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"Doesn't Glastonbury hold over 200,000 people in a couple of fields? If tents and portaloos are good enough for Noah and Jemmima then surely it will do for our new arrivals. Could get them picking potatoes in the day to pay for it too." and will they get an income suitable enough for them to live on? | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace." If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be." It’s definitely creeping in that direction. The irony is that those most vehemently against Farage and Reform are paving the way for them. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be." Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. " Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out..." It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020." It is relevant, we can't claim success in higher deportation numbers if it is attributed to higher numbers entering in the first place. The critical number is those that are granted refugee status, that is what we are working with in terms of costs for housing etc. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020." From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. It is relevant, we can't claim success in higher deportation numbers if it is attributed to higher numbers entering in the first place. The critical number is those that are granted refugee status, that is what we are working with in terms of costs for housing etc. " If someone passes for refugee status then so be it. They passed, and are eligible to work, live here etc for 3-5 years. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' " Does it matter whether someone is deported or leaves voluntarily? | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' Does it matter whether someone is deported or leaves voluntarily? " Well I agree that life under the Starmer Regime has become so intolerable that many more people will choose to leave, so I guess the Govt can claim credit for that. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' Does it matter whether someone is deported or leaves voluntarily? Well I agree that life under the Starmer Regime has become so intolerable that many more people will choose to leave, so I guess the Govt can claim credit for that." When are you off, then?  | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' Does it matter whether someone is deported or leaves voluntarily? Well I agree that life under the Starmer Regime has become so intolerable that many more people will choose to leave, so I guess the Govt can claim credit for that. When are you off, then? " | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. From BBC report: 'The Home Office has also posted a video on X, showing people being put onto planes by immigration enforcement officials, with the words: "we have removed more than 24,000 people". But the claim is misleading. The government's latest figures show that only 6,339 of these were "enforced returns". The majority were "voluntary returns" - and a significant number of these happen without the government's direct involvement or even knowledge.' Does it matter whether someone is deported or leaves voluntarily? Well I agree that life under the Starmer Regime has become so intolerable that many more people will choose to leave, so I guess the Govt can claim credit for that." Let them go then.. Bloody softies don't want to stay and do their bit plus tax dodgers can off it to live where they like.. Maybe even try a proper 'regime' and see how they do there..  | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. It is relevant, we can't claim success in higher deportation numbers if it is attributed to higher numbers entering in the first place. The critical number is those that are granted refugee status, that is what we are working with in terms of costs for housing etc. If someone passes for refugee status then so be it. They passed, and are eligible to work, live here etc for 3-5 years. " You are missing the point. If numbers are going up costs are going up as per the OP. We can't sustain this level of entry due to cost, as I mentioned above this refusal to acknowledge we have a problem is opening the door to Reform. In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control." We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible." When you say “we” are regaining control, who is the “we”? Are you an official spokesperson for the Labour Party? I hope you are being paid for it. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible." Unacceptable to who, and I don't consider a hard stop as irresponsible if the aim is to create a working buffer. If Labour had not been so keen to close the Rwanda scheme, we could have used those facilities during a hard stop, allowing services to catch up and give some breathing space. We could have also monitored the effectiveness of the scheme rather than flushing millions down the drain as symbolic gesture. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible. When you say “we” are regaining control, who is the “we”? Are you an official spokesperson for the Labour Party? I hope you are being paid for it." I say ‘we’ as a citizen. Same as I say ‘we’ shouldn’t have left the EU and caused this problem. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible. Unacceptable to who, and I don't consider a hard stop as irresponsible if the aim is to create a working buffer. If Labour had not been so keen to close the Rwanda scheme, we could have used those facilities during a hard stop, allowing services to catch up and give some breathing space. We could have also monitored the effectiveness of the scheme rather than flushing millions down the drain as symbolic gesture. " The Rwanda scheme was unlawful, and required a backdoor deal to even enable a plane to take off. And a hard-stop to refugees is unacceptable to me (who else can I talk about on an opinion-based forum?). It would raise ethical questions, legal questions (and could end up costing more in legal cases), and increase pressure on other nations. Better to improve the system we have than to place a stop on it. | |||
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"They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020." But the majority of those deportations was from legal immigrants that had overstayed their visas. The number of illegal immigrants returned was very small. We don't know exactly how small, because the government won't release the figures. | |||
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"I say ‘we’ as a citizen. Same as I say ‘we’ shouldn’t have left the EU and caused this problem." We've been through this. Leaving the EU did not create the illegal immigrant problem. It existed long before that. The problem of small boats in particular came after we started to check vehicles arriving at the border, making that route too difficult for the smugglers, so they looked for a different option. | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible. Unacceptable to who, and I don't consider a hard stop as irresponsible if the aim is to create a working buffer. If Labour had not been so keen to close the Rwanda scheme, we could have used those facilities during a hard stop, allowing services to catch up and give some breathing space. We could have also monitored the effectiveness of the scheme rather than flushing millions down the drain as symbolic gesture. The Rwanda scheme was unlawful, and required a backdoor deal to even enable a plane to take off. And a hard-stop to refugees is unacceptable to me (who else can I talk about on an opinion-based forum?). It would raise ethical questions, legal questions (and could end up costing more in legal cases), and increase pressure on other nations. Better to improve the system we have than to place a stop on it." A hard stop doesn’t mean forgetting our obligations forever. It means recognising the system we have is beyond its capacity, can’t deliver the security we need, or credibility. The Rwanda scheme had legal challenges and anything other than open doors will attract that from the progressives, but Labour’s decision to bin it entirely without trialling its deterrent effect was symbolic, and not practical. Those facilities could have given us a time buffer, and time is what desperately need. We have not got the money to keep playing this game... | |||
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"I say ‘we’ as a citizen. Same as I say ‘we’ shouldn’t have left the EU and caused this problem. We've been through this. Leaving the EU did not create the illegal immigrant problem. It existed long before that. The problem of small boats in particular came after we started to check vehicles arriving at the border, making that route too difficult for the smugglers, so they looked for a different option." https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/tories-brexit-small-boats-asylum-philp-b2751177.html https://northeastbylines.co.uk/news/politics/increase-in-small-boat-crossings-caused-by-no-returns-agreement-after-brexit/ | |||
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"They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. But the majority of those deportations was from legal immigrants that had overstayed their visas. The number of illegal immigrants returned was very small. We don't know exactly how small, because the government won't release the figures." 108,000 people made new asylum claims in 2024, 15,000 small boat arrivals 2025 year to date. Add 91,000 backlog at end of 2024. Last official home office figure was 215,500 cleans being/to be processed. The cost of housing dwarfed by accumulative cost of border force/navy/emergency services, state benefits, healthcare, schooling, lawyers, legal, courts, interpreters, resettlement, burden on councils and home office and other agencies administrating all this. Security payments to France alone are £500million. If that £15.3bn for housing is correct then the total cost of 164,000 illegals since 2018 will likely be four/five times that. | |||
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"£2.2bn of overseas development assistance (ODA) is being used this year to house asylum seekers, a small drop from £2.3bn last year. Stopping the boats and smashing the gangs clearly not working, with 1195 more arriving this week. Home Office figures, say about 32,000 asylum seekers housed in hotels in the UK. Plus those 5000 empty rooms awaiting the influx. Contracts signed by the Conservative government in 2019 were expected to see £4.5bn of public cash paid to three companies to accommodate asylum seekers over a 10-year period. But further down the bbc article it claims a report by spending watchdog the National Audit Office (NAO) in May 2025, said the number was expected to be £15.3bn. Costs appear to be all over the place ?" All over the place seems accurate but either way it's a staggering amount of money. No wonder it such a hot topic | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace." Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe" Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. " Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 " That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. " can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point." ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR." I will leave this here....  | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. I will leave this here.... "As you always do. Has Farage explained how we can leave the ECHR and protect the Good Friday agreement yet? | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. I will leave this here....
As you always do.
Has Farage explained how we can leave the ECHR and protect the Good Friday agreement yet? "I'm leaving it here because the terms "leave" and "improve" are specifically being ignored. I have nothing to add that will enhance the discussion until the difference between "leave" and "improve" is recognised.  | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. " Regardless of what people's opinions are on leaving the ECHR, it is an example of Reforms influence on the established parties | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Regardless of what people's opinions are on leaving the ECHR, it is an example of Reforms influence on the established parties" | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Regardless of what people's opinions are on leaving the ECHR, it is an example of Reforms influence on the established parties" Didn’t Theresa May talk about it in 2016? | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. I will leave this here....
As you always do.
Has Farage explained how we can leave the ECHR and protect the Good Friday agreement yet?
I'm leaving it here because the terms "leave" and "improve" are specifically being ignored.
I have nothing to add that will enhance the discussion until the difference between "leave" and "improve" is recognised. "so are you leaving Or improving this discussion ? | |||
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"Part of the problem is our inefficient civil service, it takes so long to process and evaluate each migrant that they get stuck in the system for far too long. Obviously this ends up costing the state more money and unfairly leaves migrants stuck in limbo. " Labour said they’d recruit 1000 extra case workers. On average pay plus training and pensions that will cost £60/70 million a year Labour has said it will create a squad of 1,000 officials who will track down failed asylum seekers and foreign criminals and speed up their removal from the UK. In addition a “Returns and Enforcement Unit” would aim to address the 40% fall in asylum removals since 2010. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. I will leave this here....
As you always do.
Has Farage explained how we can leave the ECHR and protect the Good Friday agreement yet?
I'm leaving it here because the terms "leave" and "improve" are specifically being ignored.
I have nothing to add that will enhance the discussion until the difference between "leave" and "improve" is recognised. so are you leaving Or improving this discussion ? " | |||
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"Part of the problem is our inefficient civil service, it takes so long to process and evaluate each migrant that they get stuck in the system for far too long. Obviously this ends up costing the state more money and unfairly leaves migrants stuck in limbo. Labour said they’d recruit 1000 extra case workers. On average pay plus training and pensions that will cost £60/70 million a year Labour has said it will create a squad of 1,000 officials who will track down failed asylum seekers and foreign criminals and speed up their removal from the UK. In addition a “Returns and Enforcement Unit” would aim to address the 40% fall in asylum removals since 2010. " And herein shows the bureaucracy, middle management and waste that so pisses taxpayers off | |||
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"Part of the problem is our inefficient civil service, it takes so long to process and evaluate each migrant that they get stuck in the system for far too long. Obviously this ends up costing the state more money and unfairly leaves migrants stuck in limbo. Labour said they’d recruit 1000 extra case workers. On average pay plus training and pensions that will cost £60/70 million a year Labour has said it will create a squad of 1,000 officials who will track down failed asylum seekers and foreign criminals and speed up their removal from the UK. In addition a “Returns and Enforcement Unit” would aim to address the 40% fall in asylum removals since 2010. And herein shows the bureaucracy, middle management and waste that so pisses taxpayers off " And in the meantime all this costing tens of billions a year, and adding extra weight on public services. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Playing right into Farage's toolbox 👏 That’s fine. I’d rather point out the errors of leaving the ECHR before doing it and realising it was a terrible idea all along. can you pivot from "leaving" to "improving"? This is an important point. ‘Improvement’ is down to parliament, not the ECHR. I will leave this here....
As you always do.
Has Farage explained how we can leave the ECHR and protect the Good Friday agreement yet?
I'm leaving it here because the terms "leave" and "improve" are specifically being ignored.
I have nothing to add that will enhance the discussion until the difference between "leave" and "improve" is recognised. so are you leaving Or improving this discussion ?
"All the echr is nonsense. Poland is using water cannons to keep the gimmegrants out | |||
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"This is an interesting read. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9dqqj0v1ndo" On the hotels section, yes less use but Serco’s contract offering above market rents to PRS landlords. Some people have been section 21’d in favour of housing gimmegrants | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. Also if I read correctly the Tory leader who used to be against leaving the ECHR is now strongly considering it. Seems the potential loss of votes from trying to ignore such problems is now to severe Fixing problems by leaving the ECHR is like fixing your broken cupboard door by burning the kitchen down. Regardless of what people's opinions are on leaving the ECHR, it is an example of Reforms influence on the established parties Didn’t Theresa May talk about it in 2016?" I think she did when she was home Secretary and suspect many have also brought up the subject. That view was very decisive for the Tory party. It is reform that are wining voters and are in a position to threaten the established parties. In my opinion the established parties are seeing their votes go to reform and in an attempt to win them back are moving in reforms direction and considering. Just my take on what I see happening. | |||
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"This is an interesting read. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9dqqj0v1ndo On the hotels section, yes less use but Serco’s contract offering above market rents to PRS landlords. Some people have been section 21’d in favour of housing gimmegrants " Should be in favour of Labour abolishing no fault evictions then. | |||
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"Do you not want them to be housed?" I don’t want them to be here until their submission for asylum has been reviewed and approved and they arrive through a recognised port of entry. | |||
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"Doesn't Glastonbury hold over 200,000 people in a couple of fields? If tents and portaloos are good enough for Noah and Jemmima then surely it will do for our new arrivals. Could get them picking potatoes in the day to pay for it too. and will they get an income suitable enough for them to live on?" No, they will get the opportunity to work in a stable country and work hard to integrate into the country, embracing the values and beliefs of this country. | |||
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"Doesn't Glastonbury hold over 200,000 people in a couple of fields? If tents and portaloos are good enough for Noah and Jemmima then surely it will do for our new arrivals. Could get them picking potatoes in the day to pay for it too. and will they get an income suitable enough for them to live on? No, they will get the opportunity to work in a stable country and work hard to integrate into the country, embracing the values and beliefs of this country. "
As has been the case for centuries..
And it has enriched the country .. | |||
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"Do you not want them to be housed? I don’t want them to be here until their submission for asylum has been reviewed and approved and they arrive through a recognised port of entry." What is your understanding of the asylum processs? | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be." Unless Labour and Conservatives take the policies of Reform seriously, they will continue to loose the confidence of the majority of those who identify with the historic Christian British values and so force those people to take the only rational decision and vote for those who have their best interests at heart. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Unless Labour and Conservatives take the policies of Reform seriously, they will continue to loose the confidence of the majority of those who identify with the historic Christian British values and so force those people to take the only rational decision and vote for those who have their best interests at heart." Check the last census. 46% stated they were Christian. Another 30+% stated no religion. Hardly the majority. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Unless Labour and Conservatives take the policies of Reform seriously, they will continue to loose the confidence of the majority of those who identify with the historic Christian British values and so force those people to take the only rational decision and vote for those who have their best interests at heart. Check the last census. 46% stated they were Christian. Another 30+% stated no religion. Hardly the majority. " Sorry let me be more crass, those that don’t want to force school girls to wear head scarfs, enjoy a pint, not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco and ensure that everyone living n the UK speaks English and that the obligation to provide translators in hospitals, schools and courts should be for the cost of the person who cannot understand the language of the country they have chosen to make a new life in. People leaving failed states (assume that is their reason for being here and not the reality that it is economics and not persecution) should not then try change systems and infrastructures and as such simply move Britain closer to their failed states. Finally, if someone chooses to speak out about a god, we should not fear that some fanatical fucktard attempt to murder the person due to some self entitled right regarding blasphemy. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Unless Labour and Conservatives take the policies of Reform seriously, they will continue to loose the confidence of the majority of those who identify with the historic Christian British values and so force those people to take the only rational decision and vote for those who have their best interests at heart. Check the last census. 46% stated they were Christian. Another 30+% stated no religion. Hardly the majority. Sorry let me be more crass, those that don’t want to force school girls to wear head scarfs, enjoy a pint, not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco and ensure that everyone living n the UK speaks English and that the obligation to provide translators in hospitals, schools and courts should be for the cost of the person who cannot understand the language of the country they have chosen to make a new life in. People leaving failed states (assume that is their reason for being here and not the reality that it is economics and not persecution) should not then try change systems and infrastructures and as such simply move Britain closer to their failed states. Finally, if someone chooses to speak out about a god, we should not fear that some fanatical fucktard attempt to murder the person due to some self entitled right regarding blasphemy." Gotcha! Thanks! | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ..." What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ... What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package." I have no problem with Halal, kosher or whatever, either. It has no impact on me, nor does it have any effect on my political or ethical considerations. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ... What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package." Far more cruel methods of slaughter. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ..." "What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package." "Far more cruel methods of slaughter." Most halal meat is slaughtered in exactly the same way as non-halal meat. There is a special exemption for slaughter without stunning, but that can only be used where the meat is intended for consumption by Muslims. It wouldn't be allowed if it were the only option at Tesco's. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ... What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package." I would encourage you to research halal food. While I am a person who enjoys a steak, I don’t see the need for the animal to suffer unnecessarily while someone utters a prayer as the conscious animal bleeds out. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ..." "What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package." "I would encourage you to research halal food. While I am a person who enjoys a steak, I don’t see the need for the animal to suffer unnecessarily while someone utters a prayer as the conscious animal bleeds out." Here's the government guidance on how to slaughter animals. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/halal-and-kosher-slaughter You'll notice that it contains the sentence "A significant proportion of halal meat comes from animals that are stunned before slaughter". That's the normal method of slaughter in the UK. You can only use the special exemption on stunning if the meat is intended for consumption by Muslims. Tesco would not be allowed to use that sort of meat, even in their halal section, since they have a significant non-Muslim customer base. | |||
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"... not be forced to eat halal food because that is the only beef or lamb sold at Tesco ... What's the problem with halal food? It's exactly the same meat as non-halal, but with a badge on the package. I would encourage you to research halal food. While I am a person who enjoys a steak, I don’t see the need for the animal to suffer unnecessarily while someone utters a prayer as the conscious animal bleeds out." Try reading up on the RSPCA website about this. | |||
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"£2.2bn of overseas development assistance (ODA) is being used this year to house asylum seekers, a small drop from £2.3bn last year. Stopping the boats and smashing the gangs clearly not working, with 1195 more arriving this week. Home Office figures, say about 32,000 asylum seekers housed in hotels in the UK. Plus those 5000 empty rooms awaiting the influx. Contracts signed by the Conservative government in 2019 were expected to see £4.5bn of public cash paid to three companies to accommodate asylum seekers over a 10-year period. But further down the bbc article it claims a report by spending watchdog the National Audit Office (NAO) in May 2025, said the number was expected to be £15.3bn. Costs appear to be all over the place ?" Direct vs indirect costs. You can calculate a basic cost of food, water, shelter. The indirect costs are difficult, staff, compensation for those who are attacked by the illegals, supplying translators, supplying advice hoc other goods, sending out military boats to pick people up, repair bills to hotels they smash. Etc etc. 15bn. A years seems a good ball park all in | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020." Have you got the source for three numbers to hand at all. I'd love to read it | |||
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" In my view, we need a hard stop not as a permanent solution, but as a reset. A state of emergency if necessary. Something that creates breathing space and allows us to regain control. We’re regaining control, it’s a process which is going to take some time after the Tories utterly lost control post-Brexit. A hard-stop on refugees is unacceptable and irresponsible. Unacceptable to who, and I don't consider a hard stop as irresponsible if the aim is to create a working buffer. If Labour had not been so keen to close the Rwanda scheme, we could have used those facilities during a hard stop, allowing services to catch up and give some breathing space. We could have also monitored the effectiveness of the scheme rather than flushing millions down the drain as symbolic gesture. The Rwanda scheme was unlawful, and required a backdoor deal to even enable a plane to take off. And a hard-stop to refugees is unacceptable to me (who else can I talk about on an opinion-based forum?). It would raise ethical questions, legal questions (and could end up costing more in legal cases), and increase pressure on other nations. Better to improve the system we have than to place a stop on it." The Rwanda scheme as it stood in the agreement was unlawful. There was a tabled ammendment that never went further as Rishi called an election that would have changed it. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. Have you got the source for three numbers to hand at all. I'd love to read it" It would seem building on this. Most tthe returns were students who's visas expired. | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. Have you got the source for three numbers to hand at all. I'd love to read it It would seem building on this. Most tthe returns were students who's visas expired." Perhaps as politicians do, the government will take credit for all those that went back under such circumstances, even though they had nothing to do with it | |||
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"I see Labour are now focusing in on parts of the ECHR that are creating loopholes, such as housing migrant families under the right to a family life. Reform are starting to dictate the pace. If we still have this level of illegal immigration in 2029, Reform will be running the country never mind dictating the pace. I'm not sure that's what we want, but that's how it will be. Labour have done very well with deportations and removals, as it happens - highest numbers since 2020- but nobody wants to talk about that. I suspect that this will be under control well before 2029 - not because of Farage, but because it was a manifesto pledge, and a key one at that. Are they really? What is the ratio % of incoming to out going? The more that come in, will clearly lead to more going out... It’s irrelevant since to you they’ll never be right. They deported or removed (depending on source) 20-25k in the first 9 months - some voluntary, some ‘proper’ deportations. But more than any govt. Since 2020. Have you got the source for three numbers to hand at all. I'd love to read it It would seem building on this. Most tthe returns were students who's visas expired. Perhaps as politicians do, the government will take credit for all those that went back under such circumstances, even though they had nothing to do with it" You know they will. | |||
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