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"From 2030, no solely petrol/diesel vehicles (hybrids okay). From 2035, only zero emission (hydrogen/electric/Fred Flintstone). Additionally, between now and 2035 (e.g. 80% by 2030), an increasing proportion of vehicles must be zero emission, or manufacturers will pay £15,000 per vehicle. Successive governments have failed by not rolling out viable infrastructure fast enough." And VED going up to £760 a year on existing worst polluters. | |||
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"From 2030, no solely petrol/diesel vehicles (hybrids okay). From 2035, only zero emission (hydrogen/electric/Fred Flintstone). Additionally, between now and 2035 (e.g. 80% by 2030), an increasing proportion of vehicles must be zero emission, or manufacturers will pay £15,000 per vehicle. Successive governments have failed by not rolling out viable infrastructure fast enough." We bought a full electric and it's great but I wouldn't like to be traveling for work, not enough chargers and they're expensive if you can find a working one | |||
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"The answer might be, like all those free bikes in China, just have electric cars that you rent when you need one. Someone will deliver it to you. You drop it off when you’re done. Make it really affordable and people won’t see the point in buying an expensive car you have to maintain anymore. " Self driving cars will be delivering themselves. But that’s not really what I was getting at. The closer we get to the dates, the more problematic it will be if they are changed. I think if the dates aren’t put back or scrapped, after 2035 there will be a massive boost in the sales of parts and cars that might ordinarily have been scrapped will be running around on the roads for decades. I saw a Morris Minor today, got to be older than me lol. The shift will go from new car manufacture to used car maintenance and repair. There will still be petrol and diesel cars running around in 40 years time becoming more and more polluting. | |||
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" I think if the dates aren’t put back or scrapped, after 2035 there will be a massive boost in the sales of parts and cars that might ordinarily have been scrapped will be running around on the roads for decades. I saw a Morris Minor today, got to be older than me lol. The shift will go from new car manufacture to used car maintenance and repair. There will still be petrol and diesel cars running around in 40 years time becoming more and more polluting. " They will tax / mot / emission fail older cars off the road. We simply won’t be allowed to use them. We are seeing this coming with higher VED in April. A 2001-17 v6 Mondeo or similar £760 a year. Classic cars may get a pass to be driven to a show. Another tactic is not allowing uneconomical repairs. | |||
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" I think if the dates aren’t put back or scrapped, after 2035 there will be a massive boost in the sales of parts and cars that might ordinarily have been scrapped will be running around on the roads for decades. I saw a Morris Minor today, got to be older than me lol. The shift will go from new car manufacture to used car maintenance and repair. There will still be petrol and diesel cars running around in 40 years time becoming more and more polluting. They will tax / mot / emission fail older cars off the road. We simply won’t be allowed to use them. We are seeing this coming with higher VED in April. A 2001-17 v6 Mondeo or similar £760 a year. Classic cars may get a pass to be driven to a show. Another tactic is not allowing uneconomical repairs. " How can a car repair be “not allowed”? My point was that “uneconomical” with regards to car repair will be a thing of the past. Unviable because of lack of parts maybe, but you can get parts for 50yo cars now and there’s hardly any about. When there’s millions of them, parts manufacturing will be a bigger business that new car production. Yeah I get what you mean about changing MOT criteria etc but once a car is a certain age it doesn’t need an MOT. Where I live, if I want to work I need a car. I can’t spend £20,000 on a second hand electric car that I can’t charge at home and no charging points within 5 miles, for that car to be uneconomical to repair in three years so I have to spend another £20k. Many people don’t have the money to buy new. I’ll be at retirement age by the time this happens but there will be hundreds of thousands of people that probably have to quit work because the government made their method of transport illegal | |||
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" Many people don’t have the money to buy new. I’ll be at retirement age by the time this happens but there will be hundreds of thousands of people that probably have to quit work because the government made their method of transport illegal " Agree. Which is my point. Going back to the V6 mondeo or similar, the low budget motorist now has to pay £760, or can’t sell it as it’s worthless as ved more than the car’s value. | |||
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"If I had the capital I'd be investing in 2nd hand petrol cars like mad." For the UK market I'm a bit out of touch these days. In a previous life I was 25 years in the motor trade. In Europe (especially Germany) people are doing exactly that. Used ICE cars (especially diesel) are in short supply and anything decent is commanding premium prices. Only last week Mrs son bought a 12 year old BMW with 140,000 kms. He'd been looking for weeks and in the end we had to drive 2 hours for him to pay 17,000€ for it. 
Jeez, when I was in the job anything over 10 years old was pretty much a scrapper. | |||
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" Many people don’t have the money to buy new. I’ll be at retirement age by the time this happens but there will be hundreds of thousands of people that probably have to quit work because the government made their method of transport illegal Agree. Which is my point. Going back to the V6 mondeo or similar, the low budget motorist now has to pay £760, or can’t sell it as it’s worthless as ved more than the car’s value. " I think the opposite will happen. As supplies become more limited due to accidents, prices will rise. Also the cost of petrol and diesel will fall as the markets are awash with surplus stock that less and less people are buying. Although fuel duty taxes will rise most likely. Only when that 15yo Ford Focus with 200,000 miles on the clock, costs virtually the same as a new EV will the market shift. But before then, half the car manufacturers will probably have gone out of business. | |||
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"I could never afford a new car anyway, so unless there’s a healthy secondhand EV market, I’ll be doing a lot of walking come 2030! "EVs don’t last long enough to make it to the second hand market. Very expensive parts, not worth fixing half of them… but yeh, they are great for the environment!! Honest | |||
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"I could never afford a new car anyway, so unless there’s a healthy secondhand EV market, I’ll be doing a lot of walking come 2030!
EVs don’t last long enough to make it to the second hand market. Very expensive parts, not worth fixing half of them… but yeh, they are great for the environment!! Honest"The rich middle classes want the poor off the roads and the roads to themselves. EVs being unaffordable for the masses is all part of the plan… | |||
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"The rich middle classes want the poor off the roads and the roads to themselves. EVs being unaffordable for the masses is all part of the plan…" Yes, millions of rich middle class people across the planet are arranging climate change with the specific aim of getting poor people off the roads. It all makes sense now. | |||
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"I could never afford a new car anyway, so unless there’s a healthy secondhand EV market, I’ll be doing a lot of walking come 2030!
EVs don’t last long enough to make it to the second hand market. Very expensive parts, not worth fixing half of them… but yeh, they are great for the environment!! Honest
The rich middle classes want the poor off the roads and the roads to themselves.
EVs being unaffordable for the masses is all part of the plan…"Genius......crackpot but genius | |||
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"The rich middle classes want the poor off the roads and the roads to themselves. EVs being unaffordable for the masses is all part of the plan… Yes, millions of rich middle class people across the planet are arranging climate change with the specific aim of getting poor people off the roads. It all makes sense now." From a certain point of view….. Poor people drive a 1.1 Ford fiesta. Rich middle class drive a v8 5 litre Range Rover sport. Poor people can barely afford to put the heating on Rich middle class have it as warm as they want Poor people holiday in UK, if at all Rich middle class have 2-3 overseas holidays a year So yeah, I’d say the rich middle class impact the environment way more than poor people. But they are the class that moan about climate change the most. | |||
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"The rich middle classes want the poor off the roads and the roads to themselves. EVs being unaffordable for the masses is all part of the plan… Yes, millions of rich middle class people across the planet are arranging climate change with the specific aim of getting poor people off the roads. It all makes sense now. From a certain point of view….. Poor people drive a 1.1 Ford fiesta. Rich middle class drive a v8 5 litre Range Rover sport. Poor people can barely afford to put the heating on Rich middle class have it as warm as they want Poor people holiday in UK, if at all Rich middle class have 2-3 overseas holidays a year So yeah, I’d say the rich middle class impact the environment way more than poor people. But they are the class that moan about climate change the most. " Well observed. | |||
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"It's not the middle class who are running the show, they are just as much slxves to the system as the rest of us. The huge corporations call the shots, built in obsolescence like apple phones when the battery gave up after two years forcing new phones to be purchased. EVs are no different they are basically fridge freezer with wheels and batteries, and much like household appliances are not designed to last much more then five years. " | |||
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"It's not the middle class who are running the show, they are just as much slxves to the system as the rest of us. The huge corporations call the shots, built in obsolescence like apple phones when the battery gave up after two years forcing new phones to be purchased. EVs are no different they are basically fridge freezer with wheels and batteries, and much like household appliances are not designed to last much more then five years. " Same with petrol and diesel cars these days. Corrosion used to kill cars in a few years, now that’s sorted the manufacturers had to find another way. So for engines, they have increased service intervals (get your new car “serviced” by the main dealer for 3 years and it will only have one oil change). They have also reduced the size of engines (big car with 1 litre turbo engine) and used stupidity such as running the cam belt in the engine oil. Engines die quickly these days. Then for the cars themselves all the unnecessary technology and annoying driver aids have sensors and cameras all over the vehicle. These either fail due to age or even the most minor accident can write a vehicle off once it is a few years old. | |||
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"It's not the middle class who are running the show, they are just as much slxves to the system as the rest of us. The huge corporations call the shots, built in obsolescence like apple phones when the battery gave up after two years forcing new phones to be purchased. EVs are no different they are basically fridge freezer with wheels and batteries, and much like household appliances are not designed to last much more then five years. Same with petrol and diesel cars these days. Corrosion used to kill cars in a few years, now that’s sorted the manufacturers had to find another way. So for engines, they have increased service intervals (get your new car “serviced” by the main dealer for 3 years and it will only have one oil change). They have also reduced the size of engines (big car with 1 litre turbo engine) and used stupidity such as running the cam belt in the engine oil. Engines die quickly these days. Then for the cars themselves all the unnecessary technology and annoying driver aids have sensors and cameras all over the vehicle. These either fail due to age or even the most minor accident can write a vehicle off once it is a few years old. " You don’t have to buy a car with all the toys, there’s some very basic cars on the market. Dacia are a good example. And you don’t have to have your car serviced by the main dealer, anyone can do it. And you could change the oil every year if you wanted to. I think changing the oil every 6,000 miles or so on an older car can seriously extend engine life. Same for phones. I needed a separate phone for a specific use and my lad dug out his old phone for me, an iPhone SE so 2016. Works perfectly despite being in a draw for a couple of years. Same iOS as my Mrs iPhone 15 and my iPhone 13. Battery doesn’t hold its charge all day but as it’s probably been put on charge over 3000 times that’s to be expected. My point is, upgrading a phone is usually a choice, not a necessity. The political elite are running the show, and yes are sometimes influenced by the CEOs of the massive corporations, but most are so obsessed with their ideology they listen to nobody, especially not the people who voted them in. And this is more true for net zero than anything else. Miliband is offshoring our CO2 emissions and spending hundreds of billions in the process, so even is we get to net zero, it will have made zero impact on the planets CO2 emissions. In fact they will probably be higher because of transporting more stuff here in diesel ships. What they are doing is a like me saying I’m going to cut my electricity usage by not using my tumble dryer anymore, I’m gonna use one in China and get my washing picked up and delivered by a diesel taxi and pay them £2,000 a time to do it. And then virtue signal how much I’ve cut my electricity bill. | |||
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"You don’t have to buy a car with all the toys, there’s some very basic cars on the market. Dacia are a good example. And you don’t have to have your car serviced by the main dealer, anyone can do it. And you could change the oil every year if you wanted to. I think changing the oil every 6,000 miles or so on an older car can seriously extend engine life. " I have a Dacia, and bought the non turbo one deliberately. I service it and change the oil annually. I also changed the oil when the dealer hadn’t for its service. I did the same on the motorhome. But most people don’t, they follow the service schedule. As for the unnecessary driver aids, they are now compulsory. Been going that way for some time with Euro NCAP but much if it is now in the European Type Approval legislation. | |||
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" What they are doing is a like me saying I’m going to cut my electricity usage by not using my tumble dryer anymore, I’m gonna use one in China and get my washing picked up and delivered by a diesel taxi and pay them £2,000 a time to do it. And then virtue signal how much I’ve cut my electricity bill. " Very good analogy.  | |||
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"It's not the middle class who are running the show, they are just as much slxves to the system as the rest of us. The huge corporations call the shots, built in obsolescence like apple phones when the battery gave up after two years forcing new phones to be purchased. EVs are no different they are basically fridge freezer with wheels and batteries, and much like household appliances are not designed to last much more then five years. Same with petrol and diesel cars these days. Corrosion used to kill cars in a few years, now that’s sorted the manufacturers had to find another way. So for engines, they have increased service intervals (get your new car “serviced” by the main dealer for 3 years and it will only have one oil change). They have also reduced the size of engines (big car with 1 litre turbo engine) and used stupidity such as running the cam belt in the engine oil. Engines die quickly these days. Then for the cars themselves all the unnecessary technology and annoying driver aids have sensors and cameras all over the vehicle. These either fail due to age or even the most minor accident can write a vehicle off once it is a few years old. You don’t have to buy a car with all the toys, there’s some very basic cars on the market. Dacia are a good example. And you don’t have to have your car serviced by the main dealer, anyone can do it. And you could change the oil every year if you wanted to. I think changing the oil every 6,000 miles or so on an older car can seriously extend engine life. Same for phones. I needed a separate phone for a specific use and my lad dug out his old phone for me, an iPhone SE so 2016. Works perfectly despite being in a draw for a couple of years. Same iOS as my Mrs iPhone 15 and my iPhone 13. Battery doesn’t hold its charge all day but as it’s probably been put on charge over 3000 times that’s to be expected. My point is, upgrading a phone is usually a choice, not a necessity. The political elite are running the show, and yes are sometimes influenced by the CEOs of the massive corporations, but most are so obsessed with their ideology they listen to nobody, especially not the people who voted them in. And this is more true for net zero than anything else. Miliband is offshoring our CO2 emissions and spending hundreds of billions in the process, so even is we get to net zero, it will have made zero impact on the planets CO2 emissions. In fact they will probably be higher because of transporting more stuff here in diesel ships. What they are doing is a like me saying I’m going to cut my electricity usage by not using my tumble dryer anymore, I’m gonna use one in China and get my washing picked up and delivered by a diesel taxi and pay them £2,000 a time to do it. And then virtue signal how much I’ve cut my electricity bill. " So dam right | |||
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"What they are doing is a like me saying I’m going to cut my electricity usage by not using my tumble dryer anymore, I’m gonna use one in China and get my washing picked up and delivered by a diesel taxi and pay them £2,000 a time to do it. And then virtue signal how much I’ve cut my electricity bill. " To be a proper analogy you’d have to say ‘I sold my washing machine off for a small profit in the 80’a and 90’s so have no means of washing my clothes at home’ | |||
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"meanwhile, clever people use a mix of solar and wind to dry their washing 🍃🌞 "Yes I hear it's a twice a year event in the UK. | |||
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" We bought a full electric and it's great but I wouldn't like to be traveling for work, not enough chargers and they're expensive if you can find a working one" We have one. A/C charger. In the process currently (sorry) of changing over to DC charge car. To allow faster charging. Looked at taking it to Portsmouth and driving to parents in Frome and Weston -Super-Mud. We use Charge-map. Very useful for planning and showing public chargers. Was gob-smacked at how few are available in UK still. 4 in Frome and 6 in Weston. I was in St.Malo at the time and there are dozens. We have Dutch and Scandinavian visitors who reckon France is crap! | |||
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" Many people don’t have the money to buy new. I’ll be at retirement age by the time this happens but there will be hundreds of thousands of people that probably have to quit work because the government made their method of transport illegal Agree. Which is my point. Going back to the V6 mondeo or similar, the low budget motorist now has to pay £760, or can’t sell it as it’s worthless as ved more than the car’s value. " Can I point out that a v6 mondeo is now quite rare and therefore only rising in price. I know this as I wanted to get another st24... but wow hard to get. The same to be said of the v6 alfas... and people will still happily buy them. I dont think the demise of the petrol car is coming.. think we will just get cleaner fuels Cali x | |||
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