce federal manufacturing regulations?"

???

... and?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The democrats!

No. The American people are to blame for getting him there. Saying it's the democrats is a cop-out. People supported him - they weren't just voting against the dems. Eventually we're all going to have to accept that people actually like trump. This wasn't one big example of a protest vote. "

.

Did they support him or were they just out of options?.

If you just look at the economics between Bernie Sanders and trump... There not that far apart, the general theme was really the same, Bernie was and is of course a hundred times the man of trump, genuine, honest and what could be described as radical like trump only polar opposite radical ideas!.

Of course America has some underlying racism but I just don't buy the narrative being pushed that that's how trump got elected, that wouldn't explain how only 4 and 8 years before they elected a black guy with a Muslim middle name?... In fact I belive it's a continuation of the same problem that got Obama elected in the first place, if we think back to his original election it was really a message of this system needs radical change (I actually predicted Obama winning when he was just throwing his name in and all the commentators were saying he had no chance because the USA would never elect a black guy.. That was a good day at the bookmakers for me )... Anyhow when we look back to his election in 08 the banking crises had just unfolded and all those "change" signs were being waved around... That's all he needed to get elected, radical change is required.

Look back to his speeches, he said the president had powers to repeal the NAFTA agreement, it's built into the agreement, congress wouldn't be needed, he won in Iowa by telling farmers he would break up the monopoly of buyers, he won in Wisconsin by saying he'd reel in the bankers, said he'd end the money in politics... That's the real change he promised but just didn't deliver but of course he was still a much better candidate than Hillary four years later and the republicans were still hopeless opposition.

.

The radical change for good message just turned into radical change with trump, brexit etc etc....

I don't want trump, he's a nut job but I can see how he got power and it didn't come out of the blue

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer"

At last someone has asked the right question!

How did Brexit and Trump win?

The answer is simple O.C.E.A.N. (a psychometric theory developed by Michal Kosinski) and a company called Cambridge Analytica who have stolen/plagiarised his work and are using it to promote extreme right wing political causes by analysis of data-mined information to determine household and individuals personality type and targeting them with type specific advertising on the net. In this way we only see adds that are designed to appeal to our personality ( some to make us do and some to not do something). We will never see the adds that do not appeal to our personality type. Or any of the adds if we are not to be targeted.

Welcome to the brave new world and the forerunner of the Ministry of Truth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The democrats!

No. The American people are to blame for getting him there. Saying it's the democrats is a cop-out. People supported him - they weren't just voting against the dems. Eventually we're all going to have to accept that people actually like trump. This wasn't one big example of a protest vote. .

Did they support him or were they just out of options?.

If you just look at the economics between Bernie Sanders and trump... There not that far apart, the general theme was really the same, Bernie was and is of course a hundred times the man of trump, genuine, honest and what could be described as radical like trump only polar opposite radical ideas!.

Of course America has some underlying racism but I just don't buy the narrative being pushed that that's how trump got elected, that wouldn't explain how only 4 and 8 years before they elected a black guy with a Muslim middle name?... In fact I belive it's a continuation of the same problem that got Obama elected in the first place, if we think back to his original election it was really a message of this system needs radical change (I actually predicted Obama winning when he was just throwing his name in and all the commentators were saying he had no chance because the USA would never elect a black guy.. That was a good day at the bookmakers for me )... Anyhow when we look back to his election in 08 the banking crises had just unfolded and all those "change" signs were being waved around... That's all he needed to get elected, radical change is required.

Look back to his speeches, he said the president had powers to repeal the NAFTA agreement, it's built into the agreement, congress wouldn't be needed, he won in Iowa by telling farmers he would break up the monopoly of buyers, he won in Wisconsin by saying he'd reel in the bankers, said he'd end the money in politics... That's the real change he promised but just didn't deliver but of course he was still a much better candidate than Hillary four years later and the republicans were still hopeless opposition.

.

The radical change for good message just turned into radical change with trump, brexit etc etc....

I don't want trump, he's a nut job but I can see how he got power and it didn't come out of the blue"

They weren't out of options. Don't forgt that Bernie ran, too. He lost. So did 16 other republicans (or whatever the astronomical number was).

The primary system is skewed towards radicals in the US. Put 17 candidates in front of people in a primary and the one with the most vocal base is going to have a lot of power. What made trump different in the primary? Well, take a look at the speech where he announced his candidacy and it says it all, really. I'm not making up the racist element - I know people who voted for him because of it and they'll openly admit it. His racist policies pushed him to the forefront in the primaries, along with his brash opinions and way of talking.

The reason he beat Hillary had a lot to do with the base he cultivated in the primaries. It also had a lot to do with the fucked up electoral college. He won states that had a chip on their shoulder that Obama didn't fix (neither did Bush, I might add) and Hillary wasn't talking about. But the essence of his success still lies in racism. Is it Mexicans that took your jobs and gave you drugs? Trump agrees. Is it black people in the inner cities that are making your life dangerous and bringing down the country? Trump agrees. Is it arab/Muslims that are frightening you with terrorism when you go to the local Wal-Mart in Wyoming? Trump agrees. Vote Trump. Afterwards we'll say you voted on border control (mexicans), domestic security (muslims/blacks), and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job).

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer

At last someone has asked the right question!

How did Brexit and Trump win?

The answer is simple O.C.E.A.N. (a psychometric theory developed by Michal Kosinski) and a company called Cambridge Analytica who have stolen/plagiarised his work and are using it to promote extreme right wing political causes by analysis of data-mined information to determine household and individuals personality type and targeting them with type specific advertising on the net. In this way we only see adds that are designed to appeal to our personality ( some to make us do and some to not do something). We will never see the adds that do not appeal to our personality type. Or any of the adds if we are not to be targeted.

Welcome to the brave new world and the forerunner of the Ministry of Truth."

CA are more about suppressing than promotion, been caught out though

http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2017/01/25/511641939/facebook-tweaks-its-trending-topics-algorithm-to-better-reflect-real-news

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The democrats(under bill) weren't that different to new labour, they threw their hat in with the middle classes, the university graduates, the educated... The only problem with that idea is it's a small voter base! That's ok it works fine when you've seen that ever decreasing voter turnout and it's ok until those banks go tits... For awhile now we've sneered at the working classes, I mean as an entity they've been called every name under the sun, lazy, feckless, d*unk, rude, arrogant, racist, sexist, xenophobic, stupid, unwilling to change.

.

The working class have technically been in recession since 1980 for many reasons and all this wouldn't be a problem except somebody gave them a vote and there going to vote for somebody offering them a change!..... And it isn't going to to stop, it's spreading

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"They weren't out of options. Don't forgt that Bernie ran, too. He lost. So did 16 other republicans (or whatever the astronomical number was).

The primary system is skewed towards radicals in the US. Put 17 candidates in front of people in a primary and the one with the most vocal base is going to have a lot of power. What made trump different in the primary? Well, take a look at the speech where he announced his candidacy and it says it all, really. I'm not making up the racist element - I know people who voted for him because of it and they'll openly admit it. His racist policies pushed him to the forefront in the primaries, along with his brash opinions and way of talking.

The reason he beat Hillary had a lot to do with the base he cultivated in the primaries. It also had a lot to do with the fucked up electoral college. He won states that had a chip on their shoulder that Obama didn't fix (neither did Bush, I might add) and Hillary wasn't talking about. But the essence of his success still lies in racism. Is it Mexicans that took your jobs and gave you drugs? Trump agrees. Is it black people in the inner cities that are making your life dangerous and bringing down the country? Trump agrees. Is it arab/Muslims that are frightening you with terrorism when you go to the local Wal-Mart in Wyoming? Trump agrees. Vote Trump. Afterwards we'll say you voted on border control (mexicans), domestic security (muslims/blacks), and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job). "

See my post above...

There was a detailed article published on the subject in December last year by 'Das Magazin' Zurich under the title 'Trump Knows You Better Than You Know Yourself'.

Not only does it explain how the manipulation works, but who is know to have used it. There is at least one English translation complete with links to research references.

An interesting read...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They weren't out of options. Don't forgt that Bernie ran, too. He lost. So did 16 other republicans (or whatever the astronomical number was).

The primary system is skewed towards radicals in the US. Put 17 candidates in front of people in a primary and the one with the most vocal base is going to have a lot of power. What made trump different in the primary? Well, take a look at the speech where he announced his candidacy and it says it all, really. I'm not making up the racist element - I know people who voted for him because of it and they'll openly admit it. His racist policies pushed him to the forefront in the primaries, along with his brash opinions and way of talking.

The reason he beat Hillary had a lot to do with the base he cultivated in the primaries. It also had a lot to do with the fucked up electoral college. He won states that had a chip on their shoulder that Obama didn't fix (neither did Bush, I might add) and Hillary wasn't talking about. But the essence of his success still lies in racism. Is it Mexicans that took your jobs and gave you drugs? Trump agrees. Is it black people in the inner cities that are making your life dangerous and bringing down the country? Trump agrees. Is it arab/Muslims that are frightening you with terrorism when you go to the local Wal-Mart in Wyoming? Trump agrees. Vote Trump. Afterwards we'll say you voted on border control (mexicans), domestic security (muslims/blacks), and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job).

See my post above...

There was a detailed article published on the subject in December last year by 'Das Magazin' Zurich under the title 'Trump Knows You Better Than You Know Yourself'.

Not only does it explain how the manipulation works, but who is know to have used it. There is at least one English translation complete with links to research references.

An interesting read..."

I'll take a look out for the article. Thanks

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

https://antidotezine.com/2017/01/22/trump-knows-you/

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job). "
.

Not who you blame, who there telling you to blame, it's the chicken and the egg....

He got 20% of the Latino vote who were they blaming for taking their jobs?.... If your a bottom rung worker for one reason or another and there's always going to be these people you've been in competition with immigrants long before they immigrated.... That's globalisation, that's NAFTA and CAFTA and TTIP...Ttip which Obama was pushing for while Hillary was getting hammered by sanders on trade deals??.... That's what trump tapped into with his blame game

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It all comes back to sanders overriding message that nobody in politics ever talks about.... Getting money out of politics.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"They weren't out of options. Don't forgt that Bernie ran, too. He lost. So did 16 other republicans (or whatever the astronomical number was).

The primary system is skewed towards radicals in the US. Put 17 candidates in front of people in a primary and the one with the most vocal base is going to have a lot of power. What made trump different in the primary? Well, take a look at the speech where he announced his candidacy and it says it all, really. I'm not making up the racist element - I know people who voted for him because of it and they'll openly admit it. His racist policies pushed him to the forefront in the primaries, along with his brash opinions and way of talking.

The reason he beat Hillary had a lot to do with the base he cultivated in the primaries. It also had a lot to do with the fucked up electoral college. He won states that had a chip on their shoulder that Obama didn't fix (neither did Bush, I might add) and Hillary wasn't talking about. But the essence of his success still lies in racism. Is it Mexicans that took your jobs and gave you drugs? Trump agrees. Is it black people in the inner cities that are making your life dangerous and bringing down the country? Trump agrees. Is it arab/Muslims that are frightening you with terrorism when you go to the local Wal-Mart in Wyoming? Trump agrees. Vote Trump. Afterwards we'll say you voted on border control (mexicans), domestic security (muslims/blacks), and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job).

See my post above...

There was a detailed article published on the subject in December last year by 'Das Magazin' Zurich under the title 'Trump Knows You Better Than You Know Yourself'.

Not only does it explain how the manipulation works, but who is know to have used it. There is at least one English translation complete with links to research references.

An interesting read..."

He does use words well. For example his statement about ...

"The revolution that has taken place whereby the people now have the power. Power has been taken from Washington and given back to the people."

The statement is about as far from reality as could be and in time his propaganda will be unmasked for what it is. For now though, the typical redneck Trumpster would have suffered premature ejaculation hearing those words.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" and the economy(whoever you blame for taking your job). .

Not who you blame, who there telling you to blame, it's the chicken and the egg....

He got 20% of the Latino vote who were they blaming for taking their jobs?.... If your a bottom rung worker for one reason or another and there's always going to be these people you've been in competition with immigrants long before they immigrated.... That's globalisation, that's NAFTA and CAFTA and TTIP...Ttip which Obama was pushing for while Hillary was getting hammered by sanders on trade deals??.... That's what trump tapped into with his blame game"

I read an article during the election that talked about Hispanics who liked trump. They were usually legal immigrants who were angry at the illegal immigrants- you see, down by the border legal and illegal immigrants aren't really differentiated between except that employers tend to hire illegal ones so they don't have to pay minimum wage and the like.

It's all a blame game, and trump played it off people's racial biases. Anyone who thinks otherwise should spend some time traveling around the US - and I'm not talking about NYC and L.A. Go to where the trump voters are and chat a while.

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By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent


"https://antidotezine.com/2017/01/22/trump-knows-you/"

I was just about to link to that..

"In the Miami neighborhood of Little Haiti, Cambridge Analytica regaled residents with messages about the failures of the Clinton Foundation after the 2010 earthquake in Haiti, in order to dissuade them from turning out for Clinton. This was one of the goals: to get potential but wavering Clinton voters—skeptical leftists, African-Americans, young women—to stay home. To “suppress” their votes, as one Trump campaign staffer bluntly put it. In these so-called dark posts (paid Facebook ads which appear in the timelines only of users with a particular suitable personality profile), African-Americans, for example, are shown the nineties-era video of Hillary Clinton referring to black youth as “super predators.”

“Blanket advertising—the idea that a hundred million people will receive the same piece of direct mail, the same television advert, the same digital advert—is dead,” Nix begins to wrap up his presentation at the Concordia Summit. “My children will certainly never understand this concept of mass communication. Today, communication is becoming ever increasingly targeted."

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"He does use words well. For example his statement about ...

"The revolution that has taken place whereby the people now have the power. Power has been taken from Washington and given back to the people."

The statement is about as far from reality as could be and in time his propaganda will be unmasked for what it is. For now though, the typical redneck Trumpster would have suffered premature ejaculation hearing those words. "

Yep...

8 years ago when the Koch brothers were funding their AstroTurf Republican Tea-party they did say that all they were doing was laying the foundations and it would take 8 years till they were running America. Guess if you have enough cash and the will you can buy anyone (sometimes those you buy don't even know they were for sale)...

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"I was just about to link to that..

"In the Miami neighborhood of Little Haiti, Cambridge Analytica regaled residents with messages about the failures of the Clinton Foundation after the 2010 earthquake in Haiti, in order to dissuade them from turning out for Clinton. This was one of the goals: to get potential but wavering Clinton voters—skeptical leftists, African-Americans, young women—to stay home. To “suppress” their votes, as one Trump campaign staffer bluntly put it. In these so-called dark posts (paid Facebook ads which appear in the timelines only of users with a particular suitable personality profile), African-Americans, for example, are shown the nineties-era video of Hillary Clinton referring to black youth as “super predators.”

“Blanket advertising—the idea that a hundred million people will receive the same piece of direct mail, the same television advert, the same digital advert—is dead,” Nix begins to wrap up his presentation at the Concordia Summit. “My children will certainly never understand this concept of mass communication. Today, communication is becoming ever increasingly targeted.""

Scary isn't it...

I'm not sure which worries me more:

The fact that we can be so easily and cynically manipulated and that the manipulators hold us in such contempt that they are openly boastful about how they can shape our choices. Or that they are willing to sell their services to the highest bidder regardless of the consequences.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in"

I'm not against immigration control on the Mexican border. I'm all for it, in fact. However I think that a wall is a silly idea - it's more symbolic than effective. The US would do better to reform it's Mexican immigration policies and crack down on the companies who hire illegal immigrants. If no one hires them then they won't come.

As for the racist element - it comes in when we are talking about non-migrants. What I was referring to in my comments wasn't only immigrants from Mexico, it's black people who have been in the U.S. longer than my (and trump's) ancestors. Or Muslims who are legal citizens. Or indeed Mexicans who are legal immigrants.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

I'm not against immigration control on the Mexican border. I'm all for it, in fact. However I think that a wall is a silly idea - it's more symbolic than effective. The US would do better to reform it's Mexican immigration policies and crack down on the companies who hire illegal immigrants. If no one hires them then they won't come.

As for the racist element - it comes in when we are talking about non-migrants. What I was referring to in my comments wasn't only immigrants from Mexico, it's black people who have been in the U.S. longer than my (and trump's) ancestors. Or Muslims who are legal citizens. Or indeed Mexicans who are legal immigrants."

Agreed; targeting people who are already citizens just because of their ethnicity, is racist. Only an idiot would disagree

But immigration control needs to be implemented. Just having immigration policies is not enough

You and I can disagree with President Trump on his choice re: The Great Wall of America but that is what he has decided. Other enforcement strategies haven't worked either; neither will this one; but it might act as a wind-break

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A big part of the problem is nobody wants to "criticise" the so called good politicans because they don't want the other half in!.

That's understandable but then what you actually get is money influencing the good ones... Bill Clinton deregulated the finance industry not because he thought it would improve the life's of the people at bottom who voted for him, he did it for the rich who payed for election... Obama didn't need congress to set the FBI onto the CEOs of the banks who committed fraud, he could have jailed them and broke up the banks, he could have set up new national government banks with all that tarp money... Just like FDR did.

He could have broken up the monopoly of the buyers in the farming industry using the powers he already said were there in his speechs.... He didn't do these things of course because that's the insidious nature of money and it takes those very rare political beasts like FDR who just point blankly refuse to be brow beaten by money

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in"

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" The US would do better to reform it's Mexican immigration policies and crack down on the companies who hire illegal immigrants. If no one hires them then they won't come.

"

.

I keep saying this over and over... The immigration policies in the US are made by business for business, there the ones who profit from it and like the status quo.

Just introduce very big fines and prison sentences for company directors and for the main part illegal immigration will just disappear

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing."

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture"

.....you can say that again

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture"

No, he's right. And the American government is aware. The issue isn't with the government it's with the people who refuse to accept facts anymore. Net illegal mexican migration is negative in the U.S.

It was the recession that caused immigrants to go back to Mexico - jobs weren't as plentiful. Ironically its creating a real problem for fruit and vegetable farmers who need illegal immigrants to work their fields. There were hearings about it in congress a few years back. It goes back to what I said - if you want to stop illegal immigration in the US then remove the incentive and punish companies who hire them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

The fact that we can be so easily and cynically manipulated and that the manipulators hold us in such contempt that they are openly boastful about how they can shape our choices. Or that they are willing to sell their services to the highest bidder regardless of the consequences."

.

There's an old saying amongst con artists that you can't con an honest person.

All the cons rely on the person's greed to manipulate them!.

.

If we had any form of accountability and real power sharing all these fancy Dan manipulations would be hopeless the solution to lies are truths dishonesty is counted by honesty and manipulation is counted by transparency.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture

No, he's right. And the American government is aware. The issue isn't with the government it's with the people who refuse to accept facts anymore. Net illegal mexican migration is negative in the U.S.

It was the recession that caused immigrants to go back to Mexico - jobs weren't as plentiful. Ironically its creating a real problem for fruit and vegetable farmers who need illegal immigrants to work their fields. There were hearings about it in congress a few years back. It goes back to what I said - if you want to stop illegal immigration in the US then remove the incentive and punish companies who hire them."

Source, please

There are similar sanctions here against employers who hire illegal immigrants. Trouble is, the enforcement is at best, patchy. And this is partly because of the fear of being branded as a ‘racist’

Once we grow up (all of us) and come to terms with the fact they we do not live in countries with unlimited resources, we will then stop throwing insults at one another and work towards finding fair and workable solutions

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture"

I like to check facts before making definitive statements.

The funny thing is that it is normally easy to check numbers on government websites, governments like numbers. But many of the US federal numbers webpages seem to have gone missing. Now this may just be a glitch, it may have something to do with the whole senior management of the State Department walking out, or (more lightly) it may be down to donny small (wandering) hands ordering the removal of anything that may contradict his presidential omnipotence.

I don't know, but considering the Donnalds ravenous voracity for veracity and his ability to excrete utter fabrication in its place I thought it worth mentioning.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture

No, he's right. And the American government is aware. The issue isn't with the government it's with the people who refuse to accept facts anymore. Net illegal mexican migration is negative in the U.S.

It was the recession that caused immigrants to go back to Mexico - jobs weren't as plentiful. Ironically its creating a real problem for fruit and vegetable farmers who need illegal immigrants to work their fields. There were hearings about it in congress a few years back. It goes back to what I said - if you want to stop illegal immigration in the US then remove the incentive and punish companies who hire them.

Source, please

There are similar sanctions here against employers who hire illegal immigrants. Trouble is, the enforcement is at best, patchy. And this is partly because of the fear of being branded as a ‘racist’

Once we grow up (all of us) and come to terms with the fact they we do not live in countries with unlimited resources, we will then stop throwing insults at one another and work towards finding fair and workable solutions"

I don't know what links I am allowed to cite, but search Google for "Pew Research Centre 5 facts about illegal immigrants in the US"

The pew research center is a very reliable source of research and polling in the US. It says net illegal migration from Mexico has been declining since 2009 and has somewhat stabilized. There are plenty of other reliable sources on Google.

The congressional hearings I referred to were held in 2010 and again in 2016. You can watch them on the CSPAN website if you'd like, but they're boring as hell. I watched them.

Calling a racist a racist isn't an insult. It's fact. Putting up a wall and calling it a solution is only lying to ourselves. I don't care if the republicans do it, but I wont sit back while people make false claims about its effectiveness or their reasoning.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The democrats!"
.

I've just realised I should have qualified that as not democratic voters but the corporatists who run and pay for the DNC, the behind the scenes manipulators of democratic policy!

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture

I like to check facts before making definitive statements.

The funny thing is that it is normally easy to check numbers on government websites, governments like numbers. But many of the US federal numbers webpages seem to have gone missing. Now this may just be a glitch, it may have something to do with the whole senior management of the State Department walking out, or (more lightly) it may be down to donny small (wandering) hands ordering the removal of anything that may contradict his presidential omnipotence.

I don't know, but considering the Donnalds ravenous voracity for veracity and his ability to excrete utter fabrication in its place I thought it worth mentioning."

No;

Quite apart from the muzzling of government departments; who have been told to go quiet, even on their ( official) twitters and facebooks etc; loads of data and fact has been removed or hidden.

Also, in case you missed it; government scientific establishments have been told directly not to publish any results of their work until it has been " passed politically ".

Just in case the science and fact doesn't give the proper alternative fact that is required.

Bush did this in a lesser way; on several occasions he asked establishments such as FDA to give him facts and supporting science to back something he wanted, when they told him that science didn't support it, they were told to go away and do it again and get " the right answer".

He actually sacked a director of the FDA in one case, because they refused to change the science to suit his agenda.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd personally like to see donald trumps dome..

and I mean whats under that toupe

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Can't understand what is 'racist' about keeping migrants out of ones country. Immigration polices determine who is permitted to enter any country. Hungry decided not to let migrants in; that is not 'racist'; that is putting ones own people first

Migrants require access to resources, whether those be health, education, infrastructure, housing, benefits or jobs. If these are already in short supply, then only a fool will permit migrants in

If what I am reading is correct the truth of the matter is Mexican migration to the USA is at a 40 year low and net migration is a negative number. Apparently more people are moving from the USA to Mexico than from Mexico to the USA (including illegals). I am still attempting to verify this. A lot of the US federal webpages have been taken down so make of that what you will but I am inclined to believe what I am hearing.

Once your research is completed, you should share your findings with the American authorities I don't think they have the full picture

No, he's right. And the American government is aware. The issue isn't with the government it's with the people who refuse to accept facts anymore. Net illegal mexican migration is negative in the U.S.

It was the recession that caused immigrants to go back to Mexico - jobs weren't as plentiful. Ironically its creating a real problem for fruit and vegetable farmers who need illegal immigrants to work their fields. There were hearings about it in congress a few years back. It goes back to what I said - if you want to stop illegal immigration in the US then remove the incentive and punish companies who hire them.

Source, please

There are similar sanctions here against employers who hire illegal immigrants. Trouble is, the enforcement is at best, patchy. And this is partly because of the fear of being branded as a ‘racist’

Once we grow up (all of us) and come to terms with the fact they we do not live in countries with unlimited resources, we will then stop throwing insults at one another and work towards finding fair and workable solutions

I don't know what links I am allowed to cite, but search Google for "Pew Research Centre 5 facts about illegal immigrants in the US"

The pew research center is a very reliable source of research and polling in the US. It says net illegal migration from Mexico has been declining since 2009 and has somewhat stabilized. There are plenty of other reliable sources on Google.

The congressional hearings I referred to were held in 2010 and again in 2016. You can watch them on the CSPAN website if you'd like, but they're boring as hell. I watched them.

Calling a racist a racist isn't an insult. It's fact. Putting up a wall and calling it a solution is only lying to ourselves. I don't care if the republicans do it, but I wont sit back while people make false claims about its effectiveness or their reasoning."

Thanks; will Google and read

Once we (I meant, you and your President ) have decided that uncontrolled migration is not feasible, then whether 'THE WALL' works or not is a success or failure of a device; that is all. I don’t think it will work but it’ll be a hellofaview from space

Currently, the issue seems to be that some people still think of migration control as a 'racist' policy. I guess they are entitled to their opinion as others are entitled to a different one

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"

Currently, the issue seems to be that some people still think of migration control as a 'racist' policy. I guess they are entitled to their opinion as others are entitled to a different one"

Migration control is, in itself, not racist;

However, it is

1. Expressed in a racist way by many.

2. Executed in a racist way by many

3. Used as an excuse by racists to express their racist views , because they can hide under "migration" and claim that they are not being racists

4. Migration is a godsend to racists as it is used to validate their views, and make them appear to be acceptable.

So for instance, Trump has used the ( largely unimportant) migration issue in acravustvwayvto further his own ends, and facilitate his supporters to be more openly racist.

Certain people in UK do the same.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Currently, the issue seems to be that some people still think of migration control as a 'racist' policy. I guess they are entitled to their opinion as others are entitled to a different one

Migration control is, in itself, not racist;

However, it is

1. Expressed in a racist way by many.

2. Executed in a racist way by many

3. Used as an excuse by racists to express their racist views , because they can hide under "migration" and claim that they are not being racists

4. Migration is a godsend to racists as it is used to validate their views, and make them appear to be acceptable.

So for instance, Trump has used the ( largely unimportant) migration issue in acravustvwayvto further his own ends, and facilitate his supporters to be more openly racist.

Certain people in UK do the same."

very agreed

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"

Currently, the issue seems to be that some people still think of migration control as a 'racist' policy. I guess they are entitled to their opinion as others are entitled to a different one

Migration control is, in itself, not racist;

However, it is

1. Expressed in a racist way by many.

2. Executed in a racist way by many

3. Used as an excuse by racists to express their racist views , because they can hide under "migration" and claim that they are not being racists

4. Migration is a godsend to racists as it is used to validate their views, and make them appear to be acceptable.

So for instance, Trump has used the ( largely unimportant) migration issue in acravustvwayvto further his own ends, and facilitate his supporters to be more openly racist.

Certain people in UK do the same."

Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example"

Well I will supply you a piece of evidence that proves that it is very much a race issue.

The Donald has said he is using his executive powers to ban citizens of 6 Middle Eastern and African countries entering the USA because they have mainly Muslim populations. He has also said that it is only criminals and drug-dealers that come to the US from Mexico and that is why he is building the wall.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"

Currently, the issue seems to be that some people still think of migration control as a 'racist' policy. I guess they are entitled to their opinion as others are entitled to a different one

Migration control is, in itself, not racist;

However, it is

1. Expressed in a racist way by many.

2. Executed in a racist way by many

3. Used as an excuse by racists to express their racist views , because they can hide under "migration" and claim that they are not being racists

4. Migration is a godsend to racists as it is used to validate their views, and make them appear to be acceptable.

So for instance, Trump has used the ( largely unimportant) migration issue in acravustvwayvto further his own ends, and facilitate his supporters to be more openly racist.

Certain people in UK do the same.

Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example"

His motivation to build the wall was expressed multiple times whilst campaigning.

"They are murderers and they are rapists and I suppose some of them might be nice people."

This has nothing to do with controlling the southern border as it can be far more effectively policed using modern technology as opposed to Roman technology.

He has a problem with Mexico and Mexicans and this problem is manifesting itself to a greater degree with every passing day.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Sooner or later your going to have to ask yourself am honest question..... How did this petulant, racist, xenophobic, sexist, looser, manage to win?.

Like farage how did this clown manage to beat the best that Oxford and Cambridge in ppe had to offer?.

Ask yourself that question and then get back to me with an honest answer

I've told you my answer.

It's obvious. He managed to win because he was considered a better option than the alternative. The funny thing is that the ones who slate him/dislike him most are the ones who created him.

A similar thing happened in the UK in the 70s. The Unions created Thatcher

That is ridiculous. The people who slate him didn't stop him, but they didn't "help create him." The people who voted for him and supported him created him. I can see the blame shifting for all of his ridiculous policies already.

I was in the US for a while before the election - I told everyone that I thought trump was going to win. And it had everything to do with the underlying topic of this very thread. The one people in the UK get angry for mentioning. Many of his supporters in the US have no problem with admitting why they voted for him."

of course they helped to create him. Do you think Trump supporters woke up one morning and thought hey, my life is so good under these Democrats/Liberals that just for a laugh I'm going to support a knobhead who will make things worse for me? Why would they have created him if things were good? The Democrats and their supporters created him because for a lot things are so bad. Take your head out of the sand

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example

Well I will supply you a piece of evidence that proves that it is very much a race issue.

The Donald has said he is using his executive powers to ban citizens of 6 Middle Eastern and African countries entering the USA because they have mainly Muslim populations. He has also said that it is only criminals and drug-dealers that come to the US from Mexico and that is why he is building the wall."

What he has done is put a120 day ban on those countries so they can take stock of what is happening and see what is going to happen, it's not a permanent ban it's a temporary ban.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

This thread is running well

.

looks like it may have to be continued with a "Trump: 'We will build Mexico border wall' Part II

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley


"Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example

Well I will supply you a piece of evidence that proves that it is very much a race issue.

The Donald has said he is using his executive powers to ban citizens of 6 Middle Eastern and African countries entering the USA because they have mainly Muslim populations. He has also said that it is only criminals and drug-dealers that come to the US from Mexico and that is why he is building the wall."

And? What is 'racist' about defending ones home (borders)? It is not as if foreign nationals have any rights to enter the US or for that matter, any other country

And when did Muslim become an ethnicity?

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France


"Your entire comment has just proven my point. You have managed to turn it into a 'racist' issue without even one piece of evidence or example

Well I will supply you a piece of evidence that proves that it is very much a race issue.

The Donald has said he is using his executive powers to ban citizens of 6 Middle Eastern and African countries entering the USA because they have mainly Muslim populations. He has also said that it is only criminals and drug-dealers that come to the US from Mexico and that is why he is building the wall.

And? What is 'racist' about defending ones home (borders)? It is not as if foreign nationals have any rights to enter the US or for that matter, any other country

And when did Muslim become an ethnicity? "

Muslim isn't an ethnicity; but it's convenient for racists to use it to cover their racist views

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