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"What do Labour supporters do anyway? Vote Burnham because they think (bizarrely) that he is Labour’s saviour? Or do they sit on their hands or vote for someone else because they support Starmer?" Some of them will have a hissy fit and Starmer will still be there next month. There's nobody fit to replace him 🤷♂️ | |||
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"What do Labour supporters do anyway? Vote Burnham because they think (bizarrely) that he is Labour’s saviour? Or do they sit on their hands or vote for someone else because they support Starmer? Some of them will have a hissy fit and Starmer will still be there next month. There's nobody fit to replace him 🤷♂️"  different PM same old cobblers | |||
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"Different leaders will have various talents and priorities, to set the agenda. Whilst they are governing, it's in the national interest that things are done as well as possible. Burnham has major support in the north and is a known quantity as a Mayor as a leader. He's more left than Steamer and could be a good plan for stability, whilst they are in power. I definitely rate him. " he might have support in Manchester but the north no chance he's done naff all out if manc land. | |||
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"A poor reflection of the huge 2024 Labour intake that they are searching outside parliament for a ‘better’ leadership option. " No one is ever going to vote for someone who has only been an MP for just over a year to lead the party. | |||
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"He was able to get a enquiry into what happened at Hillsborough and although it was too little to late for the families it seems there is going to be some sort of Hillsborough law which is largely down to Andy Burnham. Apparently he is a popular Manchester mayor. Whether that is enough of a good credential to become Prime Minister is open to debate." He’s tried to destroy Manchester and the whole of greater Manchester he is the last thing we need in no10 | |||
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"The markets really don’t like him as he is a typical tax, borrow and spend Labour incompetent. Bond yields (cost of government borrowing) shot up and is now much higher than even the Liz Truss era. Pound fell by dramatically as well." Indeed. Highest gilt yields under Liz Truss: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.7% 10-year Gilt yield: 4.6% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.06% Current gilt yields: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.56% 10-year Gilt yield: 5.18% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.85% LiZ tRuSs CrAsHeD the EcOnOmy!  | |||
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"He was able to get a enquiry into what happened at Hillsborough and although it was too little to late for the families it seems there is going to be some sort of Hillsborough law which is largely down to Andy Burnham. Apparently he is a popular Manchester mayor. Whether that is enough of a good credential to become Prime Minister is open to debate. He’s tried to destroy Manchester and the whole of greater Manchester he is the last thing we need in no10 " If he’s such a bad mayor, why do the people of Manchester keep voting for him? | |||
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"A poor reflection of the huge 2024 Labour intake that they are searching outside parliament for a ‘better’ leadership option. No one is ever going to vote for someone who has only been an MP for just over a year to lead the party." Ok point taken. They current have 403 MPs. Still poor that some within the party can’t see sufficient talent there without the need for this prolonged upheaval. At least the Tories for all their sins got this kind of stuff over with relatively quickly. Multiple times mind! | |||
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"The markets really don’t like him as he is a typical tax, borrow and spend Labour incompetent. Bond yields (cost of government borrowing) shot up and is now much higher than even the Liz Truss era. Pound fell by dramatically as well. Indeed. Highest gilt yields under Liz Truss: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.7% 10-year Gilt yield: 4.6% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.06% Current gilt yields: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.56% 10-year Gilt yield: 5.18% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.85% LiZ tRuSs CrAsHeD the EcOnOmy! "£2,911,000,000,000 public debt £434,000,000,000 in 1997 Where has £2.5 trillion been spent by Labour and Tory. | |||
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"A poor reflection of the huge 2024 Labour intake that they are searching outside parliament for a ‘better’ leadership option. No one is ever going to vote for someone who has only been an MP for just over a year to lead the party. Ok point taken. They current have 403 MPs. Still poor that some within the party can’t see sufficient talent there without the need for this prolonged upheaval. At least the Tories for all their sins got this kind of stuff over with relatively quickly. Multiple times mind!" Yeah, but none of them were any good! If, and it’s a very big if, Burnham is the right man, then surely it’s best to take a bit longer over it, rather than just pick someone so it will be over and done with quickly? | |||
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"The markets really don’t like him as he is a typical tax, borrow and spend Labour incompetent. Bond yields (cost of government borrowing) shot up and is now much higher than even the Liz Truss era. Pound fell by dramatically as well. Indeed. Highest gilt yields under Liz Truss: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.7% 10-year Gilt yield: 4.6% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.06% Current gilt yields: 2-year Gilt yield: 4.56% 10-year Gilt yield: 5.18% 30-year Gilt yield: 5.85% LiZ tRuSs CrAsHeD the EcOnOmy! "Well, she did, as the rise was significant after she became PM. 30 year Gilts rose from 3.3% to over 5% Markets don’t like instability shocker. | |||
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"He was able to get a enquiry into what happened at Hillsborough and although it was too little to late for the families it seems there is going to be some sort of Hillsborough law which is largely down to Andy Burnham. Apparently he is a popular Manchester mayor. Whether that is enough of a good credential to become Prime Minister is open to debate. He’s tried to destroy Manchester and the whole of greater Manchester he is the last thing we need in no10 If he’s such a bad mayor, why do the people of Manchester keep voting for him?" He only got on the Hillsborough campaign once it gained traction largely from a mother who wouldn't stop, and the realisation it wasn't going away. He "happened" to attend an anniversary game? he wasn't championing it from the start despite being from the wirral. As far as him and Mancs, it's like with any part of the country - nationals it'd take a lot for an area to not vote party, but more local elections it's either best candidate or complete change. It's the same with Mancs, the majority will always blindly vote Labour no matter how shit the candidate is. The original Mayoral race I thought had two better candidates than Burnham - one was the Tory woman, the other was an Independent with a finance background - which after austerity I thought was needed.. but both had more about them, not the captioned/not my job responses he gives. | |||
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"He was able to get a enquiry into what happened at Hillsborough and although it was too little to late for the families it seems there is going to be some sort of Hillsborough law which is largely down to Andy Burnham. Apparently he is a popular Manchester mayor. Whether that is enough of a good credential to become Prime Minister is open to debate. He’s tried to destroy Manchester and the whole of greater Manchester he is the last thing we need in no10 If he’s such a bad mayor, why do the people of Manchester keep voting for him? He only got on the Hillsborough campaign once it gained traction largely from a mother who wouldn't stop, and the realisation it wasn't going away. He "happened" to attend an anniversary game? he wasn't championing it from the start despite being from the wirral. As far as him and Mancs, it's like with any part of the country - nationals it'd take a lot for an area to not vote party, but more local elections it's either best candidate or complete change. It's the same with Mancs, the majority will always blindly vote Labour no matter how shit the candidate is. The original Mayoral race I thought had two better candidates than Burnham - one was the Tory woman, the other was an Independent with a finance background - which after austerity I thought was needed.. but both had more about them, not the captioned/not my job responses he gives." Has anyone said he was part of the Hillsborough campaign from the start? He got involved in about 2009 and has been a key part of it since. Can we not credit someone with doing something, just because they haven’t done everything? | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has." Why ? What's his usp | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has." Best chance for what? What do you think that Andy Burnham will do if he gets made PM? | |||
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"The level of hatred already coming from the far right proves to me that Burnham is the best man for this country." He’s wants to ‘save Labour’, he hasn’t mentioned the country. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp" I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are" Well apparently all you need to garner huge support aren't actual policies but a collection of bumper stickers for the low IQ voters. I'd go for MAKE WORK PAY AGAIN or MAKE BRITAIN FAIR AGAIN | |||
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"The level of hatred already coming from the far right proves to me that Burnham is the best man for this country." Far right claxon! Honestly, I don’t anyone actually knows what far right actually is these days. I don’t think Reform want to gas any jews, I’d imagine that’s more something Labour and the Greens would be up for. | |||
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"The level of hatred already coming from the far right proves to me that Burnham is the best man for this country. Far right claxon! Honestly, I don’t anyone actually knows what far right actually is these days. I don’t think Reform want to gas any jews, I’d imagine that’s more something Labour and the Greens would be up for." Well Reform are literally talking about concentration camps for foreigners. If that's not Nazi enough for you then I can't help you. 🤣🤣🤣 | |||
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"The level of hatred already coming from the far right proves to me that Burnham is the best man for this country. Far right claxon! Honestly, I don’t anyone actually knows what far right actually is these days. I don’t think Reform want to gas any jews, I’d imagine that’s more something Labour and the Greens would be up for. Well Reform are literally talking about concentration camps for foreigners. If that's not Nazi enough for you then I can't help you. 🤣🤣🤣" If you describe detention centres as concentration camps would it be fair to describe you as a drama queen. Think it will be a shit show for labour is Burnham is defeated by Reform. | |||
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"Well Reform are literally talking about concentration camps for foreigners. If that's not Nazi enough for you then I can't help you." Someone needs to learn what "literally" means. | |||
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"I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are" That's a good point. If Burnham can manage a good margin over Reform, say 10%, it'll show that there is significant support for a more left-leaning Labour party, and that such policies can beat Reform. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are" The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are Well apparently all you need to garner huge support aren't actual policies but a collection of bumper stickers for the low IQ voters. I'd go for MAKE WORK PAY AGAIN or MAKE BRITAIN FAIR AGAIN " As Starmer proved at the last GE | |||
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"I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are" "The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness." If that happens he'll also have demonstrated that even the best that Labour has will be beaten by Reform. Given that Starmer is a spent force and no one else has the backing to challenge him, I can't see the government continuing on much further after that. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. " I don't think he is contemplating that but yes your right, in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. It's an interesting decision for any labour voters in that area. If they don't like Starmer then it's a vote for Burnham but if they want Starmer to continue do they vote in the person most likely to replace him? I suspect they will prefer to risk loosing their preferred PM than letting Reform in. | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are. THEY ARE DETENTION CENTRES...MKAY!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣" What do you want to see done to people here illegally? What’s acceptable to you? | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are. THEY ARE DETENTION CENTRES...MKAY!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣 What do you want to see done to people here illegally? What’s acceptable to you?" . The Nazis also claimed that their actions were totally legal. History didn't forgive them on that score | |||
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"... in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor." According to a BBC article I read this morning, he doesn't have to resign as mayor to stand as an MP. He only needs to resign if he is elected. So if he loses he gets to carry on being mayor until at least the next election. | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are." You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you. | |||
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"... in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. According to a BBC article I read this morning, he doesn't have to resign as mayor to stand as an MP. He only needs to resign if he is elected. So if he loses he gets to carry on being mayor until at least the next election." Thank you for the info, it's not what I was expecting but if that's the case it looks like he has a free shot at the by election job wise. | |||
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" Has anyone said he was part of the Hillsborough campaign from the start? He got involved in about 2009 and has been a key part of it since. Can we not credit someone with doing something, just because they haven’t done everything?" Granted it's better to do something than nothing but as said above, he loves a photo op. Getting an inquiry doesn't need an MP, the amount of support it had it would have gone ahead anyway, but whilst at the extreme end, it's the type of thing he'll take credit for being involved with despite having little involvement in.. How many supporters were for it. There were large-scale houses built he took credit for, roads resurfaced he took public credit for, it turned out both came from national pots of money every city was getting. He is a slippery guy. | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are. You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you." Except it isn't. That's why the WE'RE NOT RACIST clique are freaking out. Bigots just hate their bigotry being illuminated | |||
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"... in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. According to a BBC article I read this morning, he doesn't have to resign as mayor to stand as an MP. He only needs to resign if he is elected. So if he loses he gets to carry on being mayor until at least the next election." I read a good comment that if he were to win the by-election, it'd mean a leadership election and a mayoral election... Which is quite the vanity project (  ) | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are." "You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you." "Except it isn't. That's why the WE'RE NOT RACIST clique are freaking out. Bigots just hate their bigotry being illuminated" It is untrue. The word "literally" means 'exactly true, word for word'. You're claiming that Reform are using the phrase "concentration camps", and that's untrue. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. I don't think he is contemplating that but yes your right, in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. It's an interesting decision for any labour voters in that area. If they don't like Starmer then it's a vote for Burnham but if they want Starmer to continue do they vote in the person most likely to replace him? I suspect they will prefer to risk loosing their preferred PM than letting Reform in." As mentioned by others he will be able to return to his role as Mayor, but my feeling is he would be seen as walking away by those who voted for him. The northern voters appear to me as not supporters of anyone who crosses them. | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are. You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you. Except it isn't. That's why the WE'RE NOT RACIST clique are freaking out. Bigots just hate their bigotry being illuminated It is untrue. The word "literally" means 'exactly true, word for word'. You're claiming that Reform are using the phrase "concentration camps", and that's untrue." What would you call a "detention centre" that people are prevented from leaving, despite not having been convicted of any crime? (AKA Concentration Camp) The oiliest part of your position is that you LOVE the idea of migrants being thrown into concentration camps. You LOVE the idea of harsh, inhuman conditions for brown people. That's the truth that you are so keen to pretend isn't true | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. I don't think he is contemplating that but yes your right, in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. It's an interesting decision for any labour voters in that area. If they don't like Starmer then it's a vote for Burnham but if they want Starmer to continue do they vote in the person most likely to replace him? I suspect they will prefer to risk loosing their preferred PM than letting Reform in. As mentioned by others he will be able to return to his role as Mayor, but my feeling is he would be seen as walking away by those who voted for him. The northern voters appear to me as not supporters of anyone who crosses them." It does bring up the risky topic of when does Starmer endorse Burnham.. He has to at some point and probably better he do it sooner than later  | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. I don't think he is contemplating that but yes your right, in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. It's an interesting decision for any labour voters in that area. If they don't like Starmer then it's a vote for Burnham but if they want Starmer to continue do they vote in the person most likely to replace him? I suspect they will prefer to risk loosing their preferred PM than letting Reform in. As mentioned by others he will be able to return to his role as Mayor, but my feeling is he would be seen as walking away by those who voted for him. The northern voters appear to me as not supporters of anyone who crosses them. It does bring up the risky topic of when does Starmer endorse Burnham.. He has to at some point and probably better he do it sooner than later "This will be a character changing moment for Starmer however it ends. If he survives this I do believe it will be a positive and a period of stabilisation. | |||
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"He's the best chance this country has. Why ? What's his usp I heard a quote on the news earlier from a reporter. He said Andy Burnhams up coming by election, if won, will show he can beat reform in a head to head which is what labour are desperate for. That helps with his leadership chances but not heard exactly what his plans for the country are The biggest risk for Burnham is a loss, he would have put himself into the wilderness. I don't think he is contemplating that but yes your right, in the unlikely event he does not get elected he has no immediate job. I'm presuming he can't just go back to his old job of mayor. It's an interesting decision for any labour voters in that area. If they don't like Starmer then it's a vote for Burnham but if they want Starmer to continue do they vote in the person most likely to replace him? I suspect they will prefer to risk loosing their preferred PM than letting Reform in. As mentioned by others he will be able to return to his role as Mayor, but my feeling is he would be seen as walking away by those who voted for him. The northern voters appear to me as not supporters of anyone who crosses them. It does bring up the risky topic of when does Starmer endorse Burnham.. He has to at some point and probably better he do it sooner than later
This will be a character changing moment for Starmer however it ends.
If he survives this I do believe it will be a positive and a period of stabilisation. "apologies for such an awful ending in my reply! * a positive period leading to stabilisation* | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are." "You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you." "Except it isn't. That's why the WE'RE NOT RACIST clique are freaking out. Bigots just hate their bigotry being illuminated" "It is untrue. The word "literally" means 'exactly true, word for word'. You're claiming that Reform are using the phrase "concentration camps", and that's untrue." "What would you call a "detention centre" that people are prevented from leaving, despite not having been convicted of any crime?" We're not discussing what I'd call them, or what you'd call them, we're discussing your claim that Reform are calling them "concentration camps", which is not true. | |||
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"Not sure of the history of him , so why is he being considered the "saviour" of the labour party? Personally I'm dismayed by the behaviour of cabinet members and the crap they're saying. And really disappointed that streeting has walked away from his job leaving the NHS in a mess. Jess Philips? Good riddance! Because she was blocking an inquiry into grooming gangs, but what is the deal with Andy Burnham?" Over 400 Labour MP’s & they can’t find one fit enough to run the country? Speaks volumes , don’t you think? | |||
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"This will be a character changing moment for Starmer however it ends. If he survives this I do believe it will be a positive period leading to stabilisation" I'm not so sure. If Starmer survives this, he'll still be very unpopular, and the party will still be facing Reform at the next election. It seems likely to be that the other contenders will all be busy trying to work out other ways to get rid of him before the end of the term so that they have some sort of chance of winning the next election. | |||
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"Not sure of the history of him , so why is he being considered the "saviour" of the labour party? Personally I'm dismayed by the behaviour of cabinet members and the crap they're saying. And really disappointed that streeting has walked away from his job leaving the NHS in a mess. Jess Philips? Good riddance! Because she was blocking an inquiry into grooming gangs, but what is the deal with Andy Burnham? Over 400 Labour MP’s & they can’t find one fit enough to run the country? Speaks volumes , don’t you think?" A good PM would be: Someone who has worked in a real job before being elected. Preferably (maybe essentially) in the private sector. Someone who is a proven leader. Someone who is a good orator. Someone who understands current issues, who can make a good case for any solution and get public and party buy in. Someone who can command respect both domestically and internationally. This is why none of the 400 Labour MPs are up to the job. They are a ragtag bunch of public sector workers, union activists, parliamentary researchers, lawyers, journalists etc. with no idea of how the real world works. Nor have they ever had to work in a commercial environment where what they do is directly related to putting food on the table. And, no, Andy Burnham isn’t the answer either. If he is the best they have then we sre totally sunk. | |||
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"He was able to get a enquiry into what happened at Hillsborough and although it was too little to late for the families it seems there is going to be some sort of Hillsborough law which is largely down to Andy Burnham. Apparently he is a popular Manchester mayor. Whether that is enough of a good credential to become Prime Minister is open to debate. He’s tried to destroy Manchester and the whole of greater Manchester he is the last thing we need in no10 If he’s such a bad mayor, why do the people of Manchester keep voting for him?" Ha ha, That's an easy one to answer. Last election was in 2024 just before GE, next one due in 2028 so he missed out on the bloodbath. He'd have probably have been looking for a new job anyway if it had been this year. | |||
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"Starmer surviving wouldn’t be a good thing at all. A lot of it is around messaging. Starmer speaks as if he is the Official Receiver of the UK after the Tories sent it under. The people want to feel that it will get better. They are sick of hearing how shit it is, they know, they live it, so we need someone to offer some positivity and hope. If Burnham cannot make a difference, then Reform are home and hosed for the GE in 2029. Why then, do I sense some jitters? " I did catch a brief interview with Burnham yesterday and he seemed rambling. He was doing the usual “I’m a working class lad like you” schtick (aside from going to Cambridge to read English and never having had a real job) but seemed a little incoherent, at one point talking about “nationalising housing”. I mean it’s difficult if people are constantly sticking a microphone in your face and you have to keep talking, not to say something stupid now and again. But he’s very much been on the periphery of the nation’s political consciousness and I wonder if he will rapidly unravel when he comes under more direct scrutiny. | |||
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"This will be a character changing moment for Starmer however it ends. If he survives this I do believe it will be a positive period leading to stabilisation I'm not so sure. If Starmer survives this, he'll still be very unpopular, and the party will still be facing Reform at the next election. It seems likely to be that the other contenders will all be busy trying to work out other ways to get rid of him before the end of the term so that they have some sort of chance of winning the next election." My thinking is he will need to grow quickly to cement his position. From my perspective he has been too loyal to Reeves, and too easy to turn by others. If he addresses those 2 specifics by installing a business focused chancellor and actually becomes the leader of the party he would become a much more trusted PM. We can’t afford to have a hard left socialist at the helm at this point, we don’t have the resources to sustain that philosophy, and I would anticipate economic melt down by the next GE opening the door for Reform. | |||
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"It's funny how easily the "patriots" are triggered by naming concentration camps for what they are. You got so many replies because you said "Reform are literally talking about concentration camps". That's obviously untrue, and people pointed that out to you. Except it isn't. That's why the WE'RE NOT RACIST clique are freaking out. Bigots just hate their bigotry being illuminated It is untrue. The word "literally" means 'exactly true, word for word'. You're claiming that Reform are using the phrase "concentration camps", and that's untrue. What would you call a "detention centre" that people are prevented from leaving, despite not having been convicted of any crime? We're not discussing what I'd call them, or what you'd call them, we're discussing your claim that Reform are calling them "concentration camps", which is not true." Not sure how a discussion about Andy Burnham suddenly became about racism, bigotry and concentration camps but hey ho, just the way some of these forums go I guess. Back on track, I'm not sure a change of leader, whoever it is makes any difference it's the change in action that does. If Starmer was capable of taking stock and making the necessary changes there would be no need to change leader. If not, any new leader would need a clear vision which has real support to make any real difference for the country. | |||
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"U turn already He's now distancing himself from a return to the EU" That's not what I'm seeing. The reports are that he is saying that he'll fight the Makerfield election on local issues and not the EU. To me that looks like someone that doesn't want to state their position and is hoping that people will stop asking. | |||
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"U turn already He's now distancing himself from a return to the EU That's not what I'm seeing. The reports are that he is saying that he'll fight the Makerfield election on local issues and not the EU. To me that looks like someone that doesn't want to state their position and is hoping that people will stop asking." A politician dodging the issues surely not. | |||
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"Other than being less uninspirational, what can Burnham do (in a practical sense) that Starmer cannot?" He is basically repeating the same old promises of "investing" in industry, infrastructure, etc. His biggest claim to power seems to be that he was responsible for Manchester's growth that was higher than most of rest of the UK during that period. Experts are arguing on whether Manchester's economy indeed grew that much and if it did, was it because of Burnham? | |||
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"Other than being less uninspirational, what can Burnham do (in a practical sense) that Starmer cannot? He is basically repeating the same old promises of "investing" in industry, infrastructure, etc. His biggest claim to power seems to be that he was responsible for Manchester's growth that was higher than most of rest of the UK during that period. Experts are arguing on whether Manchester's economy indeed grew that much and if it did, was it because of Burnham?" Has he given any methodology how to reverse the UK manufacturing long term structural decline, from 30% of GDP in the 70’s to less than 10% now. Between 1964-73 and 1979-89, UK employment in manufacturing declined by a third (2.5 million jobs). The share of manufacturing in GDP fell from 32% in 1973 to 28% in 1979 and 21% in 1993. In isolation uk car manufacturing has halved in the last decade. House building is at a 12 year low. Farming reduced to 0.6% gdp last time I looked I’d be interested to hear his ideas | |||
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"Other than being less uninspirational, what can Burnham do (in a practical sense) that Starmer cannot? He is basically repeating the same old promises of "investing" in industry, infrastructure, etc. His biggest claim to power seems to be that he was responsible for Manchester's growth that was higher than most of rest of the UK during that period. Experts are arguing on whether Manchester's economy indeed grew that much and if it did, was it because of Burnham? Has he given any methodology how to reverse the UK manufacturing long term structural decline, from 30% of GDP in the 70’s to less than 10% now. Between 1964-73 and 1979-89, UK employment in manufacturing declined by a third (2.5 million jobs). The share of manufacturing in GDP fell from 32% in 1973 to 28% in 1979 and 21% in 1993. In isolation uk car manufacturing has halved in the last decade. House building is at a 12 year low. Farming reduced to 0.6% gdp last time I looked I’d be interested to hear his ideas " He doesn't. As always, the politicians say that they will improve things. But no idea how. | |||
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"U turn already He's now distancing himself from a return to the EU That's not what I'm seeing. The reports are that he is saying that he'll fight the Makerfield election on local issues and not the EU. To me that looks like someone that doesn't want to state their position and is hoping that people will stop asking." It is his party companion Wes Streeting that pushed the EU topic into the headlines and some say deliberately as Burnham's main rival is Reform and he is competing in an area that voted predominantly to leave the EU. I would think that whoever the candidate for Reform is, they push that topic constantly | |||
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"It is his party companion Wes Streeting that pushed the EU topic into the headlines and some say deliberately as Burnham's main rival is Reform and he is competing in an area that voted predominantly to leave the EU. I would think that whoever the candidate for Reform is, they push that topic constantly" It's pretty clear that Streeting brought it up deliberately. It makes Burnham look bad, and it gets Reform to do all the work of discrediting Burnham so Streeting can keep his hands clean. It's a win-win for Reform. If Burnham stutters and evades, that makes him look bad and gives Reform more votes. If he straight out says that he's not interested in re-joining, that's what Reform want anyway. | |||
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"It is his party companion Wes Streeting that pushed the EU topic into the headlines and some say deliberately as Burnham's main rival is Reform and he is competing in an area that voted predominantly to leave the EU. I would think that whoever the candidate for Reform is, they push that topic constantly It's pretty clear that Streeting brought it up deliberately. It makes Burnham look bad, and it gets Reform to do all the work of discrediting Burnham so Streeting can keep his hands clean. It's a win-win for Reform. If Burnham stutters and evades, that makes him look bad and gives Reform more votes. If he straight out says that he's not interested in re-joining, that's what Reform want anyway." EU question might be on some minds but foremost is voters know this is a stepping stone, they know Burnham has no interest in the constituency and will spend the majority of his time in Westminster | |||
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"To all the Labour supporters currently keeping quiet - what could Burnham say that you think would gain him more votes?" He’s limited, just saying Labour have not been good enough. Reeves rumoured to abandon the planned 5p per litre increase in fuel duty due to take effect in September | |||
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"Not sure of the history of him , so why is he being considered the "saviour" of the labour party? Personally I'm dismayed by the behaviour of cabinet members and the crap they're saying. And really disappointed that streeting has walked away from his job leaving the NHS in a mess. Jess Philips? Good riddance! Because she was blocking an inquiry into grooming gangs, but what is the deal with Andy Burnham?" I am a labour supporter from my youth to current day. Andy Burnhams arrogance in saying he is ready to save Labour beggars belief the way for months he as been edging to be back as an mp. He has a major role as Mayor of Manchester he was voted in as such he should serve them not his ego. I am very disappointed in him and should he win the by-election he in my view will not become leader. Whatever folk think of Starmer he as leader has got the enormous mandate from the electorate. Of all the other partys not one would have stood up to Trump, Farage will not he goes to usa and slags uk off to Trump etc. Badenoch or as I call her Badenough 
Ed Davey more like a clown than anything tbh he has criticised Trump.
Polanski the green party leader to me in same ilk as Farage as in conman.
So in essence I hope Burnham if he wins by-election he does not become Pm | |||
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"I do wish these politicians would be realistic and honest with their promises when trying to get elected rather than promise massive changes and unachievable goals." Did Labour promise massive changes though? I think a lot of lefties were pretty underwhelmed, hence the drift of votes to the Greens & the comparative lack of votes for Starmer (even though he won) | |||
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"I do wish these politicians would be realistic and honest with their promises when trying to get elected rather than promise massive changes and unachievable goals. Did Labour promise massive changes though? I think a lot of lefties were pretty underwhelmed, hence the drift of votes to the Greens & the comparative lack of votes for Starmer (even though he won)" There's Lefties and Lefties, Labour will always have a problem in satisfying both camps - as Torys did with the ERG. Your Party didn't do that well so having Corbynite views wont give them any greater security. Starmer isn't doing a bad job imo, it's as if the cock that happened in the last years of the Tory government are meant to be unwound and fixed in a season, when not only the UK is a boat to turn but there's been major global events that are generational. | |||
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