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"Let me guess, some rich people in Africa want money." That's pretty much it  | |||
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"It's an incredibly complex and emotive subject; deeply hurtful and painful. . My concerns is the terminology, "The gravest". . That's somewhat dismissive of other lived experiences. Imagine how a Holocaust survivor might feel hearing that. They might be highly vocal and sympathetic to the UN's declaration, but in the same breath could say, "But what about me and my people ? Did we not suffer enough to meet that bar too? Is our suffering lesser ?" . I support the UN's statement, but not the way they worded it. . I would have said, "A grave crime against humanity' or "One of the most gravest crimes against humanity". . Words matter." This.. Putting someone's suffering in a top trumps table is utterly bizarre.. Its almost akin to saying yes Mr Jones we recognise that your family member was stabbed to death but Mr Smiths family member was burnt to death therefore that was worse for him.. | |||
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"No one would think they were responsible for the actions of their relatives several centuries ago, or feel the need to apologise or pay 'reparations' to the descendants of those affected. The idea a whole nation should do so is utterly nuts, and an obvious shakedown." Let's say there are two families on an island. Each family owned half the island. Over a period of centuries, one family grew stronger and persecuted the other, taking 90% of their land by force. Then there was a period of relative peace for 100 years. Family A has 95% of the land on the island and is done well. Family B has 5% of the land and is destitute. In this scenario, which is utterly unrealistic for a whole lot of reasons, reparations could be justified, even if the past three generations have had no violence. The premise of generational reparations make sense when there is a clear, direct, modern-day winner and loser associated with past atrocities. However... The practicalities nowadays in the case of the transatlantic sl@ve trade are very murky. There's a spectrum, from punish all whites and advantage all blacks, to matching specific descendents of those who profiteered, who are still enjoying those proceeds, with direct descendents of those who suffered. Perhaps there should not be financial compensation, per-se, but rather an acknowledgement from countries who participated, and an enhanced sense of responsibility to assist those countries to develop further, through shared initiatives that could (genuinely) benefit both parties. Taking a bunch of cash from individuals, businesses and countries and handing it over to some arbitrary group of claimants is a terrible idea. | |||
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"No one would think they were responsible for the actions of their relatives several centuries ago, or feel the need to apologise or pay 'reparations' to the descendants of those affected. The idea a whole nation should do so is utterly nuts, and an obvious shakedown." Personally responsible for the actions of my ancestors ? No. Not directly. . But indirectly benefitting from their actions ? Yes, of course. . The cut-off point is how much benefit. . If I was a scion of a monied family whose fortune was built on the sl@ve-trade, I'd feel helluva responsible (and ashamed) of my family history. I would not want that blood money every waking moment on my conscience. . I would feel reparations would be due. . Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely. . So no, it’s not about inherited guilt—it’s about inherited benefit and whether we’re willing to acknowledge and address it. Ignoring that doesn’t make it go away, it just means choosing not to deal with it. . Dismissing it as a ‘shakedown’ is easy if you’re not on the receiving end of the consequences. The reality is simpler: benefit without accountability is just complicity by another name. . You don’t have to agree, but I’m comfortable with the principle that if harm creates lasting advantage, then addressing that harm shouldn’t expire with time. I like holding myself to that principle. | |||
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"No one would think they were responsible for the actions of their relatives several centuries ago, or feel the need to apologise or pay 'reparations' to the descendants of those affected. The idea a whole nation should do so is utterly nuts, and an obvious shakedown. Personally responsible for the actions of my ancestors ? No. Not directly. . But indirectly benefitting from their actions ? Yes, of course. . The cut-off point is how much benefit. . If I was a scion of a monied family whose fortune was built on the sl@ve-trade, I'd feel helluva responsible (and ashamed) of my family history. I would not want that blood money every waking moment on my conscience. . I would feel reparations would be due. . Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely. . So no, it’s not about inherited guilt—it’s about inherited benefit and whether we’re willing to acknowledge and address it. Ignoring that doesn’t make it go away, it just means choosing not to deal with it. . Dismissing it as a ‘shakedown’ is easy if you’re not on the receiving end of the consequences. The reality is simpler: benefit without accountability is just complicity by another name. . You don’t have to agree, but I’m comfortable with the principle that if harm creates lasting advantage, then addressing that harm shouldn’t expire with time. I like holding myself to that principle." That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility. | |||
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"That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility." It makes perfect sense to me. I cannot accept personal responsibility because I was not physically there at the time those decisions were taken and made by others. . However I would like (and feel I should be bound) to take personal responsibility now and make amends. . As I said previously, "Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely." | |||
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"That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility. It makes perfect sense to me. I cannot accept personal responsibility because I was not physically there at the time those decisions were taken and made by others. . However I would like (and feel I should be bound) to take personal responsibility now and make amends. . As I said previously, "Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely."" | |||
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"That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility. It makes perfect sense to me. I cannot accept personal responsibility because I was not physically there at the time those decisions were taken and made by others. . However I would like (and feel I should be bound) to take personal responsibility now and make amends. . As I said previously, "Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely."" Sounds wonderful. You must be a lovely person. However, when the collecting tin comes around how much personally are you happy to stump up. Also who decides who gets what and how much? Lovely idea but practically impossible to implement without causing major headaches. | |||
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"That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility. It makes perfect sense to me. I cannot accept personal responsibility because I was not physically there at the time those decisions were taken and made by others. . However I would like (and feel I should be bound) to take personal responsibility now and make amends. . As I said previously, "Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely." Sounds wonderful. You must be a lovely person. However, when the collecting tin comes around how much personally are you happy to stump up. Also who decides who gets what and how much? Lovely idea but practically impossible to implement without causing major headaches." Those who support this idea should first allow their entire family tree to be examined in detail and all wrong doing by their descendants to be paid up in full. | |||
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"That makes no sense at all - you don't accept personal responsibility but you want indirect responsibility. It makes perfect sense to me. I cannot accept personal responsibility because I was not physically there at the time those decisions were taken and made by others. . However I would like (and feel I should be bound) to take personal responsibility now and make amends. . As I said previously, "Making amends should not be protected by the passage of time or the passing of generations. The harm has been done, and unless there is restitution, the harm prevails indefinitely." Sounds wonderful. You must be a lovely person. However, when the collecting tin comes around how much personally are you happy to stump up. Also who decides who gets what and how much? Lovely idea but practically impossible to implement without causing major headaches." I don't need platitudes please. This is not about guilt, or ego, or anything else. It's simply about putting things right. Some will contribute. Some will not. To each, to the best of their ability. If it became a national decision, then that's a conversation for the nation, and for elected representatives to carry and vote upon. | |||
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"It will never happen except at the point if a gun. What happened was horrible and inexcusable but it will prove impossible to pay for every historical atrocity. What next - "Bloody Romans persecuted my ancestors"- where do I sign up for a cash handout?" Pretty much this. If you take it to the nth degree (which is inevitable), then Australia, the Americas and indeed the Middle East will be redrawn. | |||
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"It will never happen except at the point if a gun. What happened was horrible and it will prove impossible to pay for every historical atrocity. What next - "Bloody Romans persecuted my ancestors"- where do I sign up for a cash handout? Pretty much this. If you take it to the nth degree (which is inevitable), then Australia, the Americas and indeed the Middle East will be redrawn." Indeed almost all the earth would be stripped of humans and returned to its earliest animal inhabitants. | |||
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"It will never happen except at the point if a gun. What happened was horrible and it will prove impossible to pay for every historical atrocity. What next - "Bloody Romans persecuted my ancestors"- where do I sign up for a cash handout? Pretty much this. If you take it to the nth degree (which is inevitable), then Australia, the Americas and indeed the Middle East will be redrawn. Indeed almost all the earth would be stripped of humans and returned to its earliest animal inhabitants." End of the day, the big bang is responsible for everything. Maybe whatever started the big bang must pay for it all. As a line in the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy says, "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move" | |||
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"What I have always found fascinating is how or why Africans in present day Africa are so keen on the religion of their erstwhile oppressors." Oppressors and castrators? | |||
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"It will never happen except at the point if a gun. What happened was horrible and inexcusable but it will prove impossible to pay for every historical atrocity. What next - "Bloody Romans persecuted my ancestors"- where do I sign up for a cash handout?" Yep, we may get money for the Romans, vikings and Normans if this plays out. Could be adverts on the TV anytime now asking if you were affected call this number | |||
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"It will never happen except at the point if a gun. What happened was horrible and inexcusable but it will prove impossible to pay for every historical atrocity. What next - "Bloody Romans persecuted my ancestors"- where do I sign up for a cash handout? Yep, we may get money for the Romans, vikings and Normans if this plays out. Could be adverts on the TV anytime now asking if you were affected call this number " Any money ye get ye can pass over this direction  | |||
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"What I have always found fascinating is how or why Africans in present day Africa are so keen on the religion of their erstwhile oppressors." Very good point 🤷 | |||
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"It's an incredibly complex and emotive subject; deeply hurtful and painful. . My concerns is the terminology, "The gravest". . That's somewhat dismissive of other lived experiences. Imagine how a Holocaust survivor might feel hearing that. They might be highly vocal and sympathetic to the UN's declaration, but in the same breath could say, "But what about me and my people ? Did we not suffer enough to meet that bar too? Is our suffering lesser ?" . I support the UN's statement, but not the way they worded it. . I would have said, "A grave crime against humanity' or "One of the most gravest crimes against humanity". . Words matter." Holocaust was obviously one of the worst but chattel sl@very was the worst! They weren't just caged and dehumanised, but forced from one continent to another, take another name, language, god and forced labour it is multiple times any other crime against humanity | |||
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"I think regular folk get their knickers in a twist when discussing reparations as there are a wide variety of models for how reparations are made, the majority of ideas aren’t about giving individuals cash. Also remember we were paying reparations to sl@ve owners until 2015 and Jews were granted reparations after the holocaust. I do agree though that oppression olympics is unhelpful when so many people are still suffering to this day at the hands of imperialist/ colonialist regimes." What utter bull shit… | |||
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"How about some of the current grave crimes being committed by (mainly) 'western' countries (again, the slv trade was from the british empire). Some of those people are still alive as are their relatives (unfortunately thousands are not). Do they get any compensation?" Way way more nations were involved, the biggest traders being the Africans themselves And I’ve certainly not benefited in any form, regardless what the political elite may say or promote | |||
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"I think regular folk get their knickers in a twist when discussing reparations as there are a wide variety of models for how reparations are made, the majority of ideas aren’t about giving individuals cash. Also remember we were paying reparations to sl@ve owners until 2015 and Jews were granted reparations after the holocaust. I do agree though that oppression olympics is unhelpful when so many people are still suffering to this day at the hands of imperialist/ colonialist regimes. What utter bull shit… " What’s bullshit? | |||
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"the biggest traders being the Africans themselves" That isn't correct. The sl@ve trade in Africa already existed, but Europeans (led by the Portuguese, British, French, and Dutch) industrialised it with the help of some African elites. | |||
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"the biggest traders being the Africans themselves That isn't correct. The sl@ve trade in Africa already existed, but Europeans (led by the Portuguese, British, French, and Dutch) industrialised it with the help of some African elites. " So that makes it our responsibility then Nobody alive today has any connection with the trade what so ever Unless of course they were trafficked recently | |||
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"I think regular folk get their knickers in a twist when discussing reparations as there are a wide variety of models for how reparations are made, the majority of ideas aren’t about giving individuals cash. Also remember we were paying reparations to sl@ve owners until 2015 and Jews were granted reparations after the holocaust. I do agree though that oppression olympics is unhelpful when so many people are still suffering to this day at the hands of imperialist/ colonialist regimes. What utter bull shit… " Which people are still suffering under imperialist colonialist regimes?.. | |||
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"I think regular folk get their knickers in a twist when discussing reparations as there are a wide variety of models for how reparations are made, the majority of ideas aren’t about giving individuals cash. Also remember we were paying reparations to sl@ve owners until 2015 and Jews were granted reparations after the holocaust. I do agree though that oppression olympics is unhelpful when so many people are still suffering to this day at the hands of imperialist/ colonialist regimes." Curious, what are those ideas which don't involve people giving out cash? | |||
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"So that makes it our responsibility then Nobody alive today has any connection with the trade what so ever Unless of course they were trafficked recently " No, and I never said it did. If the West owes reparations for the Transatlantic Sl@ve Trade, then the Arab world owes reparations for the Arab Sl@ve Trade and the Italians owe reparations for the Roman sl@ve trade – and so on. When it comes to this kind of wrongdoing, nobody was truly innocent. | |||
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"It's an incredibly complex and emotive subject; deeply hurtful and painful. . My concerns is the terminology, "The gravest". . That's somewhat dismissive of other lived experiences. Imagine how a Holocaust survivor might feel hearing that. They might be highly vocal and sympathetic to the UN's declaration, but in the same breath could say, "But what about me and my people ? Did we not suffer enough to meet that bar too? Is our suffering lesser ?" . I support the UN's statement, but not the way they worded it. . I would have said, "A grave crime against humanity' or "One of the most gravest crimes against humanity". . Words matter. Holocaust was obviously one of the worst but chattel sl@very was the worst! They weren't just caged and dehumanised, but forced from one continent to another, take another name, language, god and forced labour it is multiple times any other crime against humanity " And therein lies the trap that some can fall in to, in playing Top Trump Crimes Against Humanity. Those with lived experiences will not be able to separate that lived experience compared to others they may not have experienced...and nor should they. . As an impartial observer, my advice would be to recognise all these events as abhorrent and deal with the fallout and reparations of each one individually. . No event "trumps another". All were bad in their own specific ways. . Let's deal with all of them. | |||
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"Germany payed reparations for WWII, I don't see the issue in talking about reparations for countries we colonised." Germany paid reparations to the countries it had damaged in the immediate aftermath of the war. How is Britain supposed to compensate people that died 200 years ago? | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, " Scholarship cost money. | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money." Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. " Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? | |||
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"Germany payed reparations for WWII, I don't see the issue in talking about reparations for countries we colonised. Germany paid reparations to the countries it had damaged in the immediate aftermath of the war. How is Britain supposed to compensate people that died 200 years ago?" Before we discuss reparations, it's helpful to identify which British individuals and businesses used sl@ve labour until it was eventually outlawed. . Fortunately, there are comprehensive databases and research projects that list thousands of individuals, businesses, and merchants who owned sl@ves, operated sl@ve ships, or gained profit from sl@ve labour in the British Caribbean before sl@very was abolished in 1833. . The most extensive resource is the Legacies of British Sl@ve-ownership (LBS) database, managed by University College London (UCL), which was created from the compensation records paid to sl@ve owners when sl@very was outlawed. . There are plenty of other records too which can be searched and sifted over. . The Bank of England was linked to the sl@ve trade and at one point in the 1700s owned two plantations in Grenada through debt default. Many early British banks were founded on profits from these activities. . To date, the BoE has apologised and acknowledged its links to sl@very in the past. . The BoE has not paid reparations or direct compensation to the living descendants. . Now, when sl@very was ended, the BoE did pay the owners of the Grenada plantations money for the loss of their sl@ves. £20 million was paid out to sl@ve owners. All these records are well kept and the paper trails get very precise. . So it's not impossible to track down and go after any descendants of families engaged in these practices. . The government could also prosecute the BoE and fine them. | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people?" Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power | |||
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"Germany payed reparations for WWII, I don't see the issue in talking about reparations for countries we colonised. Germany paid reparations to the countries it had damaged in the immediate aftermath of the war. How is Britain supposed to compensate people that died 200 years ago? Before we discuss reparations, it's helpful to identify which British individuals and businesses used sl@ve labour until it was eventually outlawed. . Fortunately, there are comprehensive databases and research projects that list thousands of individuals, businesses, and merchants who owned sl@ves, operated sl@ve ships, or gained profit from sl@ve labour in the British Caribbean before sl@very was abolished in 1833. . The most extensive resource is the Legacies of British Sl@ve-ownership (LBS) database, managed by University College London (UCL), which was created from the compensation records paid to sl@ve owners when sl@very was outlawed. . There are plenty of other records too which can be searched and sifted over. . The Bank of England was linked to the sl@ve trade and at one point in the 1700s owned two plantations in Grenada through debt default. Many early British banks were founded on profits from these activities. . To date, the BoE has apologised and acknowledged its links to sl@very in the past. . The BoE has not paid reparations or direct compensation to the living descendants. . Now, when sl@very was ended, the BoE did pay the owners of the Grenada plantations money for the loss of their sl@ves. £20 million was paid out to sl@ve owners. All these records are well kept and the paper trails get very precise. . So it's not impossible to track down and go after any descendants of families engaged in these practices. . The government could also prosecute the BoE and fine them." How far in the history do you want to go? Does this witch hunt apply only on the western countries or do you dare to do this with the Arab countries? Also, who exactly do you think pays the money if you prosecute BoE and fine them today? The people who pay the fine will be completely unrelated to the ones related to sl@very. Instead of doing all this, if you really care about people in other countries which were affected centuries back because of sla@very, you could take one for the team and send your own money, instead of doing all these mental gymnastics to invent ways to punish others for mistakes they didn't do. | |||
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"Something that I've pondered before on this subject. If modern day British citizens are in anyway responsible for the bad deeds of our forefathers, then why are we not also responsible for the good deeds? Medical innovations from Great Britain include penicillin, vaccination, antiseptic surgery, CT and MRI scanning to name but a few that have saved millions, possibly billions of lives across Africa and the rest of the world. " No one is saying that we individually are responsible. The state was! And yes the state should be proud of British invention! It's not an either or situation. Britain has been a power for good, however, like all of us we have failed at times, and when we do we should confront it openly and honestly. Apologies, redress and grow | |||
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"Germany payed reparations for WWII, I don't see the issue in talking about reparations for countries we colonised. Germany paid reparations to the countries it had damaged in the immediate aftermath of the war. How is Britain supposed to compensate people that died 200 years ago? Before we discuss reparations, it's helpful to identify which British individuals and businesses used sl@ve labour until it was eventually outlawed. . Fortunately, there are comprehensive databases and research projects that list thousands of individuals, businesses, and merchants who owned sl@ves, operated sl@ve ships, or gained profit from sl@ve labour in the British Caribbean before sl@very was abolished in 1833. . The most extensive resource is the Legacies of British Sl@ve-ownership (LBS) database, managed by University College London (UCL), which was created from the compensation records paid to sl@ve owners when sl@very was outlawed. . There are plenty of other records too which can be searched and sifted over. . The Bank of England was linked to the sl@ve trade and at one point in the 1700s owned two plantations in Grenada through debt default. Many early British banks were founded on profits from these activities. . To date, the BoE has apologised and acknowledged its links to sl@very in the past. . The BoE has not paid reparations or direct compensation to the living descendants. . Now, when sl@very was ended, the BoE did pay the owners of the Grenada plantations money for the loss of their sl@ves. £20 million was paid out to sl@ve owners. All these records are well kept and the paper trails get very precise. . So it's not impossible to track down and go after any descendants of families engaged in these practices. . The government could also prosecute the BoE and fine them." What are you going on about? No one is prosecuting people or institutions about this, everyone can understand it's not the fault of anyone alive today!! | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people?" It's called "The inheritance of advantage". . No one is saying people today committed those crimes. But the effects didn’t end when sl@very did. . Compensation was paid to sl@ve owners, not the ensl@ved—and that money didn’t disappear. It was invested, passed down, and helped build generational wealth. . So the question isn’t about personal guilt—it’s about whether societies that inherited those advantages have any responsibility to address the imbalance they helped create. . Making random people pay for the past ? No. Recognising that the past still pays some people in the present ? Yes. Correcting the imbalance ? Also yes. | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power " Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? | |||
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"I come from a long line of serfs and feudal peasants- where do I go for my potential handout?" Not the same as being dragged from continent to the next. Made to take another name, learn another language, pray to a different god and then get beaten and whipped and die in chains though......all because your black | |||
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" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? It's called "The inheritance of advantage". . No one is saying people today committed those crimes. But the effects didn’t end when sl@very did. . Compensation was paid to sl@ve owners, not the ensl@ved—and that money didn’t disappear. It was invested, passed down, and helped build generational wealth. . So the question isn’t about personal guilt—it’s about whether societies that inherited those advantages have any responsibility to address the imbalance they helped create. . Making random people pay for the past ? No. Recognising that the past still pays some people in the present ? Yes. Correcting the imbalance ? Also yes." The country has gone through two brutal wars after that. Do you think that doesn't adjust the "imbalance"? And all these African countries have subjugated other countries in their history. Do you dare to ask them to correct those imbalances? The answer is simple. If you personally feel responsible for this, pay money out of your own pockets to correct the "imbalance" you are talking about. Don't try to take money out of other pockets to signal a virtue you don't even have. | |||
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"I come from a long line of serfs and feudal peasants- where do I go for my potential handout? Not the same as being dragged from continent to the next. Made to take another name, learn another language, pray to a different god and then get beaten and whipped and die in chains though......all because your black " If you dig deep into everyone's history, you will always find someone being a victim of horrible injustice. The whole idea of paying for something that happened centuries back, based on skin colour is one of the most nonsensical political idea I have heard in modern times. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"?" Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? It's called "The inheritance of advantage". . No one is saying people today committed those crimes. But the effects didn’t end when sl@very did. . Compensation was paid to sl@ve owners, not the ensl@ved—and that money didn’t disappear. It was invested, passed down, and helped build generational wealth. . So the question isn’t about personal guilt—it’s about whether societies that inherited those advantages have any responsibility to address the imbalance they helped create. . Making random people pay for the past ? No. Recognising that the past still pays some people in the present ? Yes. Correcting the imbalance ? Also yes. The country has gone through two brutal wars after that. Do you think that doesn't adjust the "imbalance"? And all these African countries have subjugated other countries in their history. Do you dare to ask them to correct those imbalances? The answer is simple. If you personally feel responsible for this, pay money out of your own pockets to correct the "imbalance" you are talking about. Don't try to take money out of other pockets to signal a virtue you don't even have." It doesn't have to be about taxation. Not sure what you don't understand about voting power on international committees | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very" Are you saying that if sl@ve trade did not happen, Britain wouldn't have roads, clothes or schools? | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? It's called "The inheritance of advantage". . No one is saying people today committed those crimes. But the effects didn’t end when sl@very did. . Compensation was paid to sl@ve owners, not the ensl@ved—and that money didn’t disappear. It was invested, passed down, and helped build generational wealth. . So the question isn’t about personal guilt—it’s about whether societies that inherited those advantages have any responsibility to address the imbalance they helped create. . Making random people pay for the past ? No. Recognising that the past still pays some people in the present ? Yes. Correcting the imbalance ? Also yes. The country has gone through two brutal wars after that. Do you think that doesn't adjust the "imbalance"? And all these African countries have subjugated other countries in their history. Do you dare to ask them to correct those imbalances? The answer is simple. If you personally feel responsible for this, pay money out of your own pockets to correct the "imbalance" you are talking about. Don't try to take money out of other pockets to signal a virtue you don't even have. It doesn't have to be about taxation. Not sure what you don't understand about voting power on international committees" I specifically called out the "scholarship" idea you came up with. Who pays for that scholarship? | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very Are you saying that if sl@ve trade did not happen, Britain wouldn't have roads, clothes or schools?" Yes, I'm saying Europe wouldn't have those infrastructure in place to make the industrial revolution, without sl@very, theirs no money for the industrial revolution | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very Are you saying that if sl@ve trade did not happen, Britain wouldn't have roads, clothes or schools? Yes, I'm saying Europe wouldn't have those infrastructure in place to make the industrial revolution, without sl@very, theirs no money for the industrial revolution " Yeah that's the most ridiculous statement I have heard | |||
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| Reply privately |
" The country has gone through two brutal wars after that. Do you think that doesn't adjust the "imbalance"? And all these African countries have subjugated other countries in their history. Do you dare to ask them to correct those imbalances? The answer is simple. If you personally feel responsible for this, pay money out of your own pockets to correct the "imbalance" you are talking about. Don't try to take money out of other pockets to signal a virtue you don't even have." This isn’t a question of virtue—it’s a question of consistency. . If we accept that wealth, institutions, and opportunity persist across generations, then it follows that some present-day inequalities are rooted in past systems like sl@very. . Wars and unrelated historical events don’t selectively erase those effects. . And bringing up other historical injustices doesn’t negate this one—it just suggests the principle could be applied more broadly. . So the issue isn’t about taking money from individuals arbitrarily. It’s about whether societies acknowledge and address structural imbalances they’ve inherited, and willingly find mechanisms to redress that imbalance. | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very Are you saying that if sl@ve trade did not happen, Britain wouldn't have roads, clothes or schools? Yes, I'm saying Europe wouldn't have those infrastructure in place to make the industrial revolution, without sl@very, theirs no money for the industrial revolution Yeah that's the most ridiculous statement I have heard "Lol!!! Ok I'll try not being rude. Who funded the trains? Who funded the mills? Who funded the canals? Where did they get the material? Who picked the material? Where did Britain get it's sugar? Who picked the cane? Where did they get the money? The most recognisable names for you to start with and work from that is Coulston, Gladstone and Rhodes. | |||
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" This isn’t a question of virtue—it’s a question of consistency. " If you really care about consistency, go and convince every country that has involved in sl@very in the past to pay reparations to their victims and then we can talk. " If we accept that wealth, institutions, and opportunity persist across generations, then it follows that some present-day inequalities are rooted in past systems like sl@very. " No I don't accept that. " Wars and unrelated historical events don’t selectively erase those effects. " Why does selective erasure matter? It erased most of the effects. " And bringing up other historical injustices doesn’t negate this one—it just suggests the principle could be applied more broadly. " History is full of injustices committed by every country and every race. If you want to selectively apply certain rules for just one of them, you are just a hypocrite. " So the issue isn’t about taking money from individuals arbitrarily. It’s about whether societies acknowledge and address structural imbalances they’ve inherited, and willingly find mechanisms to redress that imbalance." There is arbitrariness in how you pick some injustices but not others. The lame idea you came up with to punish BoE today by fining them is you picking up arbitrary targets in your witch hunt because the actual people who end up paying those fines are most probably unrelated to what BoE did centuries back. | |||
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" Yes, I'm saying Europe wouldn't have those infrastructure in place to make the industrial revolution, without sl@very, theirs no money for the industrial revolution " I agree up to a point. . There’s definitely a case that sl@very contributed—especially through cotton, trade, and capital. But saying Europe couldn’t have industrialised without it is too strong. . Industrialisation depended on a whole mix of factors—resources, technology, and institutions. Sl@very was part of the system, but not the entire foundation. . Sl@very was interconnected though and that cannot be denied. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" We can offer scholarships, Scholarship cost money. Sure but it isn't cash to the hands of corrupt government as the racists accuse any black country. Despite the evidence that Putin, Trump, Orbàn are far more corrupt. Why must people of today, many of who aren't even related to the people who committed the crime of sl@very pay for scholarship to random people? Because we owe the wealth of Britain today to their ancestors. The money from the colonies built London, Manchester, Bristol, Liverpool etc etc if it wasn't for sugar and cotton and tobacco Britain wouldn't be where it is now. We payed back the sl@ve owners who were already rich and built those cities. We pulled up draw bridge on the actual descendants of the enalaved. So yes we should apologise, we should enter negotiations on readjusting the balance of power Why are you making it a collective punishment? Not everyone in the country benefitted out of sl@ve trade. Why must people who never benefitted out of sl@ve trade pay money to random people from the other countries? Do you have the balls to ask the descendants of people in those countries who facilitated this trade and made money out of it to pay back their share of "reparations"? Yes we all have benefited from it. The roads were built on it, the cotton clothes made in Lancashire cotton factories were made from it and their descendants are alive because of those wages, schools were built on that money as were prisons and hospitals. They raised statues for these people. We've all benefited, we're all alive because of the money they made via sl@very Are you saying that if sl@ve trade did not happen, Britain wouldn't have roads, clothes or schools? Yes, I'm saying Europe wouldn't have those infrastructure in place to make the industrial revolution, without sl@very, theirs no money for the industrial revolution Yeah that's the most ridiculous statement I have heard
Lol!!!
Ok I'll try not being rude.
Who funded the trains?
Who funded the mills?
Who funded the canals?
Where did they get the material?
Who picked the material?
Where did Britain get it's sugar?
Who picked the cane?
Where did they get the money?
The most recognisable names for you to start with and work from that is Coulston, Gladstone and Rhodes."How many mills, trains, canals we have today were built at the time of sl@ve trade? | |||
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" This isn’t a question of virtue—it’s a question of consistency. If you really care about consistency, go and convince every country that has involved in sl@very in the past to pay reparations to their victims and then we can talk. If we accept that wealth, institutions, and opportunity persist across generations, then it follows that some present-day inequalities are rooted in past systems like sl@very. No I don't accept that. Wars and unrelated historical events don’t selectively erase those effects. Why does selective erasure matter? It erased most of the effects. And bringing up other historical injustices doesn’t negate this one—it just suggests the principle could be applied more broadly. History is full of injustices committed by every country and every race. If you want to selectively apply certain rules for just one of them, you are just a hypocrite. So the issue isn’t about taking money from individuals arbitrarily. It’s about whether societies acknowledge and address structural imbalances they’ve inherited, and willingly find mechanisms to redress that imbalance. There is arbitrariness in how you pick some injustices but not others. The lame idea you came up with to punish BoE today by fining them is you picking up arbitrary targets in your witch hunt because the actual people who end up paying those fines are most probably unrelated to what BoE did centuries back." Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? | |||
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| Reply privately |
" This isn’t a question of virtue—it’s a question of consistency. If you really care about consistency, go and convince every country that has involved in sl@very in the past to pay reparations to their victims and then we can talk. If we accept that wealth, institutions, and opportunity persist across generations, then it follows that some present-day inequalities are rooted in past systems like sl@very. No I don't accept that. Wars and unrelated historical events don’t selectively erase those effects. Why does selective erasure matter? It erased most of the effects. And bringing up other historical injustices doesn’t negate this one—it just suggests the principle could be applied more broadly. History is full of injustices committed by every country and every race. If you want to selectively apply certain rules for just one of them, you are just a hypocrite. So the issue isn’t about taking money from individuals arbitrarily. It’s about whether societies acknowledge and address structural imbalances they’ve inherited, and willingly find mechanisms to redress that imbalance. There is arbitrariness in how you pick some injustices but not others. The lame idea you came up with to punish BoE today by fining them is you picking up arbitrary targets in your witch hunt because the actual people who end up paying those fines are most probably unrelated to what BoE did centuries back." You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. The literal colour demographic of our globe changed due to the actions of mainly Britain, Spain and Portugal. Black people didn't exist in the Carribbean and Americas before. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. So yes once again it was a massive ordeal, and one we still live with. Not many other turning points have been so profound as the industrialision of the transatlantic sl@ve trade. | |||
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" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. " Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. " 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ?" Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same." Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected | |||
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" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. " I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. " They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. " Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. " Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. " Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
| Reply privately |
" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected " I am not even born here Most people living here today had fuck all to benefit from the trade. This is the problem with trying to track cause and effect across generations. You simply can't do it. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ " You can't seem to move away from money. It's not about money. It's about equalising the power of balance in institutions. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected I am not even born here Most people living here today had fuck all to benefit from the trade. This is the problem with trying to track cause and effect across generations. You simply can't do it. "Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits | |||
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| Reply privately |
" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected I am not even born here Most people living here today had fuck all to benefit from the trade. This is the problem with trying to track cause and effect across generations. You simply can't do it.
Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits "Nope. If you think everyone living today benefits out of sl@ve trade that happened two centuries ago, I would expect you to go even further back and find the benefactors of whatever the Mongols and the Romans did. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ You can't seem to move away from money. It's not about money. It's about equalising the power of balance in institutions." Your solutions for doing that involves money. | |||
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| Reply privately |
" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected I am not even born here Most people living here today had fuck all to benefit from the trade. This is the problem with trying to track cause and effect across generations. You simply can't do it.
Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits
Nope. If you think everyone living today benefits out of sl@ve trade that happened two centuries ago, I would expect you to go even further back and find the benefactors of whatever the Mongols and the Romans did."The Romans have left a mark on the UK. But not like the sl@ve trade. Just because we didn't have sl@very on our shores doesn't mean we didn't benefit, there would be no industrial revolution without thee British sl@very | |||
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" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ You can't seem to move away from money. It's not about money. It's about equalising the power of balance in institutions. Your solutions for doing that involves money." How? It might end up cheaper. If you add more people in a round can become cheaper | |||
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" Fine. I've outlined from a systemic, evidence-based view. . How would you redress this past injustice ? What's your plan ? Your choices are 1. Do nothing. Which makes you complicit and accepting of the past. Accepting of past, yes. Complicit, no. If you dig parental lineage, every human's ancestors would have done something horrible. No one goes around tracking that and paying for it. It doesn't make them complicit. 2. Do something. What is the kindest and most equitable solution that tackles the problem ? Great! If that's how you feel, go ahead and give our money from your own pocket. Don't expect others to do the same. Why do you feel personally respecting? It's the state not us! We just happened to get lucky and born here. It's our responsibility to ensure that past wrongs are corrected I am not even born here Most people living here today had fuck all to benefit from the trade. This is the problem with trying to track cause and effect across generations. You simply can't do it.
Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits
Nope. If you think everyone living today benefits out of sl@ve trade that happened two centuries ago, I would expect you to go even further back and find the benefactors of whatever the Mongols and the Romans did.
The Romans have left a mark on the UK.
But not like the sl@ve trade.
"Of course, because one happened many years before the other. It's almost like time erases this impact, doesn't it? " Just because we didn't have sl@very on our shores doesn't mean we didn't benefit, there would be no industrial revolution without thee British sl@very " Countries have progressed a lot without sl@very. So your claim that sl@very is the reason for industrial revolution is not true. | |||
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" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ You can't seem to move away from money. It's not about money. It's about equalising the power of balance in institutions. Your solutions for doing that involves money. How? It might end up cheaper. If you add more people in a round can become cheaper " Where is your "scholarship" money going to come from? Why should we pay for it? If you want to pay, how about you and the other guy on this thread start a fund and pay for it? | |||
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" Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits " 2000 years ago, the Romans kicked the Jews out of Judaea. Since then, they were hounded around other countries, mostly unable to return. Should the Italians pay for the Jews to return there, to restore the balance? | |||
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" You don't seem to understand the grave nature of the transatlantic sl@very. They weren't just put in chains and made to serve. I understand the grave nature of it. I am just saying that it's ridiculous to make people of today pay the price for something that happened centuries back. If we start doing that, every country will have to pay others one way or another. They were up rooted from everything they ever knew, not sold 5 miles down the road! They were forced to change identity, different name, god and language, sold like cattle at markets, whipped and r@ped before dying all because they were black. Yes, and all of them are dead now. Who exactly do you want to pay reparations to? Do you have the balls to make such demands to the Arab countries? Oh wait! You can't because they mostly castrated their sl@ves. Meanwhile, the British scientists were selling garbage that we still live with today, like savages, promiscuity that they have larger then normal penises, their brains are different size, intellect is different, all comes from this period. Find those scientists and ask them to pay the reparations. I am not going to pay a single £ You can't seem to move away from money. It's not about money. It's about equalising the power of balance in institutions. Your solutions for doing that involves money. How? It might end up cheaper. If you add more people in a round can become cheaper Where is your "scholarship" money going to come from? Why should we pay for it? If you want to pay, how about you and the other guy on this thread start a fund and pay for it?" The more you say that the thicker you sound. Like a £10 from 2 people is going to sort anything.......but guess what Nathan £10 from 70,000,000 could go a long long way, so now we understand how taxation works and not funding from Putin or Orbàn | |||
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" Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits 2000 years ago, the Romans kicked the Jews out of Judaea. Since then, they were hounded around other countries, mostly unable to return. Should the Italians pay for the Jews to return there, to restore the balance?" Doesn't work though does it....... Not sure if you've heard........ Israel After WWII, the colonial powers of the time created a state for the Jewish people, incase you know hate, like we see towards Muslims and Jews today starting to rise. So think on..... Maybe it's time we addressed the transatlantic sl@centrade | |||
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" The more you say that the thicker you sound. Like a £10 from 2 people is going to sort anything.......but guess what Nathan £10 from 70,000,000 could go a long long way, so now we understand how taxation works and not funding from Putin or Orbàn " Wait a minute! You will pay only £10 for a cause you so seriously care about? The way you talked about it made me feel that you would mortgage your home to pay for scholarship of ten poor kids from those countries. How about you and the other online social justice warriors add about £10,000 each, considering how seriously you feel about this? I would rather give out my money to causes I seriously care about. | |||
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" The more you say that the thicker you sound. Like a £10 from 2 people is going to sort anything.......but guess what Nathan £10 from 70,000,000 could go a long long way, so now we understand how taxation works and not funding from Putin or Orbàn Wait a minute! You will pay only £10 for a cause you so seriously care about? The way you talked about it made me feel that you would mortgage your home to pay for scholarship of ten poor kids from those countries. How about you and the other online social justice warriors add about £10,000 each, considering how seriously you feel about this? I would rather give out my money to causes I seriously care about. " And that's the difference, I don't see society as what I can give. I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. I see we, you see .....well you | |||
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" Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits 2000 years ago, the Romans kicked the Jews out of Judaea. Since then, they were hounded around other countries, mostly unable to return. Should the Italians pay for the Jews to return there, to restore the balance? Doesn't work though does it....... Not sure if you've heard........ Israel After WWII, the colonial powers of the time created a state for the Jewish people, incase you know hate, like we see towards Muslims and Jews today starting to rise. So think on..... Maybe it's time we addressed the transatlantic sl@centrade" Italy (and the greater Roman empire, which benefited from roads, sanitation and everything else Monty Python enumerated) didn't really pay much to make it work - perhaps pay off the colonial invaders who moved in after they were kicked out? All that the Roman Empire countries did was "recognise" Israel. Like today sl@very is "recognised". Perhaps there should be general reparations, from the English, Spanish, French, Russians, Yemenites and everyone else who either persecuted or expelled Jews? Perhaps extra voting power in the UN? | |||
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" The more you say that the thicker you sound. Like a £10 from 2 people is going to sort anything.......but guess what Nathan £10 from 70,000,000 could go a long long way, so now we understand how taxation works and not funding from Putin or Orbàn Wait a minute! You will pay only £10 for a cause you so seriously care about? The way you talked about it made me feel that you would mortgage your home to pay for scholarship of ten poor kids from those countries. How about you and the other online social justice warriors add about £10,000 each, considering how seriously you feel about this? I would rather give out my money to causes I seriously care about. And that's the difference, I don't see society as what I can give. I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. " Sounds like a poetic excuse for why you do not want to open your own wallet 🤣 And again, you have been moving goal posts between reparations not being a financial thing and then it being a financial thing (scholarship) " I see we, you see .....well you" You know nothing about me. I have causes I care about and I do my best for it. That keeps me happy and content about myself. I don't need validation from random strangers on the internet. And I am definitely not going to be guilt tripped into paying for "reparations" by those random strangers. | |||
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" I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. I see we, you see .....well you" You're literally telling an Indian to pay for crimes committed by Britain before it had even colonised India. Does that not strike you as... Unhinged? | |||
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"Your beginning to sound like the orange monkey in the white house " You ran out of arguments I see. | |||
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" I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. I see we, you see .....well you You're literally telling an Indian to pay for crimes committed by Britain before it had even colonised India. Does that not strike you as... Unhinged?" Lol, I'm telling British residents to start thinking of ways to pay reparations. | |||
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" I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. I see we, you see .....well you You're literally telling an Indian to pay for crimes committed by Britain before it had even colonised India. Does that not strike you as... Unhinged?" Considering the fact that the scholarships will be paid for by taxes, they will legit collect tax from black people in the UK to pay reparations for sl@very  | |||
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"Your beginning to sound like the orange monkey in the white house You ran out of arguments I see." To be honest, your just going around in circles, you won't accept other ways of thinking about reparations so it just a doom loop of decline | |||
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" Lol, I'm telling British residents to start thinking of ways to pay reparations. " ...so Brits in Ghana get the money? | |||
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" Lol, I'm telling British residents to start thinking of ways to pay reparations. ...so Brits in Ghana get the money?" Ghana? Money? Move away from the payment scheme, look at other ways | |||
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" Lol, I'm telling British residents to start thinking of ways to pay reparations. ...so Brits in Ghana get the money? Ghana? Money? Move away from the payment scheme, look at other ways " Sorry. Scholarships. So it's residency based, so Indians and Africans (among others) in Britain pay for scholarships to... Whom? | |||
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" Yeah you can, everyone living here benefits 2000 years ago, the Romans kicked the Jews out of Judaea. Since then, they were hounded around other countries, mostly unable to return. Should the Italians pay for the Jews to return there, to restore the balance? Doesn't work though does it....... Not sure if you've heard........ Israel After WWII, the colonial powers of the time created a state for the Jewish people, incase you know hate, like we see towards Muslims and Jews today starting to rise. So think on..... Maybe it's time we addressed the transatlantic sl@centrade Italy (and the greater Roman empire, which benefited from roads, sanitation and everything else Monty Python enumerated) didn't really pay much to make it work - perhaps pay off the colonial invaders who moved in after they were kicked out? All that the Roman Empire countries did was "recognise" Israel. Like today sl@very is "recognised". Perhaps there should be general reparations, from the English, Spanish, French, Russians, Yemenites and everyone else who either persecuted or expelled Jews? Perhaps extra voting power in the UN?" This can't be a real a post?? No one can be this ahistorical surely | |||
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" This can't be a real a post?? No one can be this ahistorical surely " Please correct the errors, then. It seems to follow your own logic, surely. | |||
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"Just because we didn't have sl@very on our shores doesn't mean we didn't benefit, there would be no industrial revolution without thee British sl@very " Following that logic, does that not mean that all African countries owe a debt to Sir Robert Macadam? His invention of tarmac paved the way for durable roads, and massively reduced friction in trade. Should African countries that have tarmacked roads be paying us for the benefit that they've received? | |||
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"Just because we didn't have sl@very on our shores doesn't mean we didn't benefit, there would be no industrial revolution without thee British sl@very Following that logic, does that not mean that all African countries owe a debt to Sir Robert Macadam? His invention of tarmac paved the way for durable roads, and massively reduced friction in trade. Should African countries that have tarmacked roads be paying us for the benefit that they've received?" Did they ask for it? Or did we impose it? And to the broader theme yes we are all interconnected | |||
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"Just because we didn't have sl@very on our shores doesn't mean we didn't benefit, there would be no industrial revolution without thee British sl@very" "Following that logic, does that not mean that all African countries owe a debt to Sir Robert Macadam? His invention of tarmac paved the way for durable roads, and massively reduced friction in trade. Should African countries that have tarmacked roads be paying us for the benefit that they've received?" "Did they ask for it? Or did we impose it?" Britain only ever exerted control over about a third of Africa. Should the other two thirds be paying us? | |||
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" This can't be a real a post?? No one can be this ahistorical surely Please correct the errors, then. It seems to follow your own logic, surely." You really painted yourself into a logical corner there. Right? | |||
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"Yawn, Africans were first to capture, ensla ve and sell their own people." Africans were the only ones to do that. Britain bought, sold, and transported slaves, but it didn't do any enslaving. That's why it's called the Slave Trade - because slaves were traded, not created. | |||
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"Yawn, Africans were first to capture, ensla ve and sell their own people. " Mesopotamia/Sumer for the earliest recorded sl@very (Iraq/Middle East). | |||
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"So my descendants are from a former British colony which means I am owed reparations." According to the chap above, there's no reparations for individuals, they only get paid to countries. So that means that you (as a Briton that has inherited all of the wealth of the slave trade) will have to pay reparations to the country that your parents (or possibly grand-parents) came from. I'm sure that sounds fair to him. | |||
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"So my descendants are from a former British colony which means I am owed reparations. According to the chap above, there's no reparations for individuals, they only get paid to countries. So that means that you (as a Briton that has inherited all of the wealth of the slade trade) will have to pay reparations to the country that your parents (or possibly grand-parents) came from. I'm sure that sounds fair to him." What guarantee is there that the monies given to whatever country receiving it would be dispersed equitably and without corruption . Just asking. | |||
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"So my descendants are from a former British colony which means I am owed reparations. According to the chap above, there's no reparations for individuals, they only get paid to countries. So that means that you (as a Briton that has inherited all of the wealth of the slade trade) will have to pay reparations to the country that your parents (or possibly grand-parents) came from. I'm sure that sounds fair to him. What guarantee is there that the monies given to whatever country receiving it would be dispersed equitably and without corruption . Just asking." No guarantees...which was the argument against Germany paying Israel reparations in 1956. Who would you have sided with in that instance? Just asking. | |||
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"Where is this going to end " If UK and the other countries categorically ask them to fuck off, this will end immediately. But no one would do that. There is a reason why they never bring up reputation talks with the Arab countries. | |||
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"So my descendants are from a former British colony which means I am owed reparations. According to the chap above, there's no reparations for individuals, they only get paid to countries. So that means that you (as a Briton that has inherited all of the wealth of the sl ve trade) will have to pay reparations to the country that your parents (or possibly grand-parents) came from. I'm sure that sounds fair to him." I see, but when one country pays another country happens, ultimately the money comes from individuals in taxes and if the receiving country are nice it is spent on individuals. I'm just cutting out the middle man. However I'm not paying a penny until the Italians cough up | |||
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"A fascinating read from the propaganda arm of the Qatari government." What leads to you conclude that the Qataris are involved with that article? | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance." I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night | |||
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"A fascinating read from the propaganda arm of the Qatari government. What leads to you conclude that the Qataris are involved with that article?" Technically speaking, that's your inference. They might not be - calling them the propaganda arm of Qatar might not be related to this article. But it is suspiciously quiet on the issue of the Arab sl@ve trade, while it still has time to mention Israel in the article (but not Argentina). It's unlikely that Qatar specifically commissioned this opinion piece, but it's bias by omission from Qatari publication does beg the question. | |||
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"Let me guess, some rich people in Africa want money." This in a nutshell. | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance. I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night " Scotland joined Britain via James I (VI) Not from pilaging and r@ping your nation for the minerals then imposing tyranny after they've exported your prisoner for sl@very in Americas. You lot really do need to pick up a few history books and truly understand what transatlantic sl@very was and what we imposed in the Caribbean and across the globe | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance. I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night Scotland joined Britain via James I (VI) Not from pilaging and r@ping your nation for the minerals then imposing tyranny after they've exported your prisoner for sl@very in Americas. You lot really do need to pick up a few history books and truly understand what transatlantic sl@very was and what we imposed in the Caribbean and across the globe " "We" didn't. | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance. I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night Scotland joined Britain via James I (VI) Not from pilaging and r@ping your nation for the minerals then imposing tyranny after they've exported your prisoner for sl@very in Americas. You lot really do need to pick up a few history books and truly understand what transatlantic sl@very was and what we imposed in the Caribbean and across the globe "We" didn't." My apologies the "British did", however, inform me, did your ancestors not travel to Britain with British a British passport? I know my mates grandparents traveled to Britain with British Jamaican passports etc. Not the case for India? | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance. I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night Scotland joined Britain via James I (VI) Not from pilaging and r@ping your nation for the minerals then imposing tyranny after they've exported your prisoner for sl@very in Americas. You lot really do need to pick up a few history books and truly understand what transatlantic sl@very was and what we imposed in the Caribbean and across the globe "We" didn't. My apologies the "British did", however, inform me, did your ancestors not travel to Britain with British a British passport? I know my mates grandparents traveled to Britain with British Jamaican passports etc. Not the case for India?" Nope. I grew up in India. And even people with British passport didn't. Will you look at an African passport holder and say "You sold sl@ves"? | |||
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"I for one are proud of my ancestors I wouldn't and we wouldn't be here in the position we are if not for are ancestors sla😭😭😭very was of it's time yes we can look and say it was wrong but putting a monetary value on it no chance. I want money and Compensation for the Highland Clearances Those terrible English rap ing and pilfering our land and women And ofcourse prima nocta on our wedding night Scotland joined Britain via James I (VI) Not from pilaging and r@ping your nation for the minerals then imposing tyranny after they've exported your prisoner for sl@very in Americas. You lot really do need to pick up a few history books and truly understand what transatlantic sl@very was and what we imposed in the Caribbean and across the globe "We" didn't. My apologies the "British did", however, inform me, did your ancestors not travel to Britain with British a British passport? I know my mates grandparents traveled to Britain with British Jamaican passports etc. Not the case for India? Nope. I grew up in India. And even people with British passport didn't. Will you look at an African passport holder and say "You sold sl@ves"?" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register" It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. " Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone." Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons." Reparations are long overdue. It doesn't have to be cash, we can start talking about what can benefit those nations. | |||
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" However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. Reparations are long overdue. It doesn't have to be cash, we can start talking about what can benefit those nations." This is what you are saying in one line - "No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened." And now you say that reparations have to be given. Two questions for you. 1) If no one today had to be blamed, why should they pay reparations? 2) If it's not in cash, what else? You have jumped goal posts frequently on this. You said scholarships at first, which clearly costs money. Now you are saying that it's not about cash. | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons." It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws. | |||
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" However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. Reparations are long overdue. It doesn't have to be cash, we can start talking about what can benefit those nations. This is what you are saying in one line - "No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened." And now you say that reparations have to be given. Two questions for you. 1) If no one today had to be blamed, why should they pay reparations? 2) If it's not in cash, what else? You have jumped goal posts frequently on this. You said scholarships at first, which clearly costs money. Now you are saying that it's not about cash." It's not about individuals alive, but but Britain is and all we've done is stuff money in the pockets of the rich and not the pockets of the people who suffered and still stuffer from racism as the beneficiaries of the fake science of the time or the rigged economy against the smaller nations. I've been consistent in saying think wider it can be scholarships, greater voting weight as t international bodies so that smaller nations can have a louder voice. I'm saying, accept and enter talks, we don't have to accept things we don't like but equally we will have to give, that's negotiations. All I'm saying is start the talks | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws." That's what it sounds like | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws." Sorry, what, pardon? If you have a problem with the way I've conducted my argument come at me! Not sending someone by something you've made up with no evidence! | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws. That's what it sounds like "Shame it took another person to point it out | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. Reparations are long overdue. It doesn't have to be cash, we can start talking about what can benefit those nations." Which public services in the UK would you cut to pay for these reparations, cash or otherwise? Why do you think Britain is in any position to actually assist these countries? What Barbados talks about reparations, it references about $24 trillion being owed to countries affected by sl*very. Annual UK GDP is £3 trillion. | |||
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" It's not about individuals alive, but but Britain is and all we've done is stuff money in the pockets of the rich and not the pockets of the people who suffered and still stuffer from racism as the beneficiaries of the fake science of the time or the rigged economy against the smaller nations. " What is Britain in this context? Who do you mean "We" when you say that we have stuffed money in pockets of the rich? " I've been consistent in saying think wider it can be scholarships, " That's money right? Why do you then pretend like it's not about money? " greater voting weight as t international bodies so that smaller nations can have a louder voice. I'm saying, accept and enter talks, we don't have to accept things we don't like but equally we will have to give, that's negotiations. All I'm saying is start the talks " Are you ok if we enter the talks with a condition that not a single pound will be spent by this country on this? | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. Reparations are long overdue. It doesn't have to be cash, we can start talking about what can benefit those nations. Which public services in the UK would you cut to pay for these reparations, cash or otherwise? Why do you think Britain is in any position to actually assist these countries? What Barbados talks about reparations, it references about $24 trillion being owed to countries affected by sl*very. Annual UK GDP is £3 trillion. " We don't know until we enter the talks. Talks aren't promises! | |||
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" It's not about individuals alive, but but Britain is and all we've done is stuff money in the pockets of the rich and not the pockets of the people who suffered and still stuffer from racism as the beneficiaries of the fake science of the time or the rigged economy against the smaller nations. What is Britain in this context? Who do you mean "We" when you say that we have stuffed money in pockets of the rich? I've been consistent in saying think wider it can be scholarships, That's money right? Why do you then pretend like it's not about money? greater voting weight as t international bodies so that smaller nations can have a louder voice. I'm saying, accept and enter talks, we don't have to accept things we don't like but equally we will have to give, that's negotiations. All I'm saying is start the talks Are you ok if we enter the talks with a condition that not a single pound will be spent by this country on this?" We is Britain and they payed the sl@ve owners who were extremely rich individuals and most still have wealth in Britain today. Your missing the word Can, it can be about anything. Let's enter the talks and find out. Yes, if you enter negotiations to see what the other side wants its not a promise! | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws." Sorry I'm not letting this go. Where? Where have I suggested or implicitly applied this? | |||
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" We is Britain and they payed the sl@ve owners who were extremely rich individuals and most still have wealth in Britain today. " What is "Britain" in this context? Is it the British people living today? " Your missing the word Can, it can be about anything. Let's enter the talks and find out. " I think we should make our stance clear on this. Isn't it better to go into talks after making it clear that we WON'T spend a single penny on this? Or do you think we must be open to pay money? | |||
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" We is Britain and they payed the sl@ve owners who were extremely rich individuals and most still have wealth in Britain today. What is "Britain" in this context? Is it the British people living today? Your missing the word Can, it can be about anything. Let's enter the talks and find out. I think we should make our stance clear on this. Isn't it better to go into talks after making it clear that we WON'T spend a single penny on this? Or do you think we must be open to pay money?" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy | |||
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" Welcome my post colonialist brother. Indians who held British passports didn't what? I don't tend to look at anyone's passports and say you sold sl@ves. But if you're point is that Africans sold sl@ves that's true. As is true throughout history. But the gravity of sending people across a continent against their will and then forcing them to loose their identity, via name, language, dress, religion with no hope of ever seeing their loved ones again doesn't seem to register It sounds like you are too eager to give collective responsibility for what a few people did. My point is that some Brits were participating in the trade and some Africans too were. But it's wrong to call everyone out, especially people who are in these countries centuries after it happened. Straws and clutching!!! No one is blaming anyone alive today for what happened. However, reading about it understanding the horrors can make us better people and therefore a better country. We have to reflect, in order to learn and then understand and accept and ask how we can work together to make things better for everyone. Pretty sure everyone is happy with reading about it and learning not to do anything like that again. It's the reparations nonsense that no one is willing to do, and for the right reasons. It would appear that someone is trying to call you a brown sahib, sellout or coconut, but use framing to make it sound less racist. Or, at least, somehow make you responsible for something with which neither you nor your ancestors had anything to do. Clutching at straws. That's what it sounds like "Where did I implicitly imply this? | |||
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" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? " But you said that people of today aren't to be blamed. So why exactly should we even enter the negotiations? " No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy " And now you have moved your goal post again. Maybe instead of beating around the bush, you have to come out with some honesty about the cash thing. If they ask us to spend money on their country in forms of building schools, scholarships or whatever, should we or should we not agree to spend money on this? | |||
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" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? But you said that people of today aren't to be blamed. So why exactly should we even enter the negotiations? No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy And now you have moved your goal post again. Maybe instead of beating around the bush, you have to come out with some honesty about the cash thing. If they ask us to spend money on their country in forms of building schools, scholarships or whatever, should we or should we not agree to spend money on this? " You equate blame with taxes? | |||
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" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? But you said that people of today aren't to be blamed. So why exactly should we even enter the negotiations? No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy And now you have moved your goal post again. Maybe instead of beating around the bush, you have to come out with some honesty about the cash thing. If they ask us to spend money on their country in forms of building schools, scholarships or whatever, should we or should we not agree to spend money on this? " It depends, does it fulfill there and our needs, it's negotiations we can't be certain of anything because we aren't involved. So my position once again. Is enter the talks, put what you want on the table and we'll see | |||
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" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? But you said that people of today aren't to be blamed. So why exactly should we even enter the negotiations? No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy And now you have moved your goal post again. Maybe instead of beating around the bush, you have to come out with some honesty about the cash thing. If they ask us to spend money on their country in forms of building schools, scholarships or whatever, should we or should we not agree to spend money on this? You equate blame with taxes?" If you are going to make us pay taxes to pay money to some random country for what some random people did centuries ago, then yes, you are blaming us for it. Why should we pay money for this if none of us living today are responsible for this? | |||
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" It depends, does it fulfill there and our needs, it's negotiations we can't be certain of anything because we aren't involved. So my position once again. Is enter the talks, put what you want on the table and we'll see" No. You are avoiding the most important question here. Most of us do not want to pay money for this. Do you want to pay money for this or not? Try not beating around the bush and answer honestly. | |||
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" Obviously, what other sort of Britain can enter negotiations??? But you said that people of today aren't to be blamed. So why exactly should we even enter the negotiations? No, you can say we enter in good faith and everything is on the table to here the ideas. You can then say that wouldn't be acceptable this would etc etc. Greater weight at climate conference, greater weight at the UN scholarship, building schools, building water pipes. Sure some of that is money and it's why we have foreign policy And now you have moved your goal post again. Maybe instead of beating around the bush, you have to come out with some honesty about the cash thing. If they ask us to spend money on their country in forms of building schools, scholarships or whatever, should we or should we not agree to spend money on this? You equate blame with taxes? If you are going to make us pay taxes to pay money to some random country for what some random people did centuries ago, then yes, you are blaming us for it. Why should we pay money for this if none of us living today are responsible for this?" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice | |||
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" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. " I thought people living today aren't to be blamed for what happened then. Who are these richest people in 2015 who owned sl@ves? " Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice " If you want, you can give your own money. Others aren't stupid enough to give money for this circus show. | |||
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" It depends, does it fulfill there and our needs, it's negotiations we can't be certain of anything because we aren't involved. So my position once again. Is enter the talks, put what you want on the table and we'll see No. You are avoiding the most important question here. Most of us do not want to pay money for this. Do you want to pay money for this or not? Try not beating around the bush and answer honestly." I personally will pay more taxes for everything. And as above if you payed taxes in Britain until 2015 you've been stuffing the coffers of the richest families in Britain. Didn't drop a tear did you? Now we ask you to divert that tax to the poorest nations, no increas because we already save what we were paying. Crocodile tears from hell | |||
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" It depends, does it fulfill there and our needs, it's negotiations we can't be certain of anything because we aren't involved. So my position once again. Is enter the talks, put what you want on the table and we'll see No. You are avoiding the most important question here. Most of us do not want to pay money for this. Do you want to pay money for this or not? Try not beating around the bush and answer honestly. I personally will pay more taxes for everything. And as above if you payed taxes in Britain until 2015 you've been stuffing the coffers of the richest families in Britain. Didn't drop a tear did you? Now we ask you to divert that tax to the poorest nations, no increas because we already save what we were paying. Crocodile tears from hell " At least now, you have admitted that you want to send money. Maybe you should have been honest from the beginning? And which richest family are we paying tax to? | |||
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" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. I thought people living today aren't to be blamed for what happened then. Who are these richest people in 2015 who owned sl@ves? Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice If you want, you can give your own money. Others aren't stupid enough to give money for this circus show." You can look them up and some of them are actually involved in wanting reparations, why are you trying to find blame all the time? It's us, we have all benefited by living in Britain we owe them! My worth isn't enough, however, collectively as a nation it is. That's how taxes work. | |||
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" It depends, does it fulfill there and our needs, it's negotiations we can't be certain of anything because we aren't involved. So my position once again. Is enter the talks, put what you want on the table and we'll see No. You are avoiding the most important question here. Most of us do not want to pay money for this. Do you want to pay money for this or not? Try not beating around the bush and answer honestly. I personally will pay more taxes for everything. And as above if you payed taxes in Britain until 2015 you've been stuffing the coffers of the richest families in Britain. Didn't drop a tear did you? Now we ask you to divert that tax to the poorest nations, no increas because we already save what we were paying. Crocodile tears from hell At least now, you have admitted that you want to send money. Maybe you should have been honest from the beginning? And which richest family are we paying tax to?" Google them!! Go on a learning journey! There's this one woman and ex BBC journalist who's started a charity and she gives up a lot of her fortunate to to Grenada | |||
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" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. I thought people living today aren't to be blamed for what happened then. Who are these richest people in 2015 who owned sl@ves? Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice If you want, you can give your own money. Others aren't stupid enough to give money for this circus show. You can look them up and some of them are actually involved in wanting reparations, why are you trying to find blame all the time? It's us, we have all benefited by living in Britain we owe them! " Look at the way you have gone around in circles in this thread
You started by saying that people of today aren't to be blamed for what happened two centuries back. And now you are saying that there are some rich families today which are still owing reparations. And somehow people living today have to pay taxes for this too?
You started by saying that cash doesn't have to be paid. And now you are saying that cash has to be paid.
" My worth isn't enough, however, collectively as a nation it is. That's how taxes work. " I personally believe in numerous causes outside the country that needs investment. I am not going to expect tax payers of this country to pay money for that. If your worth isn't enough, that's a shame. Maybe you must do another part time job during weekends instead of spending time on a swingers site, get that money to pay those reparations that you really want to pay? None of the left wing progressives have a clear case for reparations. So no one else is going to be convinced to pay for this nonsense. You just have to look at your own posts in this thread to see how silly the whole argument sounds. Good luck finding some fools willing to part away with their money for this | |||
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" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. I thought people living today aren't to be blamed for what happened then. Who are these richest people in 2015 who owned sl@ves? Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice If you want, you can give your own money. Others aren't stupid enough to give money for this circus show. You can look them up and some of them are actually involved in wanting reparations, why are you trying to find blame all the time? It's us, we have all benefited by living in Britain we owe them! Look at the way you have gone around in circles in this thread
You started by saying that people of today aren't to be blamed for what happened two centuries back. And now you are saying that there are some rich families today which are still owing reparations. And somehow people living today have to pay taxes for this too?
You started by saying that cash doesn't have to be paid. And now you are saying that cash has to be paid.
My worth isn't enough, however, collectively as a nation it is. That's how taxes work.
I personally believe in numerous causes outside the country that needs investment. I am not going to expect tax payers of this country to pay money for that.
If your worth isn't enough, that's a shame. Maybe you must do another part time job during weekends instead of spending time on a swingers site, get that money to pay those reparations that you really want to pay?
None of the left wing progressives have a clear case for reparations. So no one else is going to be convinced to pay for this nonsense. You just have to look at your own posts in this thread to see how silly the whole argument sounds. Good luck finding some fools willing to part away with their money for this "Reality isn't blame. No one alive today is to blame for the atrocities of the past. The richest families of Britain owe their wealth to sla@very. We all pay taxes anyway no one reduced your taxes when we stopped paying in 2015. And your last post..... Wtf even is that? I've got a newer car than you? Grow up! | |||
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" Reality isn't blame. No one alive today is to blame for the atrocities of the past. " And yet you want us to pay taxes to give reparations 🤷♂️ " The richest families of Britain owe their wealth to sla@very. " Ask those families to pay if you want. I am not stopping you. " We all pay taxes anyway no one reduced your taxes when we stopped paying in 2015 " We all pay tax anyway, let's also hire a cruise ships and send them to the Arabs, for absolutely no reason. " And your last post..... Wtf even is that? I've got a newer car than you? Grow up!" What does your car have anything to do with it? You are asking for others to pay for a cause that only you seem to care about. No one else wants to pay for it, nor do they have a reason to pay for it. So, if you want more money for that cause, you and your progressive friends who talk a lot about this online, should start a fund a build it. | |||
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"Why should we pay money for this if none of us living today are responsible for this?" "We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves." What you mean is - in 1833 Britain paid compensation to slave owners, financing those payments by taking out a £20m loan. For the 182 years after that point Britain was paying interest on a loan, it wasn't paying money to rich people. | |||
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"Why should we pay money for this if none of us living today are responsible for this? We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. What you mean is - in 1833 Britain paid compensation to sl@ve owners, financing those payments by taking out a £20m loan. For the 182 years after that point Britain was paying interest on a loan, it wasn't paying money to rich people." That loan went to extremely rich people! And they still are extremely rich people. | |||
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"Why should we pay money for this if none of us living today are responsible for this? We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. What you mean is - in 1833 Britain paid compensation to sl@ve owners, financing those payments by taking out a £20m loan. For the 182 years after that point Britain was paying interest on a loan, it wasn't paying money to rich people." How do you get away with typing sl@ve? | |||
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" We already did until 2015 to the richest people in Britain for owning sl@ves. I thought people living today aren't to be blamed for what happened then. Who are these richest people in 2015 who owned sl@ves? Pretty sure we can help the poorest nations over the next 300 years and you wouldn't even notice If you want, you can give your own money. Others aren't stupid enough to give money for this circus show. You can look them up and some of them are actually involved in wanting reparations, why are you trying to find blame all the time? It's us, we have all benefited by living in Britain we owe them! My worth isn't enough, however, collectively as a nation it is. That's how taxes work." No to reparations of any kind unil every other country that has done things they are probably not so proud of these days pay up. It seems time is not relevant so an example would be how much should the Italians pay for throwing people to lions as a spectator sport be. Or how much for publicly nailing people to a cross and leaving them to die in agony. What about the counties that execute people for being gay even to this day. Those that want to pay can do so but don't expect others, who had nothing to do with it, to pay in any way | |||
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" I see society as a collective, we all have benefits either money, time or talent and that's what's beautiful, and that's why I see reparations as more than financial and you can't. I see we, you see .....well you You're literally telling an Indian to pay for crimes committed by Britain before it had even colonised India. Does that not strike you as... Unhinged? Lol, I'm telling British residents to start thinking of ways to pay reparations. " You're speaking to someone who immigrated here from India. You previously assumed that his ancestors came here as "British" and so were part of the problem with sl@very (somehow). You then referenced Indians imported to Africa to help run the empire. You are looking to make him guilty by association and, when that failed, you tried to say that he's responsible for reparations by virtue of the fact that he's standing on British soil. Your assumptions were wrong, then wrong again, then wrong again. But you're foisting "white guilt" onto him. With a fairly crass chain of incorrect assumptions. You're essentially saying "you benefit from European culture, which benefited from sl@very so you're "white" for this purpose. Coconut adjacent reasoning. " Is it not the case that the British exported people from the Indian continent to the Caribbean and Africa for municipal work?" " Implied culpability. My apologies the "British did", however, inform me, did your ancestors not travel to Britain with British a British passport? I know my mates grandparents traveled to Britain with British Jamaican passports etc. Not the case for India?" " Assumptions? Welcome my post colonialist brother." Ick. You're taking someone from a colonised country and making them partially responsible for sl@very reparations - can you not see the problem? | |||
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